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I know you guys probably heard this a thousand times (and a forum search shows this) and what I'm about to say is probably very cliche, but the iPhone is a pretty amazing device.
Typically, I am a WM man (I currently own an HTC Touch Pro), and I've owned WM phones/devices for a long time now. I tried other OSes (Symbian, Palm OS), but ultimately, I prefer WM. When the iPhone first appeared, I disregarded it almost entirely because it's made by Apple. As someone familiar with Apple, I just didn't like them very much (largely due to their design philosophy).
Things didn't look like they were about to change. In fact, the next phones I was seriously looking at was the Toshiba TG01, Samsung Omnia HD i9810, and Samsung Omnia Pro B7610. Two of these are Windows Mobile and one is Symbian (which I was less likely to get anyway). The only major difference is that they aren't HTC (I want to move away from HTC because I exceedingly dislike Qualcomm).
However, something special happened yesterday: My friend invited me to lunch and he showed me his new iPhone 3GS. He allowed me to play with it.
In one word: Incredible!
As my intuition knew, I ended up not liking the design of the OS (I still prefer WM's design), but I couldn't really deny how well made the iPhone really is. More than anything else, I really have to compliment how extremely optimized it really is. Opening any software, going to the home screen, playing movies/music, and doing just about anything really was incredibly smooth. The entire time I was with my friend, I just gushed and gushed about this one aspect. The reason why is because it really is incredible how fast everything was.
The truth is that when compared side to side with my Touch Pro, the speed is really the same. However, a few things to note. First, everyone know how the iPhone seems to use "gradual transitions"? To elaborate, whenever you do anything, such as opening software or rotation, it is done in real time, and you can see the changes with your eyes. This is as opposed to WM where it is done immediately (for example, rotating with my TP results in an immediate change as opposed to you seeing the screen rotate on the iPhone).
This seems like a minor thing, but it has a large effect on perception. Notably, it makes you perceive it as being faster. When I counted down the seconds on the iPhone and WM, I noticed that opening programs and rotation are really done at the same speed, but the iPhone's gradual transition effects makes you perceive it as being faster, which is actually pretty nice.
Second thing and a very important point: My TP uses a custom ROM, which is why its speed was on par with that of the iPhone. If it had been using the stock ROM, I am positive that the iPhone would have crushed it in speed.
This seems like a moot point because I *can* use custom ROMs, but note that this forum and all of its custom ROMs are largely exclusive to HTC phones (with the sole exception of the Xperia...which was made by HTC anyway). What happens if I decide to use another WM phone (for example, the Samsung B7610)? Then I would have no choice but to remain with the stock ROM or at least hope someone would develop the stray ROM for the Samsung devices (such as the i900 on XDA).
At this point, I'm also willing to blame the speed issue on hardware. After all, the iPhone is about 72MHZ faster than my phone, and it also also has a dedicated graphics chip. On the other hand, I also have to take into consideration that it takes a custom, optimized ROM for my device to keep up with the stock ROM on a series of device which is notorious for being outdated (anyone remember the iPhone 2G)?
If anyone is wondering, am I thinking about switching to the dark side? Unfortunately, no. While the huge number of apps and the great speed is tantalizing, I am still the guy who frequently spends 4+ hours changing the ROMs on his phones (and tweaking it afterwards). I'm also the guy who frequently goes into the settings menu because he nitpicks about how each little thing on his phone works.
Can I switch to something that won't allow me that much customization? Speaking as someone who's about to change the ROM on his phone again, the answer appears to be a pretty clear 'no' as this point.
On, the other hand, while playing with the iPhone, I did find myself wishing that the Windows Mobile experience was as smooth, and great as with the iPhone, especially on stock ROMs. I also did find myself wondering what Windows Mobile 7 will be like (I can't wonder with WM6.5 because I'm using it now). But of course, what do people saying about wishing too much? It's useless.
Am I going mad?
I'd take an iphone over any WM device any day of the week, but I absolutely refuse to pay $70+ a month just to use it.
Exactly how many apps are there for windows mobile?
Until recently I assumed that WinMo>Symbian>Iphone.
Apparently that's wrong.
I was going to buy one with all the other sheep but decided to buy an ipod touch. Works great, but the first time I put it in my pocket and crouched down a bit later it nealy killed it!
Screen went a nice mix of colours and it totally stopped working. Quite a few plug ins to the computer and it came back to life.
There just to fragile and to big(iphone is thicker than the touch also), good girls phone or if you carry a handbag.
Glade I got the Jade not a problem so far.
thedigitel said:
I'd take an iphone over any WM device any day of the week, but I absolutely refuse to pay $70+ a month just to use it.
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Click to collapse
Is that the AT&T contract you have to sign up for to get an iPhone? If that's the case, why not just buy the iPhone unlocked? It's expensive, but it cost about as much as any HTC phone I've seen.
charge1313 said:
Exactly how many apps are there for windows mobile?
Until recently I assumed that WinMo>Symbian>Iphone.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
As of right now, the iPhone has roughly 50K-60K of apps while the last article detailing how many apps Windows Mobile seems to have stopped at 20K. Futhermore, the iPhone famously beaten Windows Mobile in reaching 25K apps, and I find it highly unlikely that Windows Mobile caught up.
Even from an outside perspective, though, it seems to me that the iPhone has an impressive number of apps, including a plethora of ones that Windows Mobile never seems to get (or is even capable of getting).
stu-k said:
I was going to buy one with all the other sheep but decided to buy an ipod touch. Works great, but the first time I put it in my pocket and crouched down a bit later it nealy killed it!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Well, the iPod Touch would make sense, but I would rather not have to carry two devices around. It seems better to me to have an all-in-one device in this case and, if nothing else, it would allow me to utilize the numerous phone-related apps in the app store.
I entirely agree.
My wife has a Gen 1 iphone, and I recently updated it to version 3 and unlocked and jailbreaked.
In the old days, WM had thousands of apps as one of its killer features.
I recently spent a few evenings installing apps on the wife's phone, and I was blown away. Not necessarily by the quality, but by the experience.
Everything is smooth, everything works, the user experience is "unchallenging".
I love tweaking, I love coding, I love spending MONTHS dissecting the WinMob OS to implement a tiny hack. But you know what? Why bother?!
I can't see myself giving up on WinMob - it's got momentum, and I can't be bothered to learn Objective C. I'm barely coping with C++ as it is.
But, to paraphrase Gauntlet, "WinMob [may be] about to die".
In defence of WinMob:
It's p*sses me off something crazy that when Gizmondo et all were reviewing the Palm Pre, multi tasking was one of the killer features. WinMob has had it FOREVER.
It's a good OS, it multitasks, it generally works, it can make calls and emails and whatnot.
But - the user experience is OLD.
And I think one of the most fundamental flaws is also one of the biggest strengths - WinMob runs on a hundred kinds of hardware. But the problem:
WinMob runs on a hundred kinds of hardware.
Some of those have graphic accelerators, some don't.
Some have dpads, some don't.
Some have 600mhz CPUs, some don't.
The iphone is a single homogeneous ecosystem.
Coders know they can anti-alias without trying to code to the lowest common denominator 200mhz phone with 16mb of ram. They know exactly what they're gonna get with an iphone. And that fact means they know the limitations, and how to pitch what they've got at the right performance considerations. They know what they're working on. The Human Interface spec is incredible, and incredibly helpful. Users expect an experience, naturally, because it feels natural. Apple encourages that, and coders have to honour it.
I think most of the iphone experience can and should be emulated on WinMob.
I'm not just talking about cloning Springboard and everything else. Yes, we can emulate this and that - our coders on XDA devs are incredible, and could do every bit of it.
But we need more: the experience of just being able to use the phone and expect it to work needs to be emulated.
I don't think the iphone is necessarily a better piece of hardware: I prefer my Touch HD. But clearly the user experience, the user interface paradigm, the reward of just being able to use the thing easily needs to be implemented - from the ground up.
I don't think this is going to happen on WinMob; I think the strength/limitations of a wide open platform means this probably can't happen. I think that like Win CE before it, WinMob will end up being relegated to a certain environment that has low expectations (eg Enterprise markets).
But if "Windows" devices are going to survive, I think the change has to happen at a much higher level. I can only hope that Pink or whatever is on the horizon for WinMob 7 is an integrated piece of hardware and user experience designed from the ground up to feel like it's the 21st century... using WinMob out of pity is going to get old, very very soon.
V
8525Smart said:
Well, the iPod Touch would make sense, but I would rather not have to carry two devices around. It seems better to me to have an all-in-one device in this case and, if nothing else, it would allow me to utilize the numerous phone-related apps in the app store.
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Click to collapse
Have to agree, I hate carry around two devices. Hence no longer use Ipod touch on the go, just leave it at home in docking station, which its good for.
Use the Jade for music and a phone which fits on my pocket.
I find the istore apps mostly gimmicks anyways, which you pay for and never use.
A smaller tougher Iphone would be good
vijay555 said:
I entirely agree.
In defence of WinMob:
It's p*sses me off something crazy that when Gizmondo et all were reviewing the Palm Pre, multi tasking was one of the killer features. WinMob has had it FOREVER.
It's a good OS, it multitasks, it generally works, it can make calls and emails and whatnot.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Oh my God, yes, YES!
I can't count the number of times I had to defend WinMo against people who obviously never used it. The number of ridiculously comments I seen was ludicrous and often times seem as if the people saying it were just parroting common criticisms as opposed to their actual experience.
One guy I saw even suggested that receiving text/emails and switching between apps was impossible.
On the other hand, I agree with the rest of your post too (as is the subject of my topic). I think you really hit the nail on the head: Windows Mobile's biggest strength, its availability on multiple phones, is also its biggest weakness.
As an owner of a Fuze, an HTC phone with an accelerometer, the lack of accelero-meter WinMo apps makes it very apparent.
I do agree with you that Microsoft needs to do something, at the very least, about the user experience, but I really don't see how it can be done. The iPhone is able to achieve this because it is a software available on one hardware designed by Apple themselves. In order for Microsoft to achieve the same quality of apps or user experience, they would have to design Windows Mobile to take advantage of a particular hardware specification.
As of currently, the best Microsoft can probably achieve is to design Windows Mobile with the best optimization they can while maintaining good compatibility and appearance with a wide number of hardware.
stu-k said:
HI find the istore apps mostly gimmicks anyways, which you pay for and never use.
A smaller tougher Iphone would be good
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
That may be true, but to be fair, the Windows Mobile landscape isn't exactly clear of 'gimmicky' apps either. Some of them even inspired by iPhone equivalents.
HDWobble, anyone?
The 3GS is faster not because of the clock speed, but because the A8 Cortex beats the pants out of the (very long in the tooth) ARM11 in the TP (and TP2, why HTC, why?!!!).
http://www.anandtech.com/gadgets/showdoc.aspx?i=3595&p=4
This is going to see as an odd first post but i am a jailbroken and unlocked iphone user. I have been tinkering with the iphone the way you guys tinker with winmo for 2 years now. To the original poster, if you are such a tinkerer and want to tinker with something new a jailbroken iphone is for you.
Some of THE BEST apps for the iphone are not in the apple app store because apple would never allow it.
I myself am starting to look at the TP2 and winmo phones because i was REALLLLLLLLLLLLY looking forward to the Nokia N97 and that thing just let me down a ton. I have a HTC Hero coming to play with for a while but besides the widgets i don't see a whole lot different between the new TF3D 2 on the TP2 or the TD2 and the Hero.
There are tons of useful 3rd party jailbroken apps and hacks that you can do that make the iphone even THAT much more useable. For instance the 3rd party text messaging applications are w/o question better than the stock apple version however because how they are designed they would never be approved for the app store. Also, there is a hack app called "backgrounder" which allows me to run apps in the background and multi task.
jim_0068 said:
This is going to see as an odd first post but i am a jailbroken and unlocked iphone user. I have been tinkering with the iphone the way you guys tinker with winmo for 2 years now. To the original poster, if you are such a tinkerer and want to tinker with something new a jailbroken iphone is for you.
Some of THE BEST apps for the iphone are not in the apple app store because apple would never allow it.
I myself am starting to look at the TP2 and winmo phones because i was REALLLLLLLLLLLLY looking forward to the Nokia N97 and that thing just let me down a ton. I have a HTC Hero coming to play with for a while but besides the widgets i don't see a whole lot different between the new TF3D 2 on the TP2 or the TD2 and the Hero.
There are tons of useful 3rd party jailbroken apps and hacks that you can do that make the iphone even THAT much more useable. For instance the 3rd party text messaging applications are w/o question better than the stock apple version however because how they are designed they would never be approved for the app store. Also, there is a hack app called "backgrounder" which allows me to run apps in the background and multi task.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Holy crap are you talking about the iPhone? Is the backgrounder for the iPhone? Can I have more information on how this works?
Here is a more important question... will the backgrounder app allow 3rd party alarm applications to finally work on the iPhone?
Will the backgrounder also allow automatic profile scheduling?
poetryrocksalot said:
Holy crap are you talking about the iPhone? Is the backgrounder for the iPhone? Can I have more information on how this works?
Here is a more important question... will the backgrounder app allow 3rd party alarm applications to finally work on the iPhone?
Will the backgrounder also allow automatic profile scheduling?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
yes. but Backgrounder is not compatible with the new 3.0 OS.
and on the 3G you do not exactly have lots of Ram to spare though. only ~34MB after a reset. and applications are not exactly light weight.
i believe profile scheduling is available through other means. but have not really looked into it. Performance really takes a nose dive when you start asking it to do extra stuff due to the lack of Ram.
crazy talk said:
yes. but Backgrounder is not compatible with the new 3.0 OS.
and on the 3G you do not exactly have lots of Ram to spare though. only ~34MB after a reset. and applications are not exactly light weight.
i believe profile scheduling is available through other means. but have not really looked into it. Performance really takes a nose dive when you start asking it to do extra stuff due to the lack of Ram.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Oh that's a shame... this app is useless then. I heard that Apple is considering the idea of having full support for background applications.
The problem is that:
1) Apple knows that not many people care about "background" applications.
2) Consumer common sense is distorted in that they don't understand the purpose of multi-task. They believe that multi-task is already on the iPhone because obviously, you can "exit the application into another application". This isn't the point, a true multitasking system requires A) background applications B) automation of background functions and C) the ability to switch tasks in the foreground of an application.
3) Apple knows that adding background applications will result in people complaining of slowness because 1) Alot of people still don't know what RAM is, not even my sister who is a 4+ year college student working on her masters and 2) Alot of people do not know how to manage a platform involving background applications and 3) average consumers would rather sacrifice functionality for ease-of-use.
I believe the emphasis of this multi-tasking is not a multi-tasking complaint. Idiots are prone to think that the iPhone already has multi-tasking; I've seem them argue about it. We need to add a mentality to people in which they learn that it isn't about multi-tasking, it's about background applications and how we need applications to function in the background.
Well the 3GS has double the ram and faster processor, hopefully they (third-parties) can find a way to make actual multi-tasking more plausible.
new beast in town
the android os is really taking shape and will soon be king. with so many different devices coming aboard this thing will be huge. the g1 now is awesome with just a little tweaking and those who don't want to tweak there are 2 more ota coming in the next 5 months.
nonzenze said:
The 3GS is faster not because of the clock speed, but because the A8 Cortex beats the pants out of the (very long in the tooth) ARM11 in the TP (and TP2, why HTC, why?!!!).
http://www.anandtech.com/gadgets/showdoc.aspx?i=3595&p=4
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Click to collapse
Hmm, very informative read, Thank you,
So the 3GS apparently has a superior CPU in more ways than one, which I'm not really surprised about. I did mentioned that I did not like HTC's choice of CPUs...which they're still using in their newest devices. Many other devices are already using the Cortex A8, so if it is the case that HTC is losing out due to the CPU, then that doesn't bode well for their future phones.
jim_0068 said:
To the original poster, if you are such a tinkerer and want to tinker with something new a jailbroken iphone is for you.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yes, everything you said is true. A jailbroken iPhone is a very nice thing and probably does well for tinkerers. In fact, the 3GS that my friend let me used was jailbroken too.
However, truthfully, installing apps that lets me do new things wasn't what I was really referring to before. Instead, I was largely referring to the changing of ROMs/OS. I believe the iPhone has made some progress running Linux, but nothing else as far as I can see. WM Phone has so many different ROMs available and progress has been made on running Linux (including Android) too. This allows for much more customization, in my opinion as you get the benefit of software-based customization combined with ROM/OS-based.
Besides, it's pretty fun to be running Windows Mobile 6.5 while everyone else is still using Windows Mobile 6.1.
Guys, rumours are the Pink/Zune Phone will be a Win 7 derived device based on hardware designed by Microsoft.
If they pull that off, as they say, "I'd buy that for a dollar".
V
My opinion is that in order to be a solid competitor, Microsoft needs to limit the hardware choices for their platform. HTC does a great job at making devices for Windows Mobile. Microsoft needs to pair up with them to make their own phone. With the new Zune HD coming out featuring the nVidia Tegra chipset, it would make a wonderful platform to build the next generation WM phone from. The thing is, it should be the only phone featuring WM 7 Professsional. It will enable Microsoft to fine tune WM to use every bit of the phone's capabilities, leaving nothing to be desired. Much like they do with their PC OS's, there can be several versions of the main OS with steps in capabilities. Their Zune HD phone should be the candidate for WM7 Ultimate, which would feature smooth transitions and speed.
Edit: Just saw the post above mine. I need to read more!
vijay555 said:
Guys, rumours are the Pink/Zune Phone will be a Win 7 derived device based on hardware designed by Microsoft.
If they pull that off, as they say, "I'd buy that for a dollar".
V
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Rumors are a bit too little to get excited, in my opinion. The possibility of a true iPhone competitor by Microsoft sounds amazing, but it's a bit underwhelming at this point.
We have no knowledge of the OS, no knowledge of the important specs (CPU, RAM, multimedia capabilities, etc) aside from Tegra, and the little specs that is publicly available kind of sucks. 3.3in screen with 480x272 res? Call me picky, but I would have hoped for 3.5-3.7in with at least 640x480.
Still, I have not followed the news of the Zune HD, and it does, indeed, look pretty amazing. The Os does at least. The Zune HD's OS appears to work amazingly well; It is incredibly fast and smooth.
8525Smart said:
Rumors are a bit too little to get excited, in my opinion. The possibility of a true iPhone competitor by Microsoft sounds amazing, but it's a bit underwhelming at this point.
We have no knowledge of the OS, no knowledge of the important specs (CPU, RAM, multimedia capabilities, etc) aside from Tegra, and the little specs that is publicly available kind of sucks. 3.3in screen with 480x272 res? Call me picky, but I would have hoped for 3.5-3.7in with at least 640x480.
Still, I have not followed the news of the Zune HD, and it does, indeed, look pretty amazing. The Os does at least. The Zune HD's OS appears to work amazingly well; It is incredibly fast and smooth.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I really think the only company that can actually create a truly direct competitor to Apple and iPhone is Microsoft...it's the name and not the product.....
Apple had a bad rep back then and now they are doing good.
It seems like Microsoft is tagged after Apple jumped the boat to success.
We'll just have to wait for Microsoft to adopt Apple's precedent.
With Microsoft directly creating their own phone and not just an OS, we might actually get a true iPhone killer. Though Microsoft may have to revamp the entire OS and create their own line of OS totally unrelated to Windows Mobile.
Hello World,
I really don't understand why, but I know there are some people that want WP7 on their "old" devices like HD2 and that some great gurus on XDA are working hard to do it
Yet personally I just hate WP7 and I would like to know if the opposite initiative exists or would be possible : I would like to have good old WinMo 6.5 on newer hardware
I'd love to have something with at least 1 ghz horsepower like HD2, a big capacitive screen but also with a hardware keyboard like desire Z or HTC 7 pro ... running WinMo.
Do you know if there are some hacking attempts to make work wm 6.5 on new devices designed for wp7 or android ?
Cheers,
Nibbler.
Doubt it, WM is about the only OS versatile enough to launch a different OS altogether. I personally wouldnt touch 6.5 again with a 10 foot pole, I dont want to modify my phone for a week before it gains some functionality.
There are plenty of people, like myself, who would love to trade our HD2's for an HD7. Different strokes.
z33dev33l said:
Doubt it, WM is about the only OS versatile enough to launch a different OS altogether. I personally wouldnt touch 6.5 again with a 10 foot pole, I dont want to modify my phone for a week before it gains some functionality.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
i think you will find android is just as able to launch a diffrent os .... linux based os's like ubuntu can be easly launched from android
Linux on top of linux isnt that impressive... and linux itself is kinda a letdown as is. I mean I know that its capable of a bunch of cool additional features but just like android you have to tinker with it for forever before it's usable.
uberamd said:
There are plenty of people, like myself, who would love to trade our HD2's for an HD7. Different strokes.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Give it time and I'm sure there will be plenty of people you can swap with
Old?
LOL, it´s funny how now we are used to call "old" to a year old device
I prefer Leo because I can switch between Android and WM and soon with WP7 and that´s the freedom I want on a phone.
Doubt WP7 will have the option to load WM but if I´m wrong probably then and only then I should consider it.
I agree, I would love to have the "option" to put 6.5 on a WP7 phone...just gota figure out that flash card thing !
Just because every app for 6.5 is not available for WP7 yet and won't be for a long time, basic stuff like RDC is not there yet and I need it.
z33dev33l said:
Doubt it, WM is about the only OS versatile enough to launch a different OS altogether. I personally wouldnt touch 6.5 again with a 10 foot pole, I dont want to modify my phone for a week before it gains some functionality.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I agree with you on both points : WM is the most versatile mobile OS ... and yes most of the time you have to tweak it a lot. Yet from my point of view, WM as a core and some graphical user friendly interface above like Sense gives to the user "the best of the two worlds" : a powerful and tweakable machine but also user friendly out of the box
orb3000 said:
Old?
LOL, it´s funny how now we are used to call "old" to a year old device
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I've also double quoted "Old" in my post
DavidinCT said:
I agree, I would love to have the "option" to put 6.5 on a WP7 phone...just gota figure out that flash card thing !
Just because every app for 6.5 is not available for WP7 yet and won't be for a long time, basic stuff like RDC is not there yet and I need it.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Definitely
Now that I´ve tested WP7 on my leo I must confess I prefer Windows Mobile
Read my article tomorrow in the Portal to know more
Just to try to clarify my thought :
even if certainly difficult, would it be possible or totally unthinkable to "cross-flash" let's say a tweaked HD2 rom, with some touch pro 2 keyboard drivers cooked inside, over a HD7pro or Desire Z machine if the hardware between HD2 and HD7pro/Desire Z are quite similar ?
orb3000 said:
Now that I´ve tested WP7 on my leo I must confess I prefer Windows Mobile
Read my article tomorrow in the Portal to know more
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I also think WM is just 10000 better and more powerful than WP7
Personally I just don't understand why WP7 is making such a buzz ... and even inside the techno-geeks people community
What makes me sad it is not that m$ has made WP7 ... (if some people are willing to pay to have a uglier and not customizable OS with less features, it's after all their choice ) ... what makes me sad is that WM a much more capable and versatile OS is dying
orb3000 said:
Now that I´ve tested WP7 on my leo I must confess I prefer Windows Mobile
Read my article tomorrow in the Portal to know more
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
One day working with WP7 on a hacked device gives you a firm base to run a compare of the two? I don't think so mate, that would be poor journalism at best.
Lord.Nibbler said:
I also think WM is just 10000 better and more powerful than WP7
Personally I just don't understand why WP7 is making such a buzz ... and even inside the techno-geeks people community
What makes me sad it is not that m$ has made WP7 ... (if some people are willing to pay to have a uglier and not customizable OS with less features, it's after all their choice ) ... what makes me sad is that WM a much more capable and versatile OS is dying
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Eh, I agree except the uglier part. People for the most part arent members of XDA developers. Who wants a phone that you have to tweak for days before it becomes something functional? Maybe an XDA member. Who wants a phone that you still have to bust a stylus out sometimes to hit some menu options? Maybe an XDA member. I would trade all of that in any day for the most fluid UI, intelligent keyboard, and music interface on a phone to date.
The reason for this is ......... just because.
The HTC HD2 is an awesome phone, that should be the basis of any number of other phones. Its very hackable, its stable, it works well, its epically user-friendly and it doesn't have any significant downsides. Its also very easy to change the bootloader on and we've seen the effectiveness of MAGLDR and other options.
Asking why is sort of like asking why Linux exists. It exists because its something people find useful and interesting. Some people find it awesome to hack, some find it great to use. Most don't know about it and never change their phone in any way.
I'm personally waiting to see iOS4 running on the HD2. That will be interestingly epic.
Probably the reason is WM6.5 is pretty much dead, and WP7 isn't. You aren't going to see any new apps or new development for WM6.5. All the latest apps are going to be for iPhone, Android, and WP7.
It's kind of a shame, I think 6.5 seems quite fluid and finger-friendly on my Touch Diamond running Energy ROM. However, none of the games and apps I have for iPhone and Android are available for WM6.5.
z33dev33l said:
Eh, I agree except the uglier part. People for the most part arent members of XDA developers. Who wants a phone that you have to tweak for days before it becomes something functional? Maybe an XDA member. Who wants a phone that you still have to bust a stylus out sometimes to hit some menu options? Maybe an XDA member. I would trade all of that in any day for the most fluid UI, intelligent keyboard, and music interface on a phone to date.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Just two points :
- In fact uglier or not uglier is just a matter of taste, so I wont argue on that even if I found the WP7 interface horrible ... The real point that is really ugly is that fact that m$ is becoming dictatorial and decided to prevent people to have the right to change it or customize it to suit their needs Personally I will never pay for an OS that will prevent me to do what I want to do. The OS must suit my needs, not the contrary
- And as for the tweaking ... if you take a phone like the HD2 WM+Sense, you have a pretty good power over user friendliness balance, certainly far far better than any of the WP7 devices...
zedd_D1abl0 said:
The reason for this is ......... just because.
The HTC HD2 is an awesome phone, that should be the basis of any number of other phones. Its very hackable, its stable, it works well, its epically user-friendly and it doesn't have any significant downsides. Its also very easy to change the bootloader on and we've seen the effectiveness of MAGLDR and other options.
Asking why is sort of like asking why Linux exists. It exists because its something people find useful and interesting. Some people find it awesome to hack, some find it great to use. Most don't know about it and never change their phone in any way.
I'm personally waiting to see iOS4 running on the HD2. That will be interestingly epic.
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Click to collapse
I think you've maybe misunderstood me : I don't ask "why HD2 ?" because I also think it is by far the best smartphone on the market even today or why hacking which is more and more logical and legitimate when major companies try to restrict features as much as possible just to try to sell you a shiny new new revolutionary "copy & paste" upgrade a few month later...
My point is : for now I won't change my HD2, I don't think that I will find a better phone on the market in the near future...
I mean, hardware is improving and some really nice 1 ghz+ sliding keyboard like HD7 pro will be soon available... but for me WP7 is just a wobbly dumbphone OS that will prevent me to buy such phone.
But HD2 won't last forever ... so I was just trying to know if there would be a chance that the creativity of the xda gurus could be orientated to try to keep alive WM on newer hardware, as m$ certainly won't do it, as it is more profitable for them to push forward Wobbly Phone 7
GnatGoSplat said:
Probably the reason is WM6.5 is pretty much dead, and WP7 isn't. You aren't going to see any new apps or new development for WM6.5. All the latest apps are going to be for iPhone, Android, and WP7.
It's kind of a shame, I think 6.5 seems quite fluid and finger-friendly on my Touch Diamond running Energy ROM. However, none of the games and apps I have for iPhone and Android are available for WM6.5.
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Click to collapse
And it's even better on a HD2 than on a diamond
The fact is that even if WM6.5 is dying ... there are still a lot more apps on WM6.5 than WP7 and you also find apps on WM that you won't find on Android or iPhone.
And developers are stopping to develop on WM6.5 because they think that there is no future...
But maybe if WP7 sales are very low, and power users still try to keep alive WM6.5 and show that they won't accept this forced regression ... maybe m$ will change their minds and they will give us back some power features, customisation and compatibility with WM6.5. After all, WP7 core is still windows CE based so it is just an artificial and arbitrary tie up.
They ditched all the easy access for a UI that's not terrible without a stylus. Fair trade in my opinion. I like 6.5 but I didn't like building up my hd2 with custom everything before I could call it functional. Complain about c & p all you want I never used it. I did however use the keyboard, the menus, the dialer, the SMS programs, email integration, etc. None of which could be considered useful if even functional on 6.5. I'll take an os i don't have to mod to make it awesome over one i can mod in a number of ways any time.
This may be just from my perspective but yeah. Here goes.
Android/Linux-Nice if you work it just right, however it takes hours of tinkering and at least a basic knowledge of the operating system before it can really be considered asa daily driver. It has it's problemd but because it's open source AND pretty easy people flock to it.
Windows/WP7- Very simple, very clean, lacks a few functions that we'd like to have but all in all very usable and good at what it does. The most well known and for most people easiest to understand and operate. (Yes I know WP7 is not the most well known)
Iphone/Mac- Just simple, without some major hacking it cant perform a lot of basic functions, anything that can be done on this can likely be done on another OS, comes with all the software necessary for it to work but doesnt give you much choice on what you want. Essentially pick this program or do without. Computers/phones for dummies or people who think they're "indie" by going with a corporate giant :/
Android - it's a basic interface phone, does what it says on the tin, but can be customised to do more.
Linux - great as a free server, great as an office PC, not so great if you're a home user who doesn't know how it works.
WM6.5 - It works, excellent business integration, GB of support, plenty of aftermarket improvements to simply customise it, never really understood by MS.
WP7 - simplistic, dull, lacks simple features which phones 10 years ago had. If you think the iphone is too complicated then this is the phone for you. Let uncle Bill look after your data, you can trust him...
W7 - Nice aero snap and peek features. We don't want you to use the program menu though.
Iphone - Simple phone, external airplane mode feature, other phone users will think you're a prat. It has the GB, and the WIFI. It can download apps.
Mac - show the world you have more money than sense. For people who find mice with more than one button complicated, and don't get sarcasm.
there may be a smidge of sarcasm in this post, can you spot it?
xaccers said:
Android - it's a basic interface phone, does what it says on the tin, but can be customised to do more.
Linux - great as a free server, great as an office PC, not so great if you're a home user who doesn't know how it works.
WM6.5 - It works, excellent business integration, GB of support, plenty of aftermarket improvements to simply customise it, never really understood by MS.
WP7 - simplistic, dull, lacks simple features which phones 10 years ago had. If you think the iphone is too complicated then this is the phone for you. Let uncle Bill look after your data, you can trust him...
W7 - Nice aero snap and peek features. We don't want you to use the program menu though.
Iphone - Simple phone, external airplane mode feature, other phone users will think you're a prat. It has the GB, and the WIFI. It can download apps.
Mac - show the world you have more money than sense. For people who find mice with more than one button complicated.
there may be a smidge of sarcasm in this post, can you spot it?
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Click to collapse
That was a grand reply
That I can, if a fluid UI makes you simpler than the iphone then I will take simplicity over linux any day... I just dont get the benefit other than the android gaming community and that's coming form someone who dual-boots fedora on his computer regularly.... aside from things like the cube it just cant do much that windows cant and windows can do so much more.
z33dev33l said:
That I can, if a fluid UI makes you simpler than the iphone then I will take simplicity over linux any day... I just dont get the benefit other than the android gaming community and that's coming form someone who dual-boots fedora on his computer regularly.... aside from things like the cube it just cant do much that windows cant and windows can do so much more.
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Click to collapse
A simplistic and uninspiringly dull interface on a phone which is missing features even my old Ericsson handset had, then yes it's simpler than the iphone.
As for android, personally I find it meh, I use it for a couple of games and kindle. I can't see what all the fuss is about it.
xaccers said:
A simplistic and uninspiringly dull interface on a phone which is missing features even my old Ericsson handset had, then yes it's simpler than the iphone.
As for android, personally I find it meh, I use it for a couple of games and kindle. I can't see what all the fuss is about it.
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Click to collapse
Nor can I, its decent but not astounding. I have an HD2 that I still use to tinker with. It's a great phone but only if you really want to tinker. I still play with it frequently and always keep it at its most up to date state in terms of roms but with windows 7 its nice to have a phone that works well out of the box, thats something I havent seen since before the days of smartphones and it's a great thing to see. The UI might be dull to some but I like the simplicity there, a lot of people on android go out of their way to make the UI as plain as possible rather than making it look jumbled. WP7 just mad that necessary and added some very fluid animations. In time we will be able to sideload properly and we'll have the support. For now I have a phone that works well that has not been modded in the least and I enjoy that.
z33dev33l said:
Nor can I, its decent but not astounding. I have an HD2 that I still use to tinker with. It's a great phone but only if you really want to tinker. I still play with it frequently and always keep it at its most up to date state in terms of roms but with windows 7 its nice to have a phone that works well out of the box, thats something I havent seen since before the days of smartphones and it's a great thing to see. The UI might be dull to some but I like the simplicity there, a lot of people on android go out of their way to make the UI as plain as possible rather than making it look jumbled. WP7 just mad that necessary and added some very fluid animations. In time we will be able to sideload properly and we'll have the support. For now I have a phone that works well that has not been modded in the least and I enjoy that.
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Click to collapse
I don't recognise the asertion that you have to tinker with the HD2 to get it to work.
I only ever run stock roms, not had an issue with any of them, they just work.
I don't want animations that seem to take forever or somehow give me travelsickness (thank you htc hub), I like that in WM6.5 I tap on a shortcut and the program starts, I tap on the program grid and it appears straight away. I don't have to wait for things to flip over or spin round.
I like that on WM6.5 I can have a wallpaper to brighten my day whenever I use my phone, I do really like that android has live wallpapers (I have fish swimming around my phone).
I also like that I've got so much integration with exchange.
The CEO of one of my clients likes how he can use WinMo to synchronise his work contacts and calender entries with his home PC's Outlook just by plugging his phone in. He's not techie but he has no problems with WinMo and certainly hasn't done any tweaks. Thankfully he's techie enough to understand the dangers of the cloud so certainly won't be going for WP7.
What do you mean by "dangers of the cloud" something like big brother? I guess that is a concern if theres something to hide but I guess thats not me. I love the HD2 but definitely not stock, I liked the vanilla that looked similar to zune player but even then the keyboard was just awful without swype going into menus without a stylus was terrible unless you have the hands of a three-year-old, and it still seemed slow to react. As for wallpapers it doesnt concern me, I have a lockscreen of my son that does fine because if im on my phone im seldom on the homescreen. I feel windows mobile was just intended for a stylus and through our community here we made it something better but certainly not flawless. Also, I've never even had to plug in to sync my contacts. Between past phones with google and microsoft and a couple facebook contacts I've got all the people I need and then some. I just feel android is intended for low end devices and WM6.5 was a stylus phone rather than a finger friendly phone regardless of the hardware.
All in all, WM6.5 was the last bastion of free and personal mobile OS, which many have failed to embrace (and really, who can blame them?). From here on out, it'll be like Orwell's 1984 and every person will be tagged with an RFID in a form of their mobile phone. Resistance is futile...
GET TO THAA CHOOPPPPAAAA!!!
z33dev33l said:
What do you mean by "dangers of the cloud" something like big brother? I guess that is a concern if theres something to hide but I guess thats not me. I love the HD2 but definitely not stock, I liked the vanilla that looked similar to zune player but even then the keyboard was just awful without swype going into menus without a stylus was terrible unless you have the hands of a three-year-old, and it still seemed slow to react. As for wallpapers it doesnt concern me, I have a lockscreen of my son that does fine because if im on my phone im seldom on the homescreen. I feel windows mobile was just intended for a stylus and through our community here we made it something better but certainly not flawless. Also, I've never even had to plug in to sync my contacts. Between past phones with google and microsoft and a couple facebook contacts I've got all the people I need and then some. I just feel android is intended for low end devices and WM6.5 was a stylus phone rather than a finger friendly phone regardless of the hardware.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
With MS3.5 WM becomes the most finger friendly phone I've used.
From the sounds of things, you don't use a phone for much, so I can see the appeal of WP7 for you.
The issue with the cloud is not MS poking around but some hacker. MS is a much larger target than my clients' own servers. They cannot risk their data in the hands of an entity which they have no control over and no SLA with.
MS has a history of poor security, both regards to hacking and data redundancy, look at the user data they lost without having backups. It is not plausible to expect businesses to expose themselves to such risks.
If someone hacks in and gets access to your data, then it's no big deal, someone hacks into my clients' data and companies can go bust, court cases get dismissed, generally not good.
I run my own exchange server so have no need to sync with a desktop, but for those who want to be able to sync their work mailbox data with their home computer it was an excellent secure business feature.
Funny you should mention swype, I've never needed it on winmo, but on Android (and WP7 if I ever was forced to use one longer than 5 minutes) I've installed it simply because the stock keyboard (pretty much identical to WP7's) is vile.
Why should I have to flip to a different overlay to enter numbers when it has the function of longpress?
lude219 said:
All in all, WM6.5 was the last bastion of free and personal mobile OS, which many have failed to embrace (and really, who can blame them?). From here on out, it'll be like Orwell's 1984 and every person will be tagged with an RFID in a form of their mobile phone. Resistance is futile...
GET TO THAA CHOOPPPPAAAA!!!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Don't forget new phones which detect the stock rom isn't being run so hard reset to it.
xaccers said:
Mac - show the world you have more money than sense. For people who find mice with more than one button complicated.
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Click to collapse
You, in fact, are a prat. The amount of work needed to put into Linux to make it simply usable is simply ridiculous. Mac runs the fastest out of the box and is insanely reliable.
tribestros said:
You, in fact, are a prat. The amount of work needed to put into Linux to make it simply usable is simply ridiculous. Mac runs the fastest out of the box and is insanely reliable.
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Click to collapse
bwhahahahaha
Thank you, I've just had to edit the original post
xaccers said:
With MS3.5 WM becomes the most finger friendly phone I've used.
From the sounds of things, you don't use a phone for much, so I can see the appeal of WP7 for you.
The issue with the cloud is not MS poking around but some hacker. MS is a much larger target than my clients' own servers. They cannot risk their data in the hands of an entity which they have no control over and no SLA with.
MS has a history of poor security, both regards to hacking and data redundancy, look at the user data they lost without having backups. It is not plausible to expect businesses to expose themselves to such risks.
If someone hacks in and gets access to your data, then it's no big deal, someone hacks into my clients' data and companies can go bust, court cases get dismissed, generally not good.
I run my own exchange server so have no need to sync with a desktop, but for those who want to be able to sync their work mailbox data with their home computer it was an excellent secure business feature.
Funny you should mention swype, I've never needed it on winmo, but on Android (and WP7 if I ever was forced to use one longer than 5 minutes) I've installed it simply because the stock keyboard (pretty much identical to WP7's) is vile.
Why should I have to flip to a different overlay to enter numbers when it has the function of longpress?
Don't forget new phones which detect the stock rom isn't being run so hard reset to it.
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Click to collapse
I dont use my business phone for much, so its perfect for that. My fun phone is an HD2 where I do my tinkering and such. Even when I run WM on it which is most of the time I theme it like WP7, it's just more fluid. I love all the additional features but I still cant find a keyboard on it that can keep up as well as the Samsung Focus' keyboard... I mean I guess it's different user to user but I could never use a stock HD2, it just doesnt work well for me.
tribestros said:
You, in fact, are a prat. The amount of work needed to put into Linux to make it simply usable is simply ridiculous. Mac runs the fastest out of the box and is insanely reliable.
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Click to collapse
Not anymore, Ubuntu is voted as one of the user friendliest linux OS's, and has been holding this since 2006.
User friendly =/= Linux. And this is coming from a guy that used Linux on my old computer. Ubuntu is good but still below par and not on pace with OS X or W7.
tribestros said:
User friendly =/= Linux. And this is coming from a guy that used Linux on my old computer. Ubuntu is good but still below par and not on pace with OS X or W7.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Ok, different people have different pars
Sent from my Nero powered Vibrant
z33dev33l said:
.... aside from things like the cube it just cant do much that windows cant and windows can do so much more.
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Click to collapse
You got to be kidding right, linux hands down eats windows for breakfast and then some. Linux has no limits (well almost), yeah its complicated but anything good is.
I used WinMo 6.5 for about a year and I found it good, but definitely not good enough out of the box. Very customizable though.
I just got Android and I like it, out of the box very good with alot of potential.
ErOR22 said:
You got to be kidding right, linux hands down eats windows for breakfast and then some. Linux has no limits (well almost), yeah its complicated but anything good is.
I used WinMo 6.5 for about a year and I found it good, but definitely not good enough out of the box. Very customizable though.
I just got Android and I like it, out of the box very good with alot of potential.
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Click to collapse
That'd likely be the case if there was more support for it or even if they would make a few games for it because WINE doesnt emulate too much... Theres a severe lack of aplications for it and thats its biggest fault. Android might be usable out of the box but its not pretty and compared to iOS/WP7 its laggy...
z33dev33l said:
That'd likely be the case if there was more support for it or even if they would make a few games for it because WINE doesnt emulate too much... Theres a severe lack of aplications for it and thats its biggest fault. Android might be usable out of the box but its not pretty and compared to iOS/WP7 its laggy...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
There is support for Linux, Ubuntu offers some professional support but main support is Internet/Community. Linux is not focused on gaming and this isn't mobile world where number of applications determine how good a OS is ?? (I never get that... OMG iphone has 500000 apps....like who cares, most are crap anyway).
In terms of what the OS is able to do, Linux wins, can Windows kernel be modified? No, it's not open source. Imagine Linux as a canvas which you can freely paint on and Windows as a small circle on the canvas which you can't paint outside of.
I got Desire HD and Android looks great with Sense and there's zero lag anywhere, and it's totally stock. iOS is horrid and WP7 I haven't used/seen yet.
I wonder if the transitions/animations in WP7 is actually there to hide the lag because they're bloody long winded and I'd need an option to turn them off to get it to my HD2's level.
Had another disappointment with android today, sent myself an email with a phone number, opened it in android an no obvious option to dial the number (hopefully someone will pop on and say there's a setting or a knack) so rebooted to wm and just tapped the number in the email.
I was curious to hear from former Android users how you like WP7. Mainly what are your main gripes and what functions did you actually use that are no longer available. Also, are the tradeoffs worth it in the end and what features really *make* swapping worth it. I have loved android for a long time but I'm kind of wanting something new and have liked the wp7 interface from day one. Thanks!
Sent from my ThunderBolt using XDA App
Here goes:
Mainly what are your main gripes
No apps, and if there are apps they are over priced and crap alternatives to Android versions.
Homebrew is going to cost money.
I know its a phone and should mainly just be a phone, but there is nothing to do on it, I never leave my Android phone alone always playing with something but this I treat it like a nokia 3310 lol.
What functions did you actually use that are no longer available
I don't know what it is but there are some things missing but Mango is looking good but still not as good as Android and Ice Cream Sandwich will be coming out around the same time.
Are the tradeoffs worth it in the end and what features really *make* swapping worth it.
Only thing that is making me want to swap over is the Xbox Live thing other than that Android is far superior.
I have loved android for a long time but I'm kind of wanting something new and have liked the wp7 interface from day one.
I love Android also and also wanted to try something new but Windows Phone 7 isn't something new. Stick with Android and Launcher7 lol ^^
I think I'm fine with paying for my phone to be unlocked personally, one time fee for the latest beta builds forever? Honestly I don't know why HTC Samsung and Motorola aren't looking into this for android devices so they can make some extra $ and make us impatient (or reasonable people that don't like waiting for their craptastic skins) people happy.
I don't care much for Xbox live like I use to but I definitely like Zune pass (really its probably the top single feature that has me wanting wp7 as I use my phone for music a lot).
I love android but honestly, I'm tired of trying to throw on custom ROMs (its fun but tiring) on every phone I get trying to keep up with the updates. I think the only thing that is holding me to android at this point is the ability to wifi tether my phone to my tablet and the fact that mango phones are on their way (fall is only 2-3 months away so announcements should be made soon?)
So guys, is there some feature that I am missing that you really either miss from android or you really like that wp7 had when you made the swap?
Sent from my ThunderBolt using XDA App
i switched from my old Desire Z and X8 (both of em are still in use sometimes) to a 7 Pro.
so in my own personal opinion, a small "comparision":
1. UI & Customization
I like the UI of WP7 alot more, you can use Launcher7 on Android but it doesn't feel as good. Its smoother and a lot faster, mostly due to inability of "customization" but i really don't miss it. The tile system works surprisingly well, and yeah i don't have a lot to complain about.
No wallpapers, no app launchers etc. It's a locked phone pretty much. If you don't mind, well just don't care
If you want customization stay with Android, else both of em are good in their own ways -> personal preference.
2. Apps
For most people an important point. If you compare Android market to WP7 market, WP7 looses.. big time!
You are charged for almost every app (and a good bunch of em are overpriced!). While free apps, and sometimes test versions of the paid apps are good enough, its still nothing in comparision to Android.
If you want specific apps, check prices first! (i'd recommend it before buying the phone )
There are some social features integrated into WP7 but at the moment (Pre-Mango for me still), they aren't complete. The replacements for those features are at best mediocore, sometimes they shut off randomly etc. There might be some better apps for those, but since i don't use em very much, i havent searched for them.
Otherwise the quality of the apps and games i downloaded is really good, though some of em are missing. As i said, check before you buy the phone, if you didnt already.
3. Features:
Well again the points goes to Android. Bluetooth File Transfer, Tethering and stuff like that, you won't find it on any current WP7 phone (unless you are a Mango user, but i don't know if they implement some of those features). If you need it, well i wouldn't recommend buying a WP7 as of now.
Other than that, i don't really miss any important ones.
4. Final Thoughts:
Since i don't have the WP7 for too long forgive me if i missed or overexaggerated on somethings.
In the end i think, WP7 is a real good OS. While locked down very hard, it just works (just like the hated Apple). While it does feel kind of inferioer to Android (due to the lack of some importants features mostly), it really isn't. There are workarounds for everything, though they are complicated sometimes
With Mango.. well no, even now in MY opinion (which means only for my needs etc), i equal WP7 to Android. While i still use my Androids sometimes (mainly for tethering etc), i often see myself not missing those phones.
I'd recommend WP7 everytime, as well as Android. Just get some information on both, maybe if your friends have said phones, compare them ( or go to the store and do the same).
In the end it comes down to one's need and preference
If you want, you could wait for Mango devices. Though i guess they won't up the hardware too much, maybe add some features like Front Facing Camera and stuff like that, but that's it.
I hope i could help some
BartJJ said:
I was curious to hear from former Android users how you like WP7. Mainly what are your main gripes and what functions did you actually use that are no longer available. Also, are the tradeoffs worth it in the end and what features really *make* swapping worth it. I have loved android for a long time but I'm kind of wanting something new and have liked the wp7 interface from day one. Thanks!
Sent from my ThunderBolt using XDA App
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
This entire WP7 OS is simply beautiful and fluid. Rather than 95% of all other android devices, all WP7s are completely lag free while still having a very attractive and intuitive interface. I have 28k apps at my disposal and that means one for everything I would want. The WP7 community here is amazing and hacking / development itself isn't fragmented. I've owned 3 android devices and 2 iOS devices in the past and I'm honestly never looking back.
Android too me seems very slow and inconsistent. Running a Samsung Galaxy I often find when the thing lags, it lags to the extreme. The whole app-store mechanism I find a mess, especially because to much power is given to the app developers. More often then not, they abuse these powers which destroys your battery life.
I like the way WP7 is headed, and I like what Microsoft is doing to keep it a reliable platform. What I don't like however, is the update-procedure as it's very poorly performed. I'm not blaming any company in particular, but I do think updates needs to rolled out faster. Why do ISPs have to test every minor update?
Other then that, the WP7 UI is far superior, and app support is coming along well now. We just need a major bump and hopefully Nokia will spark this? I'm looking forward to purchasing a 2nd gen phone, namely a Nokia.
I went from iphone 3gs to blackberry torch to palm pre 2 to samsung focus to atrix 4g to iphone 4 and back to samsung focus and i love it.
The largest difference to me is that WP7 lacks customization. With android you will hardly ever find 2 phones that have the same ui and settings. All windows phones home screens look the same. I am ok w/ lack of apps. Honestly there is pretty much something for everything already. What would make me happy and never go back to android is being able to personalize the home screen. Maybe some transparent tiles and a wallpaper background for homescreen. that would be awesome.
I'll try to keep this succinct. I had an Evo 4G for the last year, then switched to an HTC Arrive a couple days ago.
Like:
-Most of the apps I used on Android are available on WP7
-As a Zune Pass subscriber, having that ecosystem on my phone is awesome
-It feels like for tasks I do often, I can do all of those tasks in a lot less time than it took on Android
-I primarily develop in .NET, so the dev tools are way friendlier to me than Android's.
Dislike:
-WP7 doesn't have anything that comes close to the awesomeness of Google Navigation
-I'm pretty heavily into the Google Voice ecosystem. Losing the tight integration there is annoying.
-As a Zune Pass subscriber, the lack of expandable storage is agonizing. I can never completely get rid of my Zune HD because it's still the device I have to go to if I want access to all of my music/podcasts.
-The Amazon Android App Market's free app of the day has spoiled me so badly on the pricing race-to-the-bottom front that I am finding it very hard to convince myself to buy any of the games on WP7.
Overall, I am having a good time so far. There is some functionality I am missing, but nothing that I'd consider a showstopper. I still have my Evo 4G, so I might end up switching between the two devices every couple months or so.
I just switched from a samsung mesmerize to a HTC TP7.
My first impression was WOW. I instantly liked the tp7. it's more responsive, it's faster, i can do stuff faster, and everything loads faster. Typing on the screen is more accurate and fixes my screw ups better.
As for apps, the android market has tons more, but in my experience 99.99999% of them are completely and totally useless and the ones that aren't useless i found to be lacking. There were a few that were good, but not many. So far the ones i've tried on WP7 actually seem to be of decent quality and i can find an app for everything i need so far. Some are still obviously in the early stages and need some more features but the app feels higher quality. Of course the windows marketplace has it's share of fart, burp and police light apps. (who downloads these stupid things?)
My ONLY complaint so far is the fact i can't do custom colors on the tiles. the stock colors frankly suck. I tried unlocking the phone and chevron doesn't find the phone at all so i'm wondering if this phone just isn't unlockable with that method. Not being able to do custom tile colors just seems like an obvious omission that should have been fixed allready.
Other than that i like this phone MUCH better, it's faster and doesn't hiccup as much as android did. The loss of customization sucks a bit but honestly, who really cares. I'd rather have the phone work well than be able to customize the wallpaper. The tile color though is killing me.
lots of very good points expressed already, and I agree with most.
However: wm6.5 was far superior to my android in all the little area's that I liked / wanted to tweak... which left me disappointed when I switched to android and frustrated with the infancy of the android based os / app wanting some of the simple things that I was used to on wm6.5.
Then I jump back to windows mobile (thinking it will be great to reg edit again) only to find... tile overlay with no access to the good stuff, and on top of that extremely limited in more ways than android... apps (android copycat) extremely limited and very high priced... I never needed apps to do what I wanted. windows already had it, I just needed to turn it on or off and or tweak it the way I wanted it. customize to no end.
Now I really like the smooth integrated feel, and I took a step down in hardware just to get the operating system. I am back to hacking a android wanna be like device just to get to the meat of the phone, so I can use the power of wm7. I think...
Morrisme said:
Now I really like the smooth integrated feel, and I took a step down in hardware just to get the operating system. I am back to hacking a android wanna be like device just to get to the meat of the phone, so I can use the power of wm7. I think...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
It's WP7 !
I think all we have to do is to wait a bit. My only problem is, that the application store is pretty empty(and overpriced), but hopefully it's gonna change.
What I see is, that Microsoft tries to copy Apple in terms of system optimisation, and simplicity, and so far I say it's successful.
I hope once the marketplace will be flooded with applications, there will be a serious filter on what apps they allow, and what they don't. The main criteria of selling on marketplace should be to have a perfectly smooth application on every windows based mobile, because what I see now is far away from that. Applications seem to just thrown together for wp7 in a day or 2.
Otherwise coming from android myself, I miss certain apps, or games, or functions, but the other hand I'm impressed by it's UI, and smoothness.
WP7 has potential, but it's time is not yet here. Once a great poet said in youtube comments: "Iphone is the past, Android is the present, WP7 is the future"
I came from evo 4g and I love it I got an arrive. Its so quick. And something no one mentioned battery life is great sure if I game for a while I will need a top off bit other then that a work day is no problem btw my work day is 12 hrs
There are some surprising holes in WP7 which I didn't expect compared to other OS.
1) No common Compass API - it's down to individual hardware manufacturers to supply drivers and they all implement it in a different way. So what works on an LG won't work on a Samsung or HTC. Really hinders the use of maps and star gazing apps etc. This is despite the compass being a mandatory part of MS' hardware spec. So much for MS' tight hardware platform control. And don't think about trying Mango - even if you have the compass working in NoDo it won't in the Mango Beta - and MS say it wont be availible until the OEMs release their final versions. The whole point of a Beta and RTM is so developers can test and adapt their software ready for launch - but with the compass augmented apps (one of the killer features of modern smartphones) they are screwed. We have a common API for GPS, why not Compass?
2) No PIN delay - even the most basic phone that offers Exchange support allows a configurable delay before the phone is PIN locked, or respects the delay imposed by an Exchange security policy. Everytime my screen goes off - I have to enter an 8 character password - despite the Exchange policy allowing a max 20 minute delay. Is this fixed in mango? Is this how MS works with MS?
..and relax...
hi guys
i have a couple of questions before buying a wp7 phone
i want to buy an MS phone but im afraid that it doesn't have the "openness" that android offers
does wp7 have a "do it our way" ideology like the iphone ?
am i stuck to something like "itunes"
i noticed that when u press search Bing shows up
can i choose google instead ?
thanks
hello to you! i have been an android user since 2009, also an iOS user since 2008... now I am a happy user of a windows phone wich i tell you sincerely that you wont miss that android... I'm feeling like i was reborn, with an apealing look, everything seems to be at his natural place...its very stable, you wont meet these freeze from android or iOS..besides that, seems to me that internet explorer is faster than ever...you have the same high quality games like iOS. And yes, you can make it in your own way...microsoft has developed an app like itune, called zune, but you wont depend on zune... anyway, zune is more friendly than iTunes! so, i truly recommend you a windows phone with mango... its purely awesome!
untitledmangxg said:
hello to you! i have been an android user since 2009, also an iOS user since 2008... now I am a happy user of a windows phone wich i tell you sincerely that you wont miss that android... I'm feeling like i was reborn, with an apealing look, everything seems to be at his natural place...its very stable, you wont meet these freeze from android or iOS..besides that, seems to me that internet explorer is faster than ever...you have the same high quality games like iOS. And yes, you can make it in your own way...microsoft has developed an app like itune, called zune, but you wont depend on zune... anyway, zune is more friendly than iTunes! so, i truly recommend you a windows phone with mango... its purely awesome!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
this sounds great !!
im planning on buying a lumia 800 after 2 months
by that time they would have sorted out the firmware issues
thanks !!!
You won't regret the Lumia purchase. Had mine 10 days now, and it's gorgeous - aesthetically and as an OS.
lulzinator said:
this sounds great !!
im planning on buying a lumia 800 after 2 months
by that time they would have sorted out the firmware issues
thanks !!!
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Click to collapse
If you are waiting for 2 months, then maybe you will have more devices on offer. Hopefully a Lumia 900?
lulzinator said:
hi guys
i have a couple of questions before buying a wp7 phone
i want to buy an MS phone but im afraid that it doesn't have the "openness" that android offers
does wp7 have a "do it our way" ideology like the iphone ?
am i stuck to something like "itunes"
i noticed that when u press search Bing shows up
can i choose google instead ?
thanks
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The scope for customisation is far less than that of Android. Overall WP7 is fluid and stable but I have one app that annoyingly hangs my phone (Own this world) so it isn't true to say it is 100% hang free.
There still remain many "obvious" features missing, eg no draft text messages, no "real" 3rd party multitasking (ie apps are suspended whilst in the background).
Unless there are specific apps (locked to a particular OS) that are must haves, then I would say give WP a try.
As the guys in previous posts have told you - it's potential for modding and 3rd party apps is quite limited so far, but being a former symbian - windows mobile - android user, I gotta admit that I've gotten used to WP7 so much that I honestly can't see myself going back to an android or such. It annoyed the hell out of me for the 2 first weeks of ownership (HTC Mozart 7 is the device in question) because of some ridiculous limitations imposed on a "smartphone", but after the tedious task of reading a large amount of info, then finally updateing/unlocking my phone, I simply love it It's so smooth, and practical like you wouldn't believe, true it does have it's quirks and such, but it's a great device to use, nonetheless