Guys search the market for Real64, It's a N64 Emulator, It looks like someone has just ripped of N64oid and repacked it even the icon is the same
https://market.android.com/details?id=com.advcaveman.real64
So..
Does it have rumble?
Sent from my Xperia PLAY R800i using XDA App
The author claims it's a port of mupen64plus, an open source emulator, and he seems really intent in describing the components of the emulator. Either he's a very cheeky ripoff or it's the real deal.
Its clearly a rip off. the Gui and even the app icon is a complete copy of yongzh's n64oid.
heres the legit n64oid http://slideme.org/application/n64oid
edit: heck even the version number is the same!
Logseman said:
The author claims it's a port of mupen64plus, an open source emulator, and he seems really intent in describing the components of the emulator. Either he's a very cheeky ripoff or it's the real deal.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The description is a simple cut-and-paste of yongzh's description.
If you guys looked closer, youll see about 6 or 7 N64oid's uploaded to the market, just look at the other emulators screenshots, they didnt even bother using their own! That is seriously not fair that a legit dev like yongzh gets booted from market but the android market team still lets this drivel stay. *sigh* I dont care if he didnt use his own source code, he was the first to actually bring us a n64 emu to android and he did that very well. Damn.
I stand corrected.
He's going to get banned from the market for the same reason Yongzh did. You can't repack or port an open source project and sell it for personal gain. That's the whole point of an open source license.
Don't get your hopes up on buying this and getting a constantly evolving or improving emulator.
Clyzm said:
You can't repack or port an open source project and sell it for personal gain.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
A common misconception:
A program is free software if users have all of these freedoms [The 4 Freedoms]. Thus, you should be free to redistribute copies, either with or without modifications, either gratis or charging a fee for distribution, to anyone anywhere.
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Click to collapse
http://www.gnu.org/philosophy/free-sw.html
Probably is the guy who was pretending to have a ps3 emulator in dev and asking for donations.
He even added yongzh to his credits.
Since yongzh's version was paid, isn't it illegal? You can't exactly take paid software, rip it off completely, then sell it for your own profit, right?
speedyink said:
He even added yongzh to his credits.
Since yongzh's version was paid, isn't it illegal? You can't exactly take paid software, rip it off completely, then sell it for your own profit, right?
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Click to collapse
Yongzh took somebody elses work (mupen64plus) changed it and sold it for money which he shouldn't really do (although his emulator is awesome!). this dude stole yongzh's work and made absolutely no changes, which is alot worse imo. it even seems insulting and lazy that he would use the same icon and description.
bubblegumballon said:
Yongzh took somebody elses work (mupen64plus) changed it and sold it for money which he shouldn't really do (although his emulator is awesome!). this dude stole yongzh's work and made absolutely no changes, which is alot worse imo. it even seems insulting and lazy that he would use the same icon and description.
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Click to collapse
I'm completely aware of his ripping off mupen64plus, but this is different, he at least put SOME work into it in order to make it compatible with android. He also needs to keep putting in time to update it, so I'll pay him as incentive to keep working on it.
Logseman said:
A common misconception:
http://www.gnu.org/philosophy/free-sw.html
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Charging a fee for distribution is a very different thing from re-packing an existing program and selling it.
Buying an Ubuntu disc is paying for distribution. Buying Ubuntu and giving the distributor profit is misuse of open source.
Yongzh's account was pulled from the market because his Super Nintendo emulator was pretty much a repacked version of Snes9x and sold for profit. Yongzh can now make the same claim about Real64 if he actually ported Mupen64 properly himself, and it wasn't just another Java wrapper.
You know what, I stand corrected:
GNU Article said:
You may have paid money to get copies of free software, or you may have obtained copies at no charge. But regardless of how you got your copies, you always have the freedom to copy and change the software, even to sell copies.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
However, having read through that, there's a few more infringements here. Both Yongzh and this new developer of Real64 are distributing a version of Mupen64 (and in Yongzh's case, Snes9x) without consent of the original developers, and for profit. If the Mupen64 devs decide to go after them and prove that their software is similar enough, this can still be taken off the market. At this point it's less of an open source issue and more of a copyright issue.
Clyzm said:
Charging a fee for distribution is a very different thing from re-packing an existing program and selling it.
Buying an Ubuntu disc is paying for distribution. Buying Ubuntu and giving the distributor profit is misuse of open source.
Yongzh's account was pulled from the market because his Super Nintendo emulator was pretty much a repacked version of Snes9x and sold for profit. Yongzh can now make the same claim about Real64 if he actually ported Mupen64 properly himself, and it wasn't just another Java wrapper.
You know what, I stand corrected:
However, having read through that, there's a few more infringements here. Both Yongzh and this new developer of Real64 are distributing a version of Mupen64 (and in Yongzh's case, Snes9x) without consent of the original developers, and for profit. If the Mupen64 devs decide to go after them and prove that their software is similar enough, this can still be taken off the market. At this point it's less of an open source issue and more of a copyright issue.
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Click to collapse
How do i go about getting a refund for this?
I bought it the other day but can no longer download via the market.
-RR
h20wakebum said:
How do i go about getting a refund for this?
I bought it the other day but can no longer download via the market.
-RR
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Click to collapse
That may be my fault It was there yesterday before i wrote an email to google complaining that it's a rip off of n64oid and even if its not, it's breaking the GPL rules sorry
Logseman said:
A common misconception:
http://www.gnu.org/philosophy/free-sw.html
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Click to collapse
The overlooked 5th rule. Feel free to take the work that was taken and sold for personal gain if it is against your personal morals.
NeoandGeo said:
The overlooked 5th rule. Feel free to take the work that was taken and sold for personal gain if it is against your personal morals.
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Click to collapse
So does this mean I can take N64oid and add touch pad support and sell it ?
Because that seems to be what n4oid did
subcu1ture said:
So does this mean I can take N64oid and add touch pad support and sell it ?
Because that seems to be what n4oid did
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
i'd buy it from you...
in the dark alley of course
Clyzm said:
Charging a fee for distribution is a very different thing from re-packing an existing program and selling it.
Buying an Ubuntu disc is paying for distribution. Buying Ubuntu and giving the distributor profit is misuse of open source.
Yongzh's account was pulled from the market because his Super Nintendo emulator was pretty much a repacked version of Snes9x and sold for profit. Yongzh can now make the same claim about Real64 if he actually ported Mupen64 properly himself, and it wasn't just another Java wrapper.
You know what, I stand corrected:
However, having read through that, there's a few more infringements here. Both Yongzh and this new developer of Real64 are distributing a version of Mupen64 (and in Yongzh's case, Snes9x) without consent of the original developers, and for profit. If the Mupen64 devs decide to go after them and prove that their software is similar enough, this can still be taken off the market. At this point it's less of an open source issue and more of a copyright issue.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You do not need to ask for consent from anyone, including the authors. The GPL allows you to sell the software, not just for distribution. Jesus, it's all in the document if you'd read it. SNES9x's license allows it as well.
Read, educate yourself: http://www.gnu.org/philosophy/selling.html
subcu1ture said:
So does this mean I can take N64oid and add touch pad support and sell it ?
Because that seems to be what n4oid did
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yes, as long as the source that you changed would be licensed under the GPL and freely available.
Related
I just discovered the existence of this game. where is it on the Market? It doesn't seem to be searchable with the term "Eternal Legacy". Gameloft's own website seems to require that one enters a service provider.
With the Transformer being an WiFi only device it doesn't have a service provider.
does anyone know how to get this game working on the transformer?
I'll go ahead and cover this. Gameloft is protesting the Android Market place. As such, they pulled all apps from the market and decided to sell them via their own means. The apps are available on their website via a moronic text system that more often than not, fails. None of the games are currently built for tablets, honeycomb or tegra optimized. So, unfortunately, until Gameloft offers the games on the site as such, you are SOL.
They're idiots...thats all I have to say.
blaine.hale said:
I'll go ahead and cover this. Gameloft is protesting the Android Market place. As such, they pulled all apps from the market and decided to sell them via their own means. The apps are available on their website via a moronic text system that more often than not, fails. None of the games are currently built for tablets, honeycomb or tegra optimized. So, unfortunately, until Gameloft offers the games on the site as such, you are SOL.
They're idiots...thats all I have to say.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
And I learned something new today, thanks blaine.
So why are they protesting the market?
~DC
The reason, as far as I know, is unannounced. Weird move considering it's the largest phone platform currently on the market. Sure, they're not paying the google fee for apps but I think they lost the vast majority of sales by not being a presence on the market and making it difficult to get their product.
Time will tell
P.S. this game doesn't support tegra2 and will not run on the transformer, even if you find ways of installing it.
Gameloft really does have some of the best games ever, but they suck for not being in the market. And I wish they would start supporting tegra2 I really want to play this game on my tablet!
wonder who their marketing genius is behind this decision....personally will only buy games through the market...it's buggy at times but overall works well. Guess they're trying to build demand for the product. Probably some young hipsters trying to buck the man.
Gameloft has a store set up for the Xoom:
http://wapshop.gameloft.com/php5/us...80f5f752d267d656&from=ADID-149339&promo=bogof
And the Acer Iconia:
http://wapshop.gameloft.com/php5/us...&sv5551=e1d30053e0e9f082d4e0&from=ADID-147084
And I have read that the games for the LG P990 Optimus 2x will work:
http://wapshop.gameloft.com/php5/us...&sv5551=81c380d350b9d085c7b8&from=ADID-147084
I am debating buying the Asphalt 6 version for either Xoom or Iconia myself as I have read that they will work through some googling. If anyone is willing to spend the $5 to try them while I am talking myself into being a guinea pig at least they have the buy one get one deal going on. Asphalt 6 and NOVA for $5? Yes please.
krighton said:
wonder who their marketing genius is behind this decision....personally will only buy games through the market...it's buggy at times but overall works well. Guess they're trying to build demand for the product. Probably some young hipsters trying to buck the man.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Then why would you want to support the man?
The only reason why the Market exists is because there are dullards who can't Google the software websites for themselves.
The Market never existed in Windows Mobile, and I was able to find more quality software and information about software than Android.
So to cater to a unwashed masses of retards, software companies have to submit to Google's and Apples dumb down gateway system, letting them restrict freedom thru regulating on what kind of software is allowed and take a cut too.
Like with everything, masses of uninformed people are the single greatest barrier to freedom for everyone.
klau1 said:
I just discovered the existence of this game. where is it on the Market? It doesn't seem to be searchable with the term "Eternal Legacy". Gameloft's own website seems to require that one enters a service provider.
With the Transformer being an WiFi only device it doesn't have a service provider.
does anyone know how to get this game working on the transformer?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
See my post here http://forum.xda-developers.com/showpost.php?p=13913276&postcount=246
May be good news for your search.
klau1 said:
Then why would you want to support the man?
The only reason why the Market exists is because there are dullards who can't Google the software websites for themselves.
The Market never existed in Windows Mobile, and I was able to find more quality software and information about software than Android.
So to cater to a unwashed masses of retards, software companies have to submit to Google's and Apples dumb down gateway system, letting them restrict freedom thru regulating on what kind of software is allowed and take a cut too.
Like with everything, masses of uninformed people are the single greatest barrier to freedom for everyone.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
At the end of the day, it's all about convenience. If you can't offer that to your market...they aren't going to want the product. It is completely inconvenient for the masses to go to their site, enter MORE billing info, have a game TEXTED to you, download it via a usually broken link, then finally play it.
I was part of the old winmo crew and I fully appreciated downloading software from the companies site...but guess what!? This wonderful concept where all these applications were put in one spot ON MY PHONE with one billing method was invented and gosh darn it, I just think thats a swell place to get my apps!
If they do not want to fall into the market, they're missing 98% of the average phone users in todays world
So yes, Gameloft made a very horrible decision. Lesson here? Don't make your product hard to get.
krighton said:
wonder who their marketing genius is behind this decision....personally will only buy games through the market...it's buggy at times but overall works well. Guess they're trying to build demand for the product. Probably some young hipsters trying to buck the man.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I wouldn't be surprised if it was something to do with a clash over Gameloft's terrible licensing policy.
I think Gameloft want to optimize its game based on specific hardware.
And I definitely would not complain since:
1. the price is way cheaper compared to the marketplace, (probably the price differs from a country to another)
2. alternative payment option. the games can be paid through telco provider by premium sms charge instead of credit card. Quite convenience.
klau1 said:
The only reason why the Market exists is because there are dullards who can't Google the software websites for themselves.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
and
klau1 said:
So to cater to a unwashed masses of retards,
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
and
klau1 said:
Like with everything, masses of uninformed people are the single greatest barrier to freedom for everyone.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Huh? dullards? unwashed masses of retards?
Do you think that possibly there could be intelligent informed users of Android devices who for their own reasons like the Android Market and (gasp) even some of them use the market and other means of getting the apps that they want?
Honestly...this was a pretty ignorant post...
Most of the developers that are protesting the Android market don't like the fact that people can get a refund when they find out that the game sucks.
These developers prefer the Apple market because they can develop crap games and then the consumer is out of luck once they have your money.
Anyway... it's usually about the refund system. Google has cut it back to 15 minutes because enough developers complained, and I'm sure it won't be long before they do away with it altogether.
Drybonz said:
Most of the developers that are protesting the Android market don't like the fact that people can get a refund when they find out that the game sucks.
These developers prefer the Apple market because they can develop crap games and then the consumer is out of luck once they have your money.
Anyway... it's usually about the refund system. Google has cut it back to 15 minutes because enough developers complained, and I'm sure it won't be long before they do away with it altogether.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
This whole thought process I think is damning themselves. I know I've been less click happy on buying an app since they lowered the refund time. I had the market bug and not install the app (when it was 24 hours) and I couldn't get it installed until after the refund time was over, so I fear something similar will happen still and I only have 15 minutes to figure it out. If they get rid of it altogether, I'll deal without most paid apps. At the moment I already refuse to pay for an app through amazon because of their policy.
Of course I might not be the majority, but the return policy was a major reason (one of many) why I jumped ship from Apple and went with Android in the first place.
The title says it all. WTF Google??
Started a support thread here. (WARNING: strong language)
Edit: Other threads/links of similar interest:
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=1098192
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=1098023
http://androidforums.com/android-applications/343376-yongzh-emulators-gone-market.html
SlideMe page where he is temporarily offering his emulators for free: here.
Edit: Some more interesting info here:
http://www.zodttd.com/wp/2011/05/it-hit-hard/
Strong language is an under statement. Lol. I never noticed cause I restore my apps after flashing a Rom
I noticed coz may 26th he was going to re-release N64oid with much higher compatibility. He spent a good 2 months working on N64oid and google removes all his apps the day he was gonna release it. Dirty
How does that work exactly, considering we PAID for these apps? (I bought NESoid when it first came out, I flashed a new ROM and now I don't have it anymore which pisses me off)
jlukek89 said:
I noticed coz may 26th he was going to re-release N64oid with much higher compatibility. He spent a good 2 months working on N64oid and google removes all his apps the day he was gonna release it. Dirty
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Very dirty.
uoY_redruM said:
How does that work exactly, considering we PAID for these apps? (I bought NESoid when it first came out, I flashed a new ROM and now I don't have it anymore which pisses me off)
Click to expand...
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I've read that those who've emailed the developer had the apks sent to them. Worth a shot, Yongzh is a respectable dev and I'm sure he'd help you out.
They are all available on the Slideme market for free (for a little while atleast). He set them to free so those that had purchased them would get a chance to reinstall without having to pay again. This includes N64oid.
He stole the source code from here and there and sold it as his. He deserved it.
Quit your *****ing. He based his work of GPL licensed FOSS programs and didnot GPL his code or display the previous code licenses. He's an asshat.
bobtentpeg said:
Quit your *****ing. He based his work of GPL licensed FOSS programs and didnot GPL his code or display the previous code licenses. He's an asshat.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
And you really think this is why they were removed? I highly doubt it.
negroplasty said:
And you really think this is why they were removed? I highly doubt it.
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Click to collapse
Actually, I would be highly surprised if this wasnt related to their removal. The FOSS project heads have complained in the past to Google. And despite what you may think, Google takes license violations very seriously. Because the Market servers are separate from the Android project, Google is liable for them separately, and have in the past removed applications that fail to follow the lience requirements.
bobtentpeg said:
Quit your *****ing. He based his work of GPL licensed FOSS programs and didnot GPL his code or display the previous code licenses. He's an asshat.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
How do you know that? I somehow could not find any references about him basing apps on open source code prior to this incident.
I wont say he has or hasnt made any violations, but I will say his emulator for N64 functions almost EXACTLY like mupen64 does in ubuntu(glitches I've seen and all). Also If he is writing from scratch by himself, I'm confident that it would take much longer to make one like N64oid then it has. Again, he may have done all this work and is getting alot of crap for it for no reason. I still think the emulatos hes made work great and I activly use them, but I think he needs to make some sort of statment on the issue to clearify things.
http //www reddit com/r/Android/comments/hmwj7/android_markets_most_popular_emulators_disappear/
http //www snes9x com/phpbb2/viewtopic.php?t=4454
http //www gp32x com/board/index.php?/topic/58889-n64-for-android/
Sorry about the links. I don't have the minimum post count. I'm mostly a lurker.
all right then, pitchforks and torches it is..
otakuloser said:
http://www.reddit.com/r/Android/comments/hmwj7/android_markets_most_popular_emulators_disappear/
http://www.snes9x.com/phpbb2/viewtopic.php?t=4454
http://www.gp32x.com/board/index.php?/topic/58889-n64-for-android/
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Made links clickable.
Even if Snesoid and N64oid were ripps that still doesn't answer why everything was pulled...
negroplasty said:
Even if Snesoid and N64oid were ripps that still doesn't answer why everything was pulled...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Um, because when not one, but two of his apps are confirmed as rip-offs, the benefit of the doubt wears pretty thin as to whether the rest of them are also rip-offs. Besides, aren't two violations good enough reason to ban him and all of his apps? This is all speculation though, as Google won't say exactly why his account and apps were removed.
An interesting read for those talking about open source licenses:
http://www.zodttd.com/wp/2011/05/it-hit-hard/ (also added to the OP)
negroplasty said:
An interesting read for those talking about open source licenses:
http://www.zodttd.com/wp/2011/05/it-hit-hard/ (also added to the OP)
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Given a number a license holders (see above links) say they never heard from/were working with either of the developers, I call bull****.
Well, since his emulators were pulled down from the market (bastards at Google seem to be removing all emulators from the market now) and Yongzh was awesome enough to add them to Slideme.org FOR FREE for (from what I'm hearing) 2-weeks, I decided to download them all now and Zip them into one nice convenient file for XDA to enjoy.
**THESE ARE PULLED DIRECTLY FROM YONGZH'S SLIDEME PAGE AS OF MAY 29th, 2011**
If he does not want them here for any reason, I have absolutely no problem removing them. I just figured it'd make it easier for those that didn't happen to read on the web that he was making them available.
ENJOY!
I have no problem with these being posted for now, but once the two week window closes, we will have to remove them from XDA in order to maintain legality. Also, thanks for letting us know about their new whereabouts.
Thanks.
willverduzco said:
I have no problem with these being posted for now, but once the two week window closes, we will have to remove them from XDA in order to maintain legality. Also, thanks for letting us know about their new whereabouts.
Thanks.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Completely understandable, thanks for allowing them to stay.
IF he keeps them available longer, will you allow them to stay here as well?
Legality? Hasn't he been using open source code, selling it for profit, and then not releasing the source code or crediting the original authors of said code?
otakuloser said:
Legality? Hasn't he been using open source code, selling it for profit, and then not releasing the source code or crediting the original authors of said code?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yeah he was making a profit off of open source code. All his apps had quite a few downloads, so in that respect I don't feel sorry for him.
So far, I've tried the tiger emulators, and a couple of the oid ones.
Anyone know of some that are efficient and thus great for battery life? Any that support cheat codes? Tiger tried adding cheats but they didn't work, and his apps were pulled from the market.
Sent from my R800
I just played Zelda for 5 - 6 hours on N64oid and battery is down to 15%.
Which version are you using? Zelda won't run properly for me, and I sure as hell don't get that kinda battery life playing Mario
Sent from my R800
Orcania of Time.
Are you the guy who is still on 2.3.2?
subcu1ture said:
I just played Zelda for 5 - 6 hours on N64oid and battery is down to 15%.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
We all have to cope with this. Emulators require 10 times the processing power of the host. Which in this case is the n64.
Sent from my R800i using XDA App
subcu1ture said:
Orcania of Time.
Are you the guy who is still on 2.3.2?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I meant which version of n64oid lol
I just updated to the latest and suddenly everything runs perfectly.
Sent from my R800
captain67 said:
I meant which version of n64oid lol
I just updated to the latest and suddenly everything runs perfectly.
Sent from my R800
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
obviously most people will be using n64oid version 2.2.3 the latest version. Unless they pirated it
AndroHero said:
obviously most people will be using n64oid version 2.2.3 the latest version. Unless they pirated it
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Or you keep deleting the slideme.org app
2.2.3 is the version i am using.
But i was meaning are you still on 2.3.2 gingerbread?
subcu1ture said:
I just played Zelda for 5 - 6 hours on N64oid and battery is down to 15%.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Wow.. Thats grand!
Sent from my Xperia PLAY R800i using XDA App
AndroHero said:
obviously most people will be using n64oid version 2.2.3 the latest version. Unless they pirated it
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You mean pirated from a guy who stole open source software and is reselling it?
It is free software, and there is nothing wrong with going around paying for this particular piece of software.
Free open source software, in the FSF sense of the term, includes reselling it among its freedoms. What license does Mupen 64 have?
It's just my personal belief that open source stays free throughout anyone trying to do anything different with it. It's the only thing I will take without paying, and not feel guilty for.
NeoandGeo said:
It's just my personal belief that open source stays free throughout anyone trying to do anything different with it. It's the only thing I will take without paying, and not feel guilty for.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
End of the day yongzh spent time and effort porting the emulator, and he continues to spend his time and effort to improve the emulator.
Imo this constitutes a job. And in a civil society where people have morals. People get paid for there hard work. Your morals might be diffrent though
How would you feel if your boss said. Dya know what, I've decided i'm not paying you for the last weeks work?
That is a little different, and I have learned to stay away from analogies as they can all be picked apart no matter how much one invests in believing it is the be all end all.
I will only see fit to pay for his work if he creates a project himself, and not take another free project tweak it and charge for it. I believe that Google made the right decision on not allowing him to charge for a free open source project, and that allows me to use the "free" work with a clear conscience.
NeoandGeo said:
That is a little different, and I have learned to stay away from analogies as they can all be picked apart no matter how much one invests in believing it is the be all end all.
I will only see fit to pay for his work if he creates a project himself, and not take another free project tweak it and charge for it. I believe that Google made the right decision on not allowing him to charge for a free open source project, and that allows me to use the "free" work with a clear conscience.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yet google allow people to sell real64 on the market. There application is clearly stolen off yongzh.
Ooh i just checked I think my email to google got real64 kicked off the market
Either way compare the two
http://www.appbrain.com/app/real64-(n64-emulator)/com.advcaveman.real64
http://slideme.org/application/n64oid
The Real64 app was worse than what Yonghz did. But both of these are in the wrong. N64oid should not be paid for at all unless we get something in writing from the original Mupen64 team signing off on him charging for the emulator.
Until then, we should all treat it as fair game.
This thread is gonna end up getting locked like the last one at this rate.
Sent from my R800
NeoandGeo said:
The Real64 app was worse than what Yonghz did. But both of these are in the wrong. N64oid should not be paid for at all unless we get something in writing from the original Mupen64 team signing off on him charging for the emulator.
Until then, we should all treat it as fair game.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Mupen64 is licensed under v2 of the GPL, which allows the sale of software licensed under it.
http://www.gnu.org/licenses/gpl-faq.html#DoesTheGPLRequireAvailabilityToPublic
He's allowed to sell it. He just needs to make the source available in some way if he made any direct changes to it. Simply creating an Android wrapper that makes calls to the software in question wouldn't violate that. Even offering the source only by snail mail is enough to satisfy the GPL.
If you were right, commercial Linux distributions wouldn't be able to sell retail copies of their distros - and they do and have for years with no complaint from anyone.
So yeah... /thread.
So it is alright if it is obtained by not buying it. Which we should all do, instead of encouraging people to throw their money away at this developer.
NeoandGeo said:
So it is alright if it is obtained by not buying it. Which we should all do, instead of encouraging people to throw their money away at this developer.
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No, what don't you understand?? Your not allowed to steal it, and Yonghz is allowed to sell it. The reason Yonghz and his emulators were kicked off the market, was that he didnt make the source code available on request, as per the GPL rules.
Hi.
I have seen these apps from Björk but they don't seem to be for android. They are only for iPhone.
BUT I've read that the app could be ported from iOS to another operating systems because it was made to allow this. And Björk encouraged hackers to do that! That was said from Björk herself in an interview!
She told Drowned in Sound that the apps had been specifically designed so that they could be easily ported to other platforms -- like Symbian, BlackBerry and Android. "We really made sure when we wrote all the programs that they will transfer to other systems."
"I'm not supposed to say this, probably, but I'm trusting that the pirates out there won't tie their hands behind their back."
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http://www.wired.co.uk/news/archive...shttp://www.compositiontoday.com/blog/115.asp
I personally think that the art, sounds, videos, etc, could be extracted, but what ist with the software itself? How could it be ported if the source code is not available....
What do you think?
Can someone clarify if it would be possible?
Thanks!
Some videos of these apps. You can interact with the music and make your own versions playing or changing things in a very innovative concept.
http://youtu.be/FsxsGrnCGIk
http://youtu.be/kb3kLXVs9J0
http://youtu.be/0Rx-P2UsD5g
Still waiting!
Did anything ever come of this?
Hey anybody! Do sth about it! She preety much asked to do this, so lets do sth. I guess many people would want this app for android, and here? No reply? Please!
Nobody is interested...
I think this app is cracks for iphone, but it wasn't ported to android... It would be much more interesting.
Yeah, It would be interesting for milions of people who have android phones, and not Iphones. Android is bigger market than iphone so i just don't have a clue why nobody wants to port biophilia app on android.
[email protected] said:
Yeah, It would be interesting for milions of people who have android phones, and not Iphones. Android is bigger market than iphone so i just don't have a clue why nobody wants to port biophilia app on android.
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There no hackers who like this app, i would say.
humano said:
BUT I've read that the app could be ported from iOS to another operating systems because it was made to allow this. And Björk encouraged hackers to do that! That was said from Björk herself in an interview!
I personally think that the art, sounds, videos, etc, could be extracted, but what ist with the software itself? How could it be ported if the source code is not available....
What do you think?
Can someone clarify if it would be possible?
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Click to collapse
I think it's generally not feasible.
Björk is a very interesting artist. I think her understanding of technology, and specifically software development, "hacking" and "pirating", is limited however.
Yes, the app may have been made potentially portable, but without source code that is more or less useless.
Porting an app between platforms is a much bigger task than "pirating". It's not a simple matter of pulling files from hidden directories, or even doing some limited reverse engineering and patching of an app to bypass license checks. It's MUCH more than the mere pirating of music and movie files.
I'm presuming the app was written to IOS with Objective C, and not some portable language where the source code is embedded in the ios apps.
Anything is possible, though. With enough time one could reproduce what the app does. That's probably easier than trying to reverse engineer it.
But I'd guess this is a substantial effort, likely requiring at least many months of work by a single person. But with all the paid work, and interesting free projects available to a person with the skills to port an ios app to Android without source code, why would anyone spend at least several months doing this ?
They could face the prospect of lawsuits from the rights holders, and might be unable to sell their work on official app markets. For what ? A wink from Björk, without even a physical pat on the back ? And perhaps a certain amount of gratitude from some users...
I hope she and others have learned something. If she/they want this to happen, they should at least release open source code freely, and make sure it's not difficult to port. Yeah, the video and audio recordings can remain "proprietary" but the app source code and design documents need to be released.
Or is much of the artistic expression integrated into the source code ? I haven't looked much but I guess these are not simple apps to play video and audio. These are apps that allow some form of interaction; perhaps the music changes with that.
If that's the case, the rights holders likely will want to hold onto their "intellectual/artistic property" and keep any source and design documents to themselves.
IMO, No amount of "nudge, nudge, wink, wink" from Björk will make a porting job easy.
And AFAIK there are no ios emulators for Android that might render this a simpler "pirating" effort.
mikereidis said:
I think it's generally not feasible.
Björk is a very interesting artist. I think her understanding of technology, and specifically software development, "hacking" and "pirating", is limited however.
Yes, the app may have been made potentially portable, but without source code that is more or less useless.
Porting an app between platforms is a much bigger task than "pirating". It's not a simple matter of pulling files from hidden directories, or even doing some limited reverse engineering and patching of an app to bypass license checks. It's MUCH more than the mere pirating of music and movie files.
I'm presuming the app was written to IOS with Objective C, and not some portable language where the source code is embedded in the ios apps.
Anything is possible, though. With enough time one could reproduce what the app does. That's probably easier than trying to reverse engineer it.
But I'd guess this is a substantial effort, likely requiring at least many months of work by a single person. But with all the paid work, and interesting free projects available to a person with the skills to port an ios app to Android without source code, why would anyone spend at least several months doing this ?
They could face the prospect of lawsuits from the rights holders, and might be unable to sell their work on official app markets. For what ? A wink from Björk, without even a physical pat on the back ? And perhaps a certain amount of gratitude from some users...
I hope she and others have learned something. If she/they want this to happen, they should at least release open source code freely, and make sure it's not difficult to port. Yeah, the video and audio recordings can remain "proprietary" but the app source code and design documents need to be released.
Or is much of the artistic expression integrated into the source code ? I haven't looked much but I guess these are not simple apps to play video and audio. These are apps that allow some form of interaction; perhaps the music changes with that.
If that's the case, the rights holders likely will want to hold onto their "intellectual/artistic property" and keep any source and design documents to themselves.
IMO, No amount of "nudge, nudge, wink, wink" from Björk will make a porting job easy.
And AFAIK there are no ios emulators for Android that might render this a simpler "pirating" effort.
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Thanks Mike for the reply. I didn't see this.
Are you sure, that the source code is not included? Is not possible that there's a intermediate state of the the code, that could be built for Android? I always thought, that is something like that.
You are totally right. With the artwork we cannot build the app for android...
And I don't even have an iphone to see how the apps should look like in android.
humano said:
Are you sure, that the source code is not included? Is not possible that there's a intermediate state of the the code, that could be built for Android? I always thought, that is something like that.
You are totally right. With the artwork we cannot build the app for android...
And I don't even have an iphone to see how the apps should look like in android.
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I'm pretty sure. Anyone who claims otherwise is challenged to "show me where the source is".
For Android there is an emulator for PCs that many apps can run on, and an app of this type could run.
I know almost nothing of ios development, but likely there is an ios emulator that can run on a Mac at least ? AFAIR, ios development requires a Mac.
Feel free to send Bjork, or the companies that represent her, email asking about this.
I've been a fan of some of her music, and even acting and I even find her cute... And that's why I responded here. I had an initial thought that this could be an interesting project, but I have no time for such an unpaid hobby project.
BTW, Just looked at the iTunes page and some others. Seems to be a $12.99 app. And says "The full Biophilia App Album is now a paid app for new users, old users maintain same in-app-purchase ability." Something tells me the legal fine print says you're screwed if you hack it, especially if you tried to make a few bucks or do it publicly with your real name.
Artists (with money), hollywood and recording industry types tend to have iPhones. They don't know tech per se, don't want to know tech, and they have the cash to spend. They want something that "just works" and that's what the iPhone does, for a price. And ios is where devs make REAL money. Comparatively speaking, Android sucks for making money.
I saw some comment that they didn't make an Android app "for legal reasons". Sounds like a different way to say "business reasons". I imagine her recording company sells her music on iTunes, but doesn't sell it on Google Play in that big ongoing power play between media companies and tech companies ?
mikereidis said:
I think it's generally not feasible.
Björk is a very interesting artist. I think her understanding of technology, and specifically software development, "hacking" and "pirating", is limited however.
Yes, the app may have been made potentially portable, but without source code that is more or less useless.
Porting an app between platforms is a much bigger task than "pirating". It's not a simple matter of pulling files from hidden directories, or even doing some limited reverse engineering and patching of an app to bypass license checks. It's MUCH more than the mere pirating of music and movie files.
I'm presuming the app was written to IOS with Objective C, and not some portable language where the source code is embedded in the ios apps.
Anything is possible, though. With enough time one could reproduce what the app does. That's probably easier than trying to reverse engineer it.
But I'd guess this is a substantial effort, likely requiring at least many months of work by a single person.....
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Click to collapse
Quoting my words from a year ago out of sheer vanity, LOL.
New news about her kick-starter project for Android and Windows ports of the IPad Biophilia being put "on hold". Among other sources: http://www.guardian.co.uk/music/appsblog/2013/feb/08/bjork-cancels-biophilia-kickstarter
Summary of my opinion: I love her as an artist, but she doesn't understand technology. Ooooh, and I wish she would forget about Windows and just do Android.
IMO the IPad was targetted first because that's what all the at least reasonably well off artsy people used at that time, and could afford. Now she wants the app in the hand of those who can't afford IPads.
So why can't/haven't they just open sourced the code ? Original IOS devs still hold the rights ?
Bjork says:
"porting the app "proved unbelievably complicated""... LOL.
And the estimate seems to be 8 devs (staff?) for 5 months, for both Windows and Android. So maybe 20 developer months for each.
And that's a small project in the world I've come from, with 10-100 dev teams working for years. And she thinks that's "unbelievably complicated".
Now I don't know exactly the scope of the app is; I've never used it on Ipad, and I don't know if it uses some magic IOS stuff that's hard to port.
For all I know it could require the minimum of my quoted estimate of "...at least many months of work by a single person". Or it could be 10-20 man-years. I don't know.
My point continues to be that she doesn't have a grasp of technology. And that's fine, she's a wonderful artist IMO, and there's no shame in not having or not wanting tech knowledge.
mikereidis said:
Quoting my words from a year ago out of sheer vanity, LOL.
New news about her kick-starter project for Android and Windows ports of the IPad Biophilia being put "on hold". Among other sources: http://www.guardian.co.uk/music/appsblog/2013/feb/08/bjork-cancels-biophilia-kickstarter
Summary of my opinion: I love her as an artist, but she doesn't understand technology. Ooooh, and I wish she would forget about Windows and just do Android.
IMO the IPad was targetted first because that's what all the at least reasonably well off artsy people used at that time, and could afford. Now she wants the app in the hand of those who can't afford IPads.
So why can't/haven't they just open sourced the code ? Original IOS devs still hold the rights ?
Bjork says:
"porting the app "proved unbelievably complicated""... LOL.
And the estimate seems to be 8 devs (staff?) for 5 months, for both Windows and Android. So maybe 20 developer months for each.
And that's a small project in the world I've come from, with 10-100 dev teams working for years. And she thinks that's "unbelievably complicated".
Now I don't know exactly the scope of the app is; I've never used it on Ipad, and I don't know if it uses some magic IOS stuff that's hard to port.
For all I know it could require the minimum of my quoted estimate of "...at least many months of work by a single person". Or it could be 10-20 man-years. I don't know.
My point continues to be that she doesn't have a grasp of technology. And that's fine, she's a wonderful artist IMO, and there's no shame in not having or not wanting tech knowledge.
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Yes I love her but that's why I think too , she too thought that porting an app will need 5 guys working on it and two months oh bjork
Sent from my Nexus 4 using Tapatalk 2
Chad_Petree said:
Yes I love her but that's why I think too , she too thought that porting an app will need 5 guys working on it and two months oh bjork
Sent from my Nexus 4 using Tapatalk 2
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Click to collapse
Originally, she hoped that "hackers" would do it, somehow, without source code, and she was giving a "wink, wink" to that.
She seemed to think that porting an app to a different platform would be almost as easy as pirating music, movies or apps.
I'm too busy to get involved, but I would be happy if someone(s) would ask her to get the source code released, and the "community" may be able to look and see and offer opinions or ideas.
Perhaps a few fans have the tech abilities and free time to make something of this at little or no cost, as opposed to professional devs making a normal professional dev income.
There's a forum here: http://4um.bjork.com/viewforum.php?f=16&sid=c28e2e0870bdc695ce7da8da94849918
Anybody know if she communicates openly with her fans online ? Is there an easy way to ask her for source code and offer ideas ?
IMO, she needs to forget about a Windows port, at least for now. It should have been Android from the beginning, but that said, Android is still relatively sub-par when it comes to real-time music generation. IOS stomps Android in this area, though the latest JB changes are promising.
mikereidis said:
Originally, she hoped that "hackers" would do it, somehow, without source code, and she was giving a "wink, wink" to that.
She seemed to think that porting an app to a different platform would be almost as easy as pirating music, movies or apps.
I'm too busy to get involved, but I would be happy if someone(s) would ask her to get the source code released, and the "community" may be able to look and see and offer opinions or ideas.
Perhaps a few fans have the tech abilities and free time to make something of this at little or no cost, as opposed to professional devs making a normal professional dev income.
There's a forum here: http://4um.bjork.com/viewforum.php?f=16&sid=c28e2e0870bdc695ce7da8da94849918
Anybody know if she communicates openly with her fans online ? Is there an easy way to ask her for source code and offer ideas ?
IMO, she needs to forget about a Windows port, at least for now. It should have been Android from the beginning, but that said, Android is still relatively sub-par when it comes to real-time music generation. IOS stomps Android in this area, though the latest JB changes are promising.
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I will ask it in her forum. Perhaps she reads this proposal. It could work.
humano said:
I will ask it in her forum. Perhaps she reads this proposal. It could work.
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I signed up on that forum and didn't get any confirmation email.
I was reading the main thread about this, and I think some of the posters understand a bit about s/w development. But some others are very misinformed about how development works.
mikereidis said:
I signed up on that forum and didn't get any confirmation email.
I was reading the main thread about this, and I think some of the posters understand a bit about s/w development. But some others are very misinformed about how development works.
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Click to collapse
I am registered in that forum too and it's what you say. They don't have any idea.... :laugh:
But there's good news, at least somebody told in the forum, that she told in an interview, that she will find a cheap way to port biophilia to android.
She would never release the code as open source... It would be crazy... We would have a BIOPHILIA+
It's what you told before. She doesn't really understand the power of doing it... :victory:
humano said:
She would never release the code as open source... It would be crazy...
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Click to collapse
Well, no open source basically, generally means it's "commercial property".
So this is a commercial venture she has.
That's fine, that's OK. It belongs to her (and/or whomever) and she can do what she wants with it. No different than other software devs / vendors, musicians, song, book or movie writers etc.
But she can't expect some "benevolent hackers" to come along and "port" an app like this for her for free; with or without source code.
And she has something going on with bringing music education to the poor or something like that. And that's why she wants an Android port it appears. The poor can't afford iDevices.
And that's fine too. But it seems like it's a jumble of commercial stuff and some form of self promoting philanthropy.
Anyway, I think she should forget about this years old project and make something completely new for Android. Why re-do what's already been done ? But I guess money comes in there too. It should be faster and cheaper to re-use the high level design and media components.
mikereidis said:
Well, no open source basically, generally means it's "commercial property".
So this is a commercial venture she has.
That's fine, that's OK. It belongs to her (and/or whomever) and she can do what she wants with it. No different than other software devs / vendors, musicians, song, book or movie writers etc.
But she can't expect some "benevolent hackers" to come along and "port" an app like this for her for free; with or without source code.
And she has something going on with bringing music education to the poor or something like that. And that's why she wants an Android port it appears. The poor can't afford iDevices.
And that's fine too. But it seems like it's a jumble of commercial stuff and some form of self promoting philanthropy.
Anyway, I think she should forget about this years old project and make something completely new for Android. Why re-do what's already been done ? But I guess money comes in there too. It should be faster and cheaper to re-use the high level design and media components.
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I fully agree. These apps are already a little obsolete for android.
And I have good news. She found a team of developers who is going to do the work for low price. We will have biophilia for android after the summer. Let's see how it is...
humano said:
I fully agree. These apps are already a little obsolete for android.
And I have good news. She found a team of developers who is going to do the work for low price. We will have biophilia for android after the summer. Let's see how it is...
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I hope it's not some "boiler room" s/w dev hack operation that promises more than it can deliver. I'm restraining myself from mentioning/identifying certain world areas where this is more common.
She's apparently coming to my town this summer; I've never seen her live; would be interesting.
mikereidis said:
I hope it's not some "boiler room" s/w dev hack operation that promises more than it can deliver. I'm restraining myself from mentioning/identifying certain world areas where this is more common.
She's apparently coming to my town this summer; I've never seen her live; would be interesting.
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She said that in one interview. That's what the people in the 4um.bjork.com say. I think it's real.
I saw her live last sommer and was amazing.
Well Biophilia app is already for Android devices!
Check the playstore https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.bjork.biophilia