I know you guys probably heard this a thousand times (and a forum search shows this) and what I'm about to say is probably very cliche, but the iPhone is a pretty amazing device.
Typically, I am a WM man (I currently own an HTC Touch Pro), and I've owned WM phones/devices for a long time now. I tried other OSes (Symbian, Palm OS), but ultimately, I prefer WM. When the iPhone first appeared, I disregarded it almost entirely because it's made by Apple. As someone familiar with Apple, I just didn't like them very much (largely due to their design philosophy).
Things didn't look like they were about to change. In fact, the next phones I was seriously looking at was the Toshiba TG01, Samsung Omnia HD i9810, and Samsung Omnia Pro B7610. Two of these are Windows Mobile and one is Symbian (which I was less likely to get anyway). The only major difference is that they aren't HTC (I want to move away from HTC because I exceedingly dislike Qualcomm).
However, something special happened yesterday: My friend invited me to lunch and he showed me his new iPhone 3GS. He allowed me to play with it.
In one word: Incredible!
As my intuition knew, I ended up not liking the design of the OS (I still prefer WM's design), but I couldn't really deny how well made the iPhone really is. More than anything else, I really have to compliment how extremely optimized it really is. Opening any software, going to the home screen, playing movies/music, and doing just about anything really was incredibly smooth. The entire time I was with my friend, I just gushed and gushed about this one aspect. The reason why is because it really is incredible how fast everything was.
The truth is that when compared side to side with my Touch Pro, the speed is really the same. However, a few things to note. First, everyone know how the iPhone seems to use "gradual transitions"? To elaborate, whenever you do anything, such as opening software or rotation, it is done in real time, and you can see the changes with your eyes. This is as opposed to WM where it is done immediately (for example, rotating with my TP results in an immediate change as opposed to you seeing the screen rotate on the iPhone).
This seems like a minor thing, but it has a large effect on perception. Notably, it makes you perceive it as being faster. When I counted down the seconds on the iPhone and WM, I noticed that opening programs and rotation are really done at the same speed, but the iPhone's gradual transition effects makes you perceive it as being faster, which is actually pretty nice.
Second thing and a very important point: My TP uses a custom ROM, which is why its speed was on par with that of the iPhone. If it had been using the stock ROM, I am positive that the iPhone would have crushed it in speed.
This seems like a moot point because I *can* use custom ROMs, but note that this forum and all of its custom ROMs are largely exclusive to HTC phones (with the sole exception of the Xperia...which was made by HTC anyway). What happens if I decide to use another WM phone (for example, the Samsung B7610)? Then I would have no choice but to remain with the stock ROM or at least hope someone would develop the stray ROM for the Samsung devices (such as the i900 on XDA).
At this point, I'm also willing to blame the speed issue on hardware. After all, the iPhone is about 72MHZ faster than my phone, and it also also has a dedicated graphics chip. On the other hand, I also have to take into consideration that it takes a custom, optimized ROM for my device to keep up with the stock ROM on a series of device which is notorious for being outdated (anyone remember the iPhone 2G)?
If anyone is wondering, am I thinking about switching to the dark side? Unfortunately, no. While the huge number of apps and the great speed is tantalizing, I am still the guy who frequently spends 4+ hours changing the ROMs on his phones (and tweaking it afterwards). I'm also the guy who frequently goes into the settings menu because he nitpicks about how each little thing on his phone works.
Can I switch to something that won't allow me that much customization? Speaking as someone who's about to change the ROM on his phone again, the answer appears to be a pretty clear 'no' as this point.
On, the other hand, while playing with the iPhone, I did find myself wishing that the Windows Mobile experience was as smooth, and great as with the iPhone, especially on stock ROMs. I also did find myself wondering what Windows Mobile 7 will be like (I can't wonder with WM6.5 because I'm using it now). But of course, what do people saying about wishing too much? It's useless.
Am I going mad?
I'd take an iphone over any WM device any day of the week, but I absolutely refuse to pay $70+ a month just to use it.
Exactly how many apps are there for windows mobile?
Until recently I assumed that WinMo>Symbian>Iphone.
Apparently that's wrong.
I was going to buy one with all the other sheep but decided to buy an ipod touch. Works great, but the first time I put it in my pocket and crouched down a bit later it nealy killed it!
Screen went a nice mix of colours and it totally stopped working. Quite a few plug ins to the computer and it came back to life.
There just to fragile and to big(iphone is thicker than the touch also), good girls phone or if you carry a handbag.
Glade I got the Jade not a problem so far.
thedigitel said:
I'd take an iphone over any WM device any day of the week, but I absolutely refuse to pay $70+ a month just to use it.
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Click to collapse
Is that the AT&T contract you have to sign up for to get an iPhone? If that's the case, why not just buy the iPhone unlocked? It's expensive, but it cost about as much as any HTC phone I've seen.
charge1313 said:
Exactly how many apps are there for windows mobile?
Until recently I assumed that WinMo>Symbian>Iphone.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
As of right now, the iPhone has roughly 50K-60K of apps while the last article detailing how many apps Windows Mobile seems to have stopped at 20K. Futhermore, the iPhone famously beaten Windows Mobile in reaching 25K apps, and I find it highly unlikely that Windows Mobile caught up.
Even from an outside perspective, though, it seems to me that the iPhone has an impressive number of apps, including a plethora of ones that Windows Mobile never seems to get (or is even capable of getting).
stu-k said:
I was going to buy one with all the other sheep but decided to buy an ipod touch. Works great, but the first time I put it in my pocket and crouched down a bit later it nealy killed it!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Well, the iPod Touch would make sense, but I would rather not have to carry two devices around. It seems better to me to have an all-in-one device in this case and, if nothing else, it would allow me to utilize the numerous phone-related apps in the app store.
I entirely agree.
My wife has a Gen 1 iphone, and I recently updated it to version 3 and unlocked and jailbreaked.
In the old days, WM had thousands of apps as one of its killer features.
I recently spent a few evenings installing apps on the wife's phone, and I was blown away. Not necessarily by the quality, but by the experience.
Everything is smooth, everything works, the user experience is "unchallenging".
I love tweaking, I love coding, I love spending MONTHS dissecting the WinMob OS to implement a tiny hack. But you know what? Why bother?!
I can't see myself giving up on WinMob - it's got momentum, and I can't be bothered to learn Objective C. I'm barely coping with C++ as it is.
But, to paraphrase Gauntlet, "WinMob [may be] about to die".
In defence of WinMob:
It's p*sses me off something crazy that when Gizmondo et all were reviewing the Palm Pre, multi tasking was one of the killer features. WinMob has had it FOREVER.
It's a good OS, it multitasks, it generally works, it can make calls and emails and whatnot.
But - the user experience is OLD.
And I think one of the most fundamental flaws is also one of the biggest strengths - WinMob runs on a hundred kinds of hardware. But the problem:
WinMob runs on a hundred kinds of hardware.
Some of those have graphic accelerators, some don't.
Some have dpads, some don't.
Some have 600mhz CPUs, some don't.
The iphone is a single homogeneous ecosystem.
Coders know they can anti-alias without trying to code to the lowest common denominator 200mhz phone with 16mb of ram. They know exactly what they're gonna get with an iphone. And that fact means they know the limitations, and how to pitch what they've got at the right performance considerations. They know what they're working on. The Human Interface spec is incredible, and incredibly helpful. Users expect an experience, naturally, because it feels natural. Apple encourages that, and coders have to honour it.
I think most of the iphone experience can and should be emulated on WinMob.
I'm not just talking about cloning Springboard and everything else. Yes, we can emulate this and that - our coders on XDA devs are incredible, and could do every bit of it.
But we need more: the experience of just being able to use the phone and expect it to work needs to be emulated.
I don't think the iphone is necessarily a better piece of hardware: I prefer my Touch HD. But clearly the user experience, the user interface paradigm, the reward of just being able to use the thing easily needs to be implemented - from the ground up.
I don't think this is going to happen on WinMob; I think the strength/limitations of a wide open platform means this probably can't happen. I think that like Win CE before it, WinMob will end up being relegated to a certain environment that has low expectations (eg Enterprise markets).
But if "Windows" devices are going to survive, I think the change has to happen at a much higher level. I can only hope that Pink or whatever is on the horizon for WinMob 7 is an integrated piece of hardware and user experience designed from the ground up to feel like it's the 21st century... using WinMob out of pity is going to get old, very very soon.
V
8525Smart said:
Well, the iPod Touch would make sense, but I would rather not have to carry two devices around. It seems better to me to have an all-in-one device in this case and, if nothing else, it would allow me to utilize the numerous phone-related apps in the app store.
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Click to collapse
Have to agree, I hate carry around two devices. Hence no longer use Ipod touch on the go, just leave it at home in docking station, which its good for.
Use the Jade for music and a phone which fits on my pocket.
I find the istore apps mostly gimmicks anyways, which you pay for and never use.
A smaller tougher Iphone would be good
vijay555 said:
I entirely agree.
In defence of WinMob:
It's p*sses me off something crazy that when Gizmondo et all were reviewing the Palm Pre, multi tasking was one of the killer features. WinMob has had it FOREVER.
It's a good OS, it multitasks, it generally works, it can make calls and emails and whatnot.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Oh my God, yes, YES!
I can't count the number of times I had to defend WinMo against people who obviously never used it. The number of ridiculously comments I seen was ludicrous and often times seem as if the people saying it were just parroting common criticisms as opposed to their actual experience.
One guy I saw even suggested that receiving text/emails and switching between apps was impossible.
On the other hand, I agree with the rest of your post too (as is the subject of my topic). I think you really hit the nail on the head: Windows Mobile's biggest strength, its availability on multiple phones, is also its biggest weakness.
As an owner of a Fuze, an HTC phone with an accelerometer, the lack of accelero-meter WinMo apps makes it very apparent.
I do agree with you that Microsoft needs to do something, at the very least, about the user experience, but I really don't see how it can be done. The iPhone is able to achieve this because it is a software available on one hardware designed by Apple themselves. In order for Microsoft to achieve the same quality of apps or user experience, they would have to design Windows Mobile to take advantage of a particular hardware specification.
As of currently, the best Microsoft can probably achieve is to design Windows Mobile with the best optimization they can while maintaining good compatibility and appearance with a wide number of hardware.
stu-k said:
HI find the istore apps mostly gimmicks anyways, which you pay for and never use.
A smaller tougher Iphone would be good
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
That may be true, but to be fair, the Windows Mobile landscape isn't exactly clear of 'gimmicky' apps either. Some of them even inspired by iPhone equivalents.
HDWobble, anyone?
The 3GS is faster not because of the clock speed, but because the A8 Cortex beats the pants out of the (very long in the tooth) ARM11 in the TP (and TP2, why HTC, why?!!!).
http://www.anandtech.com/gadgets/showdoc.aspx?i=3595&p=4
This is going to see as an odd first post but i am a jailbroken and unlocked iphone user. I have been tinkering with the iphone the way you guys tinker with winmo for 2 years now. To the original poster, if you are such a tinkerer and want to tinker with something new a jailbroken iphone is for you.
Some of THE BEST apps for the iphone are not in the apple app store because apple would never allow it.
I myself am starting to look at the TP2 and winmo phones because i was REALLLLLLLLLLLLY looking forward to the Nokia N97 and that thing just let me down a ton. I have a HTC Hero coming to play with for a while but besides the widgets i don't see a whole lot different between the new TF3D 2 on the TP2 or the TD2 and the Hero.
There are tons of useful 3rd party jailbroken apps and hacks that you can do that make the iphone even THAT much more useable. For instance the 3rd party text messaging applications are w/o question better than the stock apple version however because how they are designed they would never be approved for the app store. Also, there is a hack app called "backgrounder" which allows me to run apps in the background and multi task.
jim_0068 said:
This is going to see as an odd first post but i am a jailbroken and unlocked iphone user. I have been tinkering with the iphone the way you guys tinker with winmo for 2 years now. To the original poster, if you are such a tinkerer and want to tinker with something new a jailbroken iphone is for you.
Some of THE BEST apps for the iphone are not in the apple app store because apple would never allow it.
I myself am starting to look at the TP2 and winmo phones because i was REALLLLLLLLLLLLY looking forward to the Nokia N97 and that thing just let me down a ton. I have a HTC Hero coming to play with for a while but besides the widgets i don't see a whole lot different between the new TF3D 2 on the TP2 or the TD2 and the Hero.
There are tons of useful 3rd party jailbroken apps and hacks that you can do that make the iphone even THAT much more useable. For instance the 3rd party text messaging applications are w/o question better than the stock apple version however because how they are designed they would never be approved for the app store. Also, there is a hack app called "backgrounder" which allows me to run apps in the background and multi task.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Holy crap are you talking about the iPhone? Is the backgrounder for the iPhone? Can I have more information on how this works?
Here is a more important question... will the backgrounder app allow 3rd party alarm applications to finally work on the iPhone?
Will the backgrounder also allow automatic profile scheduling?
poetryrocksalot said:
Holy crap are you talking about the iPhone? Is the backgrounder for the iPhone? Can I have more information on how this works?
Here is a more important question... will the backgrounder app allow 3rd party alarm applications to finally work on the iPhone?
Will the backgrounder also allow automatic profile scheduling?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
yes. but Backgrounder is not compatible with the new 3.0 OS.
and on the 3G you do not exactly have lots of Ram to spare though. only ~34MB after a reset. and applications are not exactly light weight.
i believe profile scheduling is available through other means. but have not really looked into it. Performance really takes a nose dive when you start asking it to do extra stuff due to the lack of Ram.
crazy talk said:
yes. but Backgrounder is not compatible with the new 3.0 OS.
and on the 3G you do not exactly have lots of Ram to spare though. only ~34MB after a reset. and applications are not exactly light weight.
i believe profile scheduling is available through other means. but have not really looked into it. Performance really takes a nose dive when you start asking it to do extra stuff due to the lack of Ram.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Oh that's a shame... this app is useless then. I heard that Apple is considering the idea of having full support for background applications.
The problem is that:
1) Apple knows that not many people care about "background" applications.
2) Consumer common sense is distorted in that they don't understand the purpose of multi-task. They believe that multi-task is already on the iPhone because obviously, you can "exit the application into another application". This isn't the point, a true multitasking system requires A) background applications B) automation of background functions and C) the ability to switch tasks in the foreground of an application.
3) Apple knows that adding background applications will result in people complaining of slowness because 1) Alot of people still don't know what RAM is, not even my sister who is a 4+ year college student working on her masters and 2) Alot of people do not know how to manage a platform involving background applications and 3) average consumers would rather sacrifice functionality for ease-of-use.
I believe the emphasis of this multi-tasking is not a multi-tasking complaint. Idiots are prone to think that the iPhone already has multi-tasking; I've seem them argue about it. We need to add a mentality to people in which they learn that it isn't about multi-tasking, it's about background applications and how we need applications to function in the background.
Well the 3GS has double the ram and faster processor, hopefully they (third-parties) can find a way to make actual multi-tasking more plausible.
new beast in town
the android os is really taking shape and will soon be king. with so many different devices coming aboard this thing will be huge. the g1 now is awesome with just a little tweaking and those who don't want to tweak there are 2 more ota coming in the next 5 months.
nonzenze said:
The 3GS is faster not because of the clock speed, but because the A8 Cortex beats the pants out of the (very long in the tooth) ARM11 in the TP (and TP2, why HTC, why?!!!).
http://www.anandtech.com/gadgets/showdoc.aspx?i=3595&p=4
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Click to collapse
Hmm, very informative read, Thank you,
So the 3GS apparently has a superior CPU in more ways than one, which I'm not really surprised about. I did mentioned that I did not like HTC's choice of CPUs...which they're still using in their newest devices. Many other devices are already using the Cortex A8, so if it is the case that HTC is losing out due to the CPU, then that doesn't bode well for their future phones.
jim_0068 said:
To the original poster, if you are such a tinkerer and want to tinker with something new a jailbroken iphone is for you.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yes, everything you said is true. A jailbroken iPhone is a very nice thing and probably does well for tinkerers. In fact, the 3GS that my friend let me used was jailbroken too.
However, truthfully, installing apps that lets me do new things wasn't what I was really referring to before. Instead, I was largely referring to the changing of ROMs/OS. I believe the iPhone has made some progress running Linux, but nothing else as far as I can see. WM Phone has so many different ROMs available and progress has been made on running Linux (including Android) too. This allows for much more customization, in my opinion as you get the benefit of software-based customization combined with ROM/OS-based.
Besides, it's pretty fun to be running Windows Mobile 6.5 while everyone else is still using Windows Mobile 6.1.
Guys, rumours are the Pink/Zune Phone will be a Win 7 derived device based on hardware designed by Microsoft.
If they pull that off, as they say, "I'd buy that for a dollar".
V
My opinion is that in order to be a solid competitor, Microsoft needs to limit the hardware choices for their platform. HTC does a great job at making devices for Windows Mobile. Microsoft needs to pair up with them to make their own phone. With the new Zune HD coming out featuring the nVidia Tegra chipset, it would make a wonderful platform to build the next generation WM phone from. The thing is, it should be the only phone featuring WM 7 Professsional. It will enable Microsoft to fine tune WM to use every bit of the phone's capabilities, leaving nothing to be desired. Much like they do with their PC OS's, there can be several versions of the main OS with steps in capabilities. Their Zune HD phone should be the candidate for WM7 Ultimate, which would feature smooth transitions and speed.
Edit: Just saw the post above mine. I need to read more!
vijay555 said:
Guys, rumours are the Pink/Zune Phone will be a Win 7 derived device based on hardware designed by Microsoft.
If they pull that off, as they say, "I'd buy that for a dollar".
V
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Rumors are a bit too little to get excited, in my opinion. The possibility of a true iPhone competitor by Microsoft sounds amazing, but it's a bit underwhelming at this point.
We have no knowledge of the OS, no knowledge of the important specs (CPU, RAM, multimedia capabilities, etc) aside from Tegra, and the little specs that is publicly available kind of sucks. 3.3in screen with 480x272 res? Call me picky, but I would have hoped for 3.5-3.7in with at least 640x480.
Still, I have not followed the news of the Zune HD, and it does, indeed, look pretty amazing. The Os does at least. The Zune HD's OS appears to work amazingly well; It is incredibly fast and smooth.
8525Smart said:
Rumors are a bit too little to get excited, in my opinion. The possibility of a true iPhone competitor by Microsoft sounds amazing, but it's a bit underwhelming at this point.
We have no knowledge of the OS, no knowledge of the important specs (CPU, RAM, multimedia capabilities, etc) aside from Tegra, and the little specs that is publicly available kind of sucks. 3.3in screen with 480x272 res? Call me picky, but I would have hoped for 3.5-3.7in with at least 640x480.
Still, I have not followed the news of the Zune HD, and it does, indeed, look pretty amazing. The Os does at least. The Zune HD's OS appears to work amazingly well; It is incredibly fast and smooth.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I really think the only company that can actually create a truly direct competitor to Apple and iPhone is Microsoft...it's the name and not the product.....
Apple had a bad rep back then and now they are doing good.
It seems like Microsoft is tagged after Apple jumped the boat to success.
We'll just have to wait for Microsoft to adopt Apple's precedent.
With Microsoft directly creating their own phone and not just an OS, we might actually get a true iPhone killer. Though Microsoft may have to revamp the entire OS and create their own line of OS totally unrelated to Windows Mobile.
Related
iphone designed websites
are super when your stuck in a edge area i cant lie
facebook actually works, found a movie listings, tv listings from aol that are very simple. gotta love it
but of course when data permits, nothing beats the REAL internet
Well at least you found one good thing.
The one good thing about iphone is how much it made me miss windows mobile.
The iPhone is actually a great phone for if you wanna get away from it all; and by "it all" i mean doing anything productive or worthwhile.
djcaston said:
The iPhone is actually a great phone for if you wanna get away from it all; and by "it all" i mean doing anything productive or worthwhile.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Oh c'mon, paying a dollar for the "Be like Lil' Wayne" app in the app store is totally worthwhile.
How about the fact that if it was not for the iphone and Apples inovative thinking most of the apps and phones we now have based on WM6 would not be available to us yet.
Touch scrolling, accelerometers, larger screens, better browsers, etc.
I never would buy an iphone do to the fact that I cound not add my GPS software or my task managers and customize it the way I like it, but if it wasn't for the great thought process it invoked for so many programmers we would still be stuck with using the stylus.
The only good thing about the iphone is that it made my AT&T ESOP get bigger. THATS IT.
the only reason why the iphone is good is because qualcomm devices make it look good.
One "redeeming" feature is the app store. Even with that feature there are so many useless apps and the Apple store policy keeps any useful apps from being developed.
anosis said:
How about the fact that if it was not for the iphone and Apples inovative thinking most of the apps and phones we now have based on WM6 would not be available to us yet.
Touch scrolling, accelerometers, larger screens, better browsers, etc.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I hope you are being sarcastic?
I believe HTC were the first company to release Touch Nav, Large screens have been around for awhile and Opera has been a fine browser for phone for awhile as well...
All apple has done is released another consumer toy to play with... Windows Mobile/ Windows CE has been around a hell of a lot longer. They have copied the idea of "custom" application, MS and Palm have had custom apps for yeaaaaaaars.
Next you are going to tell me apple invented the mp3!
djcaston said:
The iPhone is actually a great phone for if you wanna get away from it all; and by "it all" i mean doing anything productive or worthwhile.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Good lord, what is this, disinformation central? I've been FAR more productive while mobile in the last 2 weeks since I traded my Fuze in for an iPhone than I ever would have been on the Fuze. As someone who does a lot of web work, the iPhone blows the Fuze or any other WM phone out of the water. The free WordPress app *alone* guarantees that anyone doing mobile blogging will be more productive.
As a 3 year veteran of the great HTC Wizard, I'm a serious lover of Windows Mobile devices, but let's face facts here guys: In 2008, let alone 2009, the current incarnation of Windows Mobile is sadly, woefully and pathetically behind the times. iPhone is, to be sure, a VASTLY overrated device, but statements like this are just as misleading, but in reverse.
EndoSurf said:
I hope you are being sarcastic?
I believe HTC were the first company to release Touch Nav, Large screens have been around for awhile and Opera has been a fine browser for phone for awhile as well...
All apple has done is released another consumer toy to play with... Windows Mobile/ Windows CE has been around a hell of a lot longer. They have copied the idea of "custom" application, MS and Palm have had custom apps for yeaaaaaaars.
Next you are going to tell me apple invented the mp3!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
WM has certainly been around longer--and it's also been neglected longer, too. The App store is a brilliant innovation, and it's loaded with tons of useful apps (though I'd be lying if I didn't also say that it's loaded with gimmicky horse ****, too). WM truly NEEDS something like the App store, by which I mean that it needs a method for distributing apps and games via download, through the device itself, with a transparent installation process that is easy for users to understand and use.
What Apple really needs to do to take the device to the next step is adopt some WM ideas--specifically it needs to be able to do multitasking (beyond just playing music in the background with the iPod app), it needs cut and paste, and it desperately needs for ALL apps to support a landscape keyboard (Windows Mobile also suffers from this problem). Apple also needs to open the device a bit more for a greater range of app types from a greater range of programmers.
Windows Mobile is good and proven system. iPhone is a relatively new system but it's also very good and it brings a LOT of great ideas to the table.
Neither system is perfect, but where iPhone needs some polish and additional openness, Windows Mobile needs a major overhaul in the User Experience area, because right now it's idly back in about 2004, and that's just sad. Hopefully Microsoft's recent work overhauling the Xbox interface will have some runoff into the Windows Mobile arena.
I look forward to WM7, but for my money, WM6 is a waste of time on a modern device.
First of all I would like to say many thanks to all the developers in this site. I think you all have the talent and know how of making a plain windows phone into something incredible. My thanks to the maker of energy rom, and all those fantastic developers. Helping to make this comunity greater and better. I am going to miss you all. Yes I have moved into the iPhone community.
Let Me just tell you all this is my opinion and yours counts as well. I have been a very avid windows mobile user, but more so an htc fan then any. I write this thread to let you all know of my findings from switching to an apple device. with that said I also would like to emphisize that my findings are based off of device and not network.
iPhone vs windows mobile
*landscape supported in both
*copy and paste supported in both thanks to OS 3.0
*user interface- on iPhone comes built in with a nice OS
-on htc nice as well but customizable. Thanks to xda forum
*physical keyboard- only built in to some htc devices
-on iPhone does not include a physical keyboard but I feel this product in terms of progress is moving foward faster. So what I mean is this product does not include a physical keyboard you can purchase one. But the soft keys included are nice with a little practice. Even thow landscape is not supported on most device but it is on the most use full apps.
*productivity- email, document editing, mms, tethering, auto spell check,
WM- supports all of these except spell check is an extra step
iPhone - supports email, doesn't come with word editing apps but i have purchased docs to go which I like and will allow me to get free updates.($5) mms thanks to mms not supported thanks to AT&T but it will by summer( check iPhone alley for up to date news or engadget. Tethering again thanks to AT&T no sir again to be announced, auto spell check is default and a plus since o generally suck in spelling.
* customizble- supported on both via xda and jailbreak, I still like the OS so I don't need to until I get bored but I'm pretty happy now.
*UI
- wm/not very user friendly but customizable thanks to xda. Hope fully windows gets the clue.
-iphone/ very user friendly , auto spell check on the fly, dual touch, browser a plus still waiting on firefox but iPhone browser is much faster. No flash support this is a downside the the iPhone. The text magnifier is a handy tool. Easy access tools like app store handy and comes with pre approved handy tools.(and free apps ass well)
*multimedia on both is pretty equal
*gaming is a dead blow away based off of amount of developers and screen size On the iPhone , dual touch helps in dramatic amounts.
My thoughts- altough the iPhone is not the best choice for everyone. There are pros and cons for both device. This being a WM forum I expect "flamming" but instead write why you stay with wm(not htc related because I love xda and htc and don't wish to sell my fuze) i find apples iPhone is moving slot faster progress wize in terms of when they started and what it has accomplished to this date. Windows made a big mistake delaying development on windows 7.0 OS. 2010 just shows they where not ready. Thank you all
My 2 cents on user friendliness.
I would think, from a perspective of someone who likes tweaking, that wm is much more user friendly since it allows me to customize it to my heart's content rather than jailbreaking the thing to even do basic things like changing the background to every page.
The iphone is more idiot proof than user friendly. In apple's classic style, anything that provides the user to customize the system is completely locked down unless hacked. what you can use is what they allow you to, not what you want to.
multi-touch is nice and is something i wish more smartphones will adopt in the future but I don't feel like it's a "game changer" especially gaming on a smartphone is not something that's that fancy. there are plenty counterpart apps for both OS that are mirrors of each other, like the light saber, tetris, bubble breaker, etc etc.
oh i forgot to mention, tethering... it is possible for the fuze to tether thanks to some of the resident geniuses of XDA who saved many of us from having to pay 30-50 bucks extra for tethering. the iphone's tethering is still in the process since I highly doubt att will let them get away with it for free or atleast without some haggling between apple and att.
my conclusion to this is that the review is good, i just don't approve of apple's take on "customization" (or lack thereof).
mputtr said:
My 2 cents on user friendliness.
I would think, from a perspective of someone who likes tweaking, that wm is much more user friendly since it allows me to customize it to my heart's content rather than jailbreaking the thing to even do basic things like changing the background to every page.
The iphone is more idiot proof than user friendly. In apple's classic style, anything that provides the user to customize the system is completely locked down unless hacked. what you can use is what they allow you to, not what you want to.
multi-touch is nice and is something i wish more smartphones will adopt in the future but I don't feel like it's a "game changer" especially gaming on a smartphone is not something that's that fancy. there are plenty counterpart apps for both OS that are mirrors of each other, like the light saber, tetris, bubble breaker, etc etc.
oh i forgot to mention, tethering... it is possible for the fuze to tether thanks to some of the resident geniuses of XDA who saved many of us from having to pay 30-50 bucks extra for tethering. the iphone's tethering is still in the process since I highly doubt att will let them get away with it for free or atleast without some haggling between apple and att.
my conclusion to this is that the review is good, i just don't approve of apple's take on "customization" (or lack thereof).
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Thank you for you input, I agree on customizabilty. This is basic stuff. It's your phone you should be allowed to personalize it by default. What I can do with out jail break is add my own short cuts off the web and changes some of my back ground. My friend has managed to change his icons to a Laker theme, and mms enabled on his phone. Other have managed a vista ultima desktop with video background. Which to me is cool but I doubt I find it usefull productive wize. Gaming on the iPhone is different. I encourage all to take some time to YouTube developed games, ping pong, archers, brickbreaker revollusion, tap tap revenge 2, stick wars , and ifighter. This is thanks to multi touch. But I thank you for your input. And tethering is enabled for free you just have to click a link in iPhone alley. And this is money saving as well. Thank you and more should write this will let Windows mobile step up their game.
Being a long time windows mobile and long time iPhone user, here is my take on this:
iPhone is fun, smooth and pretty nifty - for someone who doesn't rely on a device to get stuff done.
WM is a slower, sometimes ugly beast that gets **** done. It may not be the prettiest but if I need it to do something, it does it.
Case and point - I manage 10 separate business units and I rely on notifications to remind me about things. The iPhone just doesn't cut it, even with its 3.0 upgrade. Without a rock solid time specific task function/reminding system that can be snoozed, it's worthless for me.
What the iPhone does better:
Web - hands down it is a better experience
Email - Again, much better IMO on the iPhone
Note taking - iPhone stomps all over WM here especially with Evernote. The newest Evernote is absolutely incredible on the iPhone.
Pictures - My fuze is much better in this area and I don't want to buy the newest iPhone to get auto zoom.
3rd party programs - iPhone may have 50,000 apps, but WM has the apps "I" need to run my business, at least at this point.
I hemmed and hawed about it for a few weeks but I gave my iPhone to my 17 year old son who doesn't need a business class device and I got an iPod touch. I can still have nifty web browsing on the go and most of the benefits of apps like Evernote.
WM is still king in my mind but there are some things that would push it over the top in regards to the Apple offerings:
1. Capacitive screen - It's amazing and makes the resistive touch of the normal PDA's seem old and outdated.
2. Give us a Word/Excel/PP Viewer program in addition to the damn programs included that rip the formatting to shreds of anything remotely complex that we open with them. Granted, there are other programs that have better compatability that the built in office apps, but come on MS, Office is YOUR program!
3. This is for hardware vendors - Get your **** together and actually include driver support so your devices look and act as smoothly as the iPhone. I have a fuze that has more memory and a faster processor (in MHz only I know) than the iPhone but it's a dog. Gimme some smooth eye candy! I look at this damn device for hours per day, at least make it more enjoyable! MS needs to step up to the plate here and realize that the 3rd party hardware vendors are the ones causing the problems. Make them have to certify devices in the areas of performance and appearance before they launch.
4. Put more than 5 people on task to put an upgraded mobile operating system out. I am embarrassed for MS that they would do something like that. I don't care if they are the best of the best, mobile computing is the future and you guys are missing the boat by such a large margin it isn't even funny in the areas of usability and looks.
-Asbestos
iPhone vs WM
I agree with asbestos, if I need a real fancy music player, I'll put stickers on my "work" WM Touch Pro. My Touch Pro does WORK just fine.
I'll pay for my TP with SPB Mobile Shell 3.0, before given a fancy music player.
Someday, somebody will realize you can play music and videos on WM. Granted Windows Media Player sucks. But there are other multimedia apps.
What I will yield to Apple is our MS developers as a whole SUCK compared to the tons of great apps being created daily for iPhone, that could be made for WM. SOmebody needs to tell WM dev's to just sit down and copy every app they make. Cause WM is not the best in ingenuity.
My two cents,
JWB
Stickers ?!? Really?
That's the most educated piece of mine you can come up with. Better yet how about you mension konomi or any other great media player and recomend windows come with a built in finger friendly and eye candy friendly UI. Yes windows does need to look into developers from this site to make their products better.
Business over entertainment
asbestos said:
Being a long time windows mobile and long time iPhone user, here is my take on this:
iPhone is fun, smooth and pretty nifty - for someone who doesn't rely on a device to get stuff done.
WM is a slower, sometimes ugly beast that gets **** done. It may not be the prettiest but if I need it to do something, it does it.
Case and point - I manage 10 separate business units and I rely on notifications to remind me about things. The iPhone just doesn't cut it, even with its 3.0 upgrade. Without a rock solid time specific task function/reminding system that can be snoozed, it's worthless for me.
What the iPhone does better:
Web - hands down it is a better experience
Email - Again, much better IMO on the iPhone
Note taking - iPhone stomps all over WM here especially with Evernote. The newest Evernote is absolutely incredible on the iPhone.
Pictures - My fuze is much better in this area and I don't want to buy the newest iPhone to get auto zoom.
3rd party programs - iPhone may have 50,000 apps, but WM has the apps "I" need to run my business, at least at this point.
I hemmed and hawed about it for a few weeks but I gave my iPhone to my 17 year old son who doesn't need a business class device and I got an iPod touch. I can still have nifty web browsing on the go and most of the benefits of apps like Evernote.
WM is still king in my mind but there are some things that would push it over the top in regards to the Apple offerings:
1. Capacitive screen - It's amazing and makes the resistive touch of the normal PDA's seem old and outdated.
2. Give us a Word/Excel/PP Viewer program in addition to the damn programs included that rip the formatting to shreds of anything remotely complex that we open with them. Granted, there are other programs that have better compatability that the built in office apps, but come on MS, Office is YOUR program!
3. This is for hardware vendors - Get your **** together and actually include driver support so your devices look and act as smoothly as the iPhone. I have a fuze that has more memory and a faster processor (in MHz only I know) than the iPhone but it's a dog. Gimme some smooth eye candy! I look at this damn device for hours per day, at least make it more enjoyable! MS needs to step up to the plate here and realize that the 3rd party hardware vendors are the ones causing the problems. Make them have to certify devices in the areas of performance and appearance before they launch.
4. Put more than 5 people on task to put an upgraded mobile operating system out. I am embarrassed for MS that they would do something like that. I don't care if they are the best of the best, mobile computing is the future and you guys are missing the boat by such a large margin it isn't even funny in the areas of usability and looks.
-Asbestos
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Click to collapse
my friend you are a perfect example to why windows is best for you.
I'm not saying and nor do I feel you are saying that I beleive the iPhone is better then a fuze. I beleive there is no such thing as an iPhone killer simply because every phone is built for a specific user.
In this case the user is a business user. I can't imagine typing countless emails and documents simply by using the soft keys altough I have seen some impressive typing on the iPhone. Not everyone is talented enough to move like the do. But I find my self getting faster each day. The built in keyboard is an advantage that I don't have on the iPhone. What weighed in my mind was windows mobile first came out in 1975 I beleive... And it has years of experience over the iPhone. The iPhone has 3 years in the market yet development for this device has excelled. What I beleive is windows took it's customers for granted said here is this product enjoy it but never develops after that? Windows 6.1 windows 6.5 windows 7.0 ? These are all slow developed UI. Windows give your consumers what they want not honey combs. Come out with 7.0 already.
Why does everyone who goes to an iPhone write one of these long, stupid, and annoying "goodbye" posts justifying their reasons for going to an iPhone? Just sell your HTC, get an iPhone, and go away. It is that easy.
My take is both are excellent phones/devices.
The reason I went to the HTC over the iPhone isn't a bias against the iPhone, but because I've used PPC/windows mobile OS's since the days of the Dell Axim X5. I'm comfortable with the WM OS, know how to tweak & hack it, customize it to suit me. The iPhone OS, really can't do a lot with it, as far as customization. Plus, the iPhone, is really intended as a "multimedia" device.
The TP/Fuze is too, but, it's not as integrated as the iPhone. I don't play MP3's, movies or anything like that. I use my TP/Fuze as a business device, and it does it very well.
Either phone, you really can't go wrong, it's a choice issue.
asbestos said:
What the iPhone does better:
Note taking - iPhone stomps all over WM here especially with Evernote. The newest Evernote is absolutely incredible on the iPhone.
-Asbestos
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Click to collapse
Say What? How does Evernote "stomp" all over OneNote? What does Evernote do that OneNote does not?
i hate these comparisons wars with smartphones going on. its like console wars or format wars. the iphone isnt bad, infact its very good. you choose the product you like the best. its not like its something you have to show off to the world and that you where the wisest because you choose it and others didnt because they are tards. i find it very hard to recommend windows mobile phones. they can do a lot if you put some work into it like a hobby. i chose between the touch pro and the iphone and went for the touch pro and i must of thought it better for me cause i even paid alot more for it. my entire family has iphones (cept my sister who has a palm centro) and that works for them. i think the touch pro is better in alot more ways but the iphone is there for people who need something easy for them.
Where to start... I'm going to get flamed a ****load for this but I could care less, all I'm doing is stating the truth.
Windows Mobile SUCKS and the ONLY reason that 6.5 is coming out is because Microsoft has finally (sort of) listened to us and made WinMo a much more user-friendly experience.
Ok that was a bit harsh lol, but out of the box, windows mobile is slow trash, and that's the whole reason XDA is here. To make windows mobile devices usable and reliable. iPhone requires no customization to be reliable. It does what it should do. It is a multimedia device, which is what 95% of custom ROMs are aiming at doing - making your phone an enjoyable, multimedia device. Maybe 10% of WinMo users actually use it for BUSINESS usage.
The iPhone has never been advertised as a "High-Powered business device", but it basically set standards for new phones. The only reason we have interfaces like TouchFlo3D and such is because HTC is trying to make WinMo devices as enjoyable as iPhones are! I love my Touch Pro and all, but let's face it - it will never be as intuitive and smooth as iPhone OS. If the iPhone were never released, we would still be stuck with Palm OS, The standard WinMo today screen, and Android & WebOS wouldn't even exist.
Why do you guys think S2U2 is so wildly popular? We all (or most of us, not all) want our devices to perform like an iPhone! If the iPhone was released with a QWERTY hardware keyboard, and it had a jailbreak, I KNOW that most of us would flock to it within days. There are many apps available for jailbroken iPhones that mimic the today screen, and by that, I mean Calendar appointments, text messages, e-mails etc are all viewable right when you turn on your device, on the Slide to Unlock menu.
HTC, do you care about your windows mobile users at all? Why are you force-feeding us your ****ty 528 Mhz qualcomm processors with no video drivers? Every phone you've released in the past year or so (which is a lot) has had the SAME EXACT SPECS. 528 Mhz Qualcomm, 288/256 MB of RAM, 512 MB Storage. Why do you do this? Because you know we'll buy your devices anyways? I know Apple is tight on security and such, leaving you with such little customizability of your phone, but it is a SMOOTH, ENJOYABLE experience! Anyone who says otherwise is just trying to justify spending $700 on an unlocked phone.
Most iPhone bashers have never actually used one in person. I've compared many HTC phones with it, and it is obviously a much smoother experience. Video recording is OUTSTANDING on the iPhone 3GS. I know it's technology we've had for years on older phones, but let's be honest, there's a reason Apple is releasing it just now. They wanted it to be perfect - and it is.
I'll remain loyal to HTC, but if Apple ever releases an iPhone with a qwerty keyboard, I know most of us will trash our HTC devices.
Roflcopterrr said:
Even more of a blow to HTC.. have you guys seen the latest OpenGL benchmarks for the 3GS?
http://www.glbenchmark.com/compare....3G S&D2=HTC P4600 Touch Pro&D3=HTC Touch Pro2
The difference in performance between HTC devices and the iPhone are very dramatic.. This is exactly what I mean. I'm sure the iPhone drivers were developed and production was rolling along on the 3GS around the same time as the Touch Pro2's release - so there shouldn't be any "but it's newer!" argument.
Come on HTC.. do you think we LIKE tearing, artifacting, and overall slow performance?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Oh no
Another comparing iphoney thread!
this is the number 54 thread...
I won´t never change to iphoney, too much reasons already have said about it, but the most important one
I won´t have the support of this great site
Respectfully,
Sadly I agree with you man, I also am tired with the poor gui, ancient msm qualcom processors. HTC is lacking majorly.
As is microsoft for that matter.
The only thing I will say is to wait for the tegra
so go post on an iphone site.
i agree with him completely.
the form factor of many of the Winmo phones are stunning. and the interfaces seem smooth and solid when skinned. i LOVE the looks of TouchFlo3D and the new TouchFlo3D2.5
but for all the comments and stuff i see on IPhone forums about Winmo having a greater selection of programs i am having an extremely difficult time finding programs that can do everything that is available now on the IPhone platform. much less be smooth and easy to use.
i cant imagine Roflcopterrr is here to troll, and i know i am not. but you cannot just twist the facts for your own purposes. (i'm talking about Winmo users claiming that their platform CANNOT run programs as smoothly as the IPhone because they can Multitask)
double post. oops.
josefcrist said:
so go post on an iphone site.
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Click to collapse
dont be a baby. And don't take it personal. Dude, I lashed out at someone in the past for this same post and almost got banned. But the truth is competition is not brewing excellence here. It is one sided. There is no comparison with the gui throughput of the iphone compared to our HTC devices. Until the tegra comes out we will be sitting here with thumbs up our asses. Thats the truth.
As it was said, mobile technology is moving at a turtles pace in the winmo world. There needs to be more of an effort in HTC and microsofts part. This post is only stating the obvious. OUR **** IS WEAK
also in america, our providers are ****ting on us with there frequent tardy releases of HTC phones. (minus the kaiser)
i did not mean it in a hurtful way. i was just messing around you cant hear the tone of my voice.
I am pretty excited for the tegra and the snapdragon i think that they will do good things for windows mobile. it is hard for me to change to a different platform after having half a dozen windows mobile based devices in a row for the past 6 or so years.
sdlopez83 said:
Sadly I agree with you man, I also am tired with the poor gui, ancient msm qualcom processors. HTC is lacking majorly.
As is microsoft for that matter.
The only thing I will say is to wait for the tegra
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
This is how it is.
Even more of a blow to HTC.. have you guys seen the latest OpenGL benchmarks for the 3GS?
http://www.glbenchmark.com/compare.jsp?benchmark=glpro&showhide=true&D1=Apple iPhone 3G S&D2=HTC P4600 Touch Pro&D3=HTC Touch Pro2
The difference in performance between HTC devices and the iPhone are very dramatic.. This is exactly what I mean. I'm sure the iPhone drivers were developed and production was rolling along on the 3GS around the same time as the Touch Pro2's release - so there shouldn't be any "but it's newer!" argument.
Come on HTC.. do you think we LIKE tearing, artifacting, and overall slow performance?
The iPhone has caused a stir because it is accessible, like all Apple products - you open the box, switch it on and it works. The app store is just fantastic because it gives the poor saps that own an iPhone just one place to look for software.
The thing is, they need to look for software because the iPhone is lacking on so many levels - bluetooth, video etc etc. The deeper you dig the more crap you find the iPhone to be, you can only now forward a text message (that is ELEMENTARY), video has only just been made available, there are no minute minders etc etc etc.
Where us WM users lose out is the fact we have so much choice - we have free apps coming out of our ears you just need to search them out. Sure some a pants and lack development, but that's because their coded by someone in their bedroom.
MS and HTC need to trawl these forums and pick some key ideas (and the coders that go with them) put them all in a room and throw ten dollar bills at them. That way we will eventually get a smooth bug-free OS that looks fantastic and performs as it deserves to.
I can't imagine how MS have been able to get away with such a clunky mobile OS for so long, and the official mobile versions of Word and Excel are just pathetic - there a third party apps that just blow these away.
Come on MS, come on HTC, give us what we've been paying for for all these years.
PS my Kaiser is about 70% business 30% fun, but I wouldn't have it if I didn't have a business use for it.
I have a $600 phone (HTC Touch Pro) that can only record CIF video at 15 fps, same as my dumbphone from 2004. HTC is crap.
Yeah, I know, the iPhone is slick, but it ain't what it should be - just like the Win Mo hardware isn't.
HTC has been churning out the same spec "it'll do" kit for too long. BUT, at least we have GPS that generally works, we have turn by turn satnav in spades, car mounts from every vendor, we have choice. iPhone users do not have choice.
What you have to remember is that we are probably in a 5% of phone users, 'early adopters' I think is the phrase marketeers use. We see the opportunities for this kit, more than the manufacturers do. In 5 years time we'll still be complaining even though we'll have multitouch screens with HD video and decent battery life - it'll be "why can't I connect to my satellite broadband account?" That's what we're like.
No excuse for HTC and MS to not make the effort though.
If it was just as simple as comparing processor performance and UI smoothness than this thread and this forum wouldn't be necessary. There's a lot more to it than that. I can't go Apple because it takes a special kind of person to own apple products and I'm not that kind of person. There are a million reasons why and I can't name them all off the top but here are some:
You can get a slingbox app for iphone but you cannot sling over 3g. Thanks Apple but no thanks. It's my data plan, I paid for it, I'm an adult and I'll decide how I want to use my kb!
They won't let apps be released that could potentially have naughty words or pictures in them. Who the hell do they think they are? I'm a grown ass man and I'll watch porn all day if I decide to do so.
They have been known to kill apps in their app store and then release OS upgrades with the same functionality.
How about download limits of 10mb over 3g? In a funny example of the bitter irony between wm and iphone - when my coworker wants to download something over 10mb at work I start my WMwifirouter and let him get on my 'network' to do his download. Much to AT&T and Apples chagrin he is still getting his download over 3g!
Bluetooth profiles? What's that for?
Did you hear about the new iphone? it's a phone - and it does mms, copy & paste and video recording. What a groundbreaking idea!
I don't keep my computers desktop cluttered with a bunch of icons. That isn't a good way of handling things. The only parts of the iphone ui that I admire are the scrolling and finger friendly aspects. The lack of detail and control over options drives me nuts.
It's like Apple sells you the hardware and then wants to sit on your shoulder and make you use it how they dictate.
Also, I wouldn't say that this site exists because of WM's shortcomings. I would say this sight exists because of the open nature of WM. I'm sure there are things iphone owners would love to tweak, but a sight like this is impossible in the apple world.
So for me Apples philosophy and business model are big net negatives when put head to head with the WM options. While you are correct about the hardware and performance advantages on iphone, keep in mind that these crappy Qualcomm processors are about to be forgotten. Nvidia's hardware is going to forever change the game. There is a leaked 2009 product list from HTC showing a device named Superstar putting a 3.7 inch display powered by Nvidia ap16. That device will be ridiculous. Also, Engadget has the scoop on an Nvidia Tegra powered device hitting US carriers this year for $199. Once these devices hit the market we will just need WM7 to follow along and the gap will be totally bridged.
I'm sure there are things iphone owners would love to tweak, but a sight like this is impossible in the apple world.
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Click to collapse
You mean like jailbreak?
No, I mean more than warez and themes.
What then? I'm really quite interested in differences between both platforms, specifically what they can/can't do at full potential.
Digitaltigre said:
No, I mean more than warez and themes.
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Click to collapse
like??????
Digitaltigre - He said what I wanted to, but couldn't.
I don't use one evryday but what Im saying is if theres things you dont like about iphone you're pretty much stuck with it. Look at what we are able to do on WM for example.
If you don't like the volume control you can install one from a different Rom. If you get tired of it you can uninstall it and go back to the standard vol control. If you decide you want different video drivers they can be cooked into a Rom. I can get into my registry and change my proxy settings, default photo location favorite channels in slingmedia player etc. I use AE button plus to remap all my hardware buttons. I have the right softkey on a double push do alt-tab between apps. That way I can have two progs open that I need to transfer info between. How can you do any of those customizations on the iphone? You cant. You may say that you wouldn't want to change the iphone but I'm saying what if you did?
Besides that I'm tired of Apple acting like they invented stuff. They brought the first gen out w/out 3g when my wm phone had 3g for years! Then when they dropped the 3g they were acting like 3g didn't exist before their new phone. Now their commercials for the 3gs are bragging on features that once again, I've had for a long time. Voice control? Really? Anyone tried Ms Voice Command? I can ask my phone what appointments I have tomorrow. I have to admit their implementation of copy/paste is pretty sweet, but there's no excuse for making users go 3 years without that basic feature. I just saw a commercial where they showed 'you can copy a phone number and paste it in a text message' Wow! I am just floored. These dudes are not making devices for me. I feel dumber everytime they talk to me!
I have to say I admire the iphone form factor...the glass capacitive touch screen, the quality build. But thats where it ends. If there was a Touch HD style phone with US 3g bands and an Nvidia chip under the hood - forget about it, it would be a wrap son. Those devices are coming and Im waiting patiently!
Ok, basically my wife is looking into a new phone and our options are more or less limitless, she just wants advantages and disadvantages of each OS. She's not picky and doesn't always need the most popular OS, she wants form, factor, and function. I am looking for a phone that will take a sim so trying to avoid Verizon and Sprint phones. Heres my opinions on the ones I can think up.
iOS-I wouldnt touch it with a ten foot pole personally but regardless of my personal feelings if it's jailbroken it's not actually a terrible OS just a bit bland. The hardware limitations and the fact that they're still building the same updates for the 2g that they are for the 4g causes some immense limitations and I cant think of an update that made a real difference.
Android- Good but often laggy even with a snapdragon. The UI customization is nice but they're killing themselves not allowing a GPU accelerated UI. I have a Dell Streak for my "fun phone" and though I love it it does seem more appealing to have a phone that "just works" for her. I dont think android will be quite as long-lived though its doing well so far. How can one expect a UI to have devoted developers when you can get anything you want free.
Windows phone 7- Perfect business device, still in what seems almost an open beta phase and lacking a lot of basic features. More promise than any other OS but for the time being it's not living up to the hype.
BadaOS-Support? What support? plays out like a bad WebOS ripoff
Blackberry-Just the most boring thing in the world. Aside from battery life I cannot seem to realize how this OS sells well outside of the old people who dont really know how to use a phone but want something high end...
WebOS- It had it's day in the spotlight and that didn't last too long... I mean its functional but feels almost dirty compared to the more modern OSes
WM6.5- Great OS for someone who wants to devote hours and hours and hours to customizing it to be the most functional OS. Sadly the only device worth having thats wm6.5 anymore is the LEO/HD2.
These are all opinions of mine, she just wants to know the opinion of others. Thanks for your input.
What is her level of technical expertise?
Sent from my Nexus S using Tapatalk
Moderate, a gaming device would be great but something with a pleasant UI is more appealing
If you don't mind about the limited hardware choice then iOS is very good, especially for newcomers. It'll probably make your life easier (less questions to answer).
Android is a different matter. The experience depends highly on what manufacturer you go for, but if you choose well then you get one of the best (functionality-wise) smartphone OSes out there together with a wide choice of hardware.
Personally I'd suggest the Nexus S (if you can cope with 16GB storage), or failing that the Galaxy S. Both are lovely devices, but the Nexus edges it with it's lovely display, GPU accelerated transitions (Android finally somewhat smooth) and Gingerbread.
Windows Phone 7? If you're a big business and/or Office user, then it's probably the easiest OS to get working with. It has good video/gaming capabilities and a GPU accelerated UI but currently suffers from limited storage space on most devices.
Choose if you love the UI or are a OneNote addict, otherwise I'd stick to the safer bet of Android/iOS for the time-being and wait for things to play out. You probably wouldn't buy a device running iOS 1 or Android 1.5 today, so I'd wait for Windows 7 to catch-up. It is good. It will be great, just in a little while.
That said you should have no problem editing/viewing Office docs or accessing Exchange email on either Android or iOS.
BlackBerry OS - used to be the pinnacle of a smartphone OS, but a lack of innovation and poor hardware has choked the platform, and RIM have said that in the future top-end BlackBerry devices will run the QNX OS they are running on the PlayBook.
WebOS - very good, but still failed to catch up fully with iOS/Android even with the recent update. That said, I think someone has to try a WebOS first - some people love it, some hate it. Limited range of apps.
WinMo 6.5 - Do not buy anymore, unless your business requires it.
Bada OS - Just no. No developers. No apps. No fantastic devices.
joeearl13 said:
If you don't mind about the limited hardware choice then iOS is very good, especially for newcomers. It'll probably make your life easier (less questions to answer).
Android is a different matter. The experience depends highly on what manufacturer you go for, but if you choose well then you get one of the best (functionality-wise) smartphone OSes out there together with a wide choice of hardware.
Personally I'd suggest the Nexus S (if you can cope with 16GB storage), or failing that the Galaxy S. Both are lovely devices, but the Nexus edges it with it's lovely display, GPU accelerated transitions (Android finally somewhat smooth) and Gingerbread.
Windows Phone 7? If you're a big business and/or Office user, then it's probably the easiest OS to get working with. It has good video/gaming capabilities and a GPU accelerated UI but currently suffers from limited storage space on most devices.
Choose if you love the UI or are a OneNote addict, otherwise I'd stick to the safer bet of Android/iOS for the time-being and wait for things to play out. You probably wouldn't buy a device running iOS 1 or Android 1.5 today, so I'd wait for Windows 7 to catch-up. It is good. It will be great, just in a little while.
That said you should have no problem editing/viewing Office docs or accessing Exchange email on either Android or iOS.
BlackBerry OS - used to be the pinnacle of a smartphone OS, but a lack of innovation and poor hardware has choked the platform, and RIM have said that in the future top-end BlackBerry devices will run the QNX OS they are running on the PlayBook.
WebOS - very good, but still failed to catch up fully with iOS/Android even with the recent update. That said, I think someone has to try a WebOS first - some people love it, some hate it. Limited range of apps.
WinMo 6.5 - Do not buy anymore, unless your business requires it.
Bada OS - Just no. No developers. No apps. No fantastic devices.
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I thank you for your reply my wife still wants WP7 but I keep trying to tell her that even though I use it it could take time to work the kinks out. She is considering android but samsung devices are hard to go with especially the galaxy S devices due to the buffer overrun issues. I think we've more or less narrowed it down to those two its just hard to pick which though she is in love with the netflix integration. I think its between the mytouch 4g and the samsung focus
The MT4G is a fantastic device. I'm sure she'd have more fun with it than WP7 and its limited options.
Sent from my Nexus S using Tapatalk
Now when you say limited options what do you mean? I only ask because I recently converted to windows phone 7 after tinkering with android for 2 years and never once having something that felt 'complete.' Also is there any site that I can make one of those phone histories on or do I have to use paint?
WM: The most tested OS good and stable for business, thousands of apps, tweaks, themes, etc a lot of knowledge.
Android: Nice to play with as all is new and free but I got easily bored
WP7: So new, needs more time to get mature. Too closed similar to apple
The hardware limitations and the fact that they're still building the same updates for the 2g that they are for the 4g causes some immense limitations and I cant think of an update that made a real difference.
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No they aren't. The 2g is stuck on Ios 3.2, while the Iphone 4 is on 4.2. Plus the hardware in the Iphone 4 is just about as fast as Snapdragon, and cortex. Hell, the A4 is a Cortex A8.
Android- I like Android a lot, but some of the manufactures don't take it as seriously as I like, and some manufactures are terrible with updates.(Samsung) And the UI isn't hardware accelerated AFAIK. But very easy to customize, I like that. Manufactures can make Android great, or bad.(Motorola, I'm talking to you with your Motoblur crap)
Ios- I like Ios too, but there are a few issues with it. AT&T is the big one, and the second issue because of that is limited data. I can't say that it's a bad thing that to make it useful to my standards, you have to jailbreak it because every Android phone I've had I've rooted for it to work great. I wish Apple would come out with an Iphone with a screen bigger than 3.7inch. And I wish Steve would not have so much hatred towards Adobe, because that means no real flash for Iphone while it's fully capable of it. Frash is okay for the Iphone, but real flash would be better.
BB Os- I'll tell you the same thing I tell people I sell these to. Blackberry is a business phone, so don't expect the fun and colorful UI you see in other OSes. It is very simple to use though, but RIM is stuck on hardware that was released almost 2 years ago. The Pre is originally clocked at 600 mhz like the Droid, the chip inside the Torch which is the newest Blackberry is only at 624 mhz, like the Storm, the Storm 2, the Bold, etc etc. Also, Blackberry does not like to update their phones to the current OS, despite most of the phones having the same specs. It is what it is.
Windows Mobile 6.5- Not bad, but not great. A nice business OS though.
Windows Phone 7- I like it a lot, but no flash support right now is a killer. I don't mind it not having things like bluetooth transfer since I really don't use it, but I would like copy and paste. Also they need to hurry up and expand to different carriers! D:
Symbian- Personally I never used it, but people say it is very versatile.
Webos- I like Webos a lot, I really do. But there simply isn't enough support behind it from developers, which means a huge lack of apps compared to Android and Ios. The big thing that kills me about it, is the fact that the Pre only has a 3inch screen, even the Pre 2 has a 3inch screen despite having specs that can be compared to the Droid 2!
Bada- Samsung, so I can't expect too much from it. I haven't tried it though, and I really don't want to.
What kind of user is your wife? If she wants a phone that does games, txt, email etc... then you have to take into consideration what is the best at these?
IOS even with it's limitations is probably the most "polished" out there. Has a huge base of followers, tons of apps, and it does work out of the box. Sure it's bland in its interface and your locked in with AT&T and the iWorld of Apple. Not to mention that you can't do anything with the hardware itself.
Android: Catching up to Apple - but still not the "iPhone killer" - yet. I personally love Android - and with enough tweaking I don't experience lag on my Captivate. But.. I would highly suggest NOT getting a Galaxy S phone. Too many issues with the devices to merit getting. I would go with an HTC.
Win Mobile 7: Although this looks promising.. if I wanted a boring interface and all the junk that goes with the OS? I'd have an iPhone. And not to mention it's still in its infancy - so who knows if it will go the way of the Do Do bird?
Should also mention about Android, if she gets an Android phone but doesn't root it, then she'll have to deal with all the bloatware the carriers put on the phone.
Can someone really tell me what WP7 and iphone comparisons there really are aside from their more strict markets. I mean yeah you cant sideload apps as easy as android but what motivation do devs have to continue developing if their apps are distributed for free.
For the simple love of sharing!!!
As it have been done for many years in WM
z33dev33l said:
Can someone really tell me what WP7 and iphone comparisons there really are aside from their more strict markets. I mean yeah you cant sideload apps as easy as android but what motivation do devs have to continue developing if their apps are distributed for free.
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I was curious to hear from former Android users how you like WP7. Mainly what are your main gripes and what functions did you actually use that are no longer available. Also, are the tradeoffs worth it in the end and what features really *make* swapping worth it. I have loved android for a long time but I'm kind of wanting something new and have liked the wp7 interface from day one. Thanks!
Sent from my ThunderBolt using XDA App
Here goes:
Mainly what are your main gripes
No apps, and if there are apps they are over priced and crap alternatives to Android versions.
Homebrew is going to cost money.
I know its a phone and should mainly just be a phone, but there is nothing to do on it, I never leave my Android phone alone always playing with something but this I treat it like a nokia 3310 lol.
What functions did you actually use that are no longer available
I don't know what it is but there are some things missing but Mango is looking good but still not as good as Android and Ice Cream Sandwich will be coming out around the same time.
Are the tradeoffs worth it in the end and what features really *make* swapping worth it.
Only thing that is making me want to swap over is the Xbox Live thing other than that Android is far superior.
I have loved android for a long time but I'm kind of wanting something new and have liked the wp7 interface from day one.
I love Android also and also wanted to try something new but Windows Phone 7 isn't something new. Stick with Android and Launcher7 lol ^^
I think I'm fine with paying for my phone to be unlocked personally, one time fee for the latest beta builds forever? Honestly I don't know why HTC Samsung and Motorola aren't looking into this for android devices so they can make some extra $ and make us impatient (or reasonable people that don't like waiting for their craptastic skins) people happy.
I don't care much for Xbox live like I use to but I definitely like Zune pass (really its probably the top single feature that has me wanting wp7 as I use my phone for music a lot).
I love android but honestly, I'm tired of trying to throw on custom ROMs (its fun but tiring) on every phone I get trying to keep up with the updates. I think the only thing that is holding me to android at this point is the ability to wifi tether my phone to my tablet and the fact that mango phones are on their way (fall is only 2-3 months away so announcements should be made soon?)
So guys, is there some feature that I am missing that you really either miss from android or you really like that wp7 had when you made the swap?
Sent from my ThunderBolt using XDA App
i switched from my old Desire Z and X8 (both of em are still in use sometimes) to a 7 Pro.
so in my own personal opinion, a small "comparision":
1. UI & Customization
I like the UI of WP7 alot more, you can use Launcher7 on Android but it doesn't feel as good. Its smoother and a lot faster, mostly due to inability of "customization" but i really don't miss it. The tile system works surprisingly well, and yeah i don't have a lot to complain about.
No wallpapers, no app launchers etc. It's a locked phone pretty much. If you don't mind, well just don't care
If you want customization stay with Android, else both of em are good in their own ways -> personal preference.
2. Apps
For most people an important point. If you compare Android market to WP7 market, WP7 looses.. big time!
You are charged for almost every app (and a good bunch of em are overpriced!). While free apps, and sometimes test versions of the paid apps are good enough, its still nothing in comparision to Android.
If you want specific apps, check prices first! (i'd recommend it before buying the phone )
There are some social features integrated into WP7 but at the moment (Pre-Mango for me still), they aren't complete. The replacements for those features are at best mediocore, sometimes they shut off randomly etc. There might be some better apps for those, but since i don't use em very much, i havent searched for them.
Otherwise the quality of the apps and games i downloaded is really good, though some of em are missing. As i said, check before you buy the phone, if you didnt already.
3. Features:
Well again the points goes to Android. Bluetooth File Transfer, Tethering and stuff like that, you won't find it on any current WP7 phone (unless you are a Mango user, but i don't know if they implement some of those features). If you need it, well i wouldn't recommend buying a WP7 as of now.
Other than that, i don't really miss any important ones.
4. Final Thoughts:
Since i don't have the WP7 for too long forgive me if i missed or overexaggerated on somethings.
In the end i think, WP7 is a real good OS. While locked down very hard, it just works (just like the hated Apple). While it does feel kind of inferioer to Android (due to the lack of some importants features mostly), it really isn't. There are workarounds for everything, though they are complicated sometimes
With Mango.. well no, even now in MY opinion (which means only for my needs etc), i equal WP7 to Android. While i still use my Androids sometimes (mainly for tethering etc), i often see myself not missing those phones.
I'd recommend WP7 everytime, as well as Android. Just get some information on both, maybe if your friends have said phones, compare them ( or go to the store and do the same).
In the end it comes down to one's need and preference
If you want, you could wait for Mango devices. Though i guess they won't up the hardware too much, maybe add some features like Front Facing Camera and stuff like that, but that's it.
I hope i could help some
BartJJ said:
I was curious to hear from former Android users how you like WP7. Mainly what are your main gripes and what functions did you actually use that are no longer available. Also, are the tradeoffs worth it in the end and what features really *make* swapping worth it. I have loved android for a long time but I'm kind of wanting something new and have liked the wp7 interface from day one. Thanks!
Sent from my ThunderBolt using XDA App
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This entire WP7 OS is simply beautiful and fluid. Rather than 95% of all other android devices, all WP7s are completely lag free while still having a very attractive and intuitive interface. I have 28k apps at my disposal and that means one for everything I would want. The WP7 community here is amazing and hacking / development itself isn't fragmented. I've owned 3 android devices and 2 iOS devices in the past and I'm honestly never looking back.
Android too me seems very slow and inconsistent. Running a Samsung Galaxy I often find when the thing lags, it lags to the extreme. The whole app-store mechanism I find a mess, especially because to much power is given to the app developers. More often then not, they abuse these powers which destroys your battery life.
I like the way WP7 is headed, and I like what Microsoft is doing to keep it a reliable platform. What I don't like however, is the update-procedure as it's very poorly performed. I'm not blaming any company in particular, but I do think updates needs to rolled out faster. Why do ISPs have to test every minor update?
Other then that, the WP7 UI is far superior, and app support is coming along well now. We just need a major bump and hopefully Nokia will spark this? I'm looking forward to purchasing a 2nd gen phone, namely a Nokia.
I went from iphone 3gs to blackberry torch to palm pre 2 to samsung focus to atrix 4g to iphone 4 and back to samsung focus and i love it.
The largest difference to me is that WP7 lacks customization. With android you will hardly ever find 2 phones that have the same ui and settings. All windows phones home screens look the same. I am ok w/ lack of apps. Honestly there is pretty much something for everything already. What would make me happy and never go back to android is being able to personalize the home screen. Maybe some transparent tiles and a wallpaper background for homescreen. that would be awesome.
I'll try to keep this succinct. I had an Evo 4G for the last year, then switched to an HTC Arrive a couple days ago.
Like:
-Most of the apps I used on Android are available on WP7
-As a Zune Pass subscriber, having that ecosystem on my phone is awesome
-It feels like for tasks I do often, I can do all of those tasks in a lot less time than it took on Android
-I primarily develop in .NET, so the dev tools are way friendlier to me than Android's.
Dislike:
-WP7 doesn't have anything that comes close to the awesomeness of Google Navigation
-I'm pretty heavily into the Google Voice ecosystem. Losing the tight integration there is annoying.
-As a Zune Pass subscriber, the lack of expandable storage is agonizing. I can never completely get rid of my Zune HD because it's still the device I have to go to if I want access to all of my music/podcasts.
-The Amazon Android App Market's free app of the day has spoiled me so badly on the pricing race-to-the-bottom front that I am finding it very hard to convince myself to buy any of the games on WP7.
Overall, I am having a good time so far. There is some functionality I am missing, but nothing that I'd consider a showstopper. I still have my Evo 4G, so I might end up switching between the two devices every couple months or so.
I just switched from a samsung mesmerize to a HTC TP7.
My first impression was WOW. I instantly liked the tp7. it's more responsive, it's faster, i can do stuff faster, and everything loads faster. Typing on the screen is more accurate and fixes my screw ups better.
As for apps, the android market has tons more, but in my experience 99.99999% of them are completely and totally useless and the ones that aren't useless i found to be lacking. There were a few that were good, but not many. So far the ones i've tried on WP7 actually seem to be of decent quality and i can find an app for everything i need so far. Some are still obviously in the early stages and need some more features but the app feels higher quality. Of course the windows marketplace has it's share of fart, burp and police light apps. (who downloads these stupid things?)
My ONLY complaint so far is the fact i can't do custom colors on the tiles. the stock colors frankly suck. I tried unlocking the phone and chevron doesn't find the phone at all so i'm wondering if this phone just isn't unlockable with that method. Not being able to do custom tile colors just seems like an obvious omission that should have been fixed allready.
Other than that i like this phone MUCH better, it's faster and doesn't hiccup as much as android did. The loss of customization sucks a bit but honestly, who really cares. I'd rather have the phone work well than be able to customize the wallpaper. The tile color though is killing me.
lots of very good points expressed already, and I agree with most.
However: wm6.5 was far superior to my android in all the little area's that I liked / wanted to tweak... which left me disappointed when I switched to android and frustrated with the infancy of the android based os / app wanting some of the simple things that I was used to on wm6.5.
Then I jump back to windows mobile (thinking it will be great to reg edit again) only to find... tile overlay with no access to the good stuff, and on top of that extremely limited in more ways than android... apps (android copycat) extremely limited and very high priced... I never needed apps to do what I wanted. windows already had it, I just needed to turn it on or off and or tweak it the way I wanted it. customize to no end.
Now I really like the smooth integrated feel, and I took a step down in hardware just to get the operating system. I am back to hacking a android wanna be like device just to get to the meat of the phone, so I can use the power of wm7. I think...
Morrisme said:
Now I really like the smooth integrated feel, and I took a step down in hardware just to get the operating system. I am back to hacking a android wanna be like device just to get to the meat of the phone, so I can use the power of wm7. I think...
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It's WP7 !
I think all we have to do is to wait a bit. My only problem is, that the application store is pretty empty(and overpriced), but hopefully it's gonna change.
What I see is, that Microsoft tries to copy Apple in terms of system optimisation, and simplicity, and so far I say it's successful.
I hope once the marketplace will be flooded with applications, there will be a serious filter on what apps they allow, and what they don't. The main criteria of selling on marketplace should be to have a perfectly smooth application on every windows based mobile, because what I see now is far away from that. Applications seem to just thrown together for wp7 in a day or 2.
Otherwise coming from android myself, I miss certain apps, or games, or functions, but the other hand I'm impressed by it's UI, and smoothness.
WP7 has potential, but it's time is not yet here. Once a great poet said in youtube comments: "Iphone is the past, Android is the present, WP7 is the future"
I came from evo 4g and I love it I got an arrive. Its so quick. And something no one mentioned battery life is great sure if I game for a while I will need a top off bit other then that a work day is no problem btw my work day is 12 hrs
There are some surprising holes in WP7 which I didn't expect compared to other OS.
1) No common Compass API - it's down to individual hardware manufacturers to supply drivers and they all implement it in a different way. So what works on an LG won't work on a Samsung or HTC. Really hinders the use of maps and star gazing apps etc. This is despite the compass being a mandatory part of MS' hardware spec. So much for MS' tight hardware platform control. And don't think about trying Mango - even if you have the compass working in NoDo it won't in the Mango Beta - and MS say it wont be availible until the OEMs release their final versions. The whole point of a Beta and RTM is so developers can test and adapt their software ready for launch - but with the compass augmented apps (one of the killer features of modern smartphones) they are screwed. We have a common API for GPS, why not Compass?
2) No PIN delay - even the most basic phone that offers Exchange support allows a configurable delay before the phone is PIN locked, or respects the delay imposed by an Exchange security policy. Everytime my screen goes off - I have to enter an 8 character password - despite the Exchange policy allowing a max 20 minute delay. Is this fixed in mango? Is this how MS works with MS?
..and relax...