Related
just dont buy their Vista! that should teach them something! never piss off thoses that supporting u!
netnerd said:
just dont buy their Vista! that should teach them something! never piss off thoses that supporting u!
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I never planned on it, what a rip off! XP will last another 3-5 years, then I am sure the next PC/MAC will have something better.
netnerd said:
just dont buy their Vista! that should teach them something! never piss off thoses that supporting u!
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OK....you got me....what does this have to do with upgrading your hermes.
maybe that you can not run upgrade software under vista
tco said:
OK....you got me....what does this have to do with upgrading your hermes.
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The pukes in Micro$oft's compliance and licensing department have demanded take down of all ROMs- source of the only stable, up-to-date WM versions of their piece-o-crap OS.
Palm did this to Shadowmite about a year ago after Cingular and Verizon started to complain to Palm. Basically MS is admiting that Gates is the carriers' *****- its a shame that sanctimonious prick elected to breed: conquers the computer world then surrenders it to Ma Bell, her children and their content providers.
Guess it's time to spread some pirated Office 2003 love....
I betcha what bothered them was the progress being made by the XDA Linux project- after seeing what Access released earlier this week M$ ought to be running scared.
I'm running SuSE Linux and have no problem upgrading my roms on my HTC TyTN.
and by the way.... all the little pretty pictures and how VISTA does multi windows with content.. Linux does too! XGL!!!!
This got me thinking.... can we load Linux on our phones?
This is annoying that M$ has to do this. They just cant leave anything alone.
Oh if Linux can do a ROM load then surely OSX can too then.
Yeah spread the good word on the process. In another topic of course(dont wanna de-rail)
This thread needs more LOLZOR1111!!!!
Seriously, wtf?
Don't buy Vista to show them what exactly?
Yeah, let's use a 5 year old OS with easily exploited security issues to teach them what?
The term cutting off your nose to spite your face comes to mind.
Also, they are protecting their legal intellectual property, and they are in the wrong?
What we do here has always been of dubious legal standing. We carry on as long as we are allowed, but we stop when we are told to stop, and that way nobody gets into trouble.
Get a grip on reality people.
Exactly well said. The trouble is instead of a nice comprehensive source of good ROMs made by people who know what they're doing. There'll be a proliferation of hacked-up images with random hacked version numbers scattered across the internet.
Will this result in fewer bricked phones and support calls?
AlanJC said:
Get a grip on reality people.
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I couldn't agree more.
Apparently a lot of people have problems with "reality" nowadays.
Yes, it sucks that the ROMs have to be pulled from the ftp servers.
Yes, Microsoft could do better and show a firmer stand regarding the carriers.
Yes, this online community is very valuable to Microsoft AND the carriers, if they realize it or not.
BUT: there are laws and if Microsoft demands the removal of the ROMs, it is their right to do so, like it or not. They could have used a more "aggressive" approach with their law department but they chose to use a more "soft" approach and this is a very wise decision.
However, Microsoft must realize that such unpopular decisions won't be forgotten and such actions will definetely not make their already bad reputation much better.
Calling for a boycott doesn't help much, I'm pretty sure myself that the carriers are behind the ROM removal, not necessarily Microsoft.
Maybe we should write a letter to the carriers, asking them if they're behind the pressure on Microsoft to have the ROMs removed. If the carriers are blamed instead and their decisions are out in the open, maybe they re-consider because trust me, I would NOT want to be a customer of a carrier who asked Microsoft to remove the ROMs. Definetely not.
personaly i'm not planning on getting vista untill maybe sp4
anyway
xp with 3th party software and no IE is safe enough
vista is mostly 3th party software functionality now as a std. ms thing
and fancy eye candy which linux and macos had for ages
but if ms see that vista is not selling as well as it should
and they connect the dots and form a picture that show that
their pull unoffical roms off sites
there is something wrong with their heads
Vista already not selling as well as it should - it started to show when it was released for volume (corporate) clients, and now its well clear that ordinary users dont rush to buy it despite all PR tsunami unleashed - maybe its "good, advanced, beautiful" and all the buzz, but even thick Joe User sees thats its somewhat lot of problems and complaints floating around.
The whole Vista thing was a reckless scheme - MS spent millions on development, but they lost the clear understanding of why exactly people will want it - on the latest stages it was more of make beleief.
Now they will have to transfer money from other branches, that is more profitable (namely being their Office branch, XBox being not profitable on their own). I think thats why they made it "WM6" (when it was clearly 5.2 originally and still 5.2 in matter of features and internal versioning) - for WM6 they can charge license fees from ODMs as for entirely new OS.
@All
Forget about roms, we will find alternative way to store them, so this is just empty talk. There are free filehosting sites, and other p2p distributing variants, so what's the problem? Microsoft has the rights to ask for deleting the roms, everyone know that. We will continiue what we doing but with difrend way of distributing rom images, thats all. About vista is sucks, you have to confirm every action you do about hunderd times, it works slow even with effects shutted down, and on high end configuration PC, it randomly loose settings, cookies, passwords, favorites, software and other stuff, overall it is unreliable fo usage.
I love to hate MS as much as the rest of you, but everybody needs to step back and take a breath on this one. The reason MS is doing this has nothing to do with piracy, Vista, progress, Linux, taking over the world, Bill Gates, them being money-grubbing pigs, or your grandmother.
The reasoning is simple...under US intellectual property laws, if they are made aware that someone is distributing their intellectual property (like a ROM that contains MS software) and they make no attempt to stop it, they forfeit their rights to that intellectual property. I don't think I need to explain why giving up their rights would be a bad idea for them.
In my experience, companies try to ignore sites like this for as long as they possibly can, because nobody wants to attract the kind of bad press a takedown notice causes. Inevitably, however, things get too big...a site gets a mention in the news, or it becomes the defacto source for ROMs, or it gets frequent mentions in other forums like cingular.com, and the attorneys finally have to face the fact that they can't possibly claim in court that they weren't aware that their IP was being distributed.
All companies do things like this every day to a lot of great sites and forums, not because they are jerks, but because the US legal system requires them to.
In the meantime, we just have to move on and do what everyone else does--find somewhere else to keep the bits
The reasoning is simple...under US intellectual property laws, if they are made aware that someone is distributing their intellectual property (like a ROM that contains MS software) and they make no attempt to stop it, they forfeit their rights to that intellectual property. I don't think I need to explain why giving up their rights would be a bad idea for them.
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Actually that's completely untrue. I think you're thinking of trademarks which do behave in that way. That was the reason for the necessary recent legal cases by Linus over the Linux trademark. There's no such requirement for copyrights or patents.
Not being on the inside it's hard to know the reason for the action: Whether it's the OEM's complaining. I think their logic is that if they only provide updates with new hardware then you'll have no choice but to buy their new hardware. and that people making updates for their older devices are harming their sales figures. they really are that dumb.
The alternative is that MS are annoyed/worried about all the information leaking about WM6 before launch and they simply want to control the release situation.
ivorh said:
Actually that's completely untrue. I think you're thinking of trademarks which do behave in that way. That was the reason for the necessary recent legal cases by Linus over the Linux trademark. There's no such requirement for copyrights or patents.
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Not quite...the nature in which you forfeit rights is different between copyrights and trademarks, but due diligence is required for both. If a known copyright infringement is not pursued within the statute of limitations, implied license is granted, meaning the infringer can essentially distribute at will.
ivorh said:
Actually that's completely untrue. I think you're thinking of trademarks which do behave in that way. That was the reason for the necessary recent legal cases by Linus over the Linux trademark. There's no such requirement for copyrights or patents.
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Not quite...the nature in which you forfeit rights is different between copyrights and trademarks, but due diligence is required for both. If a known copyright infringement is not pursued within the statute of limitations, implied license is granted.
No offence guys but Microsoft or the Vendors wouldn't have given crap about the roms here if it wasn't for the idiots (yes you know who you are) pestering the vendors and Microsoft about support for yet to be released roms. Either bugging them with questions on why something doesn't work anymore, how to use something in the new rom (GPS....), or warrenty repair for f'ing up one's device. Not to mention how pissed they must be for the even bigger idiots who contact Vender A and tell them they installed Vendor A rom on Vender B device
Really what it comes down to is if it costs them money they are going to make a stink and handling service calls for hacked/unsupported roms costs them money. Not to mention how much it would piss off Vendor A to spend money enhancing their rom only to have news sites promoting the rom to other Vendor B devices and have people installing it on Vendor B's device.
That's really what this is all about so if there is anyone to blame in all this, don't blame Microsoft or the Vendors, blame those people because if it wasn't for them, the vendors and Microsoft would have given a sh*t and probably just let things be the way they should be.
Maybe an appropriate response would be to overwhelm MS and the Carriers support systems with complaints about slow, non functioning, unstable software and devices.
The Carriers who actually sell most of us our phones should be ashamed of offering such substandard products. The diference between an "XDA-Developers sourced ROM" and the stock ROM on my device at least is enormous. Yet it was achieved by unpaid amateurs, I mean no disrespect to ROM chefs with this statement.
With the Windows update features built in to WM6 maybe there is a mechanism for MS to offer timely updates/fixes direct to the user. These updates could have incorporated "XDA-Developers" inspired enhancements and bug fixes. Sadly I feel this will not now be the case.
Yes, I can understand the global motives of MS in protecting its intelectual property but I cannot perceive any benefit to MS by exerting its right/might in this case.
</RANT>
Finally today i had enough... I filed a formal complaint with the FTC against motorola and all other mobile device manufacturers out lining the cause and effect of these companies selling us devices that we are made to be only users of rather than owners and administrators the devices we purchased. Nothing will change until we make some one step in and set the rules, i am encouraging everyone here on xda to do the same ... here is a link to the example complaint i filed and the link to the appropriate form to be filed
http://t0dbld.blogspot.com/2011/03/m...otloaders.html
https://www.ftccomplaintassistant.go...d.aspx?Lang=en
Here's some more food for though concerning smartphone security:
http://www.eff.org/deeplinks/2011/03/carrier-intransigence-harms-internet-security
Perhaps we can spin our complaint with this in mind.
Basically since smartphones are essentially computers, I feel we should insist on being able to do what we want with them - Dell, HP, etc can't object when I choose to replace Windows on my PC with Linux, neither should Moto, HTC, etc be able to determine what we can and cannot run.
Also, if my phone has HDMI out, I can easily envision using it as a media player long after it's served its time as a phone.
IMO, people would be far better off signing this petition which will be presented to Motorola to try and persuade them to change their bootloader policies as they have previously promised to do.
It is a direct request to the one organisation who can change the matters for the better - Motorola themselves.
And unlike this thread, it doesn't rely upon subjective argument of entitlement.
Step666 said:
IMO, people would be far better off signing this petition which will be presented to Motorola to try and persuade them to change their bootloader policies as they have previously promised to do.
It is a direct request to the one organisation who can change the matters for the better - Motorola themselves.
And unlike this thread, it doesn't rely upon subjective argument of entitlement.
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first of all is there any harm in both ? secondly i respectfully disagree, some one needs to be put in charge of these things and so far the only thing that governs tech is law suits, as noted above HP did loose to FTC when they tried to deny people from not using windows on there machines, also petitions although the preferred method of hippies and college students do not hold there weight in most courts, i do know from personal exp. as if you really wish i can show you my supreme court case in the state of Michigan and yes years prior we started with a neighborhood petition that didn't even hold up in the local commissions and courts. either way i have signed said petition but i feel that if we get the FTC involved it will help the Petition as eyes will be upon it.... ALSO please keep in mind this is not just motorola they just happen to be better than other companies, jsut like computers we should not have to hack anything for administrator privileges, or to wipe the device and load are own software
But on what grounds would the FTC uphold your complaint?
Just because jailbreaking etc is not illegal, that doesn't give you a right to be able to install custom ROMs onto your handset, nor does it automatically make the measures that companies like Motorola take to prevent modification of their handsets illegal.
You say that the FTC ruled against HP for preventing laptop owners from installing Linux - how come when I Google 'FTC HP Linux', I find nothing relating to that?
Step666 said:
But on what grounds would the FTC uphold your complaint?
Just because jailbreaking etc is not illegal, that doesn't give you a right to be able to install custom ROMs onto your handset, nor does it automatically make the measures that companies like Motorola take to prevent modification of their handsets illegal.
You say that the FTC ruled against HP for preventing laptop owners from installing Linux - how come when I Google 'FTC HP Linux', I find nothing relating to that?
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this is not about jail breaking and if you make it about such it will not get looked at, this is about being sold a device that we are not given administrative right to or the ability to wipe and install any software we want on it.... You wouldn't stand for this on your home pc would you ?
Because the ruling was not about linux, it was about being forced to have windows and paying for the licensing, it became much bigger than just hp as well but it is there including the end results of hp having to offer it with out windows and to refund people's money that did not agree to windows terms and returned the license
t0dbld said:
this is about being sold a device that we are not given administrative right to or the ability to wipe and install any software we want on it...
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Right, ok, fine.
But that detail aside, my question still remains unanswered - why would they rule in your favour on that basis?
In what way are you entitled to be able to completely wipe your phone and install whatever you want onto it?
t0dbld said:
Because the ruling was not about linux, it was about being forced to have windows and paying for the licensing, it became much bigger than just hp as well but it is there including the end results of hp having to offer it with out windows and to refund people's money that did not agree to windows terms and returned the license
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That's different then - it's one thing for HP to force customers to pay the licence fee for a copy of Windows they don't need/want but no-one is being forced to pay for an Android licence here, Motorola et al's practices are not costing the end user money.
I'm just trying to understand why you believe the FTC would consider your complaint, let alone side against the manufacturers.
look dude your still not getting it and thats ok, do it or dont, try to help or dont, have a good day
only a matter of time b4 these guys realize locked bootloaders dont help any1..
Wow, with malware so bad that sometimes they're sending "premium" text messages at 40 dollars a pop those low end android devices aren't looking so low end. With apps from ringtone downloaders to battery managers to guitar hero rip-offs getting malware android is really hitting the dirt. Even if sales-wise they're doing great android is taking some major blows to the legal department and now even publicity-wise with their childish approach to the patents. This malware is just another part of the tower of android crumbling. i guess that's what happens when you build a multi-million dollar building on a foundation of jell-o. I for one am interested in seeing how google recovers from all of this mess.
So far all of the Android malware I've heard of has used the rageagainstthecage exploit, which only works on older froyo ROMs. Just make sure you buy an up to date Android phone from a manufacturer that keeps their phones updated and you'll be fine.
On the Evo 4G, for example, HTC waited until there was a patch for Gingerbreak before they pushed the GB OTA. That was months ago and the new firmware still has not been rooted.
Smh...
16% of PC users are unaffected by viruses/malware.
I wouldn't buy another android device regardless of manufacturer or updates. There's still malware on android utilizing other exploits, looking into the OS itself they could pretty much get away with it completely legally without issues and with no market authorization... Its scary.
Vetvito, the great thing is that my PC, like most, comes with virus protection. Does not have direct access to my bill, and anyone with an education exceeding the third grade can prevent at least the vast majority of viruses. My wife got a vibrant for awhile and downloaded an angry birds guide and the next month we had 80 dollars in charges from fox mobile group. Its insane how bad google manages... Well... The whole mobile sect.
Well, technically everyone with an education exceeding the third grade can read what permissions an android app is asking for and can figure out that app XYZ has no business messing with your account list, contacts or text messages. Everyone is entitled to an opinion though, Android isn't perfect but it's silly saying one OS is more resistant to malware than another. The only thing that really matters is how many people use it, the more users the more people looking for vulnerabilities.
^ well put. Hence the 16% of PC users are unaffected.
xHausx said:
Well, technically everyone with an education exceeding the third grade can read what permissions an android app is asking for and can figure out that app XYZ has no business messing with your account list, contacts or text messages. Everyone is entitled to an opinion though, Android isn't perfect but it's silly saying one OS is more resistant to malware than another. The only thing that really matters is how many people use it, the more users the more people looking for vulnerabilities.
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what's more ridiculous is that tired argument. Android is open to malware because there's no app certification in the marketplace, there's no real failsafes built into the OS until after the fact, and because, well, as everyone is so proud of, its open source. Wp7 and ios are locked and thoroughly so to avoid such complications. That's the benefits you get from building your own OS rather than borrowing code that's readily available and largely outdated. IOS for awhile had a larger userbase than android. I never heard any peep about malware there... android is just a poorly built and even lesser optimized OS.
This will be my last reply since it's pointless to really continuing this conversation, but I will fill you in on a little fact that you seem to have missed. When it's possible to open up a web page and have your device jailbroken/rooted whatever, that is a very serious security hole. That means anyone can do the same thing without your permission.
I have never seen a method to root an android phone using the above method yet it's fairly common with iOS. I even remember hearing about a way to take complete control over an iPhone 4 by doing nothing more than sending it a text message, if that's not a serious security hole than I don't know what is. So if you are actually interested in using a secure OS and not just here to troll and bash android, you may want to do a little more homework on just how secure each platform is.
Take the Pwn2Own competition for example, "During the first day of the competition Safari and Internet Explorer were defeated by researchers. Safari was version 5.0.3 installed on a fully-patched Mac OS X 10.6.6.[23] French security firm VUPEN was first to attack the browser, and five seconds after the browser visited its specially-crafted malicious web page, it had both launched the platform calculator application (a standard harmless payload to demonstrate that arbitrary code has been executed) and written a file to the hard disk (to demonstrate that the sandbox had been bypassed).
The second and last browser to fall for the day was a 32-bit Internet Explorer 8 installed on 64-bit Windows 7 Service Pack 1.[23] Security researcher Stephen Fewer of Harmony Security was successful in exploiting IE. Just as with Safari, this was demonstrated by running Windows' calculator program and writing a file to the hard disk."
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pwn2Own
Google's Chrome browser was the only one that was not compromised.
An excellent explanation of just how vulnerable iOS and the iphone are. Just to throw in my own 2 cents, I have used Android for the last 3 years now. I have rarely if ever utilized a security program, and have NEVER had any of my phones compromised.
I'm not by any means saying it doesn't happen, I simply think that if your careful, and paying attention to what your doing, then you shouldn't have any problems.
I predict 3 out of 10 iPhone users will be sodomized with a Zhu Zhu Pet next year.
SUCCESSOR said:
I predict 3 out of 10 iPhone users will be sodomized with a Zhu Zhu Pet next year.
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Fantastic. Perfect phrasing.
You can judge an OS's success by the amount of malware targeting it.
Windows being the most popular OS, has the most malware.
Interestingly the most compromised OS on the internet used in botnet attacks is Linux, simply because of the numbers of computers running it.
So any successful product will be targetted, even Macs have viruses despite what apple fanboi's would have you believe.
So for IOS and Android to be targeted it reflects the market share of those products, their success, and as has been already noted, most vulnerabilities are specific to earlier versions of Android.
Any OS that is so unpopular it's market share has plummeted to 5.8% and continues to fall isn't likely to be worth targeting, so WP7 is pretty safe simply due to lack of interest in it from both consumers and malware writers.
It's a bit like people who run Win98 still for security reasons, despite it being easy to compromise, because so few people still use it, it is no longer being actively targeted.
It's been predicted... By whom exactly? I don't see any links in your posts.
Predicted by antivirus/antimalware companies wanting to scare you into buying their products? Products which may, but totally may not actually protect you (remember most of these are reactive software, they can't protect you from something they don't know about)?
xHausx said:
Google's Chrome browser was the only one that was not compromised.
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and the reason for that is the developer of the chrome exploit was led to believe it was not valid, it turns out that it was but the developer of the exploit had already given it to google for $$$
Hence the patch frenzy just before Pwn2OWn.
xaccers said:
So any successful product will be targetted, even Macs have viruses despite what apple fanboi's would have you believe.
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To be fair OS X does not have any.
If you're really paranoid about malware on android, you can download virus protection from the Market, like Lookout or Anti-virus from AVG.
Don't know how effective they are, but at least you won't be effected by any known malware out there.
But not really needed I think, check permission the app asks for and if they make sense, you should be pretty safe.
Also I think Google is on the ball when it comes to this.
Tone_ said:
To be fair OS X does not have any.
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That'll be your little secret then
Tone_ said:
To be fair OS X does not have any.
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Wrong.
http://www.macforensicslab.com/Prod...in_page=document_general_info&products_id=174
http://www.theinquirer.net/inquirer/news/2029303/virus-mac-invulnerable
Thank you. come again.
Also, Op, baby, Stop projecting your Wp7 buyers remorse onto everyone else. Yes we get it you are unhappy with your sucky boring spoonfed o/s. move on from the denial stage it and learn your lesson for your next phone, cause no one really cares. Easily aviodable and fixable Malware on Android is still better than stuipifyingly boring wp7. You can console yourself that maybe Wp8 or whatever wil be better, or maybe you can change to an iphone and lecture us on how your device is "better" than our various devices cause it has a shiny fruity logo and you can jailbreak it but until then yourphonesucks.
XOXOXO
z33dev33l said:
Wow, with malware so bad that sometimes they're sending "premium" text messages at 40 dollars a pop those low end android devices aren't looking so low end. With apps from ringtone downloaders to battery managers to guitar hero rip-offs getting malware android is really hitting the dirt. Even if sales-wise they're doing great android is taking some major blows to the legal department and now even publicity-wise with their childish approach to the patents. This malware is just another part of the tower of android crumbling. i guess that's what happens when you build a multi-million dollar building on a foundation of jell-o. I for one am interested in seeing how google recovers from all of this mess.
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I'm gonna go ahead and tempt karma here...
Malware only hits people who download stupid and questionable ****. I know this is harsh, but people bring it on themselves.
As for older versions of Android, everyone should be on cm7 anyway, unless they like their phone to be slow.
Sent from my HTC Glacier using XDA Premium App
I'm surprised they say only 3 out of 10, I would have said 50% with the total lack of control and approvals required to get apps on the marketplace. Apple certainly do a better job of controlling what is allowed live than any Android store.
I ran into this article today and I wanted to see what the people on XDA think about it. This company is working on a Android phone that it's primary purpose is to protect the users privacy.
Here's the link: http://mobile.theverge.com/2014/1/1...nn-silent-circle-geeksphone-blackphone-launch
Read the article, watch the video and let me know what you think.
Sent from GNote 3 rooted with kingo.
Saw news about this and came here to seek out does any1 have opinions about it.
i wonder, does the safety come from hardware or is it the OS what makes this so safe.. if it is the OS, i hope some1 smart enough makes custom rom for this.
I really don't see how this phone is gonna change anything. Apps and websites have keyloggers, You still need a carrier to get service from and they have control of all your traffic. What about radio frequencies that can be intercepted, IP addresses, GPS chips sending signals to satellites, baseband and firmware are connected thru the cell towers of the carrier. I'm starting to think this phone is a scam.
They said nothing about how they're dealing with all this. They are probably using the whole NSA scandal momentum to fool people into believing they are safe if they buy this phone.
Sent from GNote 3 rooted with kingo.
I saw an article about this venture also. This is a good thing. If he gets press about this phone, maybe other venders will take notice and start building in privacy features as well. :good:
I don't see the need for new hardware here. If they really want to secure something, they could create a mod for Android, that could be installed on a variety of devices for example.
Besides, if they encrypt telephony, messages and stuff, they will need to be decrypted again - but the question is where and how? I bet they won't have any hardware encryption module and even if they do, it will make communication with other phones impossible. Software encryption means other phones will need to install some additional software to communicate with the Blackphone and it might be a bit inconvenient.
orangek3nny said:
I don't see the need for new hardware here. If they really want to secure something, they could create a mod for Android, that could be installed on a variety of devices for example.
Besides, if they encrypt telephony, messages and stuff, they will need to be decrypted again - but the question is where and how? I bet they won't have any hardware encryption module and even if they do, it will make communication with other phones impossible. Software encryption means other phones will need to install some additional software to communicate with the Blackphone and it might be a bit inconvenient.
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That's a good point. how a non blackphone device is gonna decipher the encryption? how is it going to get the key? How can a non blackphone device even a establish the same "secure" connection?
Sent from GNote 3 rooted with kingo.
Andronote3 said:
That's a good point. how a non blackphone device is gonna decipher the encryption? how is it going to get the key? How can a non blackphone device even a establish the same "secure" connection?
Sent from GNote 3 rooted with kingo.
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I think you are missing the point. As you or I may not NEED this kind of security, I'm sure you can think of someone who does.
Obviously, there would be two levels of privacy/security... Connections between 2 black phones and everything else. So who utilize a black phone? How about corporations and governments? Law offices, professional sports teams, or doctors and hospitals.
Now, even though I do not NEED this, if it was affordable, I would heavily consider it.
Sent from my Nexus 5 using XDA Premium 4 mobile app
JamieFL said:
I think you are missing the point. As you or I may not NEED this kind of security, I'm sure you can think of someone who does.
Obviously, there would be two levels of privacy/security... Connections between 2 black phones and everything else. So who utilize a black phone? How about corporations and governments? Law offices, professional sports teams, or doctors and hospitals.
Now, even though I do not NEED this, if it was affordable, I would heavily consider it.
Sent from my Nexus 5 using XDA Premium 4 mobile app
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I understand what you are saying and I completely agree with you. It looks like a device that corporations and the government would "benefit" more than regular users. Either way, It won't fix 90% of all the problems people face when it comes to staying safe against privacy/security breaches. I truly believe that they are using the whole NSA scandal momentum to make people believe that they are safe/secured if they buy this phone.
P.S: Nice quotes.
I saw this phone.
It isn't an answer to every privacy issue.
What its an answer to is, not having to agree to an android apps permissions to gain access to the app.
These apps don't make their money off the app sales, they make their money sending information to retailers.
Retailers own the world.
The question I still pose is... What's wrong with retailers knowing where you are?
There's nothing you can do about the government. They won't let us make things that are government proof, nor would they (The retailers ) want to.
But, what's wrong with these apps fine tuning my specific desires to my Location?
You can't stop people from stealing your identity. The hacker/firewall paradox is, for every walk you build, they will build a taller ladder.
The only thing really close to full privacy in data sending is, that light source that sends data. It's a light bulb, and the light has data in it, a sensor receives it. It can be held within the walls of a room. But that only effects a closed circuit type system. If that light source is connected to the Internet, then game over.
Why do you think record companies and movie companies keep their computer systems offline and deal in only physical media? A hacker will get into anything I'd you give him the tools and time.
This phone gives a sense of security that is non existant
You've Just Been Tapatold ♧♢dbombROMv3.4♤♡
My Theme ( Taking Requests )
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=2658527
SaintCity86 said:
I saw this phone.
It isn't an answer to every privacy issue.
What its an answer to is, not having to agree to an android apps permissions to gain access to the app.
These apps don't make their money off the app sales, they make their money sending information to retailers.
Retailers own the world.
The question I still pose is... What's wrong with retailers knowing where you are?
There's nothing you can do about the government. They won't let us make things that are government proof, nor would they (The retailers ) want to.
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=2658527
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nailed it
The problem is Android itself. Thanks to Xprivacy, it's a lot easier to control what leaks out of your device. Personally I'd rather see more encryption mechanisms than this. FFOS seems to be on the right path
There Is nothing you can do to stop identity theft.
Nothing.
And there is nothing you can do to do the government from tapping your lines.
You want a safer form of communicating, send Voice recordings over text.
That's an entirety separate warrant, and harder to get. Other than that. It's hopeless
You've Just Been Tapatold ♧♢dbombROMv3.4♤♡
My Theme ( Taking Requests )
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=2658527
d1rX said:
FFOS seems to be on the right path
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I think you mean FOSS[1] = Free and Open Source Software. Anyway, I fully agree, in fact, that is the ONLY way. Closed source encryption programs can't be 100% trusted by definition. There might be security flaws, intentional or not.
Anyway. the NSA has backdoors to every operating system[2], so if you're really a target, they get you. Also, there are more than enough security holes in the layers under the operating system[3].
I think what these phones are supposed to do is bring end-to-end encryption for e.g. industry users so they don't get spied on. The NSA and the US government can get their hands on encryption keys for servers like in Lavabits case[4]. But this is the transport encryption. The data is, if not otherwise secured, available in plain text on the servers of providers. This also means, the officials can decrypt ANY data that comes in, not just the one of actual targets.
Now, end-to-end encryption makes sure even the provider can't see your data in plain text because you encrypt and decrypt it on your device. What Blackphone does is, it uses the apps from Silent Circle, a closed source encryption programm for VoIP and messages. Although the owner of that company is the well trusted cryptographer Phil Zimmerman, one can never be sure.
That's a good point. how a non blackphone device is gonna decipher the encryption? how is it going to get the key? How can a non blackphone device even a establish the same "secure" connection?
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You can install and use Silent Circle on any(ok, a lot of) phone(s). Just make sure you don't have additional malicious software installed. Any yes, it costs $100/year or so. And you get a subscription for SpiderOak, sort of a Dropbox but they encrypt the data before uploading. Any you get a better overview over what app uses what permissions. A few extra tweaks basically.
Alternative: Android Phone with CyanogenMod/Replica. TextSecure for messages, RedPhone for VoiP and owncloud for files. Way cheaper too, and open source, also made by well respected cryptographers like Moxie Marlinspike[5]
[1] de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Free/Libre_Open_Source_Software
[2] zerohedge.com/news/2013-09-08/nsa-has-full-back-door-access-iphone-blackberry-and-android-smartphones-documents-re"]backdoors to every operating system
[3] forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=2530044
[4] techdirt.com/articles/20131002/17443624734/lavabit-tried-giving-feds-its-ssl-key-11-pages-4-point-type-feds-complained-that-it-was-illegible.shtml
[5] thoughtcrime.org
if they want to spy on us they can ... that's it...
More info?
Hi all - looking for more info on this phone - just joined XDADev to post this.
Specifically, what brands might this hardware be found under? Know it's a Tinno S8515 but have yet to find out anything about that; seems like Tinno generally makes phones for other companies?
Any help is appreciated!
Best,
-Cx
:cyclops::cyclops::cyclops:
The greatest challenge to securing a phone is not the OS or the apps running on it, it's the baseband. We have known for well over 30+ yeasr how to harden a *nix based system (like AOS), but we haven't even started to question WTF is going on in the closed source 10-100 MB baseband RTOS, which have fulll access to your entire FS and the most important phone operations, like SIM, RF, EMMC etc etc.
Only forcing the corrupt modem OEM's to release the sources of the Baseband firmware could improve the situation. This will never happen, unless there is another baseband Snowden out there somewhere...
We already know that the BP/CP FW is extremely insecure, and relies almost solely on obscurity as their main mechanism of protection. If this was not the case, the iPhone unlock developers would have been fekked long time ago, and the rest of us would sit around with SIM/network locked bricks filling up our bookshelves.
Unfortunately the greatest majority of the millions of XDA members are completely carefree about this issue and are only happy as long as they can "tweak some ROMs". So this will never be the place to find/see any serious baseband reversing, no matter how important it would be from a security standpoint.
So to summarize, your Qualcomm baseband will continue to send your exact GPS coordinates to the network provider at will, without you ever knowing, and without anyone (here) caring. So goes for the FM transmitter that is part of the baseband FW in both Intel and Qualcomm based phones. Do you have control over that? Never.
Only a serious long term spectrum analysis study could reveal whats going on there, where and when you're not (able) to watch.
This phone is the biggest scam lol.
hyshys said:
Saw news about this and came here to seek out does any1 have opinions about it.
i wonder, does the safety come from hardware or is it the OS what makes this so safe.. if it is the OS, i hope some1 smart enough makes custom rom for this.
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I was wondering this too. If it is only the rom (just like the $1300 pwnphone). It should be port-able
iliass01 said:
I was wondering this too. If it is only the rom (just like the $1300 pwnphone). It should be port-able
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Blackphone. - no hardware security, just software, and most of it is NOT open source. Some here (@SaintCity86 , @repat) has their points, and they are mostly right! If you want some security (and I said some!!!), then get rid of most of your apps (permission check and some common sense), all Google apps (yes, all of them), install a paid (not free) and high quality VPN software, don't use the phone feature (only data sim-prepaid), get an internet phone number (with no personal details), use end to end encrypted apps to make calls and send and receive texts, install Xposed and Xprivacy (or any other variant) and limit even more the apps you have on your phone. Don't use it as your only phone, but as a secure device and share your number and other infos with trusted people! In this case, maybe, you will be able to add some layer of security and actually be able to use it. And most important, don't give your phone in the hands of anyone! It is a bit paranoid, but it's the only way! But, don't be fooled! You can have some security, only if you stay under the radar, and don't gain some attention. If yes, then you have no luck! Personally, I have seen the Blackphone, and tested it for some time, and I am not really convinced it can be trusted.
Good luck!
Andronote3 said:
I really don't see how this phone is gonna change anything. Apps and websites have keyloggers, You still need a carrier to get service from and they have control of all your traffic. What about radio frequencies that can be intercepted, IP addresses, GPS chips sending signals to satellites, baseband and firmware are connected thru the cell towers of the carrier. I'm starting to think this phone is a scam.
They said nothing about how they're dealing with all this. They are probably using the whole NSA scandal momentum to fool people into believing they are safe if they buy this phone.
Sent from GNote 3 rooted with kingo.
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Would just like to correct this common misconception, GPS is one way.
GPS receivers as found in your phones, or navigation systems, receives GPS signals only. Nothing gets sent to satellites in this process, the algorithm is purely one way.
Perhaps upon reading that, you call to mind Thomas Jefferson pulling out his Android to thwart impeding forces. I actually like that idea, but I know that the time in which John Locke wrote the contributing phrase was much different than today. It was a time of change and also a time when people realized their full potential to make a difference. In the spirit of our Founding Fathers, and in an exercise of my own Personal Liberties, I have started a petition to require cell phone carriers to allow bootloader unlock on any Android device that is not under contract or subsidy. Many of you will know immediately what this means, and the exponential benefits of such a law. Many of you will flip to the next activity complacently believing this does not affect you. If you do not understand, I wish to enlighten you as to how this affects each and every Android user in the world. Signing the petition takes only a few moments of your time and adds to the greater good of our technology and innovation as a Nation.
So what exactly does this “Bootloader Unlock” thing mean?
Well, that is a great question. Most simply put, according to Motorla’s website, “bootloader is a little bit of code that tells your device's operating system how to boot up”. That does not mean much to the average user, I am sure. What it means in my own words is it is a piece of code that dictates what I can and cannot do, in terms of software modification, to my own personal Android device. On my wireless provider whom I will call Big Red, their requirement is that OEMs (Original Equipment Manufacturers, or simply phone makers) lock this bit of code to prevent modification by the end-user or customer. I am certain, to those that do not wish to modify their devices, this sounds like a good fail-safe to avoid breaking their devices. I am also certain that to those like myself, those who have the experience and knowledge to do things like flash custom firmware or software and modify our devices to suit our own personal taste and needs, this is a huge roadblock and an impediment on what we can do with our own personal property and how it can be improved. In order to modify system files as the user sees fit, a thing called Root is required. Root is, most simply privileged access to a phones file system. A locked bootloader means that in order to gain “Root” access, a security exploit must be found and exploited in order to modify system files. These exploits are literally holes that must be (and typically are) patched in software updates sent out by the service providers or manufacturers to protect the end-user. While the efforts of the security experts are always going to be required to keep us safe and updated, I personally do not want to rely on someone to hack the software so it can be modified. This should be an inherent ability of any user who does not have a subsidy or contract obligation. I also feel that any device that can be updated by the user allows the people who develop for Android to Innovate and push our technology farther forward. When manufacturers are required to lock down a device, ultimately, the user is the one who loses. My first Android device, the Droid 1 or A855 ran an under-volted overclocked kernel (simply another piece of code that tells a device how to boot and how to run its processor among other things) that ran 1.7ghz on it’s ~600mhz processor. I used that phone at least twice as long as I would have if it hadn’t been bootloader unlocked. Also, on the note of the OG Droid, I can say that this was the phone that helped Verizon to compete with the Iphone, bolstering the customer base and creating mass knowledge of the Andoid platform. This was done with a bootloader-unlocked device. It seems that once the market was realized, bootloader locking became the normative. The Droid line has been bootloader-locked ever since. There are several examples of the same hardware being sold, under different names, with the bootloader-unlockable right out of the box. The most recent example of this is the Motorola xt1250, or Moto Maxx (US CDMA). The international version of the same phone, the xt1225 is also bootloader-unlockable. All three are known as the Quark. They are identical in hardware aside from exteriors. Big Red required their version to have the bootloader locked. There is no way to have it unlocked for now.
So Why Would I Want to Sign This Petition?
Honestly, you may not care about Android at all. You could conceivably have never been interested, and care less. However, the technology available to you today is available because of innovations and advancements that have been made across a wide technological array of development. Android is no different. Love that Halo or Heads Up inspired feature ____ manufacturer just put on your new phone? People who develop are to be thanked. The possibilities are endless for what can be done and applied across many platforms. The future of mobile technology can be greatly advanced by creating open access for all who are inclined.
Catharsis
Okay, I admit it. It is really, really unlikely our politicians actually act upon this petition, even if 100,000 signatures are reached. As much as I like to think our law should “fix” things that are wrong, I can agree with one of my favorite developers from back in the day, @adrenalyne, when he said [government typically does not, and should not interfere with private business.] I can agree with that on the same grounds by which I feel we should be granted bootloader unlock on…if and only, if, no one’s rights are infringed upon. I feel it is all of our right to do what we please with our own personal property. There was a great analogy given on XDA Developers forum in the bounty thread where this all started by @Wynnded In essence, it said the carrier provides the highway, the OEM provides the device, but it is the carrier’s highway, so if the carrier requires the OEM to lock it down so be it. Personally, I feel that if the carrier has a highway, it is a toll-road, as I pay for my service. I purchase my vehicle outright, so if I want to modify it, and I pay for my vehicle, making no obligation to said toll operator, it is not within their range of rights to tell me I cannot modify my vehicle in the way I see fit. Thank you for your time. –kitcostantino @ medicbeard on twitter #unlockthedroids
https://petitions.whitehouse.gov/pe...e-not-subsized-or-attatched-contract/QfTmsspy
Original thread:
http://forum.xda-developers.com/dro...unlock-bootloader-root-turbo-t2927958/page115
Sources:
https://motorola-global-portal.custhelp.com/app/standalone/bootloader/unlock-your-device-a
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rooting_(Android_OS)
I ask for no donations, nor anything else. Simply share this if you feel so compelled. Really, it hurts nothing even if you don’t.
#unlockthedroids