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Hello. I am new here. I saw you helped some guy running Android on his HTC touch dual. I have a SGH-i600 Windows Mobile 6 Smartphone(No touchscreen). It is the European version of the Blackjack 1. Since it is in the same category as the white "Gphone" prototype shown in An Android Demo Video...I thought I could try Android on my phone. For now, I would like to know if it is possible to run it from within windows. Later(when it will be more stable), I would like to remove WM and put Android on it as main OS. Or maybe Dual-Boot??? That would be very awesome!
Any help? Is it possible?
dude, android on any phone right now is almost impossible- i think only kaiser users are lucky enough to get some sort of unofficial OS of it working.
android is not actually out yet and when it does come out it will only be available for phones coming out then and the only hope youl have is if someone cooks a version for your blackjack or you get a phone which it supports.
hope this cleared things up
It did.
Yeah. Unfortunately, it did clear things up very well. I wish somebody could hack it to work with the SGH-i600. If not, I am getting a Kaiser or a touch-pro if the price will go down. I will not pay more than $600 on a phone.
Sorry for necro!
Sorry for necroposting, but now that Android has been released, is there anything I could do to port it to other phones. Especially my sgh-i600!
I don't much get excited by operating systems, but I'm intrigued here.
My suggestion to you would be to 1st get two sheets of paper, then write the benefits of WinMo on one and the benefits of Android on the other. And then do an HONEST comparison.
Now don't get me wrong: I have nothing against the Linux crowd, but I have a problem with tech-weenies that think it's cool to write M$ instead of MS and who believe Firefox is better simply because it isn't from Microsoft. Please don't think this statement is aimed at you - I DON'T think this of you, but instead see you as a member of the because-we-can brigade!
WinMo offers many benefits, least of which the maturity and stability, the number of devs coding for it and the number of apps available. In userland there are things like Exchange integration and more.
In my limited perspective I don't see Android matching WinMo, so aside from the because-we-can approach I see absolutely no point in migrating to it even if it was available to me right now. In fact, Android to me is of less consequence than Symbian. I see it as a Phone OS, while my device is a PDA that just happens to have phone capabilities, but is used for so much more. A bit like XP Home - pretty-ish, but outside of home usage it is mostly useless.
I will ask that you post your comparison of Android and WinMo here for all to see, but please don't get emotionally attached to either. Just stick to the facts.
let's see!
I also hate it when people bash something for no reason. I am not bashing Microsoft, nor Windows mobile. It's just that I prefer getting the most out of everything. WinMO smartphone edition freezes on me like a ***** every day, but that is not the main reason for which I would like to install Android. Android has a very easy to use SDK and I can easily port my Desktop apps to Android Platform. I am unable to understand the WinMO's sdk.Android just works for me, while WinMO doesn't. I have to say I love the phone. I could get a G1, but it doesn't suit my needs hardware wise. I just love the i600 and love the Android OS. S60 is still better than WinMO in my opinion. Easier to use(SDK) and faster(OS). I think there is a much higher chance of porting s60 as they have the e71 similar to i600.
Any luck for me? None?
after a long time being here ive noticed far too many threads moaning about the ugly interface and limitations of winows mobile
so i thought id start one that encourages new members to appreciate what we have
we have a mobile operating system that lets us do more than any other. emails on the go, internet sharing, fully customisable and the feature of being able to install unsigned software and work around compatability issues. and as far as looks go its noi uglier than a pc so we really cant complain. and i still hear about comparisons to the iphone now ill be the first to admit its a prett thing but after owning three winmo devices im never going to another, just because there are more possibilties than anything available
which brings me to this community and its part, my first device was a heavily branded spv m5000 (universal) and i really wasnt interested in flashing it or downloading because i didnt know about this community. then i got a kaiser and signed up for xda devs and have never seen so much appreciation for a mobile operating system and its features. in fact the only hangup i had was xda didnt cater for non htc devices, this was a bit of a niggle when i got the omnia. but ive still been welcomed and also decided to create a forum in the same manner as xda that caters for all winmo devices (see my sig)
so basically lets stop telling people what we think we should have and be greatful that we have the best mobile operating system available that seems to get better along the way with communities such as this one
cheers j
nb i know it seems a bit pointless posting a new topic about windows mobiles advantages but its better than another thread wishing it looked like an iphone
except windows mobile is dying and developement is drying up. Not only has the iphone outsold all wm devices worldwide but it actually has MORE apps now and more active development.
I too love WM and detest the limitations of the iphone, but sadly I must call a spade a spade
yeah it has just now. but development will pick up again. and i think the reason the iphone is doing so well is becauseits nice to look at. but they forget iphone has mass limitations
jayjay8585 said:
yeah it has just now. but development will pick up again. and i think the reason the iphone is doing so well is becauseits nice to look at. but they forget iphone has mass limitations
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
but most of iPhone users are not hackers like peeps in xda or generally in windows mobile devices. they just like the fact that it is easy to use and doesn`t even realize it`s fails etc. I just wish that wm7 will bring those iphone users to us.
when peopolemfinally reaslise the iphones limtitations then they should come by them selves. if theyre r worried about interface. ifonz, but see we have the option of a pretty shortcut menu or pc looking interface ythey get the one and only that one
doubt very much iphone ipod touch got more apps then windows mobile
if people google <insert program name> pocketpc there are always hits
piles of freeware progs and games
but granted it's easier for people who pref not to use
google to find applications in app store
jayjay8585 said:
when peopolemfinally reaslise the iphones limtitations then they should come by them selves. if theyre r worried about interface. ifonz, but see we have the option of a pretty shortcut menu or pc looking interface ythey get the one and only that one
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yah, but that is the problem. They have to install stuff to get it clean lookin etc.
yeah but the point is we have the choice we can install m2d and ifonz wad and throttle launcher they cant
the one word thatll piss every iphone user off
FULL CUSTOMISATION
jayjay8585 said:
yeah but the point is we have the choice we can install m2d and ifonz wad and throttle launcher they cant
the one word thatll piss every iphone user off
FULL CUSTOMISATION
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Well, that is also so true, but it would be good if Windows Mobile would be as easy to use in the beginning like iPhone is. It took me time to get inside WinMo and now I love it, but iPhone is easy-to-use instantly or maybe this is just me
but the full customization is Windows Mobile`s greatest side and iPhone can`t compete on that side God I still wish that we had something like iTunes Store for Windows Mobile provided by xda
jayjay8585 said:
FULL CUSTOMISATION
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
care to explain how you can change the icons of the apps displayed when you Start > Programs or Start > Settings
i myself dont kno but after flashing hyperdragonsr rom onto my old kaiser theyre different so we know it possible
at the end of the day if winmo was so easy to set up and just use xda devs would be replaced with apps to be bought from microsoft for a fee then like apple sdks would have to be bought
although apps on appstore are free. well some of them developers still have to pay for the right to develop. winmno rules
and another note the whole taking time to set up winmo to be the you like it, thats what customisation is all about, and the fact that we delve so deep is the reason this haven exists
Yeah I agree about taking winmo to where I want is that loved customization side of it.
but for casual users it is like dancing on the graves and then they go and buy iPhone which a monkey can use -.-" but winmo still pwns it. no matter of what.
One other important aspect that is not being mentioned is that fact that the iphone had great advertising. The whooped and hollered it up and every one wanted one. I have friends who have the iphone and after a period of time they want more but due to no customization they can't. They are then jealous of my WM Device. Granted MS sucks a lot, because it appears they don't listen to what people want, but to me that is a great thing. Because of that we have XDA-Dev and all the wonderful programs. If it was up to me, keep is simple Microsoft and let the community build on it. The other fact is I hate (did I already say hate) itunes. AAC is a great format but the limitations of only being able to play on certain devices and having to sync with your computer and stuff. To much hassle and not enough freedom. My iphone friends agree, now that they see how quickly I can sync, move data and upload/download what I want as opposed to what I'm being told I can.
Just my two cents.
Let the flaming begin!!!
Just about right said:
One other important aspect that is not being mentioned is that fact that the iphone had great advertising. The whooped and hollered it up and every one wanted one. I have friends who have the iphone and after a period of time they want more but due to no customization they can't. They are then jealous of my WM Device. Granted MS sucks a lot, because it appears they don't listen to what people want, but to me that is a great thing. Because of that we have XDA-Dev and all the wonderful programs. If it was up to me, keep is simple Microsoft and let the community build on it. The other fact is I hate (did I already say hate) itunes. AAC is a great format but the limitations of only being able to play on certain devices and having to sync with your computer and stuff. To much hassle and not enough freedom. My iphone friends agree, now that they see how quickly I can sync, move data and upload/download what I want as opposed to what I'm being told I can.
Just my two cents.
Let the flaming begin!!!
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Click to collapse
I hope this wont turn on a flame war
yeah, Apple`s advertising sure beats wm devices ad`s. haven`t seen a single Diamond / Touch Pro ad and I see atleast three iPhone adverts in a day at tv.
guess thats because apple is iphone and virsa versa
where wm is a os that anybody can make phones using
so should htc make adds for a ms product or
should ms make adds for a htc product ?
HTC should advertise their devices I wonder what would be results if Diamond would be as advertised as iPhone :s
Thanks for starting this thread. There is so much talk about how terrible winmo is, but personally I think its great. Sure out of the box it isn't the most user friendly device, but you can customize your phone however you want with a large array of diffent programs that allow for 'prettier' graphics and a much more user friendly interface. Its too bad development is slowing down, but I understand why. I just hope that WM7 can step up the ms game and get people interested again.
One more thing. I have a friend with a 3G iPhone. He is so die hard about it and is convinced everything else is so far inferior. Well, the other day I showed him the customization of my phone, dual booting android, and smoked him in download and internet speeds and suddenly he didn't seem so sure about his iPhone. He thought active sync was the coolest thing, I had to remind him that this was present on winmo phones for many years and is not an iphone development. I think a big issue is advertising, smart phones and ppcs are NEVER advertised on television. You may see ads for an Instinct or a Razor, but never for a Vogue, Kaiser, Diamond etc.
Anyhow, great thread. Winmo rocks.
of course it does because as we kno its has limitations but because of forums like this thre not a lot. and less work than symbian
Again, How is WM More customizable than the other platforms??
Custom Roms (Treo's and iPhone)
3rd party apps (Symbian, Treo, iPhone)
Ability to run Unsigned Code (All three again)
MS is as evil as any other company.
Flashing custom Roms(CID unlock/Hard SPL) seems easy to you because of hard work of folks here.
And should i remind you that MS/HTC haave in the past tried to shut this site down???
I hate to break it to alot of you guys, but the sub culture of the jailbroken iPhone community is much more in depth and techy than many of you think.
Windows Mobile is still my preferred OS mainly because I've been using it for so long, but I do own an iPhone 3G. Just like I've been ripping apart my WM phones for awhile with the information received here, so do I with my iPhone and it's batch of web sites. You'd be amazed at some of the stuff they've got going. Full customization of every aspect of the phones graphics, a video recorder that shoots ultra clear video (this, after years of suffering with my HTC camera software), a wealth of Apple-unapproved third party apps, system tweaks (like Safari Mobile tweaks that allow us to download, copy and paste, etc.), and more.
I do and always will love Windows Mobile, but we HAVE to remember that most of us hated WM right out of the box, otherwise we wouldn't be here. Likewise, my iPhone failed to interest me much when I first got it, yet the current generation of Jailbreaking has really opened it up.
The grass is green on both sides of the fence. I used to bash the iPhone and it's users just like everybody else, but now that I speak from experience I have come to see that the two OS's are much more alike than we realize.
The way I see it, there is no reason for me to be blindly loyal to one OS. When I started buying WM devices, I didn't sign up for some strange Microsoft regime, and likewise for Apple. We can have both, and use them as the mood strikes us.
EDIT: Oh, and don't even get me started on the touch screens...we really need some capacitive love on WM touch screens...
Reason for my question? This: http://www.engadget.com/2009/07/22/htc-adopting-android-on-50-of-its-handsets-in-2010/
Going to quite a few iPhone topics here (and made one myself), I know that a lot of you guys here seem to love WinMo (at least more than OSX), so seeing this piece of news was kind of interesting.
As we all know and as the article reiterates, the vast majority of current HTC phones are WinMo-based. The rumor is that it's eventually going to go down to 50%-based with the other 50% being Android. Of course, it's a rumor, but the articles states that HTC is already on the way to being 30% Android-based, so how unlikely is it really?
Now let me go a bit further: As it is, HTC is currently 90% WinMo-based. With the speed at which they seem to be moving (2% to 50% Android-based in one year?), who is to say they won't eventually be 90% Android-based? If this does happen, though, as we see now, XDA could easily simply add the Android-based phones with little issue. On the other hand, as we also see now with Android-based phones, the design may become more limited instead of the numerous designs available for WinMo-based phones.
But...would you guys continue to purchase HTC phones? Is your love of HTC phones all dependent upon the support of XDA-developers or can you simply not switch from WinMo?
Personally, I am pretty OS independent. I can work with any phone. However, if I do have to switch from WinMo, then I would prefer to switch to either iPhone (yeah, yeah, I know) or the Palm Pre (WebOS' increasing popularity and great usability). As it is, I'm not very interested in Android, and Google...has done/say a few things in the past to make me doubt if they'll give proper support to Android. So personally, if HTC does switch to being almost completely Android-based, then truthfully, I probably would not continue purchasing HTC.
ofcourse.
however, i am not "loyal" to any OS or company. whoever makes the best device that suits my needs gets the money.
Well
They would increase their Android models but WM will still be there, so it´s just another option to stay with HTC
Personally I think Android can be good in the future, when they achieve a more mature and solid OS, meantime I´m with WM and of course HTC
crazy talk said:
ofcourse.
however, i am not "loyal" to any OS or company. whoever makes the best device that suits my needs gets the money.
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Click to collapse
Well, I wasn't referring to company/OS loyalty; my apology if I gave that impression. What I really meant was a question of how much one likes using Windows Mobile vs how much one likes XDA support.
As I said, I'm presuming there's a certain number of people here who likes WinMo, so I'm trying to gauge how many people would stick with HTC in the case of such a large move. From your post, I'm assuming you'll go with the best device regardless of OS or XDA support, though?
orb3000 said:
They would increase their Android models but WM will still be there, so it´s just another option to stay with HTC
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Click to collapse
True, but I'm guessing one's choices may also become a bit more limited if HTC's Android support increases even further. Look at HTC's list of Android-based phones now. If you happen to not like any of the *three* choices, whether it be due to design, specs, or whatever other reason, then you're pretty much out of luck, aren't you?
On the other hand, if you don't like one HTC WinMo-based phone, you literally have a dozen other choices in various designs and specs to fit your desire.
My Understanding is that MS doesn’t work and listen well with the manufacturer. There are many complains on current WinMo capabilities and how time consuming it is to write application for it. Furthermore complains also go in to the development speed of the WM7 which no one knows anything about it. Therefore some HTC press release could be aiming of putting serious pressure to MS. Furthermore been only on WinMo leads HTC very depended on MS. I believe that is very important point by certain negotiations between HTC and MS.
Therefore it is only understandable that HTC starting put more weight on a second pillar. Besides developing own OS the Android is the best option for HTC for shaping and driving an Operation Platform for their Devices.
Anyhow that Large Companies like HTC, Samsung and some others paying serious attention to Android indicating very bright future for Android. It is most likely now that those companies will speed up the process growing young OS to maturate. WinMo and MS is really under pressure now, if Wm7 doesn’t bring the expected wowww change then it will no other way then to say... Good bye WinMo
Not sure if I really need another OS in the mix. I wouldn't mind a device that can do both Android and WinMo but only Android ... probably not. Then I might as well make the jump to the iPhone.
I certainly wouldn't rule out Android. As somebody who uses a lot of Google's webservices, Android has a definite appeal. There's a few WM-specific apps I'd miss, but the app ecosystem for Android will only improve as time goes one.
However, I've been pretty darn happy with Microsoft's direction lately (Win 7, Zune, and the Xbox 360 are all great products). I wouldn't buy another WM6 device, but I'm definitely going to be following WM7 closely.
I still think HTC has some of the best ID guys in the business (aesthetically I prefer the TD2 and TP2 to anything on the market) and they're very talented and making software tweaks, but they really need to raise the bar for hardware specs and quality if they want me to keep buying HTC devices, regardless of the OS.
edit: And agreeing with coolVariable, I'd love a device that could easily be configured to run either natively. That would be an instant sale from me. I have a feeling MS's licensing wouldn't make it easy, though.
I'd switch in a heartbeat to anything different from HTC/WinMo as long as it's available on my Sprint SERO plan.
Bulldog said:
My Understanding is that MS doesn’t work and listen well with the manufacturer. There are many complains on current WinMo capabilities and how time consuming it is to write application for it.
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Click to collapse
Hmm, if this is the case, it may explain partly why HTC is betting so much on Android so suddenly. To be honest, if it is the case, I wouldn't be surprised either. I've seen similar techniques employed by other companies in other industries recently too.
Still, corporate shenanigans or not, 50% still seems like a massive shift to me, but I'm guessing the plan might change if their 2009 30% path becomes bumpy.
coolVariable said:
Not sure if I really need another OS in the mix. I wouldn't mind a device that can do both Android and WinMo but only Android ... probably not. Then I might as well make the jump to the iPhone.
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Click to collapse
Both Android and WinMo? You mean sort of a dual boot deal or simply a device that can install either Android or WinMo roms? That would be fantastic; I think we can all agree on that. I think we can all agree too that it's unlikely.
8525Smart said:
True, but I'm guessing one's choices may also become a bit more limited if HTC's Android support increases even further. Look at HTC's list of Android-based phones now. If you happen to not like any of the *three* choices, whether it be due to design, specs, or whatever other reason, then you're pretty much out of luck, aren't you?
On the other hand, if you don't like one HTC WinMo-based phone, you literally have a dozen other choices in various designs and specs to fit your desire.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I don´t think so, there are so many models with WM to choose from, and there will be more coming.
The actual number of Andorid models is low, and as you said, it will increase, but that is good so more options will be available.
As I said, I´ll stick to HTC WM models, at least in following 2 years...Then we can see what is Android doing and perhaps I can consider...
Great thread!
I think I will continue buying HTC phones even if there was a large Android base, even more than 50%. I like Android and all, and maybe in the future I may even take one myself, but WM is so customizable and i have it just the way i like it and wouldnt change it for anything (except for a newer more powerful device maybe tegra/snapdragon which im holding out for)
I have to give credit where credit is due: if it wasn't for this site, my tp may have been my first and last winmo phone. I wouldnt have the functionality and great experience that i do now without the help of the folks here.
BTW, I think this thread would benefit greatly from a poll, as many dont have the time to post, but everyone has time to vote.
orb3000 said:
I don´t think so, there are so many models with WM to choose from, and there will be more coming.
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Click to collapse
Yes, currently, but if HTC does shift to majority Android-based phones, then the number of WinMo-based models will inevitably go down (in favor of Android-based models instead), which will then result in a lack of choices.
Nonetheless, I do agree with you. If Android eventually shows more promise, I would reconsider too, but at this point, I still prefer to switch to OSX/WebOS if I have to leave WinMo.
euphoria47 said:
BTW, I think this thread would benefit greatly from a poll, as many dont have the time to post, but everyone has time to vote.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Hmm, you're right. I don't know how I missed that simple bit of fact. Unfortunately, I think it's a bit late for me to make a poll now.
P.S. Thank you for the compliment.
8525Smart said:
Well, I wasn't referring to company/OS loyalty; my apology if I gave that impression. What I really meant was a question of how much one likes using Windows Mobile vs how much one likes XDA support.
As I said, I'm presuming there's a certain number of people here who likes WinMo, so I'm trying to gauge how many people would stick with HTC in the case of such a large move. From your post, I'm assuming you'll go with the best device regardless of OS or XDA support, though?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
i knew what you were asking. and you are correct. i'll go with the best device regardless of OS or XDA support right now.
i mean, right now im using an IPhone because it was the best for me at the time. and now i want to switch to the Tp2. saying "i won't buy XXXX device because it is made by XXXX company and runs XXXX Operating system severely limits choices.
Why of course!!!!
UPDATE: Thanx for participating in the poll but kindly leave a small comment along with it. Thanx
When we say Windows Mobile, what is the first thing that comes to your mind? Emmmmm…
Extensive Customization!! - True
Multi Tasking!! - True
Copy Paste!! - True
External SD Card!! – True
Humongous Application and Easy Installation!! - True
Boring but we got UI replacements!! - That is true aswel
And we love that don’t we. That is because it has something that no other Mobile OS had before.
Well lets hear it from you people..
Was this what you were looking for? Or is it no where even close?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
To read more go here - Windows Phone 7 might really die before its even Out?
Lets hear what you guys have to say.
what about love it hate it..u should add a poll but im getting 1 when they come out
It has new **** so i might as well love it.
hmmm. lets see how much we can crack open this os..
looks outdated visually boring like all things microsoft lately. The official statement appears to be Manufacturers will also be restricted to the smart tile user interface so not a smart move when you compare with the Android System.
I'm not worried about losing the freedom that we have on WinMo - I'm confident that the community here will find a way - and a great way, at that - to allow everyone to get what they want out of WP7, or the way I put it to my friend: I'm sure XDA-Devs will have there way with WP7.
I like the look and feel alot!!
But somehow I fear we will loose all our custimisazion possibilities...like custon ROM's simple apps, Registry tweaks, etc...
But lets see...
Like it quite a bit, seeing some great potential there.
I'm happy to see Microsoft used the Zune interface as guideline as many, including myself, liked the interface and where "hoping"/"seeing" the possibility of a phone entry to the Zune's menu structure. In this case Microsoft went further even and expanded on that UI just like i feel the Zune interface is an expanded/further developed titanium UI. Thank god we get rid of Touchflo/Sense finally, always hated it, but that's just my personal opinion ofc.
Next to that the new zoom/rendering/cleartype is very nice and a great addition to any OS.
Personally i dont care too much about all the social networking features as i hardly use them myself and suspect europeans overall use these less than americans. However i like the widespread intergration of these things, from the photo app, the Me tile etc. to the automatic selection of contact information.
Hope our great dev's and myself here at XDA will figure out the inner workings of it and be able to polish it to our liking.
my two cents for now
Wait to see how much the new OS is far to customizations, I belive that here at XDA we can hack again but why the no Power user can't? I don't complain with this new Apple/like orientation.
Hope it's not like it seems
[email protected]
Looks good to me. It is what I was expecting from a new OS. It isn't just rehashing and repackaging old ideas. I just hope there will be a call manager available for it
It looks good and advanced.
The only fear is that microsoft will go the apple way and cut the developments........
If m$ has not done that there is not better company !
If m$ has done that ( and done successfully ! ) its a sad day for XDA community.
Hope for the best be prepared for the worst !
Jump over to android if m$ has backstabed us
OS is just an OS. The application is more important.
If all the application needs to rebuild, I will simply go for android.
Why should I pay for an OS, when the efforts in the industry is now to be open source? What makes the os distictive are efficiency, multitask, free of dead lock ....But not UI.
If windows phone could make application runs on my HD lighting fast, I might go for it.
It is definetly the end to charge for a mobile OS. Will the greedy M$ make it free for us? If not, it is likely the end of wm.
Good UI, but too sad if we loose all stuff cooked over this forum....
windows 7 plays around microsoft services! buy only if u need these services
Now i understand why microsoft is not completely burying their 6.5.x series development
WM7 at its present state is not for me or for business people.
It is for Iphonish common consumers.
I was expecting WM7 to be an OS with same functional menus & functionalities as previous versions but UI but built on silverlight with zune & Xbox integration. Such a thing would have made WM7 to appeal all types of customers.
Its sad that micrsoft has decided to go in a rather commercial way as apple.
Unless WM7 supports custom skinning like Sense or Mobile shell, i don't think microsoft is going to win here.
They Need You
Years ago, in the dark ages, I was given a prototype computer from Europe to work with and redesign it if necessary. It was necessary. With some skill and a lot of luck I rebuilt a great computer for its time. The American company who owned the European rights to this computer was sinking $200 million into making this machine work for the US market. I was an independent designer (who had already upgraded this computer) and this large company did not want to listen to me or even give me anything for my work. So I never turned over the secrets to them but I wrote software for it for my software company. They worked on this computer for another 8 months and finally solved the problems. In the end, because other companies (like Commodor) beat this computer (that was way ahead of the others) to market, this great machine never caught on. The other computers weren't better but they were first and now were being used by the public. The company who would not sign a contract with me, lost their shirts in their computer division. The company was Timex.
I feel this may be the same problem with Windows mobile. Yes, they have terrific engineers but they should also look to you all on sites like this one to really get new ideas and advice. Because of this site and the programmers on it, my WM 6.1 OS has blown away even phones with snapdragon processors. I hope WM doesn't become a third rate OS because of their not listening to people like you on this site.
too little is revealed on the presentation, to me at least. i dont use social networking nor LIVE service (i do have XBOX360). i need a good organizer, customizable layout, multitasking, and NOT iphone alike!
WP7S seems to be too stripped down, compared to current WM versions. The press conference didn't go into detail, but I fear the highly customizable OS we came to know is a thing of the past - which is a bad thing imo.
But luckily Android is becoming a nice alternative.
the problem for ms is that so far most apps since pocketpc2000 works on our devices so if we can suffer the UI there are tons of apps free and paied you can use
leaving that would mean that android and even nokia n900 (also linux based) are already way ahead of ms in terms of apps and getting fancy games running also a thing ms say is not the aim of wm7 from the rumours i read say and if thats the case the no good gaming options
then iphone / ipod touch are also ahead of them
so far ms had pretty good development res for their mobiles being .net and microMFC as core techs
where iphone / ipod touch required you to buy a mac to make apps which given apples market % few developers had
not sure about how good the symbian/android/n900 development tools are
as an sdk is not really enough to make a good IDE
to be honest i find it pitifully bad.
as i was expecting it too be as soon as the words "stop, thinking off it as a pc, its a phone" came put right near the start.
no matter how much bull and spin and pr hype they put on it its a list based os. list after list after list...
this isn't really what people want is it?
I was really hoping for innovation instead its gone back 8 years.
forget windows phone, its gone windows dumb phone
This is just a PSA to all you vicious Android fanboys on this forum that hound anyone who asks the question "what phone should I get", especially when one of those options includes an iOS device or a WP7 device.
So let me get this started. I love Android. But Android is not perfect. Take a deep breath, and say it with me again, out loud.
"Android is not perfect." Was that too hard? If so the following explanation is for you.
Ever since Android first came out, people were hailing it as the iPhone killer. But in reality? It's really not. It may be getting there, and may be getting there quickly, but that's not that point.
It may be a surprise to many of you, but there are actually other human beings outside of XDA that use smartphones. Human beings that are not interested in rooting their phones or spending a lot of time completely customizing them or pushing them to the limit. These human beings want their phones to work when they need them, and that's all. Whether these phones are iOS, Android, or Windows Mobile/7 phones is completely irrelevant to them.
Except, it actually is. But see, not in the way most of you seem to think it is.
People shop for phones nowadays because the have an end they need to reach and they need the means to get to that end. Whether it's something as simple as checking an email message or quenching a thirst to play a game, they take into consideration what is the quickest, most hassle-free way to do this. This requirement is not because they are stupid. Most XDA users seem to think that anyone off XDA just buys iPhones because they are uneducated about "the true power of Android" and all that jazz. Guess what? That's not the case.
Yes. Here at XDA, we can do a lot with our phones. We root them, we build custom ROMs for them, we use features that were locked before, or get versions of our OS that aren't out yet.
But please be damn sure you understand that we are the minority. We will always be the minority. Your experience here doesn't define the mobile landscape, it only improves your personal experience with your phone. Just because you took a few hours to root your phone, find the perfect custom ROM, and settle down with it doesn't make the average Joe who just bought an iPhone (because it does what he wants easily and has all the apps he likes) a stupid user.
Here is the meat of this newsflash; Android wouldn't be here if it wasn't for iOS. (Going further, iOS wouldn't be there without Windows Mobile, and etc etc etc until we reached the very first man who asked 'why can't I see my email from my phone'). Apple took a chance on what people wanted, and realized they had something. They built an OS that was based on the ideals of OS X; simple, straight-forward, good looking, and well received. And so began the App and Data revolution. All of a sudden, the idea of having mobile data became real. These wonderful delicious little things called "apps" made the mobile world much more exciting than it had even been before. And so Apple hit a goldmine, and the mobile landscape had been painted. These apps were well-designed, fun, informative, useful, and people liked them so much, they started to buy paid apps. Apple knows how to market to people, and there success showed.
So then. Android.
Android was birthed out of the idea that Google could cash in on this app world. You may think the intentions were noble, with the idea that it was some pipe dream in the same way linux was; completely open mobile platform. After all, if Apple could have the success with a closed system, Google obviously could rock the world with an open one.
But it's not. Android, or at least what most people come to think of as Android these days, is not "open". It's open to phone manufacturers, and carriers, but that's it. It' snot open to the end user. Why else do we have locked down features, closed-source OEM skins that hinder future firmware upgrades? Why else do we have carrier-controlled Market restrictions? Why do some phones not ship with developer tools, or the ability to install from unknown sources?
Let me be frank. I love Android, but Android is a mess. It's a mess of a bunch of wonderful ideas that would have shined like nothing else in the perfect world, but a mess that didn't anticipate a simple fact; businesses like to make money.
The truth of the matter is that we don't have freedom with Android. Every little part of it has a restriction we need to bypass. Do you buy an expensive high end phone, or a cheaper low-end phone? Will you still be able to play those cool games on that low end phone? Will it get software updates? Is it safe from malware? Buying an Android phone has become the same as trying to buy a Windows PC.
It suffers from the same problem that Microsoft does when compared to Apple's line of computers. Apple builds its hardware AND its software, so they interface with complete precision and function. People with iPhones don't need to worry about security updates, or whether their phone will be obsolete. Apple may release a new phone every year, but the point is that those phones are made to last, both in terms of hardware and software. They even went the next step further and made the iPod touch, which gave phone users who weren't ready for smartphones a taste of what it was like.
My Sprint Hero came out on October 11th, 2009. The iPhone 3GS came out in June of the same year. Both were priced around the same amount, but what stands out to me the most when I think back to when I tested both that year? The fact it took Google this long to make an operating system which took ages to mature enough to be used by HTC to make a phone that STILL could not even give me a smooth web browser, something that the very first iPhone was able to do. Games on the Hero sucked in comparison to the 3D games that were playable on the iPhone.
Now then, Android smartphone hardware has advanced to a significant level, but the point of this whole rant is that Google has always been following in Apple's footsteps in the mobile world, and it's going to be that way for some time.
Be a bit humble about the begginings of Android and what it's become, and for f***'s sake, be a bit mature than just saying "LOLOLOL APPLE SUCKS GG GET ANDROID".
Because it's the rest of the world outside of XDA that defines the success of these mobile platforms, because I hate to say this, but you and I are not part of that outside world of mobile phone users, and we never will be.
The truth is, no one can really say what the "perfect" mobile OS is. All we can do is say what works best for us or what we prefer, but when we state it as fact, as though it's not arguable, that's when we become the fanboys that we so dearly hate. Just keep that in mind.
Opinions welcome, fanboyism from either side not wanted at all. Congrats on finishing this post.
Excellent post. Would read again.
Great things said there. I can see a point in it. But still, I don't either see Ios higher as Android since Ios is a mess too. Let me just take this simple statement. Music on a Ipod/Iphone needs to be converted from the computer to the device, you can't random download a song(on the device) from Internet and play it. Same as the file exploring.. if you want to search for a file, you find a file in some folder like: im/af/on/ar/qr, or just some folders which are messy, and the file types are unknown for the computer. All those small things give me the excuse to stay at Windows Mobile. Simply cause we can download music files and play it, simply cause there is great development on it, simply cause it can be customized how we want it.
Cool story bro
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d12unk13astard said:
Cool story bro
Sent from my HTC Glacier using XDA Premium App
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Good job. That must have taken some serious thought to come up with.
This is something I 100% agree with.
When I had a Samsung Moment, I had problems galore with it. Keyboard wouldn't type, horrible support, and the big network lockup. Mind you, a network lockup where you can't call out to anyone is against FCC laws. But just to get some type of damn support for the thing, I almost had to root it. And I'm sorry, but I shouldn't have to depend on an online community for support for a phone when the carrier and manufacturer of the phone should be doing that. What the hell is the point in buying the phone and paying damn near $70 a month if I can't use the damn thing?
Let's also talk about performance of the Moment and how unoptimized it was. The Moment uses the same SoC found in the Iphone 2g, and 3g. The only difference, stock 2g and 3g SoC is 600 mhz, clocked down to about 422 mhz for battery, while the Moment was 800 mhz. Both arm11 cpu cores. The Iphone 2g and 3g despite having almost half the clocked frequency of the Moment, was smoother and had actual hardware support and acceleration. Even this day, Samsung still does not have proper hardware support for the SoC being used in the Moment, Intercept, Transform, Spica, etc etc.
If done right, Android is pretty awesome I'll admit. But if I want a phone to work, I'll get something that actually works.
big advantage of android, but also a weakness:
it works well on many devices, but its not optimised for the spezific hardware of each phone...
gosualex said:
big advantage of android, but also a weakness:
it works well on many devices, but its not optimised for the spezific hardware of each phone...
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Good understanding
I love android because I love to tinker. Nothing could ever change my mind short of the os aging. I will say this flaws or not I refuse to give apple my money. So it's either wp7 or android.
My words to live buy if I can't hack it I don't want it. Just my 2cents
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I would agree iPhones support is a lot longer no network changes added, updates can brick the phones though.
Android need some love. Fragmentation. Networks slow to update. Ui 's being to sluggish to update the phone to higher levels.
All android phones should be aosp no extras from makers or networks.
Love my cm7/miui.us phone but most people would want to flash it or know how to. They would just think might as well get an iPhone.
Just my feelings. I own apple computers. Custom built pcs android phones had iPhones I still use an iPod touch in the kitchen as you can get the best speaker docks for them. Use what works best for the situation.
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Android security warning !!
I think android is the best system, but its very insecure if you let it on stock and don't secure it, root it, get rid of some apps and optimize it.
Did you know that a normal app with all permissions can get all your data?
-gps location
-contacts
-logs
-screenshots
-hidden camerashots
-sms/mms
-emails
-photos
-etc
BELIEVE IT OR NOT, THIS IS FACT !!!
There was a test in germany, where a developer made a app with all the rights to do the things above and send them hidden in the backround to a specified server to that he had access. So he could read and see all the things above and it was even updating immidiatly after a new sms or something came in and the testuser who installed it had no clue at all and was shocked when they told it to her.
The App itself was just making photos with a black censor stripe in the eyes and it seemed that it never could do that, but all the real action is going on in the backround.
By the way, he sayd it was very easy and many apps could do that and most of them really do that.
And what I know, many of you don't know or don't care and spread all your information to some companys that like to have them alot. And they allways want more.
Maybe you should spread this information by quoting this post or linking to it, because many people don't like to be ripped of their information.
Or do you like it, when someone is standing close to you and listens all what you say to your friends, when you have a private conversation ? I think not!
check out my signature also.
and be safe!
edit: i think i should post this as a new thread!
Great post, good read!!
Hard to say any mobile OS is perfect. But the world of mobile OS is developing quickly in recent years.
Haven't played extensively with Android and IOS. Currenly, I still think IOS is more polish. Android definitely have a lot of features and I am looking forward to where they take the OS to in the future. It seems like it's an OS that has a lot of support and has had to "grow up" really rapidly.
I actually agrer with everything in this post. Fact is the best technology in the world is technology that is stable, works, and allows the user to complete what ever task is needed.
Last night it was decided my wife and I are switching to verizon why? Cause the wife wants IOS and I am more partial to android and BB and thats the only carrier that has all 3.
Now to add on what was already said I think google needs to pick one manufacture purchase them then do exactly what apple does marry the hardware amd software together to get rid of what can be a problematic OS simply cause with some manufactures android is worse then on others.
Sent from my SPH-P100 using XDA App
(•.•) said:
I think android is the best system, but its very insecure if you let it on stock and don't secure it, root it, get rid of some apps and optimize it.
Did you know that a normal app with all permissions can get all your data?
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You give apps on an iphone or WM phone permissions to do these things too right, so this is a more general problem in the new mobile world...
BTW, I like you're post LiquidSolstice, you could almost call it a fact, it's not that the one is better than the other. It's just that they are different and the majority of people likes easy and simple...
I agree with alot of what LS mentions in the first post. My wife is one of those who could really care less about rooting, overclocking, mem management, or even what version of Android she is using for that matter. She just wants to be able to send that text without the keyboard "hicupping", or to make that phone call without the dialer lagging, etc. I like Android, but I don't like Google's.. well let's say "less than kosher" business practices and corporate involvements. I think a big point to remember is that there will always be people like us that get a huge kick out of toying with electronics. For some, it's a hobby, for others, a career. With that being said, there will also always be those doofies that get on sites like this one and annoy the living crap out of you. Everything needs to be taken in stride, and though there are those who appear to be clueless on a subject, always remember that we all have to learn somehow. Knowledge is not obtained through osmosis.
Android feels like a permanent beta. I prefer iOS for simple tasks plusSbsettings is unmatched. WP7 seems more like a feature phone, it doesn't tell you 'I'm smart.'
I mostly agree
I don't think the problem with android is really the fact that more than one company is involved in developing phones for android. The problem is that those companies, (OEMs & carriers) have been given way to much freedom to decide not only what processor & RAM the phone would have but to put their "stamp" on android. I think the blame for that partially falls on Google for not putting a stop to OEMs & carriers putting their bloatware on phones. Google has been asked multiple times to do something about the "fragmentation" issue & they've refused, so ultimately they are partly responsible for the "mess" android has become.
tsaxda said:
I don't think the problem with android is really the fact that more than one company is involved in developing phones for android. The problem is that those companies, (OEMs & carriers) have been given way to much freedom to decide not only what processor & RAM the phone would have but to put their "stamp" on android. I think the blame for that partially falls on Google for not putting a stop to OEMs & carriers putting their bloatware on phones. Google has been asked multiple times to do something about the "fragmentation" issue & they've refused, so ultimately they are partly responsible for the "mess" android has become.
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Well, carrier "bloat" --I put that in quotes because the current three major skins bring much needed features to Android (whether or not the execution is done well or not is a different argument)-- isn't quite what's killing it, it's the time spent optimizing the hardware for Android.
Android gets slapped on as many devices as possible and then sold as a low end affordable smartphone, and that's the issue, but that's the essence of Android at the same time.
ZeGuitarist said:
Excellent post. Would read again.
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+1 Outstanding post. Completely agree.