So I got an Idol 3 5.5 that fell from 15cm off the ground and of course broke it's screen, so a friend gave me his old iPhone 4S as a replacement until I decide what I will do with the Alcatel. I'm a semi-professional photographer and have been using SLRs and DSLRs for some 15 years. I am astounded how good the camera on the 4 and (almost) a half years old iPhone 4s is, especially compared to the half year old Alcatel. But it's not that the iPhone is excellent (although it is), the Alcatel is, well, not so good.
So, here's a test I did. I photographed the same subject in the same lighting conditions (artifical constant indoor light so no variations in lighting between shots) from the same position, maybe a few milimeteres to the side (not farther or closer to skew the perspective/depth of field).
Photos in next post so I can add attachments to it
Are you kidding me, I can't post photos?
You should not have expected superb photo quality. The cost of the phone speaks for itself.
Can't tell if you are trolling or not.
How are you a semi-professional photographer and comparing an iPhone to the Idol 3. There is more to cameras than just megapixels you know and Apple is known for having top-of-the-line cameras in their phones. Also, if you are an avid photographer, why did it take you getting an iPhone in order to confirm that you don't like the Idol 3 photos?
lying about what though? I don't think they claimed to take better pics than an iphone 4s?
OK guys, it would all make much more sense if I could post photos, but I was actually not comparing the photo quality from iPhone and Alcatel, but rather the exposure values, where the EXIF suggests that the lens on the Alcatel is not f/2.0, but actually something smaller. In the same lighting conditions the iPhone photo had these values:
f/2.4, 1/20s, ISO 200
and the Idol 3:
f/2.0, 1/50s, ISO 1800
and this suggests that there is significantly less light coming to the chip of the Alcatel (almost three stops less). I have tested the exposure value of this situation with my Nikon and it is in sync with the iPhone EXIF values. Also, depth-of-field of the image on the Alcatel when compared to the iPhone is also confirming this. I'm not here to bash Alcatel and would actually be glad if anyone could prove me wrong! Maybe my unit is defective?Please, try to shoot the same frame with the Alcatel and some other camera and compare the exposure values.
I wouldn't say they're lying.
The sensor on the Idol 3 is a Sony IMX214 which has an aperture of f/2.0.
It's a very good sensor, but the camera lens is not as good as the sensor used.
The Nexus 6 & OnePlus One have the same sensor, but the lens used are far superior than one ones on the Idol 3. (Same f/2.0)
I'll say again, the price of the phone speaks for itself.
Sent from my 6045O using Tapatalk
Yeah I know that this sensor is used in a variety of cameras and have seen images from the 1+ and they were great! But again, I'm not talking about the quality of the image, I'm talking about it's objective performance in terms of the amount of light that comes to the sensor which seems to be less than they state it should be.
I just remembered that the camera app has that "Pro" mode which makes it possible to manually input the ISO and shutter speed so I will try to do it again comparing it to the iPhone, DSLR and my wife's Sony T3 later today.
I'm sure they used a lens of lower quality but it shouldn't block almost three stops of light compared to other lenses.
Hemidrosis said:
I wouldn't say they're lying.
The sensor on the Idol 3 is a Sony IMX214 which has an aperture of f/2.0.
It's a very good sensor, but the camera lens is not as good as the sensor used.
The Nexus 6 & OnePlus One have the same sensor, but the lens used are far superior than one ones on the Idol 3. (Same f/2.0)
I'll say again, the price of the phone speaks for itself.
Sent from my 6045O using Tapatalk
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1 -
mrkva123 said:
I'm not here to bash Alcatel and would actually be glad if anyone could prove me wrong!
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and in topic you said that Alcatel is lying.
2-how you managed to shoot photos with your idol3 when it has a broken screen? Cant it be,that your idol3 camera chip or camera lenses are affected after the fall of the device?As a photographer you should know that there is heavy postprocesing and when you use poorly written software it is also bad as hell.
3- you can show usThe pictures using a link to a cloud where you can upload it.
4-The picture quality is not only made by chip. There are also lenses and a software. You can see it everywhere on chineese low budget phones. They use IMX214 bud bad optics and poor software and the pictures look bad. Also you can see it on Alcatel idol3 app that the app has a problem with propper exposure recognition (i have always to tap to a screen on a place i want to have propper exposure metering from).
So in end effect i dont defence ALcatels picture quality it can be far better with software optimalisation. But as many users said before, you cant compare iphone camera to idol3 camera. They are on different levels and as a photographer you should known that time of release is not a comparable fact (you mentioned 4 years old iphone 4....).
Anyway ...who cares?
I'm not saying that they are lying definitely but I'm just asking cause this sounds strange.
Yeah, I can use the phone although its screen is broken since only one part (lower) of the screen is not functioning and the phone is flippable, so I need to constantly flip it to use different parts of the screen.
I sincerely doubt that the fall damaged the camera or any parts of it cause everything works, no artifacts or anything else.
Once again, this has nothing to do with the quality of the lens, chip, software or anything else. Image shot at f/2.0, 1/50s and ISO 200 will have the same exposure value (it would look to be equally light or dark) whether it was shot on an Alcatel Idol 3 or a professional Hasselblad medium-format 50 000 € camera or a film camera, or a camera obscura. Exposure is objectively measurable and is expressed with these values, nothing to do with the quality of the parts used and nothing to do with the quality of the photo, it's just the amount of light, not the quality of it or the image!
I have uploaded the photos to a image hosting service but I can't link to them, I tried numerous times.
DallasCZ said:
1 - and in topic you said that Alcatel is lying.
2-how you managed to shoot photos with your idol3 when it has a broken screen? Cant it be,that your idol3 camera chip or camera lenses are affected after the fall of the device?As a photographer you should know that there is heavy postprocesing and when you use poorly written software it is also bad as hell.
3- you can show usThe pictures using a link to a cloud where you can upload it.
4-The picture quality is not only made by chip. There are also lenses and a software. You can see it everywhere on chineese low budget phones. They use IMX214 bud bad optics and poor software and the pictures look bad. Also you can see it on Alcatel idol3 app that the app has a problem with propper exposure recognition (i have always to tap to a screen on a place i want to have propper exposure metering from).
So in end effect i dont defence ALcatels picture quality it can be far better with software optimalisation. But as many users said before, you cant compare iphone camera to idol3 camera. They are on different levels and as a photographer you should known that time of release is not a comparable fact (you mentioned 4 years old iphone 4....).
Anyway ...who cares?
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I use the app A better camera for making photos and especially indoor photos are much better than using the standard app.
It's made by Almalence which is also making the software for some phone and camera manufacturers.
so, here are the images
first I shot with the iPhone since it can only shoot full auto:
http://imgur.com/CE9xNOc
EXIF says that it's:
1/20 sec, ISO 160 and f/2.4
So I set the Alcatel in the manual mode as follows to be as close to the iPhone shot:
1/30 sec, ISO 200 and the aperture is according to Alcatel, f/2.0 (although when I shot it in manual mode the aperture value is mysteriously omitted from the EXIF). the photo from the Alcatel should be brighter on these settings!
and here's what we get:
http://imgur.com/7d7c407
Once again, this has nothing to do with quality of the camera or any other parts involved, it's not that the Alcatel is worse, it is wrong.
And I finally managed to post photos
can someone please take a photo with the Idol 3 and some other cellphone in the same lighting conditions and scene just to confirm this?
you can check the EXIF values here: http://regex.info/exif.cgi
and write down the exposure values that you get from both phones.
mrkva123 said:
And I finally managed to post photos
can someone please take a photo with the Idol 3 and some other cellphone in the same lighting conditions and scene just to confirm this?
you can check the EXIF values here: http://regex.info/exif.cgi
and write down the exposure values that you get from both phones.
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i see what are you trying to tell, but i as i said, its a mobile phone i dont care.
But as i remember, there was same issue on my previous ZTE V5..the first firmwares said,that the aperture is 2.2 ...people complain about it and they have corrected it in next firmware.
So here can it be also. Ask on redit or in main XDa QA section, maybe someone who better understands optics and photograpy will tell you.
easyriider said:
I use the app A better camera for making photos and especially indoor photos are much better than using the standard app.
It's made by Almalence which is also making the software for some phone and camera manufacturers.
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Awesome! Just installed it and it is definitely the best camera app I have used on this phone. :good:
TallTommy said:
Awesome! Just installed it and it is definitely the best camera app I have used on this phone. :good:
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Agree! Because of you I gave it a try, amazing app + Now it's on sale. Wow
I don't know whether they are lying about the specs of the camera but mine is constantly collecting dust on the inside of the rear lens (already had it cleaned once and it is starting again). Never happened with any other phone I ever had and basically renders the rear camera useless within few weeks.
petertakov said:
I don't know whether they are lying about the specs of the camera but mine is constantly collecting dust on the inside of the rear lens (already had it cleaned once and it is starting again). Never happened with any other phone I ever had and basically renders the rear camera useless within few weeks.
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I have no single piece of dust on my camera..i have it for about 9 months allready.
My camera is also perfectly clean after more than half a year. I don't think they are lying about the specs. I suspect that the problem here is in the t-stop, which no lens manufacturer ever tells you about. The lens on the idol 3 is probably f/2 as they claim, but the amount of light that reaches the sensor has almost nothing to do with the f-stop, it's the t-stop that determines that. You can't actually rely on the f/stop for exposure (though it's a good approximation, usually), the f/stop is really only accurate for the depth of field that you get. I suspect that the t-stop on the idol 3 is lower than the one of the iPhone, while the t-stop of the iPhone happens to be more similar to the one of your DSLR lens. Though I have to say, the exposure difference in the photos you posted is very dramatic, maybe about 2 stops? I don't know if the t-stop can cause such a big difference.
That said, you could also easily test if the idol 3 camera is actually f/2. The idol 3 has a 6.1mm x 4.64mm sensor, and an 3.8mm focal length. Considering the sensor size, the crop factor is 7,2. As you probably know, the crop factor not only affects the focal length, but also the f/stop (and in fact also the ISO, but that doesn't matter now). So the idol 3 has a 35mm equivalent f/stop of f/2 x 7,2= f/14.4 (as far as DoF is concerned, not the exposure, obviously. This is the reason that it's so hard to get nice background blur on photos from smartphones unless you are very close up, it's because they have crazy small apertures like our idol 3 here at f/14.4. Again this is ONLY for DoF, not exposure. Basically because the sensor is very small, the aperture being small doesn't matter for exposure, the amount of light per pixel is about the same as if it was f/2 with a 35mm sensor.)
So, you could grab your Full Frame DSLR, set it to 27,4mm and f/14.4, (or if you have a 1.5x crop sensor DSLR, at 18.2mm and f/9.6), and then take a test picture with that DSLR and one with the idol 3. It's a DoF test shot, so take that into account when taking the photos (maybe set up a couple of items in a row, get them in frame in the same way on the idol 3 and DSLR, and focus on the frontmost item). The pictures from the DSLR and idol 3 should look about the same, DoF wise. The idol 3 will likely be noisier and not as sharp, and the exposure may be different too, but if the DoF is very different, then the idol 3 is not f/2. Setting up the DoF test shots might be tricky, because the minimum focusing distance is probably very different on the idol 3 and DSLR, but if you take these test shots we will at least know for certain if it is f/2 or not.
petertakov said:
I don't know whether they are lying about the specs of the camera but mine is constantly collecting dust on the inside of the rear lens (already had it cleaned once and it is starting again). Never happened with any other phone I ever had and basically renders the rear camera useless within few weeks.
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"Dust in the lens, all we are is dust in the lens..." lol No problems here, and everyone is free to do what they want with their phones, but I assume you are not using a full coverage case? I really can't believe some of the things I see people complain about when they don't use a quality case, and nowadays, a 9H glass screen protector. Not picking on you, and it's possible, even likely you got a bad unit. But "I dropped my phone, and I can't believe the pos shattered! I read it had blah blah next generation glass!" That one really makes me laugh.
And as far as the camera, There are lots of options for downloading/porting other cameras, with better settings and software. It's a $200 cell phone, and taking good pics is something that is important to me, so I always do a little searching on the forums of the new phones I get. I only paid $109 from Cricket, but even at $249 retail, what you get for the money is an amazing piece of technology, not a dedicated top of the line camera. And picture quality is somewhat subjective when you are talking about contrast, exposure, and saturation. Just one man's opinion....
hi, am I the only one to have all these "hot pixels" in the photos?
they are especially noticeable when low ISO and high values of shutter speed are set.
the first photos is taken by covering the sensor (so it should be alla black)
the second photo is a zoom of the first, the white points can be clearly seen
i can't shot photos in low light condition...and i have the same problem with my htc 10.
i think i will send the phone to a repair service
thanks
This is a dng photo of my dark room.
Iso 100/ ss 16 s
It's full of rgb dots.
https://ibb.co/mLAriK
Had a go and have similar results, getting worse towards the edges of the image, so I think it's probably not a fault per se, just noise. Smartphone cameras can't match up to professional cameras anyway but this is a bit disappointing to be honest. Unless mine is broken as well :silly:
i think it's normal to have some of this dots but not so many...with other smartphone like samsung or honor and the same setting there are no problem.
other htc users in the same conditions have no problem
i think it's a problem of the sensor. i will send the phone for a repair.
byo91 said:
i think it's normal to have some of this dots but not so many...with other smartphone like samsung or honor and the same setting there are no problem.
other htc users in the same conditions have no problem
i think it's a problem of the sensor. i will send the phone for a repair.
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Cause those companies are a smudge feast and smudging just takes care of erasing a lot of those dots.
Sent from my HTC U12+ using XDA Labs