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Thought i would share this with the rest of the XDA community who got scammed by Samsung.
A user revolt is starting among the tech blogs and on Twitter about Samsung's absolutely shameful lack of communication on updating its U.S. Galaxy S phones (including the Captivate, Epic, Fascinate, Mesmerize and Vibrant) to Android 2.2.
This is the first article i found posted 1-14.
Samsung Must Come Clean on Android Updates.
http://www.pcmag.com/article2/0,2817,2375769,00.asp
Here is the second article i found posted on 1-17.
Samsung Forcing US Carriers to Pay for Android Froyo on Galaxy S?
http://www.phonenews.com/samsung-forcing-us-carriers-to-pay-for-android-froyo-on-galaxy-s-15151/#more-15151
Here is the third article i found posted on 1-18.
Samsung Galaxy S Froyo Coming in March?
http://www.pcmag.com/article2/0,2817,2375940,00.asp?kc=PCRSS03069TX1K0001121&utm_source=feedburner&utm_medium=feed&utm_campaign=Feed%3A+ziffdavis%2Fpcmag%2Fbreakingnews+%28PCMag.com+Breaking+News%29&utm_content=Google+Feedfetcher
Here is yet another article.
Are Samsung Galaxy S Froyo Updates Being Held Back Because Of Cost?
http://www.androidpolice.com/2011/01/16/are-samsung-galaxy-s-froyo-updates-being-held-back-because-of-cost/
I don't know but there is only one way for them to please everyone and get users back on their side.....
Upgrade straight to Gingerbread. That would make all Galaxy S Users happy and probably keep a large % of them customers on their next phone.
Lets be honest, there were certainly issues when Samsung released their version of Froyo to select providers up here in canada. Rogers decided to wait it out and have them work out some bugs that were crippling other galaxy s phones. As you know FROYO is now available on Rogers and Canada being a smaller market, I believe it's being used as as testing ground for the firmware before it's released en mass to the much larger AT&T community. I've been using FROYO since it was launched on the Rogers network and haven't encountered any problems as of yet. I'm also not seeing an onslaught of complaining about phones being bricked or melted due to the release, so it would seem the AT&T update should be along rather soon. But what do i know?
http://pocketnow.com/android/samsung-not-charging-carriers-for-galaxy-s-froyo-updates
I certainly hope so and not because i would use the stock firmware but because it would provide a much easier base to dev on than what the captivate devs have to deal with at the current moment.
Reminds me of the **** Apple and Microsoft have done with updates in the past, only in reverse. "Let's update all the devices, but make the new software so robust that the old hardware can't run it!" Only Samsung's case is quite different. Our phones are very capable of new updates.
They've got us by the balls and I'm just about fed up because we're never going to see an update. It just doesn't make sense for them from an economic standpoint and AT&T doesn't want to shell out the money. If I were in business to make and keep as many billions of dollars as possible, I'd probably behave in a similar manner.
Lancez said:
http://pocketnow.com/android/samsung-not-charging-carriers-for-galaxy-s-froyo-updates
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Click to collapse
That's so arbitrary and conceited. Well, all of this is actually. But Samsung releasing that little utterance just to give us a glimmer of hope is just more hay in the barn and can't possibly be taken seriously. They've been saying the same **** since day 1. Anyone remember what happened with the boy who cried wolf?
upNsmokeAllDay said:
Here is the third article i found posted on 1-18.
Samsung Galaxy S Froyo Coming in March?
http://www.pcmag.com/article2/0,2817,2375940,00.asp?kc=PCRSS03069TX1K0001121&utm_source=feedburner&utm_medium=feed&utm_campaign=Feed%3A+ziffdavis%2Fpcmag%2Fbreakingnews+%28PCMag.com+Breaking+News%29&utm_content=Google+Feedfetcher
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
This would make me the winner of the office pool. Check my signature, been saying it since November.
People think that by complaining loud enough they will get what they want. But honestly the people who are begging for froyo are a small subset of the total handset owners. People who are on xda are the die hard tech people who always want the latest and greatest.
It will happen when it happens
Sent from my SGH-I897 using XDA App
We may be a small subset, but we are the ones our friends and family come to for recommendations. All of a sudden, the impact is no longer small.
I have no idea if the rumors are true, I know Phandroid will help spread the rumors but the rumors make sense.
Samsung sold you a device if it does not work they will fix it, but yes Android 2.1 is a working OS and Android 2.2 is an upgrade. They like most manufactures add bloatware, it does take engineering time to take stock Froyo add the bloat and all the carrier customizations, why should Samsung bother? Makes economic sense for them just to sell a next generation Galaxy S .
I for one love the stock Froyo running on my Rogers Captivate but I will not hold my breath waiting for Samsung to deliver 2.3 or 2.4
I agree at the end of the day 95% of the people will never visit XDA, or run Kies.
The tech geeks do not speak for the majority, this is why there were not line ups for the Nexus One.
Captain Geezer said:
I've been using FROYO since it was launched on the Rogers network and haven't encountered any problems as of yet.
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Click to collapse
It's been near perfect for me as well. The only complaints I have are:
1. The proximity sensor is screwed up. During a call, if the phone's screen is facing up the screen will turn back on. This means any time you hold the phone between your head and shoulder, your face starts mashing buttons. It's annoying as hell.
2. The contacts application never exits. It'll remain active in memory unless you end it. If you end it, your desktop disappears for several seconds before returning.
Gingerbread or bust.
Never again.
Sent from my Captivate.
AstroDigital said:
Samsung sold you a device if it does not work they will fix it, but yes Android 2.1 is a working OS and Android 2.2 is an upgrade. They like most manufactures add bloatware, it does take engineering time to take stock Froyo add the bloat and all the carrier customizations, why should Samsung bother? Makes economic sense for them just to sell a next generation Galaxy S.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
We are not a bunch of whiners unhappy because we don't have the latest update and demanding something we have no right to. We are a group of consumers unhappy that we have been lied to and mislead. Samsung promised this update almost at the same time the phones were released. They promised a time frame in which it would be delivered. They have not followed through on their promises. They are selling accessories for these phones that have features that will only work with the promised updates. That right there is fraud. They have released this update everywhere but in the US, which says to me that it is not a technical consideration that is holding it up. Regardless of what may or may not make sense economically to Samsung, a company that does not keep its promises deserves to have that fact spread to consumers everywhere. Let's see how many next gen Galaxy phones Samsung sells after this debacle.
I've saved them the trouble and gone ahead and switched to T-mobile and a brand new G2 (no nexus s, because I will never buy another samsung device ever again, be it tv, blu-ray player, phone, microwave, toaster, blender, pocket knife, zipper, or plastic guitar pick).
As far as the $200 early term fee? Well, I've paid it, and I will be making a trip to the county courthouse on Friday to file against AT&T in small claims court for knowingly selling a malfunctioning device and breech of contract. Should they actually decide to show up instead of calling me to settle like I expect they will, I will be citing Cuomo v. Dell as a point of reference.
After 2 non-functioning replacements, I'm done with samsung, and to be honest, it really doesn't bother me to make AT&T pay for Samsung's mistake, because AT&T sold me the phone in the first place, and could have easily given me an Iphone as a replacement when I asked them to. Maybe next time they'll think twice about using a manufacturer with a history of repeating this exact same ****.
No class action because, well, let's face it, I don't have the money or the time to pursue a class action, and as a consumer, I know that I won't be putting up with their **** ever again. I just want the contract they conned me into gone, and the $400 for the phone and the ETF back. I would suggest that if any of you are unhappy with the phone that you don't sit around and just put up with it. You need to go get another phone with another carrier, cancel your contract, and file in small claims against AT&T. When word starts spreading of this money will talk and the carriers will listen. Then samsung won't be able to sell their devices to carriers.
Thanks for making that decision easy, Samsung and AT&T.
AstroDigital said:
Samsung sold you a device if it does not work they will fix it
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Click to collapse
From experience (2 returns are failures, 1 was DOA) that simply isn't true. Samsung is making users play russian roulette with refurbished phones.
Yup. This whole story just makes me all the more satisfied with my decision to go with the EVO over the EPIC on Sprint. We, EVO owners, were among the very first phones to be updated to FroYo. I've been rockin 2.2 for months now!
Go HTC and go Sprint!
P.S. I have other reasons why I would never by a Samsung phone. For some strange reason, there are way too many apps and mods that are 'not compatible with Galaxy S phones'.
Sent from my EVO rockin' MikFroYo!
leetpriest said:
Should they actually decide to show up instead of calling me to settle like I expect they will, I will be citing Cuomo v. Dell as a point of reference.
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Click to collapse
Cuomo v. Dell was about defrauding customers out of money by falsely advertising a 0% interest rate. I think you are going to have trouble convincing a judge that AT&T committed fraud because you would have to prove that they sold you your phone knowing that it had hardware problems that could not be fixed. Since there are thousands of people using Captivates without shutdown issues or other hardware related problems, fraud is a huge stretch, especially when the burden of proof is on you. If you seriously cite Cuomo v. Dell, AT&T may defend against it just to prevent any example from being set.
nkrick said:
Cuomo v. Dell was about defrauding customers out of money by falsely advertising a 0% interest rate. I think you are going to have trouble convincing a judge that AT&T committed fraud because you would have to prove that they sold you your phone knowing that it had hardware problems that could not be fixed. Since there are thousands of people using Captivates without shutdown issues or other hardware related problems, fraud is a huge stretch, especially when the burden of proof is on you. If you seriously cite Cuomo v. Dell, AT&T may defend against it just to prevent any example from being set.
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Click to collapse
So there isn't a press release dated Dec 20 out from Samsung instructing AT&T to "Sell through existing inventory" of faulty captivates? Citing that during a small claims hearing may not do much for me, but anyone that purchased a captivate after that press release now has a very real case against samsung and AT&T.
Alas, that's neither here nor there. I couldn't cite that case in the FILING process, or the SERVING process, only during the hearing, which precedes a settlement. You're telling me AT&T might be willing to pay a local attorney thousands, or pay thousands to fly a corp attorney down here to fight over $400?
I don't see it happening. But hey, I could be wrong. They could always attempt to countersue and not win. I didn't ask for your legal advice. I merely suggested that it may be worth everyone's time to send a message to the carriers that Samsung devices shouldn't be sold, that's all. It's not like it's any skin off your back if I win or lose a SMALL CLAIMS case, right?
leetpriest said:
So there isn't a press release dated Dec 20 out from Samsung instructing AT&T to "Sell through existing inventory" of faulty captivates? Citing that during a small claims hearing may not do much for me, but anyone that purchased a captivate after that press release now has a very real case against samsung and AT&T.
Alas, that's neither here nor there. I couldn't cite that case in the FILING process, or the SERVING process, only during the hearing, which precedes a settlement. You're telling me AT&T might be willing to pay a local attorney thousands, or pay thousands to fly a corp attorney down here to fight over $400?
I don't see it happening. But hey, I could be wrong. They could always attempt to countersue and not win. I didn't ask for your legal advice. I merely suggested that it may be worth everyone's time to send a message to the carriers that Samsung devices shouldn't be sold, that's all. It's not like it's any skin off your back if I win or lose a SMALL CLAIMS case, right?
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Click to collapse
I applaud your efforts, and i would do the same thing. Small claims court should be an easy victory and here is why:
1. It probably will never get that far, as the cost of the lawyer is in excess of the $ amount - assuming you are only going after the early term fee - I don't think you have a case for anything else
2. There are laws on the books about "merchantability" or "fitness of purpose". I don't AT&T or Samsung engaged in outright, but the simple fact that the phone had defects is enough - it is not dissimilar to invoking the lemon laws for cars.
Cars have 0 day return guarantee, so lemon laws were necessary. As a consumer, you went through the proper process and let them replace your device 2 times yet defects persisted. By then your 30 day return was over.
Document your experience and you should be OK if it goes to court.
I am not a lawyer but i have filed in small claims court in the past and had very good success getting results.
http://www.law360.com/technology/articles/258771/lg-struck-with-class-action-over-smartphone-defects . credit to brooklyng2x over on lgforum for finding it.
Would be nice if you didn't have to sign up with a website in order to get on board with the CAL.
The link isn't working for me
Sent from my LG-P999 using XDA Premium App
how about this pdf? http://articles.law360.s3.amazonaws...um-6-dm_id-5305026-doc_num-1-pdf_header-2.pdf
He is right! Somebody had to do it! LG deserves it!
Well now LG won't give us GB at all lol they're probably saying, "Well here's the lawsuit, now we don't have to work on GB anymore."
this needed to be done, this isnt the first time lg has had a class action lawsuit. They have had one for their refrigerators.
nyyankees3511 said:
how about this pdf? http://articles.law360.s3.amazonaws...um-6-dm_id-5305026-doc_num-1-pdf_header-2.pdf
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Click to collapse
Thank you kind sir!
Sent from my LG-P999 using XDA Premium App
A class action lawsuit is a total and complete waste of time and a mis-use of a system that is already corrupt. Rather than attempt to get your share of $4.30 which is what the end result will be for participants just ride it out and either flash a working ROM or wait for the update.
I KNOW...WE HAVE ALL HEARD THE WHINING AND CRYING BEFORE.....I shouldn't have to flash a custom ROM, It's been since April blah blah blah...Ever heard the saying Buyer Beware. If you purchase the first run of damn near ANYTHING other than food or clothing there will ALMOST always be some type of bug to be worked out. And I don't wanna hear "Well I bought mine in June so it's not first run". IT IS!
Deal with it, grow up and let our courts handle more pressing issues other than your cell phone wont work. Hell, I flashed a custom ROM and then out of the blue am having re-boot issues. Maybe I should call Barry Obama and see if he can get me a replacement.
Have a great day!
I think more of us are pissed at the run around, lack of communication, broken promises, and now dead silence. Im sure none of us are looking for the end settlement but hoping this wakes lg up and keeps them in touch with us and not feed us BS.
nyyankees3511 said:
I think more of us are pissed at the run around, lack of communication, broken promises, and now dead silence. Im sure none of us are looking for the end settlement but hoping this wakes lg up and keeps them in touch with us and not feed us BS.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
well said.
Like I said in other thread: Some people can't see past their own nose.
I knew I held onto my G2X for a reason...
Sent from my HTC Sensation 4G using XDA Premium App
mahgninnuc93 said:
A class action lawsuit is a total and complete waste of time and a mis-use of a system that is already corrupt. Rather than attempt to get your share of $4.30 which is what the end result will be for participants just ride it out and either flash a working ROM or wait for the update.
I KNOW...WE HAVE ALL HEARD THE WHINING AND CRYING BEFORE.....I shouldn't have to flash a custom ROM, It's been since April blah blah blah...Ever heard the saying Buyer Beware. If you purchase the first run of damn near ANYTHING other than food or clothing there will ALMOST always be some type of bug to be worked out. And I don't wanna hear "Well I bought mine in June so it's not first run". IT IS!
Deal with it, grow up and let our courts handle more pressing issues other than your cell phone wont work. Hell, I flashed a custom ROM and then out of the blue am having re-boot issues. Maybe I should call Barry Obama and see if he can get me a replacement.
Have a great day!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
What exactly was this the "first run" of? A smartphone? Definitely not. A smartphone running Android? Not that either. A device with a nvidia Tegra 2 processor? Nope. I'll admit that there are a lot of devices and products that have problems with them at first -- almost all of them actually. This is beyond normal though, and there's no denying that. As far as the court system goes, the whole world is corrupt, get used to it.
nyyankees3511 said:
I think more of us are pissed at the run around, lack of communication, broken promises, and now dead silence. Im sure none of us are looking for the end settlement but hoping this wakes lg up and keeps them in touch with us and not feed us BS.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I appreciate that. But the bottom line in something like this is, now that a suit has been filed it only leads them to want to drag their feet.
I appreciate the frustration by the lack of communication. I am there as well. But I guess some of us look as the glass half full rather than the glass half empty
baldwinguy77 said:
What exactly was this the "first run" of? A smartphone? Definitely not. A smartphone running Android? Not that either. A device with a nvidia Tegra 2 processor? Nope. I'll admit that there are a lot of devices and products that have problems with them at first -- almost all of them actually. This is beyond normal though, and there's no denying that. As far as the court system goes, the whole world is corrupt, get used to it.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
It's the first run of this phone is it not? Yep sure is. I went through these issues with the original iPhone release as well. Since it was the only phone Apple released they were able to focus resources on it solely. LG, like most companies is chasing the $$ and therefore spreading themselves way too thin. I"m not making excuses but it's the reality of it all.
And yep, I know about the corruptness of the system. My brother is a personal injury attorney, I see it all the time.
mahgninnuc93 said:
I appreciate that. But the bottom line in something like this is, now that a suit has been filed it only leads them to want to drag their feet.
I appreciate the frustration by the lack of communication. I am there as well. But I guess some of us look as the glass half full rather than the glass half empty
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I think you give this more credit than it actually has. LG won't even notice something like this until it makes the run of the legal system waiting periods, response times, etc.
At best, you might see a more controlled response publicly from LG. You might see information dry up on support forums, from LG as they control responses and limit anything that could be used against them. But for development, the biggest hurdle in GB was not bugs on the G2x. As you saw recently, LG released or will soon release 2 GB handsets. This was most likely the biggest hurdle in G2x updates. Having a single LG wide GB story, then customize to individual handset. It makes no sense to think that LG would customize GB for a released handset, prior to insuring the GB release for new handsets was in place.
The day a finalized version of a LG GB os was in place company wide, thats when the porting to G2x, with any fixes, started. The work became integrating the fixes in to the GB update.
Remember, these guys are into making money, not updating for free.
I've read somewhere on this forum about speculation about LG pulling the G2x over marketing concerns in competition with the SEnsation. This does make some sense. LG will never outsell HTC. But in an end of summer market, post Sensation, a GB G2x might make a bigger splash NONE of the signs point to abandonment. Legally they can't do that. But signs do point to repositioning of a product.
I think in the rush to market to be the first Dual Core handset, LG lost, by being first.
just my opinion...
Well, as I just posted at LGs forum, I just want a new sealed updated phone. That's been one of my biggest gripes, I never get a working phone and my end result is a used scratched refurbished one without a matching box? Still with no update to boot. And I'm in WAY better shape than some customers, 'cause I have one that works.....for now.
Patently unfair.
mahgninnuc93 said:
A class action lawsuit is a total and complete waste of time and a mis-use of a system that is already corrupt. Rather than attempt to get your share of $4.30 which is what the end result will be for participants just ride it out and either flash a working ROM or wait for the update.
I KNOW...WE HAVE ALL HEARD THE WHINING AND CRYING BEFORE.....I shouldn't have to flash a custom ROM, It's been since April blah blah blah...Ever heard the saying Buyer Beware. If you purchase the first run of damn near ANYTHING other than food or clothing there will ALMOST always be some type of bug to be worked out. And I don't wanna hear "Well I bought mine in June so it's not first run". IT IS!
Deal with it, grow up and let our courts handle more pressing issues other than your cell phone wont work. Hell, I flashed a custom ROM and then out of the blue am having re-boot issues. Maybe I should call Barry Obama and see if he can get me a replacement.
Have a great day!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The problem is people's willingness to accept the nonsense. If the consumer doesn't complant about these issues, these companies will just get away with it. I don't know about you, but I am tried of just getting defective phones, I exchange it three times and same problem, then politely ask them for a full refund and was refused, saying all they can do is repair it or exchange it for the same model then wrote a letter to their head corporate offices and haven't heard back. LG don't care, they made their money.
jrwingate6 said:
I knew I held onto my G2X for a reason...
Sent from my HTC Sensation 4G using XDA Premium App
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Click to collapse
You don't have to own the phone anymore, you just have to have owned it during the period outlined in complaint. Maybe I'll recoup some of my costs for moving to AT&T.
This is great news.
My view is a bit different. There are defects about a phone I can deal with (ie. backlight bleeding, gps/wifi) but when a phone can't operate as a phone, that draws the line.
The random reboots are the most annoying thing, and some of which don't ever reboot (requires a battery pull to get it working again).
This purchase has given me a very sour taste in my mouth for not only LG and their future products but also T-mobile's sub-par involvement in assisting customers.
I'm beyond the point of going to another carrier, since plans like the one I'm on no longer exist for this price. So unless T-mobile pulls through, I'll say screw the cell-phone market altogether.
I've noticed a well organized movement especially on this forums, which by the way seems biased toward HTC, to destroy the reputation of the Tmobile LG G2x.
Any wonder why G2x didn't get an update yet? I don't think so. All this slander has unfortunately slowed down support for G2x and the majority of G2x fans will suffer the consequences for the actions of this well organized few who wish to see the not so perfect HTC product win out.
Rofl.
Oh, and no.
I think your conspiracy theory about a conspiracy theory needs work.
No doubt its all being orchestrated by Apple to keep us Android fans arguing amongst ourselves. You know ... defeat us from within.
no wish it was
sory guy but the reason for the bad publicity for the g2x is because it is broken. many of us have exchnaged it several times only to get worse devices each time.
xda started pretty big with htc devices and it did take a while but i dont think a device that has come out isnt listed for support here. I for one do not want an htc device because they have a history of having poor antenna's as they did with the sensation. other than that i think HTC has stepped up the best with openness and communication with the community. And thus deserve the respect they are getting.
lg caused the problems with the g2x by releasing it with the same problems that the O2x had several months before. there is no hiding the fact that they knew and now they are just hiding.
Frankly I think HTC should target Samsung first...
wrong priority here.
jacob808 said:
I've noticed a well organized movement especially on this forums, which by the way seems biased toward HTC, to destroy the reputation of the Tmobile LG G2x.
Any wonder why G2x didn't get an update yet? I don't think so. All this slander has unfortunately slowed down support for G2x and the majority of G2x fans will suffer the consequences for the actions of this well organized few who wish to see the not so perfect HTC product win out.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I not biased at all LG, they had it coming to them and I only bought the HTC Sensation due to the G2x was unreliable, it not slander if it true.
The reason why updates are slow is due to your willingness to keep sub-standard merchandise and overlook the major issues. Even if your was fine, most others wasn't.
I gave LG every opportunity, to make good on their promise or refund me my money or just have a company officer call me back, but they refuse!! I even wrote a letter to their Alabama location and waited over three weeks and never heard back. Due to lack of communication and LG not standing behind their product, they deserve everything coming to them. It really didn't have to go this route, I hope more people post or keep posting if they had issues with LG corp.
I know this isn't going to fix any issues with the G2x, but will make companies think twice, before releasing a untested product with known issue to the market. And yes this phone was release 6 months before it hit USA, LG just rush it out to quick to be the first with a dual-core phone.
Conspiracy theory, no way. Dead end thread.
Thread closed.
Updated 09/6/12 http://forum.xda-developers.com/showpost.php?p=31190482&postcount=81
This is a combined log of my attempt to get answers from Verizon and Samsung regarding the encrypted bootloader. I currently have a ticket with level III tech support at Samsung. It took a huge dog and pony show to get this far and I have had several forum members contact me asking to pass along info and ask questions when I finally get a hold of the right people.
I posted most of this in another thread, but it not where it should have been so I am moving it for a mod so we can keep that other development thread clean. Its 8am EST and Samsung Level III should be open in three hours as they are not staffed 24/7 like Level II/I.
For the record Samsungs Tech Support phone number is 800-726-7864
Just remember the rep you talk to regardless of what their position in the company is had no say in the encrypting of the bootloader. Its not their fault Verizon screwed us, please keep that in mind if you call. Using 5c technical words will get you past Level I but level II seemed to be on point. It took some manipulative games to get the guy to admit there was even a level III department; at first he told me level II was the highest I could go in tech support. Will update with more info when I have something.
I am also considering contacting the firm that handled the Motorola V710 lawsuit against Verizon years ago. We won that one and anyone who wanted got to trade in their phone and accessories for a full refund, no ETF, and if they wanted could also get a new device w/o extending their contract. I hate lawyers and would rather cut off my pinky finger then deal with them but it may be the only option in the end. Its like Verizon delivered us cake, then shot our dog and walked away. So mentally exhausted dealing with this crap.
Lastly, I was able to get a hold of Verizon corporate and had a low level executive call me back. This was before the device was released and we knew the bootloader was encrypted. She told me to save her number, and I am glad I did because once we found out about the lockdown I called her back and left VM. Should hear back from her Monday.
Verizon's Corporate Contact Info.
Verizon Corporate Office Headquarters:
140 West Street
New York, NY 10007
Corporate Phone Number: 1-212-395-1000
Corporate Fax Number: 1-212-571-1897
Original Post:
Ok, just an update. Level III Samsung tech support is not 24/7 like Level II/I. I have a ticket in the system regarding the issue and its been forwarded to Level III.
They will be in tomorrow (Saturday) from 8am (PST) to 7pm (PST) and I have to call back to get a hold of someone in the Level III department. I will keep dragging this up the chain of command till I can get some answers. Level II once again confirmed what we already know, Verizon did mess with the phone. Level II said don't bother with Fastboot because were not getting in that way. I don't know if he was lying but he seemed to know exactly what I was talking about when I mentioned the odin/fastboot switch.
One more thing to note, I am not sure I believe him but he said that they sent the phones to Verizon, and its Verizon that did the messing around not Samsung. I find it hard to believe Verizon was able to do this without Samsung support.
I don't have high hopes of getting anything that will be able to help us out of Level III but I will try. They have also lodged a my customer complaint and supposedly I am going to be getting a call back from someone from their corporate office in consumer relations.
I wish I could help more on the technical side but my experience only takes me to the point where everyone else has gotten with fastboot. I am however quite the people person when it comes to making noise with corporations and will keep up the good fight with Verizon / Samsung Corporate.
If there is anything specific you want me to ask Level III send me a PM by tomorrow morning and I will address it with them when I call. I know enough that I should be able to at least hold a conversation with them on the subject but more ammo would be great. I would also be willing to conference call with a repeatable dev/mod when I call them so that you don't have to jump through the two hours of crap I just did to get this escalated.
Post 2: (A reply to a forum member asking for an update)
I asked them if there is a reason I can't get into fastboot and the guy said because Verizon has locked down the device. I asked him "how" and "why" but he was unable to provide me with an answer to both questions. He then referred me to Level III as he said they were the ones who could discuss how it was done. I asked him if there was a way around it through odin using .ops he went silent for a while and said he had no information to provide on the subject and just reiterated that Verizon has made changes to the device software and I would have to refer to them regarding those changes.
With regard to the "why" question he simply said that Samsung could not comment on carrier practices only that Verizon requested the lockdown and that the phones were sent to them first to have it applied. He made it sound like Samsung told them to go take a flying leap and Verizon went ahead and did it anyway. Again, were talking about a rep here so take it with a grain of salt.
I talked about the FCC's Block C agreement regarding carriers not locking devices but the rep said he did not have a comment on the subject as he was just tech support. Block C is probably the only legal course of action we have but despite the FCC saying they were going to enforce the rule, we all know how the FCC could give a crap.
I am going to flat out ask Level III to do the right thing and leak a file for us to fix the issue. I may be nuts but I am not delusional and have no real expectoration they will help. I am however going to do my best to get them to slip something that may help a dev find a solution. If I can get at least a small puzzle piece out of Level III it might be the crack in the dam we need to blow open the floodgates.
07/11/12 Samsung Level III blew me off yesterday as well saying they were still looking into the matter. I called again today and finally received an official reply. Samsung says they have no information exactly what Verizon has done to the phone, they do not know exactly what is and is not signed/encrypted, and they have no further information. I have submitted a complaint to the president of Samsung USA but thats as far as I could go with Samsung. They have closed my case and can not provide further information. I asked if they had an original system image before Verizon gimped the phone and they said "yes but we can not provide that to our customers per carrier agreement."
Lastly I was told that there is going to be a Verizon "Developer Edition" that you can buy directly from Samsung in the coming weeks. This is in "direct response to complaints filed by customers" according to Samsung and will be distributed and supported by Samsung directly. It will cost $600+ and basically be the same phone but w/o an signed/encrypted bootloader.
Off the record information from an unnamed outside source: Verizon is releasing a OTA update to patch the root exploit in the coming days. This OTA will break and prevent re-root as well as try and stop people from using the image off of the "Developer Edition" to mess with the "normal" Verizon Galaxy S3. I don't have specific details; sorry. Do not OTA unless you want to loose root and probably not get it back. Verizon is fk'ing pissed; I mean really pissed that we have root.
From what I am hearing, Verizon's "top %5 data abusers" are all typically rooted/romed. The whole point of locking this phone down was to mess with these unlimited data customers. Verizon started this war; let us end it and make them loath the day they decided to fk with the dev community.
Again, my case Support case has been closed with Samsung. We will get nothing further from them nor any direct help. My case with Verizon corporate is also closed; they said Samsung will offer a Developer model directly and if I wanted that kind of access I needed to talk to them not Verizon.
The lawyers still have not called me back. No shock.
Up until this point I have been angry; now I am pissed. This isn't over; not by a long shot.
Will update when I have more information.
07/17/12
Samsung "Office of the President" -
Phone 877-268-2121
eMail [email protected]
FYI Samsung records phone conversations between the 4th minute and the 18th minute. Anything you say after minute 4 and before minute 18 "MAY" be recorded. I know that sounds like a strange window of recording, but its straight out of the mouth of a sympathetic to the cause tech support rep. Just had a great conversation with a guy, nothing is fixed of course but needless to say, there are people in Samsung that have been hearing rumors that the company is tired of carrier's crap and with in the next few years will be offering all Samsung headsets for a subsidized price, directly through Samsung. There will probably be trade-in specials, loyalty discounts, etc. I can't wait not to buy my devices directly through Verizon! Secondly, as of now (Verizon lies again) anything software related with this phone is coming from, programmed by, and completely influenced by Verizon. Samsung manufacturing does not touch the device or support updates after its in the hands of Verizon. The developer model is not Verizon approved, nor is Verizon happy its going to be sold [from what I am told] however per FCC open network regulations Verizon has to allow the device on the network. Updates for the developer model will be directly from Samsung.
I was able to get the Samsung Apps (store) sideloaded on my device BTW. Verizon requested it be removed which is why its not on the device pre-installed. S-Suggest is NOT the same thing as Samsung Apps. Will Write something up here on XDA later when I get a chance.
07/24/12
The Electronic Frontier Foundation called me back and said they need more info on Block C. I am out of town until next Monday and let them know I would get back to them in a few days. They also are finding a lawyer who will do it pro bono. Looks like this may actually make it to court.
So we have root but we are still locked down unlike all other carriers. Basically this is going to turn into a Droid X situation and for those who know what I am talking about you know how bad this still sucks.
I am tired of this crap guys, and think with the amount of SG3 phones sold in the US and specifically Verizon, this is the time to strike back against all encrypted devices not just the GS3. We have dealt with this garbage long enough and now its time to end nonsense.
Kirtland and Packard, (310) 536-1000, 2361 Rosecrans Ave Ste 450, El Segundo, CA 90245
That's the law firm that won the huge case against Verizon over the Motorola v710 BT lockdown. I have left them a message asking if they will take this case too. In reality this one is going to vastly larger then the Moto case because of the number of users that have this device.
Please call them and let them know on the main VM that you too have been effected by this lockdown, or any lockdown in the US on any carrier. The more people who call the more likely they will take the case. Lots of people calling is how the guys over at Howard Forums were able to get the ball rolling on the v710, so let history repeat itself for the sake of every dev, phone enthusiast, and civil rights advocate.
ROM developers usually work off of donations and by encrypting this and other devices Verizon is stealing from these developers who's livelihood is phone software development. Software developers who want an open platform also have to deal with the hassle that Verizon and other carriers have put them through by locking down devices. If the personal computer was locked down like this when it was first created and sold to people we would never be where we were today technology wise. The crippling of our mobile devices needs to stop, and it needs to stop now.
Its time to take the fight to Verizon and hopefully end the lockdowns once and for all. If the lawfirm takes the case this is going to be winner takes all. This may be our best shot to end device lockdowns in the US once and for all.
I think the push we will make is going to be Block C. Normally Verizon could argue that they locked the device [against the FCC Block C mandate] because of network security. This is going to be hard for them to argue though when every other carrier in the US and internationally has not encrypted the device. It's a long shot, and its going to be up hill, but as far as I see it this is our best chance and the time to strike on this issue is now.
Samsung Level III opens in 30 min. Will update again soon.
Level III is not in on the weekends, so I was just told by the automated message I got when the guy transferred me to that department. ok... Not what they told me yesterday but ok.
So Monday at 8am PST it is, and that's also when Verizon corporate will be calling me back too as the past two calls they have made to me have been the ass crack of dawn. If I time it right I can conference the two in and let them try and point the finger at the other one, to each others faces. No more "That's what the manufacture wanted, go talk to them" vs "That's what the carrier wanted, talk to them" runaround bull****.
Anyway, no updates till Monday then. That gives me time to root.
i'll be the first to say it but thank you
going above and beyond especially considering nobody asked you to do this. great work and i hope it leads to some results
chill145 said:
i'll be the first to say it but thank you
going above and beyond especially considering nobody asked you to do this. great work and i hope it leads to some results
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yes thank you 100%, we are all in this together.
Also please file FCC Consumer Complaints against Verizon for potentially violating the openness requirements of the Block C spectrum purchasing agreement.
https://esupport.fcc.gov/ccmsforms/form2000.action?form_type=2000F
http://www.xda-developers.com/android/it-is-illegal-for-verizon-to-lock-some-bootloaders/
It's a long shot, but maybe worth it.
Have filed complaint with FCC and BBB, posted poor review on both Blue and White versons on VZW website, wall post ripping them apart on VZW facebook, poor reviews on every device site that will let me do so that I know of, personal contact with VZW reps filing complaints.
Any other avenues we can take?
Here's what I wrote in my FCC complaint:
The new Samsung Galaxy SIII on Verizon Wireless has a locked and encrypted bootloader, which appears to violate the openness requirements that Verizon agreed to when it purchased Block C, pursuant to § 27.16 (b) of 47 CFR Ch. I (10–1–10 Edition) available here-- http://www.gpo.gov/fdsys/pkg/CFR-2010-title47-vol2/pdf/CFR-2010-title47-vol2-sec27-16.pdf
§ 27.16 (e) clearly states "Handset locking prohibited" except under certain circumstances previously delineated. The anti-consumer actions taken by Verizon impinge upon the free of use of devices by consumers, and potentially harms the livelihoods of developers, who may not be able to do their work on the device of their choice.
I would appreciate the FCC investigating and clarifying this situation.
Thank you,
Thinking further about it, with how prominent devices are in today's world, would various news providers not want to run this story as well?
I recommend tipping off any local newspaper and news station you have access to. Lets get this story out there~!
Thalinor said:
So we have root but we are still locked down unlike all other carriers. Basically this is going to turn into a Droid X situation and for those who know what I am talking about you know how bad this still sucks.
I am tired of this crap guys, and think with the amount of SG3 phones sold in the US and specifically Verizon, this is the time to strike back against all encrypted devices not just the GS3. We have dealt with this garbage long enough and now its time to end nonsense.
Kirtland and Packard, (310) 536-1000, 2361 Rosecrans Ave Ste 450, El Segundo, CA 90245
That's the law firm that won the huge case against Verizon over the Motorola v710 BT lockdown. I have left them a message asking if they will take this case too. In reality this one is going to vastly larger then the Moto case because of the number of users that have this device.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I know that the dev's are working there rear ends off, and I appreciate all their efforts. I am truly pulling for them and hope that they can get the bootloader figured out. I'm not an expert, but in my opinion the ROMs on the DX didn't compare to a fully unlocked device and I'd prefer not to have to suffer through 2+ years of touchwiz.
Thalinor,
I agree that this maybe turning into the Droid X. As a droid x owner, waiting and watching for 18 months to see VZW and Motorola dump on us, I don't think we'll get anywhere with them. There was a huge effort on the DX with petitions, phone calls, emails, twitter, and FB posts.
Just a thought, but what about petitioning the law firm to take up this case. We are not going to get anywhere from VZW's or Samsung's pity for us. If this bootloader is truly encrypted, and if it is anything like the DX, the only way we will get this device completely unlocked is through a legal obligation on VZW's part. I think our energy would be better spent with the Attorneys who stand to profit from this case rather than burning our energy on VZW and Samsung who probably don't give a crap. I would think that the law-firm would have some interest in this (maybe?):
File with the FCC:
http://www.fcc.gov/complaints/
Talk about the Block C complaints. Don't attack them.
Post on VZW's Facebook:
https://www.facebook.com/verizon
Talk about how dissatisfied you are and how you're looking to switch. Don't attack them.
Post on Samsung Mobile's Facebook:
https://www.facebook.com/SamsungMobile
Don't attack them. Talk about how you will reconsider purchasing their devices in the future. They don't want to have to lock bootloaders, Verizon is almost certainly making them do it.
File with the BBB:
http://www.bbb.org/us/verizon-wireless/
Talk about how anti-competitive their practices are and how dissatisfied you are as a customer. Require an answer.
Complain to Verizon Wireless' Site:
https://www.verizonwireless.com/b2c/contact/email.jsp
Don't attack them. Keep in mind you're talking to an employee, they didn't choose to lock down the bootloader. Be respectful but make your concern noted.
The problem lies with Verizon Wireless. They believe that there are not enough people concerned about this to affect their profit margin. You need to show that you will vote with your dollar and move somewhere else if this complaint is not answered. Also, bring up the Block C agreement. There are potential legal repercussions-- meaning that the FCC may be the best place to direct your complaints. Be respectful, I know we're upset, but being pissed off won't get you anywhere.
I just filled out a complaint with the FCC basically asking them to enforce the Block C agreement from Verizon.
I'll phone the lawyers posted on the first page when I get a chance at work tomorrow.
amt897 said:
File with the FCC:
http://www.fcc.gov/complaints/
Talk about the Block C complaints. Don't attack them.
Post on VZW's Facebook:
https://www.facebook.com/verizon
Talk about how dissatisfied you are and how you're looking to switch. Don't attack them.
Post on Samsung Mobile's Facebook:
https://www.facebook.com/SamsungMobile
Don't attack them. Talk about how you will reconsider purchasing their devices in the future. They don't want to have to lock bootloaders, Verizon is almost certainly making them do it.
File with the BBB:
http://www.bbb.org/us/verizon-wireless/
Talk about how anti-competitive their practices are and how dissatisfied you are as a customer. Require an answer.
Complain to Verizon Wireless' Site:
https://www.verizonwireless.com/b2c/contact/email.jsp
Don't attack them. Keep in mind you're talking to an employee, they didn't choose to lock down the bootloader. Be respectful but make your concern noted.
The problem lies with Verizon Wireless. They believe that there are not enough people concerned about this to affect their profit margin. You need to show that you will vote with your dollar and move somewhere else if this complaint is not answered. Also, bring up the Block C agreement. There are potential legal repercussions-- meaning that the FCC may be the best place to direct your complaints. Be respectful, I know we're upset, but being pissed off won't get you anywhere.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I don't even own an S3, nor am I on Verizon, but damn't...I'm doing every one of things and calling just out of principle. I'm glad I left Verizon a long time ago, but they still tried to get more for money for almost 2 years. Damn near ruined my credit...assholes are going down.
Sent from my SGH-I727 using xda premium
I'd love to see this in major media:
"The Samsung S3 is a excellent smartphone, but Verizon's software modifications have made it unlikely to be upgraded and supported long term. If that's important to you, we recommend you consider another carrier."
My girlfriend used to work for the local news, I'll talk to her about contacting her friends at the station and see if I can get a face to face, or at least an email contact. I'll have to dig up all the info I can on the block C stuff and locked/encrypted bootloaders to take to them first.
Sent from my Droid X until I get my SGS3
block c
The Block C issue relates more toward unlocked devices like the nexus on the play store than unlocked bootloaders. You may be able to press the unlocked bootloader issue under the 'open applications' provision, but obviously that did a ton of good for Google Wallet. Of course, I can't find a single device you can use on Verizon's network that isn't held in verizon's death grip, so even the open device provision seems to be being ignored. The worst part is that verizon filed suits against these provisions and LOST. But true to form, if you have enough money and pull, and are willing to screw your customers as every turn (share everything plans are such a great deal right?) you can break the law over and over in broad daylight, and no one with power will bat an eye. Also, I'm not sure why the 'open application' provision was never really used as a battering ram when in came to things like tethering applications.
I think this type of work is very important. Thanks so much. Very much looking forward to hearing more from the companies themselves about why they make these types of decisions. Can't wait for an update here.
Sent from my Incredible 2 using xda app-developers app
Complained with the FCC, here is my complaint for anyone looking for somewhat of a template.
Recently, after preordering a Samsung Galaxy s3 handset from Verizon, I learned that they have violated the openness requirements of the Block C spectrum purchasing agreement by encrypting my device. This directly impacts my ability to enjoy my phone, and take advantage of the spectrum which Verizon owns. While I understand that the purchasing agreement gives Verizon leeway in regards to "reasonable" protection of the network, no other carrier in the United States (or the world), has done this, leading me to believe that this action is indeed unreasonable. It is unfair and anti-competitive for a company to misuse frequencies they own in this way.
I appreciate your time, and would appreciate a response in this matter.
Thank you,
With Verizon Twitter claiming it was Samsung, I'm curious what both companies said.
skennelly said:
I know that the dev's are working there rear ends off, and I appreciate all their efforts. I am truly pulling for them and hope that they can get the bootloader figured out. I'm not an expert, but in my opinion the ROMs on the DX didn't compare to a fully unlocked device and I'd prefer not to have to suffer through 2+ years of touchwiz.
Thalinor,
Just a thought, but what about petitioning the law firm to take up this case. We are not going to get anywhere from VZW's or Samsung's pity for us. If this bootloader is truly encrypted, and if it is anything like the DX, the only way we will get this device completely unlocked is through a legal obligation on VZW's part. I think our energy would be better spent with the Attorneys who stand to profit from this case rather than burning our energy on VZW and Samsung who probably don't give a crap. I would think that the law-firm would have some interest in this (maybe?):
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
That's the whole point! I certainly don't have the money to go up against Verizon and do not want to make a dime out of this; that's not the point at all. I want Verizon to once and for all agree to stop ****ing with our phones. Phones should be sold locked not signed/encrypted.
Locked protects Verizon or the manufacture from having to eat the costs of a new phone when an end user breaks their device doing something irresponsible. I don't want Verizon paying for people's screwed up devices because eventually it will lead to MY bill going up. Its not my fault if someone screw's up their device. On the other hand by encrypting the bootloader Verizon is forcing people to do things that may lead to breaking your phone. If the manufacture offered a phone number for unlocking, where you would agree that unless it was something hardware defective, if you unlock and your device breaks, its not under warranty. Problem solved for everyone; no encrypted bootloader needed.
I am going after Verizon but this is really about every carrier who gimps cell phones. Smartphones have become pocket computers. They are no longer PDA's, or "like" pocket computers, they ARE pocket computers. Hell, my SG3 is got better hardware specs than the **** netbooks people waited in line for last black Friday at Walmart. If we consider netbooks in that they come giving the buyer full administrative access over the device and yet still give the end user the option to hook it up to Wi-Fi. One way or another my devices are hooking up to a company who I pay for data and/or voice service. My rights should be universal and now that the device in my pocket has evolved into a full blown computer, my access rights should evolve as well. Whether its a computer in your pocket or a computer on your desk, it can be used in accordance with your providers service agreement, or it can be abused.
Prejudging your entire customer base to abuse your network and handing down sentence as judge, jury, and executioner like Verizon has done, before people have even had the chance to make the decision to do right or wrong; to me that just violates every ideal set forth in this countries constitution. I am ****ing sick of corporate america ****ting on this countries citizens, and the whole god damn world for that matter. It needs to stop. While I despise lawyers to the core, I sincerely hope they take on this case and prove there are still people in the field who remember why their profession exists (Hint: Its NOT to make money) and that there is some justice left in this country.
/end rant
Update: Talked to Verizon Exec, they have passed info on to the lawyers to look over and may or may not get back to me; at this point its out of her hands.
Update: I have not heard back from the lawyers above, but another user here on XDA PM'd me and said they were able to talk to someone today who told them that the legal team was looking into the case and make a decision after getting more information. They have my number, if they want to call me they can; if not I could care less who spear heads this as long as the battle is fought and won.
Update: I called Samsung, talked to Level I, they tried to transfer me to level III, I was put on told and Level I came back and said they would call me back later. The call never came. I will try them again more vigorously tomorrow.
MichaelVash7886 said:
With Verizon Twitter claiming it was Samsung, I'm curious what both companies said.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
LMFAO @ Verizon's blatant bull**** lies. Why would Samsung decide, at their own free will and expense, to sign-encrypt ONLY Verizon's Galaxy S3, and not one other carrier in the world? Verizon is full of **** and the fact they think the line "Its the other guys fault" is actually going to work, is flat out ****ing insulting.
Screenshot that and post it here please. I do not use social networking; if they really need to spy on me they have my smartphone information, and know where to find me.
Ok I am just going to throw it out there. Please just hold the waves of "can't" and "not gonna work" negativity is just a waste. There are ways to get your voice heard that have worked for me in the past and here is my suggestion. The more the merrier!
Problem is Verizon put a encrypted bootloader on the Samsung Galaxy S3. The bigger problem and the angle we should have is they sold it to us with out letting us know their difference. News of the other S3's sold around the world painted a clear image of what we were getting into... "The same phone." Samsung had used their brand to deliver one device between all networks. Yes there were some cpu changes due to networks but that was noted everywhere. Verizon always note differences in how great there network is and the plus's in their service over others but nothing on the one change they had done to the Galaxy S3 vs the entire world. Obviously because its a negative. Their sales model was we are selling the Galaxy S3 and since we thought we were getting the same product we ordered it. Thats pretty big. Complaining here on xda I think is a waste.., the petition... I did sign btw but unfortunetly is just noise to Verizon. Everyone has to call with the general attitude of being frustrated like they have not been honestly sold a product and that trust was broken.
Don't get mad, don't start going threatening to jump ship... say that this really has broken our trust, don't mention technical info or just lightly because they are not going to have a clue. Say that they made no mention anywhere nor any employee informed you that their device was locked down vs any other and that they do a great job of letting you know market, network, and service differences but didn't lift a finger to let you know about the phone difference being a negative. Lastly listen to what they say as frustrating as it may be and say you want to find a way to rectify this what ever it takes.
Don't make calling your daily task, but just call when you have time... IE ride into work, ride home. Talk to the cust rep and when that fizzles ask for a super. Hang up call again then explain the same frustration and how you even more frustrated with the crappy response the previous rep and that its not acceptable. Just keep asking who you can talk to. If half there customer support traffic is from the locked bootloader and misleading sales thats going to send a pretty good message plus everything else thats going on with news online.
Lastly you could even email them, the more the better. The whole deal here is the message needs to be going to THE MAN... Big Red. Not the message being found out by the man reading it in off of some blog. The additional traffic to their general daily cycle work will send a strong concern message but with the same message of being misleading sales starts to make it a big deal. If this goes mainstream that can be very threatening. There is no guarantee it will work but the more headlines of frustrated and upset customers is really bad for them. No business wants to be linked to upset mis-informed customers...That is a trust issue in the Verizon Name.
Side note: This refocused energy may also help the DEV work with less noise and clutter. Everyone wants to help which is cool but so many none useful comments. If it was that easy these guys would have already done it. Lets let them reverse engineer things while we use our energy usefully to stir things up on the other end.
Boss428man said:
Ok I am just going to throw it out there. Please just hold the waves of "can't" and "not gonna work" negativity is just a waste. There are ways to get your voice heard that have worked for me in the past and here is my suggestion. The more the merrier!
Problem is Verizon put a encrypted bootloader on the Samsung Galaxy S3. The bigger problem and the angle we should have is they sold it to us with out letting us know their difference. News of the other S3's sold around the world painted a clear image of what we were getting into... "The same phone." Samsung had used their brand to deliver one device between all networks. Yes there were some cpu changes due to networks but that was noted everywhere. Verizon always note differences in how great there network is and the plus's in their service over others but nothing on the one change they had done to the Galaxy S3 vs the entire world. Obviously because its a negative. Their sales model was we are selling the Galaxy S3 and since we thought we were getting the same product we ordered it. Thats pretty big. Complaining here on xda I think is a waste.., the petition... I did sign btw but unfortunetly is just noise to Verizon. Everyone has to call with the general attitude of being frustrated like they have not been honestly sold a product and that trust was broken.
Don't get mad, don't start going threatening to jump ship... say that this really has broken our trust, don't mention technical info or just lightly because they are not going to have a clue. Say that they made no mention anywhere nor any employee informed you that their device was locked down vs any other and that they do a great job of letting you know market, network, and service differences but didn't lift a finger to let you know about the phone difference being a negative. Lastly listen to what they say as frustrating as it may be and say you want to find a way to rectify this what ever it takes.
Don't make calling your daily task, but just call when you have time... IE ride into work, ride home. Talk to the cust rep and when that fizzles ask for a super. Hang up call again then explain the same frustration and how you even more frustrated with the crappy response the previous rep and that its not acceptable. Just keep asking who you can talk to. If half there customer support traffic is from the locked bootloader and misleading sales thats going to send a pretty good message plus everything else thats going on with news online.
Lastly you could even email them, the more the better. The whole deal here is the message needs to be going to THE MAN... Big Red. Not the message being found out by the man reading it in off of some blog. The additional traffic to their general daily cycle work will send a strong concern message but with the same message of being misleading sales starts to make it a big deal. If this goes mainstream that can be very threatening. There is no guarantee it will work but the more headlines of frustrated and upset customers is really bad for them. No business wants to be linked to upset mis-informed customers...That is a trust issue in the Verizon Name.
Side note: This refocused energy may also help the DEV work with less noise and clutter. Everyone wants to help which is cool but so many none useful comments. If it was that easy these guys would have already done it. Lets let them reverse engineer things while we use our energy usefully to stir things up on the other end.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Such a great post :good:
I totally agree and I think this will catch their attention way more than anything we can do online. I'm in.
Wont do anything different. They'll tell you the same thing they told me after I filed a BBB complaint against thrm for my X2. "Your totally right our phones blow, so let me early upgrade you or do ypu want to terminate your contract for X amount of money?"
mike86325 said:
Such a great post :good:
I totally agree and I think this will catch their attention way more than anything we can do online. I'm in.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Thank you for the kind words, Its the same angle I talk to Verizon about on the 28th the day that they said the Unlimited Data was gone.. I told them that I found out from everyone but them and how they didn't inform me in any way.
We need to get more people on the non informed purchase angle. They make no mention online or anywhere. Sure Pocketnow and like sites do but they are not selling us the phone. Their image is even worse now that Corp and Tech release 2 different statements.
I really hope this gets unlocked easily because I really like the phone really nice feel to it.
This is a good approach. As someone who pitches in with customer service/support for a tech company, it's often the "nice" people who get better responses, and the quantity of requests can have a bigger affect.... way more than one angry person ranting and raving that you can just write off and ignore.
Also, it's still a person at the other end of the line. They probably are not aware of the situation or don't like it either, but it's their job. It's the people at the top that usually push down these horrible policies, the bean counters and such that don't have to deal with the angry public.
I work at a major utility. Please remember that if you call be nice to the customer service representative you are taking to. They are only the messenger, please remember that. They are not allowed too much latitude with what they can do for you. The reason for your call is logged and reviewed by the management of the company so if you call constantly and take up customer service minutes over the locked bootloader you WILL have an impact on daily business and cause management of the company to fix the problem. Calling customer service works.
Sent from my ADR6300 using Tapatalk 2
Boss428man said:
Ok I am just going to throw it out there. Please just hold the waves of "can't" and "not gonna work" negativity is just a waste. There are ways to get your voice heard that have worked for me in the past and here is my suggestion. The more the merrier!
Problem is Verizon put a encrypted bootloader on the Samsung Galaxy S3. The bigger problem and the angle we should have is they sold it to us with out letting us know their difference. News of the other S3's sold around the world painted a clear image of what we were getting into... "The same phone." Samsung had used their brand to deliver one device between all networks. Yes there were some cpu changes due to networks but that was noted everywhere. Verizon always note differences in how great there network is and the plus's in their service over others but nothing on the one change they had done to the Galaxy S3 vs the entire world. Obviously because its a negative. Their sales model was we are selling the Galaxy S3 and since we thought we were getting the same product we ordered it. Thats pretty big. Complaining here on xda I think is a waste.., the petition... I did sign btw but unfortunetly is just noise to Verizon. Everyone has to call with the general attitude of being frustrated like they have not been honestly sold a product and that trust was broken.
Don't get mad, don't start going threatening to jump ship... say that this really has broken our trust, don't mention technical info or just lightly because they are not going to have a clue. Say that they made no mention anywhere nor any employee informed you that their device was locked down vs any other and that they do a great job of letting you know market, network, and service differences but didn't lift a finger to let you know about the phone difference being a negative. Lastly listen to what they say as frustrating as it may be and say you want to find a way to rectify this what ever it takes.
Don't make calling your daily task, but just call when you have time... IE ride into work, ride home. Talk to the cust rep and when that fizzles ask for a super. Hang up call again then explain the same frustration and how you even more frustrated with the crappy response the previous rep and that its not acceptable. Just keep asking who you can talk to. If half there customer support traffic is from the locked bootloader and misleading sales thats going to send a pretty good message plus everything else thats going on with news online.
Lastly you could even email them, the more the better. The whole deal here is the message needs to be going to THE MAN... Big Red. Not the message being found out by the man reading it in off of some blog. The additional traffic to their general daily cycle work will send a strong concern message but with the same message of being misleading sales starts to make it a big deal. If this goes mainstream that can be very threatening. There is no guarantee it will work but the more headlines of frustrated and upset customers is really bad for them. No business wants to be linked to upset mis-informed customers...That is a trust issue in the Verizon Name.
Side note: This refocused energy may also help the DEV work with less noise and clutter. Everyone wants to help which is cool but so many none useful comments. If it was that easy these guys would have already done it. Lets let them reverse engineer things while we use our energy usefully to stir things up on the other end.
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I feel for you guys. I really do. We've tried everything with the One X but to no avail. Good luck with your attempts. These carriers need to remember who gives them their money.
Sent from my HTC One X using xda app-developers app
manchild83 said:
I work at a major utility. Please remember that if you call be nice to the customer service representative you are taking to. They are only the messenger, please remember that. They are not allowed too much latitude with what they can do for you. The reason for your call is logged and reviewed by the management of the company so if you call constantly and take up customer service minutes over the locked bootloader you WILL have an impact on daily business and cause management of the company to fix the problem. Calling customer service works.
Sent from my ADR6300 using Tapatalk 2
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Thank you for the comment and good to hear your advise!
Ok now we really have been miss sold. The answers I have recieved from support are well making there position worse they said that not only the bricking of devices but that these open devices would take down their data networks do to use. If that is the case why release the "Developer Edition". Everything will break lose anyway. We all pre-ordered thinking we got a unlocked Galaxy S3 and now with out any word of additional editions they try and fix things...?
Where was an unlocked phone advertised or even realistically expected?
It sucks but VZW is so big and doesn't care at all, and won't suffer much from it.
Sent from my AT&T Galaxy SIII (SGH-i747)
yes it was expected since EVER model that has been released thats att tmo sprint international korean and us cellular ALL are unlocked.
Thats it it wasn't printed that it was locked it was advertised just like the other Galaxy s3's... They were sell you the same Galaxy S3 with the same experience you would expect unless other wise noted... which it wasn't... They should just offer to unlock our phones and void the warranty. Simple fix and essentially the same thing they have done with the Developer Edition and it would save them some returns..