i have read some post from Nvidia.. im just kinda confuse..
http://www.androidcentral.com/nvidia-stop-supporting-harmony-platform-past-froyo
do they really trashing our tablet ? no more drivers for future updates?
that's an old article and speculation has been around since it's original release. From updated stories, Nvidea claims that it WILL provide support IF the manufacturers request it. It's confusing becuase Nvidea says it wants Honeycomb from Google, Viewsonic wants drivers from Nvidea. Google won't approve use of their market or code for Viewsonic, and of course, WE want it all.
So, as it stands right now:
Google will only release Honeycomb to their approved vendors
Nvidea wants Honeycomb, and will support Harmony boards IF manufactureres request it
Viewsonic will update what they currently have, but can't advance their Harmony based products without Nvidea's cooperation.
WE are sitting with Froyo systems with no hardware acceleration becuase either Nvidea isn't providing it, or Viewsonic is not requesting it (or it cant be done) and getting Honeycomb is a pipe dream, since that all depends on Google.
I think I summed it up nicely, but there are a plethora of posts dealing with this exact topic.
That's why my next device is gonna be an apple ipad. They support their devices after more than 3 years. I will never buy anything with the damn android logo or OS on it. Screw you Google, screw you all android companies, you deserve it. I can't believe that I bought 2 new gtablets to become obsolete and without future in the moment I opened the box. If that's the "experience" that google want from android users, so well I got the "experience", now you can make a roll with android and stuck where you know, Google and Android
By the way I know this is old news, but each company is throwing the ball to others and I see they don't give a damn about users.
It's not Google's fault.
It is Google fault for not given permission to companies for using the sources needed, and the companies for no giving support to android. It is Google fault for the mess a Google Market, being not accessible to a most devices, and for the mess with all android versions.
So go and kiss Google if you a fan of them, but don't take out the blame from them because they are guilty as the companies. For me is the end of all Google related products , I'm sick of them. They become the Microsoft of the 2000's.
Bye bye Google and Android.
kekinash said:
It is Google fault for not given permission to companies for using the sources needed, and the companies for no giving support to android. It is Google fault for the mess a Google Market, being not accessible to a most devices, and for the mess with all android versions.
So go and kiss Google if you a fan of them, but don't take out the blame from them because they are guilty as the companies. For me is the end of all Google related products , I'm sick of them. They become the Microsoft of the 2000's.
Bye bye Google and Android.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Well, only "Google experience" devices get full Market access... anyone can build an Android device... anyone can use Android... but they have to partner with Google to get Market access and early access to Android... Viewsonic does not have this partnership... (No, I'm not a die hard fan of Google, but I do love Android).
It's basically up to the manufactures to ask for Google support (and pay for it)...
kekinash said:
It is Google fault for not given permission to companies for using the sources needed, and the companies for no giving support to android. It is Google fault for the mess a Google Market, being not accessible to a most devices, and for the mess with all android versions.
So go and kiss Google if you a fan of them, but don't take out the blame from them because they are guilty as the companies. For me is the end of all Google related products , I'm sick of them. They become the Microsoft of the 2000's.
Bye bye Google and Android.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Not really.
Google sets certain standards that have to be met (primarily hardware features) on a device for that device to have "google support" which it basically Market, Gmail, Gtalk, etc....all the Google provided apps.
As mentioned....anyone can build a device and run Android on it.....download the source code from AOSP and go to town. However...AOSP doesn't have or support the Google proprietary apps (Market, Gmail, etc..).
So, it's not Google's fault, it's the device manufacturers fault for being cheap and not adding the required hardware components to the devices to gain Google support.
This is also another reason why Honeycomb (OS 3.0) hasn't been released to open source yet.....hardware requirements are changing (3G not required, etc...) but they are still wanting a cohesive tablet design.
All these cheap android tablets are built to be cheap....because most people only want to pay xx amount. This gets you a "non supported" device....but if you are on this board.....you know that going in on the purchase. It's the community of developers that increase the overall function and use of these cheap "non supported" tablets.
If you wanted a "Google supported" device, buy one. Xoom, Acer Iconia, ASUS Transformer, etc.... Not a Viewsonic Gtabet, 10s, Nook Color, Coby whatever, Folio 100, etc...etc...etc...
Apple makes the iPad and the iOS running on it.....of course they support it.
Viewsonic makes neither the device or the OS.
thank you tcrews. well said
with all of this being said, I bought a G-tab knowing that it wouldn't be an exceptional piece of hardware out of the box. I knew that it took tweeking. I love my Vegan 5.1.1 system, and enjoy using it every day for games, surfing, news, adding sheet music to it, downloading PDFs for upcoming meetings. It's much more convenient than taking a binder full of music, or a stack of papers into a meeting. My son can watch movies on it, or play games, and the battery lasts longer than my Acer netbook.
Is it the best thing on the market, HELL no...but it's also not the most expensive, either.
AAs far as Google partnerships, I suspect that it's their pressure that intimidates companies. After all, as was mentioned, if you want full Google support, you need to buy a partnered piece of hardware. They typically cost more, simply due to the partnership. SO, in the case of viewsonic specifically, the great devs here have devised a way to bypass the partnership (limited bypass, but still a bypass) So, what's Viewsonic's motivation to acquiring said partnership? If Nvidea is trying to get one, perhaps it was Google that stipulated that Honeycomb will not be available on their Harmony platform.
We all know that if the devs here have hardware drivers for Harmony, and eventually code for Honeycomb, EVERY g-tab owner will have both, without requiring Viewsonic to get a partnership with Google.
So, fault lies in a few places (although definitely not warrented or deserved)
1st, to viewsonic for making such a hackable device. We ALL love the fact that we can put on it, basically, whatever we want. this thing is easier to "jailbreak" than an iPod touch.
2nd, to the devs on this site. They have done WONDERFUL work, for FREE to make our experience what it should be. Indirectly, though, the fact that they've made it "look" so easy, would certainly lead to companies doing whatever it takes to protect their assets.
Think of it this way...Since Google makes profit on the sales of their "approved" devices, why on Earth would they want to give the devs here a chance to make the G-Tablet be able to keep up with the devices that are yet to come? It would be Google that would need to explain to Asus, Motorola, HTC, etc. why people aren't buying their golden tablets, over the discount priced G-tab.
My only complaint in all of this is that Gingerbread is a potential reality on the G-tab. The Harmony board will obviously support it and run it. I would be happy if Nvidea would continue development to make a "STOCK" G-tab perform the way that it's hardware was designed to perform. After that, the devs here could tweak it to make it perform better than anticipated. Once Nvidea updates their drivers to utilize all of the hardware acceleration that the Harmony board is capable of, then I would be fine if their abandoned it.
Hell, in all of this discussion, I find that of the 3 computers I own, 2 are running XP, one is running Vista. I'm obviously not a person that is into the "MUST HAVE THE NEWEST" mentality. I'm sure my Acer would nearly explode if I tried running Windows 7 on it, but I'm not upset...XP works fantastically on it. Same with the G-tab. Honeycomb may run, it may be glitchy, it may have bugs, it may make my G-tab explode...regardless, I'm happy with what I have, but would like the hardware acceleration that I know it can handle.
Todd
Thanks tcrews for the explanation, but I think that companies must put somewhere that the device they sell you doesn't have the blessing of google, or they can't access the market and that you will end with an unsupported and obsolete device after you bough it. for a mere 150 dollars more I can have a device that I know for sure is gonna be supported for more than a year. The same happened with my 2 android phones. I bought them and didn't see any update or fix for all the mess with the Android OS, and the same happens with a lot of devices or phones. The companies just put them on the market knowing that they will not be supported in the future. When it was a cheap phone, that was OK for me, but for a phone you pay more that 400 bucks it's an insult.
Simply put Android right now is a big mess, and will stay in the future far from it, until they fix the mess and companies start giving support to what they sell.
I share your view kekinash.
I don't care who's fault it is, the point is Android is a mess unless you want to get into development, hacking, etc. (All of which I can do to an extent).
I have an android phone made by Samsung, I've got the G-tablet, and I used to have a Motorola android phone. Each device has had a number of unexplained issues, of which no one tends to take responsibility for or any level of accountability. The fingerpointing I observed with my current Samsung phone is nothing short of comical. It's AT&T's issue, oh no, it's Samsung that does the software, oh no, you have to call Google "Android support". Nonsense.
My wife has had to iphones, and as much as I despise Apple, any issues (and they were minimal) were resolved quickly. And, you don't have the issue of the same app not working on the same version of the OS. Yes, Apple will discontinue support for older devices just like anyone else, but I've never fought with the iphone as much as I have to do circus acts with these Android-based devices.
Everyone is entitled to their opinion, and I respect everyone's opinion. I love the Android "concept", but the execution, for me, is far from worth my time.
That's why, whether good or bad, an ipad costs what it does.
kekinash said:
That's why my next device is gonna be an apple ipad. They support their devices after more than 3 years. I will never buy anything with the damn android logo or OS on it. Screw you Google, screw you all android companies, you deserve it. I can't believe that I bought 2 new gtablets to become obsolete and without future in the moment I opened the box. If that's the "experience" that google want from android users, so well I got the "experience", now you can make a roll with android and stuck where you know, Google and Android
By the way I know this is old news, but each company is throwing the ball to others and I see they don't give a damn about users.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Why must we be bothered with cr-apple plugs on a Android forum? Just go over to cr-apple you don't have to announce it. These type of posts leads us to believe you are just a fanboy trolling.
Yeah, typical answer from a fanboy. I not married to either company, I just pointing the differences between both OS, on one (IOs) you get support, on the other (Android) you're at your own.
It's my right to criticize the things I see wrong, you may like it or not, agree or not, but you can't take this right from me, at least here at the States. And saying what another company is doing right is not to be a fanboy.
And by the way, if the developers here and in another places weren't doing a great job with Android, the OS will be a Sh*t, specially with the g tablet, so a big thanks goes to them. I using a non stock rom and this is the only thing that avoided to send back the 2 tables I have.
This thread is not being productive at all. Closed.
Related
multi-touch WTH!
ok.. so i just read this:
VentureBeat claims that Apple specifically asked Google not to use Multi-Touch in their Android platform and Google agreed. The report comes from an unidentified member of the Android team:
Apple, which of course makes the signature multi-touch mobile device, the iPhone, apparently asked Google not to implement it, and Google agreed, an Android team member tells us.
WTH!
I dont see how Apple even got away with patenting multi touch on a touch screen in the first place. Apple has gone overboard with patenting and it seems everything they see now, they patent. I'm surprised they havent tried to patent the wheel since its standard for older iPods.
I'm sure with captive or whatever screens the iphone and g1 use, its gonna have multi touch anyways. Captive screens are built for multi touch and Google/HTC coded it in to not use it but it was only a matter of time before people unlocked it.
I thought Apple actually patented the gestures and not the multi touch part tho. Since G1 doesnt do gestures than I would think Google is in the safe.
I've owned a few iPods and own a Classic iPod now but damn, Apple really blows.
Yep. It's what many people have been saying for a long time.
Never forget that the Google CEO Eric Schmidt is on the Apple board of directors. He'll never compete with Apple unless he absolutely must.
Even the Android move was done simply to meet the major hole in their strategy for mobile devices but he obviously chose to leave Apple their differentiating factors.
Also notice that apps are being released with an iPhone priority first, then Android?
It pisses me off particularly because I don't think Apple has a leg to stand on with their "patent". Multi-touch, specifically the gestures that they claim, have been around for longer than Apple or Fingerworks. Look up Jeff Han from his TED demonstration in 2005. Pinching, zooming, flicking motions, etc.
I think Google just wants to let Palm fight it out with Apple and when it is determined that the pinch and other gestures are not patentable by Apple, Google will be out there with Synaptics and other companies releasing some gesture standards.
Google is just playing nice for now.
A comment i read stated that although multi-touch isn't included it is supported so if some third party developer wants to use it they can. Result- end user gets the features they want and google keeps its hands clean.
As for the apple apps first - i imagine that's just because there's more revenue potential from iphones. At the moment anyway
incidently I have jf RC8 1.4, is there something I need to do to enable multi-touch in the browser?
Google has separate teams for iphone apps and android so its not a matter of apple getting apps first, its a matter of where they are in their development cycle.
Android got latitude first right? Its not yet available for the iphone.
dwang said:
Android got latitude first right? Its not yet available for the iphone.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
..... it is a google product, nothing to do with apple. I would certinaly hope so
moussam said:
Google is just playing nice for now.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
exactly. if google was really afraid of apple, i think the iphone would start losing some of its beloved google apps. which would just be hilarious.
later on, multi-touch may just become the standard. apple can't hold onto it forever, and even if they do.. well that's why i love android.
Remember Google is in it to win it. Yes they have a os, but there are EVERYWHERE. And will take their time. I agree put the code in and let other create for it. Keeping their hands clean.
Smart boogers they are
Apple asked Google not to use multi-touch in Android, and Google complied
MG Siegler | February 9th, 2009
One of the bigger complaints about T-Mobile’s G1, the first phone based on Google’s Android platform, is that its touch screen doesn’t use multi-touch, the technology which allows for a screen to accept multiple points of contact as simultaneous input. Now we may know why.
Apple, which of course makes the signature multi-touch mobile device, the iPhone, apparently asked Google not to implement it, and Google agreed, an Android team member tells us.
Further, the Android team member went on to say that they were relieved that Google didn’t go against Apple’s wishes, given the legal storm that appears to be brewing between Apple and Palm, which is using multi-touch technology in its new Pre phone. Even if Apple ultimately decides not to pursue legal action against Palm (it’s not yet clear how likely that is, but Apple does have an impressive array of patents), the situation has likely soured the relationship between the two companies. Google, it seems, wants no part in ruining its relationship with Apple.
And that makes sense. While the connection between Apple and Palm would seem like it should be strong, given how many former Apple employees now work at Palm, Google and Apple are actually more aligned. Not only does Google specially tailor a ton of its products for the iPhone (both with apps like Maps and Google Search, and specially formatted webpages), but its chief executive, Eric Schmidt, is on Apple’s board of directors. And don’t underestimate the fact that both share a chief rival: Microsoft.
Recent demonstrations (video below) have proven that the G1’s screen and Android are capable of handling multi-touch, so some people seemed confused that Google and HTC (which makes the G1) wouldn’t implement it. Now we know. The larger question going forward is, will multi-touch become important enough that Google has to include it in Android? After all, there are going to be a ton of Android-based phones come out this year, many that just have large screens like the iPhone (and get rid of the G1’s crappy keyboard). You can bet there will be pressure on Google to include multi-touch support in Android — especially after the Pre comes out.
On an related side note, the Android team member also confirmed that Intel has a massive effort underway related to Android. We reported at the end of last month that Intel was prepping to help with a large rollout of Android-based netbooks, possibly as soon as this year. It’s still not entirely clear what specifically Intel is doing on its end, but despite what some may think, it is heavily involved, our source contends.
Intel has been backing the Moblin project (mobile Linux), and it has now shifted its focus onto Netbooks for this year, jkOnTheRun’s Kevin Tofel noted recently. It seems that in some way it wants to be involved with Android too (though, Tofel noted in our comments on the other post that Android likely runs better on ARM architecture rather than Intel’s).
Our source confirmed that many different Android netbooks, as well as other Android-based projects are in the works. And that China is a hotbed for Android-based activity right now.
from:
http://venturebeat.com/2009/02/09/a...se-multi-touch-in-android-and-google-complied
Its only a matter of time before Apple claims to have invented air and will be charging us for every breath
oh, I am sorry... I didn't notice there already was a thread...
some nice mod merged it.
just keep in mind that its the 'gesture' that is patented, not the ability to have a multitouch input.
urgent - quickly separate multitouch from jf's version
as seen in other posts, apple got the patent for multitouch now. they announced to fight against everyone, who copies their feature. although this is meant in the direction of palm and maybe microsoft, this could concern us (and jesusfreke), too.
my suggestion is to separate multitouch from jf's version to avoid that jf is being sued by apple. maybe someone else with another account on xda, who doesn't care about being sued by apple could release the multitouch app for a short time and then ban it to the rapidshare hell...
For the mods: I don't believe that apple has the right to claim the patent for multitouch as others were quicker (microsoft). So I think this isn't a suggestion for illegal things but a tactic to avoid a legal action with unknown result. If you think, this post is not appropriate, let's discuss this first before closing the thread. Otherwise you would have to close the jf thread, too (I hope you won't do this).
They didn't patent all of multitouch. See http://www.engadget.com/2009/01/28/apple-vs-palm-the-in-depth-analysis/
i dont think apple would come after a single independant developer..... bad PR.... but would go after palm or M$ without any hesitation........ i dont really understand how they can patent something like that anyway.... its like patenting using a steering wheel......
It'll most likely be thrown out.
They're just using it to buy time for steve jobs to recover from cancer
I remember - not long ago - that palm was suing forum members that used the name "palm" for their forum. they didn't mind the bad PR. So I wouldn't be too sure, that they won't try to prevent someone having multitouch on a competiting device. They "asked" google to keep away from multitouch an they followed. If erverybody (the jf thread has 119,850 views, even if 19,850 are from me ) can have multitouch on the G1, they won't be happy with that.
And that's no secret of a little community. In nearly every article about the G1, jf'S version is mentionned, so apple knows about that.
So just to be sure that we don't have to raise funds for JF's legal action...
If it's possible, make it happen. Some people here already asked for a version without multitouch because some apps don't work anymore and future apps won't be supported by multitouch.
Just publish within EU
Such **** (SW patents) still doesn't fly in EU, so just publish it (t)here (rapidshare is in EU, AFAIK)
that was one of the sites...
http://www.palmpowerups.com/PalmPowerups.php?s=
http://mashable.com/2011/03/24/honeycomb-delay/
Sent from my Desire HD using Tapatalk
just saw this. Not happy about it. The source may lead to buggy phone versions, but its also very important to everyone who will get left behind trying to get 3.0 upgrades from their manufacturer.
Now that's not good ...
Sniff.. sniff.. HONEYCREAMS! Why devs no give me honeycreams for my gtab?
I'm guessing this is not good for my drooling alter ego.
It is not release to the general public, but manufactures still got access to it, so maybe VS will have it updated
It is possible that Google's attempt to not shoot itself in the right foot will result in it shooting itself in the left foot.
Not surprised at all
They do not want to see sub 300$ device with their flagship os, they want big partner to ramp-up production and sales first...
I am far from certain that company get it for free this time, same for us... hey it's google not the vatican, I place google not far from apple on my list of big bad ugly corp...
Beside as much as I like to play with a new release I am not into such an hurry since Honeycomb is kindalike a new os not 100 % compatible with the current apps it seems
wow really.....tsk.....tsk by that definition it mean the xoom wasnt ready and there it is in the stores for purchase......thats just shameful ow well i sold my gtab days ago and my ipad 2 will be in my hand april 15, between this and the security problems that was in the market (i actually got an email from google and i dont know which app it was if anyone knows the names of the apps tell me) im off android for a while
I would like to sympathize but I can't I dislike false information, the security issue you mention is transmission of IMEI... big deal... apps store like handhango where asking for it to do DRM for ages...
If you wanted and preferred an IPAD that's your right, we can understand that build quality is there...
P00r said:
I would like to sympathize but I can't I dislike false information, the security issue you mention is transmission of IMEI... big deal... nokia and other apps store like handhango where asking for it to do DRM for ages...
If you wanted and preferred an IPAD that's your right, we can understand that build quality is there...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
what false information.....i just said i got and email from google telling me some apps was taking information from my tab and ask someone to tell me their names
Yes... The only way i see for now is to ask viewsonic for the update.
Do you know any way to make viewsonic make it faster???
P00r said:
Not surprised at all
They do not want to see sub 300$ device with their flagship os, they want big partner to ramp-up production and sales first...
I am far from certain that company get it for free this time, same for us... hey it's google not the vatican, I place google not far from apple on my list of big bad ugly corp... ...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
x2
They wanna be the new Microsoft, tried to mess with Fiber and probably got spanked on the bottom by the big boys....maybe Microsoft will be the new Google, and apple.... well apple makes a solid product, i dig my macbook, but Steve Jobs can suck it.
AT&T buys T-Mobile and THIS in the same week?! FML.
If they release honeycomb open source then no one will buy motorola xoom. Its not even about modifiying it on phone OS. Who will waste so much time on that. They not going to give the os out for a while. Better hope VS will make one for us
Have we so quickly forgotten reports that the version of Honeycomb on the Xoom leaves something to be desired?
And witness the results of a phone version of Android with an aftermarket U.I. overlay on our g tablets.
If Google is going to compete with Apple for the mainstream market, they need a good solid operating system with several successful tablet releases to improve customer perceptions.
Much as I love my g tablet, I have no qualms admitting that the iPad is miles better out of the box and that is what the general public wants.
Well finished products and a slick marketing machine are Apple's strengths, underestimate them at your peril.
I don't think Viewsonic are part of the open handset alliance. If they aren't part of the OHA I doubt they're getting access to Honeycomb either.
So now all we have to do is assemble team of highly skilled agents, break into Google's Mountain View complex, and steal the Honeycomb source code... I've seen Mission Impossible and Office Space. It can be done.
Who's with me?
From my CM powered Evo
It's kind of disappointing but it won't keep me from enjoying my G-Tablet.
honey....not right now
i have just taken a bite of gingerbread. i still need sometime to enjoy, do not want to spoil it with honey yet.
The problem isn't that they are not releasing Honeycomb this minute, or this month is they are saying they won't be releasing it anytime soon. Also there is rumors saying they are telling the vendors with HC they will get to keep it to themselves until IC, which is complete BS.
If Google wants to pull that then I will just not spend any money on apps, upgraded phones/tablets until they decide open source is open sourse. I will use they money to donate to dev's instead.
It's just really annoying that we could have people working on HC right now (or maybe a month or 2 from now), but it appears Google thinks HC shouldn't be released and instead kept to itself until the merge in IC. Well if it's not good enough to be open source they shouldn't have released the Xoom and any other HC tablet!
Viewsonic announced it's Honeycomb tablet @ 7 inches. Which means they have the HC source code... which means they hate the gtab community.... because we don't get it, even for modding purposes.
http://www.engadget.com/2011/05/12/viewsonic-7x-shrinks-honeycomb-to-7-inches-for-the-tiny-handed/
They don't hate the Gtab community. Don't try to anthropomorphize a corporation because you will only end up sad and depressed. All Viewsonic wants is to make money by putting out products and then putting out more products. We are numbers, not faces.
Fair enough. I suppose I am a bit idealistic that they would continue to support something older. Perhaps more my frustration is the lack of source code when it could be given... but that it an entitlement mentality I suppose.
forgiventhief said:
Fair enough. I suppose I am a bit idealistic that they would continue to support something older. Perhaps more my frustration is the lack of source code when it could be given... but that it an entitlement mentality I suppose.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
stop caving because one person says something!!!!
and to the user that commented to the OP, thought the info you stated (numbers, not faces) is true, STOP ACTING LIKE IT'S ACCEPTABLE.
To many 300 to 500 dollars is a lot of money and the company has a moral obligation to support it for a reasonable amount of time. This was in no way accomplished by viewsonic. Horrible business ethics and I WILL NEVER BUY ANOTHER VIEWSONIC PRODUCT. you vote with your purchasing power and viewsonic lost mine, my family's and my friend's votes.
as an aside, I suspect seeing all the progress made viewsonic might try to "save the day" and eventually release something for our g tab honeycomb flavored. I'm not fooled and you shouldn't be either. Your support should be for the devs like roebeet. If your running honeycomb and you haven't donated to him or the adamdevs you should feel worse than viewsonic.
vote with your money, I VOTE FOR OUR DEV COMMUNITY!
(before I get any posts about talking about donation, donation doesn't imply 3,000 dollars. Even if it's only a dollar, it says something.)
You do realize viewsonic just slapped their name on the Malta, right? You're mad at the wrong company.
schettj said:
You do realize viewsonic just slapped their name on the Malta, right? You're mad at the wrong company.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Doesn't matter, though. As soon as VS slapped their name on it, they've adopted it.
The way VS is treating the gtab is worse than just numbers. They have intentionally ignored it, not giving it any press or anything at all. There isn't even a direct link to the gtab from their main website.
The gtab is doing way better than other "real" VS devices. It's the number 1 seller on amazon for goodness sake. I'm still baffled why VS isn't putting more energy into the gtab. It's like they don't even wanna mention it.
I think it is a way to get more people to move to their ViewPad line and off of the GTab. I will not switch to their new line just because they put 3.0 on it. Our Devs will get a port over to the GTab and it will blow their new line out of the water. Shady tactics if you ask me.
goodintentions said:
Doesn't matter, though. As soon as VS slapped their name on it, they've adopted it.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
But they don't have any code... they have no development resources. They have a brand name. Whooo.
Seriously.
goodintentions said:
It's the number 1 seller on amazon for goodness sake.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yes, it was for the week it was on blowout $280 clearance. Look, it's a great bit of first gen tegra2 tablet hardware with a dreadful screen that would make it unsellable at any price other than "half of what everyone else charges".
That's dropping under $200-$225 now, which is probably well below the breakeven point. So enjoy it, and support the hackers hacking away, but forget about any serious support for it from VS. You'll be much happier.
yes, the code for our G-tabs belongs to Malata, but so does the code for the Vega and the Adam. They are rumored to be at least getting official GB roms WITH hardware acceleration. VS is to blame for not providing us with that as well. If they do, but are keeping it hush-hush, I'll change my opinion.
Of course, Vega and Adam are running on the new 1.2 bootloader (always have been). Now VS teases us with an update that they pull, that is on the 1.2 bootlaoder? In essence, VS provided our devs, very briefly, with the tools needed to port any updates from Adam or Vega. So, while not actually giving us what we've requested, they are letting other companies, and third party developers do their work for them.
It may be that Malata has abandoned VS for their lack of support for the G-Tab, so Malata cut them off from future development releases.
snapz54 said:
and to the user that commented to the OP, thought the info you stated (numbers, not faces) is true, STOP ACTING LIKE IT'S ACCEPTABLE.
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I didn't say it's acceptable. In fact it makes me just as mad as it seems to have made you and I have made my opinion on that fact known many times on this board and the Nvidia developer board. I'm just saying that the people who want these updates are currently in the minority. I agree that we should get updates but we have to realize that might not happen. In fact I'd much rather use homegrown software from the fine developers on XDA, Cyanogen, and any other dev website that's working for better things for the Gtab than anything Viewsonic/Malata/Nvidia puts out anyhow.
This whole frequently updated software thing is new to the world. I mean think about Apple and Microsoft. Microsoft updated like once every five years. Apple was better, but in both cases users were made to pay for the updates. Now we buy these devices and expect free software updates indefinetly? Sounds good to me, but what about these companies? Where is the money for them? What incentive to they have to churn out more software at no charge to the customer? I'm just saying that there are two sides to this argument and both should be represented.
adampdx said:
This whole frequently updated software thing is new to the world. I mean think about Apple and Microsoft. Microsoft updated like once every five years. Apple was better, but in both cases users were made to pay for the updates.
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What color is the sky in your world?
The problem with Android is exactly the problem Google is trying to get a handle on....
Fragmentation.
When you leave updates up to the the hardware manufactures, you're guaranteed to screw your customers. Because the only way the HW guys make any money at all is by having the customer buy new hardware to get the shiny new features.
Hopefully Google will be able to beat these guys into submission, but I do feel for them... they thought they were getting in on a great thing with a cheap OS for their hardware, and instead they were turned into commodity manufacturers delivering Google ad revenue to Google. Ah well.
I'd much rather use homegrown software from the fine developers on XDA, Cyanogen, and any other dev website that's working for better things for the Gtab than anything Viewsonic/Malata/Nvidia puts out anyhow.
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But it's these updates that custom rom devs use to get the information they need to make their roms. If we ever get official hardware acceleration it will be bundled into one of the officially released updates. The drivers can then be added to existing roms, or future roms. The bottom line is that we NEED official updates if we are to ever get the G-tablet to reach it's full potential.
Now we buy these devices and expect free software updates indefinetly? Sounds good to me, but what about these companies?
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These companies, namely VS knows that they put out a crap product, in regard to software. In fact, they, at one point, directed their customers HERE for support for their device. They released a product in which the hardware outclassed the software. What we paid for was hardware, plain and simple. only recently have people actually said they're using stock firmware and it doesn't suck. Prior to the latest updates (3588 and later) I would suspect that everyone that bought a G-tablet, including myself, KNEW that they were going to have to flash a custom Rom. Just a few days ago, another 850+ G-tabs were sold on Woot, again. At one point it was the top seller on Amazon. VS has to save a little face and continue to support their software, and yes, provide updates.
Fortunately for VS, Notion Ink seems more interested in updating their product for us...of course, VS had to sneak in the 1.2 dev branch that's shared by the Adam.
some good points have been made, but none of the ones supporting VS have been valid.
slapping your name on something instantly slaps responsibility on you, this "passing the buck" mentality is a big part of whats wrong with the world. Everyone can blame someone else and nothing gets done.
The consequences in some small part are now realized. Myself and others will not support viewsonic in any capacity in the future. Actions like this catch up with you, VS is a horrible company that saw an opportunity to make a quick buck without a moments thought of how it might affect anyone.
stop supporting these type of actions, they are wrong.
snapz54 said:
some good points have been made, but none of the ones supporting VS have been valid.
slapping your name on something instantly slaps responsibility on you, this "passing the buck" mentality is a big part of whats wrong with the world. Everyone can blame someone else and nothing gets done.
The consequences in some small part are now realized. Myself and others will not support viewsonic in any capacity in the future. Actions like this catch up with you, VS is a horrible company that saw an opportunity to make a quick buck without a moments thought of how it might affect anyone.
stop supporting these type of actions, they are wrong.
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So you bought an $800.00 xoom?
snapz54 said:
stop supporting these type of actions, they are wrong.
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That would be "don't buy the product"
Since I wanted a device I can experiment with, and didn't want to spend more than $280, this was the only device available.
I bought it knowing what it was. An orphan device with no significant Vendor support.
i thought google said they aren't going to release honeycomb SDK? so doesn't that mean manufacturers are not allowed to release it?
but i guess if we buy the next VS tablet. we can port a honeycomb rom from that to the gtab.
ninditsu said:
i thought google said they aren't going to release honeycomb SDK? so doesn't that mean manufacturers are not allowed to release it?
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You're confusing SDK (Software Development Kit) with Source Code. That said, up to this point, Google has been reluctant to release the Source Code for Honeycomb for - what I can only assume is - the purpose of reducing hardware fragmentation and QA purposes.
schettj said:
What color is the sky in your world?
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Ha! Always good to get a laugh out of these heated discussions. As far as fragmentation goes, I agree. It's a problem that Google created and now they're trying to fix. I'm not sure I can imagine a world where there are several hundred different pieces of tech floating around from different manufactures that all use software provided by a singular, separate company. Oh, wait...that sounds like WINDOWS. He he... I wouldn't dare compare our beloved Google to the likes of Microsoft. Never.
schettj said:
That would be "don't buy the product"
Since I wanted a device I can experiment with, and didn't want to spend more than $280, this was the only device available.
I bought it knowing what it was. An orphan device with no significant Vendor support.
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Thank you. These things are on clearance for a reason. A lot of people here have unrealistic expectations. Companies don't make money by pouring resources into devices that nobody bought. I remember buying an Atari Lynx back in the day and only had it for about a year before everybody stopped making games for it and they were pulled off the shelves. I never once thought that Atari hated me.
So now that Google has acquired Motorola, what does this mean for us? I would assume the big Android backers like LG and Samsung have plan B's? I know samsung has the Bada O.S., not sure what LG will do. But we can all expect that as of today, all plans for Samsung to continue android development has all but ceased. Wouldn't make good sense for them to continue to put money in Google's pocket now that they are in the hardware business.
in case you haven't seen it...
http://www.bgr.com/2011/08/15/google-to-acquire-motorola-mobility-for-12-5-billion/
orateam said:
But we can all expect that as of today, all plans for Samsung to continue android development has all but ceased.
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It would be silly for Samsung to stop making android phones. Your assumption is just that, and it's not a very good one.
This deal isn't closed. It's still subject to regulatory approval.. and if it gets approved we wont see anything for a while..
Posted via tapatalk from my Samsung Stealth.
writing is on the wall.
http://finance.yahoo.com/blogs/dail...V0aGFib3U-?sec=topStories&pos=1&asset=&ccode=
If you believe google bought Motorola for just the patents, pass the pipe this way....
Google could have paid a fraction of that, to buy the patents and give motorola a long term lease on them that expires beyond the patent. This occurs frequently. Google just did this a few weeks ago where they bought 1000+ patents from IBM.
Google bought Motorola for both reasons. They realized that apple is running the table with profits on hardware. You can only make so much money giving away your stuff for free.
I hate when companys do stuff like this. This will only turn into another iphone type company. You will see the cost of phones going up.. Google is trying to be the next Apple.
We can all kiss open source goodbye.
Goodbye ANDROID hello MOTOROID OR MOTODROID
Relax, this is a good thing.
http: //androidandme.com/2011/08/news/google-acquires-motorola-mobility-in-order-to-protect-android-from-patent-trolls/
lefunque said:
Relax, this is a good thing.
http: //androidandme.com/2011/08/news/google-acquires-motorola-mobility-in-order-to-protect-android-from-patent-trolls/
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+1
Sent from my GummyCharge using XDA App
Definitely a good thing. Google will remain open source (they're not dumb enough to put an end to that) and it helps with the frivolous legal battle apple and microsoft has been going after everyone about. I just hope they finally unlock the motos soon. Always liked the phones but I love custom roms too much to deal with a locked bootloader (thus why my X2 went bye bye)
Tapatalk via DROID Charge
I wouldn't worry. Google purchasing Motorola actually benefits all Android device manufacturers.
Sent from my SCH-I510 using Tapatalk
What does Google buying Motorola MOBILITY have to do with the other android OEM's? Nothing. Google just did this to back up all their OEM's with Motorola's patents.
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Another thing people don't seem to realize is that if Google does begin to behave badly, Samsung et al can just fork the code base.
Nothing is stopping Samsung, LG, HTC, Amazon, BN, and others from forming a consortium to develop there own brand of forked Android OS for use on their own smart phones.
For those that are optimistic, sorry to disappoint, but this is not. I’ve seen this same situation many times and it never works out. In fact, think of the last time this situation has turned out positive for the co-dependents.
I was at a huge oracle conference when oracle stabbed their 2 biggest sponsors in the heart. These sponsors (HP and Redhat) paid millions for sponsorship. They had their logos on stages, bags handed out, and BANG! Oracle announced on Day 1 that they were acquiring SUN and supporting all unix O.S. by themselves. HP had just the previous year made a huge deal with oracle on an agreement to be their primary hardware supplier and even worked on Oracle’s newest tech, oracle exadata, with them. At first, all the lovey dovey stuff came out and HP and oracle both said this was going to be great for both of them. Redhat said the boost in Unix OS would be good for them. NOT TRUE. Redhat is barely staying alive after putting all their eggs in the oracle basket. HP partnered with Microsoft to make the next big thing in the HP slate, vaporware, only to have to buy the PALM O.S. which isn’t working too good. It’s always like this. The mobile industry is about to become a 2 horse race. Samsung, HTC, LG, I see T.V. Sets in your future.
orateam said:
For those that are optimistic, sorry to disappoint, but this is not. I’ve seen this same situation many times and it never works out. In fact, think of the last time this situation has turned out positive for the co-dependents.
I was at a huge oracle conference when oracle stabbed their 2 biggest sponsors in the heart. These sponsors (HP and Redhat) paid millions for sponsorship. They had their logos on stages, bags handed out, and BANG! Oracle announced on Day 1 that they were acquiring SUN and supporting all unix O.S. by themselves. HP had just the previous year made a huge deal with oracle on an agreement to be their primary hardware supplier and even worked on Oracle’s newest tech, oracle exadata, with them. At first, all the lovey dovey stuff came out and HP and oracle both said this was going to be great for both of them. Redhat said the boost in Unix OS would be good for them. NOT TRUE. Redhat is barely staying alive after putting all their eggs in the oracle basket. HP partnered with Microsoft to make the next big thing in the HP slate, vaporware, only to have to buy the PALM O.S. which isn’t working too good. It’s always like this. The mobile industry is about to become a 2 horse race. Samsung, HTC, LG, I see T.V. Sets in your future.
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Nope, different situation. Oracle's bread and butter is, and has always been, very proprietary software and consulting services. Once they had there own underling OS and control of Java, they quickly began bringing as much as possible in house. That was the Oracle mentality from the giddy-up though and Red Hat/HP should have been aware of that. Very common with companies like that (MS, for example, has a very long and sordid history of doing the same thing).
Google is quite a bit different. For one thing, their bread and butter isn't in Android as an OS, it is in data collection and analytics (for advertising, marketing, and such) as well as various cloud services. Hardware margins being what they are, and Google's core business being what it is, it will be in Google's best interest to make sure that Android continues to be on as much hardware as possible.
yeah if anything the acquisition should be a good thing, hopefully they will take the moto phones and unlock them and put some pressure on other companies to follow suit. i think they will do some good things with moto's hardware and get other companies on top of their stuff, IE updates, unlocked bootloaders, not such garbage UI's, etc, etc......
Raccroc said:
Nope, different situation. Oracle's bread and butter is, and has always been, very proprietary software and consulting services. Once they had there own underling OS and control of Java, they quickly began bringing as much as possible in house. That was the Oracle mentality from the giddy-up though and Red Hat/HP should have been aware of that. Very common with companies like that (MS, for example, has a very long and sordid history of doing the same thing).
Google is quite a bit different. For one thing, their bread and butter isn't in Android as an OS, it is in data collection and analytics (for advertising, marketing, and such) as well as various cloud services. Hardware margins being what they are, and Google's core business being what it is, it will be in Google's best interest to make sure that Android continues to be on as much hardware as possible.
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Love ya response. It's a very good point. I looked a little more into it and found that motorola aquired General instruments. The company every cable company uses for it's DVR. apparently motorola owns the DVR patents and is currently suing TIVO. if motorola wins, nobody will be able to record T.V. but them. If Google can get into every Cable box and keep apple from ever creating a DVR.......
Samsung said this:
“We welcome today’s news, which demonstrates Google’s deep commitment to defending Android, its partners, and the ecosystem.”
J.K. Shin, president of Samsung’s Mobile Communications division.
If anything this will boost more innovation.
"This acquisition will not change our commitment to run Android as an open platform. Motorola will remain a licensee of Android and Android will remain open. We will run Motorola as a separate business. Many hardware partners have contributed to Android’s success and we look forward to continuing to work with all of them to deliver outstanding user experiences."
-Larry Page (http://googleblog.blogspot.com/2011/08/supercharging-android-google-to-acquire.html)
Google is anything but stupid, and they're not going to go shooting their partners -- which are the reason Android's so successful -- in the foot. Yes, this is obviously going to result in stronger competition for HTC, Samsung, LG, etc., and of course they aren't going to be thrilled about that, but it also drastically strengthens them against patent trolls and exorbitant patent licensing fees can cut into profits even more than stronger competition.
Plus, keep in mind that Motorola has a seriously low market share compared to HTC or Samsung -- they're in seventh place worldwide. This isn't like if Google bought HTC (which could have afforded to do -- but didn't because HTC has a tiny patent portfolio). In other wordS: if Motorola were the only one making Android handsets, Android would quickly fall to third or fourth place in the OS race.
Anyways, long story short: this means nothing for us other than that the next time we buy a phone, Motorola handsets may be better options. Of course, it just may spur competitors to keep up faster with updates, etc., leading to better devices all-around. Either way, we, the consumers, win.
Falcyn said:
"This acquisition will not change our commitment to run Android as an open platform. Motorola will remain a licensee of Android and Android will remain open. We will run Motorola as a separate business. Many hardware partners have contributed to Android’s success and we look forward to continuing to work with all of them to deliver outstanding user experiences."
-Larry Page (http://googleblog.blogspot.com/2011/08/supercharging-android-google-to-acquire.html)
Google is anything but stupid, and they're not going to go shooting their partners -- which are the reason Android's so successful -- in the foot. Yes, this is obviously going to result in stronger competition for HTC, Samsung, LG, etc., and of course they aren't going to be thrilled about that, but it also drastically strengthens them against patent trolls and exorbitant patent licensing fees can cut into profits even more than stronger competition.
Plus, keep in mind that Motorola has a seriously low market share compared to HTC or Samsung -- they're in seventh place worldwide. This isn't like if Google bought HTC (which could have afforded to do -- but didn't because HTC has a tiny patent portfolio). In other wordS: if Motorola were the only one making Android handsets, Android would quickly fall to third or fourth place in the OS race.
Anyways, long story short: this means nothing for us other than that the next time we buy a phone, Motorola handsets may be better options. Of course, it just may spur competitors to keep up faster with updates, etc., leading to better devices all-around. Either way, we, the consumers, win.
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+ 1
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i get that is what is being said, but if i were in Samsung or HTC's camp, i would be re-considering my funding into a technology where the software i've been depending on could be pulled away at any moment. Now that google has the hardware side covered, if HTC and Samsung keep throwing money that way, it's a big risk.
Microsoft could always have bought a hardware company like Dell, but it knew what that would do to the confidence of other builders. IMO, google should just have bought the patents.
orateam said:
i get that is what is being said, but if i were in Samsung or HTC's camp, i would be re-considering my funding into a technology where the software i've been depending on could be pulled away at any moment. Now that google has the hardware side covered, if HTC and Samsung keep throwing money that way, it's a big risk.
Microsoft could always have bought a hardware company like Dell, but it knew what that would do to the confidence of other builders. IMO, google should just have bought the patents.
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Like someone else said, it's in Google's best interest to keep android on as many devices as possible. I seriously doubt anything will change for sammy or htc.
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1st off, My house is an android powered house and I love the platform. It is only after months of being around my girlfriend and her family as they used android, that I started to really put a finer point on why so many people prefer other OS's (yes i understand Android is grabbing up market share like crazy). this is my thoughts after watching people I know use and leave android, use and struggle with android, and use and love android.
1st off, a list of the things that aren't google fault per say, but pit falls due to there lack of control over the final product.
#1) battery life. Due to varying hardware design and the freedom to do as you please to the OS, manufactures have made some phones with really bad battery life. this coupled with the constant updating a android device can do for any apps and the increase in popularity of cloud service, android ends up with wildly varying battery life from device to device.
#2) Consistency. If someone had a Verizon "droid", they could be using a Sense UI, a moto blur UI, or vanilla android. That's just in that one "brand of phone" alone. People dont adapt well to tech if they aren't big tech fans.
#3 quality of hardware, and I'm not talking about specs. Most consumers only judge the internals on how smooth the final product is. No, I'm talking about, build materials and the screen. There is some junk out there (allot of them have great internals). some of these phones are built like toys with race car parts inside them.
Now for where google is falling short.
#1 marketing. This is amazing to me that an Advertising company would fall short here but they do. Google ads focus on strange things like the ability to unlock your bootloader. Most people have no idea what this means and why they should care. They probably shouldn't care since they will never hack there phones.
also, every time Apple comes out with an "I" product ad, they are doing a real good job of showing how there "new feature" will make your life more fun and allot easier. The funny thing is, they are almost always features that android already had.
This is one of the things I really started to notice as I was surrounded by the non tech savvy android users. I would say, "funny, android already does that, has for a while now". My girlfriend would then ask, "does my phone do that?". Wow Google, you should be the master and telling people about all the selling points of your product.
#2 ease of use. This one may also be an issue with the carriers but I am going to put it in this section. One of the things I again noticed as I helped my girlfriend master here Nexus S 4G was, weird quirks that are not even a stumbling block to a Tech savvy user but almost a deal breaker to the average consumer.
Example: when my girlfriend 1st got here nexus, she hated it, couldn't believe I recommended it. One of her issues that stuck in my mind was the SMS limit. She hated that the SMS would cap her before she was done texing a message. She didnt care if it sent as two messages but she wanted to be able to type one continues message and then send it, letting the software sort it out. So I said, no problem, my phone doesn't do that (galaxy nexus) so there must be a deep setting to control this. As it turns out there wasn't, at least I couldn't find it. So again, I said no problem and down loaded handsent witch fixed the problem and she loved the easy theming. Well along came here ICS update that I had been raving about and her phone started crashing. Turns out handsent was the reason. Again, I said, no problem and downloaded Go SMS witch she loves even more.
That's just one example, in the mean time, 4 people in her family have switched from android to I Phones and don't regret it. I feel that one of them was mainly due to the hardware they chose and the rest is because they didn't have the live in tech help that my girlfriend has ( don't mean that to sound arrogant). My girlfriend loves her phone partly because I fix each issue as it arises and inform her of cool features.
Conclusion: I really think that the the lack of consistency is the other side of the open source double edged sword. this shows it self in software and hardware. It can be as small as the order in witch the bottom buttons appear, and as big as the Sense UI that changes everything a little bit. I also feel that no one besides Verizon in the early days, is really advertising Android well. Even Verizon doesn't do as good of a job showing you how much the phones can do and why you should want these features as Apple does.
Oddly I aggree with most of that, esp the marketing, you know I just found out just how good google voice was the other day... I have had android phones now for 3 years... Lol.
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funny you should bring up google voice. That was one of the things that I was thinking about when it comes to advertising short comings. It has been a great feature and a solid performer and now with Jellybean, it has every function of Siri, with the performance level I have come to expect from Google voice.
google needs to talk about it in plain English with every day examples of implementation
All of those faults/cons/criticisms can be attributed to just about any device/thing/object/concept that endorses an open-ended nature. The one off the top of my head that fits the OP's bill nearly word for word is Windows (technically Windows is closed-source). The Playstation 3 is a similar concept too. It's got all the nice bells and tech but its advertising sucks.
Google doesn't need to do any advertising, but rather the respective manufacturers. They're the ones that should be selling what Android does for their phones and why people should choose their phones over the others. If there are feature discrepancies from one phone to the other, the manufacturers should work to get those features implemented, that's the real strength of open-source software. It helps a lot if a manufacturer works together with their modding community to make it happen, which in turns makes your product/device more competitive and play on that.
Google caters to the developers because that's what Google is: a developer. That's why Google has their own line of phones: Nexus. Their phones are catered to the developers and well...us XDA'ers. They do a good job at advertising where it matters: recent one being their own conference just a week ago. If it reassures the OP: the rumor that Google plans to expand the Nexus line to more manufacturers is a good thing for us XDAers and friends of XDAers.
alpha-niner64 said:
All of those faults/cons/criticisms can be attributed to just about any device/thing/object/concept that endorses an open-ended nature. The one off the top of my head that fits the OP's bill nearly word for word is Windows (technically Windows is closed-source). The Playstation 3 is a similar concept too. It's got all the nice bells and tech but its advertising sucks.
Google doesn't need to do any advertising, but rather the respective manufacturers. They're the ones that should be selling what Android does for their phones and why people should choose their phones over the others. If there are feature discrepancies from one phone to the other, the manufacturers should work to get those features implemented, that's the real strength of open-source software. It helps a lot if a manufacturer works together with their modding community to make it happen, which in turns makes your product/device more competitive and play on that.
Google caters to the developers because that's what Google is: a developer. That's why Google has their own line of phones: Nexus. Their phones are catered to the developers and well...us XDA'ers. They do a good job at advertising where it matters: recent one being their own conference just a week ago.
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1st off, other companies doing it too, its not a reason to ignore said issue. Also, windows is taking steps to correct the hardware issue and make there OS consistent (for example)
If you think google doesn't "have to" advertise, I guess your right but even companies like 3M who sells many products to OEM's that then sell to the end user (like google) advertise to further there brand and promote the use of there products by OEM's. Also, 3M knows more about the products than any one OEM that uses there products, not to mention, the OEM's that use 3M consider 3M to be one of the reasons there product is good, and will not focus on key points of the 3M element.
Also, look at gorilla glass from corning, another product that isn't sold direct to the end user. They do there own advertising to promote there product and increase brand recognition to better sell there product.
I also disagree that google is a developer selling to developers only. Google nexus 7 is a perfect example of that. The nexus 7 tab is meant to further the "play store" brand, and is being sold at a vary low price point in the hopes that play store sales will make up for it just like the Kindle. I also don't think the Galaxy Nexus is a "developer device" at least, not exclusively.
So does google have to, no. Should they want to, yes.
What would you have Google advertise about that other companies should be doing in their stead? Google has brand recognition already and it's pretty clear by Google I/O that their intended audience isn't the Apple crowd: so who else would there be to advertise to? If the Apple crowd is whom you're referring to: that should be Samsung, HTC, Sony's job to do. What can Google do to help those manufacturers sell their features to the consumer that those companies aren't already doing themselves?
This is where we are going to disagree. Google has brand recognition but Android has far less. Verizon, did the best job and now the "droid" brand has more recognition than "android", many times "droid" is used and the general brand for all android by consumers. I don't think Google should depend on hardware companies to advertise there product. Even windows advertises there software. The OEM's should ALSO advertise but not ONLY advertise.
Advertising that the Galaxy nexus has a "unlockable" boot loader is un needed and doesnt further the brand. 98% of the people who want a unlocked boot loader, knew the galaxy nexus had one before the ad hit the streets.
The fact that apple fans are oviusly not googles target market is or should be false (proven by samsung). Google should be polishing there OS so that more of apple users would be interested. Google will not be able to continue on for ever just appealing to a small market such as the XDA community. OEM's will abandon them if that was the case. Look at the OEM's and there behavior, they are not interested in selling phones to the developer community only, otherwise Motorola would not lock there phones down as they did, or at least they would offer developers unlock tools like HTC has done. HTC is a little more "developer marketed" but lets be real, they still drag there feet when ever they can or feel pressure from the big 3.
That leads me to the Carrier's, they do not want to sell phones marketed to developers that are easily hacked and modded. they want control. Google should want to sell the most units they can within reason. This means helping the developer community with there goals and helping the OEM's and Carrier's with there's. Google should be (and I think they are) trying to make android more marketable to the masses and then lead that marketing campaign by example.
Its like that old saying, "alone with your principles". You can stand here and say that the OEM's should do all the advertising but it doesn't change the fact that they aren't doing what needs to be done and google need to sell product that is dependent on the platform. They are an advertising company so do they sit back and hope HTC and Samsung start talking more about there product and doing more to show how it will improve our lives or should they step in and show the OEM's how its done, at the same time increasing the value of there products
I think a lot of your issues are going to be solved for the mainstream with more Nexus devices rolling out. The other great thing is that as more people start looking at Nexus flexibility and timely updates the more other OEMs will be forced to follow suit if they want to stay viable. It seems Sony and to some extent HTC and Samsung are pretty serious about both the hardware and update side of things so anyone else will just have to play catch-up.
As a whole though some of these things will continue to persist. One of the draws of Android devices is having smartphone abilities without ridiculous cost. There will always be people who want the goodies but don't have a lot of extra funds and those devices will simply be a little behind the curve. With the optimizations coming via Jellybean though OEMs won't have the excuse of claiming that newer versions are too complex for older phones and I would hope that they continue to push updates for a reasonable period.
Stupid post. Why? Because you have no clue what android is. Android is an open source operating system. OEM's take android, and just so you know, they don't need google's consent, and manipulate it the way they want to put on their hardware. Google has no say in what they do to it, how they arrange their buttons, or the UI that they add to it. So your post is more directed at OEM's than google.
lowandbehold said:
Stupid post. Why? Because you have no clue what android is. Android is an open source operating system. OEM's take android, and just so you know, they don't need google's consent, and manipulate it the way they want to put on their hardware. Google has no say in what they do to it, how they arrange their buttons, or the UI that they add to it. So your post is more directed at OEM's than google.
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if you read my post you would have seen I acknowledge that some of these issues are a side effect of open source. They do in fact charge for the "gaps" suite. all hardware sold with gaps on it has paid licensing to Google.
dB Zac said:
if you read my post you would have seen I acknowledge that some of these issues are a side effect of open source. They do in fact charge for the "gaps" suite. all hardware sold with gaps on it has paid licensing to Google.
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So? Google gets no say in how they manipulate the OS. I mean seriously...battery life? How the f*** could that be a google issue?
I spesificly said that wasn't Google's fault, but a short coming of open source
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dB Zac said:
I spesificly said that wasn't Google's fault, but a short coming of open source
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Sounds like you need an Iphone..
lowandbehold said:
Sounds like you need an Iphone..
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So I have to love it and ignore any and all short coming or be crusified? Ok sounds like a page from apple fanboyism
here, since you will not read the whole thing before commenting, i will post the part you seemed to miss
dB Zac said:
1st off, a list of the things that aren't google fault per say, but pit falls due to there lack of control over the final product.
#1) battery life.
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dB Zac said:
1st off, My house is an android powered house and I love the platform. It is only after months of being around my girlfriend and her family as they used android, that I started to really put a finer point on why so many people prefer other OS's (yes i understand Android is grabbing up market share like crazy). this is my thoughts after watching people I know use and leave android, use and struggle with android, and use and love android.
1st off, a list of the things that aren't google fault per say, but pit falls due to there lack of control over the final product.
#1) battery life. Due to varying hardware design and the freedom to do as you please to the OS, manufactures have made some phones with really bad battery life. this coupled with the constant updating a android device can do for any apps and the increase in popularity of cloud service, android ends up with wildly varying battery life from device to device.
#2) Consistency. If someone had a Verizon "droid", they could be using a Sense UI, a moto blur UI, or vanilla android. That's just in that one "brand of phone" alone. People dont adapt well to tech if they aren't big tech fans.
#3 quality of hardware, and I'm not talking about specs. Most consumers only judge the internals on how smooth the final product is. No, I'm talking about, build materials and the screen. There is some junk out there (allot of them have great internals). some of these phones are built like toys with race car parts inside them.
Now for where google is falling short.
#1 marketing. This is amazing to me that an Advertising company would fall short here but they do. Google ads focus on strange things like the ability to unlock your bootloader. Most people have no idea what this means and why they should care. They probably shouldn't care since they will never hack there phones.
also, every time Apple comes out with an "I" product ad, they are doing a real good job of showing how there "new feature" will make your life more fun and allot easier. The funny thing is, they are almost always features that android already had.
This is one of the things I really started to notice as I was surrounded by the non tech savvy android users. I would say, "funny, android already does that, has for a while now". My girlfriend would then ask, "does my phone do that?". Wow Google, you should be the master and telling people about all the selling points of your product.
#2 ease of use. This one may also be an issue with the carriers but I am going to put it in this section. One of the things I again noticed as I helped my girlfriend master here Nexus S 4G was, weird quirks that are not even a stumbling block to a Tech savvy user but almost a deal breaker to the average consumer.
Example: when my girlfriend 1st got here nexus, she hated it, couldn't believe I recommended it. One of her issues that stuck in my mind was the SMS limit. She hated that the SMS would cap her before she was done texing a message. She didnt care if it sent as two messages but she wanted to be able to type one continues message and then send it, letting the software sort it out. So I said, no problem, my phone doesn't do that (galaxy nexus) so there must be a deep setting to control this. As it turns out there wasn't, at least I couldn't find it. So again, I said no problem and down loaded handsent witch fixed the problem and she loved the easy theming. Well along came here ICS update that I had been raving about and her phone started crashing. Turns out handsent was the reason. Again, I said, no problem and downloaded Go SMS witch she loves even more.
That's just one example, in the mean time, 4 people in her family have switched from android to I Phones and don't regret it. I feel that one of them was mainly due to the hardware they chose and the rest is because they didn't have the live in tech help that my girlfriend has ( don't mean that to sound arrogant). My girlfriend loves her phone partly because I fix each issue as it arises and inform her of cool features.
Conclusion: I really think that the the lack of consistency is the other side of the open source double edged sword. this shows it self in software and hardware. It can be as small as the order in witch the bottom buttons appear, and as big as the Sense UI that changes everything a little bit. I also feel that no one besides Verizon in the early days, is really advertising Android well. Even Verizon doesn't do as good of a job showing you how much the phones can do and why you should want these features as Apple does.
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Ok let me help you out.
#2: Actually, Droid branding is owned by motorola, therefore they will only be using blur UI.
Marketing: Google is not in the business of advertising an OEM's phone. That is up to the OEM and the OEM only.
Ease of use: Apple owns a patent that breaks up the long text AFTER it is typed. Therefore, it would be illegal for Android to use it. Example invalid.
Conclusion: Verizon sucks.
You really did not point out 1 thing that google has control over in your whole post.
lowandbehold said:
Stupid post. Why? Because you have no clue what android is. Android is an open source operating system. OEM's take android, and just so you know, they don't need google's consent, and manipulate it the way they want to put on their hardware. Google has no say in what they do to it, how they arrange their buttons, or the UI that they add to it. So your post is more directed at OEM's than google.
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http://www2.macleans.ca/2011/03/14/android-isnt-really-open-its-just-less-closed-than-apple/
Google only cares about advertising (and like to snoop in on what you do, say, what you buy, where you shop, visit, etc... ) of course.
But they do have pretty good control over Android.
lowandbehold said:
Ok let me help you out.
#2: Actually, Droid branding is owned by motorola, therefore they will only be using blur UI.
Marketing: Google is not in the business of advertising an OEM's phone. That is up to the OEM and the OEM only.
Ease of use: Apple owns a patent that breaks up the long text AFTER it is typed. Therefore, it would be illegal for Android to use it. Example invalid.
Conclusion: Verizon sucks.
You really did not point out 1 thing that google has control over in your whole post.
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1st off, "droid" always running blur was not the point and incorrect. Verizon owns the "droid" name, as it is licensed to them by Lucus Industries. hence the HTC phones under that same brand name. I was commenting on the superior advertizing and Branding that Verizon did. The Droid 1 was a great vanilla phone that did well in a large part, due to advertizing. The verizon campain made "droid" a household name, more so than "Android".
2nd google can advertise features and the OS without advertising a specifice peice of hardware, windows does it all the time. Also, since google does have Google branded harware (nexus), they are in the hardware biz and should advertize aas such.
"Verizon sucks" based on what I can only emagin was your reasoning for this statement, I'm sure all major cariers "suck, not really the point here. Out of all the cariers, Verizon, furthered the android the most in the last 3 years out of anyone. Only now is Samsung beging to be the leader in promoting the android platform.
I agree with you on this, anyone who ask me what phone to get, i personally recommend iPhone UNLESS the guy knows his stuff, i myself LOVE android, been using it for 3 years now but i am software developer and very much familiar with kernels and bootloaders and and and , someone was aksing me the other day, since Android has much bigger marketshare, why everything comes out for iPhone first?
answer is simple, as a developer making things for iPhone is sooooo much easier, you only have "ONE" screen dimension to worry about, you only got 3-4 phones to worry about which 90% of them are similar, now compare this with android phones !!!
and last as everyone mentioned is advertising, personally i think google and all manufacturers do a HORRIBLE job promoting , remember when iCloud came out? nothing new really, just another DropBox, but Apple made such a big deal about it, everyone was AMAZED !!! same with siri, and so many other things,
Personally i think iPhone WORKS, its great for people who dont think outside the box, they want something that WORKS and thats it, they like to be TOLD what to do, how to use your phone , and they follow it.
Android is for thone who like to explore, install custom ROMs , play with OC/UV , etc.
Raul77 said:
remember when iCloud came out? nothing new really, just another DropBox, but Apple made such a big deal about it, everyone was AMAZED !!! same with siri, and so many other things
thats another real good example of, others were 1st but Apple advertizes better
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I actually came from a blackberry, where in convention they make and market their devices.
When I switched to android now essentially Samsung was giving me their flavour of what they call android through Touchwiz and I really hated it.
Google should really take sometime to ensure manufacturers aren't dumbing down the platform for consumers and give users a clear overview of how it can serve them. Which is exactly what Google does with its Nexus.
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