Database Info

Touch: HD ~ $180, Pro ~ $120, Diamond ~ $108

*Mods please feel more than free to move this where you think might be more appropriate. I just wanted to make sure everyone at least had a chance to look at it and know about it, and knew that mostly only people who already had Diamonds would be in the Diamond forum.
*There is a link in my sig a post over at ppcgeeks. I will be keeping that one updated and current much more often. This is kind of just a general thing to look at, but that is where I will be keeping things updated and such simply because thats where I posted it first.*
PLEASE REFER TO THE POST OVER AT PPCGEEKS INSTEAD OF THIS ONE (link in my sig). IT IS MUCH MORE UP TO DATE AND WILL CONTINUE TO BE AS SUCH. Feel free to post here if you perhaps dont have a membership at ppcgeeks (tho I would highly recommend becoming a member there if you are not). I am just leaving this one here for kicks.
"Ok, so this is my little post about how I am able to get phones for real cheap. It is not a lame scam or anything stupid like that. I hope that you can look at my name, how many times I have been thanked and where, and my little green reputation squares etc, and perhaps the posts that I have made in order to trust this a little better for your benefit. Vogue users should find this easier as they know a little more about me.
The moral of the story is:
I have discovered a really interesting way of obtaining phones and other like things (and I think this MAY be how a lot of people on eBay always have them so cheap, but I don't really know).
The prices I have quoted in the title are rough estimates. The cost could swing either way probably about $69. Hopefully, my prediction that these prices are a little on the high side is correct.
As time goes on, these (like anything else) will become cheaper. This also applies (I think, still researching) to my deal here. So if the Diamond soon drops $100 in price, it will also do so accordingly here (again, this concept I am still researching but should know for sure within a few days).
I am currently not sure how to handle all requests and..."orders" I guess you would put it. I don't think the forum system is really going to be that efficient, neither the PM system. Let me know if you have any suggestions.
Real problem: you are all going to think "this is too good to be true". And very understandably. I'm not sure how to get you folks to take a rational logical approach to this and think it through rather than shying away with the "if it sounds too good to be true, it probably is", which, undoutbedly, some of you already have done :S. If I throw all the details at you right now, I really don't think youre going to believe it. I am trying to write this right now so that I would read on and be curious at the very least if it were me. And I am also aware that if I threw all the details out here, I would also not believe it myself.
The concept is affiliate marketing and referrals. If anyone reads this and knows what I am talking about, plz vouch for me or something. The odds are little to none of the people reading this will, but I figured it couldn't hurt to put down.
I know 100% that I can get ahold of all European (GSM) versions of each of these phones (which could of course unlocking them would be the idea), and I can start doing that now. Obviously I will not be getting ahold of a US CDMA HD soon as it will probably be a very long time till its made that way if ever (
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).
The CDMA US Diamond, on the other hand, I believe that I can get probably within a few weeks.
The CDMA US Pro, probably about two months (judging from the 10/19 release date, if it turns out to be 11/2 it will be accordingly later).
I MAY be able to get the CDMA US Diamond and Pro now just as with the GSM versions, but that is another issue that I am still currently researching. I will update this post accordingly with new information (hopefully I should know this specific piece within a few days).
I'm really not too sure what else to say. Please no flaming, I'm not trying to scam anybody or anything and yes it is for real. If you are going to be close/narrow minded and get pissed that I am claiming this and not even consider it, please do not post and move on over this thread as if you had never read it
If you think there might be a chance of truth here, shoot me a PM as that is the way that I will currently be handling this until I figure out a better system. Email will work more than fine as well, in fact that may be even better.
I know that this here will scare some people away, but it is part of the deal so I guess I had better just say it: To do this will cost you somewhere in between $5-$6, depending on tax. At 6.35%, that is about $5.31. This is not a cost I am charging and will receive, though the ~ $5.50 (lets say $5.50 to be pessimistic) may be able to be negotiated down.
If you have never heard of Netflix, or Blockbuster Online, please research them before contacting me or posting here.
Oh! Jeez I guess I had better add that this is not illegal.
Also, this can be done in Canada, the US, or the UK.
I was more than skeptical about this at first too, but am now a believer.
You are not buying the phones from me, so don't mistake me trying to give back to the community more as a chance to scam you all; I am not the one making the $$ here.
Ok so now I really can't think of anything else that needs to be said. Here goes posting this beast for the first time (probably gonna end up beating my flashing how to for vogue op in length!), hopefully no one goes getting crazy.
As I said previously, I'll update as I go (I'm sure I'll think of something in 10 min lol).
It is real, k? Its not free, its not a scam, and you are required to do a little bit of work. I will say that it is easy, and it does work.
lemme know,
Jim."

i sent you an pm...

hmmm very interesting!

jim256 said:
$5-$6, depending on tax. At 6.35%, that is about $5.31. This is not a cost I am charging and will receive, though the ~ $5.50 (lets say $5.50 to be pessimistic) may be able to be negotiated down.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
That is interesting. Not to be a retard or anything, but where does this money go? So if I read the whole article right, you're charging $5.50 to us so we can get the method of how to get these phones for cheap right?

PM You. lets see how fast things are gonna move.

Kraize92 said:
That is interesting. Not to be a retard or anything, but where does this money go? So if I read the whole article right, you're charging $5.50 to us so we can get the method of how to get these phones for cheap right?
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Click to collapse
No, sorry if i wasnt clear enough. Please refer to the post over at ppcgeeks as it is more up to date and such. But the ~$5.50 does NOT go to me. It is (obviously) pretty complex. But I am not the recipient of the $5.50 (as you will see). (altho that would be nice )

Black93300ZX said:
...so instead of doing that we're supposed to blindly invest in something because we trust him?...
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Click to collapse
lol NO. it surprises me that even here on xda and ppcgeeks how few ppl can actually read. you DO NOT PAY ME. YOU NEVER WILL. get it everyone? lol...jeez. answering questions is fine, but answering the same one 100x/day is a little lame.
Black93300ZX said:
...when the first successful purchase comes through I'm game, but until then I need details.
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Click to collapse
i like that, thats the attitude. just be patient, and then after a few people have vouched for it, contact me and lemme know!

I'm in. Sent you an email.

pyramid or "ponzi" scheme
If anything that has happened in the US has showed if it sounds too good to be true it probably isnt

Yea def man, I need to see a video. With actors that say they are not actors. Also these actors must say "this product works" "Im Giussepe Franco I dont own the company! I don't own anything about it!"

see.. i dunno, this sounds like some **** like AMWAY or a Pyramind scheme like the other member said.
$180 for a phone that is retailed at $900+ at the moment..
i dunno meng..and yea im a member over at ppcgeeks and the members over there are calling shannigans as well..
i need proof and substantial proof at that!

It's called MLM (multi-level marketing)... slightly different than a pyramid scheme but most people get screwed all the same. Put it this way... the first several people who paid the $5 (not the first people here at XDA, the first people who got on board with this particular program) will probably end up getting a phone for that price. Most will not.
Sorry Jim, you seem like a decent guy, and I hate to see YOU get screwed too. MLM is older than the day is long, and each "program" fizzles out long before MOST of the contributors get the product that they contributed for.
Stay away from this guys. You too Jim.

Black93300ZX said:
I'm not saying we pay you, but we have to pay SOMEONE, and that's what I don't trust... Money leaving my possession without full details on where and why it's going there.
I'm a full out skeptic, but I'm not about to accuse you of running a scam until I hear bad things about it, so as I said, once a reputable member (not a user with 3 posts) posts on here that they got their Touch HD for $200, I'll be on that right away. I hope for everyone's sake this is true, as it'd turn out to be great... And if it is, thank you in advance for helping us.
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Click to collapse
alrighty, now that is a much better approach. just to get this out there (and I suppose I had better update the OP on ppcgeeks as well), you dont ever pay out any money before you know whats going on. its not like you pay 6 then figure out what the heck is going on

4. be sure to become familiar with netflix and blockbuster [online].
Bah, hoops!

jim256 said:
If you have never heard of Netflix, or Blockbuster Online, please research them before contacting me or posting here.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Why must we know that? How about you PM me with the details. I'd love to read the few very long posts.

I had a email from a very nice lady in Nigeria whose poor husband had been killed, he was a general in the army and very rich and all I had to do was give her my bank details so she could deposit his $10,000,000 into my account so she could gain access to it. All I had to do was let her have my secret password
and send her some money and for my help I got 10% for doing it.
Really its true, my balance has gone to zero but she said this is normal and my $1,000,000 should be in my account any day now.
So i dont need to join this scheme as I have plenty of money to by a Touch HD at full price but I am sure it will work just as well as my Nigerian deal has

[THEFT] Stealing Applications from the android market

There is a person in my area who advertises that he will root a phone and show people how they can use their newly rooted device to get the paid applications from the android market for free.
One of his advertisements HERE
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I sent a couple emails and asked exactly what he was doing.
He told me he is installing Titanium Backup on rooted phones and instructing people
to purchase an applications > backup the application using Titanium Backup > then refund the purchase.
I am aware that this does not work for all applications, but am appalled that this kind of thing not only seems OK for some, and they are profiting from stealing applications from the developers who are making them.
If there is something that can be done to stop people like this i would surely like to help
I also highly recommend that when building an application, a Developer check market license every time the app is started. This does make devices that are WiFi only hinder a bit, but crooks like this are ruining our android experience.
feel free to report him to the BSA
BSA reporting

They won't get asp updates, and you can only refund an asp once...
I'd not go so far as to suggest a licence check on every single launch, legitimate users will hate you and go elsewhere or get a cracked version...
Making legitimate irritating is why people currently pirate music so much... Same with game drm and no-cd patches... Steam addressed that for the pc though
But for this case, he's acting immorally and probably illegally...

Well that's a terrible ad . He stated:
I have worked with hundreds of phones and I have damaged any of them
Click to expand...
Click to collapse

"Use Wifi Hotspot for free"
uh, wat? One can already use unlocked wifi without rooting...
Does he think people are stupid, or am I misunderstanding something?
yay, first post!

Without titanium also can steal paid app from market...no need that
|Post from XDA premium app
|BroodRom RC2
|Instanet Free Access (no one believe its free)

This an unfortunate side effect of all the abilities our developers have given us. It's sad to see people taking advantage of the open market of android, and using it for personal gain, but he also has to leave a lot of info out of the process for his "customers" to have the wool draped over their eyes.
Hopefully people will be able to sniff this out as to-good-to-be-true, and not let this guy make money off of products he doesn't own.
People really need to learn ethics these days...
Posted from my CM7'd Fascinate. Please ignore any spelling errors.

Someone should report him to his domain holder so he can be prosecuted. What he's doing is violating all wireless companies TOS and Google's TOS for the market and intellectual property.
Sent from my SkyRaider Bolt using Tapatalk

I hate this guy. I just don't understand people who are just stealing apps and thinks that it will have no consequences. Today, every phone and app have internet access and developers are able to find out how many their apps were stolen and how many were purchased. So then, if everybody will be just stealing apps, they will stop development and we will have no apps and games and it will kill Android like it did to Windows mobile (there on the other hand was easier to download cracked apps then to buy it).

This dude is unbelivable, as are the customers who do business with hm. I really hope that this is microscopic part of consumers. It really wrong and dumb to steal something costing 1 or 10 euros or usd and takng a risk that it does not work at all. Do peopole actually count any value for their time and effort? Taking one hour or so to mess up your phone and steal what, 5 euros from devs who have written Better guides online with video tutorials, then many network operators ever boder... this is low.
Report him asap.
Sent from my Dell Streak using xda premium

He is not doing anything illegal. He is just showing you how to steal apps. Now it is down to you to steal or not to steal.

Calyxim is right, although he is participating in the crime kinda.

He may not be doing the illegal acts but he is aiding people who are willing to steal them. Which technically makes him an accomplice to theft, therefore making it illegal.
Sent from my SkyRaider Bolt using Tapatalk

I have worked with hundreds of phones and I have damaged any of them.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I also found that funny. Outside of the obvious legal and moral implications of stealing, I find it more than annoying that he is providing a service that should never be done for profit, but rather out of interest and love for hacking in whatever form one is able. Call me an elitist, but I think that I you are not able to root your phone and or don't have the drive to ask someone for help like about a million people on this forum, then you have no business rooting. Getting a rooted device without so much as a basic understanding for the process is the equivalent of script kiddying in my estimation.

Ugh!! I hate people who male up businesses in hacking!! Especially iPhone ones!! When I tell people I root androids, I dumb it down and say I hack them, and they always say, " so does that mean I can download free apps" ahhhhhhh
Sent from my HTC_Amaze_4G using xda premium

Android has this problem due to other software and methods already it is something that cant be stopped in todays world the way i see it :/
Sent from my Blade using xda premium

dude found the way to make easy money

Not to mention making money off if the work of others here. It has not gone unnoticed for sure.

call da police!

I don't get it. I'm pretty new to Android, but most of these apps cost less than a dollar. Really? You'd steal a dollar? Not that I'd steal anything.

I agree it is theft but at the exact same time my view is on this is the guy is wrong for charging for a service like this. Personally I think it is pointless to get worked up over theft of a mobile application like tons of people crack software for computers it happens. But has anyone ever considered Android's kernel? It is Linux which means it relates to the Free Software philosophy which gets me why charge for apps why make a profit I personally believe in coding for learning,fun, collaboration and the benefit for others. But if someone wants to make a profit then sure go ahead. But you know people are just going to pirate it so how much of a profit will you truly make off a app? But to go as far as charging someone for that kind of service is even lower.

Extremely disappointed with the android community

I just need to vent. I'm a fairly active developer for the android platform. I've created a number of kernel patches and applications that I have released at no charge to the community for about 10 or so devices.
All this I do in my "spare time", which I have very little of because I am a full time professional student who takes on 32 credit hour semesters.
Recently, since my 1994 geo prizm is literally falling apart and I was hoping to scrounge together a little bit of money to get a new car so I don't end up stranded on my way to class, I decided to release a paid application. Fastcharge / Force AC toggle which allows you to toggle on and off the force AC feature. A feature which I have personally implemented and released source patches for on a number of devices.
Not only in every thread where I released the patch on a device did I write up how to toggle the feature through the command line, but I also stated that I also implemented a toggle into my completely free application that you can also download from the market, IncrediControl.
In good faith and knowing how annoying licensing is, I elected to not include licensing in my application. This is a huge regret.
Within a couple days of releasing the application to the market I googled it to see if anyone was talking about it. One of the first links was to a piracy site where a user was requesting the widget, to which another user obliged and posted the apk to a filesharing site. Doing something I never though I would have to do, I filed a DMCA takedown request, which was answered quickly and the app was taken down. Monitoring the thread, every single time a link gets taken down, another user requests the app and the original user reuploads it, most recently to 11 different sites.
So now, after filing dozens of takedown requests. This user has decided to unzip my apk, change out the artwork, and now is going around releasing it as his own work.
Really, all this to avoid paying $1.50 (only ~$1 of it actually going to me) to an individual whose yearly income is low enough that he doesn't have to file taxes?
This disgusts me.
This is even worse than the 50% "order cancellation rate" that the widget has. I'm not stupid, I know exactly what users are doing, but yet initially I was willing to ignore it. But this has gone too far.
What is even the point of pissing off a developer so much that he is considering saying screw the platform all together? It doesn't even make sense. We, the developers improve your devices, generally at little or no cost, and this is how we're repaid. With ~50% of current users of the application having pirated it. To avoid paying just over $1.
Now before someone even counters with the "my area doesn't support paid applications" argument I've actually gladly GIVEN the widget away to a number of users who casually mentioned in the release threads that they couldn't download it for this reason. Not to mention, everyone knows there are apps that unlock the market in these areas to be able to purchase apps.
How much more generous can a developer be than to provide source code patches for a feature, provide information on how to toggle the feature, provide a COMPLETELY FREE way to toggle the feature, and then charge a measly $1.50 for a secondary, slightly more convenient way to toggle.
Yet he's repaid like this .

Of course, this must suck for a developer like you. Unfortunately, it seems to happen more and more often, and all I can really say is:
I would gladly pay a few bucks for an application like IC or BootManager. That BootManager seemed really interesting, but we can't buy apps from the Play Store without CC (and as a 16-year old, I don't have one). I asked the developer if he accepted Paypal, but he didn't.
Don't get me wrong, and this is not an attack to you personally: developers, if you made something really nice, and people will like it, 70% of the people will gladly pay for it, just make sure you allow them to.

Chaosz-X said:
70% of the people will gladly pay for it, just make sure you allow them to.
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Click to collapse
I honestly thought this was the case. It's really not. The problem is much worse than that. If 70% of users in the root community paid for apps it would be astonishing. Its made pretty clear by the number of users who download the app, back it up and then cancel the order.
If a 16 year old kid had made me that offer, the e-mail reply I sent would have the apk attached.

Well, that is a real flaw of Android: tweakability is really impressing, but these things make it really difficult to earn some money as a developer.
We have been thinking about anti-piracy measures as well, with stuff such as authentication with a server, and locking down the code and verifying integrity of APKs and stuff to make sure it's really hard to mess with the code, but it's just sad that there's a need for these measures..

The trouble is everything has piracy right from movies to game consoles through to mobiles and music.
I mean the iPhones appstore would be a hell of a lot bigger if there was no jailbreaking and installous.
Every platform has been cracked so you'll get it regardless of what you develop for.
Sent from my HTC Desire using XDA

I think you know you just needed to vent but can I change your picture.
There are some people in this world who just don't buy the idea of an idea as property. That's not compatible with this business model. That's the first problem.
The next problem is that
there's a million and one apps out there and which one are we going to choose? Where does it start, where does it end? We all have our limits. What's yours?
For me, the app has to be something very unique and possible generate me cash. For example something I use every day at work. If it's something that the phone should do anyway I tend to skip it and save the $1 for the next phone that does it out of the box. Your app is a great thing, but there's many utility apps out there. It just doesn't fall into the kind of thing I'd cave my strict budgeting for. There are people here with a 1000 apps installed and you expect them to pay $1000 in this sense.
Another way would be having utility in the cloud and then the app is free. Another one of course, advertising.
The difference with both of these is we don't need to risk a credit card with the market. That's the main reason I personally haven't bought many apps and I'd imagine it's a problem for minors too.
The very community that allowed us to create the app fails to pay for it's products is like life itself.
I'd say make something for the iphone instead because there's more profit there but that would never have been possible, see what I'm saying? That's the 3rd problem.
So you've got 3 problems there all converging into one big push towards piracy. But remember, can your app assure security that the pirated version cannot for example? This is how one has to think.
In short,
you can't do something and hope to make a bit from it on the side. You got to go out from the start and get the money aspect central from the start. I mean, that's business and of course that's exactly what the android community works hard to free us from.
Still, summarising those 3 points for suggestion:
- offer something free things can't (i.e. security, brand etc) For example, I never run pirated stuff for fear of insecurity on my data whereas I'll try out software that way on an old PC
- can always put a service in the cloud aka the javascript trap
- iphone is there if you want...
- needs to "the one app" a certain person would pay for, not something everyone likes
Also just to make that point again, if one does not believe in property then inconveniently there is no moral crime here. I suggest learn to live with this and go with the flow

I hope google sells PlayStore cards (like itunes cards) that allows user to buy apps, music, movies, books without a credit card. I really want to buy some amazing apps but i dont have a credit card so i just use free apps. I think that if u cant buy an app that cant be a reason to piracy or sidedownload that app.

jago25_98 said:
For me, the app has to be something very unique and possible generate me cash. For example something I use every day at work. If it's something that the phone should do anyway I tend to skip it and save the $1 for the next phone that does it out of the box. Your app is a great thing, but there's many utility apps out there. It just doesn't fall into the kind of thing I'd cave my strict budgeting for. There are people here with a 1000 apps installed and you expect them to pay $1000 in this sense.
Another way would be having utility in the cloud and then the app is free. Another one of course, advertising.
The difference with both of these is we don't need to risk a credit card with the market. That's the main reason I personally haven't bought many apps and I'd imagine it's a problem for minors too.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The feature is 100% unique and so is the widget. Not to mention, if you didn't want to pay the $1, I provided a free way to toggle the feature in the utility app. The point is, that there is nothing forcing people to pay for the widget to use the feature. But instead of using the free option provided, they not only pirate the paid app, but edit the artwork and release it for free as their own. It defies logic.
Also, ad based apps don't work with the rooted community. I learned that early on. Myfree utility app is ad supported. With over 40,000 installs you would think it would make even a dollar a day. Nope, makes nearly nothing. That's when I realized that the same niche I was marketing to are the same people who block ads. Even if someone didn't want to block ads, they can't install a single ROM that doesn't include an ad blocking hosts file out of the box.

chad0989 said:
[...] How much more generous can a developer be than to provide source code patches for a feature, provide information on how to toggle the feature, provide a COMPLETELY FREE way to toggle the feature, and then charge a measly $1.50 for a secondary, slightly more convenient way to toggle.
Yet he's repaid like this .
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Click to collapse
Be sure you're looking at all sides. Yes, you're in a losing war with guys intent on pirating your app. You can't stop them, and well, you goofed on the licensing, so someone will no doubt release the clone.
First of all, don't do the Big Media thing and assume that everybody that pirates your app would have paid for it if it hadn't been available. A lot of folks collect, or just try something once. You'll only work yourself into a funk thinking about all that money you "would" have if only they hadn't been able to pirate it. They wouldn't have. At least not all of them.
More importantly, be aware that placing something out there with value does reach folks that otherwise would have no idea of you or your plight. More than once, I've purchased an app that I don't really need, but found clever and cheap enough I can buy it without thinking about the investment. I've spent more on Android software at $1-15 over the last year than I did over the last 25+ at $30-100 a pop. I've only refunded an app once, by accident.
Finally, be up front about your situation. A guy trying to make do does influence my impulse buying. So does his reputation. If you're doing a lot, be sure that's clear on your app page, and let us know clearly you're the guy that also brought us whatever.
I am curious, though: How much did you actually bring in?

Chad- thanks for telling your story, I agree that you have every right to be disappointed. Especially the buying and refunding, that to me send almost worse because you can't stop dedicated pirating, but I would have hoped the rest would have bought the app.
It's easy to forget the human side of development, so thanks for sharing your side.

Jesus christ Chad. This is f$%&*#@ ridiculous. Probably the best and most generous kernel dev I have ever come into contact with, and people are cheating you out of 1.50. Please don't abandon Android. I need kernels when I get my rezound! but in all seriousness, warez needs to stop.
Sent from my ADR6400L

Yep. Sucks. After getting serious about android , which wasn't too far in, joining with a nexus one and seeing all the free HARD work we get, I definitely try buying stuff I use. If I can't pay sometimes I will see if dev does something else I can donate to. Its an issue I've thought about and part of it really boils down to how sorry people are in general. They want free and cheap. $1 is laughable even when it can be easily had for free. You really should market yourself a bit even though you don't want to. And people should really put a complimentary $5 or so budget a month or more and try to support devs. Maybe if you have something he gave free but has an app you won't use for a buck, buy the dollar app and uninstall after the 15 minute period. Or throw him a 5 through PayPal or something. Its simple really. If these devs don't have to resort to ramen and water they keep dev'ing especially for the community supporting him or her. And if they're eating vegetables and have plenty of red bull money it gives them wings. Otoh, the devs that make us pay to reinstall an app after we bought it on another or lost our phone suck. Balls. Won't buys theirs anymore.
teach a man to fish, you feed him for life. teach a man to fastboot, and you create competency. and less threads on xda.

Maybe you should implement a system like some developers do where you download the app for free with a time limited trail, then they would go to another website to pay for the app to unlock it, and the unlock codes would be unique for every user which would minimize piracy.
Sent from my GT-N7000 Samsung Galaxy Note "Go big or go home" using XDA app

rafa6571 said:
I hope google sells PlayStore cards (like itunes cards) that allows user to buy apps, music, movies, books without a credit card. I really want to buy some amazing apps but i dont have a credit card so i just use free apps. I think that if u cant buy an app that cant be a reason to piracy or sidedownload that app.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
In the Netherlands we have prepaid Visa card.
Works well.
Maybe you google something similar in your own country.
(3V prepaid Visa cards)

That does suck but if someone wants to pirate an app even licencing doesn't stop them as there is an app that apparently patches licence checks.
It is so easy for even a non root and new user to find cracked apps, I have seen links on here and even on peoples facebook sites, it's got to the point where people can just browse a webpage and click a link to get the cracked version of an app.
Unfortunately if someone wants to crack it they can. Unless you could implement your own security check somehow, something obfuscated in the code, licencing is the only alternative as it would stop people using backed up cancelled versions at least.
Unfortunately it seems a lot of people just don't want to pay for apps.
Dave
Sent from my LG P920 using Tapatalk

also have to look at both sides. some people just refuse to pay for **** whatever it is, or get it as cheaply as they can. being android apps, the free route is how they're going to go. but the other side, you hsould be grateful for all the people that do pay. they're the ones helping keeping google, open source, android and everything in between chugging along. open source is the future and you can tell every corporation i said that. and thanks for you your work even though i've never used it.

jago25_98 said:
...
Also just to make that point again, if one does not believe in property then inconveniently there is no moral crime here. I suggest learn to live with this and go with the flow
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
There is plenty to disagree with in your post as it all seems like an attempt at rationalizing ways to get around the system. This last statement is a ridiculous attempt at summarizing why stealing is OK. Your morals don't define the crime, the law does. Stealing property, physical or intellectual, is not legal and not right regardless of your morals or lack of.
Chad,
I am sorry to hear of your products' abuse. I used your kernels all the time on my Incredible devices and bought IncrediControl to support development. I have purchased many applications just to support development and believe that is the way to get high quality applications.

Piracy is just so damn easy on Android. I know ppl that are doing it who I wouldn't even expect to be doing such a thing. This guy I know love android only because he can get everything free by just googling the apk.

awww thats sad i feel really bad for you!

I've used pre paid visa debit cards to buy apps. You can find them in Any money shop like Cheque cashing places for example. You can even just stick a dicky diver (£5) on them. Perfect for situations like this
Sent from my GT-I9100 using xda premium

[Q] Sidekick 4g dock bar

Here is a Noob question for you. Is it possible to add an item to the stock SK4G dock bar? I want to add web in between apps and contacts cause I use it so much. I have searched the forums and can't come up with anything. Thanks.

Unfortunatly no :'( I tried doing it before and got tired of trying to figure out how to do it so I just got launcher pro than the cracked version of launcher pro plus xD
Sent from my SGH-T839 using xda premium

l1f3h4cker said:
Unfortunatly no :'( I tried doing it before and got tired of trying to figure out how to do it so I just got launcher pro than the cracked version of launcher pro plus xD
Sent from my SGH-T839 using xda premium
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
shame on you. the developers work hard on those apps. you are one of many reasons why I wont develop apps cause it will just end up on some torrent or pirate site so cheap bastards such as your self can steal it.
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"lightbox_close": "Close",
"lightbox_next": "Next",
"lightbox_previous": "Previous",
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"lightbox_share": "Share",
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I know that developer and that is the reason hes not updating his launcher to work with ICS. Hes sick of his work being stolen from him.
Sent from my SPH-D710 using xda premium

ReActiveDisorder said:
shame on you. the developers work hard on those apps. you are one of many reasons why I wont develop apps cause it will just end up on some torrent or pirate site so cheap bastards such as your self can steal it.
I know that developer and that is the reason hes not updating his launcher to work with ICS. Hes sick of his work being stolen from him.
Sent from my SPH-D710 using xda premium
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
yeah thats poopy, but its the way of the world. people shouldnt do things they love for the hope of money, and if they dont love doing it they shouldnt do it at all.

i agree that the developer should be supported, but, if you like me and cant even afford a 1$ app, using their app and telling people how great it is is the next best thing.

Thanks for the heads up. Its a shame it can't be done but I guess that's what ROMS are for. Maybe Reactive Disorder will see this and kung fu it into one of his. I've been looking at his work and I swear he is half computer with the stuff he does. But anyway I don't agree with swiping peoples work. If they put it out there for free or just want donations then its fine to get it, otherwise PAY THEM FOR THEIR WORK! I am a chef and a musician. I HATE when people rip me off and can't tolerate seing it done to someone else. Nothing worse than spending days/weeks poring everything into something just to have someone else come in and snatch it without even a thought about what you went through. At least in my circles if you get ahold of my recipes or sheet music I can come and punch you in the face when I catch you.
Sent from my SGH-T839 using XDA

-Nomad- said:
Thanks for the heads up. Its a shame it can't be done but I guess that's what ROMS are for. Maybe Reactive Disorder will see this and kung fu it into one of his. I've been looking at his work and I swear he is half computer with the stuff he does. But anyway I don't agree with swiping peoples work. If they put it out there for free or just want donations then its fine to get it, otherwise PAY THEM FOR THEIR WORK! I am a chef and a musician. I HATE when people rip me off and can't tolerate seing it done to someone else. Nothing worse than spending days/weeks poring everything into something just to have someone else come in and snatch it without even a thought about what you went through. At least in my circles if you get ahold of my recipes or sheet music I can come and punch you in the face when I catch you.
Sent from my SGH-T839 using XDA
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
i agree to a degree, but honestly if that person cant afford your music and there was no way to get it free, you wouldnt have gotten that money anyway.

yoyowhatup22 said:
i agree to a degree, but honestly if that person cant afford your music and there was no way to get it free, you wouldnt have gotten that money anyway.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I can see where your coming from but its a little different in the music world. At my shows there is the expensive seats up front, cheap seats in the back and free out in the field. I am not saying that I am after everyone's money just give me credit for my work. I have had people steal my sheet music and claim it as their own before. That doesn't mean I won't make money at all but I put a lot of work into that and to have someone else say they did it is what pissed me off. He could have had it if he just asked but that was weeks of my time lost and I have nothing to show for it. When it comes to apps I agree that there should be a free trial for all of them, but if its not and you can only get it by paying then if you want it bad enough you will buy it. If making apps was my only source of income and someone leaked it and everyone gets it for free without at least donating then I would starve. That's what gets me so riled up.

It's like every thread on here, ReActive butts in and it goes way off-topic (or he just insults someone for posting about a dream), but I can't stay away from this one as it speaks to the core of my principals.
-Nomad- said:
He could have had it if he just asked but that was weeks of my time lost and I have nothing to show for it.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
...so how does that change if he asked? What do you have to show for it then that you lost by him not asking? Even if he doesn't ask, you can still say: Hey, I made that, and people are benefiting from it. Isn't that why you create art, so people can enjoy it? Does it really matter if they know who the artist is or not (if you are not trying to make money off it)?
-Nomad- said:
If making apps was my only source of income and someone leaked it and everyone gets it for free without at least donating then I would starve. That's what gets me so riled up.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Back to money again. Money is a false construct and has nothing to do with art, skill, or creativity. If your only source of income is payment from individuals for something you can copy and reproduce without costing you any money or time, then you are in the wrong business. If I can't hold it in my hand, it is not a commodity, it is simply knowledge/information/directions/instructions. All of those things should be free to the entire globe.
If I can see it, if I can hear it, if I can learn how to build it... then I have an undeniable human right to record it, copy it, modify it, and redistributed it to anyone and everyone. Not sharing your recipes/sheet-music with who ever is interested (for free) is a crime to my sense of morality/values. It is all just information, and the collection of all the worlds information should be freely available to every human on the planet.
"If I give you a pfennig, you will be one pfennig richer and I'll be one pfennif poorer. But if I give you an idea, you will have a new idea, but I shall still have it too" - Albert Einstein

You can't "build" it, pal.
Stealing my software (or anybody else's) is a crime.
Furthermore, it's not about the love and it's not about the people; it's about the money.
Anytime you publish any kind of IP, you know that there will be theft, but that doesn't mean I have to like it--or endorse it.
Furthermore, this site forbids piracy and if you go around proudly saying otherwise, you will proudly join Jin out there in the wild blue yonder.
If you can "build" all this great software, just make your own. No need to steal it if it's so trivial and easy for you.

orange808 said:
Stealing my software (or anybody else's) is a crime.
Anytime you publish any kind of IP, you know that there will be theft, but that doesn't mean I have to like it--or endorse it.
If you can "build" all this great software, just make your own. No need to steal it if it's so trivial and easy for you.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I had a huge event to get ready for so getting back into the forums here to post has been challenging. Thank you Orange808. I was upset I couldn't get on to tell the other guy about how stealing from me hurt me, but you got to them first. I say that at the end of the day, no mater how you try to justify it, if you take something that's not yours without going through the proper channels you are a thief. I don't care what kind of Robin Hood complex you have, if you didn't compensate or do whatever else is asked of you to obtain the product, and even ideas can be products, you stole it. I am not ok with that at all. If you are ok with being a thief that's your problem, don't try to make me thank you for it. But with that all said we are way off topic. I started this thread to ask a question. It has been answered. I don't know how to close a thread on this forum, but it needs to be closed. If you want to argue about morality, START YOUR OWN THREAD! Please stop doing it on mine. Thank you.
Sent from my SGH-T839 using XDA

Ok. I'm quite respectful, and will leave this thread alone as requested. Just know that I would never steal anything from anyone (which requires taking something physical away from them).

rpmccormick said:
Ok. I'm quite respectful, and will leave this thread alone as requested. Just know that I would never steal anything from anyone (which requires taking something physical away from them).
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I don't have the time/patience to look up and post all of the links , but go to wikipedia and look up Intellectual property and you will see that it is protected and treated as real property with all of the same rights. That means that taking someones music, app, program or any other IP without their permission is still theft. Don't believe me ask a lawyer. As I said before. The original topic this thread was started for has been answered and this thread is closed. Start your own thread if you really want to hash this one out.
Sent from my SGH-T839 using XDA

rpmccormick said:
Ok. I'm quite respectful, and will leave this thread alone as requested. Just know that I would never steal anything from anyone (which requires taking something physical away from them).
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
jeez, cmon. just because you arnt physically taking it away doesnt mean you didnt steal it, i steal. i can admit that, no im not proud of it but i cant afford any of it anyway. but having your moral compass pointed so far south like that is just wrong.

rpmccormick said:
Ok. I'm quite respectful, and will leave this thread alone as requested. Just know that I would never steal anything from anyone (which requires taking something physical away from them).
Click to expand...
Click to collapse

I did stay away for a while. Not trolling. Will stay away again... but I saw this today and felt I had to picture-post back to ReActive. Many other people share my morals. To us, "having your moral compass pointed so far [north] like that is just wrong."
Click here for Other Pic

rpmccormick said:
I did stay away for a while. Not trolling. Will stay away again... but I saw this today and felt I had to picture-post back to ReActive. Many other people share my morals. To us, "having your moral compass pointed so far [north] like that is just wrong."
Click here for Other Pic
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Sent from my SPH-D710 using xda premium

Android Piracy - Real numbers

Hi
few days ago i have released my game on android. I have spend almost a year on development.
There are two option available lite and full ( paid ) full - with full content, and lite with truncated content. Implemented market licensing library. And two separate analytics to track lite and full version separately.
After an hour from release there was first payment, and of course user canceled within 15 minutes transaction.
After 3 hours - i have noticed that google is indexing illegal APKs . What the **** !
They tells that are for developers , and in other side they indexing pirated content ;/
So far there were total 7 full purchases in 3 days
So here is analytics from full version ( from 3 days )
{
"lightbox_close": "Close",
"lightbox_next": "Next",
"lightbox_previous": "Previous",
"lightbox_error": "The requested content cannot be loaded. Please try again later.",
"lightbox_start_slideshow": "Start slideshow",
"lightbox_stop_slideshow": "Stop slideshow",
"lightbox_full_screen": "Full screen",
"lightbox_thumbnails": "Thumbnails",
"lightbox_download": "Download",
"lightbox_share": "Share",
"lightbox_zoom": "Zoom",
"lightbox_new_window": "New window",
"lightbox_toggle_sidebar": "Toggle sidebar"
}
What should i think about this ? 7 purchases and 2600 UU ????
ps. i dont publish title in case of removal ( some may think it is promotion )

There is a lot of piracy on android, its very easy to find pirated apps and there's only one solution I could think of although not sure it is a perfect solution.
That would be to have the app check for licence validation and if none found over a long period of say a month have the app refuse to run until it can check with google but it might annoy a lot of potential users.
Dave
( http://www.google.com/producer/editions/CAownKXmAQ/bigfatuniverse )
Sent from my LG P920 using Tapatalk

mistermentality said:
That would be to have the app check for licence validation and if none found over a long period of say a month have the app refuse to run until it can check with google but it might annoy a lot of potential users.
Dave
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
There is license validation - but already cracked ;/

hi tajniacki
I think that you are little bit on lost position. I think thats why some devs release only free apps with advertisements inside - but this have also some disadvantages:
I had app for kid - about learning letters. - After some realease dev add ads inside app thats ok for me - but how can i explain 2yo kid to not click on color bars that appear on bottom of screen?

^ haha good point. I think developers will have to go the extra mile in android. I think devs should use some type of Internet based verification (this would actually be a really good startup idea i think). Similar to windows except nothing works if the app is unable to connect to the internet every so often.
Sent from my Kindle Fire using XDA

As Blizzard ? Keep most of the stuff on remote servers and play only after logging in ? It will be very hard for small devs , and startup idea is good
Everything can be cracked but this is madness :0 A lot of companies tried to have better DRM protection without luck. So we are on the lost position which is very sad.

BorrowADolla said:
^ haha good point. I think developers will have to go the extra mile in android. I think devs should use some type of Internet based verification (this would actually be a really good startup idea i think). Similar to windows except nothing works if the app is unable to connect to the internet every so often.
Sent from my Kindle Fire using XDA
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
That's a big problem for people like myself who live in areas where they can't always get reception for a licence check or who don't have a data connection.
I bought a panorama camera app then found it only works when connected to internet....bit pointless if you are trying to take pic of a place that has no reception though.
Dave
( http://www.google.com/producer/editions/CAownKXmAQ/bigfatuniverse )
Sent from my LG P920 using Tapatalk

tajniacki said:
As Blizzard ? Keep most of the stuff on remote servers and play only after logging in ? It will be very hard for small devs , and startup idea is good
Everything can be cracked but this is madness :0 A lot of companies tried to have better DRM protection without luck. So we are on the lost position which is very sad.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
It is sad. Especially for small developers that spend tons of time and don't necessarily have the resources to implement insane drm and licensing/validation structures.
I think like much pirated content, we just have to hope there are enough decent people still willing to pay for things. And realize not every pirated copy is a lost sale. Pretty lame that they are readily indexing that stuff, but I'm guessing it'd be hard not to.
I'd hate to add up how much I spend on apps. I've probably only refunded a couple times when I felt the app wasn't what I needed or if I already had a competing paid app I felt was still stronger.
Good luck!
Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I717 using xda premium

Yes, it would be expensive and impractical for small devs. But on the flipside, only the more expensive apps are readily available as pirated copies.
Im not saying u need Internet every time. But u will need internet for installation and u will need it like every other time u use the app. Obviously not the way to go for many types of apps.
Sent from my Kindle Fire using XDA

Wow, I knew Android piracy was bad, but I didn't realise it was that bad. The worst part is that whatever DRM or whatever you add, they'll crack it in days Tools like apktool or apk-manager or whatever, while designed to create mods and themes etc. for apps, make it all to easy to reverse engineer apps. Sucks, but I guess that's "how it is"
EDIT: It's not hard to see why many devs turn to putting ads in their apps and releasing for free.

I think the best way to look at piracy as a content creator is to look at the people that illegaly download your content as a group that isn't a part of your potential customers. These people always justify their ways by saying they "wouldn't buy it anyway". But then if you wouldn't buy it anyway, why the hell do you want to pirate it?
It sucks but that's the way it is! I think you should just try and look at the positive side that your work was that good that it got pirated

The_R said:
I think the best way to look at piracy as a content creator is to look at the people that illegaly download your content as a group that isn't a part of your potential customers. These people always justify their ways by saying they "wouldn't buy it anyway". But then if you wouldn't buy it anyway, why the hell do you want to pirate it?
It sucks but that's the way it is! I think you should just try and look at the positive side that your work was that good that it got pirated
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
That's easy to say, but when 7 out of ~3000 customers are paying, it's not so practical any more.

Most pirates are the younger generation, imagine, they have no options for paying the app, therefore they become pirates and unfortunately they stick to it.
If there were young people-friendly payment methods then maybe 15-30% more would pay.
So this is the sad reality we're living in.
Sent from my HTC Optimus Ray S

To be honest, most piracy occurs with apps the user would not purchase but if they can get it for free they would try it. I am not defending the act I do not pirate and have only purchased 4 apps. It is a catch 22, I do not want to waste money on crap, and the developer deserves their due for there efforts. If piracy did not exist, I guess my point is that you would not have nearly the number of downloads
Flyer

iok1 said:
Most pirates are the younger generation, imagine, they have no options for paying the app, therefore they become pirates and unfortunately they stick to it.
If there were young people-friendly payment methods then maybe 15-30% more would pay.
So this is the sad reality we're living in.
Sent from my HTC Optimus Ray S
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
This is very true, as a young teenager I had no choice, as I had no income source, no cc to validate when I did get money, and it just stuck. Only recently have I realized that it's not a good practice. I still pirate all of my media initially, but many things I buy, especially if the dev or artist is struggling or new (Sarah donner and her music) or if the product is absolutely amazing (minecraft, the binding of isaac)
Sent from my DROIDRAZR using XDA

SifJar said:
That's easy to say, but when 7 out of ~3000 customers are paying, it's not so practical any more.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Maybe put a version of your app out there with a few features disabled but use adverts in it and perhaps it would earn more income as people will click ads at some point and each click is money you might not have from the app if only selling one version?
Dave
( http://www.google.com/producer/editions/CAownKXmAQ/bigfatuniverse )
Sent from my LG P920 using Tapatalk

You guys are forgetting about adblock on android. But yes, I have pirated some apps, but if I like it, I'll support the developer. If the Dev gets no money, that means no app.

You can easily filter the illegal downloads with email address verification. Very effective and low cost.
App: Public Key + Email Address
Server: Private Key + Verification Algorithm

This is extremely sad, and I think we need to set a fire under Google to do something about it. The problem is it is hard to do anything without closing the system, which would be to much like apple (evil)! So here is an idea; when someone is sideloading an app, the installer checks the market, and if it finds that is a paid app, it refuses to install it! Only problem would be with things like the amazon app store, where they both have the same app. They could at least make the app produce a sort of license before it installs. I know nothing of drm, so don't listen to me if this is dumb.
Sent using Tapatalk

Wow, I would never expect it to be that bad for a phone.