Database Info

Forum Members, How aggressive should Moderators be?

I've moved this discussion from the Kaiser_Diamond_Version_1 Thread to open it up for more discussion.
I took a very aggressive Mod Stance in the thread as within minutes of it's creation we were already on page four of posts like:
"Woot I'm first", "Where is the link", "OMG IDK WTF", and such.
Within the first 30 minutes (all before the link was posted) I had removed about 20 pages of worthless posts.
So, users of XDA-Devs give me your feedback on this...

Excuse me? Trying to make the forum more readable of all of you members, remember even with our recent pay increase ($0 added to our already excessive salary of $0) we are still underpaid and overworked allowed the privlige of getting the heel of the boot from members who don't agree with our decisions.
Do you think nobody will complain when the first usable post is somewhere around page 112?
(but of course this post will be deleted within a few minutes also so enjoy and reply while you can)
standbackiamcrazy said:
thanks for all of your hard work, but where is the humanity? and the facist moderating of this forum, i say free ranting! and also free love,(any offers?)
Click to expand...
Click to collapse

Ask questions & take interest sure but 100 pages of "Woot" & "I got first post" or "Man where the %&^#$ is the DL Link" will only serve to flush this thread before the Rom is even released.
orithm said:
Are you deleting posts kyphur? Can't we ask questions and take and interest?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse

orithm said:
Are you deleting posts kyphur? Can't we ask questions and take and interest?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
he is doing his job and trying to keep thread clean to discuss issues.
leo, if u have time, can u plz post benchmarks so we can compare how rom stacks against others?

Jealous, no... Everybody plays, everybody wins.
You completely missed the point of what I'm doing here. Think about what you just said, you've made now 4 posts about something that hasn't been released yet and not one of them was relevant to the topic at hand.
So we end-up with 500 posts in the thread that you have to wade through to get to the 58 which really have something to say about the Rom (once it's released) and everyone wonders why so many members simply start new threads or ask a question that has already been answered 12 times in the thread.
My threads are clean(er) because I aggressivly moderate them. I'm simply expanding that policy into this thread because I know it's gonna be huge even if it is cut down to only the essential posts.
NOTE: even this discussion about my over-aggressive moderation will be removed from the thread (although I just might make it a new thread to allow for discussion of it).
Rougenator said:
Kyphur, I have a lot of respect for u and what you do for this community. But emotions are also important. You deleted 3 of my messages... And they were not that bad... Also Everybody find its way trough the messages Leo gets. Within 2 days he gets more than 20 pages..
Jealous???
Click to expand...
Click to collapse

kyphur said:
Excuse me? Trying to make the forum more readable of all of you members, remember even with our recent pay increase ($0 added to our already excessive salary of $0) we are still underpaid and overworked allowed the privlige of getting the heel of the boot from members who don't agree with our decisions.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I would really like to thank you for moderating this fourm and deleting my message before I got the chance to delete it myself after your post.
Seriously thanks for the hard work and feel free to delete this.

Kyphur thanks man
kyphur said:
Jealous, no... Everybody plays, everybody wins.
You completely missed the point of what I'm doing here. Think about what you just said, you've made now 4 posts about something that hasn't been released yet and not one of them was relevant to the topic at hand.
So we end-up with 500 posts in the thread that you have to wade through to get to the 58 which really have something to say about the Rom (once it's released) and everyone wonders why so many members simply start new threads or ask a question that has already been answered 12 times in the thread.
My threads are clean(er) because I aggressivly moderate them. I'm simply expanding that policy into this thread because I know it's gonna be huge even if it is cut down to only the essential posts.
NOTE: even this discussion about my over-aggressive moderation will be removed from the thread (although I just might make it a new thread to allow for discussion of it).
Click to expand...
Click to collapse

den85nis said:
kyphur said:
Excuse me? Trying to make the forum more readable of all of you members, remember even with our recent pay increase ($0 added to our already excessive salary of $0) we are still underpaid and overworked allowed the privlige of getting the heel of the boot from members who don't agree with our decisions.QUOTE]
I would really like to thank you for moderating this fourm and deleting my message before I got the chance to delete it myself after your post.
Seriously thanks for the hard work and feel free to delete this.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Are you serious? - answers to my questions were not deleted but the questions were, me thinks slightly over zealous..........
EDIT: WONDER HOW LONG TILL THIS GETS DELETED
Click to expand...
Click to collapse

I think deleting genuine posts has meant the post has turned into that not the fab new diamond based rom we are about to receive.
As this is the first diamond rom there will many pertinant questions not currently answered in the first post and the opportunity at least to ask should be there, even if this will need some tidying up later...IMO

Ah, but your question was quoted in the answer so instead of leaving 2 posts I left the one that contained all of the content
orithm said:
Are you serious? - answers to my questions were not deleted but the questions were, me thinks slightly over zealous..........
EDIT: WONDER HOW LONG TILL THIS GETS DELETED
Click to expand...
Click to collapse

kyphur said:
Ah, but your question was quoted in the answer so instead of leaving 2 posts I left the one that contained all of the content
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
My point is rather than moderating minute by minute allow there to be some questions and answers and then tidy it up. OK most posts dont add value (like this one which you can kindly delete) but does it matter? It doesn't matter deleting them I guess but it just feels a bit crappy to find out your geniune posts have been deleted 5 minutes after posting.

I've never had a Rom chef get upset about this kind of trimming and in fact Leo has thanked me for the house cleaning.
Trimming excess content from a thread is Moderator Discretion and I don't often use that as a reason to remove posts. As I said this is gong to be a bear of a thread just becuase it's the first Diamond Port so I'm just doing some preventive maintenance and trying to set the tone early on.
I will be moving all posts regarding my moeration from this thread into another thread in one of the General Forums (later this evening) so we can talk this out if anyone likes.
Everyone's input is appreciated and taken into consideration but I have seen many excellent Rom Chefs walk out of the kitchen because of too many useless posts like "Woot I got first" or "can't wait for the link" etc.
bengalih said:
So, while I appreciate everything you have done for us Kypher, and with all due respect, I think you are overstepping your bounds. If you strongly disagree I would talk it over with the site admins and update forum rules accordingly. If there is a forum rule that already prohibits this (other than an all inclusive "moderator discretion" then please point me to it).
Click to expand...
Click to collapse

kyphur said:
I've never had a Rom chef get upset about this kind of trimming and in fact Leo has thanked me for the house cleaning.
Trimming excess content from a thread is Moderator Discretion and I don't often use that as a reason to remove posts. As I said this is gong to be a bear of a thread just becuase it's the first Diamond Port so I'm just doing some preventive maintenance and trying to set the tone early on.
I will be moving all posts regarding my moeration from this thread into another thread in one of the General Forums (later this evening) so we can talk this out if anyone likes.
Everyone's input is appreciated and taken into consideration but I have seen many excellent Rom Chefs walk out of the kitchen because of too many useless posts like "Woot I got first" or "can't wait for the link" etc.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
great point Kyphur i dont post as many of other user but many people post useless junk like the one you told, let it be people and mantain these forum clean of junk

sorry to post another (useless) post with regards to the title, but i had to speak up my opinion about this.
i really really appreciate the job kyphur and all the other moderators are doing in terms of deleting, cleaning, etc. to be honest, if we hadnt been this used to talk a lot and not say anything, this "job" would not exist. when a noob goes asking questions without searching, everybody starts flaming, but it is just because these insane 100-page threads that they are not reading.
and btw, im active on other forums as well, on different matters, and trust me, this is a more than free and common-sense forum in my opinion. i simply love it.
so lets stop posting useless posts and go to the subject thinking about the others as well, people who want to find out real things about this ROM, for example, and not other BS. for example, i was just trying to find out whether this is more than a diamond-ringtone ROM or not. i managed to find this out after 5-6 pages of threads.
to be honest, even the "im downloading now, thanks a million" posts i find useless. there should be a place with all the master cooks names where they could get thanks and donation and that should not count against the user post count. im wondering how many of those "thanks, ure a GOD", etc. kind of guys would still thank.
just my 2 cents on the matter...
kyphur said:
Jealous, no... Everybody plays, everybody wins.
You completely missed the point of what I'm doing here. Think about what you just said, you've made now 4 posts about something that hasn't been released yet and not one of them was relevant to the topic at hand.
So we end-up with 500 posts in the thread that you have to wade through to get to the 58 which really have something to say about the Rom (once it's released) and everyone wonders why so many members simply start new threads or ask a question that has already been answered 12 times in the thread.
My threads are clean(er) because I aggressivly moderate them. I'm simply expanding that policy into this thread because I know it's gonna be huge even if it is cut down to only the essential posts.
NOTE: even this discussion about my over-aggressive moderation will be removed from the thread (although I just might make it a new thread to allow for discussion of it).
Click to expand...
Click to collapse

ionutz6 said:
sorry to post another (useless) post with regards to the title, but i had to speak up my opinion about this.
i really really appreciate the job kyphur and all the other moderators are doing in terms of deleting, cleaning, etc. to be honest, if we hadnt been this used to talk a lot and not say anything, this "job" would not exist. when a noob goes asking questions without searching, everybody starts flaming, but it is just because these insane 100-page threads that they are not reading.
and btw, im active on other forums as well, on different matters, and trust me, this is a more than free and common-sense forum in my opinion. i simply love it.
so lets stop posting useless posts and go to the subject thinking about the others as well, people who want to find out real things about this ROM, for example, and not other BS. for example, i was just trying to find out whether this is more than a diamond-ringtone ROM or not. i managed to find this out after 5-6 pages of threads.
to be honest, even the "im downloading now, thanks a million" posts i find useless. there should be a place with all the master cooks names where they could get thanks and donation and that should not count against the user post count. im wondering how many of those "thanks, ure a GOD", etc. kind of guys would still thank.
just my 2 cents on the matter...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
ionutule you are so right. There are many ways the topic can be organized. Seperate bug topics for example, or some Thank you tools (a post after the 1st one where all thanks stay together (i dont know if there is such a hack for this forum).
Eitherway... my respect to the rest of the chefs and the mods who r trying to keep mess out of the forums

Please Read!

Hopefully this catches the eyes of those who need to read it most...
Too many people are trying to take the easy road and post a new thread on a subject or idea, usually asking a question about something that has already been answered instead of doing a simple search!
I've been a member here for a couple years now and haven't needed to post very much because, if you take the time, the information is out there. 99.9% of the time, you aren't the first person to ask a question, have a problem, or hit a wall.
If you're having trouble doing something that was posted in a thread, POST YOUR QUESTION IN THAT THREAD!!
It seems as though there are a lot of newbies who are anxious to root their Inc, which is fine: If you pay attention, read the instructions and most of the thread before you begin, and follow them to a T . Every time I have a problem either rooting or installing a ROM or something else, I am the one who did something wrong.
Some of you are probably new to the Thread concept, which is also fine. It's very frustrating getting used to how they work, and learning the "right" way to do things- but trust me, it's worth it.
Posting a new thread is like standing on a chair in the middle of a crowded room and screaming out a question. If your in the wrong room (i.e. wrong section), people are going to be upset. If the question was already answered by another group (i.e. another forum), people are also going to be upset. If you aren't sure if you should start a new thread, you probably shouldn't.
Take the time and READ THE RULES! Here they are if you don't know where to find them:
New forum rules, please read!
1. Search before posting.
Use one of our search functions before posting, whether you have a question or something new to share, it's very likely someone already asked that question or shared that news.
2. Member conduct.
2.1 Language: XDA is a worldwide community. As a result what is ‘ok’ to say in your part of the world may not be ok in someone else’s part of the world. Please think about who is reading what you write. Keep in mind that what you think of as acceptable use of language may not be acceptable to others. Conversely, while reading member posts, remember that word you find offensive may not be to the writer. Tolerance is a two way street.
2.2 Nudity: XDA is used by people of all ages, including minors. It's not acceptable to post nude/pornographic imagery, which includes exposure of the male or female genitalia or of female breasts.
2.3 Flaming: XDA was founded as a group of people sharing information about certain mobile phones. Sharing does not involve virtual yelling (flaming) it does involve working together to solve problems in an environment of mutual respect and understanding. Losing your temper and flaming another member, or group of members, is not acceptable behavior.
2.4 Personal attacks, racial, political and/or religious discussions: XDA is a discussion forum about certain mobile phones. Mobile phones are not racial, political, religious or personally offensive, therefore none of these types of discussions are permitted on XDA.
2.5 New Members: Treat new members the way you would have liked to have been treated when you were a new member. Provide the new members with guidance, advice and instruction always with respect and courtesy.
2.6 All members are expected to read and adhere to the XDA rules.
3. Post only using a clear subject and message.
You're most likely to receive a helpful answer to your question if you use a short subject title that describes your problem and a message that explains in detail what your problem is and what you've tried to solve it.
4. Use the English language.
We understand that with all the different nationalities not everyone speaks English well, but please try. If you're really unable to post in English use an online translator, You're free to include your original message in your own language below the English translation.
5. Post a message only once.
As a large forum we don't need unnecessary clutter, You're free to edit your message as you like, so if you do not receive an answer revisit your message and see if you can describe your problem better. Not everyone is online at the same time, it might take a while before you receive an answer.
6. Do not post warez.
If a piece of software requires you to pay to use it, either pay or find your cracks and serials somewhere else. We do not accept warez nor do we permit any member to promote or describe ways in which Warez, cracks, serial codes or other means of avoiding payment, can be obtained.
7. Do not spam.
If you wish to advertise a product, contact us we provide ads. But do not post it in the forums, it will be removed and you're likely to receive a ban.
You are however allowed to sell used goods like your own device, parts of your device or accessories for your device in the marketplace forum, please read the rules there before posting. (This rule includes signatures, if you use a signature it will appear in your post)
8. Donations.
We appreciate all donations to xda-developers.com, it keeps our forum online and well maintained. As a user you're allowed to ask for donations in your signature as a thank you for your hard work. However donations up front are not allowed, this forum is about sharing, not about getting paid to do something, that's what your job is for.
9. Don't get us in trouble.
Don't post copyrighted materials or do other things that will obviously lead to legal trouble. If you wouldn't do it on your own homepage, you probably don't want to do it here either. This does not mean we agree with everything the software piracy lobby try to impose on us, it simply means you cannot break any laws here, since we'll end up dealing with legal hassle caused by you. Please use common sense: respect the forum, its users, and those that write great code.
10. Help others if you can.
If you see posts from others where you can help out, please do. This place exists because people are helping each other, and even if you are relatively new to the matter, there's probably already quite a few people newer than you that would benefit from what you've learned. Don't be shy.
11. Don’t post with the intent on selling something.
As an elaboration to rule number 7, don’t use XDA to advertise your product or service. If you are the proprietor of a for-pay product or service, you may use XDA to get feedback, provide beta access, or offer support on the product, but you may not make any posts with the primary intent of selling. This includes posting press releases, announcements, or links to downloads for trial software. The only exception to this is when you’re posting an exclusive release to XDA.
12. Using the work of others.
If you are developing something that is based on the work of another Member, you MUST first seek their permission, and you must give credit to the member whose work you used. If a dispute occurs about who developed / created a piece of work, first try to settle the matter by private message and NOT in open forum. If this fails then you may contact a moderator with clear evidence that the work was created by you.
Convincing evidence will result in copied work being removed. If there is no clear evidence you created the work then in the spirit of sharing all work will remain posted on the forums.
These rules apply to all software posted on XDA unless that software comes with a license that waives these rules.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
So instead of starting a new thread like "How do I.." or "Where do I" or "Why can't I..." Do a search of the threads, Google it, or even hop on over to PPC Geeks, Trust me- you'll find the answers you're looking for.
BTW - Thanks to Mikey1022 for moderating

+100000000000000000000000
I wish people had to read this before they could post new threads. This forum seems to be worse than most of the other android forums on xda... not sure why.
Everyone who disagrees with this should check out the nexus one forum to get an idea of how lax things are here.

You better watch it. Some people may take offense to this. people also have to be aware when they do make a new thread that it is in the correct section. Too many questions are being posted in Development instead of General. Let's keep the sections on topic so people can find what they came looking for.

I agree, but I can see the other side as well.
The "Root process" thread is up to 108 pages. Sure, searching helps, but you are still poring over pages and pages of forums for hours. I kind of learned that this was the buy-in from my WinMo days, but that doesn't make it less frustrating.
One advantage to sticking to existing threads, however, is that people who are successful will probably post back to that thread, with any variations they used, whereas they are less likely to post to a new thread.

Calibob2001 said:
Hopefully this catches the eyes of those who need to read it most...
Too many people are trying to take the easy road and post a new thread on a subject or idea, usually asking a question about something that has already been answered instead of doing a simple search!
I've been a member here for a couple years now and haven't needed to post very much because, if you take the time, the information is out there. 99.9% of the time, you aren't the first person to ask a question, have a problem, or hit a wall.
If you're having trouble doing something that was posted in a thread, POST YOUR QUESTION IN THAT THREAD!!
It seems as though there are a lot of newbies who are anxious to root their Inc, which is fine: If you pay attention, read the instructions and most of the thread before you begin, and follow them to a T . Every time I have a problem either rooting or installing a ROM or something else, I am the one who did something wrong.
Some of you are probably new to the Thread concept, which is also fine. It's very frustrating getting used to how they work, and learning the "right" way to do things- but trust me, it's worth it.
Posting a new thread is like standing on a chair in the middle of a crowded room and screaming out a question. If your in the wrong room (i.e. wrong section), people are going to be upset. If the question was already answered by another group (i.e. another forum), people are also going to be upset. If you aren't sure if you should start a new thread, you probably shouldn't.
Take the time and READ THE RULES! Here they are if you don't know where to find them:
So instead of starting a new thread like "How do I.." or "Where do I" or "Why can't I..." Do a search of the threads, Google it, or even hop on over to PPC Geeks, Trust me- you'll find the answers you're looking for.
BTW - Thanks to Mikey1022 for moderating
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
How much time did you spend writing this? No ones going to pay attention.

Calibob2001 said:
Hopefully this catches the eyes of those who need to read it most...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You know they won't. The ones who post these repeated topics are the ones who freak out when they're lost, post a topic, and hit refresh all day instead of looking for the answer. The only ones who actually read this are the ones already pissed off about it.

barry1685 said:
How much time did you spend writing this? No ones going to pay attention.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
LOL, I didn't even read it. Just scrolled to through the comments

bluetooth_decay said:
I agree, but I can see the other side as well.
The "Root process" thread is up to 108 pages. Sure, searching helps, but you are still poring over pages and pages of forums for hours. I kind of learned that this was the buy-in from my WinMo days, but that doesn't make it less frustrating.
One advantage to sticking to existing threads, however, is that people who are successful will probably post back to that thread, with any variations they used, whereas they are less likely to post to a new thread.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
There are so many pages of topics because of the issue that is being described. There is a very handy function called "search" that, while not perfect, at least narrows results down for you. You can search within a Section, Topic or down to a single thread for key words.
Odds are, if you are on here you know how to navigate the web. If you can't perform a basic search in a topic or thread then please don't try to root your phone or follow any instructions to change, modify or "hack" anything.
As was brought out by [OP], if you WANT to do something that you think will be useful to you, read up on it. If you do run into an issue, search the key word of your issue. Entering "boot loop", "frozen", "Error message 123" will return something to help you find your answer. Odds are, you are not alone and, if you find you are alone, return to the thread where you were following instructions to do whatever it was you want to do and post a reply describing your issues. [OP] or others who are familiar with the process will help. Patience is a must.

barry1685 said:
How much time did you spend writing this? No ones going to pay attention.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Far too long than I care to admit - My first draft was rather angry and the overtone has calmed quite a bit...
And even if ONE newbie reads it and gleans even a whisper of insight as to how to operate the forums, then I have been 100% successful- even if 1% of those who read it take this to heart, at this point, that's still 2 fewer Threads the moderators have to close down...

MY Gripe
My biggest grip is those people: "What Music Player Are You Using" I don't really care and that's usually a personal preference. After joining the android section of XDA three months ago. It's astonishing to see how many DUMB post go up...It makes android users look idiotic? I'll admit I'm a noob but you don't see me posting stupid crap all over the place. This time I believe I've found the right section to express my opinion. I still can't get over how many crappy posts are out there. UGH
~PLUR~ Peace Love Unity Respect
DJyoSNOW

Impatient PMers
What's really not acceptable and why I actually stopped helping people in the "Newbie Forums" is because when people wanted more information/answers, I would start to help and then soon after I would receive a PM asking for more help, which is wasteful because then instead of answering the question(s) for the site as a whole, only you are getting your "quick fix".

I am a noob.
I read it and it explains alot.
Thank you. Your site is very helpful and has saved me from problems in the past.
I have posted something once and i was really in a bind but no reply on it. I always search for my questions first and with alot of digging i can find the answers (Most of my answers came from you site by people that blow me away at how knowledgable they are) and most of the people who answer questions are very patient here, (even though there was a thread right above the question with the answer) thank you guys for doing great work.
Again i am very new to all of this and i couldnt be writing this from my rooted incredible with s off and cm 6.0.2 that is overclocked and i did some minor hacks via your forums. Thank you again.
Sent from my ADR6300 using XDA App

I read it.. nice post very Mich appreciated.. not a newb but sometimes feel that way when I'm stuck!
Sent from my ADR6300 using XDA App

I'm sorry to have been THAT guy.
Sent from my ADR6300 using XDA App

Thank You
I read threads on this site every single day but I am much more involved in Android Central (they are smaller and less cluttered IMO), however, I rarely post anything because if you just dig a little deep you WILL find you answer in here.... I just wanted to Say THANK YOU FOR POSTING THIS... I FEEL THE SAME WAY EVERY FRIGGIN DAY.... in the time that it takes for someone to post a new thread and wait for a response, they could have already found the answer themselves. and to top it off, you can search the threads for specifics....
I THINK THAT YOUR OP SHOULD BE A STANDARD WARNING TO ANY AND EVERYONE THAT WANTS TO START A NEW THREAD

lol, you've been a member since 08 and you're just now figuring this out? No offense, but I doubt this will do any real damage. I constantly see these threads and it doesn't do anything cause people will ALWAYS keep posting stuff like this unless it's a hidden subforum. Its ****ty, and I don't mean to rain on your parade, but it's just how it works on forums.

one main problem i see, and im sure its why so many people post the same question 12 different times, is the search on the forums suck, you can type in a specific thing and even if you switch between thread or posts, it brings up EVERYTHING (example: i need to find "honeycomb launcher dock" do i type that in the search, it will bring up EVERY post or thread with ANY of those words in it, and 99.9% of the time its ROMs, no apps, .apk files or anything close to what you are looking for, now when ive looked for a ROM, yea like you said it works 99.9% of the time, with anything else its crap) .to me that was a terrible terrible mistake made by the person that set up the "search tool" on this site. and i think THAT is why there are soooo many "double" posts. the search tool needs to be set up the correct way.

Sonic Design said:
one main problem i see, and im sure its why so many people post the same question 12 different times, is the search on the forums suck, you can type in a specific thing and even if you switch between thread or posts, it brings up EVERYTHING (example: i need to find "honeycomb launcher dock" do i type that in the search, it will bring up EVERY post or thread with ANY of those words in it, and 99.9% of the time its ROMs, no apps, .apk files or anything close to what you are looking for, now when ive looked for a ROM, yea like you said it works 99.9% of the time, with anything else its crap) .to me that was a terrible terrible mistake made by the person that set up the "search tool" on this site. and i think THAT is why there are soooo many "double" posts. the search tool needs to be set up the correct way.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You could enclose those words in quotes, but then it would have to match that phrase perfectly. I personally use google instead of any forum searches as none of them are really all that great (unless I'm searching a particular users' posts).

codybear said:
You could enclose those words in quotes, but then it would have to match that phrase perfectly. I personally use google instead of any forum searches as none of them are really all that great (unless I'm searching a particular users' posts).
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
yea very true, i like to take what most GM's here say and change it
"google is your friend, the forum search is not"

A great resource to help with Google searches are at the google is your friend link in my signature. I usually direct people to that when they say they can't find anything using Google. Just thought I'd point it out so everyone can help spread this resource to those that are not Google savvy.

Bad Forum Ettiquite

I was SO HAPPY when I read the post about "Operation Iron Fist", and SO DISAPPOINTED when I saw the enforcement in action.
Can we PLEASE start issuing 24-48 hour bans for people who break or disregard forum rules?
Example: The VERY FIRST POST in the dev section is titled "If you didn't create "it", then it doesn't belong in Development", and the rest of the post goes on to tell you WHY and WHERE YOU SHOULD POST if you don't meet the criteria for the dev section. A thread like "TEAM TOXIC on GALAXY S 4G" should not have had time to get 9 replies, and the OP should be banned for at least 24 hours for BLATANTLY disregarding the rules.
I saw a thread a couple of days back where a guy was trying to make a place where people could post their WidgetLocker mods/themes. The OP specifically asked people to NOT reply to the thread unless they were posting a theme, but instead they should PM the person with their question and request they update their post with the answer. This thread has AT LEAST 100 ***IDIOTS*** in it asking question after question, making request after request, despite the OPs wishes, and no mod has *ever* done anything about it.
I don't know if "Operation Iron Fist" was a joke or a serious endeavor, but from the looks of things, I'm gonna have to go with the former. People who disregard the rules at their whim -- first time offenders or not, unknowingly or not -- are EXACTLY what is driving devs away from XDA in mass numbers.
I guess what I'm trying to say, here, is; Could we have some ORDER around here? ENFORCE the rules, and start giving people a REASON to follow them...
"Damn, I should have read the rules before I posted that, now I'm banned for a day" -- That guy won't break that rule, again.
"Wow, I just got a warning from a mod because I didn't follow a rule. Oh well" - That guy will break the rules again -- probably including the one he JUST got a warning for.
I've moderated my fair share of forums in my day, and I have to say the **** I see people get away with on here is appalling.
Anyways, that's my two-cents on the subject. I'm pretty frustrated and fed up with having to dig through MOUNTAINS of bull**** to get little tidbits of useful information just because some selfish jackass can't be bothered with reading and following the rules.

Have to agree with you but it is a very big Forum so we cannot read everything that is posted so we need every ones help that way helping us is helping you in the long rum.
As far as the Punishment goes we do have a fair system that includes infractions and bans depending on the crime.
So please if you see anything Report the Post or drop me a pm
Thanks Guys

lufc said:
Have to agree with you but it is a very big Forum so we cannot read everything that is posted so we need every ones help that way helping us is helping you in the long rum.
As far as the Punishment goes we do have a fair system that includes infractions and bans depending on the crime.
So please if you see anything Report the Post or drop me a pm
Thanks Guys
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
He does moderate the forum well but he is human n not god lol use him when u see things that shouldnt be

RaverX3X said:
He does moderate the forum well but he is human n not god lol use him when u see things that shouldnt be
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
yeah, right on. I'll start being more pro-active in that arena

are you saying that I have bad forum etiquette?

jager555 said:
are you saying that I have bad forum etiquette?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Well.. do you ?

NRGZ28 said:
Well.. do you ?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
lolol. only on mondays

No. I'm saying that people should be a little more considerate of others, and not clutter up potentially useful threads and forums with unnecessary stuff. I guess I'm also saying that the penalties for it should be a little more harsh and frequent, IMO.
I have to admit, though, I haven't been making much use of the report button, myself, so I haven't been doing my part, either. That changes here

I do think that people should post threads in their proper forum and that mods are doing a good job, you have to remember that they do have lives outside of xda, they can't be here 24/7.
Sent from my SGH-T959V using XDA App

Yeah, sometimes I kinda lose sight of stuff like that and get a little wound. Thanks for the check, guys
Still pretty frustrated about all the inconsiderate people, though *shrug*

Dev Thread "Spam"

Got some cleanup requests already, so I figured this might help.
The thing with dev thread "spam" is that it is really in the eye of the beholder. :cyclops:
Ultimately it is up to us mods of course but getting some guidance by the devs would be helpful. We can do a thread cleaning on request of the OP, but what I view as "spam" is not necessarily the same as wardfan220's definition of spam. Or the OP's definition of spam.
Everybody knows it when they see it, but what I see is not what you see.
Please do not respond to those posts or troll or flame the poster. Instead, click on the little triangle button in the upper corner of the post and report it so that wardfan220 and I might deal with it appropriately. We aren't trying to stop people from posting, we are trying to teach them to post appropriately.
Some general types of posts that get reported are:
"Thanks for a great ROM" posts
"ETA" posts
"Bug reports" without proper troubleshooting or logging
"Didn't read the OP" posts
Off Topic for various reasons
Please consider this from two angles. What is unacceptable from a new user with 10 posts is often tolerated or even acceptable when done by a senior member or a dev team member for each example above. This can often lead to a perception of unfairness, from both sides.
We will get PM's by new users asking, "why did you delete my "thanks" post in the dev thread and not delete member xxxxxxx's "thanks" post? Is it because member xxxxxxx has 150 posts and I have 10?"
We will get PM's from current users asking "why did you delete my Only-Slightly-Off-Topic post in the dev thread? I have been a good member and it was just a little off topic and the dev doesn't mind".
If the devs could write up some general rules or guidelines as to what they find acceptable or not in their first or second post, when they ask for a thread cleaning or when members report posts as "dev thread spam", it would be very helpful to us making a more informed decision on what is spam and what is not, and have a better chance of getting the dev/OPs desired results, whether in avoiding posts or after the party cleanup.
Discussions and thoughts are welcome.
Thank you,
mf2112

^^ I agree that there is a very fine line between what's acceptable and what's not.
Earlier, I planned on making an "Etiquette thread" just for general guidance, but seeing some replies from fellow members on other thread, gave up on it.
One thing I believe in is that asking for ETA is definitely spam, irrespective of what beautiful wrapper it's wrapped in, because it basically undermines whatever the developer has done so far, in her/her personal time. So, if reported, these posts should be warned.
Other thing I believe is people should be more lenient towards "New users". Instead of scaring them away, or instead of spoonfeeding them with answers, they should be directed to correct thread, where they can read/understand what's going on, and maybe be directed towards development/modding/porting/etc. That's the only way 9003 would be out of "low activity device"
Will add more(got some more as I did a lot of thinking on this) later on, as I need to get a haircut now.
Thanks for this discussion.

Well i admit i am pretty aggressive to noobs which is wrong and against the rules in the first place, but some of them just get on my nerves.
They sometimes just call me or a dev fags / (place world's insults here) for helping them with their question and then sticking a "It's not the right place to ask such questions' note or because a dev is taking his time and not updating something every second.
Others also ignore all other posts / instructions, ask the same question and keep spamming and not accepting to follow the installation instructions again, they don't even post a logcat/whatever to support their claims.
I mostly resort to being a little aggressive and reporting the post if they don't cooperate.. Now i am not a mod, but i don't like being treated like that or seeing some respected member getting insulted because of a fat lazy noob not doing anything and insulting everyone.
Conclusion:
I agree with everything you said here and i do think mods should work with devs and members directly and should take some serious actions against offenders from now on.
I really feel bad for you with having to deal with such issues daily
Goodluck!

Has there been any luck with this idea?
Have devs even attempted it or just ignored this post?
Sent from my GT-I9100 using xda premium

Not much response, but that's ok.

That's a shame really because it's a really good idea.
Sent from my GT-I9100 using xda premium

Issues

This is generally a concern from a friend and I will not be responding to any post or pms from this. (from anyone)
"
I have recently noticed that numerous developers have had their pages deleted because of in proper layout.
1st of all this makes sense that it should be in a the proper layout, but.......... big but here, does that mean delete it before they even get a warning. most developers are doing this on their own time and have their own fans to keep happy. Therefore because a simple source or gitcode is not in place right away, doesn't mean it should be deleted right away. Warn the people first, kinda makes the moderators look like their power hungry and also make people not want to be here. There's a fine line between being moderated or just an _____.
2nd not everyone is going to see the rules right away or may easiely forget to add something to it. This does not give it a right for deletion. Also, note there are many other developers that people have noticed that are no way in these rules and are still up? so makes u curious.....
Anyway I'm not bashing anyone on this, I just feel that the admin should start filtering some moderators for that bad ones. Every forum has at least one dud and it completely ruins the site.
As I said before, I will not be responding to anything from this post or pms. If I get banned fro simply posting a concern and not bashing,it just proves this even more. Or if the page gets deleted.
I think it will be good for the forum if you can see some other peoples views on this issue.
Best of luck with everything, with this hopefully positive feedback.
"
(This was for my friend who was looking for a nexus 7 thread for hours to only find out it was deleted, not my own words to a degree)

Bludra said:
This is generally a concern from a friend and I will not be responding to any post or pms from this. (from anyone)
"
I have recently noticed that numerous developers have had their pages deleted because of in proper layout.
1st of all this makes sense that it should be in a the proper layout, but.......... big but here, does that mean delete it before they even get a warning. most developers are doing this on their own time and have their own fans to keep happy. Therefore because a simple source or gitcode is not in place right away, doesn't mean it should be deleted right away. Warn the people first, kinda makes the moderators look like their power hungry and also make people not want to be here. There's a fine line between being moderated or just an _____.
2nd not everyone is going to see the rules right away or may easiely forget to add something to it. This does not give it a right for deletion. Also, note there are many other developers that people have noticed that are no way in these rules and are still up? so makes u curious.....
Anyway I'm not bashing anyone on this, I just feel that the admin should start filtering some moderators for that bad ones. Every forum has at least one dud and it completely ruins the site.
As I said before, I will not be responding to anything from this post or pms. If I get banned fro simply posting a concern and not bashing,it just proves this even more. Or if the page gets deleted.
I think it will be good for the forum if you can see some other peoples views on this issue.
Best of luck with everything, with this hopefully positive feedback.
"
(This was for my friend who was looking for a nexus 7 thread for hours to only find out it was deleted, not my own words to a degree)
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Threads can be removed from site until the OP is updated to work with the rules. Just because users cant see it doesnt mean it was deleted. There is always a warning given before a thread is deleted. As for keeping fans happy. Boy are you in the wrong place. This is no concern here as this is a Developers site made for and by developers to share work with each other.
For 2. There is no excuse for this. Everyone sees the rules when they join.

zelendel said:
Threads can be removed from site until the OP is updated to work with the rules. Just because users cant see it doesnt mean it was deleted. There is always a warning given before a thread is deleted. As for keeping fans happy. Boy are you in the wrong place. This is no concern here as this is a Developers site made for and by developers to share work with each other.
For 2. There is no excuse for this. Everyone sees the rules when they join.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
^^^^^^^This^^^^^^:good::good:
Bludra said:
This is generally a concern from a friend and I will not be responding to any post or pms from this. (from anyone) Best of luck with everything, with this hopefully positive feedback. "
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Sir if there is an issue/or wish to compliment any Staff of XDA, there are measures in place to help in yours or anyone else's issues:
http://www.xda-developers.com/contact/
Thank you Sir.

Bludra said:
This is generally a concern from a friend and I will not be responding to any post or pms from this. (from anyone)
"
I have recently noticed that numerous developers have had their pages deleted because of in proper layout.
1st of all this makes sense that it should be in a the proper layout, but.......... big but here, does that mean delete it before they even get a warning. most developers are doing this on their own time and have their own fans to keep happy. Therefore because a simple source or gitcode is not in place right away, doesn't mean it should be deleted right away. Warn the people first, kinda makes the moderators look like their power hungry and also make people not want to be here. There's a fine line between being moderated or just an _____.
2nd not everyone is going to see the rules right away or may easiely forget to add something to it. This does not give it a right for deletion. Also, note there are many other developers that people have noticed that are no way in these rules and are still up? so makes u curious.....
Anyway I'm not bashing anyone on this, I just feel that the admin should start filtering some moderators for that bad ones. Every forum has at least one dud and it completely ruins the site.
As I said before, I will not be responding to anything from this post or pms. If I get banned fro simply posting a concern and not bashing,it just proves this even more. Or if the page gets deleted.
I think it will be good for the forum if you can see some other peoples views on this issue.
Best of luck with everything, with this hopefully positive feedback.
"
(This was for my friend who was looking for a nexus 7 thread for hours to only find out it was deleted, not my own words to a degree)
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
There's also a fine line between coming to this site to contribute and thinking you or your "friend" are above the rules!
Rules are rules and if a moderator thinks a thread should be unapproved or deleted then guess what?....there's most likely a reason for this
Also if you're a developer, an RD then you sure as hell better know the rules by now........I mean, they're clearly posted for everyone to see...lol
Oh and about fans, that shouldn't come into play! Whether you're a lone developer just starting out or have a mob of fanboys.....rules are rules! Just because this developer has 10000000000000 kernels or roms or whatever doesn't mean he should get special treatment. AGAIN......rules are rules and if a developer is not held to those rules then how are you going to enforce them on a junior member?
Another thing, from my experience if I have an issue with a moderator.......contacting the moderator committee is the best route! Going off on the moderator or starting a thread complaining about this or that isn't always best.......it will only lead to more threads being closed down and infractions/bans passed around...lol
JUST MY TWO CENTS.......

Bludra said:
This is generally a concern from a friend and I will not be responding to any post or pms from this. (from anyone)
"
I have recently noticed that numerous developers have had their pages deleted because of in proper layout.
1st of all this makes sense that it should be in a the proper layout, but.......... big but here, does that mean delete it before they even get a warning. most developers are doing this on their own time and have their own fans to keep happy. Therefore because a simple source or gitcode is not in place right away, doesn't mean it should be deleted right away. Warn the people first, kinda makes the moderators look like their power hungry and also make people not want to be here. There's a fine line between being moderated or just an _____.
2nd not everyone is going to see the rules right away or may easiely forget to add something to it. This does not give it a right for deletion. Also, note there are many other developers that people have noticed that are no way in these rules and are still up? so makes u curious.....
Anyway I'm not bashing anyone on this, I just feel that the admin should start filtering some moderators for that bad ones. Every forum has at least one dud and it completely ruins the site.
As I said before, I will not be responding to anything from this post or pms. If I get banned fro simply posting a concern and not bashing,it just proves this even more. Or if the page gets deleted.
I think it will be good for the forum if you can see some other peoples views on this issue.
Best of luck with everything, with this hopefully positive feedback.
"
(This was for my friend who was looking for a nexus 7 thread for hours to only find out it was deleted, not my own words to a degree)
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Pretty sure this was involving me since its being talked about in that g+ thread I was tagged in a have read.
This "rd" was sent a pm and explained why it was unapproved and couldve easily sent me a pm in response saying opps if U reappove I'll fix it real quick. Instead there was an insulting pm responded with and multiple bashing threads on site and off site yet the thread was still reapproved.
Forgetting something in an op is one thing. But blatantly doing it cause you don't have time or be cause you believe you are good enough to not have to comply with rules is another thing.
The nexus 4 section had multiple kernel devs get the same pm and everyone else complied with little to no fuss and went on their way.
Also this is a developers site so the whole fan thing means absolutely nothing here.
XDA Moderator

Papa Smurf151 said:
Pretty sure this was involving me since its being talked about in that g+ thread I was tagged in a have read.
This "rd" was sent a pm and explained why it was unapproved and couldve easily sent me a pm in response saying opps if U reappove I'll fix it real quick. Instead there was an insulting pm responded with and multiple bashing threads on site and off site yet the thread was still reapproved.
Forgetting something in an op is one thing. But blatantly doing it cause you don't have time or be cause you believe you are good enough to not have to comply with rules is another thing.
The nexus 4 section had multiple kernel devs get the same pm and everyone else complied with little to no fuss and went on their way.
Also this is a developers site so the whole fan thing means absolutely nothing here.
XDA Moderator
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Maybe I need to spend some more time in that section as I decide if I am getting the Nexus or not.
Now As this as run its course, I am gonna close this up.
Oh and on a side note. Had it been me, a ban would have been issued.
Thread closed