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My Biggest Problem with the Captivate - And It's Silly

First, let me say up front that I have the utmost respect for the developers in the Captivate forum. It's a handicapped device that has much more potential than I think we'll ever be able to tap, simply because there isn't much motivation for Samsung to fix its biggest issues. Let's face it: The things we like most about our favorite Android handsets are precisely the things that make them seem "too complex" to the non non-technical general public. I think that the Galaxy S line has been a huge dissapointment to enthusiasts, and a big "ooh, ahh" for the iPhone-types.
That being said, let me move on to my main gripe: Through my Droid Incredible, I fell in love with flashing ROMs. If it had a higher build number, I flashed it. And you know why? Because it was better a better build. Newer baseband versions fixed more problems than it caused. I could flash ROMs on a train versus needing to be at my desktop for an exhaustive multi-step shamble. And when ROMs were released from build to build, developers in general knew what to expect as far as results.
I simply can't say that that's true with the Captivate. I'm growing increasingly frustrated with this phone and it's idiocy. I hate having ROMs with "Beta 9.3.5" after their title. I hate that half of the releases are to take out some Samsung crap, replace it with some AOSP-like goodness, just to see what sticks.
Again, it's not a condemnation of the Devs. They have made this phone tolerable, which is no small task. I just think it's a sad state of affairs when an OS based on an open source foundation has been so brutally slapped together that it makes a phone with the looks and hardware specs of a Ferrari about as much fun to own and maintain as a Yugo.
Who's with me on this one?
EDIT:
I'm keeping my original post above, partly because there have been too many responses to make removing it reasonable, and partly because I'd like something to review the next time I decide to try and put my thoughts out there to the community.
I never imagined that I would draw so much criticism over this post. I honestly thought I did a pretty good job of making it apparent that I truly appreciate all of the developers' work. I'm a huge fan of the Android platform and of open source projects in general. Allow me to draw a poorly crafted and weak analogy, if I may:
I love my two-year old boy dearly. He's a fantastic kid and big bright spot in my life. He has asthma, and I really do hate providing his breathing treatments. It doesn't mean I'm not thankful for the technology that allows him to breathe, and I certainly wouldn't consider trading him in for a different model without such issues. I would, however, consider venting to other parents of an asthmatic child about how laborious the process of breathing treatments is, and how unfriendly it is towards children his age.
I'm not quite sure how I managed to come across as anti-open source, anti-developer, or at all unappreciative of our dedicated developers - but apparently that's exactly what I did, so for that I apologize. What is really awful is that with one well-intended post I feel that I have ostracized myself from a community that I thoroughly enjoy supporting.

So instead of being constructive... and building a ROM of your own or simply not using them, you're complaining? No one said you have to use them. No one said you have to update all the time.
Definitely not with you.

I think the fustration you're feeling is related to these only having being available to the masses for about 2 months. The modding community started with HTC phones, so they have the momentum. That being said the samsung community is making a lot of progress, and HTC/Samsung cross modding is in full swing. Be patient.
Sent from my SPH-D700 using XDA App

Thanks for your thoughts. I thought I had posted in "Captivate General", not "Captivate Troll." My mistake.
I have actually tried just about all the ROMs available. You may have noticed that I stated that this is not a Dev issue. I doubt many can do better than the talented developers we have here - I know I couldn't. Hell, even Samsung can't.
My point is that I think the Galaxy S line is a harbinger of things to come for Android. I hope I'm wrong, but as Android becomes increasingly mainstream, it also becomes increasingly less important to deliver function AND form.
The average consumer wants sexiness with phrases like "dual-core" listed in the specs, regardless of what the device can actually deliver.
Sent from my GT-I9000 using XDA App

crayak said:
I think the fustration you're feeling is related to these only having being available to the masses for about 2 months. The modding community started with HTC phones, so they have the momentum. That being said the samsung community is making a lot of progress, and HTC/Samsung cross modding is in full swing. Be patient.
Sent from my SPH-D700 using XDA App
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You have a good point, and I have no problem waiting. I suppose I was just sharing my reflections.
Sent from my GT-I9000 using XDA App

I share you feelings somewhat. Thats why I picked a ROM (Cognition 2.1.6) and will stick with it until Froyo officially drops for the Captivate. I also hate having to restore a phone after a flash which is why I choose not to do it often.

vbhines said:
My point is that I think the Galaxy S line is a harbinger of things to come for Android. I hope I'm wrong, but as Android becomes increasingly mainstream, it also becomes increasingly less important to deliver function AND form.
The average consumer wants sexiness with phrases like "dual-core" listed in the specs, regardless of what the device can actually deliver.
Sent from my GT-I9000 using XDA App
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I actually agree here. But this is sort of Google's thing in a lot of areas. Google Wave, Google Buzz etc. Google MASTERS searching. And everything else they throw stuff on a wall and some sticks and some don't. I worried about that with Android from the very beginning. They often times release half finished products and then allow the devs to finish (or not in some cases) the future of the product/service.
By going to 100 different carriers in 100 different iterations google may very well stop caring about the polished product and just allow the devs to do the rest.

When I had my HTC Hero I had a Flash addiction. Now I just have decided to stick with one build and update it when updates happen. There have been quite a few VERY recent improvements. SetIron's kernel is a fine example. Stuff is happening at a much faster pace than it was when I got my phone 2 months ago. There are twice as many ROMS if not more. Things are going blow wide open when Official Froyo and its source code drop. I think there was stagnent developing at first because we all knew Froyo was coming. If we're lucky Froyo and Gingerbread will share the same kernel so porting IT won't be a big deal either.

FWIW, The Captivate hasn't been out anywhere near as long as the Incredible. Give the Devs some time - it can only get better.

rfarrah said:
FWIW, The Captivate hasn't been out anywhere near as long as the Incredible. Give the Devs some time - it can only get better.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I think his frustration is more that we have this incredible piece of hardware and the less than stellar job that Samsung has done to finish it off on the software side. If it wasn't for the devs/cookers I probably would have sold my Captivate by now, and I have only had it for 1 month, coming from a Milestone.
Samsung, hire some of these devs to fix your mess you call a kernel and os. Without the lagfixes from the devs this phone responds worse than my Milestone.

bradasmith said:
I think his frustration is more that we have this incredible piece of hardware and the less than stellar job that Samsung has done to finish it off on the software side. If it wasn't for the devs/cookers I probably would have sold my Captivate by now, and I have only had it for 1 month, coming from a Milestone.
Samsung, hire some of these devs to fix your mess you call a kernel and os. Without the lagfixes from the devs this phone responds worse than my Milestone.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
+1
Thank you for saying what I was trying to, but in far fewer words.

the galaxy s phones might be the last of the phones not locked by the manufacturer. and i like the samsung software package but dislike that it only works if x or y componant is still there. i dont get the appeal of aosp for an every day rom but i get that it is a transition for porting other things, once we know what we need to make the phone work with aosp we can make it work with anything. and i think that people arent giving samsung enough credit for support on the device. the stock rom was buggy and jf7 came out and made things better, now we are waiting on froyo and im sure it will be better yet, if the the leaked copies are an indication then froyo should be quite good.
i think the multi step proceedures is dev preferance for clearing data, there have been roms that you can flash over and keep everything. the other issue is lagfixes which aren't available(or needed) on other devices. the lagfix is part of those oh sh!t moments where you need odin, also having odin available is another avenue for the devs. if we could only flash from recovery you would see alot more cockwork flashable roms that are compatable with multiple lagfixes.
i messed with an evo and really got an apreciation for samsung, i felt the evo was of low build quality and that odin flashing a rooted rom is much more convenient than the rage against the cage meathod of adb pushing files and rooting and recovery flashing. rooting a galaxy s is rediculously easy, just an update.zip, or an one click app on the phone, or a one click app on a pc. or for froyo a 3click kernel flash in odin then an update.zip. or flashing a rooted rom with odin.
i have made many noob mistakes and taken risks and got it running every time. i dont know about the incredible but i think with some other devices i would have either bricked or pulled all my hair out fixing it.
i was in the airforce and one thing that people always said was that the two best bases are the one you last came from and the next one you are going to. people were always telling stories about "back in kirkland...." and "when i get to misawa..." but people were always complaining about there current base. i have a fealing that in year or two when we have new phones we will see many thing we hate about those as well. and if we had motorolas we'd hate those and if we had incredibles we see the galaxy s playing asphalt 5 from samsung apps and be like if only my phone could do 3d like that one.

I have one issue with my phone, the GPS. While I'm mad it doesn't really work it's something I NEVER use. Other than that I'm running the latest Cognition rom and couldn't be happier.

gunnyman said:
.....Things are going blow wide open when Official Froyo and its source code drop. I think there was stagnent developing at first because we all knew Froyo was coming.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I think this is 100% the reason. I fully expect that there will be some amazing things done and some great roms released.
I don't know if it was mentioned or not already but the reason why there are so many beta versions of roms and why newer versions open up issues is for the same reason as above, no source code available. So be patient and I promise you'll be kicking yourself for making this thread.

I am not a programmer, just a user with some technical expertise, but I love these open source OS's. I jumped on Linux as soon as MS Vista came out and the improvements and leaps forward by that community on the desktops has been amazing. When I opened a Win7 PC for the first time, I realized Microsoft is now copying Linux, not the other way around. Just last week I looked at the new MAC OS and I wanted to scream that they were ripping off the XFCE GUI in Linux. Linux is leading the way in Netbooks now and embedded devices are now a focus. If you have ever flashed a router with Tomato, or one of the other Linux router OS's, you know what amazing things routers are now capable of. And then we have smart phones and make no mistake, Android is just Linux in a smart phone. We don't have to deal with a proprietary systems from MS or Apple, where you only get what they hand out to you. This is Burger King baby, you get it your way. Google may be the name on this open source OS, but it belongs to us all. Google can not take this OS proprietary. Yet any time we, the people, wish we can spin off another branch of development with those things we want. OS's like Meego (and I'm sure there will be others) should be able to be ported over, if we wish, in the near future. We may be looking at an era where we can truly buy the smart phone of our choice, install our OS of choice and choose our carrier of choice with ease.
Bottomline here is you can help. If you are not a dev, or a programmer, you can still contribute to this by continuing to use these builds, and report bugs, and you can contribute money to any of the open source efforts, particularly in areas where you want to see more effort. You don't have to sit on the side lines anymore and just whine about how you are getting the short end of the stick by the big corporations. Open Source belongs to us all, take ownership.

i dont think apple is really copying xfce. ..macosx versions are terminal based and therefor unix like and very similar to linux. x11 window environments have been around for many year. xfce doesn't offer that much that i know of that isn't in others window managers. it is possible that the developers on all sides are taking ideas from each other, but i think since power user often have a lot of shortcuts setup to get through common tasks faster that they are implementing some of these things as presets. similarities can just as easily similar minds overcoming very common problems. granted many developers may be running alternate os's and may be inspired by the other. not that i dont believe in corperate espionage i certainly do but i think a lot of things are just obvious solutions.
the problem with phones is that the manufacturers can lock us out and the locks can be difficult to break. you are right that google doesnt own the os but the manufacturers have proprietary source along side the source that they must release because it was taken from google. at some point it makes development dificult. i think we need an emphasis on aosp to build roms from. not because i like the google software, i find it plain and ugly, but because once aosp is figured out there is more understanding of how it all fits together and ports become easier.
i just cant wait to see the day when we can custom order aosp compatible hardware and build phones based on what our priorities are and what we can afford. i know we cant actually solder the boards our selves with surface mount but it could be done on an assembly line with robots if a manufacturer decided to use them to there full potential.

vbhines said:
Thanks for your thoughts. I thought I had posted in "Captivate General", not "Captivate Troll." My mistake.
I have actually tried just about all the ROMs available. You may have noticed that I stated that this is not a Dev issue. I doubt many can do better than the talented developers we have here - I know I couldn't. Hell, even Samsung can't.
My point is that I think the Galaxy S line is a harbinger of things to come for Android. I hope I'm wrong, but as Android becomes increasingly mainstream, it also becomes increasingly less important to deliver function AND form.
The average consumer wants sexiness with phrases like "dual-core" listed in the specs, regardless of what the device can actually deliver.
Sent from my GT-I9000 using XDA App
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I couldn't agree with your more about your criticism about Samsung - but I'm not sure how this applies for Android as a whole. The closest thing you can say is Android fails to exclude poorly performing companies - but that's not much of a statement, is it?
Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I897 using XDA App

GreenWolf70 said:
I am not a programmer, just a user with some technical expertise, but I love these open source OS's. I jumped on Linux as soon as MS Vista came out and the improvements and leaps forward by that community on the desktops has been amazing. When I opened a Win7 PC for the first time, I realized Microsoft is now copying Linux, not the other way around. Just last week I looked at the new MAC OS and I wanted to scream that they were ripping off the XFCE GUI in Linux. Linux is leading the way in Netbooks now and embedded devices are now a focus. If you have ever flashed a router with Tomato, or one of the other Linux router OS's, you know what amazing things routers are now capable of. And then we have smart phones and make no mistake, Android is just Linux in a smart phone. We don't have to deal with a proprietary systems from MS or Apple, where you only get what they hand out to you. This is Burger King baby, you get it your way. Google may be the name on this open source OS, but it belongs to us all. Google can not take this OS proprietary. Yet any time we, the people, wish we can spin off another branch of development with those things we want. OS's like Meego (and I'm sure there will be others) should be able to be ported over, if we wish, in the near future. We may be looking at an era where we can truly buy the smart phone of our choice, install our OS of choice and choose our carrier of choice with ease.
Bottomline here is you can help. If you are not a dev, or a programmer, you can still contribute to this by continuing to use these builds, and report bugs, and you can contribute money to any of the open source efforts, particularly in areas where you want to see more effort. You don't have to sit on the side lines anymore and just whine about how you are getting the short end of the stick by the big corporations. Open Source belongs to us all, take ownership.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
This is one of the best posts I have read on this forum. What a great insight into the evolution of the smartphone, it damn near brought a tear to my eye and sure as hell made me proud to be an owner and defender of the ideal of Open Source. Sure, my Captivate isn't perfect, but I continue to try new ROM's and use my technical proficiency to try and reason out any bugs so as to provide useful feedback. In turn, these ROM's continue to get better and everyone profits.
I love you guys... *group hug*

Dani897 said:
the galaxy s phones might be the last of the phones not locked by the manufacturer. and i like the samsung software package but dislike that it only works if x or y componant is still there. i dont get the appeal of aosp for an every day rom but i get that it is a transition for porting other things, once we know what we need to make the phone work with aosp we can make it work with anything. and i think that people arent giving samsung enough credit for support on the device. the stock rom was buggy and jf7 came out and made things better, now we are waiting on froyo and im sure it will be better yet, if the the leaked copies are an indication then froyo should be quite good.
i think the multi step proceedures is dev preferance for clearing data, there have been roms that you can flash over and keep everything. the other issue is lagfixes which aren't available(or needed) on other devices. the lagfix is part of those oh sh!t moments where you need odin, also having odin available is another avenue for the devs. if we could only flash from recovery you would see alot more cockwork flashable roms that are compatable with multiple lagfixes.
i messed with an evo and really got an apreciation for samsung, i felt the evo was of low build quality and that odin flashing a rooted rom is much more convenient than the rage against the cage meathod of adb pushing files and rooting and recovery flashing. rooting a galaxy s is rediculously easy, just an update.zip, or an one click app on the phone, or a one click app on a pc. or for froyo a 3click kernel flash in odin then an update.zip. or flashing a rooted rom with odin.
i have made many noob mistakes and taken risks and got it running every time. i dont know about the incredible but i think with some other devices i would have either bricked or pulled all my hair out fixing it.
i was in the airforce and one thing that people always said was that the two best bases are the one you last came from and the next one you are going to. people were always telling stories about "back in kirkland...." and "when i get to misawa..." but people were always complaining about there current base. i have a fealing that in year or two when we have new phones we will see many thing we hate about those as well. and if we had motorolas we'd hate those and if we had incredibles we see the galaxy s playing asphalt 5 from samsung apps and be like if only my phone could do 3d like that one.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
GreenWolf70 said:
I am not a programmer, just a user with some technical expertise, but I love these open source OS's. I jumped on Linux as soon as MS Vista came out and the improvements and leaps forward by that community on the desktops has been amazing. When I opened a Win7 PC for the first time, I realized Microsoft is now copying Linux, not the other way around. Just last week I looked at the new MAC OS and I wanted to scream that they were ripping off the XFCE GUI in Linux. Linux is leading the way in Netbooks now and embedded devices are now a focus. If you have ever flashed a router with Tomato, or one of the other Linux router OS's, you know what amazing things routers are now capable of. And then we have smart phones and make no mistake, Android is just Linux in a smart phone. We don't have to deal with a proprietary systems from MS or Apple, where you only get what they hand out to you. This is Burger King baby, you get it your way. Google may be the name on this open source OS, but it belongs to us all. Google can not take this OS proprietary. Yet any time we, the people, wish we can spin off another branch of development with those things we want. OS's like Meego (and I'm sure there will be others) should be able to be ported over, if we wish, in the near future. We may be looking at an era where we can truly buy the smart phone of our choice, install our OS of choice and choose our carrier of choice with ease.
Bottomline here is you can help. If you are not a dev, or a programmer, you can still contribute to this by continuing to use these builds, and report bugs, and you can contribute money to any of the open source efforts, particularly in areas where you want to see more effort. You don't have to sit on the side lines anymore and just whine about how you are getting the short end of the stick by the big corporations. Open Source belongs to us all, take ownership.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
EsotericPunk said:
This is one of the best posts I have read on this forum. What a great insight into the evolution of the smartphone, it damn near brought a tear to my eye and sure as hell made me proud to be an owner and defender of the ideal of Open Source. Sure, my Captivate isn't perfect, but I continue to try new ROM's and use my technical proficiency to try and reason out any bugs so as to provide useful feedback. In turn, these ROM's continue to get better and everyone profits.
I love you guys... *group hug*
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Well said Androiders!
+10

Then go wait on the sidelines for a cyanogen port. We, galaxy s phone owners. Don't and won't need huge steps beyond what we have. Your expectations are limited to what your old phone needed to perform.
You are right its silly. And unnecessary. Find a new hobby if porting roms isn't doing it for you.
vbhines said:
First, let me say up front that I have the utmost respect for the developers in the Captivate forum. It's a handicapped device that has much more potential than I think we'll ever be able to tap, simply because there isn't much motivation for Samsung to fix its biggest issues. Let's face it: The things we like most about our favorite Android handsets are precisely the things that make them seem "too complex" to the non non-technical general public. I think that the Galaxy S line has been a huge dissapointment to enthusiasts, and a big "ooh, ahh" for the iPhone-types.
That being said, let me move on to my main gripe: Through my Droid Incredible, I fell in love with flashing ROMs. If it had a higher build number, I flashed it. And you know why? Because it was better a better build. Newer baseband versions fixed more problems than it caused. I could flash ROMs on a train versus needing to be at my desktop for an exhaustive multi-step shamble. And when ROMs were released from build to build, developers in general knew what to expect as far as results.
I simply can't say that that's true with the Captivate. I'm growing increasingly frustrated with this phone and it's idiocy. I hate having ROMs with "Beta 9.3.5" after their title. I hate that half of the releases are to take out some Samsung crap, replace it with some AOSP-like goodness, just to see what sticks.
Again, it's not a condemnation of the Devs. They have made this phone tolerable, which is no small task. I just think it's a sad state of affairs when an OS based on an open source foundation has been so brutally slapped together that it makes a phone with the looks and hardware specs of a Ferrari about as much fun to own and maintain as a Yugo.
Who's with me on this one?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I897 using XDA App

[Q] Android App Emulator

I'm much like several of the people who bought TouchPads in the recent firesale. I absolutely love WebOs and the device in general but the thing that's bothering me is that the app selection is absolutely horrible! I know that there is an Android App Emulator on the PlayBook, is it possible for something like that to show up on the TouchPad? I love WebOS and I don't really want to give it up for only Android. I'm sure tons of people would really like something like this on their new Touchpads. Thanks!

Sounds like a great idea hmm...

I agree. I think that porting Dalvik to WebOS might be the best move to give us the Android apps and still let us easily use Linux, including ubuntu apps.

Well the problem would be the license..

lol...good point

license issues?
I thought it was opensource/freeware? How else could Cyanogen, etc., do what they do?

is it possible to port alien dalvik to the TouchPad? We should get some developers on this.

FAILHARD said:
is it possible to port alien dalvik to the TouchPad? We should get some developers on this.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You took the words right out of my mouth!!
I'm actually trying to find developers for the exact same thing. It should be doable. Alien Dalvik was made in Qt which was ported to WebOS so in theory it's entirley doable. the only question is if there are any developers free to take it on that aren't currently working on a full Android OS port.
I'd really like to get a development team set up for this because alot of people would like to keep WebOS and just have a larger app catalog.

Yeah, exactly what I was thinking. We should look for a dev who could possibly have experience it Qt, though that's not completely necessary. If we gain more support, I'll post a dev thread.

I can't offer anything other than Beer/Pizza money but this is a great idea. WebOS is generally well reviewed and not looked at as a problem so much as a benefit. The OS is solid. The App Catalog is not.

Android Emulator :-D
I would love see a emulator on my TP. I would like to be able to place Android on the device I still much prefer the UI and design on WebOS even though Android is far more capable.
I'm happy to donate to this cause should someone take it up

alien dalvik is not open source, however, dalvik in general as well as the whole android os is under the apache license, this can be modified, forked and reworked (such as myriad turbo/alien dalvik) without having to release the source, its obviously possible... But you know what would be easier, porting android as a whole... Even dual booting would be easier.

Well the allure of this is having the superior Android app selection on the arguably better tablet experience of WebOS. If that were made possible - I wouldn't care about having Android on the device.

I couldn't agree more. As an OG Pre owner I love webOS but couldn't fight everything I can do with Android.
If I could get all my Android apps and keep my TP the way it is would be perfect.
The problem with porting Android right now is we have to use 2.3 which is for phones and not 3.2. I would rather either wait for ICS/4.0 for a port or just get the app market working.
Sent from my PG86100 using XDA Premium App

That settles it there are enoght people interested in having a standalone WebOs android app emulator without having full android.. I'm starting a development thread, doing some preliminary work, and going to look for a few interested developers to work with on getting this going. My touchpad comes tomorrow so then i can really get into it..

Thanks Roto I was just about to do the same.

also, Roto post a link

Up. Beer on me

Here is the link to the development thread.
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?p=16904876#post16904876
Failhard since you and I were the first to put in work on this idea i'd like you to help me head the project and find volunteer talent if you're up to it.
I took a look into what goes into a Dalvik port... it's TOTALLY doable just a matter of time and effort..
Unfortunately after i return to college in a week time will be in short supply for me so ALL help is appreciated!

I had never used WebOS before getting a tablet this last weekend. I have been an android fan for smartphones for now (I am willing to move to something better when it is available, otherwise stick to what works). I am a web designer/user interface designer and since starting using WebOS this last weekend, when it comes to the OS and its default apps that come with it, it is clear WebOS has the best user interface of the tablets (I used both iOS and Android OSes 1.5-3.2, Windows 7 tablets don't really count as a tablet OS and that is clear when using it on tablets).
The Android Emulator would be a great idea, but if you want quick development specifically for WebOS, we need to get a program created that can easily and painlessly port android apps to WebOS apps. Also it will take HP courting and reassuring the big players like Netflix, Hulu, Corporate IT Software Development companies that WebOS is viable and have continued support.
HP/WebOS only has a short amount of time to really establish itself. Next summer is rumored to be Windows 8 release and Windows 8 tablets coming. If Windows 8 can create a good tablet interface (WebOS is the one to beat imo atm as it has the number 1 interface), plus it's strong backing of games, program/application support and being able to integrate phone, xbox, tablet, and PC (Desktops and Laptops). Windows 8 is the biggest threat to anyone in the tablet market at the moment imo and they have been very successful in many of their endeavors as of late ("don't poke the sleeping giant" comes to mind, google and Apple have done that).
Due this short Window of time (pun partially intended), we have to establish WebOS as a main competitor to Google and Apple and prepare it for the onslaught of Windows 8. We need to work as a community to get things rolling and we need to push HP to court the big players in the industry to produce apps and content for WebOS and to continue further development on the operating system on their end. If we as a community and HP execute right, it will be a very exciting year coming up.

Amazon's iPad Killer on way

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Amazon's now entering the tablet market with it's kindle, but this is no ordinary kindle. The Kindle Tab, has a 7 inch Capacitive color display and runs Android.
The report has leaked at TechCrunch, by MB Siegler and apparently he was not allowed to leak any pictures of the tab. But he has mentioned that the form factor of the kindle tab is much like the Blackberry PlayBook, in size and shape.
The Kindle Tablet has a back-lit colored display unlike the e-ink in the kindle currently we have, he also added that the multi-touch is more of two finger touch unlike the iPad ten finger touch.
The Android user interface Kindle Tab uses is unlike we have ever seen, it is a mix of Black & Orange and has a iTunes cover flow like interface. The favorite apps can be pinned on to desktop and the top bar shows "YOUR NAME's Kindle". To add up to the amazing UI the notifications appear in a bright orange colored tab, which looks very soothing.
There are no physical buttons on the whole tablet, but the one thing which is going to take this Android Tablet the long way is its ability to access the Amazon content store in one touch, which includes the Amazon App Store, Amazon Cloud Player, and obviously the Amazon Book Store.
The only drawback is that the tablet would not be receiving any Honeycomb or Ice Cream Sandwich, it will run on its native Android 2.2 Froyo with Amazons custom UI.
Talking on the hardware specs, the Kindle Tab (7-inch) runs on a single core processor and has a 6GB on-board storage. It shall be available in both Wifi only and Wifi + 3G versions from the various carriers. It has a battery backup of about 10hrs, which is pretty good compared to other tablets.
The outer body is much like the Blacknerry PlayBook with its Black rubbery back, and its top positioned speakers.
The Kindle tablet is designed for dedicated book readers who love their Kindle, but need a colored version with more power, Android and NO CAMERA.
The Amazons Kindle Tab 7-inch should be hitting the market by November 2011 for 250$ only
Source GizMee

The article is a pure rip-off of techcrunch's original article by MG Siegler.
The picture is a COMPLETE fake (used by Gizmee to attract visitors), nothing else.
This is not an iPad killer at all! It's a low-end android based ebook by Amazon. Please stop comparing it with higher end tablets.
Next time, use the correct source.
Edit: Noticed your username, it all makes sense now. Please stop this unfair practice. Come again with original and rather more creative articles.

sygeek said:
The article is a pure rip-off of techcrunch's original article by MG Siegler.
The picture is a COMPLETE fake (used by Gizmee to attract visitors), nothing else.
This is not an iPad killer at all! It's a low-end android based ebook by Amazon. Please stop comparing it with higher end tablets.
Next time, use the correct source.
Edit: Noticed your username, it all makes sense now. Please stop this unfair practice. Come again with original and rather more creative articles.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Don't hold back....... tell him how you Really feel......... Also, I agree...

Android is just no good for tablets.

I don't understand this "ipad" or "iphone" killer phrase.
Apple has been around for a long time, they're not going anywhere.
Even with Android completely owning the marketshare, Apple is just fine where they're at.
No single Tablet/Phone/OS is going to "kill" Apple.
z33dev33l said:
Android is just no good for tablets.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Why are you on an Android forum?
Seriously, you have NOTHING positive to say.
Have you EVER used Honeycomb?
Find something better to do with your time.

Android scores
Android devices have more functions than Apple

Why are you on an Android forum?
Seriously, you have NOTHING positive to say.
Have you EVER used Honeycomb?
Find something better to do with your time.[/QUOTE]
I think he meant Froyo, he can't possibly be talking about HC

Sorry but this is not an Android forum - it's for general xda stuff that does not have a dedicated section.
Just add him to your ignore list if he bothers you so much.

Tone_ said:
Sorry but this is not an Android forum - it's for general xda stuff that does not have a dedicated section.
Just add him to your ignore list if he bothers you so much.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Its still a mainly android community.
Every post he makes is anti Android...so why post in an android community?

mattykinsx said:
Its still a mainly android community.
Every post he makes is anti Android...so why post in an android community?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Because he's a troll.

mattykinsx said:
Its still a mainly android community.
Every post he makes is anti Android...so why post in an android community?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Lots of WinMo/Windows Phone users here. XDA's roots are from WinMo anyway.
As for his comments - I agree. Android is no good for tablets. Not necessarily because it's bad but because it's not the best. Tablets are right now novelty third choice devices behind smart phones and desktop/laptop computers. You don't need one, and you'll only think about getting one after having the first two. They're pretty much impulse buys for early adopters, and I don't think anyone outside of the Android diehards or really cheap-o's are going to go for the Android tablets. Honeycomb is half baked and the apps just aren't there. It's basically your Android phone blown up that includes the same app ecosystem that isn't anywhere near as good as iOS's. The iPad is very much the same, just more polished and with an incredibly innovative and robust app ecosystem. I think all current tablets are a waste of time.
One thing is for sure, Android isn't going to take over but Windows 8 might (and I personally think will completely dominate the market within 2-3 years).

I love these comments about Honeycomb.
While the apps to go with Android tablets don't compare to the iPad apps, yet, that doesn't mean anything for Honeycomb itself.
It's a beautiful OS. And great for tablets.
I would even go as far as making the claim that it is better than IOS is on the iPad.

Its not an android community, its a community for developers to meet and discuss. The fact that I dislike android tablets is not something that shouldn't be posted. For every action there is an equal and opposite reaction. Android is too slow for a tablet in my opinion, I want a speedy OS for a tablet experience, I want something that feels fast, fluid, and smooth. I want something with a pleasant UI and I want something where I dont have to concern myself with app compatibility. Hell, I prefer my windows XP tablet to the current offerings. I hope windows 8 changes that. Android is just too broken for me. For every selling point there's an equally large flaw and that's my issue.

z33dev33l said:
Its not an android community, its a community for developers to meet and discuss. The fact that I dislike android tablets is not something that shouldn't be posted. For every action there is an equal and opposite reaction. Android is too slow for a tablet in my opinion, I want a speedy OS for a tablet experience, I want something that feels fast, fluid, and smooth. I want something with a pleasant UI and I want something where I dont have to concern myself with app compatibility. Hell, I prefer my windows XP tablet to the current offerings. I hope windows 8 changes that. Android is just too broken for me. For every selling point there's an equally large flaw and that's my issue.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
It's a predominately android community. You make comments with no information given all the time to try to start a fight and it's beyond ridiculous.
By this post you have clearly shown that you have never used Honeycomb.
Of course, I should expect this from the same person that tried to skew data for no other reason than to make Android look bad and try to stir the pot.
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=1206411
You are entitled to your own opinion, of course, but it is wrong to make judgement on something that you clearly have not even tried.

Another "me too" nook color device... great. A degradation to the kindle lineage.

mattykinsx said:
It's a predominately android community. You make comments with no information given all the time to try to start a fight and it's beyond ridiculous.
By this post you have clearly shown that you have never used Honeycomb.
Of course, I should expect this from the same person that tried to skew data for no other reason than to make Android look bad and try to stir the pot.
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=1206411
You are entitled to your own opinion, of course, but it is wrong to make judgement on something that you clearly have not even tried.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I have tried honeycomb, actually have it on a nexus S and on a tab. Its not any more impressive than any other build, even less so as a number of the apps dont work or display very small. As for my prior mistake that can be blamed entirely on wmpoweruser.com who reported what I said, the skewed data was on their part. I have since found out that they are a very biased site and only about 1/5 of their blogs aren't a comparison of how much better we are than android. This does not change the fact that I feel android is actually even worse than ios on tablets and that says something as ios is bad on iPhones and garish on tablets.

z33dev33l said:
I have tried honeycomb, actually have it on a nexus S and on a tab. Its not any more impressive than any other build, even less so as a number of the apps dont work or display very small. As for my prior mistake that can be blamed entirely on wmpoweruser.com who reported what I said, the skewed data was on their part. I have since found out that they are a very biased site and only about 1/5 of their blogs aren't a comparison of how much better we are than android. This does not change the fact that I feel android is actually even worse than ios on tablets and that says something as ios is bad on iPhones and garish on tablets.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Please support your points by some brief explanation to each of those statements. Else, it sounds like you're just trolling OR are an android hateboy.
Keep in mind that everyone is entitled to his/her opinion, wrong/right. Some opinions are justified by plain laid facts, some are just ignorant. You seem to be the latter. I would want to treat someone like you the same way, *add to ignore list*.
Also, it doesn't really make sense using something you don't like, on your primary devices. Add to that, you're using it on smartphone too, a device not created for such an OS.
I still doubt if you've ever used honeycomb other than relying on (anti-android) blog reviews.

sygeek said:
Please support your points by some brief explanation to each of those statements. Else, it sounds like you're just trolling OR are an android hateboy.
Keep in mind that everyone is entitled to his/her opinion, wrong/right. Some opinions are justified by plain laid facts, some are just ignorant. You seem to be the latter. I would want to treat someone like you the same way, *add to ignore list*.
Also, it doesn't really make sense using something you don't like, on your primary devices. Add to that, you're using it on smartphone too, a device not created for such an OS.
I still doubt if you've ever used honeycomb other than relying on (anti-android) blog reviews.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
those aren't my primary devices, they're devices that I use to test apps and such when I do bother devving for android (which is becoming less and less frequent.) tell me, what fact do I need to back up? Even on the iPad (which is a complete joke) ios is fully hardware accelerated, plays the vast majority of the apps that the iPhone does, and that's about the only arguments I have in the ipads favor but it's more than I can say about android/honeycomb. It was and is a beta OS that was never completed. Most of the games I played on the tab either had fixed dimensions or would FC whenever I tried opening them. I would never use android devices as my primary devices, I have a dell venue pro and an aging XP tablet for that.

Ignoring the fact that "<something> killer" is a stupid phrase, what exactly is it about this tablet that is supposedly capable of killing the iPad? Cos well, I don't get it.

Gusar321 said:
Ignoring the fact that "<something> killer" is a stupid phrase, what exactly is it about this tablet that is supposedly capable of killing the iPad? Cos well, I don't get it.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Maybe it hunts in packs, or drops down on unsuspecting ipads from low branches?

[Q] Is Android truly open ?

The iPhone is closed and Android is open.
Well!
That's the conventional wisdom about the dueling mobile operating systems. Apple's iPhone operating system runs only on Apple's iPhone (plus the iPad and iPod), and every app must be approved by the company before it appears on the App Store. Android, which Google gives away for free, runs on dozens of phones from many different carriers, and anyone can freely upload new apps to the Android Market without approval.
But that conventional wisdom is showing a few cracks, at least on the Android side. Take the flashy new Bing app for Android, announced today by Microsoft: It's not available to all Android phone users -- only the ones that use Verizon.
Shame

I think you don understand the concept of open source.
Pls brush up your knowledge before commenting.
Plus OS and apps are two different things. Don mix the soup with curry and start talking nonsense
Sent from my GT-N7000

Brush your brain idiot

francomur99 said:
Brush your brain idiot
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
brush your own brain.
android is open means it is open source, we know the source of android.
it does not meat, everyone gets every app instantly..

Don waste time explaining to him if he refuses to listen or learn. Mod can close this thread.
Sent from my GT-N7000

Is it just me or everyone is being super-aggresive here?

What are you talking about? Try to install Bing app and you will see that is not available anymore in Google Play Store or whatever you want to call it...then try to install the apk and you will get the web search is been stopped from an unknwon service or Big brother or whatever you want to call it. Don't try to be smart with me because you were just a little child when I started to work in the mobile industry... I hate people that attack without know anything about it.. Android is a disgrace !!...
From my Htc Sensation Xe
Frank

francomur99 said:
What are you talking about? Try to install Bing app and you will see that is not available anymore in Google Play Store or whatever you want to call it...then try to install the apk and you will get the web search is been stopped from an unknwon service or Big brother or whatever you want to call it. Don't try to be smart with me because you were just a little child when I started to work in the mobile industry... I hate people that attack without know anything about it.. Android is a disgrace !!...
From my Htc Sensation Xe
Frank
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I don know where you pick up your knowledge about the mobile industry. *facepalm*
This is clearly an app problem and has nothing to do with the OS.
Your thread should be asking about bing app and not about android.
Email to the bing app team instead of whining here
Edit: there must be a reason why it is taken down from the play store. They might be repairing some bug. And the server might be down while they are fixing it.
Sent from my GT-N7000

francomur99 said:
What are you talking about? Try to install Bing app and you will see that is not available anymore in Google Play Store or whatever you want to call it...then try to install the apk and you will get the web search is been stopped from an unknwon service or Big brother or whatever you want to call it. Don't try to be smart with me because you were just a little child when I started to work in the mobile industry... I hate people that attack without know anything about it.. Android is a disgrace !!...
From my Htc Sensation Xe
Frank
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
you still don't understand what open means

You don't have to tell me what is open source...even the walls know the basic concept. The thing is that Google has lost the control of android...to me a mobile OS fragmentation is bad....Onestly I don't even remember the exact number of android devices that I had in my hands ...rooted and not, with Sense or Cyanogen or even MIUI and just one iPhone4S with Jailbreak obviously....the true is that the iPhone 4S just works...it just works..how many times to I have to say it...if just was a little bit bigger would be perfect....and one more thing I have Bing also on 3 Uk carrier while with all the android devices I cannot have it anymore....shame one more time Google-android because Bing's unavailability is not the only problem...I could write a book to report all the android's problem.....Yes Ok the Widgets are nice but is not the only thing that count....the eco-system is more important than widgets believe me.
Respect

ofcourse it is open..it is linux and linux is an open source..

@francomur99 , please don't insult people by calling them to brush their own brains . You should mind your language on this forum . And , if this is about the app problem , you should make a thread about Bing and don't make the matter worse by saying is it truly open rather than talking about the app . Because this is unfortunately not what you wanted to ask right? Do not say about others first , say about yourself first . Because , mainly people like this don't tend to know what they're doing in the first place . It is an open source btw . Did that solve your question ?

francomur99 said:
You don't have to tell me what is open source...even the walls know the basic concept. The thing is that Google has lost the control of android...to me a mobile OS fragmentation is bad....Onestly I don't even remember the exact number of android devices that I had in my hands ...rooted and not, with Sense or Cyanogen or even MIUI and just one iPhone4S with Jailbreak obviously....the true is that the iPhone 4S just works...it just works..how many times to I have to say it...if just was a little bit bigger would be perfect....and one more thing I have Bing also on 3 Uk carrier while with all the android devices I cannot have it anymore....shame one more time Google-android because Bing's unavailability is not the only problem...I could write a book to report all the android's problem.....Yes Ok the Widgets are nice but is not the only thing that count....the eco-system is more important than widgets believe me.
Respect
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
bugs has nothing to do with opensource or being openly developed.
its simply means anyone can use or abuse it (like you try to say). thats the deal with open source and environment.
its like a garden open to everybody and no one takes care of it, it dies at the end and no longer will be a garden where everyone is taking care of it together. Google only cares of the OS and drastic meassures someone make a hack to dial dirty numbers or so.
if android was closed like apple, you would see only what google wanted. you would get only that app google approved and yes, you would have only google phones out and it would become a gimmick like iPhone.
and winphone and other bada operating systems would gain more market value.
your specific Verizon issue is with Microsoft and another company, not Android or Google in this case, they just gave the option to restrict distribution, the choice is the developer of the product.

Here is a great article i just read that talks about some of the major problems with android right now.
http://betanews.com/2012/04/28/goog...n=Feed+-+bn+-+Betanews+Full+Content+Feed+-+BN
Honestly I would love to see android be just android. All phones running the same version of android. I understand that no all phones can run 4.0 but every phone that runs 2.x should run the same version of 2.x, and every phone that runs 4.0 should run the same version of 4.0.
One of the biggest takeaways i had from the article above is that with apple, you are buying into a lifestyle. Everything is integrated, and the experience is the same across ALL hardware.
Heres to hoping for the best.

I'll jump into this flame-fest......
No one uses bing. Who cares?
That fragmentation nonsense is just hilarous, and is nothing more than a person trying to laughably say they are better than someone else because they chose to use a different phone.
17 year old emo kids who hang out at the apple store all day keep shouting that. What they fail to realize is that "fragmentation" = choice. If you want that "unfragmented" same old same old android phone, it's simple....buy a nexus device. Vanilla android right out of the gate.
But if you want "fragmentation" err, excuse me, what a normal person would consider *alternative choices* you can pick up any of the dozens or android phones currently sold that have carrier and manufacturer implemented changes. Some are subtle, some are very different.
In short, you are not superior to someone else because you drive a Chevy and they drive a Ford, because you use an Android and they use Winmobile, because you have a PS3 and they have an Xbox360. There is no better, there's only what a person prefers. For them. The worst kind of person in today's society is commonly believed to be a religious zealot, going around preaching to every one else how they are wrong because they go to a different church, or they go to one at all. They believe something, so they have to try and convince the rest of the world that what they believe is superior!
No one cares. Seriously, calm down, pour the kool-aid into the sink, and listen to what you are saying.

Cirkustanz said:
I'll jump into this flame-fest......
No one uses bing. Who cares?
That fragmentation nonsense is just hilarous, and is nothing more than a person trying to laughably say they are better than someone else because they chose to use a different phone.
17 year old emo kids who hang out at the apple store all day keep shouting that. What they fail to realize is that "fragmentation" = choice. If you want that "unfragmented" same old same old android phone, it's simple....buy a nexus device. Vanilla android right out of the gate.
But if you want "fragmentation" err, excuse me, what a normal person would consider *alternative choices* you can pick up any of the dozens or android phones currently sold that have carrier and manufacturer implemented changes. Some are subtle, some are very different.
In short, you are not superior to someone else because you drive a Chevy and they drive a Ford, because you use an Android and they use Winmobile, because you have a PS3 and they have an Xbox360. There is no better, there's only what a person prefers. For them. The worst kind of person in today's society is commonly believed to be a religious zealot, going around preaching to every one else how they are wrong because they go to a different church, or they go to one at all. They believe something, so they have to try and convince the rest of the world that what they believe is superior!
No one cares. Seriously, calm down, pour the kool-aid into the sink, and listen to what you are saying.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Hold on so your saying that having touchwiz, sense, and blur help Android...
Sent from my SGH-T989 using xda premium

Dougshell said:
Hold on so your saying that having touchwiz, sense, and blur help Android...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
its linux , get used to it.
Linux got as example Kde , Gnome etc.. never been a problem or fragmented, so having different frontends on mobile is just a company trend, until Google takes on the task to control the mobil interface, and then you're lost like users with iPhone, no chance of changes onless you got apples approval.

Dexter_nlb said:
its linux , get used to it.
Linux got as example Kde , Gnome etc.. never been a problem or fragmented, so having different frontends on mobile is just a company trend, until Google takes on the task to control the mobil interface, and then you're lost like users with iPhone, no chance of changes onless you got apples approval.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Unfortunately your comparison doesn't work. I can install kubuntu and easily remove all traces of kde and replace it with gnome...try that with touchwiz
Sent from my SGH-T989 using xda premium

If this discussion is going to continue, please keep the flaming/name-calling/fanboism out of it. Debating the merits of different mobile platforms will go on forever, and almost always results in the issues I just mentioned. Let's try to not let that happen here.

Your concept of open source is funny lol
Sent from my GT-I9100 using XDA

Which OS?

Hey guys! Which OS you all foresee that will become the next trendsetter in few years to come?
Sent from my SGPT13 using xda premium

Odp: Which OS?
Windows Phone and Windows 8 are getting more and more popular but personally i don't like the new metro interface and these OSes.
Sent from my HTC HD2 using xda app-developers app

Ubuntu! It's already gathered a lot of dev attention! Soon it will be a good competition for android!
LIFE! Live it to the best!

Android
----------------Read If You Have Time----------------
Send From My Samsung Galaxy Note 2 N7100,
HIT thanks if I did Helped you.
LIFE! It's what you make out of it!

Ubuntu
Sent from my Micromax A50

I guess I'm going for android or ubuntu. I'll probably start using ubuntu on my nexus but I may switch back to android. Hopefully we see easy porting of android apps.

Well they say that a mobile is has 10 years in it, and android may be the first to break that unless apple hire the next Steve jobs. Android has a decent push to keep momentum though I think that it will once again retract to being "the geek phone" is, which I Dont mind... I don't like android becoming so popular because future models will be dumbed down for the masses rather than suped up for us...
I think Ubuntu has a nice idea on paper and some eye candy but I think it isn't practicle in as application to be as widely accepted as iOS for the mainstream or as open and moddable (although it should be really, as its from Linux) to attract us nerds or devs beyond the initial "wow its Ubuntu on a phone" factor. It also relies on webapps rather than more mature os tactics of moving away from web apps, can't blame them though as they want lots if apps asap to compete.
RIM should change their name to RIP
I don't know enough about tizen or Firefox to comment but I think Firefox os is DOA tbh.
That leaves the mighty windows phone, building up a catalogue of Apps and mind share, original and beautiful design reflecting windows 8 and Xbox, as fluid and intuitive as iOS with more functionality, slowly becoming more and more open, Nokia are driving it... I believe that wp can do it! I think that by wp9 there will be a lot more openness to the is for devs but not as much as android, but enough to feel free, it will catch on to people moving away from ios or people with Windows 8 tablets and ultra books and it will be a big thing. I love android to death but I believe wp8 will be the big thing of the future.
I think a route android may go is like Linux, different builds rather than just different skins, android touch wiz os could be potentially a different os to motoblur android for example... That could be a goood or a bad thing if it does.
-------------------------------------
Sent from my Nokia 3310

Windows phone is ok, but Microsoft has always been so restrictive, I cant see it taking off and storming the market. Android, because its open for the world to develop, hone and improve. Microsoft cant keep up, they are too interested in money and not what the consumer wants. Heck just look at how fast android has evolved. Compare that to the backwards step taken by Microsoft with the introduction of Vista, a few years back.

storm_chaser said:
Windows phone is ok, but Microsoft has always been so restrictive, I cant see it taking off and storming the market. Android, because its open for the world to develop, hone and improve. Microsoft cant keep up, they are too interested in money and not what the consumer wants. Heck just look at how fast android has evolved. Compare that to the backwards step taken by Microsoft with the introduction of Vista, a few years back.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Was vista really a backwards step or were people (me included) complaining that a brand new GPU/ram-heavy OS was running slow and buggy on our 7 year old computers?
Both Android and windows (inc windows phone) have made huge advances in the last 2 or 3 years, and I've seriously considered sueing apple for false advertising with "most advanced operating system" lol not that its a bad system but no software of apple is particularly advanced... But I wouldn't win because 'advanced' us not quantitative enough and only really subjective (though on the back of that they should not be allowed to claim that, either)
-------------------------------------
Sent from my Nokia 3310

I think BB10 OS will have a chance in the future

till now android is best, windows 8 is catching up lately, then we have ubuntu and mozilla os coming up head..its so exciting, and then recently bb10 is launched which got good reviews.