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I've seen camera examples from the n5 which look great but mine look grainy..any ideas what settings do people use
Sent from my Nexus 5 using XDA Free mobile app
Try compare the exif info.
P.s. it is not a problem of setting, it just if you know some basic photography techniques.
Sent from my Nexus 5 using XDA Free mobile app
sorry, i got to laugh first.. lmao!
settings could be different for every single photo.
and @DummyPLUG said it right, its about learning some basic photography skills, and knowing some basic physics about light helps. one thing is for sure though, dont just press the button. touch the screen first, where you want it focused. point and click, youll get better looking photos as well.
Enable HDR.
MrObvious said:
Enable HDR.
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why? i refuse to use it. photos that come out of hdr do look nice, but also lose out on a lot of detail, as tbe image size is also reduced.
DummyPLUG said:
it is not a problem of setting, it just if you know some basic photography techniques.
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This
simms22 said:
settings could be different for every single photo.
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This
MrObvious said:
Enable HDR.
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and this, where ever possible.
see, i dont agree to enable hdr whenever possible. sure, overall images seem to look better. but you lose so much detail by using it. if detail is important to you, like the detail in my photos to me, than its the worst thing to do. as i can get a better looking "hdr" images by editing the photo after, than the hdr camera can capture.
simms22 said:
why? i refuse to use it. photos that come out of hdr do look nice, but also lose out on a lot of detail, as tbe image size is also reduced.
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To me, HDR + gives a truer account of the actual light conditions in front of the lens and also better pictures in lower light.
My HDR pictures are bigger. Just done a low light test. 800KB vs 1.2MB
Edit, oh maybe you mean resolution?
5992704 vs 583680 in my tests. 6mpx vs 5.8 - not a lot of detail really.
Sent from my Nexus 5 using Tapatalk
rootSU said:
To me, HDR + gives a truer account of the actual light conditions in front of the lens and also better pictures in lower light.
My HDR pictures are bigger. Just done a low light test. 800KB vs 1.2MB
Sent from my Nexus 5 using Tapatalk
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Click to collapse
that's a 33.33% reduction in size. not counting the hdr effect which ruins the actual detail(zoom all the way in to look).
instead, id say use touch to focus whenever possible. as just pressing the button will give you an average focus over the whole image. but touch to focus will give you detail where you need it.
simms22 said:
that's a 30% reduction in size.
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Sorry, i though you were saying a smaller file size is a BAD thing. Im confused, are you now saying its BETTER?
rootSU said:
Sorry, i though you were saying a smaller file size is a BAD thing. Im confused, are you now saying its BETTER?
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wait, your saying the hdr photo is larger or smaller. to me it sounded like you said smaller.
simms22 said:
wait, your saying the hdr photo is larger or smaller. to me it sounded like you said smaller.
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Even though I used the word bigger?
rootSU said:
Even though I used the word bigger?
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the way you wrote the photo size.. but i just checked as well, pixel size is smaller in an hdr photo, not mb in the file size.
simms22 said:
the way you wrote the photo size.. but i just checked as well, pixel size is smaller in an hdr photo, not mb in the file size.
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Click to collapse
To me, HDR+ looks sharper too.
I'd upload a couple of examples, but they get compressed on TT or Photobucket. Maybe G+ doesn't compress? That said, I don't like using my real name in forums so... hahah
rootSU said:
To me, HDR+ looks sharper too.
I'd upload a couple of examples, but they get compressed on TT or Photobucket. Maybe G+ doesn't compress? That said, I don't like using my real name in forums so... hahah
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na, g+ does as well.
i guess if you dont have much photography knowledge, then hdr+ might be good to use Lp
simms22 said:
na, g+ does as well.
i guess if you dont have much photography knowledge, then hdr+ might be good to use Lp
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Click to collapse
Well HDR+ is designed to give more detail where a normal camera would lose in dark and light areas. To me the results are better on a phone where you cannot adjust the shutter speed, iso or aperture.
I think its very unfair to link the use of HDR+ to photography knowledge. Its about the result. I myself am a keen amateur photographer and understand photography principles well, but it doesn't change the fact that HDR+ gets more information on a point and shoot than without.
I guess its slightly subjective as to whether you like your photos accurate or not. But technically, HDR + is better
Edit.. For those who don't know what we're debating, here's a link
http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/High-dynamic-range_imaging
Sent from my Nexus 5 using Tapatalk
rootSU said:
Well HDR+ is designed to give more detail where a normal camera would lose in dark and light areas. To me the results are better on a phone where you cannot adjust the shutter speed, iso or aperture.
I think its very unfair to link the use of HDR+ to photography knowledge. Its about the result. I myself am a keen amateur photographer and understand photography principles well, but it doesn't change the fact that HDR+ gets more information on a point and shoot than without.
Sent from my Nexus 5 using Tapatalk
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
well.. detail. hdr does make darker areas lighter, as thats why i do make many images hdr like, or faux hdr. from that point of view, sure, details get somewhat better. well, not better but you can see the details better. but on another hand, when you look at the details when you zoom in, the tiny details, they are worse. but thats just because of the nature of hdr on mobile, on taking several images and meshing them together. in my photography, those tiny details are very important, since many of my photos are macro-like, and focus on a specific point while everything else blurs. using hdr+, it tends to not catch the fine details.
simms22 said:
well.. detail. hdr does make darker areas lighter, as thats why i do make many images hdr like, or faux hdr. from that point of view, sure, details get somewhat better. well, not better but you can see the details better. but on another hand, when you look at the details when you zoom in, the tiny details, they are worse. but thats just because of the nature of hdr on mobile, on taking several images and meshing them together. in my photography, those tiny details are very important, since many of my photos are macro-like, and focus on a specific point while everything else blurs. using hdr+, it tends to not catch the fine details.
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Well macro is a different kettle of fish. I use a completely different set up for macro, ie not a phone
To me a phone is for snaps. I find HDR+ gives a better snap
Anyways, whatever. Use it, don't. The op has enough info to decide now
Sent from my Nexus 5 using Tapatalk
rootSU said:
Well macro is a different kettle of fish. I use a completely different set up for macro, ie not a phone
To me a phone is for snaps. I find HDR+ gives a better snap
Anyways, whatever. Use it, don't. The op has enough info to decide now
Sent from my Nexus 5 using Tapatalk
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
or use it in certain types of shots. anyways, its a personal preference. and absolutely!
@rootSU @simms22 people never understand this.
Lethargy said:
HDR = High Dynamic Range, multiple (doesn't matter how many) pictures taken at different exposures and put together so you get everything exposed and nothing over/under-exposed.
HDR+ = Google's random magic algorithm for scene recognition, saturation fixing and contrast fixing, done with multiple (I think 2) images. Quoting Google; “With HDR+, create vivid photos by day and sharper photos by night.”
What Google calls "HDR+" only exists on the Nexus 5.
See this image: http://images.fonearena.com/blog/wp-content/uploads/2013/11/htc-one-hdr-vs-nexus-5-hdr-plus.jpg
As you can see, the HDR image doesn't have anything over/under-exposed whereas the HDR+ image has it's subject underexposed.
HDR is NOT the same as HDR+.
Edit: also have to add that "HDR+" is limited to the Google Camera. If you download a 3rd party camera app to use on the Nexus 5 and it has a "HDR mode", it'll be actual HDR, rather than what Google calls "HDR+".
I'm pretty sure the algorithm for "HDR+" is closed source but its definitely not real High Dynamic Range.
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here is my first quick test i ve did with my lg v10, using cinema size in manual mode, and test the manual focul.
simply amazing quality, this is what i ve been looking for to have in a smartphone since years!
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1jW2u_KSen8
Now that looks like a delicious ice-cream
Thanks for the upload mate, indeed nice OIS and focus performance.
But what I'm wondering is the other options mainly shutter speed; I'm not really deep into photography but using a Lumia for over 2 years I know how useful manual controls are for photos. But I just don't understand how you can change shutter speed in a video; isn't that a function which may only have a meaning while taking photos? Isn't the "shutter" open all the time while recording a video thus changing shutter speed while recording actually means nothing?
Thanks in advance if one can enlighten me. For instance can you make a test video while changing shutter speed on the fly?
Mmmm Ice-cream! Can you change the framerate to PAL (25 / 50fps)?
jmone said:
Mmmm Ice-cream! Can you change the framerate to PAL (25 / 50fps)?
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nop, only 30/60
nocomp said:
nop, only 30/60
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Thanks for checking.... no surprise really
That's pretty sharp. Can you do a 1080p test using OIS? The wobbles still bother me. I'm curious what OIS can do.
lensgrabber said:
That's pretty sharp. Can you do a 1080p test using OIS? The wobbles still bother me. I'm curious what OIS can do.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
+1 , i am curious also
i ll do one tomorrow, night time here already
nocomp said:
i ll do one tomorrow, night time here already
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Thanks! I'm subbed to your channel and will watch out for new vids.
lensgrabber said:
Thanks! I'm subbed to your channel and will watch out for new vids.
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thxx a lot, if there any other test you want me to do, just post them here
Well, my humble request stays few posts back but I guess its been overlooked
tersagun said:
Now that looks like a delicious ice-cream
Thanks for the upload mate, indeed nice OIS and focus performance.
But what I'm wondering is the other options mainly shutter speed; I'm not really deep into photography but using a Lumia for over 2 years I know how useful manual controls are for photos. But I just don't understand how you can change shutter speed in a video; isn't that a function which may only have a meaning while taking photos? Isn't the "shutter" open all the time while recording a video thus changing shutter speed while recording actually means nothing?
Thanks in advance if one can enlighten me. For instance can you make a test video while changing shutter speed on the fly?
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Click to collapse
shutter speed, is the process that allow the light to go in the captor to every frame you record.
usually this process is automatic, now you can change the spdeed, meaning, if it s too dark you can add more light than auto mode would allow, and get better picture
4K Time Limit?
Is there a time limit on how long you can shoot 4K video? If so, what is it? Thanks.
jokalee said:
Is there a time limit on how long you can shoot 4K video? If so, what is it? Thanks.
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I don't believe their may be one, if anything you would be more concerned about running out of memory space for the video than anything. These 1minute videos range from 600mb-1gig per file from a few shots I made.
make123 said:
I don't believe their may be one, if anything you would be more concerned about running out of memory space for the video than anything. These 1minute videos range from 600mb-1gig per file from a few shots I made.
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Click to collapse
Thanks. I see that LG is giving away a 200 GB microSD card with purchase of the phone. I'm debating upgrading my Note 3.
jokalee said:
Thanks. I see that LG is giving away a 200 GB microSD card with purchase of the phone. I'm debating upgrading my Note 3.
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Click to collapse
Actually let me update you on that I don't want you to go off with wrong information here, but now that I notice It did say "5:00" minutes when I started recording in 4k , note, I don't know if it's because my memory card is only 32gb (aka memory max like I said) or if it's because that's really the max time you're allowed, Just a heads up! Also a 3minute video is 1GB so note worthy as well, not sure where I got other info I must have clicked the wrong videos
make123 said:
Actually let me update you on that I don't want you to go off with wrong information here, but now that I notice It did say "5:00" minutes when I started recording in 4k , note, I don't know if it's because my memory card is only 32gb (aka memory max like I said) or if it's because that's really the max time you're allowed, Just a heads up!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I thought it might be. I'll maybe try a few different camera apps if I decide to go with the phone. I think my Note 3 is 5 min. with the default camera, but I get up to 17 minutes with other apps.
When taking a photo in a street during the night with iso 50 and shutter speed of 1 second, car headlights produce light trails.
But when recording a timelapse (using 1 fps manual video and same iso and shutter speed as before) the resulting video does not have light trails.
Why is that? Does the shutter speed setting has different meaning for photo and video?
So I was looking for a solid video recording app and stumbled across this, if you want a manual video app you will be more than happy as the controls are amazing. To achieve these surprising video setups simply press the settings toggle and select Resolution, bump it all the way up. Make sure the FPS and the playback FPS is at 30 and do not change any of the Exposure/ISO options. Now that is done I have found that in low light conditions the FPS may go down just a bit, around 2FPS, which is not that much off a difference. I have tried different combinations but it seems that 42FPS is the limit for all resolutions which is very sad as we still do not have [email protected] in 2018 . But overall this is amazing, the front camera shocked me the most, it not only unlocked a super high resolution it also comes with a very nice FPS. Some bad things are that the zoom is not very good on the viewfinder at all (but is alright in the actual video) compared to other video camera apps and it does cost alot of money for an app (around $13 USD), but the features it brings make it more than worth it .
I am using Cosmic OS 3.1 Oreo 8.1 unofficial with official Gapps and I haven't tried this on any other ROM.
If you want I can upload some examples
Link: https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.filmic.filmicpro&hl=en_GB
That app is way too pricey for what the end user gets. Also, I am unsure that our phone supports more than 30 frames per second video recording. Do not waste your hard earned money
neo299 said:
That app is way too pricey for what the end user gets. Also, I am unsure that our phone supports more than 30 frames per second video recording. Do not waste your hard earned money
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Click to collapse
Well, it is not for everyone. I took the plunge and I have checked my videos metadata and gone through frame by frame to see if their is just duplicates and to my surprise it is true 42FPS with the super high resolution. My friend has a LG V10 and the customization on this camera app is very comparable to his, which is very good. The quality of what this app produces is mind-blowing, it makes any low light shot look super. I know what you mean, this price is way too high for any app, so I would only recommend this app to proper enthusiasts. The typical user wouldn't really care or notice the bumped up pixels and FPS.
I saw 60 fps 1080p in latest Arnova's GCam beta. Did you check it out?
neo299 said:
I saw 60 fps 1080p in latest Arnova's GCam beta. Did you check it out?
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I might have the wrong version ( V7 beta 1) but this is fake 60FPS all it is is 30FPS video sped up to become 60FPS, its been like this for a long time .
neo299 said:
I saw 60 fps 1080p in latest Arnova's GCam beta. Did you check it out?
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Even of you toggle that option on. Camera records at 1080p 24fps.for some reason...1080p30fps is the limit...Dont really know why and the EIS video recording sucks..Big time...
I_Raptor_I said:
So I was looking for a solid video recording app and stumbled across this, if you want a manual video app you will be more than happy as the controls are amazing. To achieve these surprising video setups simply press the settings toggle and select Resolution, bump it all the way up. Make sure the FPS and the playback FPS is at 30 and do not change any of the Exposure/ISO options. Now that is done I have found that in low light conditions the FPS may go down just a bit, around 2FPS, which is not that much off a difference. I have tried different combinations but it seems that 42FPS is the limit for all resolutions which is very sad as we still do not have [email protected] in 2018 . But overall this is amazing, the front camera shocked me the most, it not only unlocked a super high resolution it also comes with a very nice FPS. Some bad things are that the zoom is not very good on the viewfinder at all (but is alright in the actual video) compared to other video camera apps and it does cost alot of money for an app (around $13 USD), but the features it brings make it more than worth it .
I am using Cosmic OS 3.1 Oreo 8.1 unofficial with official Gapps and I haven't tried this on any other ROM.
If you want I can upload some examples
Link: https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.filmic.filmicpro&hl=en_GB
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Terrible gui and there is nothing special with this app. I personally like stock Lineage 15.1 camera or one of Google Camera mods. OpenCamera is also not bad (gui is not beautiful, but easy to use).
I_Raptor_I said:
So I was looking for a solid video recording app and stumbled across this, if you want a manual video app you will be more than happy as the controls are amazing. To achieve these surprising video setups simply press the settings toggle and select Resolution, bump it all the way up. Make sure the FPS and the playback FPS is at 30 and do not change any of the Exposure/ISO options. Now that is done I have found that in low light conditions the FPS may go down just a bit, around 2FPS, which is not that much off a difference. I have tried different combinations but it seems that 42FPS is the limit for all resolutions which is very sad as we still do not have [email protected] in 2018 . But overall this is amazing, the front camera shocked me the most, it not only unlocked a super high resolution it also comes with a very nice FPS. Some bad things are that the zoom is not very good on the viewfinder at all (but is alright in the actual video) compared to other video camera apps and it does cost alot of money for an app (around $13 USD), but the features it brings make it more than worth it .
I am using Cosmic OS 3.1 Oreo 8.1 unofficial with official Gapps and I haven't tried this on any other ROM.
If you want I can upload some examples
Link: https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.filmic.filmicpro&hl=en_GB
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
How did you get 42FPS in video recording..i only get 30FPS or below in 1080p/4k mode.. and max 120FPS in 720p. that too in slow mo..couldnt get 60/50/42 fps in any video quality option....
negzzkaka said:
How did you get 42FPS in video recording..i only get 30FPS or below in 1080p/4k mode.. and max 120FPS in 720p. that too in slow mo..couldnt get 60/50/42 fps in any video quality option....
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Bump up the fps in 4K all the way up to 30fps and make sure the playback speed it the same, record your video with auto exposure, then you can check what real fps output (should be around 45fps in good light) is using this:
https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.roryhool.videoinfoviewer&hl=en
It should work in Oreo ROMs, but I dont know if it will work on Nougat.
I_Raptor_I said:
Bump up the fps in 4K all the way up to 30fps and make sure the playback speed it the same, record your video with auto exposure, then you can check what real fps output (should be around 45fps in good light) is using this:
https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.roryhool.videoinfoviewer&hl=en
It should work in Oreo ROMs, but I dont know if it will work on Nougat.
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Click to collapse
Wow nice app, mate. Do you have any camera app for taking photo which is better than GCMod5?
MaxLover said:
Wow nice app, mate. Do you have any camera app for taking photo which is better than GCMod5?
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Click to collapse
Well so far this Google HDR algorithm is so good, literally no other photo app can compare it it. So what I recommend is BSG's new Gcam, it provides so much customization to get the perfect picture, especially with the new auto shutter speed version - as the Le Max 2 has a limited measly shutter speed of half a second, this is merges photos with the limited shutter speed giving out a much nicer image. Although front camera portraits and HDR have that annoying Green filter, but i mostly use my main camera only so for me this is what I use the most.
Link: https://www.celsoazevedo.com/files/android/google-camera/f/MGC_5.1.018_FINAL_3.1.apk
I_Raptor_I said:
Although front camera portraits and HDR have that annoying Green filter, but i mostly use my main camera only so for me this is what I use the most.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Try Serjo84 GCAM mod, no green tint from front camera.
giaur said:
Try Serjo84 GCAM mod, no green tint from front camera.
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Click to collapse
link?
popoyaya said:
link?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I find that while Serjo87 Gcam's are very good Toylan009 Gcam's are more stable and have no green tint aswell.
Serjo87
Toylan009
I'm try this app but camera stop. Error
That app is way too pricey for what the end user gets. Also, I am unsure that our phone supports more than 30 frames per second video recording. Do not waste your hard earned money.
electrajailbeak said:
That app is way too pricey for what the end user gets. Also, I am unsure that our phone supports more than 30 frames per second video recording. Do not waste your hard earned money.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Nope. It's worth it for the incredibly smooth zoom alone.
Too much to set the bitrate speed. Therefore the video takes up a lot of space.
So as seen on dxomark , the Huawei P20 pro is now the king of phone cameras, and one key thing is that it has a second monochrome camera just like the essential. Perhaps they figured out how better to "utilize" the monochrome camera much better than the devs at Essential?
i love my essential and i think is hope that it can be even better!
geminihc said:
So as seen on dxomark , the Huawei P20 pro is now the king of phone cameras, and one key thing is that it has a second monochrome camera just like the essential. Perhaps they figured out how better to "utilize" the monochrome camera much better than the devs at Essential?
i love my essential and i think is hope that it can be even better!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
There are a lot of ways to use the monochrome camera.
You can possibly use the image for increased dynamic range or contrast.
I use the Google Camera port for most shots, and use the OEM camera for B/W shots, which it does very well.
Sent from my PH-1 using Tapatalk
How do they do it? Better hardware that's how
I don't think the way Huawei incorporates both cameras is better hardware, it's much better software. Huawei uses what they have better.
Murbert said:
I don't think the way Huawei incorporates both cameras is better hardware, it's much better software. Huawei uses what they have better.
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Click to collapse
The hardware itself, i.e. the cameras, are better quality. We can argue this all day, but you can only polish a turd so much (fix poor quality hardware with software)
The P20 Pro takes amazing pictures because Huawei put an amazing primary sensor (and lenses) in the phone along with good image processing.
GCam demonstrates the limit of image processing (taking low-light images being more detailed than the monochrome camera on the stock app) but without better camera hardware that's as far as this phone can go.
What better hardware? The P20 can get about 50% more light per pixel which is half a stop which amounts to nothing in the photography world. DSLR sensors gather 10 times or more light than phone cams and yet DSRLs are dying.
In the smartphone camera world, software is everything. Remember that the LG G6 has the same sensors as the PH-1 and yet its DXO scores for texture and noise are way higher than both the P20 and the Pixel 2. And that's the scores for just a single sensor. The Xiaomi 5s also has the same sensor pair in the same arrangement as the PH-1 and the combined output trounces any single sensor in the smartphone world.
Essential is really behind in their software department, notwithstanding their commitment in software support. Despite of the fact the camera designer was the one behind the iPhone's portrait mode, their software still can't live up to hardware potential. The current stock cam app, even with combined sensor output, can't come close to some GCam mods which use just a single sensor.
---------- Post added at 12:08 AM ---------- Previous post was at 12:03 AM ----------
The P20 Pro, on the other hand, got the good low light quality only in 10MP mode which pixel-bins the 40MP down to 10MP. Its texture and noise scores are still no better the than the G6. At 40MP its low light quality is worse than crap.
Yeah no.
You can't go using "it's nothing compared to DSLR's" when the difference is 50% more light per pixel. DSLR's are not dying because of quality but because it's convenient to have a good enough camera in your phone.
Obviously software is the key for modern cellphone imagery, that isn't even the point here. We already know what better processing does for the Essential sensor in the GCam mod. Which also works on the G6 incidentally and yields generally better results than LG's own app. But on the whole it's not nearly as good as the Pixel 2 for instance. Don't give me "but DXO said" because even G6 users don't believe they do better.
ChronoReverse said:
Yeah no.
You can't go using "it's nothing compared to DSLR's" when the difference is 50% more light per pixel. DSLR's are not dying because of quality but because it's convenient to have a good enough camera in your phone.
Obviously software is the key for modern cellphone imagery, that isn't even the point here. We already know what better processing does for the Essential sensor in the GCam mod. Which also works on the G6 incidentally and yields generally better results than LG's own app. But on the whole it's not nearly as good as the Pixel 2 for instance. Don't give me "but DXO said" because even G6 users don't believe they do better.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I didn't say "it's nothing compared to DSLR's" . If you don't understand, I'll say it again: 50% more light is half a stop which is nothing in the photography world. Do you even know what 50% more light means?
DSLRs have better hardware, but are dying not because of lack of convenience, but because quality from smartphone are good enough these days. Convenience was always there from the beginning of the smartphone age, but quality has only gotten good enough a few years recently. DSLRs always have the hardware advantage, but smartphone have the software and that's what make the difference.
And G6 users can't do better than Pixel 2 like DXO because they don't know what to do to get as good as DXO, at least in terms of texture and noise. "On the whole" is another matter since it's the whole package, which means Google software is much better than LG software. Well, it's the software that makes the difference. That's the point I'm making. It's not the camera hardware, it's the software. Differences in smartphone camera hardware are peanuts.
He also neglects to mention OIS on the g6.
Also, the Xiaomi Mi 5s Plus has the exact same design, with the same two Sony IMX258 sensors, one RGB and one Monochrome, no OIS, and it has the exact same problems with low light, even in daylight, and shutter lag. That phone was released a year ago. So Xiaomi proved this idea is a failure.
crixley said:
He also neglects to mention OIS on the g6.
Also, the Xiaomi Mi 5s Plus has the exact same design, with the same two Sony IMX258 sensors, one RGB and one Monochrome, no OIS, and it has the exact same problems with low light, even in daylight, and shutter lag. That phone was released a year ago. So Xiaomi proved this idea is a failure.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Since you mentioned OIS, what does OIS do to make the sensor output better, specifically texture and noise quality? If you don't know, it does exactly jack squat nothing to the sensor. It helps with the whole package, but that doesn't make people like it more than the Pixel 2.
And the Xiaomi 5s is not a failure, at least in terms of camera quality. The least you could do when trying to argue against it is to look up review results for yourself. Look at the comparison tool at GSMarena for the 5s in stereo mode compared to any other phone cam, instead of talking about something you know nothing about. People make the results and tools available and you don't even bother to look at. Sad!
Why people make unsubstantiated claims about something they don't understand or even try to learn about? Opinions can always be different, but at least have some informed opinion.
tnthd2 said:
Since you mentioned OIS, what does OIS do to make the sensor output better, specifically texture and noise quality? If you don't know, it does exactly jack squat nothing to the sensor. It helps with the whole package, but that doesn't make people like it more than the Pixel 2.
And the Xiaomi 5s is not a failure, at least in terms of camera quality. The least you could do when trying to argue against it is to look up review results for yourself. Look at the comparison tool at GSMarena for the 5s in stereo mode compared to any other phone cam, instead of talking about something you know nothing about. People make the results and tools available and you don't even bother to look at. Sad!
Why people make unsubstantiated claims about something they don't understand or even try to learn about? Opinions can always be different, but at least have some informed opinion.
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Lol you're one to talk. You don't think OIS effects low light photos? Interesting. You should do some reading. Noise levels in low light are highly related to OIS.
It is ranked about the same as essential phone by most reviewers.
If you're going to call me out, at least be right
crixley said:
Lol you're one to talk. You don't think OIS effects low light photos? Interesting. You should do some reading. Noise levels in low light are highly related to OIS.
It is ranked about the same as essential phone by most reviewers.
If you're going to call me out, at least be right
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Absolutely not. OIS reduces vibration from your hands to help getting sharper images. Same exposure parameters with or without OIS give exactly the same noise level. It does nothing to help noise from sensor. If you think it does, explain or cite how it does.
The effectiveness of OIS on smartphones is dubious at best due to the very short focal length on most phones. If it's really effective, those gimbals wouldn't be in high demand or that expensive. But this is another matter unrelated to the photo quality of sensor output.
tnthd2 said:
Absolutely not. OIS reduces vibration from your hands to help getting sharper images. Same exposure parameters with or without OIS give exactly the same noise level. It does nothing to help noise from sensor. If you think it does, explain or cite how it does.
The effectiveness of OIS on smartphones is dubious at best due to the very short focal length on most phones. If it's really effective, those gimbals wouldn't be in high demand or that expensive. But this is another matter unrelated to the photo quality of sensor output.
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"If your camera meters the need for a slow shutter speed which will cause camera shake, there are two ways to switch to a faster shutter speed:
1. Open up the aperture. Opening up the aperture (makes the hole bigger and therefore) allows more light to come in and so reduces the time the shutter needs to stay open. ["Shutter speed" is simply the time the camera keeps the shutter open.]
2. Often, especially in low-light situations, this will not even give you a fast enough shutter speed to hand hold the camera, so the second way is to use a higher ISO."
"At this slow shutter speed and without using a tripod, we will obtain a blurred image if we hand hold the camera. But, with Image Stabilization, we are now able to hand hold the camera without worrying about camera shake (1/15 sec. is 2 stops slower than 1/60 sec.).
If the light level falls further and the camera now needs an even slower shutter speed, say of 1/4 sec. (that's 4 stops slower than 1/60 sec.: 1/60 sec., 1/30 sec., 1/15 sec., 1/8 sec., 1/4 sec.), Image Stabilization will not help us eliminate camera shake in this case. It will, however, reduce its effect.
Note that IS works irrespective of the ISO used. Whereas High ISO forces you to use a high ISO (with resulting high noise and image degradation issues *1), IS allows you to keep at a low ISO while still reducing camera shake (thus keeping maximum image quality). That is, it does not mess with your selected exposure settings (you keep the shutter speed, aperture and ISO you want to use)"
crixley said:
"If your camera meters the need for a slow shutter speed which will cause camera shake, there are two ways to switch to a faster shutter speed:
1. Open up the aperture. Opening up the aperture (makes the hole bigger and therefore) allows more light to come in and so reduces the time the shutter needs to stay open. ["Shutter speed" is simply the time the camera keeps the shutter open.]
2. Often, especially in low-light situations, this will not even give you a fast enough shutter speed to hand hold the camera, so the second way is to use a higher ISO."
"At this slow shutter speed and without using a tripod, we will obtain a blurred image if we hand hold the camera. But, with Image Stabilization, we are now able to hand hold the camera without worrying about camera shake (1/15 sec. is 2 stops slower than 1/60 sec.).
If the light level falls further and the camera now needs an even slower shutter speed, say of 1/4 sec. (that's 4 stops slower than 1/60 sec.: 1/60 sec., 1/30 sec., 1/15 sec., 1/8 sec., 1/4 sec.), Image Stabilization will not help us eliminate camera shake in this case. It will, however, reduce its effect.
Note that IS works irrespective of the ISO used. Whereas High ISO forces you to use a high ISO (with resulting high noise and image degradation issues *1), IS allows you to keep at a low ISO while still reducing camera shake (thus keeping maximum image quality). That is, it does not mess with your selected exposure settings (you keep the shutter speed, aperture and ISO you want to use)"
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Hmm, that's a lot of quote, but not sure how much you understand or believe in all that. How do you adjust any of those settings with any (except one) cam app?
Whatever exposure setting you take a picture at with OIS on, I can take another picture at the same setting with OIS off. The noise level will be exactly the same. There might be a difference in sharpness, but how much difference will depend on how firm I can hold the camera or if I use an external stabilization device or not.
Like I've said, it helps with the whole package, but it doesn't explain how the G6 get higher noise score than the Pixel 2 which also has OIS. It's all in the software.
tnthd2 said:
Hmm, that's a lot of quote, but not sure how much you understand or believe in all that. How do you adjust any of those settings with any (except one) cam app?
Whatever exposure setting you take a picture at with OIS on, I can take another picture at the same setting with OIS off. The noise level will be exactly the same. There might be a difference in sharpness, but how much difference will depend on how firm I can hold the camera or if I use an external stabilization device or not.
Like I've said, it helps with the whole package, but it doesn't explain how the G6 get higher noise score than the Pixel 2 which also has OIS. It's all in the software.
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What that user was trying to convey is OIS let's you use a slower shutter with less motion blur due to camera shake. Slower shutter equals lower ISO, which likely results in less noise. This doesn't help for moving subjects though.
gk1984 said:
What that user was trying to convey is OIS let's you use a slower shutter with less motion blur due to camera shake. Slower shutter equals lower ISO, which likely results in less noise. This doesn't help for moving subjects though.
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That's the theory. Slower shutter speed *requires* lower ISO for the same lighting level, since the aperture is fixed. But in practice, I wouldn't give it up like that, but rather try to brace myself to reduce vibration or just use a stabilization device/tripod so I can shoot at the same exposure setting and get the same acceptable noise level.
tnthd2 said:
That's the theory. Slower shutter speed *requires* lower ISO for the same lighting level, since the aperture is fixed. But in practice, I wouldn't give it up like that, but rather try to brace myself to reduce vibration or just use a stabilization device/tripod so I can shoot at the same exposure setting and get the same acceptable noise level.
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I think you have it backwards.
A slow shutter allows you to use a low ISO.
A fast shutter requires a high ISO.
This assumes shutter an not aperture priority.
Also 1/focal length is the minimum shutter speed to not have noticeable shake at correct lighting.
I feel like this has gone a tad off topic. Not to say its completely irrelevant but I feel the starting point is, us comparing both the Ph1's and the P20 implementation to know whats different.
Is everyone else experiencing lag when saving raw photos from the expert raw camera ? It just seems to take forever after taking a couple photos . Any fixes ?
Did you try restarting the phone? Also clear phone cache
Depending on the situation (e.g. lighting conditions), Expert RAW can be kinda slow.
FYI. Samsung pushed out an update to Expert RAW.
gernerttl said:
Depending on the situation (e.g. lighting conditions), Expert RAW can be kinda slow.
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It usually does that after the 2nd consecutive shot . I will try the update now , but don't think it will be making a huge difference
So no, same issue. Seems to go just a liiiiitle but quicker, with a bit less stutter
twiggy.xlr4 said:
So no, same issue. Seems to go just a liiiiitle but quicker, with a bit less stutter
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And probably a bit less heat
Try saving your images as RAW only. I just changed my save settings to save RAW only. The save time is noticeably shorter.
gernerttl said:
Try saving your images as RAW only. I just changed my save settings to save RAW only. The save time is noticeably shorter.
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I have done just that when I saw I got the option. But still pretty slow even so
twiggy.xlr4 said:
I have done just that when I saw I got the option. But still pretty slow even so
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My images were pretty well lit, which means I am using a lower ISO and a faster shutter speed. As counter-intuitive as it may sound, higher ISO images have more data in them. I've experienced this same issue with DSLRs. Increasing the ISO increases the sensitivity of the sensor, which in turn increases the amount of data being captured. Combine that with the slower shutter speeds associated with low light capture and it will slow the camera's over all performance.
This doesn't mean performance can't be improved. Expert RAW performance (speed-wise) is noticeably slower than the Camera app. Samsung needs to tweak the algorithms it uses to process the image when saving.
Apple Pro Raw can do 48Mpx, S22 Ultra only 12Mpx, come on Samsung, at least 27Mpx.
12Mpx is ok for mobile phone, but for big screen or to print it sucks.
DoKaTSuYa said:
Apple Pro Raw can do 48Mpx, S22 Ultra only 12Mpx, come on Samsung, at least 27Mpx.
12Mpx is ok for mobile phone, but for big screen or to print it sucks.
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You obviously have no idea how Samsung cameras work. Nor how digital cameras (or any camera) work.
The S22 Ultra's camera is 108MP. It combines 9 pixels (3x3) into one. This essentially makes bigger pixels which improves dynamic range.
A 12MP image is plenty enough to make a 13x19in print. I've made 13x19in prints from 6MP RAW images almost 20 years ago.
Before talking smack do your homework.
Why your Samsung Galaxy S22 Ultra's 108MP camera takes 12MP photos
Plus how to take full-resolution shots — and why you probably shouldn't bother
www.androidpolice.com
The software is doing some heavy processing, which I suspect explains the lag. Mainly I wanted to confirm that I experience this, too. It takes a second or two to save the files. Being an IT person, I know to be patient with the software, but I could see where people might get impatient with it. It is important to consider the use cases for which the software was designed. It provides high fidelity images by combining data from multiple shots, I believe. It is more of a niche app, whereas the default camera app is meant to be your everyday app.
I have had two other issues with Expert RAW, dealing with corrupted files, but that is a topic for a new thread.
Hector M said:
The software is doing some heavy processing, which I suspect explains the lag. Mainly I wanted to confirm that I experience this, too. It takes a second or two to save the files. Being an IT person, I know to be patient with the software, but I could see where people might get impatient with it. It is important to consider the use cases for which the software was designed. It provides high fidelity images by combining data from multiple shots, I believe. It is more of a niche app, whereas the default camera app is meant to be your everyday app.
I have had two other issues with Expert RAW, dealing with corrupted files, but that is a topic for a new thread.
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Actually, in addition to processing, for some reason, Expert RAW is capped at only 48Hz refresh rate. AFAIK.
ekin_strops said:
Actually, in addition to processing, for some reason, Expert RAW is capped at only 48Hz refresh rate. AFAIK.
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Refresh rate has nothing to do with how fast an app processes data.
gernerttl said:
Refresh rate has nothing to do with how fast an app processes data.
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Where did I say that the refresh rate has done such? Can you read my reply once more, but this time slowly?
"Actually, IN ADDITION to processing, for some reason, Expert RAW is capped at only 48Hz refresh rate. AFAIK."
Saying here that apart from the processing, the screen refresh rate is ALSO capped at 48Hz which contributes to that "laggy" feel on the screen when trying to work inside the app.
Hector M said:
The software is doing some heavy processing, which I suspect explains the lag. Mainly I wanted to confirm that I experience this, too. It takes a second or two to save the files. Being an IT person, I know to be patient with the software, but I could see where people might get impatient with it. It is important to consider the use cases for which the software was designed. It provides high fidelity images by combining data from multiple shots, I believe. It is more of a niche app, whereas the default camera app is meant to be your everyday app.
I have had two other issues with Expert RAW, dealing with corrupted files, but that is a topic for a new thread.
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That heavy processing is made more complicated by the lighting conditions and the settings either the camera or the user sets. Like I said, using a higher ISO means more data has to be processed. Slower shutter speed combine with high ISO equals slow performance.
When using it in well lit conditions the lag is barely noticeable.
To be fair, there is a lot of room for improvement. If Samsung wants to market Expert RAW as a DSLR replacement, it has a lot of work to do.
ekin_strops said:
Where did I say that the refresh rate has done such? Can you read my reply once more, but this time slowly?
"Actually, IN ADDITION to processing, for some reason, Expert RAW is capped at only 48Hz refresh rate. AFAIK."
Saying here that apart from the processing, the screen refresh rate is ALSO capped at 48Hz which contributes to that "laggy" feel on the screen when trying to work inside the app.
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The refresh rate only deals with how often the screen is refreshed. It has nothing to with background image processing. Furthermore, where did you hear that the app's refresh rate is capped?
gernerttl said:
The refresh rate only deals with how often the screen is refreshed. It has nothing to with background image processing. Furthermore, where did you hear that the app's refresh rate is capped?
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Bruh.....
I'M NOT SAYING THAT THE REFRESH RATE HAS ANYTHING TO DO WITH HOW PROCESSING WORKS. I'm saying that the app has capped refresh rate so it also contributes to the laggy feel when you scroll inside it etc....
I didn't hear it, you can literally check the refresh rate of the panel while you're in the app.
ekin_strops said:
Bruh.....
I'M NOT SAYING THAT THE REFRESH RATE HAS ANYTHING TO DO WITH HOW PROCESSING WORKS. I'm saying that the app has capped refresh rate so it also contributes to the laggy feel when you scroll inside it etc....
I didn't hear it, you can literally check the refresh rate of the panel while you're in the app.
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"Bruh"
Before talking anymore, you should read the original post. The OP was talking about how long it takes to save a RAW image, which has NOTHING to do with the refresh rate. A higher screen refresh rate does not have anything to do with how fast an app runs. All it does is provide perceptibly smoother scrolling experience, better readability and use more batter. Expert RAW and the Camera apps don't require a lot of scrolling, so Samsung capped the refresh rate to help save battery. Your whole argument is moot.