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Touch Pro Camera sharpness ... normal?

Hi Guys!
I'm really happy with my Touch Pro for about a month or so, but one thing really dissapoints me : the camera. Before this TP I had a N95 and it really has a great camera; fast, vivid and sharp.
I have tried virtually every available setting in the TP Camera, but I keep getting pictures that aren't really sharp. Best result is pictures taken from a short distance, but when I try to shoot for example my house or street (daylight!) it's a bit blurry.
What's with your TP camera's; are they 'great' of do you have the same impression as I do?

well the HTC company has come from far considering the camera`s.
when al the other manufactor`s like samsung or nokia had 1.3 and 2.1 MP in their phone`s, htc was still stuck with 0.3 MP in their phone`s.
second while for all the other manufactory`s the camera function was very important to them, it wasn`t for htc.
htc never was sold as a camera phone but as an PPC or PDA with a camera.
and don`t forget that a company like sony and samsung already made very good foto and video camera`s it was easy for them to implement a good camere in their phone.
so altouch you now have a nice 3.2MP with autophocus on youre HTC it stil isent a real photo camera.
it just can take picture`s and good ones for the majority of people.
still if you want to take a proffesionel looking foto you got to do it with youre real camera
personaly for me the camera in the HTC is good for a quick snapshot or a nice picture.
sure i would like to see a better camera on the Touch pro or diamond, but if it was just the good camera i wanted i was getting me a sony ericsson.
probably you did aspect more from the camera of youre HTC, and that is to bad.
maybe you did not do any research on the camera`s in the past.
or you didn`t see picture`s taken with an HTC before you bought yours and so i can understand the disappointment you are having.
but you probably haveto live with it.
there are also some settings you can adjust with, maybe you got to try it out.
point is, HTC has a camera on it but it is not the most important thing on the phone.

Are you touching the round button first to get a focus, before you depress it fully to take the shot? Lightly placing your finger on the button causes the indicator on-screen to go green, indicating focus has been achieved. If you don't do it in these two steps, the camera hasn't focussed properly and your shots will be fuzzy.
I tend to get pretty good shots with mine.
It's all there in the manual.

You really can't expect much from the pinhole camera. The focus is strictly software contrast detection fixed focus, so it will be nowhere as good as a real camera with true autofocus. Basically it's stuck at a super high aperture (fstop, like f22) so that it can focus on everything. It can't really truly "focus." With such cheap cameras, it's possible some just aren't calibrated right. I'm still waiting for those liquid lenses that were suppose to revolutionize camera phones 2 years ago or the Squiggle 5mm focusing motor.

What i found a lot of people doing is they hold the thumb over the button and hear the fake focus noise and think thats it, when it fact you have to keep your thumb there until you hear the focus beeps. Usually takes 2-3 seconds. I'm actually kinda impress how macro the focus can get. Noise is pretty bad though, you'll need to reduce the image by at least 1/4th to get rid of it via subsampling.

Thanks very much for all your quick replies!
Yep; I'm using a light touch on the button and wait for the auto-focus to become green before completely pressing. I also tried other settings like pressing once and waiting for the picture to be taken.
I complete understand your filosophy about that the HTC builds PPC's / PDA's and not camera-phones like the Sony or Nokia. In that light; the pictures of the 3.2MP camera aren't too bad.
However, I am used to carrying my phone with me everywhere and sometimes would like to take a picture without carrying my normal camera around. That was going really great with the N95; so great that most of the time I left my real camera at home. Now, with the HTC, I have to remember to carry my camera with me when I am going somewhere I might want to take a picture. That sucks in my opiniion
I did extensive research on the phone I wanted and the TP was the best match for my needs. I thought. Never thought about checking the camera-quality. Stupid me.
But... I am not thinking of getting rid of the phone because of the camera. Yet.

I don't think it's a focus problem, I think the problem is the low quality of the lens. Yes, unfortunately TP doesn't have nearly the quality of a N95 or similar, but the N series has always been about great multimedia cameraphones, which isn't TP's market. I'm not justifying the bad quality, I'm just saying I didn't expect a great camera from a professional phone.

what about the camera quality compared to a 2mp BlackBerry camera??
just curious

msmith1991 said:
what about the camera quality compared to a 2mp BlackBerry camera??
just curious
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I also have a BlackBerry Pearl from my work and its camera is about the same quality as the Touch Pro. Sometimes even a bit sharper but less colourfull. It hasn't got autofocus.

G Tablet FF Camera upgrade?

I'm just curious, and still have not found the answer I was looking for via search.
Can the 1.3mp camera be replaced with a better a 5mp camera on the G Tablet?...
Assuming The hardware exists, and that it is compatible, is possible I am sure a new kernel is needed, what about the possibility of adding 720 recording like the hd2(android version) or the nexus one?
Any thoughts would be appreciated, and thanks in advance.

I would personally love to see the addition of a 5 or 8MP rear-facing camera. Yeah, I know it would involve some massive hardware hacking, but it would be a nice addition.

Is that pain and suffering really worth the upgrade? There would be no way to use the camera effectively because you would have to have you back to what you were shooting. My opinion would be to go buy an HD video camera for $150. Cheaper and easier than hacking your tablet up.

This is one thing that frustrates me about my G-tablet. I took some videos of the family out in the snow the other day and it was a real pain trying to capture the video since the camera only faces forward. The video turned out alright since we were outside and in good light. I've found that unless you are in really good lighting, the camera does not perform well. The quality didn't even compare to most of the devices that are out on the market now (latest Android 720p phones, iPhone/iPod Touch).
I'm looking forward to the NI Adam's swivel camera. It should be really nice for not only video chatting (front-facing) but also being able to film other things from different angles. For example, it would be nice to angle the camera almost completely to the back to film other people in front of you or angle the camera perpendicular to the device if you want to lay it on the table and do a timed photo or something similar. The camera is supposed to be higher resolution on the NI Adam, but higher MP doesn't necessarily equal higher quality so I'm crossing my fingers.

I wonder if now that we have kernel source there wouldn't be some way to add support for usb webcams? I imagine the only reason no one has done it yet is because most android devices don't have usb ports.

joshua.lyon said:
This is one thing that frustrates me about my G-tablet. I took some videos of the family out in the snow the other day and it was a real pain trying to capture the video since the camera only faces forward. The video turned out alright since we were outside and in good light. I've found that unless you are in really good lighting, the camera does not perform well. The quality didn't even compare to most of the devices that are out on the market now (latest Android 720p phones, iPhone/iPod Touch).
I'm looking forward to the NI Adam's swivel camera. It should be really nice for not only video chatting (front-facing) but also being able to film other things from different angles. For example, it would be nice to angle the camera almost completely to the back to film other people in front of you or angle the camera perpendicular to the device if you want to lay it on the table and do a timed photo or something similar. The camera is supposed to be higher resolution on the NI Adam, but higher MP doesn't necessarily equal higher quality so I'm crossing my fingers.
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The FF camera is only meant for video chatting.

First off, thanks for the replies. I was looking for feedback and info and I need more, please keep them coming.
Second, I too like the idea of a rear cam pics and video, and yes I understand I wouldn't be able to take pics without my back facing, I still want it to be a web cam; The question is can I replace that cam with a better one, even if it may only be a 2.0 or 3mp? If you are going to do video chat, or maybe even streaming videos would a higher mp camera help or hurt?
Third from my understanding there may be room for a rear camera, as well as room for modules that can be added like gps. If I can get any more info and can keep the cost reasonable, I may look into both.
I like the g tab cause its a Do It Yourself-er that has tons of potential, and since I have some time on my hands, I am looking to make any one(or more) of these a potential project.
Thanks Again for the input

Skyydragon said:
First off, thanks for the replies. I was looking for feedback and info and I need more, please keep them coming.
Second, I too like the idea of a rear cam pics and video, and yes I understand I wouldn't be able to take pics without my back facing, I still want it to be a web cam; The question is can I replace that cam with a better one, even if it may only be a 2.0 or 3mp? If you are going to do video chat, or maybe even streaming videos would a higher mp camera help or hurt?
Third from my understanding there may be room for a rear camera, as well as room for modules that can be added like gps. If I can get any more info and can keep the cost reasonable, I may look into both.
I like the g tab cause its a Do It Yourself-er that has tons of potential, and since I have some time on my hands, I am looking to make any one(or more) of these a potential project.
Thanks Again for the input
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There's no way to install a rear facing camera. All these projects you mentioned have been looked into by others and have basically determined not worth it.

jfholijr said:
There's no way to install a rear facing camera. All these projects you mentioned have been looked into by others and have basically determined not worth it.
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If they all have been looked into and determined not worth the trouble, then I will concentrate my efforts elsewhere, I wont waste my time.
Apologies for wasting valuable thread space on this, and thanks for the input.

levrin said:
I wonder if now that we have kernel source there wouldn't be some way to add support for usb webcams? I imagine the only reason no one has done it yet is because most android devices don't have usb ports.
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FWIW, My Odroid T had a functioning USB webcam running android 2.1 and then 2.2. There were some driver issues, but they got them worked out.

Could this camera firmware can updated to Karbonn Titanium S5 ?

[Discussion] Quality of Camera's on Phones

It would be nice to hear some opinions on this following thoughts I've had, ever since I upgraded my phone last year from an iPhone 3G (2.5mp camera I think) to an Xperia Arc S, which at the time was the highest quality / size MP camera on a phone at 8MP, which is still a decent size for a phone camera today, as mid-ranged phones usually start at around 5-8MP and the super smart phones these days are running upward of 10MP, I think 13MP is the highest, at least on Android, that Nokia Symbian phone was like... 42MP? Or at least the fidelity / quality resembled that due to its massive lens housing, god knows what was in there, but if I remember rightly it was only 5MP images... Someone correct me.
Anyway, with my Arc S at 8MP, the images are fairly decent, I mean they're never going to be used for print, so it doesn't really need to be higher. However, as an art graduate, I spend time when I can taking photographs, and I have a 14MP Sony NEX 5, which as standard is already a better quality sensor than the tiny ones that make it into a phone.
My first point is it's still only 1MP higher than these smartphones, which makes me think; say I upgrade my phone in 1 year when 16MP is the highest, now we've gone over, for me I'm reluctant to go higher than my camera because I'd probably be swayed to using the phone more for photography, though the phones would probably have to be double the MP of a decent camera to really compare.
Secondly, Lenses, well the one on my Arc S is fairly standard, though probably more complex than some others as I think it has 7 layers of various shaped pieces of glass. But when it comes down to it, any photographer will tell you it's almost 100% the lens that really makes a photograph what it is, the phones are getting better quality, but the lenses probably aren't, the phones are constantly trying to get thinner which doesn't help matters, but phones have actually gotten fatter sue to bigger screens needing bigger battery, so I'm unsure on this part of the topic.
The lenses I use on my NEX are Canon FD mounts, a format from the early to mid 70's all the way up to about 1994, they are manual lenses because of their age and incompatibility with modern auto-focus, but the quality is superb, and I'm not just saying it, one of the lenses is a 1.4 50mm prime, and can do some great shots, though the camera isn't full frame so the lens works out at 75mm, but I also have a 28mm 2.2 (I think?) prime, which works out around 42mm and is really good.
Both lenses are dated between 1972 and 1982, and no current phone could replicate the fidelity, bokeh and colour, which is one of the reasons why proper cameras will always have the advantage. (The NEX doesn't have a mirror inside so can replicate the original setup of older cameras easily, meaning a huge number of adaptors allows tons of different lenses to become available)
However with the Nokia pureview phone (still don't remember its name... 850?...) It had a body capable of housing some very interesting tech, that hasn't really been used since, at least to my knowledge. Seeing some pictures online really showed you what this phone was capable of, I think the resolution of the images were in the ten thousands X whatever, and remained really sharp, for a phone at least. Maybe it's lack of success is due to it been on a non-leading OS at the time, I can imagine people would want a camera with maybe an Android phone? (Which apparently, Nokia are working on) so maybe it will see it's true colours shine on a larger base OS. If this tech is worth the larger body size of a phone, people are going to want it...
And lastly, Convenience. One of the main points of having a camera is to be able to capture moments WHENEVER, and having a decent camera on a phone has been a growing trend over the past few years, with the growth of social networks, YouTube and Instagram. And you're more likely to have a phone with you than a camera for a situation that's spontaneous.
So what are peoples thoughts? A few months back Jessops one of the leading camera sales company in the UK went into administration, with only a few stores been saved;
Will we see a heightening trend amongst phones been used instead of standalone cameras?
Will they (DSLR's etc) be phased out completely?
Are you an avid photographer with your phone, or do you use a standalone camera?
Am I wrong?
I'd like to hear some opinions, hopefuly some educated ones on the subject will give a sense on the spectrum of issues.
Another point to consider, Smart-Cameras, the new trend of cameras running Android, though I don't think any have interchangeable lenses.
Thanks for reading, also... You may need to change some 'if's to 'of's because my phone has a habit of changing my words.
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I use my phone for everyday rubbish shots (whatsapp and such) and storing information (bustimes, lists, important stuff i take a snapshot of.) .
It will NEVER replace my DSLR.
It simply lacks the functionalities of one. So long as I can't set aperture and change lenses, it's not a real camera. I need my telezoom and macro lenses.
You can't seriously expect a phone, even that 42mp one to be as high - quality as a dslr. Too many pixels crammed into way too small a sensor. As it has always been with phones.
Not to mention, phones lack the power of a dslr. Ever tried taking nightshots with a phone? They're bad. Very bad. Or high speed shots. Nuhuh, they cant. Or far-zoom?
Lets face it, cameras on phones are not meant for professionals. They're meant for people on facebook, twitter and instagram.
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ShadowLea said:
I use my phone for everyday rubbish shots (whatsapp and such) and storing information (bustimes, lists, important stuff i take a snapshot of.) .
It will NEVER replace my DSLR.
It simply lacks the functionalities of one. So long as I can't set aperture and change lenses, it's not a real camera. I need my telezoom and macro lenses.
You can't seriously expect a phone, even that 42mp one to be as high - quality as a dslr. Too many pixels crammed into way too small a sensor. As it has always been with phones.
Not to mention, phones lack the power of a dslr. Ever tried taking nightshots with a phone? They're bad. Very bad. Or high speed shots. Nuhuh, they cant. Or far-zoom?
Lets face it, cameras on phones are not meant for professionals. They're meant for people on facebook, twitter and instagram.
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Man how can you compare a DSLR with a smartphone camera??, a DSLR is a camera with an awesome quality and the smartphone camera is only a phone with a decent camera and not for pro- photographers.. i would always choose a DLSR over a smartphone camera. And by the way i agree with ShadowLea that you can't cram 42mp in a small lens!!! it is outrageous!

Well, it's to do with trends, if you agree or not is a different matter, but lots of pro photographers and teachers will tell you if you ask, about how important this new revolution is, the quality you can get is pretty good, even compared to digital cameras less than 10 years ago.
If it can take photographs then it's a valid form, there are pro photographers then spend lots of their time using phones for photography, 5MP and decent light is enough, some of these phones are better quality than the point and shoot cameras of recent past.
Instagram, though trendy is a very valid post processing tool, just because the majority of people use it recreationaly it doesn't diminish its power, and usage.
People use Polaroid cameras all the time, and they're quite limited, and the quality can vary greatly. You can't change the lens, and you can't really adjust any settings.
Polaroid is probably most comparable to the quality of the mid range smartphones.
As for the Nokia 41MP camera phone, if you actually look at the images you can get a good sense of the quality. The short article can be found here:
http://www.extremetech.com/electron...review-camera-finally-coming-to-windows-phone
You can also easily find examples by doing an image search on Nokia Pureview.
The convenience of a very good quality camera phone can allow for great photos, which is why it's really taking off as a trend.
Denying it is the same arguments as saying Digital is better than Film, though there are still counter arguments, benefits and people still use film cameras and Polaroid.
There's a statistic recently that goes something like; there have been more photographs taken in 2012 than all previous years since photography's invention combined.
I'm not sure if that's word for word correct, but I think it was on a Vsauce YouTube video not long back.
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I think you need to understand that Professional stands for "getting paid for your work" or "being an accomplished/awarded photographer" and not "I can hold a camera!".
Yes, there have been more photo's taken in the last year than since the invention of the photograph. I do hope you are also aware that this includes every halfbrained moron on Instagram and Facebook posting their friday-night drunk shots.
No selfrespecting real photographer uses a phone's camera for his or her work. The only ones that do are either A, doing an experiment, or B, people on the internet fooling themselves into thinking they're photographers.
PHONE CAMERAS DO NOT HAVE APERATURE SETTINGS. And that's where it all ends. There isn't a single pro or semi-pro who uses a fixed aperature camera.
42MP doesn't make a bloody difference if the sensor is meant for 2MP. The photo's may look fine on the internet, but newsflash: Your monitor is 72DPI, not 300. And a 6000x6000 pixel image is always going to look amazing when downsized to 1920x1080 or lower. (which is what every website does.)
As for trends, they're for the common cattle, not semi/professionals. People with knowledge and experience pay attention to specs, not to hypes.
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ShadowLea said:
I think you need to understand that Professional stands for "getting paid for your work" or "being an accomplished/awarded photographer" and not "I can hold a camera!".
Yes, there have been more photo's taken in the last year than since the invention of the photograph. I do hope you are also aware that this includes every halfbrained moron on Instagram and Facebook posting their friday-night drunk shots.
No selfrespecting real photographer uses a phone's camera for his or her work. The only ones that do are either A, doing an experiment, or B, people on the internet fooling themselves into thinking they're photographers.
PHONE CAMERAS DO NOT HAVE APERATURE SETTINGS. And that's where it all ends. There isn't a single pro or semi-pro who uses a fixed aperature camera.
42MP doesn't make a bloody difference if the sensor is meant for 2MP. The photo's may look fine on the internet, but newsflash: Your monitor is 72DPI, not 300. And a 6000x6000 pixel image is always going to look amazing when downsized to 1920x1080 or lower. (which is what every website does.)
As for trends, they're for the common cattle, not semi/professionals. People with knowledge and experience pay attention to specs, not to hypes.
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I think you're missing my point, I meant professional photographers that use iPhones for photography for non print, recreation, street photography etc.
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For those interested in hearing a pro talk about it, I present, Chase Jarvis.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=buDa-m65RyA&feature=youtube_gdata_player
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Is Alcatel lying about the camera/lens on the Idol 3?

So I got an Idol 3 5.5 that fell from 15cm off the ground and of course broke it's screen, so a friend gave me his old iPhone 4S as a replacement until I decide what I will do with the Alcatel. I'm a semi-professional photographer and have been using SLRs and DSLRs for some 15 years. I am astounded how good the camera on the 4 and (almost) a half years old iPhone 4s is, especially compared to the half year old Alcatel. But it's not that the iPhone is excellent (although it is), the Alcatel is, well, not so good.
So, here's a test I did. I photographed the same subject in the same lighting conditions (artifical constant indoor light so no variations in lighting between shots) from the same position, maybe a few milimeteres to the side (not farther or closer to skew the perspective/depth of field).
Photos in next post so I can add attachments to it

Are you kidding me, I can't post photos?

You should not have expected superb photo quality. The cost of the phone speaks for itself.

Can't tell if you are trolling or not.
How are you a semi-professional photographer and comparing an iPhone to the Idol 3. There is more to cameras than just megapixels you know and Apple is known for having top-of-the-line cameras in their phones. Also, if you are an avid photographer, why did it take you getting an iPhone in order to confirm that you don't like the Idol 3 photos?

lying about what though? I don't think they claimed to take better pics than an iphone 4s?

OK guys, it would all make much more sense if I could post photos, but I was actually not comparing the photo quality from iPhone and Alcatel, but rather the exposure values, where the EXIF suggests that the lens on the Alcatel is not f/2.0, but actually something smaller. In the same lighting conditions the iPhone photo had these values:
f/2.4, 1/20s, ISO 200
and the Idol 3:
f/2.0, 1/50s, ISO 1800
and this suggests that there is significantly less light coming to the chip of the Alcatel (almost three stops less). I have tested the exposure value of this situation with my Nikon and it is in sync with the iPhone EXIF values. Also, depth-of-field of the image on the Alcatel when compared to the iPhone is also confirming this. I'm not here to bash Alcatel and would actually be glad if anyone could prove me wrong! Maybe my unit is defective?Please, try to shoot the same frame with the Alcatel and some other camera and compare the exposure values.

I wouldn't say they're lying.
The sensor on the Idol 3 is a Sony IMX214 which has an aperture of f/2.0.
It's a very good sensor, but the camera lens is not as good as the sensor used.
The Nexus 6 & OnePlus One have the same sensor, but the lens used are far superior than one ones on the Idol 3. (Same f/2.0)
I'll say again, the price of the phone speaks for itself.
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Yeah I know that this sensor is used in a variety of cameras and have seen images from the 1+ and they were great! But again, I'm not talking about the quality of the image, I'm talking about it's objective performance in terms of the amount of light that comes to the sensor which seems to be less than they state it should be.
I just remembered that the camera app has that "Pro" mode which makes it possible to manually input the ISO and shutter speed so I will try to do it again comparing it to the iPhone, DSLR and my wife's Sony T3 later today.
I'm sure they used a lens of lower quality but it shouldn't block almost three stops of light compared to other lenses.
Hemidrosis said:
I wouldn't say they're lying.
The sensor on the Idol 3 is a Sony IMX214 which has an aperture of f/2.0.
It's a very good sensor, but the camera lens is not as good as the sensor used.
The Nexus 6 & OnePlus One have the same sensor, but the lens used are far superior than one ones on the Idol 3. (Same f/2.0)
I'll say again, the price of the phone speaks for itself.
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1 -
mrkva123 said:
I'm not here to bash Alcatel and would actually be glad if anyone could prove me wrong!
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and in topic you said that Alcatel is lying.
2-how you managed to shoot photos with your idol3 when it has a broken screen? Cant it be,that your idol3 camera chip or camera lenses are affected after the fall of the device?As a photographer you should know that there is heavy postprocesing and when you use poorly written software it is also bad as hell.
3- you can show usThe pictures using a link to a cloud where you can upload it.
4-The picture quality is not only made by chip. There are also lenses and a software. You can see it everywhere on chineese low budget phones. They use IMX214 bud bad optics and poor software and the pictures look bad. Also you can see it on Alcatel idol3 app that the app has a problem with propper exposure recognition (i have always to tap to a screen on a place i want to have propper exposure metering from).
So in end effect i dont defence ALcatels picture quality it can be far better with software optimalisation. But as many users said before, you cant compare iphone camera to idol3 camera. They are on different levels and as a photographer you should known that time of release is not a comparable fact (you mentioned 4 years old iphone 4....).
Anyway ...who cares?

I'm not saying that they are lying definitely but I'm just asking cause this sounds strange.
Yeah, I can use the phone although its screen is broken since only one part (lower) of the screen is not functioning and the phone is flippable, so I need to constantly flip it to use different parts of the screen.
I sincerely doubt that the fall damaged the camera or any parts of it cause everything works, no artifacts or anything else.
Once again, this has nothing to do with the quality of the lens, chip, software or anything else. Image shot at f/2.0, 1/50s and ISO 200 will have the same exposure value (it would look to be equally light or dark) whether it was shot on an Alcatel Idol 3 or a professional Hasselblad medium-format 50 000 € camera or a film camera, or a camera obscura. Exposure is objectively measurable and is expressed with these values, nothing to do with the quality of the parts used and nothing to do with the quality of the photo, it's just the amount of light, not the quality of it or the image!
I have uploaded the photos to a image hosting service but I can't link to them, I tried numerous times.
DallasCZ said:
1 - and in topic you said that Alcatel is lying.
2-how you managed to shoot photos with your idol3 when it has a broken screen? Cant it be,that your idol3 camera chip or camera lenses are affected after the fall of the device?As a photographer you should know that there is heavy postprocesing and when you use poorly written software it is also bad as hell.
3- you can show usThe pictures using a link to a cloud where you can upload it.
4-The picture quality is not only made by chip. There are also lenses and a software. You can see it everywhere on chineese low budget phones. They use IMX214 bud bad optics and poor software and the pictures look bad. Also you can see it on Alcatel idol3 app that the app has a problem with propper exposure recognition (i have always to tap to a screen on a place i want to have propper exposure metering from).
So in end effect i dont defence ALcatels picture quality it can be far better with software optimalisation. But as many users said before, you cant compare iphone camera to idol3 camera. They are on different levels and as a photographer you should known that time of release is not a comparable fact (you mentioned 4 years old iphone 4....).
Anyway ...who cares?
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I use the app A better camera for making photos and especially indoor photos are much better than using the standard app.
It's made by Almalence which is also making the software for some phone and camera manufacturers.

so, here are the images
first I shot with the iPhone since it can only shoot full auto:
http://imgur.com/CE9xNOc
EXIF says that it's:
1/20 sec, ISO 160 and f/2.4
So I set the Alcatel in the manual mode as follows to be as close to the iPhone shot:
1/30 sec, ISO 200 and the aperture is according to Alcatel, f/2.0 (although when I shot it in manual mode the aperture value is mysteriously omitted from the EXIF). the photo from the Alcatel should be brighter on these settings!
and here's what we get:
http://imgur.com/7d7c407
Once again, this has nothing to do with quality of the camera or any other parts involved, it's not that the Alcatel is worse, it is wrong.

And I finally managed to post photos
can someone please take a photo with the Idol 3 and some other cellphone in the same lighting conditions and scene just to confirm this?
you can check the EXIF values here: http://regex.info/exif.cgi
and write down the exposure values that you get from both phones.

mrkva123 said:
And I finally managed to post photos
can someone please take a photo with the Idol 3 and some other cellphone in the same lighting conditions and scene just to confirm this?
you can check the EXIF values here: http://regex.info/exif.cgi
and write down the exposure values that you get from both phones.
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i see what are you trying to tell, but i as i said, its a mobile phone i dont care.
But as i remember, there was same issue on my previous ZTE V5..the first firmwares said,that the aperture is 2.2 ...people complain about it and they have corrected it in next firmware.
So here can it be also. Ask on redit or in main XDa QA section, maybe someone who better understands optics and photograpy will tell you.

easyriider said:
I use the app A better camera for making photos and especially indoor photos are much better than using the standard app.
It's made by Almalence which is also making the software for some phone and camera manufacturers.
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Awesome! Just installed it and it is definitely the best camera app I have used on this phone. :good:

TallTommy said:
Awesome! Just installed it and it is definitely the best camera app I have used on this phone. :good:
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Agree! Because of you I gave it a try, amazing app + Now it's on sale. Wow

I don't know whether they are lying about the specs of the camera but mine is constantly collecting dust on the inside of the rear lens (already had it cleaned once and it is starting again). Never happened with any other phone I ever had and basically renders the rear camera useless within few weeks.

petertakov said:
I don't know whether they are lying about the specs of the camera but mine is constantly collecting dust on the inside of the rear lens (already had it cleaned once and it is starting again). Never happened with any other phone I ever had and basically renders the rear camera useless within few weeks.
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I have no single piece of dust on my camera..i have it for about 9 months allready.

My camera is also perfectly clean after more than half a year. I don't think they are lying about the specs. I suspect that the problem here is in the t-stop, which no lens manufacturer ever tells you about. The lens on the idol 3 is probably f/2 as they claim, but the amount of light that reaches the sensor has almost nothing to do with the f-stop, it's the t-stop that determines that. You can't actually rely on the f/stop for exposure (though it's a good approximation, usually), the f/stop is really only accurate for the depth of field that you get. I suspect that the t-stop on the idol 3 is lower than the one of the iPhone, while the t-stop of the iPhone happens to be more similar to the one of your DSLR lens. Though I have to say, the exposure difference in the photos you posted is very dramatic, maybe about 2 stops? I don't know if the t-stop can cause such a big difference.
That said, you could also easily test if the idol 3 camera is actually f/2. The idol 3 has a 6.1mm x 4.64mm sensor, and an 3.8mm focal length. Considering the sensor size, the crop factor is 7,2. As you probably know, the crop factor not only affects the focal length, but also the f/stop (and in fact also the ISO, but that doesn't matter now). So the idol 3 has a 35mm equivalent f/stop of f/2 x 7,2= f/14.4 (as far as DoF is concerned, not the exposure, obviously. This is the reason that it's so hard to get nice background blur on photos from smartphones unless you are very close up, it's because they have crazy small apertures like our idol 3 here at f/14.4. Again this is ONLY for DoF, not exposure. Basically because the sensor is very small, the aperture being small doesn't matter for exposure, the amount of light per pixel is about the same as if it was f/2 with a 35mm sensor.)
So, you could grab your Full Frame DSLR, set it to 27,4mm and f/14.4, (or if you have a 1.5x crop sensor DSLR, at 18.2mm and f/9.6), and then take a test picture with that DSLR and one with the idol 3. It's a DoF test shot, so take that into account when taking the photos (maybe set up a couple of items in a row, get them in frame in the same way on the idol 3 and DSLR, and focus on the frontmost item). The pictures from the DSLR and idol 3 should look about the same, DoF wise. The idol 3 will likely be noisier and not as sharp, and the exposure may be different too, but if the DoF is very different, then the idol 3 is not f/2. Setting up the DoF test shots might be tricky, because the minimum focusing distance is probably very different on the idol 3 and DSLR, but if you take these test shots we will at least know for certain if it is f/2 or not.

petertakov said:
I don't know whether they are lying about the specs of the camera but mine is constantly collecting dust on the inside of the rear lens (already had it cleaned once and it is starting again). Never happened with any other phone I ever had and basically renders the rear camera useless within few weeks.
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"Dust in the lens, all we are is dust in the lens..." lol No problems here, and everyone is free to do what they want with their phones, but I assume you are not using a full coverage case? I really can't believe some of the things I see people complain about when they don't use a quality case, and nowadays, a 9H glass screen protector. Not picking on you, and it's possible, even likely you got a bad unit. But "I dropped my phone, and I can't believe the pos shattered! I read it had blah blah next generation glass!" That one really makes me laugh.
And as far as the camera, There are lots of options for downloading/porting other cameras, with better settings and software. It's a $200 cell phone, and taking good pics is something that is important to me, so I always do a little searching on the forums of the new phones I get. I only paid $109 from Cricket, but even at $249 retail, what you get for the money is an amazing piece of technology, not a dedicated top of the line camera. And picture quality is somewhat subjective when you are talking about contrast, exposure, and saturation. Just one man's opinion....

Why new phones have 3 or more cameras?

I don't understand why new phones have a lot of cameras and only one camera have a lot of mpx other have 8mpx or less, is it so hard to make 1 better camera than fill whole back of the phone? Also cameras stick out on new phones so is easier to break it. I think is better to make just one camera with e.g 48mpx than 3 more. Also in my opinion professional camera should be to making photos than normal smartphone.

masturbino69 said:
I don't understand why new phones have a lot of cameras and only one camera have a lot of mpx other have 8mpx or less, is it so hard to make 1 better camera than fill whole back of the phone? Also cameras stick out on new phones so is easier to break it. I think is better to make just one camera with e.g 48mpx and 3 more. Also in my opinion professional camera should be to making photos than normal smartphone.
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Welcome to XDA.
Multiple cams because there's inadequate space for a optical zoom lense.

It's just marketing thing. 3 cameras are "better" than one good main camera.
All these 8MP ultrawide cameras and 2MP macro cameras are pretty much trash.

Dayuser said:
It's just marketing thing. 3 cameras are "better" than one good main camera.
All these 8MP ultrawide cameras and 2MP macro cameras are pretty much trash.
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My 12mp ultra wide does ok even with the fixed focus. When you can't pan back ultra wides are your only option.

My biggest complaint is that the cameras aren't well protected. A sapphire lens cover would be fairly scratch resistant, but would probably add a bit to the cost.

DonutsAreGood said:
My biggest complaint is that the cameras aren't well protected. A sapphire lens cover would be fairly scratch resistant, but would probably add a bit to the cost.
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A good case is all that's needed. I live in the desert (sand and grit everywhere) and this N10+ is 3.5 yo has zero scratches or mars on the factory cam protector.
Case it, keep your fingers off the cam protector and clean with a dry microfiber cloth occasionally. No fuss or bother.
They are generally cheap and easy to replace if damaged.

blackhawk said:
My 12mp ultra wide does ok even with the fixed focus. When you can't pan back ultra wides are your only option.
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Your phone ultrawide is 16MP.. As i remember right that you still have Galaxy Note 10?

Dayuser said:
Your phone ultrawide is 16MP.. As i remember right that you still have Galaxy Note 10?
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My bad, yeah 16mp. After the N10+ Samsung went nuts with the cams. The N20U ie the humpback. Then then the bs highest mp count race was on.

@masturbino69
With regards to thread's title: I think this article
Why Do Some Smartphones Use Multiple Cameras?
Lots of high-end smartphones have added multiple camera modules and lenses to the back of their designs. But why? The fact is that they do different things for different phones, so we’re here to break it all down for you.
www.howtogeek.com
explains it well