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Not sure if this is the right place to share this or not, but wanted to give some others some help from my own experiences.
I have recently gone through an awful battle with ATT regarding my upgrade status for a new phone. The very vague version of the story is that three months ago my online account showed me as eligible for an upgrade and I was going to get the Iphone 3GS. When I went to the store to buy it, I was told that I was not eligible because my account (on their end) said I was not eligible. After countless arguments and working my way through the 'ranks' of management I FINALLY came to learn that Apple's agreement with ATT does not allow them flexibility to correct customer concerns with the iphone and they are not allowed to do price overrides. The truth of that is questionable, but regardless they outright refused to give me the standard upgrade pricing on the Iphone. In the end I chose to go with the Captivate and from what Ive read, it was the right choice . I thought though that I would share with you all some free tools and services that are available to consumers that helped me and can help you get your complaints and concerns taken care of.
Most of you I hope already know about some of these, but if you dont they can be priceless.
1. The Better Business Bureau: (w-w-w. bbb .o-r-g) The BBB are the knights in shining armor for consumers. They basically will act as a mediator between you and a company who you are having difficulty getting through to or who you feel are giving you the run around. The best part is that since the BBB gives 'report cards' to millions of companies across the country, you can almost always get in touch with a very high up customer service worker who has more flexibility to help you. ATT in general has a department dedicated strictly only to addressing BBB complaints (Corporate Escalations Department Consumer Complaints Division) The only way you will ever have the privilege to speak with these individuals is to go this route. Theres never a guarantee with the BBB, but it will beat dealing with mindless call center drones who are unwilling or not allowed to take care of your issues appropriately. The complaint process is very easy and user friendly and in the best case scenario you will be contacted by the company within 7 days of filing. The BBB will stay in contact with you throughout the entire process and keep you updated with what the company is submitting to them as well.
2. The Federal Communications Commission: (w-w-w. fcc .g-o-v) Did you know that the FCC oversees the doings of all wireless carriers in the country? If all else fails, an FCC complaint is the equivalent of calling in a customer service artillery attack against a wireless company. The company is REQUIRED to address any complaints submitted by consumers to the FCC and you WILL hear back about your complaint. Best yet, the FCC will fight for your side of things and encourage the carrier to work towards getting you a fair resolution. Again, there are no guarantees, but if your getting the run around continuously then go this route! One of the most common complaints to the FCC about carriers regard early termination fees and with the FCC on your side you can almost always get a clean break from a cell contract without having to pay any of those nasty fees that can add up very quickly.
3.BASIC CUSTOMER SERVICE CALL CENTER WORKERS ARE COMPLETELY WORTHLESS TO YOUR CAUSE! I would repeat that but I think you get the point. Call Center employees are extremely limited in what they can actually do for you. Do yourself a favor and ask to speak to a manager, if they tell you that you the manager will say or give you the same resolve, ignore them and again demand to speak to a manager. Call Center employees are trained to try and steer you away from speaking to anyone above them and they will try to convince you that doing anything above them is pointless. DON'T LISTEN! Stick to your guns and talk to a manager or supervisor.
When it does come time to speak to a manager you will be in much better hands because you will actually be talking to someone who has the authority to resolve your complaint and offer you something in return. Supervisors are USUALLY more sympathetic about your complaint as long as you don't jump down their throats from the get-go. Explain your issue sternly and tell them what you want in return. You don't have to break out the boxing gloves but don't be a pushover either, if you don't get what you want, then move onto the next rung on the ladder. It may sound like a lot of work, but if your getting the work around then it is worth every bit of your time and energy to fight it. Don't back down till you get a fair resolve.
Also, the BBB and FCC are excellent bargaining tools to use in your favor. Threatening to file a complaint with either organization can sometimes be enough to tilt the scale. Companies fear this because they know its incredibly easy to file one and there's a good chance that your going to do it if you threaten it.
Again, desperate times call for powerful action. Don't let these comapnies bully you, tell you that your wrong or the worst one: tell you that you don't understand how something works. Companies love trying to convince you that your wrong and that its your fault that your account or whatever is messed up.
This worked for me...
I had to call about 20 times to get them to comply with the terms. the last time I called, the call was escalated to the management team almost immediately. I talked to the man very calmly and explained the situation with him. I told him that sprint had changed the terms of my contract several times, I had the original contract in which I signed dated 9/21/2010 and I was not going to accept the new terms with their material changes. He said that sprints attorneys had already looked at the changes to the "surcharges" paragraph and they were not an adverse material change due to the fact that sprint is just imposing limits which it had none before. So I went on to explain the adverse change to the arbitration agreement which impeded my ability to pursue any wrong doing and showed sprint favoritism. I told him of all the complaints I had been researching about JAMS arbitration showing the business favoritism. He asked me to hold a minute and came right back asking if I had considered the buy back program. I told him absolutely not I was not going to loose $250 on a phone less than a year old which they would only give $95 for and expect me to pay $110 for an ETF. He said unfortunately there is nothing I can do. I replied, I am following all the terms of the contract, I stated the Provisions for breaking the contract with no ETF (material change) and again told him this new arbitration agreement which I would be using to pursue the change to the "surcharge" paragraph adversely affects me. He asked me to hold he would transfer my call to the head of his call center because his hands were tied. About 20 minutes later he came back on the line and told me he had talked to the head of the call center and he was willing to mark my contract fulfilled as of last month and set my account to cancel at the end of the billing cycle so I could port my number if I wanted. I told him that was awesome and I appreciated them abiding by our contract even though it took multiple calls to get it completed.
1. Take notes. write down the names and employee ID of all the people you talk to.
2. Make sure you tell them you want to cancel due to the material change to the terms and conditions.
3. If you get a person that seems like they are put out by having to be at work right now tell them something came up and you will have to call back later and thank them for their time. then call right back and get someone who is having a better day.
4. Tell them you do not like the fees but the change to the arbitration agreement is the material change that you do not agree with, it is because they are impeding your ability to resolve any disputes with sprint due to the changes to the arbitration agreement so it adversely affects you.
5. Do not let the persuade you into the buyback program unless you know what the conditions are and you don't mind loosing all the money you paid for your phone upfront, you will still have to pay the ETF and they don't pay much for phones ($95 max for the Epic). You could sell your phone on craigslist for more than they offer and possibly enough to cover the ETF.
6. Always remain calm and collected speak slowly and plainly, be courteous mind you manners. Talk to the employee for a minute ask where he is located and how his day is going. Make sure you are improving their mood sympathize with them. Tell them you understand they have been told what to say and they have to follow orders but someone must be able to complete this and abide by the terms and conditions. Talk to them like their on your side (reverse psychology). If I can make them laugh over something I usually have their support when the call is escalated to the next department. It definitely makes a difference if the previous employee leaves a good comment and they side with you on the account and doesn't say you are an ahole.
7. Do not let them persuade you into the buyback program unless you know what the conditions are and you don't mind loosing all the money you paid for your phone upfront, you will still have to pay the ETF and they don't pay much for phones ($95 max for the Epic). You could sell your phone on craigslist for more than they offer and possibly enough to cover the ETF.
8. If the employee does not agree the arbitration change is a material change. mention "In Cunningham vs. Fleetwood Homes of Georgia, reported at page 611 of the third Federal Reporter, volume 253, the Eleventh Circuit Court of Appeals ruled that arbitration clauses are material terms to a contract.”
9. They may offer a discount of .50 each month to offset the surcharge or $10 a month for 3 months to continue service. If you take these offers your contract will still be in full effect and you will be stuck with the new terms.
10. Get a CONFIRMATION NUMBER and keep it safe. Do not loose it just in case the employee lied which has been known to happen from time to time. check your account online and click "see my contract details" it should show almost immediately the contract is complete. press print screen and save the image at least until your final bill has arrived and is correct. I have been burned by companies which lied in the past because it does not matter what they tell you on the phone its what is in writing that counts. If they lie and you have no proof 30 days after the change you are stuck in your contract.
With a bit of luck they should let you out of the contract depending on the representative. They have no legal grounds to make you stay. If they refuse try again be persistent. I overheard the employees talking in the back ground at one point about how many times I had called over this issue. one of them even said "he is one persistent a**hole". Do not give up, if you don't find yourself making headway after 25 calls file a complaint with the BBB, FTC, FCC, your state attorney general, local chamber of commerce and your state public utility commission.
Good Luck,
Brandon
I recently sold a Note 4 on Swappa. A few days later after the device had been delivered to the buyer I received a notification stating that the phone had a scratch big scratch down the front of the screen. The buyer decided to say it "must have been damaged in shipping". Which was a lie because he posted picture on Imgur of the device in his hand with the screen fine and only the minor scratch it had from the listing.
IMO proving that his described larger scratch must have happened after he owned the device and was using it.
Swappa agreed that I was not obligated to refund the money, so the buyer took it up with pay pay. Even though the claim in Paypal happen 4 days after he received the device, they still sided with the buyer and said I owed him a full refund.
PAYPAL does not provide seller protection. In fact they agreed (2 different managers) that the evidence I provided proved my side of the dispute but, PayPal was going to rule in his favor because otherwise they have to deal with the buyer's credit card company and would most likely have to eat his refund whether or not he returned the device. They would rather me have to eat the loss than have PalPay have to deal with a credit card charge back.
No JOKE that is what I was told.
I just wanted to make everyone aware that you are not safe selling devices on Swappa or using PayPal, neither service will protect the seller. TBO I felt more supported when I used Craig's List.
I know XDA has a partnership with Swappa or something, and I do not blame them for the entire problem, but it may be best to rethink that relationship. Or maybe just Swappa's relationship with PayPal.
Don't get hosed.
.
Sent from my SM-G935T using XDA-Developers mobile app
Swappa sided with you, so not sure why you say later that Swappa doesn't side with sellers? A little contradictory? No? :silly:
And PayPal is PayPal. That's really out of Swappa's hands. PayPal is the preferred method of payment all around the Internet, so not much can be done about that at this point.
An unfortunate situation anyway.
And that is why I never use PayPal myself and advise people not to use it. I only buy devices from people I know and use Google wallet to do so. Yes there is a risk but then there is always risk involved.
Not using PayPal is nuts, although I understand what happened here. This is the most credible method of payment worldwide and probably not bound to change soon... **** happens, I guess? Best of luck next time
Ev0luti0n_ said:
Not using PayPal is nuts, although I understand what happened here. This is the most credible method of payment worldwide and probably not bound to change soon... **** happens, I guess? Best of luck next time
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You would be amazed at how many people really do refuse to use it. Mainly after all the BS with them not to long ago.
What bull****? I know they have constant policy updates, but haven't followed technology much. Where there problems with it?
Ev0luti0n_ said:
What bull****? I know they have constant policy updates, but haven't followed technology much. Where there problems with it?
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Simple is that I could get said object. Then report to paypal that it was not as described and get my money back and keep the item. This caused a huge issue with paypal not to long ago. People were doing it left and right which cost people tons of money.
Side note. Watch the swearing. It doesnt belong here.
Even with the forum self censoring? Never thought it would be a problem. Sure thing.
In case anyone is considering buying their phone (or any items) from this criminal company, I just want to emphasise the dangers of buying from them. I've been through 7 months of hell in an attempt to get my Samsung S7 Edge back from them. It seems they are never going to send it back to me. £500 down the drain and lots of anger and distress.
This is the story:
https://uk.trustpilot.com/reviews/58ab865ff434950bc4fe0860
And a previous thread looking for advice on XDA: https://forum.xda-developers.com/s7-edge/help/received-phone-screen-fix-looks-t3506196
As they are priced very competitively, it may be attractive and tempting to bite the bullet and buy from China. That's why I bought the S7. I felt confident in a Samsung product. If the item works flawlessly and never fails, you are going to be happy. But if anything fails you will lose out big time as they ARE NOT willing to help in case of faulty equipment. Instead, their strategy is to exhaust you with non-answers until you simply give up. I am not rolling over though.
Stay far far away from this company.
I can imagine your troubles and exactly imagine how exhausting this may be. However one overall valid rule in buying from China is that the tempting cheap price in the beginning may be very expensive afterwards. This is just a risk you need to be willing to take. Your experience is not limited to eglobal or anyone else but applies to this part of business in General. Also, it is a bit harsh to call them "criminals" though I can fully follow your point of view and conclusion.
I was living in China for some time and it is just common in their understanding that you buy things as they are. There's generally no such thing as warranty. Once the business is concluded everyone goes its own way. There's even no service line built up that a distributor has anyone in contract for repairs. This is just the practice over there and it meets our high level service expectations on the other end of the world. I don't think they want to cheat you but they just don't know how to deal with that all along with their boss requiring that no business should be done with loss (which limits the budget for such handling).
All those shops coming up recent days they are just trying to get a small piece of the cake. They even don't get their products from the manufacturer but through third party shops whom they cannot turn to out of the reasons mentioned in case of any problem. And to be clear: I am absolutely against those businesses and aside of some known sellers for Chinese phones I would never buy anything of value from such websites / ebay / Amazon.
So you ship your phone to your Warehouse and it goes with the next batch to China (most probably someone takes it flying there to avoid the paper work for import) and over there they are trying to find a small shop who may be able to do this or not. After that it goes the way back it came. Seriously, don't expect too much. They're already doing more than maybe most of such shops would be doing.
However, if I'm not mistaken eGlobal is despite many other sites with a UK company behind. The people are pretty much the same but you would be able to take legal action as UK law and - most important - Court applies. In the end you would be able to seize their Warehouse if a judge finds your claims are true. Unfortunately especially in UK such Limited companies are easily shut down and re-opened under a different name.
To sum it up: Buying from such Chinese sources goes always without any liability and warranty from seller and you should be prepared for total loss in worst case.
andiling said:
I can imagine your troubles and exactly imagine how exhausting this may be. However one overall valid rule in buying from China is that the tempting cheap price in the beginning may be very expensive afterwards. This is just a risk you need to be willing to take. Your experience is not limited to eglobal or anyone else but applies to this part of business in General. Also, it is a bit harsh to call them "criminals" though I can fully follow your point of view and conclusion.
I was living in China for some time and it is just common in their understanding that you buy things as they are. There's generally no such thing as warranty. Once the business is concluded everyone goes its own way. There's even no service line built up that a distributor has anyone in contract for repairs. This is just the practice over there and it meets our high level service expectations on the other end of the world. I don't think they want to cheat you but they just don't know how to deal with that all along with their boss requiring that no business should be done with loss (which limits the budget for such handling).
All those shops coming up recent days they are just trying to get a small piece of the cake. They even don't get their products from the manufacturer but through third party shops whom they cannot turn to out of the reasons mentioned in case of any problem. And to be clear: I am absolutely against those businesses and aside of some known sellers for Chinese phones I would never buy anything of value from such websites / ebay / Amazon.
So you ship your phone to your Warehouse and it goes with the next batch to China (most probably someone takes it flying there to avoid the paper work for import) and over there they are trying to find a small shop who may be able to do this or not. After that it goes the way back it came. Seriously, don't expect too much. They're already doing more than maybe most of such shops would be doing.
However, if I'm not mistaken eGlobal is despite many other sites with a UK company behind. The people are pretty much the same but you would be able to take legal action as UK law and - most important - Court applies. In the end you would be able to seize their Warehouse if a judge finds your claims are true. Unfortunately especially in UK such Limited companies are easily shut down and re-opened under a different name.
To sum it up: Buying from such Chinese sources goes always without any liability and warranty from seller and you should be prepared for total loss in worst case.
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Thanks for the reply.
I will definitely look into taking legal action. I have friends who are willing to help me out.
I'm now at a point where they pretended to agree on sending me a replacement phone which was "fully functional", but now that I accepted, they claim it needs to be tested and refuse to give me a timeframe.
They are just trying to wear me out mentally. It has been going on for almost 6 months now, but I just become increasingly determined to take them down.
Disgusting people.
R u referring to the "eglobaldogitalcameras(.)com(.)au site? I "almost" ordered from them because they were so cheap...i ended up just renewing contract via another carrier...as i was also concerned about horror stories i heard buying from ebay and other China sites that send flagship samsung and htc smartphones from china or hk to rest of world..
Does anybody of you return the phone to SBE Ltd. before?
SBE Ltd (Service Beyond Expectations)Unit A1-A2 Beaver Industrial Estate, Beaver Road, Ashford, Kent, TN23 7SH
https://sbeglobalservice.com/worldwide-locations/
What was the outcome?
Reviews of SBE online:
Yell (~60% of negative comments)
https://www.yell.com/biz/sbe-ltd-ashford-4846566/#reviews
Google (twice as many negative comments)
https://www.google.co.uk/maps/place/SBE+Ltd/@51.1355629,0.8657654,17z/data=!4m17!1m8!3m7!1s0x47deda4b23107a5b:0xe5cdb3c3290af8c5!2sBeaver+Industrial+Estate,+Beaver+Rd,+Ashford+TN23+7SH!3b1!8m2!3d51.1355629!4d0.8679541!16s/g/1tmbvd91!3m7!1s0x47dedb0ee0f74def:0x8c5eb7539d9cc645!8m2!3d51.1359687!4d0.8681304!9m1!1b1!16s/g/1thsqnrf
Trustpilot >750 negative reviews (13%)
https://uk.trustpilot.com/review/uk.sbeglobalservice.com?stars=1
I found those reviews SHOCKING!
After reading a few of the stories you will notice the pattern. This company operates globally since 1996!
This is an invitation to the discussion as the scale of this practice is huge!
Xiaomi, Sony, OnePlus, Huawei, Apple, Motorola, Cat and others are involved.
After reading a few of the stories you should notice the pattern. This company operates globally since 1996!
Fostel said:
I planned to return a phone that was switched on only once. It was purchased as a gift but the birthday boy did not like it.
Contacted customer service via chat the next day asking what the return procedure looks like. Instead of explaining, they started the process for me and I received the jiffy bag today.
I had a gut feeling that something is not right when I realized that the jiffy bag was posted by this SCAM company so XIAOMI UK already broke the LAW by selling my details to them (third party - GDPR).
And I mean, everything. My name, home address, email, phone number also IMEI, and the serial number of the device.
The included letter state: ‘Returning your Device for DOA Assessment’
As far as I know, DOA means Death On Arrival. I never claimed the device to be damaged in any way. It was turned on for an hour or two and put down. The condition is the same as it arrived minus a foil wrap (there were no seal stickers on the box).
• What do they play here? Is this a generic letter for a 'change of mind' return?
• Does anybody of you returned the phone to Xiaomi before?
This is an invitation to the discussion as the scale of this practice is huge!
Xiaomi, Sony, OnePlus, Huawei, Apple, Motorola, Cat and others are involved.
After reading a few of the stories you will notice the pattern. This company operates globally since 1996!
I found those reviews. SHOCKING!
https://www.yell.com/biz/sbe-ltd-ashford-4846566/#reviews
https://www.google.co.uk/maps/place/SBE+Ltd/@51.1355629,0.8657654,17z/data=!4m17!1m8!3m7!1s0x47deda4b23107a5b:0xe5cdb3c3290af8c5!2sBeaver+Industrial+Estate,+Beaver+Rd,+Ashford+TN23+7SH!3b1!8m2!3d51.1355629!4d0.8679541!16s/g/1tmbvd91!3m7!1s0x47dedb0ee0f74def:0x8c5eb7539d9cc645!8m2!3d51.1359687!4d0.8681304!9m1!1b1!16s/g/1thsqnrf
https://uk.trustpilot.com/review/uk.sbeglobalservice.com?stars=1
SBE Ltd (Service Beyond Expectations)Unit A1-A2 Beaver Industrial Estate, Beaver Road, Ashford, Kent, TN23 7SH
https://sbeglobalservice.com/worldwide-locations/
Why nobody is discussing this?!
I decided to keep this phone but this may be the last Xiaomi phone that I purchased.
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They responded to your review left on trustpilot....
I dunno...they don't look like a complete "scam" you are making them out as...there are tons of positive reviews among the completely negative -- that isn't so likely if it was a complete scam. It sucks they were given your information and details, but I don't know how they would function (as a repair/replacement company) without some of that information...
simplepinoi177 said:
They responded to your review left on trustpilot....
I dunno...they don't look like a complete "scam" you are making them out as...there are tons of positive reviews among the completely negative -- that isn't so likely if it was a complete scam. It sucks they were given your information and details, but I don't know how they would function (as a repair/replacement company) without some of that information...
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Thanks for popping in. Some of those positive reviews on Trustpilot do look fake. FYI Trustpilot can be played and many shady companies do it... daily. Also, would you write poems in reviews of the repair centre after they just did their job? I would still be upset at the manufacturer that the item broke in the first place and I had to go through a warranty claim.
I have read hundreds of reviews last night and I truly feel for people crying out their stories. They cannot all be wrong or coincidental as there is a pattern that I know full well as I learned the hard way. I lost my property and after months of chasing got another device with a different issue (somebody else's return). I sold it privately to minimise loss and moved on but many are naive enough to send it back to them again to get scammed a second time.
I am just trying to make people aware that this practice exists. Do not get scammed folks. Do your research. Peace!
Maybe the online chat was a chatbot and got the reason for return wrong. Or maybe it's Xiaomi UK's policy to have all phones returned, where the customer has changed their mind, to have the phone inspected to ensure it's still in as new condition.
Whatever the case Xiaomi UK are within their right to nominate any company to act as their service centre agent, and as such are well within data protection laws in sending relevant customer details to any third party company chosen as their agent to act on their behalf. It's exactly the same as passing on your details to a courier to deliver the phone, and I don't see any complaint about that. You will have scrolled passed something telling you these things when skipping past the Ts and Cs.
There does not appear to be a scam, nor has anything illegal happened.
It's just unfortunate that Xiaomi UK have chosen such an apparently disreputable company to act as their service centre.
Robbo.5000 said:
Maybe the online chat was a chatbot and got the reason for return wrong. Or maybe it's Xiaomi UK's policy to have all phones returned, where the customer has changed their mind, to have the phone inspected to ensure it's still in as new condition.
Whatever the case Xiaomi UK are within their right to nominate any company to act as their service centre agent, and as such are well within data protection laws in sending relevant customer details to any third party company chosen as their agent to act on their behalf. It's exactly the same as passing on your details to a courier to deliver the phone, and I don't see any complaint about that. You will have scrolled passed something telling you these things when skipping past the Ts and Cs.
There does not appear to be a scam, nor has anything illegal happened.
It's just unfortunate that Xiaomi UK have chosen such an apparently disreputable company to act as their service centre.
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You must be mad thinking that was a chatbot.
It's obvious you did not read the reviews of the people who had their property stolen/damaged/not adequately replaced/ money extorted.
In the UK, you need to consent to your details being passed to a third party otherwise, it will be a data breach. A courier or postman cannot be compared to any Ltd. company.
You've completely missed the point so I edited the original post to make it clearer.
EOT.
Fostel said:
You must be mad thinking that was a chatbot.
It's obvious you did not read the reviews of the people who had their property stolen/damaged/not adequately replaced/ money extorted.
Also, you are wrong about UK law. You need to consent to your details being passed to the third party. A courier or postman cannot be compared to any Ltd. company. You are free to send them your devices if you will.
You completely miss the point so I edited the original post to make it clearer.
EOT.
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You gave no info either way to indicate if the online chat was real or a bot. I only gave that out as a possible cause of why Xiaomi thought you wanted to return the phone because it was broken.
I've done numerous data protection courses in the UK for various companies of worked for. I know they don't need to ask your permission. As said previously this fact would have been buried in the T's and C's.
Xiaomi UK have obviously outsourced the service centre repair work to SBE Ltd. (Along with many other manufacturers) They have the right to forward relevant information to SBE to allow SBE to do the required work on their behalf.
It is exactly the same as when the phone was delivered. Xiaomi do not deliver themselves, they outsource the work to a delivery company. In order to do this, they have to give your details to the delivery company. In order for SBE to perform their duties for Xiaomi, they too require details of Xiaomi's customers they are performing the service for.
Xiaomi (and all other manufacturers) are not allowed to send customer data that is not relevant, but they are allowed to pass on data that is relevant and required to allow SBE to do the services they are contracted to perform.
The unfortunate part of all this is that it's not financially sensible for these manufacturers to have their own dedicated UK service centres. I would guess that almost all manufacturers use SBE Ltd. because their is no other company in the UK that can compete with the scale of work SBE can do. So as customers in the UK, if you have a problem within the warranty period, you have no choice but hope SBE get it right with your phone.
Now to get the point. In your case, your contract was with Xiaomi. If SBE had stuffed up your phone, whilst working on behalf of Xiaomi, then that would be between you and Xiaomi to work out. It would be Xiaomi's responsibility to deal with SBE. If Xiaomi's contractors are incompetent, that is only Xiaomi's problem to deal with.