Database Info

[Q] Conspiracy Theory

Does anyone think that AT&T would be smart enough to intentionally leak Froyo to the dev community to see what methods would be employed to hack/mod/de-bloat and then subsequently block/secure those methods? Just food for thought.

JimmyStale said:
Does anyone think that AT&T would be smart enough to intentionally leak Froyo to the dev community to see what methods would be employed to hack/mod/de-bloat and then subsequently block/secure those methods? Just food for thought.
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I think that they may or could do this to find bugs in a mass consumer type BETA just before a final release. I may be wrong that they would not do this to find ways to keep people locked out.
But who knows they may do this for your stated reasons.

You give the death star far too much credit. We are the minority. The masses will simply take what AT&T gives them.

I highly doubt it. The methods we use to do most of the things AT&T hates, like circumventing their stupid 'no non-market apps' policy, are the same ones we've always been using, and not just with the captivate but all their other android handsets too.

lol no AT&T I'm sure is not even paying attention to what Samsung does with it's phones. As long as Sammy gives ol' AT&T the checklist stating yup we broke it to your specs - AT&T will let it out the door without even looking at the software update.

JimmyStale said:
Does anyone think that AT&T would be smart enough to intentionally leak Froyo to the dev community to see what methods would be employed to hack/mod/de-bloat and then subsequently block/secure those methods? Just food for thought.
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Click to collapse
This is not even good enough to be a conspiracy. What happens on XDA affects a minority of phones. Neither AT&T or Samsung see any need to get info in advance, they are way to busy on their QA and Dev cycles.
Go work for a big corporation that has a software development group and you will soon learn that any idea like this is pure folly.
The leaks are coming from a developer or QA person with time to kill and who sees no harm in leaking. If the company found out, he/she would be fired, but there is no way anyone will ever know as this stuff floats around the company network and on USB sticks all day long.

Not to mention AT&T is smart enough to know that those who work to remove bloatware, aren't going to use it (and pay them) anyway.
Its the ones that don't know any better that they hope to suck a few extra dollars from.

D2G/DPro SBF has been publicly released (link inside)

Just saw a series of tweets from @P3Droid saying they're looking for a soft-bricked D2G or Pro to test SBF files on. He said he's in the Phoenix area so do yourself and everyone else a favor if you've got a phone to send him and get that sucker fixed!
Edit: At 11:30 p.m. EST on 1/2/2011, @P3Droid tweeted that they will be publicly releasing the SBF files for both the D2G and Pro within the next 12 hours. I'll post a link to their posting once it's up. Note that they caution you to grab the stuff ASAP as it will likely be taken down by Moto via C&D (not that there won't be plenty of mirrors after that)
Edit2: It looks like links are up on Team Black Hat's forum. I assume since this is now for free there is no issue linking to their forum but if anyone better versed than I in the rules disagrees, please say so and I'll take the link down.
http://www.mydroidworld.com/forums/...id-2-global-sbf-file-2-4-29-full-rsdlite.html
Again, thanks to Team Black Hat for the great work they do and for the decision to rapidly release this SBF publicly. Hopefully the short window between it being kept exclusive to their app and the public release will not deter folks from supporting the cause.

bout time. This will really get the modding community going for the global finally. Hear that all they need to do now is test it and they'll be set.

Yes this is very good news.
See my post down further as to see why I say this isn't good news.
Hint: This smells like a scam.

i hope that this is true, then we could start seeing a lot more modds dfor the d2g

Of course, 2 days after i send my brick in to verizon. good news tho

If you check the twitter account it says that the phone must be mailed just like the band unlock guy... I smell a scam and I for one do not recommend sending any phones by mail to anyone you don't know. You're just asking to have your phone stolen.
I wouldn't trust anyone who says that you must mail the phone to them or that you must meet them in person. If they really want to be trust worthy they will just give you the link to the file straight up. If they needed testers then they can setup a private channel on irc or something.

This is not a scam.
All of the members of TBH have NS(Non Secured) flash dev phones because that is what we personally chose to spend our own money on.
We also have consumer hardware test phones for other models but not the D2G or Pro.
We cannot test the SBF files we got recently on our phones and cannot afford to purchase these models at full retail to test the files.
We are well established in the community and have provided virtually all of the leaked SBF files for all of the Droid devices in existence.
Our record of community service stands for itself and has no comparable parallel.
Everybody wants these files and we want to release them so users who have soft bricked can recover and everyone can breathe a little easier modding these phones.
I would ask anyone who questions our motives how much of their own money they have spent on providing the community with such valuable resources as these files?
Anybody?
I thought so...

cellzealot said:
This is not a scam.
All of the members of TBH have NS(Non Secured) flash dev phones because that is what we personally chose to spend our own money on.
We also have consumer hardware test phones for other models but not the D2G or Pro.
We cannot test the SBF files we got recently on our phones and cannot afford to purchase these models at full retail to test the files.
We are well established in the community and have provided virtually all of the leaked SBF files for all of the Droid devices in existence.
Our record of community service stands for itself and has no comparable parallel.
Everybody wants these files and we want to release them so users who have soft bricked can recover and everyone can breathe a little easier modding these phones.
I would ask anyone who questions our motives how much of their own money they have spent on providing the community with such valuable resources as these files?
Anybody?
I thought so...
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Click to collapse
Beautiful post and well said!
Sent from my DROID2 GLOBAL using XDA App

cellzealot said:
This is not a scam.
All of the members of TBH have NS(Non Secured) flash dev phones because that is what we personally chose to spend our own money on.
We also have consumer hardware test phones for other models but not the D2G or Pro.
We cannot test the SBF files we got recently on our phones and cannot afford to purchase these models at full retail to test the files.
We are well established in the community and have provided virtually all of the leaked SBF files for all of the Droid devices in existence.
Our record of community service stands for itself and has no comparable parallel.
Everybody wants these files and we want to release them so users who have soft bricked can recover and everyone can breathe a little easier modding these phones.
I would ask anyone who questions our motives how much of their own money they have spent on providing the community with such valuable resources as these files?
Anybody?
I thought so...
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Click to collapse
I do apologize as I'm new to having a Motorola device and thus do not know all of the developers yet for this brand of hardware. I recently came over from an HTC phone which has the Unrevoked team behind it for rooting purposes and so forth.
I only claimed that this seemed like a scam as I'm cautious about these short of things and your request asking for phones to be mailed seems very much so a tail tell sign of a scam. Again I apologize if this is your preferred operating procedure.
If I had better information about your group/organization then I wouldn't be so quick to dismiss it. If I had a soft bricked phone and had this information before hand I would have been more willing to help out. Though I personally still do not want to ship any phone via the mail. I would prefer an in person meeting where this test could then be conducted.
I too understand these phones are not cheap and it's not easy for developers to obtain consumer devices for testing purposes. Since these phones cost so much is why I'm cautious when it comes to someone asking for a phone to be mailed in.

I think the best way to test whether its an sbf or not is to make a new thread with links to it and a disclaimer, if it works, hey, that's awesome, if it doesnt, who cares, the phones its being tested on are already softbricked anyhow.
My question is, what if it is the sbf? Besides fixing softbricked phones, what more can be done with it?
Sent from my WICKED FAST Droid 2 Global with fission using XDA app

boomertwo said:
I do apologize as I'm new to having a Motorola device and thus do not know all of the developers yet for this brand of hardware. I recently came over from an HTC phone which has the Unrevoked team behind it for rooting purposes and so forth.
I only claimed that this seemed like a scam as I'm cautious about these short of things and your request asking for phones to be mailed seems very much so a tail tell sign of a scam. Again I apologize if this is your preferred operating procedure.
If I had better information about your group/organization then I wouldn't be so quick to dismiss it. If I had a soft bricked phone and had this information before hand I would have been more willing to help out. Though I personally still do not want to ship any phone via the mail. I would prefer an in person meeting where this test could then be conducted.
I too understand these phones are not cheap and it's not easy for developers to obtain consumer devices for testing purposes. Since these phones cost so much is why I'm cautious when it comes to someone asking for a phone to be mailed in.
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rusty815 said:
I think the best way to test whether its an sbf or not is to make a new thread with links to it and a disclaimer, if it works, hey, that's awesome, if it doesnt, who cares, the phones its being tested on are already softbricked anyhow.
My question is, what if it is the sbf? Besides fixing softbricked phones, what more can be done with it?
Sent from my WICKED FAST Droid 2 Global with fission using XDA app
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We will not release anything until we have had a chance to thoroughly test it for ourselves, not all things we get are worth releasing.
To be honest this thread started good but really went silly rather quickly. Neither Cell nor myself need to defend the work we have done for the community and to state that we are scamming is asinine. As Cell stated we have lots of devices in many different flavors, they are not consumer phones therefore we can not always test things that we would like to.
I'm sure you know what TBH does and what we have done, if not you can most likely find 1 or 2 posts about us online somewhere. This is not a question of us not knowing what the files are, we know what we have in hand therefore that is not the question being asked. The request is for a consumer device to test this on.
So if you know someone with a phone that is inoperable have them contact us, so we can help them out and in return help out the entire community.
P3Droid
TBH

Has anyone offered to send a phone to you yet? Where are you located?

No, I went and bought a new D2G from VZW tonight so I can manage this myself.
Once testing is complete we will decide when and how to release the SBF file.
You're welcome...

sorry if I came off as a bit "silly" i do know about tbh and their contributions to the droid community. i was just suggesting an alternative way of testing this, but i understand your concern about releasing it publicly, it may cause more harm than good.
while im here, might i ask if the 3g mobile hotspot patch can be made for the d2g, seeing as how you have a d2g now? ive been waiting a while hoping that someone can make the patch for the d2g.

cellzealot said:
No, I went and bought a new D2G from VZW tonight so I can manage this myself.
Once testing is complete we will decide when and how to release the SBF file.
You're welcome...
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Hey guys, sorry for the harassment/doubters. Unfortunately, the couple of posters who got on here were too lazy to follow the links on your twitter account to the website where it can be clearly seen just how crazy active you guys are on the Android scene and how reasonable you are with these types of requests.
Thanks so much for all the work you do to make Android phones do what they're supposed to do (stupid carriers with their stupidity). You guys do great work and I, for one, appreciate it a lot! Looking forward to the release

cellzealot said:
No, I went and bought a new D2G from VZW tonight so I can manage this myself.
Once testing is complete we will decide when and how to release the SBF file.
You're welcome...
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This is very generous from your side!
I don't know about others, but I think we should establish a fund or something like that to cover such expenses for our development teams. I am totally willing to shell some money for having the peace of mind of having the SBF file for my D2G laying around ready shall the need arise.
Right now (without SBF) I am reluctant of touching anything on my phone due to lack of safe way out. I am not in the States and exchanging the phone will cost me considerable amount of money and efforts.
Not sure if I should start a new thread for this as cellzealot already bought the phone, but I if this gets somehow organized, I am in with $20 to offset the expense. $20 is much less than what I would have to pay to ship the phone anywhere for whatever reason.
cellzealot, does your team have a paypal or something we can use for the purpose?

I have a Droid2Global that boots but is stuck at the stupid Backup Manager screen and doesn't allow me to go anywhere else. If you want, I'm more than happy to try the SBF out on that D2G if you send me the SBF. PM me if you want me to try it.

@leobg: Thanks for the offer of support.
We really don't care for the practice of plastering donate buttons all over in every forum where we post...so we don't do it.
The best way to support TeamBlackHat and the continued availability of these files and our other development projects is to purchase our app in the market for the extremely reasonable sum of $2.00 US. It is just a downloader that provides our users with access to all of the various leaks and other files. There is a filter that only presents content for the specific connected device.
There is also a donate button at the top of the screen for further support if you are feeling generous, thanks. The files are made available via the app exclusively for some period and then posted publicly for everyone later on MyDroidWorld. http://www.mydroidworld.com/forums/forum.php
That is our way of providing a perk for our supporters and also assuring that all content is made available to the entire community.
This also prevents us from being accused of "selling leaks", despite the fact that those making such accusations have no clue whatsoever how these files are acquired or at what cost.
This is what we do and have been doing for most of the past year or so since the advent of Motorola Android phones with the original Droid.
There is no profit in this at all...trust me...it's just a way for us to absorb some of the cost of our passion for these devices and serve a unique and critical function to meet need for these kinds of files.
Nobody else has consistently proven to have access to these files except us and we have released every flash file for every Motorola Droid device in existence with the exception of two that RootzWiki released.
We don't do a lot of self promotion and prancing around on forums attracting attention to ourselves, that's not our way.
Thanks again for your interest and support!

Just sent you a donation for your work on the droid 2 global sbf. Your work is much appreciated!
THANK YOU!
-Strandedhuman

I have just purchased the TBH app from market. Plan to use the donate link there very soon. I really appreciate your efforts guys!
Sent from my DROID2 GLOBAL

XDA/Samsung

Hello Guys,
My name is John, I recently became the social media analyst at Samsung mobile. I wanted to start opening the lines of communication between XDA and Samsung. First I wanted to say I have noticed your work on our devices on the XDA forums. I think you guys do an outstanding job, I myself am a developer for mobile devices. So let’s get down to business, we’re going to be in Austin from March 10-15 for the SXSW(south by southwest http://sxsw.com/convention). I was wondering if any of you guys are going so that we could meet up and share a couple of ideas I have. I am looking forward to meeting some of you GREAT developers!
Thanks in advance,
John
Social Media Analyst
Samsung Mobile USA
Twitter: @SamsungJohn

Is this for real? Please provide some proof you work for samsung.

Sooooo...what's the hold up with Froyo, John?

wonner said:
Sooooo...what's the hold up with Froyo, John?
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+1
Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I897 using XDA App

I honestly hope you are authentic. It is about time that the people who make the phones embrace the superior developmental process.

Pikabob said:
I honestly hope you are authentic. It is about time that the people who make the phones embrace the superior developmental process.
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Or at least attempt to embrace some kind of something. That'd be a start for Samsung.

Sounds like BS advertising to get people in seats at this event.

Interesting...go through his previous posts once, not exactly his first time posting on the forums...

So let’s get down to business, we’re going to be in Austin from March 10-15 for the SXSW(south by southwest http://sxsw.com/convention).
The link doesn't work....

Troll.....

Yeah, sounds troll to me, but it will be nice for them to show here...and learn a bit of how things are done
Sent from my GT-P1000 using XDA App

Real
Yes I am the real deal, I am a developer/social media analyst. I don't mind taking a picture of my badge or something to prove my credibility.

SamsungJohn said:
Yes I am the real deal, I am a developer/social media analyst. I don't mind taking a picture of my badge or something to prove my credibility.
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Click to collapse
I think he's legit, folks.
If you are indeed an analyst for Samsung, welcome to XDA. I'm sure you've already noticed by now that there is a lot of cynicism both for Samsung and your claim of being an employee. Simple reason for this is that most everyone here feels that Samsung has ignored their pleas for help, didn’t deliver promised upgrades, and left millions of Galaxy S owners with buggy software/hardware, etc.
If your goal is to reach out to Samsung users at the grassroots level, you're in the right place. However, you also have a tough job ahead of you. The disenfranchisement runs deep and it will take a lot of effort to fix.
Here are some suggestions for you to escalate internally within Samsung:
1. Support the development efforts of the XDA developers. There are many talented people working quite hard to customize, fix and generally improve Samsung firmware. Samsung should make some effort to provide these developers with source code, tools, and help.
2. Take an honest and upfront approach to product defects that find their way onto store shelves (e.g. GPS, battery, etc). I guarantee the cost of addressing the problem will be fully offset by the shift in customer loyalty. An unreliable product is perceived many times worse if the OEM denies or ignores the issues.
3. Set a release schedule with carrier partners and stick to it. Apple has set the benchmark for frequent over the wire software updates. Android applications are updated with fixes and improvements on a regular basis. In stark contrast, our firmware lags far behind Google’s releases and FOTA is failing more than it’s working. This has to change. Samsung needs to push out regular firmware updates that are applied seamlessly without loss of data. Forget FOTA and do it like Apple does OTW (over the wire).
4. Allow users the option of switching to AOSP. Some people like TouchWiz and some don’t. Give them the choice.
BTW, in addition to being an informed consumer, I work in the mobile industry. I know a fair amount about how it should work. The Samsung Galaxy product suite is performing very well but the real question is how long will it last. Loyalty takes effort to maintain and is easy to lose.
P.S. I may very well be at SXSW but I won’t know for sure until a week or so beforehand.

I understand I have a lot of work ahead of me. As I said before, Im here to establish a partnership with XDA developers. Inbox me to let me know if your going to be there so i can arrange somewhere to meet.

If he was legit, one of the Admins would be announcing that SamsungJohn is a rep from Samsung; he wouldn't be doing it himself as a post in the forum.

paulbh said:
If he was legit, one of the Admins would be announcing that SamsungJohn is a rep from Samsung; he wouldn't be doing it himself as a post in the forum.
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^^^^^^ that's a good point!

SamsungJohn said:
I understand I have a lot of work ahead of me. As I said before, Im here to establish a partnership with XDA developers. Inbox me to let me know if your going to be there so i can arrange somewhere to meet.
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If you are in fact telling the truth, I warmly welcome you to the true birthplace of the galaxy s.

paulbh said:
If he was legit, one of the Admins would be announcing that SamsungJohn is a rep from Samsung; he wouldn't be doing it himself as a post in the forum.
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Why? There's quite a bit of speculation in your claim--why would he have to go through admins to post here?
Sent from my SGH-T959 using XDA App

Kubernetes said:
Why? There's quite a bit of speculation in your claim--why would he have to go through admins to post here?
Sent from my SGH-T959 using XDA App
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You would think that someone who is in the position he claims to be in, would come in a little more professional than just a random post.
He said he has been lurking the forums and likes what he sees. So he has also seen all the dissapointment that is running through these forums as well.
If you were in his position would you not want to come in here, with support and proof of who you are? (there is multiple threads of the same post in other categories, all have been asking for proof for hours)
I'm not saying hes not who he says he is, just think he could have introduced himself a little better.

Guys, do a little research. Pretty easy to figure out that he is either very thorough or he's actually legit.
Maybe we should tell him that it is a welcome first step to see him here.
He is an analyst so he's going to have to escalate pretty far up the food chain to be effective. Hope you're a good communicator John.
Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I897 using XDA App

Contact Samsung directly in regards to Bootloader

Hey guys, instead of only filling complaints with the FCC/Verizon, we should also be pursuing Samsung. I already went ahead and sent out a message on their contact site. It isn't a direct letter to a CEO or anything like that, but, one would believe that enough attention will get a letter slipped through the cracks.
Remember, use tact, type grammatically correct, and be extremely respectful. They may "work for us", and we may "own the product", but without them directly breaking a law, we have no reason to get out of line.
For those of you who have yet to file a complaint with the FCC, might as well spend the time doing that as well in the same sitting.
Here is the letter I sent, as well as the link to their form.
https://contactus.samsung.com/custo...MailQuestionProduct.jsp?SITE_ID=1&titleCode=1
Sir or Ma'am,
I am writing today in regards to the issue with the locked bootloader on the Verizon SCH-i535. In many regards this is one of the greatest phones I have ever used, I also have the Verizon Nexus device. My issue, along with thousands of other Verizon subscribers, is that we would like the capability to unlock the device for free use.
Verizon was just recently fined for not allowing certain apps like tethering to be used on the network by the FCC. I know this doesn't hold any relevance much to the bootloader, however, it seems as if with Verizon being the only network requiring such locks that there must be some other underlying decision. Manufacturers like HTC have taken measures to allow unlocking of their devices on Verizon with their HTC Developers portal. This may only be a personal, or small community opinion, but I believe the device would sell significantly better, at least among the knowledgeable developers/modders, if it was unlocked, or unlock-able.
There have been several petitions past around, as well as dozens of e-mails, tweets, and the like to try and understand why we are being forced to be locked down unlike the other carriers. It doesn't seem appropriate that the Galaxy Nexus should be capable of being unlocked, while this device cannot. How does locking one device prevent harming the "integrity" of the network? If this were truly an issue, I would assume any and every device would be locked before they were even introduced to the network, as well, other carriers would follow suit.
In a side note, many willing customers have been awaiting the "Developer Edition" device. We are all aware that there really is not difference between this device and ours, aside from being capable of unlocking. So, how can there be 2 of the same devices on the same network, yet the device we hold cannot be unlocked? It really seems as if you guys are trying to work FOR us, the customer, while Verizon is working against all of us.
In the end, really I am just another loyal customer curious as to if/when we could see a utility that would give us the capability of unlocking out device to use at our liking? We are all well aware that it may void our warranty, but in our eyes the benefit outweighs the risk.
I would like to ask politely if my concern be passed along to all of those that may be concerned, specifically Samsung Mobile US CEO and such.
Thank you all for your time, I look forward to a response.
Respectfully,
Andrew Lemacks
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Click to collapse

I will do the same with your template. Thank you sir

No problem. This tactic has worked on HTC devices, I would assume Samsung should follow suit. Although, Samsung has less to lose.

Very nice letter, hopefully you can get a response or have your letter be passed along to somebody who can say something that doesn't sound like automated message.

Will do. Thank you!

Sent mine.

JetBlue said:
Very nice letter, hopefully you can get a response or have your letter be passed along to somebody who can say something that doesn't sound like automated message.
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Realized auto-correct isn't automatically correct after re-reading it, lol. *out* instead of *our*
duxup said:
Will do. Thank you!
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detta123 said:
Sent mine.
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Awesome, the more the better.

Anyone who hasn't seen, you may want to follow up with using EDNYLaw's template for filing your complaint in about the best manner possible. He couldn't make it any easier! When they FCC gets flooded with complaints like that, it's a lot harder to look the other way as you shred what look like "legal" documents. Take the time people. http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=1820634&page=8

Good luck!

No need for luck.

Already sent the FCC complaint, not just did this as well.

Awesome, let's continue the push everyone!
Edit: tapatalk thinks I'm on a nexus, lol.
Sent from my Galaxy Nexus using Tapatalk 2

Looks like I got my reply.
Code:
Dear Chris,
Thank you for your inquiry about your Samsung Galaxy S® III (Verizon)(SCH-I535) and we understand that you're having concern with the locked bootloader of the phone.
We also understand that you're requesting to have the option to unlocked the bootloader of the phone, instead of purchasing a Verizon's Developers Edition Galaxy S3 phone.
We apologize for any inconvenience this may have caused you. We appreciate hearing from our customers, as your comments are vital for us to continue improving our products, as well as our business.
There is no configurable option on the handset to unlock the Bootloader, as this may affect the software of the phone and also can cause unstable performace. The phone was designed manufactured to the specifications of Verizon Wireless for whom they are produced. We will forward your feedback request to the appropriate parties for further review and consideration.
Do you have more questions regarding Samsung Mobile Phones and Accessories? For 24 hour information and assistance, we offer our new FAQ/ARS System - Automated Response System at http://www.samsung.com/support.
Thank you for your continued interest in Samsung products.
Sincerely,
Victor
Technical Support

I haven't even received a standard reply yet. I didn't even get an automated response stating they got my inquiry. I may need to resubmit, unless this means they are actually reading what we say and replying in kind.
ddggttff3 said:
Looks like I got my reply.
Code:
Dear Chris,
Thank you for your inquiry about your Samsung Galaxy S® III (Verizon)(SCH-I535) and we understand that you're having concern with the locked bootloader of the phone.
We also understand that you're requesting to have the option to unlocked the bootloader of the phone, instead of purchasing a Verizon's Developers Edition Galaxy S3 phone.
We apologize for any inconvenience this may have caused you. We appreciate hearing from our customers, as your comments are vital for us to continue improving our products, as well as our business.
There is no configurable option on the handset to unlock the Bootloader, as this may affect the software of the phone and also can cause unstable performace. The phone was designed manufactured to the specifications of Verizon Wireless for whom they are produced. We will forward your feedback request to the appropriate parties for further review and consideration.
Do you have more questions regarding Samsung Mobile Phones and Accessories? For 24 hour information and assistance, we offer our new FAQ/ARS System - Automated Response System at http://www.samsung.com/support.
Thank you for your continued interest in Samsung products.
Sincerely,
Victor
Technical Support
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Click to collapse

AtLemacks said:
I haven't even received a standard reply yet. I didn't even get an automated response stating they got my inquiry. I may need to resubmit, unless this means they are actually reading what we say and replying in kind.
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I never got a confirmation email from sending the message, but that showed up in my inbox today, so im guessing they are reading them one by one.

ddggttff3 said:
I never got a confirmation email from sending the message, but that showed up in my inbox today, so im guessing they are reading them one by one.
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Well that is a good sign! Here's to hoping I get something good this weekend!

AtLemacks said:
Remember, use tact, type grammatically correct, and be extremely respectful. They may "work for us", and we may "own the product", but without them directly breaking a law, we have no reason to get out of line.
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This. This! 1,000 times this!
The fastest way to get any communication to a company round-filed is to be disrespectful, to not meticulously grammar-check your writing (seriously, have at least one other person check it for you before sending), and to resort to foul language of any sort (even milder stuff like "damn", "hell", etc can give your letter an offputting tone).
As AtLemacks said, they're not breaking the law, and they've done this under the direction of Verizon. As crappy as Samsung can be in the software arena, they are not ultimately to blame for this (though they could bear some culpability for not pushing back).
So please, check your writing, have someone else read it, read it again, put it down and go to bed for the night, then read it again when you get up in the morning before you send it out.

I got a response from Samsung today and I just had to post it here. My emotions as I initially saw that I had this but then started, and completed, reading it: :victory: -> ->:rofl: -> :crying:. I have not altered ANY of this email including the names. As you read it, keep in mind my letter was extremely polite and grammatically correct...and my name is NOT Rick.
Dear Rick,
Thank you for your inquiry. I see that that you have question of unlock the bootloader so you can customize the phone.
As of now We still do not have updates about that, and as of now verizon lock the bootloader.But if we have update about unlocking the bootloader will be posting it to the website so please do visit our website(www.samsung.com/us).
At your earliest convenience, please call Samsung Customer Support by phone at our toll free number 1-800-726-7864. Please choose the following options by pressing 1 – Customer, 2 – Tablet, and then 3 – Wi-Fi Galaxy Tablet.
We appreciate your continued interest in Samsung products.
Sincerely,
Claire
Technical Support

I got the good ole generic reply back too, that it has been forwarded. Now, if there is any weight to the statement, lets keep the push going and fill up a few e-mail inbox's!

Motorola just heaped a load of cow dung on us today!

Today the Moto upgrade page changed the status of the AT&T Atrix 2 and Atrix 4G to "Further plans coming soon," so they have reneged on their promise of 3rd quarter of this year. Thanks Moto for heaping a stinking load of cow dung on us. Why did they have people sign up for a soak test that never happened? Here is the upgrade page updated on 22-September-2012.
https://forums.motorola.com/pages/00add97d6c
Unless they plan on going straight to Jelly Bean this is very upsetting.

I'm really hoping that this means we are going straight to JB, but knowing Moto, who knows. I guess we are lucky they haven't relegated us to staying on GB like they did with some of the other devices on that list.
Sent from my MB865 using xda app-developers app

They could've just released the second or first leak as the OTA and unlocked the BL and ppl would've been happy.
Hopefully we get JB... not counting on it though. Good thing i decided to install the leak and SCv7. Thanks to jim and rdavisct and all the devs here.
Motorola sucks! I'm very upset about this.
Sent from my MB865 using xda app-developers app

Other regions are getting ICS rolled out...
Its not moto its at&t, and its at&t about the bootloaders too, the Photon Q is a sprint phone, thats why you can unlock the bootloader.

I'm going to blame the carriers on this one. No other reason moto can roll out ICS to Atrix 2 that are in other regions other then the USA.
FYI: ICS is official in the SEA region as of 11 Sept. The website says Q4 2012, but let me assure you, that is not the case.
Motorola SEA
11 September
Good morning! We are pleased to let our Motorola XOOM2 and ATRIX2 users know that they will be receiving an over-the-air update to Android 4.0 (Ice Cream Sandwich). Users can also do a manual upgrade by going to Settings\About Tablet\Systems Updates. Please note that the upgrade does not allow for a previous version of Android to be re-installed, and we do recommend that users back up their data prior to this upgrade.
For more inquiries please contact our Product Inquiry Hotlines listed in our previous post. Thank you.

Yes, after some reflection the blame should be on AT&T. Atrix 2s all over the world including China, Cambodia, India and more got the ICS update already. So the likely reason is that AT&T blocked the update so people would upgrade to a new phone and extend their contracts. Since I am using an AT&T Atrix 2 (unlocked) in Thailand that is not an option for me. For regular AT&T customers with an Atrix 2, it looks like AT&T scubmagged you.

I am not a litigious person but if AT&T is blocking these updates, there are some grounds for us the consumer for a legal remedy. There are bugs and problems with the current OS and the update is supposed to fix these for us. The fact that AT&T is blocking us from getting them from the manufacturer is a violation and breach of our warranty and grounds for a lawsuit.

I am now a bit more thankful that I moved onto the AHD, however I mourn for all of my Atrix 2 friends here.
The good news is that the A2 community already has two different ICS leaks which have been worked on since early July, so it's not as if the phones can't run ICS at all. Needless to say, AT&T seems to be the culprit for this major hold-up.
Also, @ ajsedlacek, you likely wouldn't be able to sue AT&T for anything. They probably have a clause releasing them from any potential lawsuits once you sign a contract agreement with them.

Agree 100% with this. In the US the carriers hold all the power. None of them are exempt. Heck... look at the BS Verizon pulled with their "Nexus"
All international phones will get updates first for a variety of reasons, with a big reason being the carriers
Sent from my SGH-I777 using xda premium

I think most of us saw this coming. When I woke up this morning and saw the news, it definitely wasn't surprising to me.
My opinion on all of this, screw it. We've got awesome Devs here that are absolutely awesome at what they do, and personally, the LEAKS that we have of ICS are just fine for me.
Also, CM10 from Jim (and others) is right around the corner, and that excites me much more than getting official ICS. Granted it would be nice to have the official version, but there are better things in store for our Atrix 2.

Axis_Drummer said:
I think most of us saw this coming. When I woke up this morning and saw the news, it definitely wasn't surprising to me.
My opinion on all of this, screw it. We've got awesome Devs here that are absolutely awesome at what they do, and personally, the LEAKS that we have of ICS are just fine for me.
Also, CM10 from Jim (and others) is right around the corner, and that excites me much more than getting official ICS. Granted it would be nice to have the official version, but there are better things in store for our Atrix 2.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I agree 100%.
Sent from my MB865 running CM10

What folks here really need to do, is swallow their 'entitlements' and stop acting like they're "owed" something. It's getting ridiculous, and rather embarrassing to read. You all bought an Atrix 2, that doesn't mean you also purchased the moon and the stars and everything else you've ever wished upon. We get what we get, so don't throw a fit. Whatever comes our way, will be made more amazing by our talented development team. Stop crying about timetables, what you anticipated, and what you feel you deserve. It's a phone for Christ's sake, and to be such malcontents about when we "get this or that" is leaving a rather bitter, self-warranted, rotten taste in the mouth of this forum. Does Motorola suck? Yeah, undeniably so. Does AT&T hold back inexplicably? Certainly. But, you bought the tickets, now take the ride. Stop complaining, or buy another phone. If you're staying with the A2, you can take solace in the fact we have an inarguable competence and talent here, otherwise, take your b¡tching elsewhere. It's growing ever so redundant, and removes from the integrity of everything we've done here, if the threads are flooded with crap like this...
Two bits offered, take 'em or leave 'em...
EDIT: Sorry for the rant, but c'mon, enough is enough.
Sent from my rooted Mayan Calendar

whatever, man
i told my mommy im not getting ics, and she's calling at&t tomorrow :laugh:

souljaboy said:
whatever, man
i told my mommy im not getting ics, and she's calling at&t tomorrow :laugh:
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Case in point. I've seen enough from you already.
Edit: If you're joking around with me, ha-Ha. I hope that's what you're looking for. If not, you have more practice to be done with your reading comprehension.
Sent from my rooted Mayan Calendar

Yeah.., I'm not understanding why everyone is crazy about "OFFICIAL" ICS. We already have a leak or rather 2 that have barely if any bugs and a couple of GREAT rom's based on ICS. Furthermore we have a fully working build of CM10 based of off Jellybean (not counting the camera... yet). Personally I couldn't care less about when an "official" version is released because it won't change anything, and I advise you all to do the same.

Just my 2 cents. Not in response to anybody but just my opinion.
The whole argument about updates being not "promised" and being "gratis" is bogus. So is the argument about manufacturers hands being tied by Google.
Short of a legally enforceable contract, Google as well as the manufacturers do everything in their power to lead people into believing that their phones will be updated to the next version of the OS. Google had announced the Alliance with the declared aim of providing OS updates for 18 months from device release date. Last time I checked, Moto was a part of the alliance. Moto has had the Atrix 2 on its update page since February 2012, if I'm not wrong. At the very least, this is a Gentleman's agreement on the part of Google/manufacturer that our phone will be updated. Now if any manufacturer wants to say that it had made no legally binding committment to update, where is the honour in that? Why should I trust such a corporation with my hard earned money in the future? As far as I'm concerned, there WAS a pomise, either express or implied, to update my phone and the manufacturer has dishonourably reneged.
This appeared on the Moto forum:
"Thank you for being a Motorola Mobility customer. We know you value having the latest and greatest technology on your device. We are working very closely with Google and our carrier partners to bring you the best possible experience on each of our devices powered by Android. This means ensuring that all upgrades and updates enhance device functionality and provide an overall improved experience.
As previously communicated, DROID RAZR, DROID RAZR MAXX, DROID 4, DROID BIONIC, DROID XYBOARD 8.2 and 10.1, and MOTOROLA XOOM WiFI + 3G/4G will be upgraded to ICS. Additional details on timing for these products will be shared at a later date.
To help our customers understand the steps we go through to develop an upgrade, we are describing the high-level process for delivering upgrades below. During this process, we work to ensure that an upgrade is possible, and that it provides a satisfying experience. For each smartphone or tablet currently in the market, you will see updated information on what stage the upgrade plan is in.
* Please note this timing is Motorola Mobility's best estimate and contingent on successful completion of testing.
==> https://forums.motorola.com/pages/00add97d6c"
Clearly that sounds like a promise of OS upgrades to come. So untill my next phone states on the box "This unit will not receive any further OS updates from us" I'll expect the updates to come in a somewhat timely manner.
Updates being free is anouther argument I have never understood, even when accompanied by the inappropriate analogy of PC and Windows OS. Unlike in PCs, mobile device owners are completely dependent on the manufacturer to provide OS updates. The cost of developing updates has obviously already been paid in advance by the device owners - would the manufacturers sell even half the number of devices if they told their customers upfront that they would not provide any updates? These are functionality and security updates to an OS that is still in its infancy on products that cost hundreds of dollars one way or the other.
About manufacturers being hamstrung by Google/carriers, Google has already released the OS source code for manufacturers to do as they please. The carrier argument may be true though - I guess if you buy a subsidized phone, you got to be prepared to pamper to the whims of the carrier.
About the phones getting updates through leaks, I would guess even the people who do not visit xda, who don't know nothing about installing leaks ... deserve to have ICS on their phones?

Apex_Strider said:
What folks here really need to do, is swallow their 'entitlements' and stop acting like they're "owed" something.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Ummm...Yes, I (we) are owed something. Its called updates and bug fixes.
So far one upgrade with no real fixes...
If you're OK with that, so be it. But don't try to sit here and tell people what they should or should not be doing.
Yes the deb's here have done a great job. Saying that, its not their jobs! It is that of Motorola's and at&TS.
Sent from my MB865 using xda app-developers app

dk-v1 said:
Ummm...Yes, I (we) are owed something. Its called updates and bug fixes.
So far one upgrade with no real fixes...
If you're OK with that, so be it. But don't try to sit here and tell people what they should or should not be doing.
Yes the deb's here have done a great job. Saying that, its not their jobs! It is that of Motorola's and at&TS.
Sent from my MB865 using xda app-developers app
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You've so much to learn, young grasshopper...
The "upgrade" wasn't an 'upgrade', it was a leak, I'm sure you recall this, yeah? If it was an official OTA, and needed "bug fixes", likely we would have already gotten them. What we did, was hack the Moto servers, to 'fish' for updates. We found one (two, to be specific) and nothing subsequent to that is owed to us by Moto or AT&T, because what we found wasn't even intended for use by us -the end consumer. We'll get the release when we get it. My point was for everyone to stop this incessant b¡tching and whining. It's borderline manic...
Sent from my rooted Mayan Calendar

I don't think anyone feels entitled to anything, but it is reasonable to expect some updates and maintenance. Granted we got 2.3.6, but is that really an update when most everyone else at the time was running 2.3.7?
I don't think anyone here questions the contributions made by the devs, nor isn't grateful. I think we're all just frustrated that we're behind the times and know that we have a lot of potential going to waste.
I came from M3 and had a Motorola Cliq XT, so I been through all of this before with Moto and their updates. Fortunately we had Turl (which some of you devs might know), and when I left there about a year ago we had CM7 2.3.7 running great on a phone that had barely a 1/3 of the hardware we have on our A2.
I'm confident we'll move forward, we have some great devs here. We're all entitled to our opinions and expectations, and we all want more because we know we're more than capable of taking advantage of it. I think we just need to organize and focus on what we have going on here at XDA. Personally, I'm excited for CM10 and can't wait to get something more proper running on this piece lol.
Sent from my MB865 using xda app-developers app

Not sure how I feel about this. Mixed feelings here. Their explanations are not very clear.