Database Info

signatures against knox .. read .. & help us..

hello!
we all make a great community. many of whom will you be unhappy with Samsung's initiative to use the consequences KNOX we already know ..
if we want to be prisoners, we bought the iphone ...
so.. this is the idea:
SAMSUNG: Remove the Knox system. On recently in new Software Updates.
http://goo.gl/kbIAyj
link original: http://www.htcmania.com/showthread.php?t=690492

Won't happen the rreason is good why the use it. For safety
However it's not liked for developers
Sent from my GT-I9505 using Tapatalk 4

Neahhhh.... We are too small for this big game is up to us to find a solution
Sent from my GT-I9100 using xda app-developers app

excellent idea; I will be joining the effort .
Sent from my GT-I9505

+1 We have to share this petition and publish in different media, forums, blogs etc... By the way signing and moving wont stop some people to find a B plan or solution without the help of Samsung.
Im seriously thinking of changing my s4 to a nexus 5... If we wanted propietary software wed have bought a nice iphone

Hate to say this but this petition thing will never work. Sorry but spinky360 was right.
If you really wanted freedom from locked bootloaders and all that, buy a nexus. That's just how it is.
I wish you luck. You're gonna need it
Sent from my GT-I9505 using Tapatalk 4

chickentuna said:
Hate to say this but this petition thing will never work. Sorry but spinky360 was right.
If you really wanted freedom from locked bootloaders and all that, buy a nexus. That's just how it is.
I wish you luck. You're gonna need it
Sent from my GT-I9505 using Tapatalk 4
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Would have bought Nexus if, 1) Samsung had been straight with its end users at the time of purchase and 2) seeing as Kitkat update to S4 will also region lock the device =(
I am now rocking an HTC one. I like it.

chickentuna said:
Hate to say this but this petition thing will never work. Sorry but spinky360 was right.
If you really wanted freedom from locked bootloaders and all that, buy a nexus. That's just how it is.
I wish you luck. You're gonna need it
Sent from my GT-I9505 using Tapatalk 4
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Well I don’t agree that we cannot make a change. If you read a book like The Tipping Point: How Little Things Can Make a Big Difference , you will come to see that even though Samsung spend around 4 billion $ for marketing , the final say is in the hand of the consumers . Currently if you look around the s4 forum, the note 3 forum, and other forums around of the web you will see that people are unsatisfied with what Samsung is doing, and they are advising people away from Samsung.
For one, I know that I can directly influence 50 of my friends and I made sure to contact each and every one of them about Samsung new policies and advised them against any future purchase of a Samsung device. I also contacted some blogs explaining the issues that we have with Samsung - I have yet to hear a word from them - so even though Samsung can pay its way around the web to silence some critiques , it cannot affect the social binding , and the negative social vibe generated around its products . So let’s wait and see if Samsung will stay arrogant and fall like blackberry, nokia , palm … and any other too big for consumer company did , or whether they are going to start making some changes .

63or63 said:
hello!
we all make a great community. many of whom will you be unhappy with Samsung's initiative to use the consequences KNOX we already know ..
if we want to be prisoners, we bought the iphone ...
so.. this is the idea:
SAMSUNG: Remove the Knox system. On recently in new Software Updates.
http://goo.gl/kbIAyj
link original: http://www.htcmania.com/showthread.php?t=690492
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Pointless. Millions of phones are sold and only a hand full of rooters.

chickentuna said:
Hate to say this but this petition thing will never work. Sorry but spinky360 was right.
If you really wanted freedom from locked bootloaders and all that, buy a nexus. That's just how it is.
I wish you luck. You're gonna need it
Sent from my GT-I9505 using Tapatalk 4
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
man!
I buy a samsung galaxy from the first that came out! always done with what I please! ROM metia you were pre-beta just to try!
with this, we put a barrier samsung and limits us to do what they want!
where it stayed that have Android to be free?
you say you buy a Nexus if I do not go through what we are subjected samsung .. do not you think you're thinking the wrong way? you are undergoing something you limited without any claim?
rings at David vs. Goliath, but at least you will know that there are a handful of unhappy with this new security policy, which on one hand is very good, but on the other, baaaaaaad!
we know that many end users do not even know it's a ROM, let alone answer if you have rooteado or not .. but we are the damned geeks what we like tinkering with what we buy ..
that's the point. perhaps not even make this request out of the desk, but at least we did not stay silent.

For one, the English version of the petition is rather unreadable due to poor punctuation and grammatical errors.
But the real problem is that KNOX itself isn't the problem but how Samsung has decided to inform the companies that handle the warranty repairs. Their line is simply "if there are any 0x1 flags then no warranty". The KNOX flag itself should only mean one thing: that the device was tampered with and its security compromised (important information for corporate IT departments) but it should have no bearing to hardware repairs as these are two separate things.

Done
Enviado do meu GT-I9505 utilizando Tapatalk 4

I think this "petition" threads should be closed and deleted on XDA ... it obviously never changed anything. I signed so many and it never helped (last one was "HTC One X S-Off petition"). I dont think Samsung nor HTC gives a **** about flasher and custom ROM users like us. They need us just for beta testing when they throw us some "leaks" (like a bone to a dog).

Petition

Hi guys,
i just wanted to know if there's a way to send a petition with a lot of signatures to samsung , against knox and warranty checker.

I see what you're trying to do but Samsung won't care
if Samsung cared about users then we wouldn't have those things in the first place(or at least they would have been implemented differently)
Sent from my GT-I9500 using Tapatalk

hate this kind of thing , i will just move to sell this device..android is open. They are making it close.. i will just buy a nexus device next time

and it gets worst with the region lock on unlocked devices
i mean why the F*** sell unlocked devices if they're still locked, samsung is little by little taking away user freedom
so im going Sony next year, i would now but money is short
Sent from my GT-I9500 using Tapatalk

i will just get a nexus device.. nothing else.

there is an ongoing petition against knox in the general forum ;you can join the effort and feel free to create another one i m sure to support your quest

carmeloseven said:
i will just get a nexus device.. nothing else.
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Click to collapse
Nexus is also a locked down device IMO, no removable battery, no extSD card, poor camera.
I'm also going to jump ship to Sony.

difyel said:
there is an ongoing petition against knox in the general forum ;you can join the effort and feel free to create another one i m sure to support your quest
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Seriously?
Samsung will wipe their ass with our petitions....

Correct me if I'm wrong but you guys jumping ship to sony, aren't sony devices bootloader locked as well? And unlocking it leaves a permanent mark which cannot be reverted. Therefore, voiding your warranty
Sent from my GT-I9505 using Tapatalk

Dean-xXx said:
Seriously?
Samsung will wipe their ass with our petitions....
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Probably but it s more about creating brand awareness .Also pragmatically speaking a company which is snob vis a vis its consumers will fail . Reality check Blackberry , you can visit the crackberry forum to see the level of unhappiness consumers had to understand why this company which had only deaf ears to its consumers is going bankrupt .

Truth about Samsung Knox.

I heard good informtaions about Knox.
I live in South Korea so all informations may not for your Samsung.(But i believe samsung do not treat different by region...)
All informations are heard from Samsung Electronics Service Center Engineer
1.Restore KNOX Warranty Void Stat is possible. Samsung Electronics Service Center in Korea have KNOX Warranty Void reset tools. but only a few have.[In Korea, there are over 100 service centers.]
2. If you do Kies Emergency Firmware Recovery, KNOX Warranty Void state can change to 0x1.[Not all, but a guy using Galaxy S4 LTE-A had this situation. so he change Mainboard]
Samsung knows it, so they don't care about KNOX Warranty Void state when you have software problem or hardware problem. But they care Flash Counts.
I think service role is different by regions... In Korea law, phones comes with a full 1 year warranty.{Except boke by users}.
for cost repair service, Engineers should proof that phone was broke by User. so if they can't check[Like bootloader vaporize] or this situations can be appear naturally, They provide free service in 1 year.
[Except when engineers detect Custom Binary State is not official or rooting, Custom Roms]
Like He used strange custom roms so the wifi chips break. but he erase Custom Binary Count and update movinand firmware by Odin, Everything reset. So he can get free service.
So, do not care about KNOX. Just enjoy custom firmware.(Except Someone need KNOX)

I today emailed to Turkish service.. So waiting for response. I will tell soon.

Emergency firmware recovery is when my knox was tripped. ..
Sent from my SM-N9005 using Tapatalk

what about the warranty bit in samsung note 3 n900 exynos ? same or not ? thanks

semeru said:
what about the warranty bit in samsung note 3 n900 exynos ? same or not ? thanks
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I think it will be same in SM-N900. Treat different by region, device is kind of crazy ㅡ_ㅡ;;;;;;;

k939699 said:
I think it will be same in SM-N900. Treat different by region, device is kind of crazy ㅡ_ㅡ;;;;;;;
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Click to collapse
Thanks, I will try to ask samsung service center in my country later :thumbup:
Sent from my SM-N900 using XDA Premium 4 mobile app

k939699 said:
I heard good informtaions about Knox.
I live in South Korea so all informations may not for your Samsung.(But i believe samsung do not treat different by region...)
All informations are heard from Samsung Electronics Service Center Engineer
1.Knox warranty restore is possible with special tools. but only a few Service Center have tools.
2. If you do Kies Emergency Firmware Recovery, with quite many probability, KNOX can be 0x1
because of this, Samsung do not care about Knox warranty.(It means KNOX can't effect at your 1 year device warranty)
So, do not care about KNOX. Just enjoy custom firmware.(Except Someone need KNOX)
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I just have a big grin in my face :laugh::laugh::laugh:
Thats why i know nobody who sent his phone in with 0x1, and didnt get a free repair. but i know a lot people who did (i know one person who failed at that point, but his binary status was custom and knox 0x1 tho)

Have people read the blog on the samsungknox-website?
From the post "About rooting Samsung KNOX-enabled devices and the KNOX warranty void bit"
"Submitted by Peng Ning (VP, Enterprise Security Group) on Wed, 12/04/2013 - 12:40"
When it comes to rooting, there have been some questions regarding Samsung’s KNOX-enabled devices and if they can, or should, be rooted at all. From Samsung’s perspective, the short answer is yes, but it is important to take into account the end user’s situation since device rooting should be evaluated on a case-by-case basis due to conflicting requirements.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Indicating that individual might want and should be able to root, but the enterprises should not have to deal. Right?
KNOX-enabled devices allow a customized OS kernel to boot which allows individuals to run customized Android systems.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
the “KNOX Warranty Void” bit (or simply KNOX bit) is used to detect if a non-KNOX kernel has been loaded on the device. [...] If a non-KNOX boot loader or kernel has been put on the device, KNOX can no longer guarantee the security of the KNOX Container. [...] There are two possible scenarios: first, a new KNOX Container can no longer be created on such a device; and second, the data encrypted and stored in an existing KNOX Container can no longer be retrieved. Everything else should work just as before.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Another post have information about CF-AutoRoot, and a link to instruction.
Cant post links yet, but googleing their posts title will get you there.
I might be daft, but it looks official.

Have we all thought about this:
"KNOX Warranty" means that KNOX can warrant the system is secure. "
instead of "device hardware warranty".
Sent from my SM-N9005 using xda app-developers app

https://www.samsungknox.com/en/blog...ox-enabled-devices-and-knox-warranty-void-bit
There is the link for those that actually want to read it
https://www.samsungknox.com/en/blog/about-cf-auto-root
Here is CF root link as well saying this is safest way to root LOL

Just emailed samsungknox and asked about warranty void, got this reply:
Thank you for your inquiry. What I can confirm is that once the KNOX fuse is blown, the KNOX warranty is void and users will no longer be able to use KNOX on their device. In addition, resetting the 0x1 flag on the device will not be possible.
I believe device warranty is handled separate from the "KNOX warranty" - I will look into this issue and provide you some clarification regarding this matter.
Best regards
Steve
Samsung KNOX Team
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I have to say, I kinda like the whole "I believe device warranty is handled separate from the "KNOX warranty"" bit. Will update when he gets back to me.

What Samsung region team was that reply from?

It does not state which region team, just says Samsung KNOX Team. But I did put Sweden as my country of residency in their contact form.

Here's my 2 pence on the matter:
If an official Samsung tool (emergency recovery) can flick KNOX into 0x1, then Samsung can't say anything. They can't prove *how* you tripped it.
If the guys at Samsung Knox are saying it's nothing to do with the years warranty, then I imagine Samsung allow the repair centres to pass customers off (if they wish) and claim that the warranty is invalid. If the s**t hit the fan, Samsung could just claim the centre was misinformed. Let's face it, who can be bothered to take on the might of such a large corporation?
The point of KNOX is to make enterprise security viable for android devices. If you're part of an enterprise, then as a system admin you can check to see if KNOX is invalid, thus rendering the phone potentially insecure if it has been triggered. AFAIK, that's really its only intention, it's NOT as a warranty tool.
I might be wrong, but usually logic dictates what's right in these situations. Thoughts?

jonboyuk said:
Here's my 2 pence on the matter:
If an official Samsung tool (emergency recovery) can flick KNOX into 0x1, then Samsung can't say anything. They can't prove *how* you tripped it.
If the guys at Samsung Knox are saying it's nothing to do with the years warranty, then I imagine Samsung allow the repair centres to pass customers off (if they wish) and claim that the warranty is invalid. If the s**t hit the fan, Samsung could just claim the centre was misinformed. Let's face it, who can be bothered to take on the might of such a large corporation?
The point of KNOX is to make enterprise security viable for android devices. If you're part of an enterprise, then as a system admin you can check to see if KNOX is invalid, thus rendering the phone potentially insecure if it has been triggered. AFAIK, that's really its only intention, it's NOT as a warranty tool.
I might be wrong, but usually logic dictates what's right in these situations. Thoughts?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
That's exactly right. I made the point earlier that there have been reports of tripped Knox flags on non-rooted, totally stock devices with stock recoveries, and as such, there's no way that Samsung could legally refuse to honor warranty on that basis alone, because it's obvious that what we know trips it is not limited to the things most of us are dealing with, such as custom recovery or kernel, etc.
As long as the issue is limited to the ability to use Knox, and no other features are restricted, I don't think there's anything to be concerned about. I first encountered this with the S4 myself, and I sold it without a Knox bootloader. Unfortunately, I bought the Note 3 with a Knox bootloader, so there was no way to avoid it.
That said, I'm not about to obsess over the stupid flag, because I'll probably keep the device for a year tops, and then move on to something else. Most of us will, I assume.

From the looks of it, it seems like Knox is more of a way to determine whether your device is "secured" with Knox rather than determining whether Samsung will allow you to use your warranty. This is very good news and what I was guessing from the beginning. I may go ahead and flash now and if something wrong happens, just send my phone in for replacement and pray that I am right. Hopefully someone who has 0x1 will break their device and send it in for a repair so we can be sure.

Some people have sent theirs back with 0x1 and had repairs done, other have not been so fortunate. A user here in the UK was told by Samsung (and had his note 3 sent back immediately) that they would not undertake any repair via warranty or if he paid the cost himself. --- currently a lot of conflicting reports, and by the looks of it, it's based on individual criteria as to whether it gets fixed or not. (Unless you throw the EU Directive at them)
Sent from my SM-N9005 using XDA Premium 4 mobile app

radicalisto said:
Some people have sent theirs back with 0x1 and had repairs done, other have not been so fortunate. A user here in the UK was told by Samsung (and had his note 3 sent back immediately) that they would not undertake any repair via warranty or if he paid the cost himself. --- currently a lot of conflicting reports, and by the looks of it, it's based on individual criteria as to whether it gets fixed or not. (Unless you throw the EU Directive at them)
Sent from my SM-N9005 using XDA Premium 4 mobile app
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I think that's what will be the standard experience for most lazy service areas, like in my area. Central America has a long tradition of allowing vendors to avoid warranty service. Buy something, and the common thing is that most retailers only honor a 90 day warranty on most items, regardless of how long the factory warranty actually is. Rules only apply when and where they can be enforced.

Anyone to open new topic that organises volunteers to contact each countries samsung services and learn the standart procedures about knoxing and warranty.
Also maybe in the end (for sure there will be conflict with the countries) we can send report to samsung to clear this knoxing issue if effects to warannty.

After reading this i might just take the hit, install custom recovery and rom and forget about knox.

Samsung, Warranty Bits, and Bullsh..... .. .

Regarding Samsung's "Warranty Bit" Sh**​(Originally from http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?p=49345592)​
For those of you who are as ticked off as I am about Samsung's new warranty bit/voided warranty behavior due to a suspected E-fuse in their latest devices, YOU (yes, YOU) need to speak up and make sure that Samsung executives are starkly aware of who pays for their 50' yachts and their effing Bentleys! Tell them that your support for them is easily dissolved and that this new "practice" of theirs is one of the quickest and easiest ways to dissolve it.
Consumers are the ones who pay Samsung's bills. This is a truth that they would rather not acknowledge, but given a force that's great enough in numbers, they will yield to the will of their consumers.
Just look at Microsoft and Windows 8 (8.1), as well as their recent release of Office 2013 (license transfer). Microsoft has got to be one of THE most stubborn corporations in the world right now, but even they have yielded to the overwhelming force that is the consumer, and more specifically, their bank accounts. Ever heard the phrase "money talks"? Oh, it most certainly talks.. We as consumers have the ability to make our money talk collectively, so, if we want to see an end to this new way that they're giving their customers the shaft, we need to join voices and speak UP.
Drown them with emails, light up their tech support lines, and paint this picture for them as clearly as you can. Tell them that you WILL NOT continue to purchase their devices when they deny warranty service simply because of a "warranty bit", or for other ridiculous and non-sensical reasons, and tell them that Knox should come as an OPTION and NOT A MANDATE. I've listed a few ways to do that below. If anyone else has other/better ways of doing so, then by all means, share with the class.
Samsung USA's online customer feedback form: https://contactus.samsung.com/customer/contactus/formmail/mail/MailQuestionProduct.jsp?SITE_ID=1&titleCode=1
Samsung USA's toll-free customer service phone number: 1-855-SAM-USA1 (1-855-726-8721) 9am – 9pm ET, 7 days a week
Samsung Mobile USA's Facebook page: https://www.facebook.com/SamsungMobileUSA
If there's a forum on XDA Developers or ANY OTHER WEBSITE where you think this post might help spread the word about this, then you have my expressed written consent to copy this entire post (verbatim, from beginning to end please, including this part at the bottom) and re-post it WHEREVER you think it might help this cause. I've attached a text file that includes this post, as well as all the formatting/coloring (Attention Re-Poster: please re-attach the same text file).
Go, contact Samsung NOW!

(Reserved)

Every Android phone I've ever bought came out of warranty when rooted. In Note 3, Samsung just found a way to detect rooting, that's all. Nothing else changed, so I don't think this is going to have much effect.

aydc said:
Every Android phone I've ever bought came out of warranty when rooted. In Note 3, Samsung just found a way to detect rooting, that's all. Nothing else changed, so I don't think this is going to have much effect.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
But you even cant flash stock FW, nor downgrade, which will lead to 0x1 flag. Also, did you see amount of RAM tat knox uses? And you tell me % of users that need knox? Most expensive device, with many weaknesses that they didn't address, but they forced us to accept knox. No choice, or to stay on 4.2.2. And everything with no clear explanation!? I won't buy their product soon!
Sent from my GT-I9505

jjnhl68 said:
But you even cant flash stock FW, nor downgrade, which will lead to 0x1 flag. Also, did you see amount of RAM tat knox uses? And you tell me % of users that need knox? Most expensive device, with many weaknesses that they didn't address, but they forced us to accept knox. No choice, or to stay on 4.2.2. And everything with no clear explanation!? I won't buy their product soon!
Sent from my GT-I9505
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Good - don't.
Knox is included and everyone knows that, it's in the box and everywhere.
Downgrading is a security risk and rooting is technically an exploit.
Knox uses very little RAM (if you uninstall the main apk which doesn't even require root)

I can't believe we're still talking about ram usage of some small apps even if we've got 2/3 gbs of ram to spare...

Skander1998 said:
Good - don't.
Knox is included and everyone knows that, it's in the box and everywhere.
Downgrading is a security risk and rooting is technically an exploit.
Knox uses very little RAM (if you uninstall the main apk which doesn't even require root)
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
But then, KNOX using no RAM would be better. If half the owners of Note3 don't use KNOX, what's the point in it even using any?
Why have a device that's so powerful but then put on software that just hogs. 2.5GB memory yet the TouchWiz and the other crap that Samsung put in it take up so much.

OP, after reading your post, I find it very difficult to comprehend the exact purpose and reasoning that you are trying to convey. After all, it sounds that you are merely butthurt that you got denied warranty because you tampered with your device.
However, you must try to understand how the business world works first.
Your issue is a problem that a miniscule portion of the market experiences. Those of us who consider themselves "leet haxxorz" tend to enjoy tinkering with their devices to streamline the user experience. However, things often go wrong - phones and tablets get bricked. Then the frustrated consumer heads back to Samsung to demand repair/exchange.
As a corporation, Samsung must have noticed that this was costing them a significant amount of money, and hence KNOX was created as a comprehensive tool with a feature to instantly diagnose whether product has been tampered with.
The average user that understands absolutely nothing about technology could care less whether KNOX exists or not.
And as long as KNOX will save the company money in the long run, your persistent complaints will accomplish absolutely nothing. Don't forget that we represent a fairly insignificant portion of the market. Encouraging users to tamper with products encourages liability which costs money. Money that no company is willing to pay.
The only advice I can offer you is to ensure you are not voiding any sort of warranty before you partake in certain activities. By doing research I was able to avoid the 0x1 situation, and retain my warranty. Of course, I had to sacrifice rooting and installing a custom ROM.

jjnhl68 said:
But you even cant flash stock FW...which will lead to 0x1 flag...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
no ppl have flashed stock roms without tripping their knox..
jjnhl68 said:
...nor downgrade, which will lead to 0x1 flag...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
as the other user said this can be considered a security issue so you have no argument..
jjnhl68 said:
...Also, did you see amount of RAM tat knox uses? And you tell me % of users that need knox?...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
its like any other "bloat", do you use any of those apps? do you cry about those apps?
jjnhl68 said:
..Most expensive device, with many weaknesses..
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
what weaknesses? and it isnt most expensive anymore... :angel:
jjnhl68 said:
...No choice, or to stay on 4.2.2...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
how do you plan on doing that? as the note 3 came with 4.3
jjnhl68 said:
...And everything with no clear explanation!?...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
the word "knox" is printed EVERYWHERE.. what more are they supposed to do to make users "aware"
jjnhl68 said:
... I won't buy their product soon!...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
only part of your post that i agree with :laugh:
PS- next time you want a big company to do what YOU want...try doing research and not make silly mistakes that can make your argument really weak

Khizar said:
no ppl have flashed stock roms without tripping their knox..
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Also ppl have flashed with tripping their knox!!!
Khizar said:
as the other user said this can be considered a security issue so you have no argument..
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Click to collapse
And I should loose my warranty because of that???
Khizar said:
its like any other "bloat", do you use any of those apps? do you cry about those apps?
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Click to collapse
See my point!!! No need for bloat, ok?
Khizar said:
what weaknesses? and it isnt most expensive anymore... :angel:
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It was when i have bought it!!! For 6 months my phone was 3 times in service for repairs under warranty (microphone, speaker, display defects)
We all know about weak points of S4, we are using them, aren't we?
Khizar said:
how do you plan on doing that? as the note 3 came with 4.3
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I was on 4.2.2 in time of buying
Khizar said:
the word "knox" is printed EVERYWHERE.. what more are they supposed to do to make users "aware"
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Khizar said:
only part of your post that i agree with :laugh:
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Khizar said:
PS- next time you want a big company to do what YOU want...try doing research and not make silly mistakes that can make your argument really weak
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
As I already said, in summer 2013. you couldn't know Samsung's intentions, ok?

On any phone rooting or tampering with your phone voids your warranty no questions asked.
On every root thread the first thing is a warning telling you your warranty is now void.
Your malicious intentions to break the rules of your warranty and fake it to get free servicing is now not possible hence the whining.
PS: flashing stock firmware will never void your warranty unless it has an older bootloader version (security risk)

Personally I mostly agree with the OP. I actually posted a couple of posts in here detailing my email to Samsung Australia and responses and they have vanished - no explanation.
I think the argument that, 'it is clear it has Knox so don't whine about it' is specious and ignores the fact there are 5.4 million members on XDA, most of whom would take exception to being told they can't mod their phones.
I have rooted and not lost Knox, but I also would like more access to my phones without voiding warranty. There are reasons. I want root because the apps I prefer to use require it. Titanium and Greenify are very handy to have and both require root.
I want a custom recovery because a Nandroid backup is the only way I know of to back up a phone that includes all screens, all screen layouts and widgets and can put your phone back just like you had it without having to sit for hours recreating the layout. I backup my calls, SMS, contacts and apps, but the restore is painful. A nandroid makes it simple and you can't do it in stock recovery.
I have no complaints at present about the kernel, but I had a lot of pleasure with my S3 playing with different ROM's using Siyah or GoogyMax - when I have a few months on my Note 3 I will venture down that path, but electronics follow the bathtup curve so I'd like to make sure I'm on the bottom of the bath before I risk warranty.
As I said to Samsung, they appear to have made a choice to follow the Apple line, but more extreme, (you can jailbreak an Apple and return it to stock for warranty purposes) most likely in the hope of becoming the next Blackberry. (i.e. Corporate standard phone) but I think they would have been far better to NOT annoy their current customers who are mostly private individuals and bring out a different but similar phone for Corporates. (I make the assumption about the type of users because I can't recall seeing anyone in the S3, Note, S4 Zoom or Note 3 forums with problems to do with Enterprise sysapps, Enterprise setups, or even Exchange services - to me that suggests very few users are using them)

Journyman16 said:
Personally I mostly agree with the OP. I actually posted a couple of posts in here detailing my email to Samsung Australia and responses and they have vanished - no explanation.
I think the argument that, 'it is clear it has Knox so don't whine about it' is specious and ignores the fact there are 5.4 million members on XDA, most of whom would take exception to being told they can't mod their phones.
I have rooted and not lost Knox, but I also would like more access to my phones without voiding warranty. There are reasons. I want root because the apps I prefer to use require it. Titanium and Greenify are very handy to have and both require root.
I want a custom recovery because a Nandroid backup is the only way I know of to back up a phone that includes all screens, all screen layouts and widgets and can put your phone back just like you had it without having to sit for hours recreating the layout. I backup my calls, SMS, contacts and apps, but the restore is painful. A nandroid makes it simple and you can't do it in stock recovery.
I have no complaints at present about the kernel, but I had a lot of pleasure with my S3 playing with different ROM's using Siyah or GoogyMax - when I have a few months on my Note 3 I will venture down that path, but electronics follow the bathtup curve so I'd like to make sure I'm on the bottom of the bath before I risk warranty.
As I said to Samsung, they appear to have made a choice to follow the Apple line, but more extreme, (you can jailbreak an Apple and return it to stock for warranty purposes) most likely in the hope of becoming the next Blackberry. (i.e. Corporate standard phone) but I think they would have been far better to NOT annoy their current customers who are mostly private individuals and bring out a different but similar phone for Corporates. (I make the assumption about the type of users because I can't recall seeing anyone in the S3, Note, S4 Zoom or Note 3 forums with problems to do with Enterprise sysapps, Enterprise setups, or even Exchange services - to me that suggests very few users are using them)
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i cannot agree with you more.
its all about consumer rights and samdung has no rights to force enterprise solutions on private individuals who have no use for NSA grade security.
however,we have samdung fanboys here who keep defending corporate right more than consumer rights...even going as far to judge who deserve warranty or not.
The logic of not being able to downgrade to a older bootloader and not tripping knox is absolute bullcrap.afterall,it is samdung's official ROM and flashing it trips knox and samdung claims you are trying to be funny with their devices(yeah,that's right,you pay top dollars for their phones and it does not belong to you.PERIOD),so what does that tell you?
samdung going the way of apple and trying to be a corporate phone ala blackberry????
Bi*ch please, blackberry was the top corporate device coz its secured as hell.but jus look at how many ppl actually want to use a blackberry to take pictures,listen to music,surf the net,play games on it or hell even show it to frds they have a new model.
samdung,you have the best hardware in the market,i'll give you that.but your TW sucks,loaded with bloatware and is at best irritable when compared with any custom rom and laughable when compare with CM.
with knox,you can have it.no more samdung's knox-pox time for me to switch to something more friendly.

I do not know why everyone is *****ing about KNOX, I had a look at it after reading the OP's post, from what I can see, and I might be wrong, BUT you actually need to INSTALL it first, otherwise it it just sits there doing nothing. do not like it or want to use it, then DO NOT INSTALL IT, or just disable the KNOX install file, SIMPLE.

frostmore said:
however,we have samdung fanboys here who keep defending corporate right more than consumer rights...even going as far to judge who deserve warranty or not.
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This is really uncalled for, it has ALWAYS been the case that if you root your phone, you lose your warranty. In this case samsung track it by flipping a bit, so they know when you have voided the warranty, many other devices handle this in the form of bootloader unlocks. Once you unlock a bootloader on other devices the process is recorded, purely to void your warranty. This is nothing new, perhaps attaching the name KNOX to it has given you the idea that it is corporate security etc. If it were simply called "Warranty void bit" it would be no more or less related to knox (it just happens that knox shares some of the security mechanisms with how the bit is controlled).
And while we are talking about consumer rights. As the manufacturer of a product it is their right to refuse warranty due to tampering with the software. Maybe with the warranty void bit they can save a few bucks in warranty fraud from people who break their devices with root. As for "going as far to judge who deserve warranty or not" I've already stated that it has always been the case that if you tamper with the software your device warranty is void. Hell, Samsung have had some of the most lax security policies over their devices for the past few years with regards to tracking tampering. Next thing you know you will be complaining that unlocking the bootloader on your sony device is irreversible, or that unlocking your HTC device leaves traces even after relock.

lilstevie said:
This is really uncalled for, it has ALWAYS been the case that if you root your phone, you lose your warranty. In this case samsung track it by flipping a bit, so they know when you have voided the warranty, many other devices handle this in the form of bootloader unlocks. Once you unlock a bootloader on other devices the process is recorded, purely to void your warranty. This is nothing new, perhaps attaching the name KNOX to it has given you the idea that it is corporate security etc. If it were simply called "Warranty void bit" it would be no more or less related to knox (it just happens that knox shares some of the security mechanisms with how the bit is controlled).
And while we are talking about consumer rights. As the manufacturer of a product it is their right to refuse warranty due to tampering with the software. Maybe with the warranty void bit they can save a few bucks in warranty fraud from people who break their devices with root. As for "going as far to judge who deserve warranty or not" I've already stated that it has always been the case that if you tamper with the software your device warranty is void. Hell, Samsung have had some of the most lax security policies over their devices for the past few years with regards to tracking tampering. Next thing you know you will be complaining that unlocking the bootloader on your sony device is irreversible, or that unlocking your HTC device leaves traces even after relock.
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Voluntarily voiding your warranty is one thing,unilaterally voiding warranty for trying to downgrade to an earlier version of rom is considered what again?
no one says manufacturer rights shouldn't be protected.but what samdung is doing here is voiding warranty based on the knox bit.unilateral refusing warranty coz knox bit is tripped.and consumer should have the right of full access to their phone.not some two bit restricted access based on samdung's specfications.
rooting so that we can use apps like TB or Greenify is what i called reasonable.Rooting so that you can overclock the cpu and then crying for warranty when its burnt is what i called being a fraud.and most of us want root is mainly due to the former and not latter.so why should consumer be penalized for wanting full admin access to their phones?
i have no qualms about sony or htc's open door policy when it comes to voiding your warranty.at least they are open about it and giving you a choice to do it and also allowing you to have an unlocked bootloader.with samdung,they are like "oh we are ok with rooting,but hey we keep the bootloader locked,so no downgrade,no warranty and sucks to be you".
Yeah,consumer rights my baby smooth behind.
and dun worry too much about being called a samdung fanboy.that wasn't directed at you,rather a certain individual who has been championing samdung's knox warranty void (and their corporate interests)with arguments like security risk,malicious intentions to break the rules of your warranty and the mother of all bullcrap "flashing stock firmware will never void your warranty unless it has an older bootloader version (security risk)".

frostmore said:
Voluntarily voiding your warranty is one thing,unilaterally voiding warranty for trying to downgrade to an earlier version of rom is considered what again?
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And compared to some devices that don't even let you downgrade at all, whether you want to void your warranty or not are any different because?
frostmore said:
no one says manufacturer rights shouldn't be protected.but what samdung is doing here is voiding warranty based on the knox bit.unilateral refusing warranty coz knox bit is tripped.and consumer should have the right of full access to their phone.not some two bit restricted access based on samdung's specfications.
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Okay, first of all, using terms like "samdung" is just making you sound like a petulant child. It really does not help your case at all. Secondly, you are contradicting yourself in one swoop here, saying that they should be able to protect their rights, but they shouldn't have a mechanism to be able to protect their rights.
frostmore said:
rooting so that we can use apps like TB or Greenify is what i called reasonable.Rooting so that you can overclock the cpu and then crying for warranty when its burnt is what i called being a fraud.and most of us want root is mainly due to the former and not latter.so why should consumer be penalized for wanting full admin access to their phones?
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Please tell me what the difference is. Sure I get why you want to use Greenify, or TB, but tell me how from the perspective of the manufacturer how they can tell the difference on a broken phone. Why should the OEM have to pay for all those devices bricked through stupid actions of users with root access (and it is more common than you think) for the benefit of the few that will not destroy their device in the process.
frostmore said:
i have no qualms about sony or htc's open door policy when it comes to voiding your warranty.at least they are open about it and giving you a choice to do it and also allowing you to have an unlocked bootloader.
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Samsungs policy towards warranty is your device is excluded through the act of modification, that is to hardware or software. Sony and HTC have a similar policy rooting, in fact I don't think I have seen any device on the market where the warranty is maintained on rooting. Please note here, I'm not saying that people haven't gotten their devices repaired after rooting. I'm simply noting the act of rooting in most territories around the world constitutes breach of terms for the warranty and therefore makes that null and void.
frostmore said:
with samdung,they are like "oh we are ok with rooting,but hey we keep the bootloader locked,so no downgrade,no warranty and sucks to be you".
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Um, no. Samsung are like "we are okay with everything, but note that modification of the software on your device constitutes voiding your warranty". Unless you have a carrier variant like an AT&T device or Verizon device the bootloader is unlocked, as in, it was never locked down in the first place, you can open up heimdall or odin with the device connected in download mode, and flash it to your hearts content. Downgrading is a tricky situation. Samsung are well within their rights, and in some cases required to as per IP licensing to keep the boot environment secure.
frostmore said:
Yeah,consumer rights my baby smooth behind.
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You mean consumer rights that people have been abusing for years?
frostmore said:
and dun worry too much about being called a samdung fanboy.that wasn't directed at you,rather a certain individual who has been championing samdung's knox warranty void (and their corporate interests)with arguments like security risk,malicious intentions to break the rules of your warranty and the mother of all bullcrap "flashing stock firmware will never void your warranty unless it has an older bootloader version (security risk)".
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I don't worry I'm no fanboy of any device. I am however one that is a firm supporter that if people hadn't been abusing the warranty procedures that these sorts of measures would never have been implemented.

If I have administrator rights in my computer why I can't have the same in my phone?
Does being an administrator in your windows desktop computer void your warranty?
Why I can't unninstal all the apps that I don't use?
Sent from my SM-N9005 using Tapatalk

frostmore said:
Voluntarily voiding your warranty is one thing,unilaterally voiding warranty for trying to downgrade to an earlier version of rom is considered what again?
no one says manufacturer rights shouldn't be protected.but what samdung is doing here is voiding warranty based on the knox bit.unilateral refusing warranty coz knox bit is tripped.and consumer should have the right of full access to their phone.not some two bit restricted access based on samdung's specfications.
rooting so that we can use apps like TB or Greenify is what i called reasonable.Rooting so that you can overclock the cpu and then crying for warranty when its burnt is what i called being a fraud.and most of us want root is mainly due to the former and not latter.so why should consumer be penalized for wanting full admin access to their phones?
i have no qualms about sony or htc's open door policy when it comes to voiding your warranty.at least they are open about it and giving you a choice to do it and also allowing you to have an unlocked bootloader.with samdung,they are like "oh we are ok with rooting,but hey we keep the bootloader locked,so no downgrade,no warranty and sucks to be you".
Yeah,consumer rights my baby smooth behind.
and dun worry too much about being called a samdung fanboy.that wasn't directed at you,rather a certain individual who has been championing samdung's knox warranty void (and their corporate interests)with arguments like security risk,malicious intentions to break the rules of your warranty and the mother of all bullcrap "flashing stock firmware will never void your warranty unless it has an older bootloader version (security risk)".
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Ha ha, Samdung!! Like Samsung but like dung. Aww man, did you come up with yourself? That is brilliant

AllanJ60 said:
I do not know why everyone is *****ing about KNOX, I had a look at it after reading the OP's post, from what I can see, and I might be wrong, BUT you actually need to INSTALL it first, otherwise it it just sits there doing nothing. do not like it or want to use it, then DO NOT INSTALL IT, or just disable the KNOX install file, SIMPLE.
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*grins* Yep, you are right... you're wrong. It isn't the Knox software people are upset about, it is the Knox counter that is built in. It is set at 0x0 and if you do anything with your phone except take Samsung OTA updates, which have been tightened even further once they realised the Devs had found a way around their little booby trap, you trigger a change of state in that counter to 0x1.
It is supposed to be irreversible and you can trigger it by doing things Android users have been doing since Android came out. A good number of what are now standard apps require root access and providing that will trigger Knox. As pointed out, if you decide you don't like a particular OTA update (say to KitKat) and try to go back to a previous version (say the one your phone came with) you trigger Knox.
And Samsung is voiding warranties because Knox is triggered. Blanket voiding as far as can be determined. Doesn't matter if there's a hardware issue (say the charge circuit stopped) they will void because that trigger is at 0x1.

[Q] Why the hell Samsung flatter carriers?

Hey,
I just don't get why Samsung flatter carrier - that is Samsung does whatever carriers want it to do.
Carriers ask manufactures, including Samsung, to load their phone with annoying carrier apps, brand their logos on the phone (Verizon even did it on the home button -_-), and to make their slow UIs to be the default (Docomo...)
Yes, I do get Samsung has to suck carriers' a** because carriers are its customers, but does Samsung have to do this anymore?
Look at Apple, they have no trouble with going against the carriers' wishes. In fact, they act like a boss in front of the carriers. It is all possible because Apple products are popular and it knows that carriers will buy its phones anyways.
Samsung has grown to become the #1 smartphone manufacturer in the world and still for some reason has that servile attitude. Being a customer, I think consequences from Samsung's (and other manufactures') flattery is really really annoying.
WHY??????????
P.S. Recently Korean government made this wonderful law that requires (rather recommends) phone manufacturers to allow its users to delete most of the pre-loaded app. Fortunately, all of the Korean manufacturers accepted the new law and made most of the pre-loaded apps deletable in Korean models. (Yeah!) I hope this becomes the worldwide trend.

thats why we root and install custom roms.
who cares what they put on it.
its junk anyways.

bweN diorD said:
thats why we root and install custom roms.
who cares what they put on it.
its junk anyways.
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I don't like rooting cuz it voids the warranty and breaks the security.
And in fact, Android phones are satisfactory even without rooting

csm121295 said:
And in fact, Android phones are satisfactory even without rooting
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wow, you just ranted about stock crapware, then said this ^^^
sorry i replied, you cant have your cake and eat it too.

No I meant in terms of functionality, Android is satisfactory even withoit rooting.
And yes, I am willing to root anytime as long of it won't void the warranty and break the security.
Sent from my Nexus 7 using XDA Free mobile app

roots required
csm121295 said:
No I meant in terms of functionality, Android is satisfactory even withoit rooting.
And yes, I am willing to root anytime as long of it won't void the warranty and break the security.
Sent from my Nexus 7 using XDA Free mobile app
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1.root your phone and delete them using system uninstaller.
2 don't worry about warranty because you can use triangle away app to remove custom counts and restock the Rom back when you need warranty.