Solving usb port mistery - TG01 Accessories

Hello everyone! My name is Patryk Andrzejewski (don't try to read my name if you're not polish), and this is my first thread on XDA.
I am studing electronics on university of technology so i'm pretty well with all kind of electronic stuff.
What i'm trying to do is "x-ray" the usb port in our TG01.
My basic targets is to find way to charge the device while using USB HUB or while listening music. If it's even possible to do.
Right now I know how to connect TG01 to amplifier by 3.5mm plug. Generaly most amplifiers have high impedance input while tg01 expect low impedance earphones to switch usb port to audio output. So what we need to do is take two resistors with the same resistance around 10k Ohm and connect them both between ground and both signal channels in male 3.5mm plug of the amplifier. This should do the trick. You can experiment with resistance but it should be as high as possible to not interfere in sound quality, but if it be to big output won't swich or sound would chop on high volume.
Basic usb cable have four wires plus ground. While micro usb plug have five pins. This extra pin is used to tell device what cable is connected, hub earphones charger or pc. It can be done by two ways, in each cable this extra pin is shorted to diferent other pins. Or it's connected by resistor to ground or Vcc.
What i need to do is determine how it is in our devices and if it would be done make a cable what will allow to charge while using usb to other purposes.
I can also help with porting microusb-3.5mm cables from other devices to TG01, just what i need is this cable, it's schematic, connection route with insides picture or small donation to buy it for tests.
Or eventualy I can make solution how to do it yourself.
Right now I waiting for a pack with new empty microusb male and female plugs to do some tests.
If someone have some experience with this please share.
Also it would be great if someone will port me on to usb switch driver.
Feel free to talk to me on priv.
Thread will be updated...

Hi @patryk,
Welcome to the TG01 Forum.... especially on this particular topic - if you can find a way to get multiple function via the uUSB port simultaneously, that will be great
There have been various attempts at this before, but in practice the only route seems to be using Bluetoth for audio while either charging or using the port in host mode.
I did a piece on Brighthand a while ago on connecting an external hard drive; there have also been discussions on MoDaCo and later on XDA (down the Accessories thread.... one is here and I think there may be some earlier than that). There is a link in the XDA post to a Freescale Smiconductor chip schematic. This is supposed to be able to (externally) support multi-function usage - ntended to be used by 3rd Party manufacturers in eg. a car kit, but as yet I am not aware of any such accessories having been released. If/when available would be suitable for any of the modern crop of uUSB based evices, though I think many car makers have opted for Bluetooth connectivity instead of the older style fixed car kits with cables.

Acording to pdf from your link I'm right, its all about one resistor. It's entire possibly to do this.
Tomorrow morning tests...
Thanks
oh I cant wait so:
rid_f: >220 kOhms
rid_a: 122-126 kOhms <-- this is what we're interest in
rid_b: 67-69 kOhms
rid_c: 36-37 kOhms
rid_g: 1 kOhm
These res val has small tolerance and ar not typical.
rid_a resistance is used to switch to charge device from charger and use usb for earphones or hub!
earphones - yes, but headset - not sure I must check first where mic is connected
here it is Dummy cable schematic:

Here are some related illustrations:
Schematic of the uUSB standard audio accessory control:
View attachment 505996
Picture of the supplied Toshiba earphone adaptor pcb:
View attachment 505997
The mic is connected to pins 1 and 2 (White and bare Cu)
I have made up several 3.5mm audio adapters using Neutrik 3.5mm jacks with 10k resistors fitted from D+ and D- to 0V common:
View attachment 506008
This ensures it will switch to audio out when connecting to external speakers with or without a ground-loop isolator transformer where typically the external device will have too low an impedance for the TG01 to recognise.
Shorting out D+ (Pin 2) and D- (Pin 3) causes the TG01 to go into Charging mode.
An R from ID (Pin 4) to 0V (Pin 5) causes the TG01 to go into Host mode.

I check all of these Rid's and it seems they don't work on Tg01. No matter how i try there is working only charging or earphones never both same time.
As you say device can be forced to charge when resistor < 200 ohm is connected between D+ and D- and they are floating.
There also must be other way to do this by the driver of usb charging becouse pc link charges only when TG is on.
In TG mic an switch of headset are connected to ID pin. So this first schematic of yours is about Toshiba accesory ?
Technicaly charging while using audio out is possible becouse VBUS pin is free in headset.
I'll do some other tests tomorrow..

Hi!
Any news since February?

I will find answers on many questions by reading this document

djtonka said:
I will find answer on many question by reading this document
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
It is a good document, but iunfortunately leaves many questions unanswerable.
In Section 6.4 it shows a schematic of an Accessory Charger Adapter which is essentially what we need to achieve simultaneous charging and audio out (or other functions). It does not however give enough detail to implement. I have previously identified a Freescale chip which has been designe dto do this job, but hae been unable to identify any source from which to obtain one. In essence this is aimed at the peripheral manufacturers' -who might wish to design and market eg. a hands free car kit to which you could connect a microUSB On The Go spec device. However so far as I can discover there are no manufactureres who have as yet brought any related device to market. If anyone happens to have found anything somewhere across the globe - please shout !
Regards,
Kevin

Related

adapt headphone adapter enable mic

Hi All
I, like many people, use my orbit and now orbit 2 as an mp3 player. I have a few headphone adapters which allows me to use normal headphones which sound much better than the stock o2 ones. Not a bad solution however when a call comes in you have to unplug the headphone adapter to allow the phone mic to work. Having the adapter plugged in disables the phone mic.
I was wonder if anyone had any ideas on how I could 'fix' the headphone adapter so that it no longer disabled the mic. The theory is that should a call come in i can keep my headphones on and simply hold the phone up to my mouth to talk. My look a bit odd but it will save all that unplugging/replugging.
Thanks in advance
Jeff
found this...
http://www.tracyandmatt.co.uk/blogs/index.php/2006/09/10/htc_hermes_usb_connector_pin_config
assuming it's the same...do you think I just break off pin 1 ?
thanks again.
Jeff
wertert said:
found this...
http://www.tracyandmatt.co.uk/blogs/index.php/2006/09/10/htc_hermes_usb_connector_pin_config
assuming it's the same...do you think I just break off pin 1 ?
thanks again.
Jeff
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I doubt it's that simple. I really, really wish I could find it again but floating around somewhere on the web is a site that has a proper wiring diagram as well as just the pinouts.
From memory I think there's a pin held low (or maybe high) somewhere to tell the device that the adaptor is plugged in. I don't think that just the presence of a connection to pin 1 is what does it.
My suggestion is to open up the plug on your least-favourite adaptor (to experiment in case you trash it) and look for internal links between pins. My guess would be that either one of pins 4 or 5 is not a genuine Gnd signal but is actually a pin that is held low (i.e. set to Gnd) by the headset adaptor via a link from one of the genuine Gnd signals coming in on USB pin A or the other one of pin 4 or 5 . Alternatively one of pins 4 or 5 might be asserted high by a bridge to pin E. Finally the USB NC pin (pin B) might be the detector pin and asserted either high or low via a link to one of the Gnd or +5V input pins.
What you really have to hope for though is that two of the above are true because if there is only a single pin on the plug that is either asserted high or low to allow the detection of the presence of the headset then you're really out of luck because it is then extremely unlikely that it will separately detect that the speakers are plugged in but the mic isn't so, when you identify and disable the appropriate link, you will probably also re-enable the speaker in the handset as well as activating the mic.
All the above is guesswork I'm afraid, but I am a computer hardware designer so it's not totally uneducated guesswork, so you really will have to experiment or find that wiring schematic I spoke about, but the basic message is to look for links asserting some detector pin (or pins) high or low on the connector.
- Julian
P.S. I can't think of any way that you'll break anything just by cutting links but be very careful not to short out any existing connections because that could damage your device and don't create your own extra links unless you know exactly what you're doing.

Simultaneous micro usb to 3.5 mm audio out while charging possible?

A similar question has been asked on modaco but I don't think a solution was found. Therefore I am going to ask if this would work here.
Is it possible to connect a micro usb (male) to mini usb (female) adapter up to this thing (HTC 4 in 1 adapter: I can't post link because I am a new user but just search it on youtube). This would connect to the tg01 micro usb and provide a 3.5 mm audio out in addition to a mini usb connection where one could potentially hook up a charger. I was thinking of testing this out as it would cost about 10-15 dollars but I do not want to damage my phone in the process. I have no electrical engineering knowledge but maybe someone else can explain if this would work before I order anything.
On a side note: I order samsung WEP870 bluetooth headphones on sale as an alternative to this. Note sure how sound quality is but I will try answer any questions you guys might have.
Any input is welcome.
mobius8 said:
Is it possible to connect a micro usb (male) to mini usb (female) adapter up to this thing (HTC 4 in 1 adapter: I can't post link because I am a new user but just search it on youtube). This would connect to the tg01 micro usb and provide a 3.5 mm audio out in addition to a mini usb connection where one could potentially hook up a charger.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I was heavily involved in the discussion running on MoDaCo you refered to; unfortunately there has been no breakthrough on this issue to date.
I did look into the the HTC adapter you mention, but it actually uses the proprietary HTC ExtUSB plug on the input end (connecting to the phone) and NOT a normal mini-USB. The ExtUSB has 11 pins which include a discrete audio output (being used to feed the 3.5mm jack socket) and also hard-wired power (used to accept the charger input).
In the case of the TG01 uUSB socket, it is too 'intelligent' for its own good. Every function, charging, audio out, USB data transfer, etc., is under procesor control. Different functions are triggered by the device 'seeing' a certain resistance across the sense pin and ground; depending on this the processor then configures the use of the socket pins accordingly.
I am after what you are trying to achieve also; there is a chip supposedly available which is intended to fulfil exactly this functionality, but I've been unable to find any devices on the market which use it and attempts to contact the manufacturer with a view to getting a few samples to try and build an interface have so far been unsuccessful.
I've attached a couple of documents which explain the uUSB Charger Adapter and also the chip spec sheet for reference.
View attachment MC34825.zip View attachment batt_charging_1_1.zip
If anyone else knows anything to help move this one forward, will be much appreciated !
Thanks for the nice explanation,
Hopefully one day there will be an adapter that can make this possible.

HTC Serial Cable without extUSB

Hi guys,
I bricked my G1 recently and am going to try to Unbrick using the guide on cyanogen's wiki.
One requirement is the debug serial cable, but here in India I haven't been able to get my hands on the ExtUSB breakout. I do have a mini usb breakout. Could I use that instead?
The pins I need are:
1 VCC
2 Ground
3 tx
4 rx
The pins available on the mini usb breakout are:
A +5V
B -Data
C +Data
D N/C
E Ground
Pretty obviously:
1 -> A
2 -> E
Goggling tx and rx, I think they mean data in and out but not sure. Anybody have any advice?
Unbrick guide on cyanogen:
wiki.cyanogenmod.com/index.php?title=JTAG_for_Dream/Magic
ExtUSB breakout:
sparkfun.com/products/9167
Post questions in the questions section!!!
ExtUSB is backwards compatible with mini USB: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Universal_Serial_Bus
I have several mini USB cables, some with a Type A male connector on the other end, others with a wall plug end, and still some with the cigarette lighter adapter end. They all work with the G1. The 2 extra pins on the ExtUSB are for sound only.
Xsite_01 said:
It's compatible just for charging and file tranfer but for serial interface are not compatible. You are accesing serial interface trough extra audio pins, so you can buy G1 headphones and make htc serial cable. Headphone yes, charger no.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Ah, when I saw serial I thought, "why is he calling a USB cable by only part of it's name" (universal serial bus). I misunderstood the post and did not think he was talking about an actual serial/RS232 connection.
So as to try to contribute something to OP, have you tried looking at this? http://www.instructables.com/id/Android-G1-Serial-Cable/
I was doing some study connect my serial GPS (gives TTL level serial signals) to HTC P3400 WM. Found out about G1 cable in instructables and other materials that explained how to use serial ports in HTC mobiles. I came across a very cheap "adapter" in a roadside shop in Chennai - one end of this one goes into the mini usb and the other end provides a 3.5mm stereo audio jack. I grabbed one of them and surprised to find that it did not have the moulded rubber connector. I opened the plastic case and found that I can easily solder pins 7,8 and 9. I will be testing this over the week end!
Thanks for the info Xsite_01, i think i can find some headphones to cut up and give it a try.
If smpncrc's adaptor works, i'd love to get my hands on it in delhi.
Thanks for all the info guys

Alternative to micro USB Charging / Data cable

Someone asked help on our local forum about this and I thought it might also be of help here, so here goes my share.
If you are like me who wants to carry only a small cable for charging and data transfers, you'll find it hard to get your hands on a good micro USB charging/data cable. Buying micro USB charging/data cable for Samsung is tricky since the wiring can be different from the normal USB cable. There should be 5 pins on the micro end, but sometimes there are just 4. But Samsung cable uses only 4 pins that might have been rewired. I'm not sure whether only Samsung does this or the same can be said of the other brands. There are also micro USB cables being sold that does only charging and no data function, and vice versa.
I've grown tired of searching for a cheapo charging/data cable that doesn't deliver the function, so what I did was I bought micro USB to USB adapters instead and bought a normal female-to-male usb cable extender just in case the fragile cable wires get broken again they can be easily replaced. They get the job done. You can also use the other gender adapter and cable combo but using the same combo that I use enables you to charge and transfer data with just the adapter and without the cable in case the fragile cable gets damaged.
They charge the phone as fast as what the USB power brick provides and what the phone can accept at the same time. :victory:
This thread was opened with the intention to help others to easily find an almost guaranteed working data/charging cable combo because not everyone has access to a cheap branded cable. (And sometimes even a branded cable does not guarantee both functions). This is a quicker guaranteed solution for those buying micro USB cable that has no way to test the cable they are purchasing, mostly those buying online or those buying impulsively.
The logic behind the "almost guaranteed working data/charging cable combo" is that unlike micro USB cable, an extension cable guarantees that every pin has its own wire with no modifications, that's why it is called an extension cable. The micro USB adapter, guarantees the full conversion from micro USB to USB interface to have all pins connected properly, that's why it is called adapter/converter.
So, if you do not like the idea of the extended length that is protruding out of your micro USB slot, this thread is not for you and you are not obliged to use or try the setup in any way. The solution provided here is not perfect but a fully functional solution.
I hope this can help someone.
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No offense, but that is a seriously stupid idea. Do you have any idea the amount of leverage that contraption will put on the μUSB port? Hit that wrong or yank it too far and it will snap the port right off the board.
There is absolutely nothing special about any Samsung charger or cable. They use standard, straight-through A-B cables just like every other phone. The chargers themselves conform to industry standards, whereas + and - are on pins 1 and 4, and the data pins are tied together in order to trigger the phone into high current charge mode. The "B" end of a mini/micro USB does have 5 pins - the extra pin is for an ID resistor (referenced to ground), so the phone can identify when it has been inserted into a desk or car dock. There is no corresponding pin on the "A" end, and the lack of an ID resistor or the physical pin will have absolutely no effect on charging.
Taz420nj said:
No offense, but that is a seriously stupid idea. Do you have any idea the amount of leverage that contraption will put on the μUSB port? Hit that wrong or yank it too far and it will snap the port right off the board..
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The same goes for the charging flap. Anything that is applied too much force will break. I've been using it for almost a month now and everything is fine. It's just an alternative, maybe a short-term substitute for the oem usb cable if you want.
Taz420nj said:
There is absolutely nothing special about any Samsung charger or cable. They use standard, straight-through A-B cables just like every other phone. The chargers themselves conform to industry standards, whereas + and - are on pins 1 and 4, and the data pins are tied together in order to trigger the phone into high current charge mode. The "B" end of a mini/micro USB does have 5 pins - the extra pin is for an ID resistor (referenced to ground), so the phone can identify when it has been inserted into a desk or car dock. There is no corresponding pin on the "A" end, and the lack of an ID resistor or the physical pin will have absolutely no effect on charging.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
And how would you explain the slow charging by other micro usb cables then when using the Samsung-bundled power brick? The usb cables work properly with other devices, other than Samsung. I have plenty of them, only 1 other cable works properly.
http://forums.androidcentral.com/samsung-galaxy-s4-accessories/274965-samsung-s4s-micro-usb-standard-usb-cable-2.html
And no, Samsung bundles 4-pin cables. So the phone can't identify when it has been inserted into a desk or car dock?
I've never had any trouble with generic charging cables on any of my Samsung Galaxy phones. That adaptor looks useful for plugging in a memory stick though. Lol
Sent from my SM-G900F using Tapatalk
My Kindle USB charger cable doesn't work for my S5. It just doesn't fit but all my other charges cables from my S3, Nexus 7 and of course my S5 cable work. A bit strange but I guess it is the problem of the Kindle cable? BTW the Kindle one works on my S5...
jopat said:
The same goes for the charging flap. Anything that is applied too much force will break. I've been using it for almost a month now and everything is fine. It's just an alternative, maybe a short-term substitute for the oem usb cable if you want.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Of course anything can be broken given enough force. But it takes far less force to break something when you have effectively quadrupled the length of the lever. The stock cable's plug is 1/2" long. That contraption is easily 2" long. That's the same reason you don't use a one-piece solid adapter to plug 1/4" headphones into the 1/8" jack on your phone. It's 6th grade science.
And how would you explain the slow charging by other micro usb cables then when using the Samsung-bundled power brick? The usb cables work properly with other devices, other than Samsung. I have plenty of them, only 1 other cable works properly.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Considering you are the only one to have this "problem", Mod Edit – Some content removed . USB is USB. That's the entire point of adhering to standards. There are no "special" or "rewired" cables for Samsung, nor does any current Samsung device (with the exception of the Tab2 10.1) require any proprietary cable or charger. If a device's connectors do not adhere to the published USB standards, then the USB name and logo can not be used under penalty of law. A company can use the technology in a non-standard configuration, but it must have a distinctly different connector and can not use the USB marks.
And no, Samsung bundles 4-pin cables. So the phone can't identify when it has been inserted into a desk or car dock?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
WTF are you talking about? The standard "A" side of ANY USB cable only has 4 pins. There is no such thing as a 5 pin standard "A". The μUSB JACK on the phone has all 5 pins (well, technically 10, since it is USB3.0, but the extras aren't pertinent). μUSB "B" end of a CABLE does not use the ID pin (pin 4), because it does not need to - so whether or not it is physically present in the plug end is moot, because even if it is there, it's not connected to anything. The only thing the ID pin is used for is for situations where the phone needs to know when a certain device is connected. If the ID pin is connected straight to ground, the phone knows that an OTG adapter is plugged in and it puts itself into host mode. If it sees a certain resistance to ground, it puts itself into either car mode or dock mode depending on what resistance it sees.
And for the record, most of the posters commenting in that thread you linked to over at AC are retards. Especially the OP, who claims to "know for certain" that the S3 uses a connection with reversed pins. Because just like EVERY OTHER PHONE WITH A μUSB PORT, the S3's jack follows the USB standard pinout.
---------- Post added at 12:50 PM ---------- Previous post was at 12:48 PM ----------
AMoosa said:
I've never had any trouble with generic charging cables on any of my Samsung Galaxy phones. That adaptor looks useful for plugging in a memory stick though. Lol
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
It won't work, because it's not an actual OTG adapter. It doesn't have the ID pin tied to ground in order to put the phone into host mode.
This made me LOL
But yes any A to Micro USB cable will work. However, if you use the provided cable that Samsung gives you it will charge quicker by using the extra USB3.0 plug.
But, my S4 charges just as fast as the standard OEM cable they provided when using my Galaxy S2 or any other quality USB A to Micro USB wire. This however is not true when using junk/cheap USB cables irregardless the USB plug ends. The wire quality is usually pants compared to other brands. Some of the cheap USB wires will even show a resistance on an ohms meter.
In the end, the OP is making a very complicated USB plug for their phone Just buy a quality USB cable from walmart ebay bestbuy etc
elesbb said:
But yes any A to Micro USB cable will work. However, if you use the provided cable that Samsung gives you it will charge quicker by using the extra USB3.0 plug.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Sorry, but that's wrong*. The 3.0 plug only adds extra data pins. Power still runs through pins 1 and 5. It will charge faster if you use the provided CHARGER - because that outputs two amps, versus the 3/4 to one amp output by older/generic chargers. The S2/S3 came with one amp cube chargers, the S4/S5 came with a two amp. The ones you find at gas stations are generally 750mA to one amp. But it does not matter if you use a 2.0 or 3.0 cable to get that charge rate, because it is dependent on the charger, not the cable..
[* the 3.0 standard does call for higher power capability when connected to a computer port - the device can negotiate up to 900mA from the host while simultaneously transmitting data (USB2.0 specifies up to 500mA). However this is still lower than the power that is available from the supplied charger.]
As far as sourcing cables, you absolutely can't go wrong with Monoprice. They have the high quality cables with the glossy, hard plastic plug grips (just like what comes with Apple and high end Samsung products) for $3..
Taz420nj said:
LOL I just noticed that
RETARD changed the pics in the OP of which adapter and cable he kludged together - I guess in an attempt to make it look less idiotic.. However it's still stupid, because YOU CAN USE ANY A-TO-MICRO-B CABLE IN ANY LENGTH.
In case anyone's interested, this is what he had originally posted..
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
LoL
Those are not the pics I posted, you just posted your own pics. You're always trying too hard. :silly:
But, yes, I changed the pics because the pics are the opposite gender from what I have indicated that I bought. Nonetheless, they are the objects indicated as vice versa, which failed to register in the pea-size object inside that large cranium of yours.
so what I did was I bought micro USB to USB adapters instead and bought a normal female-to-male usb cable extender just in case the fragile cable wires get broken again they can be easily replaced. They get the job done. You can also use the other gender adapter and cable combo but using the same combo that I use enables you to charge and transfer data with just the adapter and without the cable in case the fragile cable gets damaged.
Taz420nj said:
I actually don't need to back up my "claim" (which it's not actually a "claim", it's a well-documented, globally recognized industry standard) - because you're posting all the evidence for me. You're just too stupid to realize it. Now please. After you impale your crotch on that rusty gate (you should do it multiple times just to be sure), go eat some kindergarten paste and play hopscotch with the rest of the retards.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
It's because you can't, in any way. First, you don't have that capacity. Second, those " well-documented, globally recognized industry standard" is not for the "USB" that you re referring to, therefore they don't exist. "USB" is not the whole device or cable itself, but the receptacle & plug and how they will transmit power and data. They don't specify how the device should deliver them. In fact, you can attach another device in the cable between the USB ends.
Taz420nj said:
USB is an INDUSTRY STANDARD. That means in order for a manufacturer to be allowed to call a device "USB Certified", the manufacturer MUST ADHERE TO THE STANDARD'S POSTED SPECIFICATIONS. It does not matter whether the manufacturer chose to use a standard, mini, or micro USB port. It also does not matter if the manufacturer uses a dual-purpose port (such as a USB/eSATA hybrid port on a laptop) or proprietary port (such as Samsung's 11 pin Micro USB) - provided that the port is BACKWARDS COMPATIBLE (there's that obscure word again) - meaning that still adheres to the posted specifications for pinouts and connector dimensions for the USB standard.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I'll say it once again, the USB standard is for the connectors. Anything beyond the connectors and the immediate wires connecting on the pins are not covered by the standard that you claim.
So, just for everyone's information, and since I am already tired of your continued spawning of nonsense and making others ignorant as you, I will explain everything in detail in layman's term. Although, I doubt that eenie weenie pea-size object in your cranium can comprehend them. But nonetheless, I will have maximum tolerance for the handicapped in this thread. Be sure not to post any blabbering anymore, because your ignorance is being broadcasted worldwide.
USB is a plug & socket standard, just like your power plug and power sockets. They have their own standards set by the governing bodies to ensure universality among electronic devices to ensure that they fit and function. Like the power plug, the USB has + and - wires, but with added wires for data transfer. The standard refers to the physical dimensions and positions of the plug and function of the pins, as well as the code classes, but anything beyond that other than the voltage are not covered by the usb standard. If they were also included in the same standard, there won't be innovation. It will be dictating something like a power plug can only be attached to an electric fan and cannot be used elsewhere. The wires inside are also not obliged by the standard to be present. Although there are 4 pins, they are not required to be all used and attached electric wires into. This is the reason why you can't say that all USB cables are the same and will function the same, and that especially applies to micro USB cables. They look the same but you will not know the difference until you use them or slice them open.
Taz420nj said:
However it's still stupid, because YOU CAN USE ANY A-TO-MICRO-B CABLE IN ANY LENGTH.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
For your statement that you keep on insisting, your tribe was obviously left out by civilization. For charging/data cable, which this thread aims to give alternative to, you need the correct micro USB cable, using just any micro USB cable that you come across won't guarantee that it will supply power for charging and do data transfer.
Regarding length, you cannot use just ANY LENGTH because the signal weakens after a certain length. You will need to attach a booster to maintain that transfer speed longer than that length.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/USB#Cabling
The USB 1.1 Standard specifies that a standard cable can have a maximum length of 5 meters with devices operating at Full Speed (12 Mbit/s), and a maximum length of 3 meters with devices operating at Low Speed (1.5 Mbit/s).
USB 2.0 provides for a maximum cable length of 5 meters for devices running at Hi Speed (480 Mbit/s). The primary reason for this limit is the maximum allowed round-trip delay of about 1.5 μs. If USB host commands are unanswered by the USB device within the allowed time, the host considers the command lost. When adding USB device response time, delays from the maximum number of hubs added to the delays from connecting cables, the maximum acceptable delay per cable amounts to 26 ns. The USB 2.0 specification requires that cable delay be less than 5.2 ns per meter (192 000 km/s, which is close to the maximum achievable transmission speed for standard copper wire).
The USB 3.0 standard does not directly specify a maximum cable length, requiring only that all cables meet an electrical specification: for copper cabling with AWG 26 wires the maximum practical length is 3 meters (9.8 ft).
This is, again, straight from wiki:
To reliably enable a charge-only feature, modern USB accessory peripherals now include charging cables that provide power connections to the host port but no data connections, and both home and vehicle charging docks are available that supply power from a converter device and do not include a host device and data pins, allowing any capable USB device to charge or operate from a standard USB cable.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/USB#Connector_types
This is particularly evident in most micro USB cables bundled with powerbanks. The powerbank requires only to supply power and it doesn't need data transfer. So, it is more logical to bundle data-less cable so that the material acquisition cost could be lowered. The opposite can said about older cellphones that are bundled with proprietary charging cables that have micro USB slots for data transfer. Most of their bundled USB cables do not have charging capabilities, although some can still be charged when plugged into the computer.
And also, this proves that USB cables do not provide the same current or amperage. And also proves that not all micro USB cables will charge your device at full speed due to different resistance which the caveman has still failed to answer. The OP provided visuals, so I'm hoping the caveman can at least recognize them. This is a factual data and not some blabbering blah-blah-blah from someone obviously left out by time.
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=2451375
vectron said:
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
This thread was opened with the intention to help others to easily find an almost guaranteed working data/charging cable combo alternative because not everyone has access to a cheap branded cable. (And sometimes even a branded cable does not guarantee both functions). This is a quicker guaranteed solution for those buying micro USB cable that has no way to test the cable they are purchasing, mostly those buying online or those buying impulsively.
The logic behind the "almost guaranteed working data/charging cable combo" is that unlike micro USB cable, an extension cable guarantees that every pin has its own wire with no modifications, that's why it is called an extension cable. The micro USB adapter, guarantees the full conversion from micro USB to USB interface to have all pins connected properly, that's why it is called adapter/converter.
So, if you do not like the idea of the extended length that is protruding out of your micro USB slot, this thread is not for you and you are not obliged to use or try the setup in any way. The solution provided here is not perfect but a fully functional solution.
To avoid further trolling, this thread will not be updated any more nor any post will be made by the OP.
Oh my f*cking god it is amazing that someone can be as utterly stupid as you are and survive beyond puberty. Seriously, do you have any idea what a moron you sound like?
YOU HAVE NO CLUE WHAT YOU ARE TALKING ABOUT.
I find it absolutely ASTOUNDING that you are quoting sources that completely contradict your argument, and yet you claim them as evidence that you are right.
I was particularly amused by the fact that you quoted the wiki, but you don't seem to have read or understood what you quoted in the least. This is evidenced by the fact that you claim:
jopat said:
] Second, those " well-documented, globally recognized industry standard" is not for the "USB" that you re referring to, therefore they don't exist. "USB" is not the whole device or cable itself, but the receptacle & plug and how they will transmit power and data. They don't specify how the device should deliver them. In fact, you can attach another device in the cable between the USB ends.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
and
jopat said:
]I'll say it once again, the USB standard is for the connectors. Anything beyond the connectors and the immediate wires connecting on the pins are not covered by the standard that you claim.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
But if you had actually read the VERY FIRST LINE at the top of the wiki entry, it says:
Universal Serial Bus (USB) is an industry standard developed in the mid-1990s that defines the cables, connectors and communications protocols used in a bus for connection, communication, and power supply between computers and electronic devices
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
It is not just about the "connectors and the immediate wires connecting the pins", the USB standard lays out EVERYTHING, from the connector dimensions, to the pinouts, to the cables, to the power transmission levels, to the data transfer. If a device does not comply with those standards, then it can not be legally called "USB Certified".
Game, set, match.
Mod Edit
Thread Closed
ronnie498
Forum Moderator

Connecting an android phone to a car with a MOST optical audio system. Help needed!

Hi all,
I have an interesting problem to pose to the techies amongst you.
I have just managed to get my dream car and now need to integrate my phone without paying the huge sums being asked for by the car manufacturers and some aftermarket electronic suppliers (car ICE specialists too). My phone is currently a Samsung Galaxy Note 3 and the car has MOST optical audio and satnav systems.
I'm after 3 distinct, yet simultaneous, solutions, which are : -
A/ power supply to the phone
B/ HDMI or RCA output to a dash mounted 5 inch lcd screen for satnav purposes
C/ audio output to link into the car's current MOST audio system (head unit in the dashboard, also running the car's hvac, and the amplifiers are in the boot)
My first thought was to open up the USB 3 cable and to run individual wires to 3 separate plugs for each of the 3 solutions listed above. At this point many of you may be laughing at my clearly very poor understanding of modern electronics, particularly USB, and I would not argue that at all - I'm a complete dimwit here! Obviously (I think...) the clear solution is in the fact that USB can run different objectives simultaneously.
So... I run my USB 3 CABLE from the phone to a (presumably powered?) USB 3 hub and have 3 appropriate cables plugged in and running respectively to A/ a USB cigarette lighter socket, B/ an hdmi (or RCA, or composite?) plug and C/ to a standard stereo headphone jack or socket.
I don't think A/ will work because I don't see power going from the socket back through the hub and into the phone. Suggestions welcomed as I can't see how to get power to the phone at the same time as having a USB cable supplying data out. Or is there power over USB through a hub available?
B/ seems straightforward enough.
C/ the audio then needs to go to an analog to digital / wired to optical adapter and then a 2 into 1 optical switch (so I can still have the existing output from the head unit) before plugging into the amplifiers. These 2 adapters are easily available through eBay, Amazon or Maplins as far as I can see. The issue I foresee here is will the head unit still be able to control volume, fade, etc of the signal coming from the phone? If the control of the amplifiers happens via the optical cables then presumably that won't happen if I've used a switch to change the source? Would taking the output from the phone's headphone socket be of any benefit? I doubt it as the output power from there may be quite a bit higher than from the USB port...
So you can see that I clearly need some knowledgeable direction here or I will be forever going round in ever decreasing circles!
Many thanks in advance for any help given. Cheers, Mark

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