Hello, I've been an XDA lurker for a while, starting with my Galaxy S4. I just recently got a OnePlus 6, and love it so far, but this one problem is kind of irritating me.
When using the front camera (both in the camera app when not set to 4:3, and third party apps like snapchat), the picture looks very zoomed in). I'm guessing its because any other ratio is just a cropped version of 4:3.
The only way I can think to fix this is to force a different ratio for the camera to use, but I'm not sure if that is even possible.
Anyone else have this type of problem? Help would be much appreciated.
I think its because the lense has a higher focal length... Nothing to do with ratio.
So is there any way to work around this so that the front image isn't so zoomed in?
For video? It's because of their stabilization
NateDev said:
For video? It's because of their stabilization
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I mean in the pictures. Like if you're taking a selfie, the viewfinder shows the image as very zoomed in (like your face covers the image if you're a normal distance away), and the picture is taken like that.
When you shoot with 4:3 you have all the picture of the sensor. When you shoot with 16:9 or other you don't use all the sensor but it crops the image to be in that ratio. And you see the zoom. Take a picture with 4:3 and zoom with your fingers to see a picture of 16:9 shot. It's the same.
OnePlus 6
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Hey all,
Here's a pretty cool macro DSLR effect I discovered the other day. FINALLY a use for 4K video resolution!
All you have to do when in video mode is select 4k (3840 × 2160) and zoom in 4x. When close to a subject tap to focus as usual and you may be shocked that the image suddenly has crazy depth of field but still remains sharp.
The reason? The camera module has an aperture of f/2.2 which is great, but that's not the real clincher. 4K UHD has 8,294,400 pixels in a frame. Just to give you an idea 1080p is only 2,073,600 pixels. So basically, when you zoom in 4x, your image still looks great. No other phone camera can do this in 2013.
Big deal, SO WHAT? you may be thinking. Well the results CLEARLY speak for themselves..
Happy shooting!
James Harrison said:
Hey all,
Here's a pretty cool macro DSLR effect I discovered the other day. FINALLY a use for 4K video resolution!
All you have to do when in video mode is select 4k (3840 × 2160) and zoom in 4x. When close to a subject tap to focus as usual and you may be shocked that the image suddenly has crazy depth of field but still remains sharp.
The reason? The camera module has an aperture of f/2.2 which is great, but that's not the real clincher. 4K UHD has 8,294,400 pixels in a frame. Just to give you an idea 1080p is only 2,073,600 pixels. So basically, when you zoom in 4x, your image still looks great. No other phone camera can do this in 2013.
Big deal, SO WHAT? you may be thinking. Well the results CLEARLY speak for themselves..
Happy shooting!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Are you saying that if you record in 1080p mode and framed the shot exactly the same, that the depth of field would not be the same? I'm confused?
I understand the merits of 4K recording, but I don't see how the depth of field would be affected.
WOW! Cant believe all that comes from the small lens sensor of Note 3
Sent from my SM-N9005 using Tapatalk
Maverick777 said:
Are you saying that if you record in 1080p mode and framed the shot exactly the same, that the depth of field would not be the same? I'm confused?
I understand the merits of 4K recording, but I don't see how the depth of field would be affected.
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I probably should have explained this better but you can't really frame the same shot in 1080p because you'd be way too close to the subject for the camera to even attempt to focus on it. 4k allows much more flexibility for macro shots.
And do you have a 4K display to see this awesomeness?
Otherwise you're just watching it at 1080p lol.
James Harrison said:
I probably should have explained this better but you can't really frame the same shot in 1080p because you'd be way too close to the subject for the camera to even attempt to focus on it. 4k allows much more flexibility for macro shots.
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Now I'm curious how 4K video zoomed in 4x downscaled to 1080p compares to 1080p video zoomed in 4x. I wonder if Samsung is using software zooming to enlarge the video image or cropping the sensor to achieve the field of view. If it's software zoom then there's obviously going to be a loss in quality. But if it's simply cropping the sensor there should be no difference. And it fact it'd be a waste of time and memory space to shoot in 4k zoomed to 4x and then having to downscale it to 1080p afterwards. That would add unnecessary steps for editing. Also, in 1080p mode you have access to the software video stabilization while in 4k mode you don't.
it's not about the resolution lol. think putting on different DSLR lenses for your phone.
great find, OP! will be trying this soon
4k works with approx 50% more colours than normal 1080p. Even if you dont have a tv to warch it in full res, a 4k clip will look and FEEL rather different than everything else.
The clip in the above link is done with a little bit of postproduction. Indeed its impressing and there is more to be discovered.
_madness haven't any rest, only swet_
CorruptedSanity said:
And do you have a 4K display to see this awesomeness?
Otherwise you're just watching it at 1080p lol.
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lol, it's not about the resolution. it's kinda like being able to use different lenses for your note 3.
great find, OP. thanks!
Maverick777 said:
Now I'm curious how 4K video zoomed in 4x downscaled to 1080p compares to 1080p video zoomed in 4x. I wonder if Samsung is using software zooming to enlarge the video image or cropping the sensor to achieve the field of view. If it's software zoom then there's obviously going to be a loss in quality. But if it's simply cropping the sensor there should be no difference. And it fact it'd be a waste of time and memory space to shoot in 4k zoomed to 4x and then having to downscale it to 1080p afterwards. That would add unnecessary steps for editing. Also, in 1080p mode you have access to the software video stabilization while in 4k mode you don't.
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Cropping a sensor of say a 35mm legs by 1.6 doesn't give you a 56mm zoom perspective. You're still getting a relatively wide angle shot but simply cropped.
CorruptedSanity said:
Cropping a sensor of say a 35mm legs by 1.6 doesn't give you a 56mm zoom perspective. You're still getting a relatively wide angle shot but simply cropped.
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I understand that. However, in this instance is 1080p mode on the Note 3 simply cropping the sensor to begin with? My question in relation to the OP is if you shoot at 4K mode, zoom in a 4X, is the phone simply cropping the sensor 4x to give you a lossless zoom? Or it is using some type of software pixel binning to give you the zoomed in view? Or perhaps a combination of both.
And how does that compare to shooting in 1080p mode with the 4x zoom?
I took a few sample videos sitting at my desk and to my naked eye viewing both videos on the Note 3's screen, there is 0 difference between shooting at 4K resolution with a 4x zoom and shooting at 1080p at 4x zoom other than the file size. The field of view is identical. I'm looking to see if there's any advantage at the end of the day if I want to end up with a 1080p file as the end product. Is there any advantage to shooting the same field of view at 4K and downscaling?
The 4x zoom when shooting at 4K did not give me a distance advantage versus shooting 1080p at 4x zoom. The phone remained at the same distance as my subject when framing the shot with the same field of view. So for macro video shots, I do not appear to have any advantage when shooting at 4K.
Epic and very well done video!
Sent from my SM-N9005 using Tapatalk
James Harrison said:
I probably should have explained this better but you can't really frame the same shot in 1080p because you'd be way too close to the subject for the camera to even attempt to focus on it. 4k allows much more flexibility for macro shots.
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Click to collapse
I think what he's saying is that no matter of 1080p or 4k, distance and senzor pixels are the same, therefore theoretically you shouldn't necessarily have to do 4k to do such zooming. Question is: in effect does zooming in 1080p still record lossless as far as the sensor goes (13mil pixels), or zooming in 1080p only zooms into the 1080p capture (magnifies the 2mil pixels).
Maverick777 said:
I understand that. However, in this instance is 1080p mode on the Note 3 simply cropping the sensor to begin with? My question in relation to the OP is if you shoot at 4K mode, zoom in a 4X, is the phone simply cropping the sensor 4x to give you a lossless zoom? Or it is using some type of software pixel binning to give you the zoomed in view? Or perhaps a combination of both.
And how does that compare to shooting in 1080p mode with the 4x zoom?
I took a few sample videos sitting at my desk and to my naked eye viewing both videos on the Note 3's screen, there is 0 difference between shooting at 4K resolution with a 4x zoom and shooting at 1080p at 4x zoom other than the file size. The field of view is identical. I'm looking to see if there's any advantage at the end of the day if I want to end up with a 1080p file as the end product. Is there any advantage to shooting the same field of view at 4K and downscaling?
The 4x zoom when shooting at 4K did not give me a distance advantage versus shooting 1080p at 4x zoom. The phone remained at the same distance as my subject when framing the shot with the same field of view. So for macro video shots, I do not appear to have any advantage when shooting at 4K.
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BoneXDA said:
I think what he's saying is that no matter of 1080p or 4k, distance and senzor pixels are the same, therefore theoretically you shouldn't necessarily have to do 4k to do such zooming. Question is: in effect does zooming in 1080p still record lossless as far as the sensor goes (13mil pixels), or zooming in 1080p only zooms into the 1080p capture (magnifies the 2mil pixels).
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I just assumed that zooming in ALWAYS "magnified" the pixels so you'd naturally just get sharper detail with the 4k mode. I now understand my error with the field of view though (I tried it out myself too)
I guess the main thing to take home is the amount of detail you're getting from this phone's sensor.
Hi Guys,
I asked myself how the zoom on my Z3 should work.
As far as I know, the Z3 can Zoom into the sensor while taking 8mpix pictures.
While I tried it, it seemed to me that the quality gets really bad.
I was guessing that the indicator on the left is the indicator which separates digital zoom from the sensor-zoom.
As far as I thought the light grey indicator-bar shows the part which is the sensor zoom and the dark part is the digital zoom.
Considering the quality it seems to me that both modes are digital zoom. The picture looks really annoying while i use it.
I just thought maybe I'm doing something wrong - has anyone an idea how I can improve this or use it right or or or...
Regards,
Matthias
I didn't know about the 8mp restriction, i also tested it out in the shop, but in 20mp mode. The sections looked identical. However, as the sensor is not at it's limits at 8mp, i guess it could take a higher resolution and crop it to 8mp size at the zoomed in section.
Auto mode enables you to use the camera's Clear Zoom feature, which produces good-looking, lossless-like digital zoom.
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the image is stretched by the software, which then attempts to fill in the blanks as best as it can. Well, thanks to the giant sensors on the Nokia Lumia 1020 and Sony Xperia Z1/Z1 Compact, zoom is no longer a problem. But instead of opting for bulky zoom lens (Galaxy S4 Zoom), they both rely on their massive resolution in order to get what we call 'lossless' zoom.
So what's lossless zoom, then? In simple terms, it means that zooming into a scene will only result in a negligible loss in quality. Think of it this way: there are so many pixels available with a camera like the one on the 1020 that you can 'crop' any part of the photo and still have more than enough pixels for a full-sized photo that will appear zoomed in. No upscaling, and no loss of quality. But how does it work in practice?
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More info about everything
http://www.phonearena.com/news/What...-work-in-the-Lumia-1020-and-Xperia-Z1_id52198
So conclusion is, it is all digital zoom
electrash said:
More info about everything
http://www.phonearena.com/news/What...-work-in-the-Lumia-1020-and-Xperia-Z1_id52198
So conclusion is, it is all digital zoom
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Okay, it is something like digital zoom. But I think, the quality while zooming into an 8mpix picture should not be worse in quality (depending on the zoom factor) than the 20mpix picture.
When I take a 8 mpix picture, I assume that the image processor will take it in 20mpix and shrink it down to 8.
And what I would like to see is that
I could zoom in and it will just move into the sensor to a 1:1 size.
Another thing : while using the video mode, the stabilizer does an amazing job.
What about the photo-mode? I can't see any stabilisation there.
Since I only take 8mpi pictures, I guess the picture-frame could also be panned around the 20m of the sensor...
Regards,
Matthias
Maeffjus said:
Okay, it is something like digital zoom. But I think, the quality while zooming into an 8mpix picture should not be worse in quality (depending on the zoom factor) than the 20mpix picture.
When I take a 8 mpix picture, I assume that the image processor will take it in 20mpix and shrink it down to 8.
And what I would like to see is that
I could zoom in and it will just move into the sensor to a 1:1 size.
Another thing : while using the video mode, the stabilizer does an amazing job.
What about the photo-mode? I can't see any stabilisation there.
Since I only take 8mpi pictures, I guess the picture-frame could also be panned around the 20m of the sensor...
Regards,
Matthias
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In SA mode, phone take oversampled photo (which means he take 21mp, but he make HD pixel (one pixel combine colors from neibghours)... so when you take 8mpx it takes 20mp ovesampled.
When you zoom in, it will take more and more neibhours pixel to combine in one, so that means loseless.
Hi everyone!
Which resolution do you use, 12 mpx or 20 mpx? 12mpx gives you hybrid zoom x2 but phone only uses rgb lens, while 20mpx supposedly uses both lenses to create a hybrid colour/b&w pic. So which do you use? I have it on 12mpx in order to use zoom but don't really know which is best.
Cheers!
It actually depends on your preference and the situation you want to create in the photo. I use the 20mp when shooting wide angle landscapes, while im using the 12mp when shooting portraits or closeups
earl_110 said:
It actually depends on your preference and the situation you want to create in the photo. I use the 20mp when shooting wide angle landscapes, while im using the 12mp when shooting portraits or closeups
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Thanks for replying! I've actually found that shooting a normal close up pic on 12mpx shoots in kind of a wide-angle effect. Last friday celebrating carnival at school, I was able to fit in a whole class of 28 kids from a few feet away. If u look at the pic, it looks like it has been shot on a wide-angle lens!
Any more opinions on camera config are more than welcome!
I don't believe that the 20MPx option uses both cameras. When you partially cover the B&W sensor, there is no noticable effect on the photo. Looks like it is only software based up-scaling and may get you jagged edges sometimes. After some testing with 20MPx and then 20MPx resized to 12MPx just for comparison, I prefer the 12MPx default setting.
_Marian_ said:
I don't believe that the 20MPx option uses both cameras. When you partially cover the B&W sensor, there is no noticable effect on the photo. Looks like it is only software based up-scaling and may get you jagged edges sometimes. After some testing with 20MPx and then 20MPx resized to 12MPx just for comparison, I prefer the 12MPx default setting.
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Hi Marian, thanks for your reply!
So on a phone with a dual camera, what would be the purpose of the dual lens?? If one is rgb and the other monocrome, don't they both work together to provide depth information and zoom? Or do all colour pics use just the one rgb lens and the other is exclusively for b&w pics?? Seems a little pointless to me...
You are totally right about the sw upscale to 20mp as any other camera app only detects a maximum resolution of 12 mp, but it seems strange to me that even on 12mp colour pictutes, the phone wouldn't use both lens (depth and zoom) because the inferior P20 Lite precisely doess that on all the reviews I read about it (I've always thought that was the point of all dual-lens cameras).
Cheers!
The B&W sensor should provide depth information. You can try different camera modes and cover the B&W sensor. The phone says "Please do not cover the lenses." in some camera modes. But if you don't put finger too close, nothing happens. I can't tell it does anything at all to the image quality which seems strange. Did they made some mistake in latest build? It only does have some effect on aperture mode when you can see heat haze effect on display. It sucks we don't have more options like jpg quality or sliders for post-process filters.
When I switch the 3x zoom it's not sharp at all and very grainy, if it optical it's supposed be very sharp,
Is anyone else having an issue with the 3x zoom on the camera ?
watchnj said:
When I switch the 3x zoom it's not sharp at all and very grainy, if it optical it's supposed be very sharp,
Is anyone else having an issue with the 3x zoom on the camera ?
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Optical
Vanhoud said:
Optical
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Do you have any quality issues using it ?
It's only an 8MP sensor
Did you take a pic? I've noticed that once I get to 6-8x the camera looks super grainy, but when you slide the brightness up or down it tends to make it better, and once the pic is shot the grain goes away and it looks like a normal picture.
Can't upload pics rn for some reason but the 3x looks slightly better than 2.9x with the main camera.
explosivequack said:
Did you take a pic? I've noticed that once I get to 6-8x the camera looks super grainy, but when you slide the brightness up or down it tends to make it better, and once the pic is shot the grain goes away and it looks like a normal picture.
Can't upload pics rn for some reason but the 3x looks slightly better than 2.9x with the main camera.
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So the camera uses digital drop for 2.2-2.9x zoom?
It is a 2.2x optical system and it takes a "3x zoom" lossless crop out of the taken image, leaving an 8mp resulting image.
Ì sent my Samsung A70 back because 16:9 was limited to 8 MP, I knew little about aspect ratios their respective resolutions, now that I have read a lot about it I am somewhat wiser. I was used to taking 16:9 photos on my S8+ and cropping the picture to my liking while maintaining the 16:9 AR. This requires a somewhat larger original picture if you wish to view the result on a large screen.
I bought the 7 pro and immediately ran into the same problem, aspect ratios are stuck to a certain resolution and 48 MP is limited to 4:3 JPG format, I can´t even choose 16:9 and decided to go along with the 20:9 fullscreen option ... can still easily be cropped to 16:9. But why are aspect ratios locked into a certain resolution which is usually okay in it´s original size for viewing but doesn´t allow for a lot of creativity.
I have been using a Gcam mod which has 16:9 available and the pictures do allow for a small crop, not much though before the pixels suffer on the big screen.
I will never use 4:3 as I hate the field of view it offers.
4:3 is likely the native sensor size/ratio. It comes from mimicking film cameras. Film cameras in turn copied oil painting canvases. 16:9 is just a compromise television format to approach Cinema formats roughly 21:9.
Sent from my GM1917 using Tapatalk
larsdennert said:
4:3 is likely the native sensor size/ratio. It comes from mimicking film cameras. Film cameras in turn copied oil painting canvases. 16:9 is just a compromise television format to approach Cinema formats roughly 21:9.
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Yes, I figured that. Why are the size of the pictures restricted in all aspect ratios? that´s my question. As the average consumer you get 48MP advertised when you buy the phone, large pictures are however impossible to shoot in any other aspect ratio than 4:3 and for that you need to tweak the settings. For most people the camera will be 12 MP at most.
Why can´t I f.ex. shoot a 16:9 picture at 24 MP? I realize the fact that it´s impossible to get a 48 MP picture at 16:9 due to how the camera angle works.
The main sensor has 48 million pixels laid out in a 4:3 aspect ratio. Furthermore they are grouped in a quad Bayer layout which really just makes it a 4x light sensitive 12mp camera instead of a 48mp detail sensor. That is the hardware.
If you want images cropped to another aspect ratio afterwards, download something like Open Camera or MX Camera and set a custom resolution.
Sent from my GM1917 using Tapatalk
larsdennert said:
The main sensor has 48 million pixels laid out in a 4:3 aspect ratio. Furthermore they are grouped in a quad Bayer layout which really just makes it a 4x light sensitive 12mp camera instead of a 48mp detail sensor. That is the hardware.
If you want images cropped to another aspect ratio afterwards, download something like Open Camera or MX Camera and set a custom resolution.
Sent from my GM1917 using Tapatalk
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All third party apps are limited to the 12 MP, they don´t know how to use the 4x .... so they are pretty limited in their range of resolutions.
Yes and regrettably can't use the other lenses either.
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larsdennert said:
4:3 is likely the native sensor size/ratio. It comes from mimicking film cameras. Film cameras in turn copied oil painting canvases. 16:9 is just a compromise television format to approach Cinema formats roughly 21:9.
Sent from my GM1917 using Tapatalk
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Cinema is 2.35:1 which is why on 16:9 shows you the black bars on the top and bottom of your screen for the majority of movies.
---------- Post added at 01:33 PM ---------- Previous post was at 01:30 PM ----------
AurioDK said:
Yes, I figured that. Why are the size of the pictures restricted in all aspect ratios? that´s my question. As the average consumer you get 48MP advertised when you buy the phone, large pictures are however impossible to shoot in any other aspect ratio than 4:3 and for that you need to tweak the settings. For most people the camera will be 12 MP at most.
Why can´t I f.ex. shoot a 16:9 picture at 24 MP? I realize the fact that it´s impossible to get a 48 MP picture at 16:9 due to how the camera angle works.
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Unless your going to print MASSIVE size prints, overall, MP is a marketing ploy to get your to spend more money on am item. After 12 to 16mp, for 95% of people, the difference is in the pixel size in Montana, not the number is pixels.
larsdennert said:
The main sensor has 48 million pixels laid out in a 4:3 aspect ratio. Furthermore they are grouped in a quad Bayer layout which really just makes it a 4x light sensitive 12mp camera instead of a 48mp detail sensor. That is the hardware.
If you want images cropped to another aspect ratio afterwards, download something like Open Camera or MX Camera and set a custom resolution.
Sent from my GM1917 using Tapatalk
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
So in general, when stock camera takes 12mp photo on 48mp sensor, it would be using pixel binning, resulting in better looking image, right?
larsdennert said:
Yes and regrettably can't use the other lenses either.
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If yes, then if 3rd party Apps can capture photos at 12mp only, is it using pixel binning on main 48mp sensor or some other tech? If other tech, what is that other tech?
Thanks!
Even non Bayer sensors use four sensors filtered for each color. Generally an RGGB configuration. One sensor with a red filter, two with green and one with blue. They aren't individually addressible. They are summed together in hardware to mix all the colors. A Bayer configuration of groups allows sub addressing of different luminance channels.
larsdennert said:
Even non Bayer sensors use four sensors filtered for each color. Generally an RGGB configuration. One sensor with a red filter, two with green and one with blue. They aren't individually addressible. They are summed together in hardware to mix all the colors. A Bayer configuration of groups allows sub addressing of different luminance channels.
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Thanks for more details. Also, if you could, please answer (maybe you already answered but I did not get it) the doubts I asked above.
Thanks
It might be a custom API that only the manufacturer accesses with their binary or camera app. Google camera2 API may not support it but people do cool stuff with the Google camera app to get at stuff.