Related
OK so i know this is the wrong forum, BUT I came across this and wanted to "bump" it so to speak. This was posted by kyphur in 08 and in a mods sig now. Please read and adhere to the spirit of the post. It is RIGHT ON!!!
I think what a lot of people forget is that this is not a "make my phone neat & kewl" place.
As implied by the name this is technically a Developers forum/community.
Now what does that mean? Well first off it means that there is an expectation that if you are here then you want to customize your device but rather than just installing something that someone packaged you want to understand how it works and maybe even enhance it yourself.
When I first came here with a Blue Angel it was a different environment. PDA Phones were not embraced by the general public because of the expense and complexity (I paid over $400 for my BA). A $400 phone 4 years ago was expensive, today the Tilt is $300 after rebates but with inflation & the rise in the cost of other devices and the fact that there are other sources out there giving them away for $150 our neat bit of kit has become popular with mainstream users.
Now we have a flood of new users who are asking not "How can I do this myself" but more like "Give me the quick fix" without caring to understand the process. See if you read the threads then you get to experience the learning process, you see how the issues were investigated and confirmed. Then you get to watch the different attempts at resolution and learn why some failed while others worked. That is called Development.
The NooB backlash is coming from users who have walked in the development shoes and is directed mainly at those who don't care for the journey but just want the end result or destination.
As a Development Forum we are just as much (if not more) about the journey. I've read so many comments like "I don't have time to read all of the threads" or "I don't care how it works, just that it does". These very statements are contrary to the heart & soul of XDA-Devs and that is why the backlash is so strong.
Let me be very clear on this: IF YOU DON'T CARE ABOUT UNDERSTANDING THE JOURNEY THEN YOU PROBABLY SHOULDN'T BE HERE IN THE FIRST PLACE.
XDA-Devs is about developers & hackers helping each other and working together to get the most out of our devices by understanding them better than most.
XDA-Devs is not about helping everyone who wants a "Kewl bit of kit" make their phone better than the guy next to him.
Now do we go kicking users off who never contribute anything, NO. We tolerate it to an extent. Where the toleration ends is when these users start diluting the usefulness of the forum by repeating the same questions over and over again.
You ask us to understand your position. Well if you want to benefit from our experience and time then I think it is only fair that you understand our position.
Maybe you can recommend an alternative site for people who just want the newest tweaks and software.
the idea is not that only developers should be looking at this site, but that this is a place where developers communicate with each other and the beneficiaries of their work. This is not the place for someone to post threads about general questions about how to use or mod their device. This is a place that will develop the capabilities of the android platform if it is allowed. Developers WILL abandon this forum if it becomes a bulletin board or a technical support site.....and if you need a question answered, there are other forums on THIS site to address those.
Agreed 100%. While developing for the Windows mobile, I also got the same thing. I would post a thread and WARN people of a certain things and tell them how to fix it. Then I'd get 30 pages of "geeze, you broke something. how do you fix it?" That gets annoying real fast. I would love it if this forum forced people to take a test before they could post in the development sections... Before that, they should only be able to post in the regular sections.
One thing that really bugs me is the fact that the newbs don't want to search but don't realize that they take OUR time to search FOR them. No one knows everything. Every developer on this site searches and learns. I know that if you put together all the time that I've spent on this site JUST researching and searching, it'd be MONTHS and MONTHS of non-stop, no sleep searching and researching. So why can't the average person search for 2 minutes? Is their time worth more than my time?
/rant - while talking on the phone so it might not make sense...
Pinesal said:
Maybe you can recommend an alternative site for people who just want the newest tweaks and software.
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There are thousands, but essentially all they do is copy stuff off here.
Like the post said, if you just want to root your phone so it can do 'cool stuff' and not give a **** about how the damn thing works then maybe you shouldn't be modding your phone (that wasn't aimed at you btw, just 'people' in general the market place is made up of 99% 'these people' who don't/can't read and it's pretty irritating.)
Agree with the post 100%, fantastic
we sadly are living in the (ME) world
there is such a huge gape beetween the 10-19 generation and 20-29
10-19 generation is living in such an easy world, they never had to blow into their nintendo cassettes , know how heavy a quantum bigfoot is or what RTFM mean's
You said it, this is in the wrong forum.
You're not an admin and although you can spend your time here (and pretty much all of your posts) reporting out-of-place threads, you're still not an admin.
People always wonder into communities and it always takes a while to learn the way things work. Mickey is doing a good job on closing and moving threads that are unrelated to development.
With that said...
Reported.
Agreed. It's really, really, really, really getting to me. I wish OP's had semi-moderator power. They could at least delete all necessary posts and ban that user - if required- for a certain amount of time from their thread only.
jubeh said:
You said it, this is in the wrong forum.
You're not an admin and although you can spend your time here (and pretty much all of your posts) reporting out-of-place threads, you're still not an admin.
People always wonder into communities and it always takes a while to learn the way things work. Mickey is doing a good job on closing and moving threads that are unrelated to development.
With that said...
Reported.
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ughh, no i'm not an admin, and no almost all my posts, or the majority, or a half are reported threads, but i do try to help out the mods when i can. they are not on all forums at all times and can use the help, and they have said as much.
Oh thank you thank you! People here should want to understand why thing the work as they work. Not just want their phones to look cool.
As it you wouldnt know it, i have been with xda for years well since the titan came out. before that i was modding an ipaq and of course the old palms. everyonce in awhile i lose interest and move on only to come back when i have something new(major a.d.d). i do write java as well as c and even c++(so on) i typically find this place useful to try stuff out and even set up my own custom rom just for me. i dont post because i can google. while i have many of my own questions i would like answered i simply dont ask most of the time(such as using micro kernels and modding app2sd to make the os have two options sd in or out. however the problem is not the generations or age difference or anything like that. its social systems outside of xda. posting a reply used to mean an answer or something useful. now its normal to simply post "great job". thats nice and all but maybe instead of complaining about it we should come up with a new system that improves xda. like a sorting system or sub thread system and set up catagorys for our replys. like thumbs up would be for the "good job". i know its hard to keep everyone happy but this is a forum first, a forum has design problems when you get the number of people xda has. use advanced search it helps a lot. a sorting system with requirements for certain catagorys would help devs. its not easy modding and getting it right and you cant do it alone. xda is the help even if its not your phone sometimes others have solutions too. such as winmo users putting android on their phones(yes i did it too my old titan for fun). things i learned and other devs learn can help us and vice versa. i have yet to find bad technology only poorly thought out ideas that could have been. which is why we mod.
p.s. wtf is up with palm and blackberry ads all the time.
Most of those kids just want the answer or fix in the next 3min. with perfect steps or a patch that supposedly will fix and hack their device,after that they´ll never show up.
All they want is to show off without bothering to read.
I totaly understand. I do feel sometimes that certain devs do get a bit annoyed with people who just want to fix the phone and not understand. I'm not linux or coding wiz. But whe I got here in may I was one of the people who just wanted me phone to be better than urs. I still have that to some extent but I have developed more of a "how and what is causeing this issue" attitude. I try to contribute as best as I can. Helping out over at q&a as best as I can. I enjoy xda and without my days would be more boring than what the are now. I dunno I guess I'm just rambling. Bottom line is I have tried to correct my attitude toward modding. Hell I even post my email so users can drop a line if they need help.
i am 20 and i fondly remember blowing into my nes super nes and genesis games.
i am pretty new to XDA. when i first found this site all i wanted was a quick fix. now i am getting more intrested in the actual dev aspect. i want to be able to create my own rom eventualy. yes i do find myself asking stupid questions and getting some foul responses but in my opinion no question is a stupid one. only the one not asked. yes alot of people just want a fix but there are new users who want to learn. like me. so i appreciate the help i have recieved from most members. and i alwasy appoligise for my stupidity. so dont get down on all noobs because alot of us want to learn and the only way to is to ask.
saprano614 said:
i am pretty new to XDA. when i first found this site all i wanted was a quick fix. now i am getting more intrested in the actual dev aspect. i want to be able to create my own rom eventualy. yes i do find myself asking stupid questions and getting some foul responses but in my opinion no question is a stupid one. only the one not asked. yes alot of people just want a fix but there are new users who want to learn. like me. so i appreciate the help i have recieved from most members. and i alwasy appoligise for my stupidity. so dont get down on all noobs because alot of us want to learn and the only way to is to ask.
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nobody is getting down on noobs. ONLY the site users who FAIL to post questions and general comments in the correct forum
jaaronmoody said:
nobody is getting down on noobs. ONLY the site users who FAIL to post questions and general comments in the correct forum
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Just want to make a statement befor someone did.
I thank you for this post. I came to this forum a long time ago I have learned quite a bit and appreciate everything that is done here. There are very skillful people that are on here and I wish I had the amount of skill then thesemodders, hackers, developers etc... have I keep my mouth shut unless i feel there is some thing that i know how to answer, i have never complained about a single rom i simply research what can be done to change for fix it, all answers rely in a search somewhere either here or google. I just wish other people would do the same then we would be able to prevent a 300+ page threads where only about 25 pages are worth anything.
look at the amount of posts from someone who knows they are barley able to contrubute(but do what he can) and been here this long. compared to people who have been here dont have much to contribute but love to post everything that comes to thier minds.
Join Date
22nd October 2006
Total Posts
89
samygent said:
we sadly are living in the (ME) world
there is such a huge gape beetween the 10-19 generation and 20-29
10-19 generation is living in such an easy world, they never had to blow into their nintendo cassettes , know how heavy a quantum bigfoot is or what RTFM mean's
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
HEY!
im 18 and clearly remember blowing into those damn games to make them work. but when they worked, so much fun i still think theyre better than the crappy xbox and ps3 games of today... but thats just me. lol
pleeease yall! let's keep THIS thread on topic! LOL!!
Of course, let me first pay my respects to the devs and their much appriciated efforts.
I was just doing my daily browse of the dream and sapphire forums and a few things occured to me that i wanted to share in case they warranted some real consideration by others.
Cross-device-roms
It seems that more and more lately, ROMs posted in the Dream forum would be just as appropriate in the Sapphire forum because they work on both platforms. I don't expect the mods want to double-post, then track both, but it doesn't seem efficient, nor a great idea to leave it to the users to create the new topics and link over. To help differenciate those ROMs and make searching easier, perhaps the subject line could say something like [dream/sapphire]?
Google/HTC-base
Another issue I've come across as a result of NEEDING full exchange support and wanting good integration (iow, not using market apps to get it), I've come to realize that HTC ROMs provide this and AOSP/Google ROMs don't. Now that I get this, I'm surprised to find that ROM subject lines don't declare which type of base was used (perhaps it's assumed/implied), but seeing [Google-base] or [HTC-base] (or something like that) would be incredibly helpful for folks like me.
User-rating-of-builds
Lastly, instead of wading through pages of posts to find out what others think of any given ROM, I'd love to see some sort of rating system and polls would be a good way to do this, but then I consider the versioning/release complication involved and wonder if that would be a bad idea implemented so simply, or if the poll could be reset with each release. This way it would be easy at a glance to see how happy/pleased/satisfied the users of a ROM are.
I'm sure many people can think of why any of these suggestions might NOT be a good idea, but there's no point building up this thread airing those concerns. If you're a dev/modder and you agree, just do what you think is best. If you're a user and you agree, see the attached poll and use it. Ideally, this post will die if nobody agrees and if they do, change will happen.
If you vote and that's not enough to bump the thread, maybe you should post with something simple like 'voted' to keep it alive.
Take care all.
rainabba said:
Of course, let me first pay my respects to the devs and their much appriciated efforts.
I was just doing my daily browse of the dream and sapphire forums and a few things occured to me that i wanted to share in case they warranted some real consideration by others.
Cross-device-roms
It seems that more and more lately, ROMs posted in the Dream forum would be just as appropriate in the Sapphire forum because they work on both platforms. I don't expect the mods want to double-post, then track both, but it doesn't seem efficient, nor a great idea to leave it to the users to create the new topics and link over. To help differenciate those ROMs and make searching easier, perhaps the subject line could say something like [dream/sapphire]?
Google/HTC-base
Another issue I've come across as a result of NEEDING full exchange support and wanting good integration (iow, not using market apps to get it), I've come to realize that HTC ROMs provide this and AOSP/Google ROMs don't. Now that I get this, I'm surprised to find that ROM subject lines don't declare which type of base was used (perhaps it's assumed/implied), but seeing [Google-base] or [HTC-base] (or something like that) would be incredibly helpful for folks like me.
User-rating-of-builds
Lastly, instead of wading through pages of posts to find out what others think of any given ROM, I'd love to see some sort of rating system and polls would be a good way to do this, but then I consider the versioning/release complication involved and wonder if that would be a bad idea implemented so simply, or if the poll could be reset with each release. This way it would be easy at a glance to see how happy/pleased/satisfied the users of a ROM are.
I'm sure many people can think of why any of these suggestions might NOT be a good idea, but there's no point building up this thread airing those concerns. If you're a dev/modder and you agree, just do what you think is best. If you're a user and you agree, see the attached poll and use it. Ideally, this post will die if nobody agrees and if they do, change will happen.
If you vote and that's not enough to bump the thread, maybe you should post with something simple like 'voted' to keep it alive.
Take care all.
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Click to collapse
very good idea voted.
i want to get involved in the community and help bring great things to this device and any other that i can. i have a degree in computer information systems, do systems imaging, and know enough to get by, tweak, and customize, but linux was never taught to me . it is pretty straight forward. i understand the concept, language, and most of the commands, but i am not a programmer by trade. i do know that you don't even have to actually know a lot of languages because, in many cases, there is another program that you can tell what you want to happen and it will write the base language for you. if somebody can point me in the right direction and/or give me a task to help them with, i would love to do so.
thank you
don't mean to sound ignorant. just wanna help.
That's a fantastic attitude, and welcome to the doubleshot forums.
The MT4G Slide Compendium is a sticky at the top of general here, and is a great starting point to familiarize yourself with the doubleshot forums. It has links to a lot of the relevant threads scattered around here, as well as some explanations of terminology and so forth. It's designed to help orient you with everything we have going on here.
Here is a link to my Guide Index, which is a collection of tutorials and such i've put here and is also in my sig. The bottom of the post has links to a lot of information about the device off-site, manufacturer and so forth.
One of the best things you can do if you aren't contributing code is to contribute documentation. How to do basically anything you want to do is spread out all over XDA as a whole. If information can be referenced and concentrated here into the MT4GS sub-forums, it would make it easier for people to develop for the device.
Not having to scour XDA at large to figure out how to do something, and someone taking the time to explain how to do it here and provide links to track down more information is always helpful.
I know in searching XDA to learn how to do these things, it's been helpful for others to have been making summaries and guides on how to do them - sharing it here paves the way for others who come behind you and want to learn how to do what you're learning.
And if you aren't interested in posting guides on how to do the things you've learned, then just taking the time to answer questions people ask on the board about the device if you know the answer is a way to be helpful. The longer you hang out here, the more you learn, and the people coming behind you are curious too.
The longer you hang out here, too, you come to learn where information is and in what threads - you can direct newer people by answering questions with links to the relevant threads or posts since you already know what they are. It only takes a few minutes to track down the information if you have a good idea of where it is.
Because XDA is pretty much where we figure out a lot of the new stuff, the board grows randomly, and information gets scattered with pieces here and there in threads to solve problems and such. When people ask questions you can link to the scattered pieces and by doing so it helps index everything we are learning.
Basically, the desire to help is all that you need and these are some ways people can do so without in-depth technical knowledge. You're probably combing the boards learning things anyway, so when people have similar questions explaining what you know helps us all.
We all have different ways of learning, so sharing how you did can teach others new methods and ways of doing beyond just how to do the specific thing itself.
It sounds like you are as excited about all this as some of us are here, and with a device like the doubleshot in your hands I don't blame you.
Any questions just ask, as long as you aren't posting random questions in the dev sections it's all good.
Once again, welcome to the MT4GS forums, you'll have a blast with us here.
Edit:
Kernel stuff is in C flavor language, Android stuff itself is mostly Java, and if you don't have the program Notepad-plus-plus you should pick that up for making mostly all of your general coding edits on the computer with.
Thank you. I am excited. My first device that I toyed with was an htc leo 1024 (us), so I had an edasy entry into the world just because there are so many resources available for it. I will start by posting a couple of guides about things that I know were difficult to grasp/follow when I first started. Thank you very much for the directions and taking the time to post them and reply to me. Time to study...
Sent from my myTouch_4G_Slide using XDA App
That's fantastic.
This is my second Android device, first phone - the other one is a Nook Color.
Much like how you say having a lot of dev interest in the device you came from helped you (and man, does it ever) the advantage the Nook Color had was it's unbrickable. It boots from the MicroSD first, before internal memory, and you can run a self-contained copy of Android from the MicroSD card.
I got a chance to break it in so many different ways, (who needs a build.prop ... let's just delete that) and all I had to do was pop out the memory card and flash a fresh copy of CM7 onto it.
The internal memory is still the stock Barnes & Noble skinned operating system, hasn't been rooted or anything, yet I was still able to get the full-on Android experience in a safe play zone.
Coming to this phone, it's taught me ahead of time what I can and can't mess with before bad things start to happen, and it's a lot easier to play with this stuff if you know where the lines are. The ones you get in trouble if you cross.
It really wasn't until I got my hands on this device that I started to get into a lot of dev work on Android - but now i'm having an absolute blast with it and this device is pretty impressive.
I can't wait to read about what tricks you've picked up along the way, i'm always looking for an opportunity to be educated. Take some time and see what we've got laid out here, in some cases you may be able to add to existing threads instead of making new ones for duplicate topics.
The MT4GS is what, 6 months old now? We'll keep getting more people in here as they come to their upgrades or get warrantied up to this device. I'm eagerly awaiting more devs to end up in our corner of the forums, i'm curious to see what kind of cool things people can make the device do.
The more information we have organized and mapped out about the device and how to do things with it, the easier it gets for people who come behind because they don't have to re-invent the wheel just to get something done.
It's mind boggling to me how much i've learned in the past year here at XDA, especially in the last few months. It's all because people take the time to sit down and explain how they've done the things they've done and are excited to share their discoveries.
Having this device since before root was viable, i've watched this section of XDA grow from literally just a handful of threads into what it is now - pretty soon we'll have a majority of the resources right here for people to just show up and get work done with minimal fuss.
I know my dev time is hit or miss, sometimes I have days on end, other times not - one way i've been trying to help when i'm not around is leaving how-to's and guides behind me that people can reference while i'm gone.
There's still a whole lot that I haven't even gotten into yet, and i'm very appreciative of people taking the time to share some cool discovery or trick that's made their life a lot easier.
(sometimes I ramble a bit, especially when on boring conference calls)
I came to XDA to learn how to do some fun stuff with my Nook Color, and maybe learn how to write apps for the market. Here I am writing ROMs and nowhere close to putting any apps in the market. With the library of knowledge that XDA is everytime I sit down at the keyboard I learn something new, I wish i'd found this place a long long time before I did - it feels like home.
that's pretty cool about the nook color. i may have to pick one up to play with. i'm sure there are all kinds of neat things to be figured out (and easily implemented) with a device that boots from an external source before the internal.
i got pretty lucky with my hd2. as soon as i saw that there was a way to do it, i had to figure it out (of course). however, instead of reading all of the instructions and bulletins on correct procedure, like an intelligent person... you can probably guess where i'm going with that... and VIOLA! an expensive paperweight.
i was very lucky that phone is setup the way it is and for resources like you and some of the other devs and especially the others that learned by trial and error and took the time to post their experiences.
Coming from being an iPhone fanboy, I was well aware of the snooty attitudes that are rampant over there. Now that I have a taste of the Android side, I have learned a few things, some the hard way, and one thing I've noticed is how the attitudes are much the same. I have met some cool people with some great ideas and skills, and there are even a few that will answer questions. I get that some get annoyed at the asking of the same questions over and over. However, as a Dev, you should be expecting this. As Android takes more and more market share, new people are coming into this (like me) and trying to learn as much as we can. Some want simple answers, some want more complicated ones. I did a lot of the research myself, watching videos, Google searches, etc. But some people don't know how to, or just aren't computer literate.
XDA is a GREAT resource for information. But like other sites, sometimes you have to word your searches just right or you get nothing close to what you are trying to find out. Not the site's fault, it's just the way search engines are. So a hoard of people head into the threads, asking questions, and mostly getting good answers, But, as I have trolled through, I notice a lot of attitudes coming from devs, or friends of devs as they attack people because they didn't have 4 hours to troll though 500 pages in a thread, reading each and every post. Hoping their question was asked and answered before. If that makes you angry, maybe you should just make your ROMs and share them with a few friends and call it a day. From what I can see, most of the ROMs are pretty much the same in a lot of respects. I know the difference between TW ROMs and AOSP ROMs. I did the homework. I learned the hard way by soft bricking my phone, and I researched and got myself out of that jam thanks to the videos and postings of some nice people. There are a lot of people that don't have the PC skills or the time to do that. And even more that have no idea about message boards and how they work. BTW, the term "flaming" someone is as irritating to me as those people that ask the same questions over and over are to you. This is almost 2013. Terms like that are the exact reason I hate having to use message boards. Not everyone is as knowledgeable as you are. It doesn't mean they are dumb, they just don't want to learn, or they don't have the time.
I guess I'm trying to say, if you are going to put yourself out there by developing a ROM for free, and then complain because someone asks you a question or bugs you because you haven't updated it, maybe you should just all start charging for the ROMs. I will go back to stock myself, but I'm sure there are a few that will pay to have a few extras a little ahead of time. Then your base will shrink, allowing you to breathe easier knowing you are getting paid for your time. Maybe then, you will have to be a little nicer, more customer friendly. If you don't think you are getting the recognition you deserve, then don't do it. I know many would miss the customization, but they would quickly forget about it and find something else to do. And by the way, I have never had an issue like this. I'm strictly speaking from an observers point of view. Matter of fact, I may start doing some reviews, that will include not only the ROM itself, but the developers attitude when it comes to helping people through their issues. I think people should have the right to know if they are going to get help or not when choosing a ROM or other custom feature.
In closing, a lot of questions could be answered if some threads were created and "stickied" that explain the basic functions and directions dealing with flashing ROMs. It seems a lot of the "bugs" people experience are actually explainable because they had no clue what a clean flash vs dirty flashing was. Or that if you had Nova on one ROM, then flashed another ROM and Nova auto installed along with your other apps, that you would have to uninstall Nova to avoid problems. Or that CM kernels are not compatible with TW kernels and if the new ROM you are flashing doesn't install a new kernel, your new ROM may not be compatible with the one left behind form the old. Stuff like that. Sorry for the long post. Again, I have had no problems with anyone on here, dev or not, I just have seen a lot of this happening. And a lot of the attitudes are from dumb little things. You wanted to make ROMs, we all didn't force you to. And if you stop, others will take your place. I have seen that recently too, as soon as the new Nexus hit, a ton of devs left the SGS3 in the dust. But a few new guys showed up and have done a great job with their stuff. Congrats to them, I have found a good stable ROM because of this, and have received great support from this guy. He also regularly updates and interacts with the people taking the time to possibly brick their device to load his ROM. I hope more of those people show up in the future. Those are the people I will keep following and being patient with.
Most people usually help out, some don't. I just have a problem with developers thinking their **** don't stink as you'll learn if you venture out of this forum.
This thread is kinda out of line. Devs deliver us ROMs for free, who's to say what's expected and what's not? The only thing XDA requires devs to do is make their process or code open source, that's it. Devs aren't customer service reps, nor do they have to answer questions and play nice. They are doing us a favor by releasing the latest and the greatest bottom line. If your going to run a ROM, you should read the entire thread because there may be things you have to do, and if it weren't for people asking the same question over and over, threads would be half as long. If you dont have the time or the patience to do the research, you shouldn't be modding your device to begin with.
Sent from my SCH-I535 using Tapatalk 2
Elite49 said:
Most people usually help out, some don't. I just have a problem with developers thinking their **** don't stink as you'll learn if you venture out of this forum.
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Yes, that does seem to be an issue. I notice too that the Original Android Devs are a little more snooty than the TW devs. Just my observation.
Do you honestly blame them? If they are going to spend hours and hours of their time coding, learning, and releasing ROMs for you, for free, and on top of it have you spend 10 mins maybe searching for an answer and then bothering them? I honestly don't blame them.
I've spent hours breaking things just to figure out how they work. Flashing things over and over and over again.
I wouldn't want to do that for hours on end, to have someone spend 10 mins, give up, and cry to me for help, then get mad when I didn't hand them the answer.
Sent from my SCH-I535 using xda app-developers app
Shibby87 said:
This thread is kinda out of line. Devs deliver us ROMs for free, who's to say what's expected and what's not? The only thing XDA requires devs to do is make their process or code open source, that's it. Devs aren't customer service reps, nor do they have to answer questions and play nice. They are doing us a favor by releasing the latest and the greatest bottom line. If your going to run a ROM, you should read the entire thread because there may be things you have to do, and if it weren't for people asking the same question over and over, threads would be half as long. If you dont have the time or the patience to do the research, you shouldn't be modding your device to begin with.
Sent from my SCH-I535 using Tapatalk 2
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You're right, they do deliver them for free. But people are trusting them and risking bricking a very expensive device to try their ROM and push their ROMs on other people. They willingly put themselves out there. We all could buy and use phones without customizing them. I'm just saying they act a little too fancy sometimes. Not all of them. Just a few.
Why is this out of line? I posted this in the general section. If I would have posted it anywhere else you would have said it should be in the General forum. See, you made one of my points for me. And last time I checked, I can say whatever I want. If the forum wants to cut it, fine. I'll deal with it on my outlet. No big deal.
Not going to lie, I think Android fanboys are worse than Apple fanboys from what I've seen. I was on a YouTube channel where a woman was talking about how she got an iPhone after selling her Galaxy Nexus and the comments were, "Go kill yourself iwhore", "Traitor sheep", "iSlut", Dumb bimbo etc. The most I see on Mac rumors are "poorphone" or no apps, or cheap looking. Whereas here, if you say iPhone you'll have a ton of people start calling you a sheep. I don't know, I think its incredible how ignorant some people are. Some people just like other things.
Galaxy SIII/Soon to be Note 2 owner once it comes in ftw.
Oh as an edit. That Instagram thing was awful a few months back when Android got instagram. iOS users were saying, "Oh now we get to see what poor people do" Terrible. Simply terrible.
nosympathy said:
Do you honestly blame them? If they are going to spend hours and hours of their time coding, learning, and releasing ROMs for you, for free, and on top of it have you spend 10 mins maybe searching for an answer and then bothering them? I honestly don't blame them.
I've spent hours breaking things just to figure out how they work. Flashing things over and over and over again.
I wouldn't want to do that for hours on end, to have someone spend 10 mins, give up, and cry to me for help, then get mad when I didn't hand them the answer.
Sent from my SCH-I535 using xda app-developers app
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I doubt people are giving up in 10 minutes and running for the forums. Most people don't want to risk any of this to possibly ruin their expensive phones. The point is, they put themselves out there and make themselves available on the forums. If they don't want to deal with noobs (which every one of you was at one time or another) then throw up a ROM on some site and leave it. I'm not blaming anyone for anything. I figured out a lot on my own too. I have asked very few questions of anyone. But there are a lot of people that don't have the time or knowledge to find all this out on their own. If they are being asked the same question over and over, maybe put those answers in the OP to begin with. I have seen quite a few ROMs posted with very little info in the OPs. They aer banking on everyone knowing what they are doing right off the bat.
And lets really clear some things up. Some of these "Devs" aren't really developing anything. They have the time and/or patience and utilize the kitchen to strip down a stock rom. They throw in some mods that real devs made and slap their name on it. Then ask for donations like they just did something incredible. I've tried just about every modified stock rom on xda and there was really no difference. And God forbid someone has anything negative to say about a rom.
And in regards to the aosp devs, if they dont want to be asked questions or don't want their work criticized they shouldn't be making roms for the public. This forum is filled with smart asses that think everyone should know what they know. Everyone at one point had to ask someone else for help because how else do you learn.
Sent from my Galaxy S III
RCITNet said:
And lets really clear some things up. Some of these "Devs" aren't really developing anything. They have the time and/or patience and utilize the kitchen to strip down a stock rom. They throw in some mods that real devs made and slap their name on it. Then ask for donations like they just did something incredible. I've tried just about every modified stock rom on xda and there was really no difference. And God forbid someone has anything negative to say about a rom.
And in regards to the aosp devs, if they dont want to be asked questions or don't want their work criticized they shouldn't be making roms for the public. This forum is filled with smart asses that think everyone should know what they know. Everyone at one point had to ask someone else for help because how else do you learn.
Sent from my Galaxy S III
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This. This is the cancer invading xda lately. Ungrateful ****s...
my tapatalk signature sucks more than yours.
RCITNet said:
And lets really clear some things up. Some of these "Devs" aren't really developing anything. They have the time and/or patience and utilize the kitchen to strip down a stock rom. They throw in some mods that real devs made and slap their name on it. Then ask for donations like they just did something incredible. I've tried just about every modified stock rom on xda and there was really no difference. And God forbid someone has anything negative to say about a rom.
And in regards to the aosp devs, if they dont want to be asked questions or don't want their work criticized they shouldn't be making roms for the public. This forum is filled with smart asses that think everyone should know what they know. Everyone at one point had to ask someone else for help because how else do you learn.
Sent from my Galaxy S III
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That is why they are guides and info posted in op if bugs and such?
I sure did not post here when I was rooting oh I need some help with adb fastboot Odin what's the problem there are plenty of guides that cover everything
People just tend to give up so easily; that's how lazy the generation has become. Those guides posted helped me out and such. I didn't ask someone else for helped I did this on my own with a guide up on here now I know more than just rudimentary things of the android world I help people out but still gets annoying when you have 5 if the same threads I mean if I could find them why can't they? It's really not that hard.
Sent from my SCH-I535 using xda app-developers app[/QUOTE]
Sent from my SCH-I535 using xda app-developers app
This thread is getting heated I see a monitor locking it soon
Sent using xda premium
As someone buying a G1 and not even knowing what rooting was, I have no sympathy for the winers. I soft bricked, got almost no sleep reading up on recovering it, and I never once posted a question. Now I'm flashing/recovering/restoring any device I want.
The devs spend countless hours working on making roms and apps for us, the least you could do is research (hours if necessary) before asking the same questions that have been answered previously. If you can't handle common sense tasks then a) don't root or flash b) stay with your iPhone
Not trying to rip anyone, but this is a pointless thread Imo.
Sent from the Matrix
dnar56 said:
As someone buying a G1 and not even knowing what rooting was, I have no sympathy for the winers. I soft bricked, got almost no sleep reading up on recovering it, and I never once posted a question. Now I'm flashing/recovering/restoring any device I want.
The devs spend countless hours working on making roms and apps for us, the least you could do is research (hours if necessary) before asking the same questions that have been answered previously. If you can't handle common sense tasks then a) don't root or flash b) stay with your iPhone
Not trying to rip anyone, but this is a pointless thread Imo.
Sent from the Matrix
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Endorsed.
Replace G1 with D1 and that's my story. I googled. I bricked. I bricked a lot. And I read. End of story.
You make it seem like phone tinkering and flashing are a right, a service if you will. It's not. This is a site for phone geeks to share their work. You should be grateful it's not a paid service. Why fix something that's not broken? If you don't like the way it is, you have plenty of options out there. You are complaining about forums in general - it's not limited to xda.
For the record, your post was pretty good until the last paragraph. Didn't agree with that one, however - that's Ok. Your opinion. Just like this is mine...
Sent from my SCH-I535 using Tapatalk 2
I do have to add though that out of like the 15 touchwiz stock ROMs out there, most of them are the same. And personally I think dev's should accept and take in whatever criticism they get for their ROM. As constructive criticism, so they can make their ROM better.
If they have no desire to make it better, then they should outright say their will only be one release. If they feel someone is being disrespectful, they should be the better person and tell them politely to not be so disrespectful. Just my opinion, and yes I am grateful for all the devs do here.
Sent from my SCH-I535 using xda app-developers app
NightxFall said:
I do have to add though that out of like the 15 touchwiz stock ROMs out there, most of them are the same. And personally I think dev's should accept and take in whatever criticism they get for their ROM. As constructive criticism, so they can make their ROM better.
Sent from my SCH-I535 using xda app-developers app
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Constructive criticism is fine. What's annoying (even from a non-dev perspective) is the same question getting asked over and over again. Sometimes a dead horse is kicked up for 4-5 pages. Then once it finally dies down, some dude asks the same question. It's silly and unnecessary. If they Google their question followed by ", xda" they would have found the original answer.
Sent from my SCH-I535 using Tapatalk 2
First, I have no problems with XDA. That wasn;t the intention. XDA provides a great service to people who want to customize their phone AND devs that want to put their work out there.
Second, if you feel like this thread is useless, why are you spending the time to respond?
Third, the statement I made wasn't a slam on anyone. I am well aware of people that are too lazy to search things out for themselves. The point I was making, is we need each other. If we refuse to tinker with our phones, the devs are essentially doing this for themselves and a few friends that want to join in. If they aren't creating ROMs, we don't have a way to customize our phones. However, we can get along without each other too. I know if the ROMs weren't there, I would still enjoy the use of my smartphone. If we weren't downloading, devs would still tinker with building ROMs. The whole issue is how we treat each other on ANY forum. If you are getting asked the same questions over and over, maybe a the first post should be updated with those Q&A's. I have seen very few OPs do that. In fact, a majority of the AOSP threads have nothing at all posted regarding issues or potential problems. They just expect everyone to know everything. Everybody learned from somebody else. Whether it was through Google search, this forum or YouTube videos. MOST of the people complaining about the same questions being asked have very little info on their thread.
Again, props to those devs that don't mind helping people out. And props to XDA for providing the forum. The rest should put up pay sites maybe, but their ROM downloads would quickly fall. I have enjoyed my experience thus far tinkering around with something new. But the few in the community that whine about people asking questions should settle down and realize how you act. That goes for the "customer" that can't ask nicely too. I'm not anti-dev. I get what they do is tough and time consuming.
Real_JESRadio said:
First, I have no problems with XDA. That wasn;t the intention. XDA provides a great service to people who want to customize their phone AND devs that want to put their work out there.
Second, if you feel like this thread is useless, why are you spending the time to respond?
Third, the statement I made wasn't a slam on anyone. I am well aware of people that are too lazy to search things out for themselves. The point I was making, is we need each other. If we refuse to tinker with our phones, the devs are essentially doing this for themselves and a few friends that want to join in. If they aren't creating ROMs, we don't have a way to customize our phones. However, we can get along without each other too. I know if the ROMs weren't there, I would still enjoy the use of my smartphone. If we weren't downloading, devs would still tinker with building ROMs. The whole issue is how we treat each other on ANY forum. If you are getting asked the same questions over and over, maybe a the first post should be updated with those Q&A's. I have seen very few OPs do that. In fact, a majority of the AOSP threads have nothing at all posted regarding issues or potential problems. They just expect everyone to know everything. Everybody learned from somebody else. Whether it was through Google search, this forum or YouTube videos. MOST of the people complaining about the same questions being asked have very little info on their thread.
Again, props to those devs that don't mind helping people out. And props to XDA for providing the forum. The rest should put up pay sites maybe, but their ROM downloads would quickly fall. I have enjoyed my experience thus far tinkering around with something new. But the few in the community that whine about people asking questions should settle down and realize how you act. That goes for the "customer" that can't ask nicely too. I'm not anti-dev. I get what they do is tough and time consuming.
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We spend time to respond to actually have you realize no one is gna be here all the time for you some things you have to be done by themselves, I'm 16 I wonder when you'll realize that. No one is gna be up your ass changing your clothes for you either learn the hard way or just not at all.
I have seen multiple threads of people complaining that their data is gone on cm10.1 and not one has bothered to even look at the op's post clearly showing the way to fix it. They just want the easy way out to ask and have someone redirect them there and I have but it gets tiring doing it over and over and over again.
Sent from my SCH-I535 using xda app-developers app
Despite me being new to XDA I am not new to the process of rooting android phones. I have been rooting other people's phones before I bought the Galaxy S 3. I don't ask questions in forums I research my own answers to my questions. I noticed the same things as the person who started this thread I just don't see the point in bringing it up as it will continue to happen.
Unlike all the badass geniuses in here I have asked questions since I got my first smartphone less than a month ago.
I think it's pretty stupid how people think they're so cool because they figured out how to root, there are so many details in rooting/flashing ROMs and kernels and these high end smart phones are very expensive especially now because of the **** economy, people just don't want to brick they're phones they invested so much in.
People aren't supposed to know all the bugs in a new ROM they flashed and you guys are giving this "issue" too much priority.
Sent from my SCH-I535 using xda app-developers app
I've been an XDA user for a few years now, and for the most part I have found it to be a great source of help and information across a wide range of devices and platforms... up until recently.
I have always had a strong interest in mobile phones/devices. And when I got my first smart phone in 2008 my interest was piqued further. I am not a developer, and I don’t intend on becoming one. I am a user. I love customization, apps, games and everything about smart phones (started on Winows Mobile, and I now use Android).
The way I understand it… XDA was started as a developer’s site/forum… for developers. Over the years it began to evolve into a non-exclusive community. Anyone could ask for help on any range of smart phone topics – which I thought was great.
Lately it seems that XDA has been trying to get back to their roots… that is to say, they are trying to make the forums more developer exclusive. I can only say that is a bad thing from a selfish stand point. Of course if I were a developer I might take issue with my forums being flooded with non-developer related (and therefore… irrelevant) threads and posts. I am in no position to criticize the site managers about what type of site they wish to run and how they want to run it. But XDA is becoming useless to me. It is becoming increasingly difficult to find help on non-development related topics.
So… Can someone please recommend another (more user-orientated) site? I like to ask questions on a range of topics; some device specific, some about how to use apps, some game hints, some general android queries, app recommendations, etc. Is there a better forum for a user like me?
Thanks for any help.
I used to frequent http://www.teambamf.net/ when I had my HTC Thunderbolt, Yea, it was my first smart phone.
They do a lot with Samsung phones, you might want to take a look and see what they have to offer.
CharlesTheMan is willing to help anyone who asks, they're good guys.
If you can't find what you want there, just ask, they can tell you what you need to do and recommend where to go if they can't answer your questions.
It always pays to search for different alternatives, I work in an IT department as a programmer, systems network analyst and a webmaster.
Don't always use the same search engine, change up, use Bing or Dogpile or many others to find what you need.
I can spend hours researching for what I need, there is so much out there now you just need to learn "Where To Look", per say.
Good luck and remember, if you don't find what you are looking for, look somewhere else!!
G.
Hi G,
Thanks for taking the time to reply. I almost always do a pretty extensive google search before coming hear to post. I rarely use bing or anyother search engine before coming here to ask... will certainly give it a go.
Thanks again.
I don't think there's another forum as great as XDA
but if you could be more specific or if you like MIUI rom, you can find everything about it here miuiandroid[dot]com
retslagoon said:
I don't think there's another forum as great as XDA
but if you could be more specific or if you like MIUI rom, you can find everything about it here miuiandroid[dot]com
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hi retslagoon,
I do not have any particular question at this time. But thanks for your reply.
One issue I have with 'being specific' (and I think I might find this hard to explain) is that I can spend quite a bit of time typing out a questing/post (and trying to be clear and specific), while wording correctly; only to have it be ignored - for whatever reason. So the entire exercise ends up being a waste of time.
I do not know why so many simple questions get ignored on these forums, there could be a range of reasons (either because people don't know the answers to them, or because people don't bother to read them; I also wonder if it is due to the fact that some of these unanswered questions are not at all development related and therefor are intentionally ignored to teach the poster a lesson about posting on a development forum).
Eitherway, XDA is not satisfying my search for help/advice and information.
Thanks again.
[email protected] said:
hi retslagoon,
I do not have any particular question at this time. But thanks for your reply.
One issue I have with 'being specific' (and I think I might find this hard to explain) is that I can spend quite a bit of time typing out a questing/post (and trying to be clear and specific), while wording correctly; only to have it be ignored - for whatever reason. So the entire exercise ends up being a waste of time.
I do not know why so many simple questions get ignored on these forums, there could be a range of reasons (either because people don't know the answers to them, or because people don't bother to read them; I also wonder if it is due to the fact that some of these unanswered questions are not at all development related and therefor are intentionally ignored to teach the poster a lesson about posting on a development forum).
Eitherway, XDA is not satisfying my search for help/advice and information.
Thanks again.
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My experience is that often threads are unnecessarily started: A quick Google-search before in most cases would have given the answer(s) requested. At least if the issue(s) is/are device independent. So you must not wonder a post istn't replied.