School project, please take this quick survey

School project, please take this quick survey - General Topics

http://www.surveymonkey.com/s.aspx?sm=4u_2bOh_2bpZw_2bi6kapzFi_2bZHw_3d_3d
answer as if there has been no customization to the phones. i have to do a report on which cellphone would be best for a business and i'm breaking it down by OS first then looking at hardware then carrier. if you have any questions or suggestions, please post.
thank you
EDIT:
i have to do a business report which selects which phone would be best for businesses and sales people. i decided to look at features of each smartphone OS first because, WM has the best document editing i think, where iphone has the easiest functionality, so i would weigh the pros and cons of each OS from a business standpoint (so iphone having games means nothing, stuff like that). then after an OS is chosen, if it ends up being WM or BB, i will look into phones, which has the best hardware pretty much. then see which carrier has the best plan for that phone. and then my report would have the best OS, phone, and plan for the price all presented in a business proposal.
if you need anymore information just ask. thanks again.

looks to me that iphone is best for UI and games and music, winmo takes the rest
did the survey

Done the survey and while WM is good, BB wins hands down for mobile email and out of the box security, it was what it was designed for.

Done the survey
May I ask what is the intention of it?

If you would post the intent of the survey I'd reckon that alot more people would do it. I'll do it just for the nostalgia of school though

thanks everyone. i'll put more into the first post about what it's for.

OK, now you have explained the details a wee bit better I think it's going to end up a choice between BB and WM.
Have a look at this thread BB/WM/iPhone head to head where someone else on this forum is doing similar from a different viewpoint.

thanks. i thought it would be BB and WM without researching because iphone is more play and isn't really for work. android has all the potential to be the best, but only when the apps are developed, where BB and WM are built with business in mind.

It's going to boil down to the need to edit documents, which WM does and BB doesn't, or a very secure email platform - the BB. There is also the question of will their email be initially handled inhouse and then pushed to the handheld?

it's funny, i didn't think that BB could edit word documents, and yet most people in my survey say BB has the best MS office options.

Related

Return to Mysterious Island

i realy want this game cracked but cant fin it can some one help me

Yes. Go buy it and I'll send you a crack!

LOL

hahahhha but no serious

serrious, go buy it

i thougt you guys could help me

you thought wrong.you are HelplessEver now...
soRry

do you now a funn and good quality game

Yeah! Return to the Mysterious Island - a very good game. You should definitely buy it!!!

do you hate me serius

Stop encouraging this guy by keeping his thread alive!!

Seriously, bestever, someone spent a lot of time and energy to create that game. Go buy it and show the programmer a little appreciation, rather than finding a cracked version and, basically, stealing.
How would you feel if you spent hours and hours and days and days writing a book, and you find a publisher and spend even more time - and lots of money, too - getting the book published, and as soon as it finds its way to the shelves, someone buys one, makes a gajillion photocopies of it, and started giving it free to everyone who asked. Suddenly you're not selling a single book - because everyone's getting it for free.
Wouldn't you be mad?
Seriously. Go buy the game if you like it that much.

You are joking, right?
I really find interesting everybody's opinion here, especially when considering the fact that all posts belong to a forum which is well known for it's illegal roms...
So, if I want a WM6 device I should buy one right? I shouldn't upgrade my old WM5 device, as by doing this I am not respecting the authors (aka programmers) of the new OS nor the producers (aka manufacturers) of the new devices. And they don't make profit anymore, as I don't have to buy a new device, since my old is upgraded. For example, my old Prophet runs on EXACTLY the same hardware as the Elf. But I don't have to buy the Elf anymore. Is that what your are telling us?
Great. Let's shut down this forum
The truth is that games & software are way too expensive. If they kept the prices in reasonable limits then we wouldn't consider cracking them...

i think booth have right in somewais
sorry for bad english

dj_aris said:
I really find interesting everybody's opinion here, especially when considering the fact that all posts belong to a forum which is well known for it's illegal roms...
So, if I want a WM6 device I should buy one right? I shouldn't upgrade my old WM5 device, as by doing this I am not respecting the authors (aka programmers) of the new OS nor the producers (aka manufacturers) of the new devices. And they don't make profit anymore, as I don't have to buy a new device, since my old is upgraded. For example, my old Prophet runs on EXACTLY the same hardware as the Elf. But I don't have to buy the Elf anymore. Is that what your are telling us?
Great. Let's shut down this forum
The truth is that games & software are way too expensive. If they kept the prices in reasonable limits then we wouldn't consider cracking them...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Actually, there's a difference here. If "bestever" wanted to get a copy of the game with developing in mind - maybe create a new game based on the same engine or something - then there wouldn't be a problem. This is xda-developers.com, where people collaborate to develop new software solutions for our smartphones and pdaphones. The developers post their creations so that the masses can download, install, and essentially beta-test them. It's an intellectual exercise, and if a few people just download WM6 (for example) just for their own personal use, that's okay, the developers here don't seem to mind.
The game in question, however, was designed and is marketed as for-profit. The developer spent a lot of time and energy creating that software. If he spent a total of 40 work hours programming, editing, compiling, testing, reprogramming, and fixing bugs in this game and sold it for 20 bucks, he's making 50 cents an hour. He'd have to sell 15 copies just to hit minimum wage.
If bestever wanted to get a copy of the game to use it as a template to design his own, that's fine. At least with me. But he just doesn't want to pay for it. There's a word for that - "stealing".
On top of all that, the programmer of the game in question is not a bloodsucking monopolistic corporation worth billions of dollars and doing everything possible to squeeze every last red cent they can out of the average Earth-dweller. Whatever issues I may have with people and their illegal software downloads comes to a halt when I reach Microsoft. I don't like them, I don't like the way they do business, and I think they deserve what they get. The only reasons I use Windows PCs is because they're industry standard anymore, and I grew up using them long before I developed any sense of politics - I started at age 6 with Win3.1. The only reasons I use a Windows Mobile device is because of the huge third party app support, vastly superior abilities compared to your garden-variety cell phone, and the prohibitive cost (and lack of third party support) behind the iPhone.
If the developer of the game wanted it to be free, he'd be distributing it freely. If you like the game that much, show the developer some support and PAY FOR THE GAME. Otherwise, the game might not even exist.
I won't argue with you that the cost of games and software is way too expensive. I don't want to pay over 200 bucks for an operating system for my computer, but I don't know crap about Linux, whereas I'm very proficient in Windows (2k, XP, 2k3S, etc.) But here's the rub, and in order to be properly understood you have to be completely honest with yourself. If money wasn't a problem, if instead of making 25k/year you were making 250k/year, would you still be cracking software, or would you be buying it?

Alright guys. Let's all take a deep breath here. The age-old question of warez, and cracks and hacks won't get answered here.
If there are any moderators in sight, please delete this thread, It is totally off-topic, and should never have been allowed to propagate.

sorry for starting this

A Thread to praise winmo (even though it has limitations)

after a long time being here ive noticed far too many threads moaning about the ugly interface and limitations of winows mobile
so i thought id start one that encourages new members to appreciate what we have
we have a mobile operating system that lets us do more than any other. emails on the go, internet sharing, fully customisable and the feature of being able to install unsigned software and work around compatability issues. and as far as looks go its noi uglier than a pc so we really cant complain. and i still hear about comparisons to the iphone now ill be the first to admit its a prett thing but after owning three winmo devices im never going to another, just because there are more possibilties than anything available
which brings me to this community and its part, my first device was a heavily branded spv m5000 (universal) and i really wasnt interested in flashing it or downloading because i didnt know about this community. then i got a kaiser and signed up for xda devs and have never seen so much appreciation for a mobile operating system and its features. in fact the only hangup i had was xda didnt cater for non htc devices, this was a bit of a niggle when i got the omnia. but ive still been welcomed and also decided to create a forum in the same manner as xda that caters for all winmo devices (see my sig)
so basically lets stop telling people what we think we should have and be greatful that we have the best mobile operating system available that seems to get better along the way with communities such as this one
cheers j
nb i know it seems a bit pointless posting a new topic about windows mobiles advantages but its better than another thread wishing it looked like an iphone

except windows mobile is dying and developement is drying up. Not only has the iphone outsold all wm devices worldwide but it actually has MORE apps now and more active development.
I too love WM and detest the limitations of the iphone, but sadly I must call a spade a spade

yeah it has just now. but development will pick up again. and i think the reason the iphone is doing so well is becauseits nice to look at. but they forget iphone has mass limitations

jayjay8585 said:
yeah it has just now. but development will pick up again. and i think the reason the iphone is doing so well is becauseits nice to look at. but they forget iphone has mass limitations
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
but most of iPhone users are not hackers like peeps in xda or generally in windows mobile devices. they just like the fact that it is easy to use and doesn`t even realize it`s fails etc. I just wish that wm7 will bring those iphone users to us.

when peopolemfinally reaslise the iphones limtitations then they should come by them selves. if theyre r worried about interface. ifonz, but see we have the option of a pretty shortcut menu or pc looking interface ythey get the one and only that one

doubt very much iphone ipod touch got more apps then windows mobile
if people google <insert program name> pocketpc there are always hits
piles of freeware progs and games
but granted it's easier for people who pref not to use
google to find applications in app store

jayjay8585 said:
when peopolemfinally reaslise the iphones limtitations then they should come by them selves. if theyre r worried about interface. ifonz, but see we have the option of a pretty shortcut menu or pc looking interface ythey get the one and only that one
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yah, but that is the problem. They have to install stuff to get it clean lookin etc.

yeah but the point is we have the choice we can install m2d and ifonz wad and throttle launcher they cant
the one word thatll piss every iphone user off
FULL CUSTOMISATION

jayjay8585 said:
yeah but the point is we have the choice we can install m2d and ifonz wad and throttle launcher they cant
the one word thatll piss every iphone user off
FULL CUSTOMISATION
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Well, that is also so true, but it would be good if Windows Mobile would be as easy to use in the beginning like iPhone is. It took me time to get inside WinMo and now I love it, but iPhone is easy-to-use instantly or maybe this is just me
but the full customization is Windows Mobile`s greatest side and iPhone can`t compete on that side God I still wish that we had something like iTunes Store for Windows Mobile provided by xda

jayjay8585 said:
FULL CUSTOMISATION
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
care to explain how you can change the icons of the apps displayed when you Start > Programs or Start > Settings

i myself dont kno but after flashing hyperdragonsr rom onto my old kaiser theyre different so we know it possible
at the end of the day if winmo was so easy to set up and just use xda devs would be replaced with apps to be bought from microsoft for a fee then like apple sdks would have to be bought
although apps on appstore are free. well some of them developers still have to pay for the right to develop. winmno rules
and another note the whole taking time to set up winmo to be the you like it, thats what customisation is all about, and the fact that we delve so deep is the reason this haven exists

Yeah I agree about taking winmo to where I want is that loved customization side of it.
but for casual users it is like dancing on the graves and then they go and buy iPhone which a monkey can use -.-" but winmo still pwns it. no matter of what.

One other important aspect that is not being mentioned is that fact that the iphone had great advertising. The whooped and hollered it up and every one wanted one. I have friends who have the iphone and after a period of time they want more but due to no customization they can't. They are then jealous of my WM Device. Granted MS sucks a lot, because it appears they don't listen to what people want, but to me that is a great thing. Because of that we have XDA-Dev and all the wonderful programs. If it was up to me, keep is simple Microsoft and let the community build on it. The other fact is I hate (did I already say hate) itunes. AAC is a great format but the limitations of only being able to play on certain devices and having to sync with your computer and stuff. To much hassle and not enough freedom. My iphone friends agree, now that they see how quickly I can sync, move data and upload/download what I want as opposed to what I'm being told I can.
Just my two cents.
Let the flaming begin!!!

Just about right said:
One other important aspect that is not being mentioned is that fact that the iphone had great advertising. The whooped and hollered it up and every one wanted one. I have friends who have the iphone and after a period of time they want more but due to no customization they can't. They are then jealous of my WM Device. Granted MS sucks a lot, because it appears they don't listen to what people want, but to me that is a great thing. Because of that we have XDA-Dev and all the wonderful programs. If it was up to me, keep is simple Microsoft and let the community build on it. The other fact is I hate (did I already say hate) itunes. AAC is a great format but the limitations of only being able to play on certain devices and having to sync with your computer and stuff. To much hassle and not enough freedom. My iphone friends agree, now that they see how quickly I can sync, move data and upload/download what I want as opposed to what I'm being told I can.
Just my two cents.
Let the flaming begin!!!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I hope this wont turn on a flame war
yeah, Apple`s advertising sure beats wm devices ad`s. haven`t seen a single Diamond / Touch Pro ad and I see atleast three iPhone adverts in a day at tv.

guess thats because apple is iphone and virsa versa
where wm is a os that anybody can make phones using
so should htc make adds for a ms product or
should ms make adds for a htc product ?

HTC should advertise their devices I wonder what would be results if Diamond would be as advertised as iPhone :s

Thanks for starting this thread. There is so much talk about how terrible winmo is, but personally I think its great. Sure out of the box it isn't the most user friendly device, but you can customize your phone however you want with a large array of diffent programs that allow for 'prettier' graphics and a much more user friendly interface. Its too bad development is slowing down, but I understand why. I just hope that WM7 can step up the ms game and get people interested again.
One more thing. I have a friend with a 3G iPhone. He is so die hard about it and is convinced everything else is so far inferior. Well, the other day I showed him the customization of my phone, dual booting android, and smoked him in download and internet speeds and suddenly he didn't seem so sure about his iPhone. He thought active sync was the coolest thing, I had to remind him that this was present on winmo phones for many years and is not an iphone development. I think a big issue is advertising, smart phones and ppcs are NEVER advertised on television. You may see ads for an Instinct or a Razor, but never for a Vogue, Kaiser, Diamond etc.
Anyhow, great thread. Winmo rocks.

of course it does because as we kno its has limitations but because of forums like this thre not a lot. and less work than symbian

Again, How is WM More customizable than the other platforms??
Custom Roms (Treo's and iPhone)
3rd party apps (Symbian, Treo, iPhone)
Ability to run Unsigned Code (All three again)
MS is as evil as any other company.
Flashing custom Roms(CID unlock/Hard SPL) seems easy to you because of hard work of folks here.
And should i remind you that MS/HTC haave in the past tried to shut this site down???

I hate to break it to alot of you guys, but the sub culture of the jailbroken iPhone community is much more in depth and techy than many of you think.
Windows Mobile is still my preferred OS mainly because I've been using it for so long, but I do own an iPhone 3G. Just like I've been ripping apart my WM phones for awhile with the information received here, so do I with my iPhone and it's batch of web sites. You'd be amazed at some of the stuff they've got going. Full customization of every aspect of the phones graphics, a video recorder that shoots ultra clear video (this, after years of suffering with my HTC camera software), a wealth of Apple-unapproved third party apps, system tweaks (like Safari Mobile tweaks that allow us to download, copy and paste, etc.), and more.
I do and always will love Windows Mobile, but we HAVE to remember that most of us hated WM right out of the box, otherwise we wouldn't be here. Likewise, my iPhone failed to interest me much when I first got it, yet the current generation of Jailbreaking has really opened it up.
The grass is green on both sides of the fence. I used to bash the iPhone and it's users just like everybody else, but now that I speak from experience I have come to see that the two OS's are much more alike than we realize.
The way I see it, there is no reason for me to be blindly loyal to one OS. When I started buying WM devices, I didn't sign up for some strange Microsoft regime, and likewise for Apple. We can have both, and use them as the mood strikes us.
EDIT: Oh, and don't even get me started on the touch screens...we really need some capacitive love on WM touch screens...

What do you think about the new WinMo 7?? Like or Not?

UPDATE: Thanx for participating in the poll but kindly leave a small comment along with it. Thanx
When we say Windows Mobile, what is the first thing that comes to your mind? Emmmmm…
Extensive Customization!! - True
Multi Tasking!! - True
Copy Paste!! - True
External SD Card!! – True
Humongous Application and Easy Installation!! - True
Boring but we got UI replacements!! - That is true aswel
And we love that don’t we. That is because it has something that no other Mobile OS had before.
Well lets hear it from you people..
Was this what you were looking for? Or is it no where even close?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
To read more go here - Windows Phone 7 might really die before its even Out?
Lets hear what you guys have to say.

what about love it hate it..u should add a poll but im getting 1 when they come out

It has new **** so i might as well love it.

hmmm. lets see how much we can crack open this os..

looks outdated visually boring like all things microsoft lately. The official statement appears to be Manufacturers will also be restricted to the smart tile user interface so not a smart move when you compare with the Android System.

I'm not worried about losing the freedom that we have on WinMo - I'm confident that the community here will find a way - and a great way, at that - to allow everyone to get what they want out of WP7, or the way I put it to my friend: I'm sure XDA-Devs will have there way with WP7.

I like the look and feel alot!!
But somehow I fear we will loose all our custimisazion possibilities...like custon ROM's simple apps, Registry tweaks, etc...
But lets see...

Like it quite a bit, seeing some great potential there.
I'm happy to see Microsoft used the Zune interface as guideline as many, including myself, liked the interface and where "hoping"/"seeing" the possibility of a phone entry to the Zune's menu structure. In this case Microsoft went further even and expanded on that UI just like i feel the Zune interface is an expanded/further developed titanium UI. Thank god we get rid of Touchflo/Sense finally, always hated it, but that's just my personal opinion ofc.
Next to that the new zoom/rendering/cleartype is very nice and a great addition to any OS.
Personally i dont care too much about all the social networking features as i hardly use them myself and suspect europeans overall use these less than americans. However i like the widespread intergration of these things, from the photo app, the Me tile etc. to the automatic selection of contact information.
Hope our great dev's and myself here at XDA will figure out the inner workings of it and be able to polish it to our liking.
my two cents for now

Wait to see how much the new OS is far to customizations, I belive that here at XDA we can hack again but why the no Power user can't? I don't complain with this new Apple/like orientation.
Hope it's not like it seems
[email protected]

Looks good to me. It is what I was expecting from a new OS. It isn't just rehashing and repackaging old ideas. I just hope there will be a call manager available for it

It looks good and advanced.
The only fear is that microsoft will go the apple way and cut the developments........
If m$ has not done that there is not better company !
If m$ has done that ( and done successfully ! ) its a sad day for XDA community.
Hope for the best be prepared for the worst !
Jump over to android if m$ has backstabed us

OS is just an OS. The application is more important.
If all the application needs to rebuild, I will simply go for android.
Why should I pay for an OS, when the efforts in the industry is now to be open source? What makes the os distictive are efficiency, multitask, free of dead lock ....But not UI.
If windows phone could make application runs on my HD lighting fast, I might go for it.
It is definetly the end to charge for a mobile OS. Will the greedy M$ make it free for us? If not, it is likely the end of wm.

Good UI, but too sad if we loose all stuff cooked over this forum....

windows 7 plays around microsoft services! buy only if u need these services

Now i understand why microsoft is not completely burying their 6.5.x series development
WM7 at its present state is not for me or for business people.
It is for Iphonish common consumers.
I was expecting WM7 to be an OS with same functional menus & functionalities as previous versions but UI but built on silverlight with zune & Xbox integration. Such a thing would have made WM7 to appeal all types of customers.
Its sad that micrsoft has decided to go in a rather commercial way as apple.
Unless WM7 supports custom skinning like Sense or Mobile shell, i don't think microsoft is going to win here.

They Need You
Years ago, in the dark ages, I was given a prototype computer from Europe to work with and redesign it if necessary. It was necessary. With some skill and a lot of luck I rebuilt a great computer for its time. The American company who owned the European rights to this computer was sinking $200 million into making this machine work for the US market. I was an independent designer (who had already upgraded this computer) and this large company did not want to listen to me or even give me anything for my work. So I never turned over the secrets to them but I wrote software for it for my software company. They worked on this computer for another 8 months and finally solved the problems. In the end, because other companies (like Commodor) beat this computer (that was way ahead of the others) to market, this great machine never caught on. The other computers weren't better but they were first and now were being used by the public. The company who would not sign a contract with me, lost their shirts in their computer division. The company was Timex.
I feel this may be the same problem with Windows mobile. Yes, they have terrific engineers but they should also look to you all on sites like this one to really get new ideas and advice. Because of this site and the programmers on it, my WM 6.1 OS has blown away even phones with snapdragon processors. I hope WM doesn't become a third rate OS because of their not listening to people like you on this site.

too little is revealed on the presentation, to me at least. i dont use social networking nor LIVE service (i do have XBOX360). i need a good organizer, customizable layout, multitasking, and NOT iphone alike!

WP7S seems to be too stripped down, compared to current WM versions. The press conference didn't go into detail, but I fear the highly customizable OS we came to know is a thing of the past - which is a bad thing imo.
But luckily Android is becoming a nice alternative.

the problem for ms is that so far most apps since pocketpc2000 works on our devices so if we can suffer the UI there are tons of apps free and paied you can use
leaving that would mean that android and even nokia n900 (also linux based) are already way ahead of ms in terms of apps and getting fancy games running also a thing ms say is not the aim of wm7 from the rumours i read say and if thats the case the no good gaming options
then iphone / ipod touch are also ahead of them
so far ms had pretty good development res for their mobiles being .net and microMFC as core techs
where iphone / ipod touch required you to buy a mac to make apps which given apples market % few developers had
not sure about how good the symbian/android/n900 development tools are
as an sdk is not really enough to make a good IDE

to be honest i find it pitifully bad.
as i was expecting it too be as soon as the words "stop, thinking off it as a pc, its a phone" came put right near the start.
no matter how much bull and spin and pr hype they put on it its a list based os. list after list after list...
this isn't really what people want is it?
I was really hoping for innovation instead its gone back 8 years.
forget windows phone, its gone windows dumb phone

Would HTC ever make a Phone for WebOS, now that Palm bought by HP?

I am probably not considering something very obvious, such as "focus", but with the news that HP has now bought Palm, rescuing the highly praised webOS from a premature death, would HTC --- do you think --- ever make a webOS smartphone?
Aren't they playing it rather cool at the moment re Windows Phone? -- with some speculation that Microsoft's lockdowns would prohibit things like SenseUI, thereby giving reason to question "why make phones at all for Windows?" ... So, with that thought floating around, I'm just not familiar with the proprietary relationships between Palm and its device manufacturers.
Someone help me out here:
(1) Phone Manufacturers making devices for Android OS:
HTC
Motorola
Samsung
Sony
Acer
(Toshiba?)
( )
(2) Phone Manufacturers slated to make devices for WindowsPhone series 7:
??
(3) Phone Manufacturers who design phones for Blackberry:
?? (I don't know this market at all, but am curious)
(4) Phone Manufacturers who make phones currently for Palm (the Pre, Pixie)
?? again, i just don't know, have never followed this
(5) Phone Manufacturers who make phones for iPhone OS:
Apple
(some knock-off called Syphone, right? but does it actually run apple's OS?)

I'm pretty sure blackberry design its own phones.

Everyone (or at least most of them) you have listed up in the Android section is also making WP7 devices. Additionally also DELL. Nokia is also doing close business with Microsoft. It's a pity! They should rather jump on Android as well if they want to get out there alive

WalkingTaco said:
I'm pretty sure blackberry design its own phones.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Really? They have in-house product design, or do they contract it out secretively and just brand every result a RIM device?
I know next to nothing about Blackberrys other than the hype about redundant servers and lots of reasons why they have been billed as the secure email solution for all these lawfirm and gopvernment types...
But once they went touchscreen, do they actually have a separate OS, or do they not distinguish between the hardware and software -- for marketing purposes so as not to confuse their customers about their core message of secure mesaging?
Followup since maybe you know a thing or two about blackberrys: the storm was a bust, right? At the time it was considered laughbalethat they could penetrate the casual consumer market.. but have they come back with better offerings in the touchscreen arena?
Do you see them always in some way presrving their core hardware philosophy of keyboard below screen, single orientatation vs rotate? ... or do you think they will try to move their diehard custimers toweard bigger screens like droid, and give them a slide out, flip out, fold over, or other kind of deployable hardware keyboard?
Just curiousabout your thoughts/

RAMMANN said:
Everyone (or at least most of them) you have listed up in the Android section is also making WP7 devices. Additionally also DELL. Nokia is also doing close business with Microsoft. It's a pity! They should rather jump on Android as well if they want to get out there alive
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Okay I figured that re WP7 device makers, since they came first and android was tapped next... But dell makes touchscreen devices? damn, i never knew that! Their marketing must be lousy.
Nokia keeps baffling me.
RAMMANN, I saw you commenting (i think ) in that " WP7 fail" thread, right, aren't you active in that?
Regardless: Help me understand this: I've never understood the Symbian OS or its market simply because i never had a symbian powered phone... But, isn't this correct -- about a year ago nokia bought symbian, right? But my recollection from back then -- which may be wrong -- was that they were going to kill it -- or simply use it as a proprietary OS in their own phones.
And yet... within that WP7 fail thread, numerous comments particularly at the start of the thread sang the praises of Symbian OS as the most efficient and best Open source OS out there -- with those praising it saying that, by contrast, ANdroid is a battery hog and ineffcient in its process managewment... The precise details are not so impt for what I want to knoiw:
Although I have known nothing about Symbian, the buzz, whenever i heard it mentioned over the past 5 years, was always positive... almost cult-like ... or rather "true believers" because it was that outstanding an OS...
So, if that is the case... and Nokia bought them, what WAS their plan? to give them respources to develop it further fortheir exclusive use, or what? The discussion confused me becasue it made it seem to me that it was still a very active OS outthere for developers to work with...
So what am I missing her.. it seems like I am missing the whole story. And re Nokia themselves... why are they always -- to my mind -- considered in an entirely different box or category from WM (i don;t like calling WP), Android, iPhone, WebOS, Blackberry? They never seem to get parity... The only time I hear or see Nokia mentioned is when someone wants to make a comparison about how inefficinet current phones are, and how their Nokia from 10 years ago could do virtually everything Phone X can do today (minus the big media player screen) with battery charge lasting 5 days, and stuff of that nature... or they mention the Nokia N900 as the best phone out there --- yet it rarely comes up in the big compariosn tests.
Why is that?
And does N900 run symbian OS? If so, is it marketed that way? [EDIT: OKAY I just read this part, so i see that answer is no: which begs the question AGAIN: why are devs here at XDA continuing to extoll the greatness of symbian ?? why?? Is it The Poor Little OS That Nobody Really Took The Time To Understand? or what??
EDIT: from a review contained in link above:
The main buzz about the Nokia N900 has centred on its operating system. Instead of the ageing Symbian S60 OS found in all Nokia's top end blowers, Espoo has opted for Maemo 5 instead. And we're pleased to say the results, as far as the OS is concerned, are every bit as good as we hoped. Maemo 5 is a far more intuitive OS than S60 and certainly edges out the N97 for ease of use. The menus are clear and straight forward, so you won't spend ages rooting around for what you want when you need it. It feels way more powerful too, with the Nokia N900 dealing with multitasking at lightning speed.
Click to expand...
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And finally, this statement:
Nokia is also doing close business with Microsoft. It's a pity! They should rather jump on Android as well if they want to get out there alive
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First off, how are they collaborating? Are they not in direct competition with head-to-head OS ?
... Were you alluding to more of a case of Nokia hooking up with the wrong contender for SURVIVING ALONG WITH IPHONE -- Windows vs Android? -- or were you alluding to Nokia having company stability problems like Palm was having, heading straight inot the tank -- before rescued last second by HP?
I know these are lots of questions -- but it's because I see the events of Palm's acquisition as being way more significant than others might see. And so it has promoted all these questions... yes... about survival as consumers start to select in the next year which touchscreen platforms start to go away because they just can't compete anymore, lacking sufficient differentiation or value proposition.
Any answer -- even if to just one of my 50 questions -- would be valued! thank you

I don't know what you are all asking, but trying to answer....
I never had Symbian device, nor do I really know a lot about the openess of the OS. From what I heard it was very open in the beginning (maybe similar to Windows Mobile?) but then suddenly lots of viruses began to spread and the Symbian OS got locked down. I think it's a similar Sandbox approach like on Android. Though I can't really say this is correct, it's only what I heard from people, so far I never did any research on my own.
Nokia jumpin on WP7 instead of Android, I took a piss on it because I think WP7 sucks. Currently it's not even sure the OS will be successful. Android already is.
That's all.... really nothing to worry about or put a lot of thoughts into

design != produce
htc produce devices for others and design for others or at least used to
apple, ms.... don't produce their hardware they design it and have others produce it

quicksite said:
Apple
(some knock-off called Syphone, right? but does it actually run apple's OS?)
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It doesn't. The old ones used to run Nucleous Plus OS. I heard some versions are running android / windows 6.1 now.

Real quick, too much to read. I know BlackBerry is owned by RIM. I think they actually manufacture it and distribute it. I don't know if you were asking about RIM or just knew nothing about BlackBerrys.
And why companies operate with Microsoft: money.

Thanks for the answers.
So Blackberry makes Blackerrys. check.
Nokia to work with MS because of money. Okay.
HTC produces devices platform owners prescribe, ie to match the WM hardware and OS specs and Android hardware and OS specs.
I ask too many questions, I'll admit that. But my two main ones remain unaswered, not even close. (still, why can't people take 10 minutes occasionally for some big picture thinking, why is everything reduced down to twitter chatter?
(1) My thread topic question -- no one has even taken a stab at it. Who currently makes the phones that run webOS? i.e., who made the Pre and Pixie. ... with HP's acquisition of Palm, do you see HP wanting to exclusively manufacture Palm devices? ... or do you see them having any interest in having more device choice by asking HTC to develop phones for webOS. That's my main question. My guess is: no one knows. fair enough.
(2) My 2nd main question was what Nokia's plans for Symbian were. ANd could someone sort out the mixed message? At that "Windows Phone 7 epic fail" thread, various XDA-devs sing the praises of Symbian as a better OS than android, way more efficient. .. Then I read the review for the Nokia N900 and it says Nokia jettisoned Symbian as outdated. So wtf are people talking about re SYmbian then? And does it have a future?
RELATED: In the Touchscreen OS Wars of 2010-2011, it looks like webOS will live to see another day, WP7 will likely survive and thrive in its enterprise market niche or wherever the hell their niche turns out to be. iPhone OS survives. Android survives -- and yet -- you read some online magazines and people love to speak of market fragmentation already happening with Android, and that it's already spelling doom and gloom for Android yadda yadda... I think though that is true re the 2.1 vs 1.5. 1.6 version problems and Google ought to get their act togeher, Android , unless they misstep, is here to stay.
But will Blackberry have and be a touchscreen OS, or a platform Blackberry builds off of, or will it be phased out?
And what of Symbian? Is it in effect dead now in terms of a platform for mainstream consumer devices?

quicksite said:
(1) My thread topic question -- no one has even taken a stab at it. Who currently makes the phones that run webOS? i.e., who made the Pre and Pixie. ... with HP's acquisition of Palm, do you see HP wanting to exclusively manufacture Palm devices? ... or do you see them having any interest in having more device choice by asking HTC to develop phones for webOS. That's my main question. My guess is: no one knows. fair enough.
RELATED: In the Touchscreen OS Wars of 2010-2011, it looks like webOS will live to see another day, WP7 will likely survive and thrive in its enterprise market niche or wherever the hell their niche turns out to be. iPhone OS survives. Android survives -- and yet -- you read some online magazines and people love to speak of market fragmentation already happening with Android, and that it's already spelling doom and gloom for Android yadda yadda... I think though that is true re the 2.1 vs 1.5. 1.6 version problems and Google ought to get their act togeher, Android , unless they misstep, is here to stay.
But will Blackberry have and be a touchscreen OS, or a platform Blackberry builds off of, or will it be phased out?
And what of Symbian? Is it in effect dead now in terms of a platform for mainstream consumer devices?
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I'm sorry, but your topic question is is very bold letters on wikipedia. Pal, Inc. is the manufacturer of the Palm Pixi. Almost every question you have related to who makes what is easiest thing to find on Google.
BlackBerry has a touchscreen OS. The BlackBerry Storm? Hello? BlackBerry is here to stay. It is very useful for office phones. My fathers work actually distributes those now instead of beepers. When you need a phone for nothing but e-mail and scheduling and nothing else - BlackBerrys are the best. Who knows about touchscreen as their not really trying to apply to teenagers and fashion freaks. They're trying to make a phone that's good for business - and their doing a very good job.
Android will always be here to stay. Trust me on this. There's nothing wrong with the market. If you did read that, it's just a rumor. Google has no reason to "get their act together." Android was just born, and it's getting developed fast. See, they could wait like Apple and make a new generation only every now and again, or shoot out updates rapidly. I like updates rapidly. =]

r3s-rt said:
I'm sorry, but your topic question is is very bold letters on wikipedia. Pal, Inc. is the manufacturer of the Palm Pixi. Almost every question you have related to who makes what is easiest thing to find on Google.=]
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Okay then, fine. That's the literal side of XDA that i find so unrefreshing. On the other hand, there are thousands to compensate for your snide attitude who recognize the underlying question is about impact of HP buying Palm and what ripple effects we might see.
Let me google that:
"ripple effects we might see due to HP buying Palm"
I'm sure it'll be fascinating, but in any event probably a lot more interesting than anything you've added here.
Chastising and pulling the old "use search" rubric is quite boring and indicative of a tunnelvision mind. But thanks for an answer at least.

quicksite said:
Okay then, fine. That's the literal side of XDA that i find so unrefreshing. On the other hand, there are thousands to compensate for your snide attitude who recognize the underlying question is about impact of HP buying Palm and what ripple effects we might see.
Let me google that:
"ripple effects we might see due to HP buying Palm"
I'm sure it'll be fascinating, but in any event probably a lot more interesting than anything you've added here.
Chastising and pulling the old "use search" rubric is quite boring and indicative of a tunnelvision mind. But thanks for an answer at least.
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Click to collapse
And that's what 90% of people at XDA find so unrefreshing. You ask a question (one very simple to answer) without trying to find it out yourself. Then you post a thread and when people respond with ideas, you INSULT THEM for not knowing! THEN, when we help for future reference, you INSULT?! You actually expect us to help you? Next time I see you, I'll be sure to kick you in the nuts and demand you take me out to dinner.
It's not like I even had to dig through Google!
http://www.google.com/webhp?hl=&sou...anufactures+palm&gs_rfai=&fp=84c7fb41710deb10
Very, very simple search with 10 results right there. Don't insult me because you're lazy or just that stupid.
edit: To your ripple effect remark:
http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&...after+buying+palm&aq=f&aqi=&aql=&oq=&gs_rfai=
DID THAT JUST WORK!? ZOMG!

For many of the questions you ask people can only answer with spectaculations, esp. thread title, so what would you expect? and btw this is usually a development forum
I personally don't understand the fragmentation issue people claim over Android. I don't have an Android phone and therefore never had a chance to access the market but from what I heard people with Android 1.6 don't see applications designed for 2.1 and sometimes vice versa. Actually that's a good thing because this way it is secured that you're not installing an app that doesn't work on your phone. And if developers are still active on such projects they will add support for future versions of Android and if they don't then their projects will die. That's also a good thing. This is better solved compared to WM. Imagine you have 6.5 and install applications designed for PPC 2003. Sometimes they work, sometimes not, sometimes they work but just look ugly (designed for stylus etc.)
Like I said before I can't tell this for sure, but probably an experienced Android user can confirm this or otherwise tell what's wrong....

RAMMANN said:
For many of the questions you ask people can only answer with spectaculations, esp. thread title, so what would you expect? and btw this is usually a development forum
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Click to collapse
Was this to me, or him? o.o
I personally don't understand the fragmentation issue people claim over Android. I don't have an Android phone and therefore never had a chance to access the market but from what I heard people with Android 1.6 don't see applications designed for 2.1 and sometimes vice versa. Actually that's a good thing because this way it is secured that you're not installing an app that doesn't work on your phone. And if developers are still active on such projects they will add support for future versions of Android and if they don't then their projects will die. That's also a good thing. This is better solved compared to WM. Imagine you have 6.5 and install applications designed for PPC 2003. Sometimes they work, sometimes not, sometimes they work but just look ugly (designed for stylus etc.)
Like I said before I can't tell this for sure, but probably an experienced Android user can confirm this or otherwise tell what's wrong....
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Click to collapse
I see plenty of 2.1 only apps in the market, and vice versa (from all the comments "Duuhhjuu doesn't run on my droid which isn't 1.6 even though you clearly say its for donut only duhhhjjuu" I wish this was true, and this is why many dev. actually stop developing.
And if it doesn't run - it doesn't run. You get a force close. If it runs - it runs.

r3s-rt said:
And that's what 90% of people at XDA find so unrefreshing. You ask a question (one very simple to answer) without trying to find it out yourself. Then you post a thread and when people respond with ideas,
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If you had any ideas about HTC ever manufacturing for webOS touchscreen operating system, i did not see them, for that was the question, and it's never been edited in the title.
you INSULT THEM for not knowing! THEN, when we help for future reference, you INSULT?!
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Honestly r3s-rt, I'm not sure where I see your help at all. Your interest was slapdown from the start, and you got called out on it, and people like you don't like getting called out on anything, so you get into anger mode, and "I'm so much smarter than you" mode. That's what I meant by annoying.
It's not like I even had to dig through Google!
http://www.google.com/webhp?hl=&sou...anufactures+palm&gs_rfai=&fp=84c7fb41710deb10
Very, very simple search with 10 results right there. Don't insult me because you're lazy or just that stupid.
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You are correct that there's a sub-question of the thread topic that is a simple known that a search engine would tell me. If I had posted a thread topic asking "hey guys, who manufactures the palm Pre", it would be relevant. The fact that its incidental to the core question of what change might be introduced by a culture change brought on by HP 's purchase of Palm mitigates your whole operatic theme of "look how quickly I found the answer!"...
edit: To your ripple effect remark:
http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&...after+buying+palm&aq=f&aqi=&aql=&oq=&gs_rfai=
DID THAT JUST WORK!? ZOMG!
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Click to collapse
Look, I can tell you think you are about the smartest guy on the planet, and perhaps you are. However, you are showing your oversensitivity to my comment about the twitterization of our culture 's attention span. I stand by that. "Too much to read" was you preface... That stung you. You didn't like that. So you wanted to slam. I understand that. I'm sorry if I hurt your feelings implying you had an impatiently short attention span.
If you DO happen to read this whole post, consider the following:
Here is a snapshot of your search results that allegedly answer the central question of this thread:
{
"lightbox_close": "Close",
"lightbox_next": "Next",
"lightbox_previous": "Previous",
"lightbox_error": "The requested content cannot be loaded. Please try again later.",
"lightbox_start_slideshow": "Start slideshow",
"lightbox_stop_slideshow": "Stop slideshow",
"lightbox_full_screen": "Full screen",
"lightbox_thumbnails": "Thumbnails",
"lightbox_download": "Download",
"lightbox_share": "Share",
"lightbox_zoom": "Zoom",
"lightbox_new_window": "New window",
"lightbox_toggle_sidebar": "Toggle sidebar"
}
The presence of search results on Google does not equal the opinions of XDA-dev members.
My thread question: Would HTC ever make a Phone for WebOS, now that Palm bought by HP? I think has relevance because there has been quite a lot of discussion since February and the preview of WP7 that HTC might not be so interested in making phones for WP7 given they would be, supposedly, prohibited from including any of the HTC SenseUI interface features they have been developing and improving over the years, from TouchFlo on WM to Sense on Android. Thus, if they were to be removed from the WP7 lineup, my question, sparked by the acquisition of palm by HP, was whether HTC might ever be asked to make phones for the webOS platform. It seems to me to be an interesting question to ask a forum founded around a company that started the touchscreen phone industry.
That is why there is such robust opinion on the 324 posts here on this thread thread WP7 is complete FAIL ... far more depth and insight than could be found by sequential readings from this for example:
The problem is: algorithms still do not replace humans, and much as I find your style of communication annoying, I would probably grow tired, on a desert island, of talking to an algorithm after a while and mush prefer talking to you than to it... much like Man in white and man in black on LOST.
But trust me I get it, you'd much rather be deemed right and thew winner than have a thoughtful speculation about the ripple effects of webOS being kept alive by HP's purchase of Palm. I'm really happy to hear of it. Palm threw a Hail Mary pass with their ground-up webOS and new Pre -- and it was really well reviewed, well- received, and to this day there is considerable praise for webOS. That it was about to die with palm's imminent death would have been too bad.
It will be interesting to see if Microsoft's Hail Mary pass can resuscitate its once dominant mobile platform.
General
Anything that involves all of the phones and doesn't fit in any of the other fora.
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(3) Phone Manufacturers who design phones for Blackberry:
?? (I don't know this market at all, but am curious)
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I know BlackBerry is owned by RIM. I think they actually manufacture it and distribute it.
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But will Blackberry have and be a touchscreen OS, or a platform Blackberry builds off of, or will it be phased out?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
BlackBerry has a touchscreen OS. The BlackBerry Storm? Hello? BlackBerry is here to stay. It is very useful for office phones. My fathers work actually distributes those now instead of beepers. When you need a phone for nothing but e-mail and scheduling and nothing else - BlackBerrys are the best. Who knows about touchscreen as their not really trying to apply to teenagers and fashion freaks. They're trying to make a phone that's good for business - and their doing a very good job.
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(4) Phone Manufacturers who make phones currently for Palm (the Pre, Pixie)
?? again, i just don't know, have never followed this
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Pal, Inc. is the manufacturer of the Palm Pixi.
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I was never here to help? You just got pissy because I simply pointed out that you refused to search, instead you depended on everyone else.
I ask too many questions, I'll admit that. But my two main ones remain unaswered, not even close. (still, why can't people take 10 minutes occasionally for some big picture thinking, why is everything reduced down to twitter chatter?
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There's where you insulted. If you didn't mean that as an insult, it certainly came off as one. However, as I don't use twitter, other than keeping up with companies, news, etc.; I wouldn't know about this twitter talk. I could possibly be wrong.
You called me out on nothing.
I'm sorry, but your topic question is is very bold letters on wikipedia. Pal, Inc. is the manufacturer of the Palm Pixi. Almost every question you have related to who makes what is easiest thing to find on Google.
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Click to collapse
That's the most "offensive" thing I could have said. Your response was:
Okay then, fine. That's the literal side of XDA that i find so unrefreshing. On the other hand, there are thousands to compensate for your snide attitude who recognize the underlying question is about impact of HP buying Palm and what ripple effects we might see.
Let me google that:
"ripple effects we might see due to HP buying Palm"
I'm sure it'll be fascinating, but in any event probably a lot more interesting than anything you've added here.
Chastising and pulling the old "use search" rubric is quite boring and indicative of a tunnelvision mind. But thanks for an answer at least.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
To which I said:
And that's what 90% of people at XDA find so unrefreshing. You ask a question (one very simple to answer) without trying to find it out yourself. Then you post a thread and when people respond with ideas, you INSULT THEM for not knowing! THEN, when we help for future reference, you INSULT?! You actually expect us to help you? Next time I see you, I'll be sure to kick you in the nuts and demand you take me out to dinner.
It's not like I even had to dig through Google!
http://www.google.com/webhp?hl=&sour...c7fb41710deb10
Very, very simple search with 10 results right there. Don't insult me because you're lazy or just that stupid.
edit: To your ripple effect remark:
http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&s...=&oq=&gs_rfai=
DID THAT JUST WORK!? ZOMG!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Now can you follow the conversation? You called me out on what where? I got angry where? I simple stated facts, and even got a humorous laugh out of this.
Here is a snapshot of your search results that allegedly answer the central question of this thread:
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http://www.marketwatch.com/story/sale-of-palm-looking-tougher-2010-04-29
^^ Also taken from my search results.
In a conference call with analysts, Bradley called H-P's $1.2 billion deal to buy Palm a "transformational deal." He noted the company's similar Silicon Valley backgrounds, and promised that H-P will invest "heavily" in Palm, and plans to expand the company's webOS into other devices beyond smartphones. He also said Jon Rubinstein, the CEO of Palm, plans to stay on. See H-P-Palm news story.
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http://gizmodo.com/5526620/hp-buys-palm-how-it-changes-everything
^^ Taken from my search results. Clearly covers your ripple effects.
Ohhh this one's a long one....
Worst Case Scenario
The real challenge might come in reconciling the brand personalities. Palm's products, regardless of how well they've sold, have always been innovative—the Pre was a breath of fresh air when it was released. HP, on the other hand, has tended to paint in broad beige strokes. And their products that do stand out, like the Envy laptop, have come across as derivative. There's also the unfortunate case of iPaq—another HP acquisition that was left to rot.
So will Palm fuel HP's creative capabilities? Or will HP stifle the ingenuity that's made Palm worth buying in the first place?
Best Case Scenario
HP has the resources to fully leverage Palm's software and hardware, and not just on smartphones. And while Palm's problem was never that it couldn't keep up with demand, its main issue—generating demand in the first place—is no longer a problem with HP's reach and marketing budget. HP's made a significant investment thus far in their TouchSmart interface, and while it's a fine skin it can only stand to gain from webOS insights. Can you say webOS tablet?
What May Happen
As for when we'll actually start seeing webOS in HP products, HP's being mum. It's reasonable to expect we won't hear anything more official until the transaction is complete, but there are some very clear paths they can (and probably will) take:
• Phones—Whither the iPaq? Ha, who cares! It's doubtful that HP would spend this kind of money on an established brand like Palm just to murder it in service of a flimsy brand like iPaq. HP's phone line has always been undistinguished, so for them to buy Palm is effectively to install a pre-made, well-regarded mobile division into their company. So, what does this mean in terms of actual phones?
There will probably be another generation of webOS phones. Yesterday, I wouldn't have felt certain about this; today, it's a good bet. Palm was living and dying by the Pre and Pixi, which were first-gen products running a first-gen operating system. HP's massive resources will give the OS the kind of time it needs to spread its wings on time-appropriate hardware. Imagine a webOS phone with WVGA resolution; with a Snapdragon processor; with a genuinely responsive interface. That's what we're talking about here. Forget the Pre Plus—it's time to start waiting for the Pre II.
The only awkward point here is that HP is an official partner with Microsoft for Windows Phone 7. They've committed to continue working with Windows Phone 7, although one might imagine that their interest in Microsoft's platform diminishes significantly now that they've got their own in-house mobile operating system.
• Computers—With this purchase comes a wealth of intellectual property (patents) spanning decades, much of which concerns touch interfaces. HP has been very, very aggressive in developing touch interfaces for Windows machines with its TouchSmart line, and could easily incorporate some of Palm's mobile tricks into its software. By and large, though, HP's expansive computer lineup will remain unchanged.
• Tablets—HP's tablet strategy is heading in a dangerous direction. The anticipated HP Slate runs Windows 7, a desktop OS, while much of the rest of the industry seems to have opted for mobile OSes. HP hasn't shown a ton of interest in Android in the past, and their tablet plans have so far ignored Google's OS—the presumed competitors to the iPad's iPhone-based OS. Which brings me to what is quite possibly the most exciting possibility here: The webOS tablet.
No, seriously—think about it. WebOS has a more intuitive interface than Android, and better notification system than anyone else, and prodigious social networking abilities. It has a fair amount of apps. It's compatible with the same mobile hardware that's powering many of the first wave of Android tablets. This—this—would be awesome.
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Now, do you really want to continue this flaming me for helping you? o.o

Sorry, I believe this deserves its own post:
But trust me I get it, you'd much rather be deemed right and thew winner than have a thoughtful speculation about the ripple effects of webOS being kept alive by HP's purchase of Palm. I'm really happy to hear of it. Palm threw a Hail Mary pass with their ground-up webOS and new Pre -- and it was really well reviewed, well- received, and to this day there is considerable praise for webOS. That it was about to die with palm's imminent death would have been too bad.
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H-P will invest "heavily" in Palm, and plans to expand the company's webOS into other devices beyond smartphones
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I hear an apology?
Oh, NO HTC will NOT be developing a phone with webos anytime soon. They may try, but that all ends up in HPs hands. If they're smart, and can keep webos on the right track, then no, don't expect to see it on an HTC phone anytime soon.

r3s-rt said:
Now, do you really want to continue this flaming me for helping you? o.o
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Click to collapse
Not flaming. But I will take issue with you because you are so heavily invested in being right, so much so that while you place your microscope upon certain pixels that excite you, you ignore, or just don't consider my question worthy of consideration.. which is your right, but why do you have to pollute my thread and take it totally off-topic -- to prove your prowess?
What is wrong with you.
The presence of search results on Google does not equal the opinions of XDA-dev members.
My thread question: Would HTC ever make a Phone for WebOS, now that Palm bought by HP? I think has relevance because there has been quite a lot of discussion since February and the preview of WP7 that HTC might not be so interested in making phones for WP7 given they would be, supposedly, prohibited from including any of the HTC SenseUI interface features they have been developing and improving over the years, from TouchFlo on WM to Sense on Android. Thus, if they were to be removed from the WP7 lineup, my question, sparked by the acquisition of palm by HP, was whether HTC might ever be asked to make phones for the webOS platform. It seems to me to be an interesting question to ask a forum founded around a company that started the touchscreen phone industry.
That is why there is such robust opinion on the 324 posts here on this thread thread WP7 is complete FAIL ... far more depth and insight than could be found by sequential readings from this for example:
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The quoted part above is what I care about. Not someone's story. Not someone's search results. That's not why Im part of XDA... As the Windows Phone 7 example should have amply shown... but again, pixels that didn't allow you to score. Such a tempest in a teapot.

quicksite said:
Not flaming. But I will take issue with you because you are so heavily invested in being right, so much so that while you place your microscope upon certain pixels that excite you, you ignore, or just don't consider my question worthy of consideration.. which is your right, but why do you have to pollute my thread and take it totally off-topic -- to prove your prowess?
What is wrong with you.
The quoted part above is what I care about. Not someone's story. Not someone's search results. That's not why Im part of XDA... As the Windows Phone 7 example should have amply shown... but again, pixels that didn't allow you to score. Such a tempest in a teapot.
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Please, read my last post then come up with an actual response. No more insults. You are just determined for me to insult you, aren't you?

[Q] For people who LIKE WP7 Only

I really like WP7, I recognise that it has some missing features but I am confident the se will be addressed with time. My concern is that anybody considering WP7 who reads this forum (or a plethora of other websites) could be easily put off by the negativity displayed by:-
1) Android/ IOS trolls
2) Disenchanted WM6.5 users who still want to spend their lives tweaking and cooking
Roms
3) People with an irrational fear of "the cloud".
4) Journalists who are desperate for MS to fail (because they are not Apple or Google
and thus not trendy!)
My question is, what can those of us who have faith in the platform do to balance the arguments a bit? I'm not talking about fanboism, I'm talking about expounding the positive features of WP7 like one note, like cloud sync, like the people hub, like the fast browser, like XBox integration for gamers (even though I do not use that much), like the easy access camera, like Zune and Zune Pass, like the fluid interface, like 25Gb of FREE Skydrive etc.
For example, I have a 16Gb HD7 with 25Gb skydrive means that to me I have a 41Gb device - more than my Ipad (see, I am platform agnostic).
If those of us who like WP7 do not actively support it, it will go the way of WebOS no matter how much Microsoft spend on their marketing budget.
WP7 is a revolution, let's get revolutionary about it!!!!

adesonic said:
I really like WP7, I recognise that it has some missing features but I am confident the se will be addressed with time. My concern is that anybody considering WP7 who reads this forum (or a plethora of other websites) could be easily put off by the negativity displayed by:-
1) Android/ IOS trolls
2) Disenchanted WM6.5 users who still want to spend their lives tweaking and cooking
Roms
3) People with an irrational fear of "the cloud".
4) Journalists who are desperate for MS to fail (because they are not Apple or Google
and thus not trendy!)
My question is, what can those of us who have faith in the platform do to balance the arguments a bit? I'm not talking about fanboism, I'm talking about expounding the positive features of WP7 like one note, like cloud sync, like the people hub, like the fast browser, like XBox integration for gamers (even though I do not use that much), like the easy access camera, like Zune and Zune Pass, like the fluid interface, like 25Gb of FREE Skydrive etc.
For example, I have a 16Gb HD7 with 25Gb skydrive means that to me I have a 41Gb device - more than my Ipad (see, I am platform agnostic).
If those of us who like WP7 do not actively support it, it will go the way of WebOS no matter how much Microsoft spend on their marketing budget.
WP7 is a revolution, let's get revolutionary about it!!!!
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Click to collapse
I'm with ya, WP7 brother. I try to do my part by telling it like it is, being the highest quality mobile OS yet released, but who knows if it is having fruitful effect.

I'm with you too
It may be missing some features but just by looking at it, you can see that once Microsoft does implement the missing features it will look a lot better than Android's.
It's the first OS that's actually impressed me ever since iPhone came out.
I liked Android but it felt unfinished and I felt that buying one was not a good investment, since by the next year they would stop handing out updates for it and they would release a device frequently.

Hell yeah! Let's do this thing!

you want to know the best way to promote windows phone? allow people to use it. i've shown my phone to virtually all my friends, and they all really like it. though they didn't use it for very long, they liked the capabilities of the OS in terms of smoothness, visual appearance, and functionality (well with what they played with).
i think we really just need to see MS continue to better the platform both on the phone side, but also on the developer side. they need to get the SDKs for all the hardware out asap, and then work on more SDKs that will bring features not yet on the market by any other maker. what could this be? who knows... but MS has enough in their coffers to find out, as well as enough R&D going on.

The Gate Keeper said:
you want to know the best way to promote windows phone? allow people to use it. i've shown my phone to virtually all my friends, and they all really like it. though they didn't use it for very long, they liked the capabilities of the OS in terms of smoothness, visual appearance, and functionality (well with what they played with).
i think we really just need to see MS continue to better the platform both on the phone side, but also on the developer side. they need to get the SDKs for all the hardware out asap, and then work on more SDKs that will bring features not yet on the market by any other maker. what could this be? who knows... but MS has enough in their coffers to find out, as well as enough R&D going on.
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Click to collapse
^this! I've already had one person wish they hadn't got a desire - let's keep this up!
You know what Microsoft need though right? A huge pr stunt in the US, UK, France, Germany etc. Just to catch the headlines and make sure that good things are said

+1. I'm very glad to have gotten this phone and once the first update is out I'll be even happier. All my friends who have been on the fence about a new phone have heard from me!

For me the WP7 is perfect in the sense that I am done with the whole power user/modding thing. I used to have a TP2 and tried a lot of ROMs but in the end I just wanted a phone that did two things i.e fluid and give me exactly the information I needed at a glance so I could get on with my life rather than tinker with it all the damn time. And this is where the WP7 serves me very well.
I see a lot of 6.5 users whining here but I truly wish they had done a bit of reading on the WP7 platform so they would know that the WP7 is going to be nothing like the 6.5 and I truly hope it never will be because MS will permanently lose me to android. I'm glad I gave WP7 a chance after reading up on it even though I had washed my hands off the WM platform after the 6.5 nightmare.
Probably the biggest reason I'm enjoying the WP7 is because I knew fully well before buying the phone what features to expect and what it won't have out of the box so that saved me the headache of buying first and then whining about it in these forums. I mean what part of 1.0 don't you understand? Personally I think the 6.5 fan boys are even worse than android fan boys. For me the 6.5 offers quantity over quality and I guess some people are fine with that but not me and that's why I chose WP7.

f1restarter said:
I see a lot of 6.5 users whining here but I truly wish they had done a bit of reading on the WP7 platform so they would know that the WP7 is going to be nothing like the 6.5 and I truly hope it never will be because MS will permanently lose me to android. I'm glad I gave WP7 a chance after reading up on it even though I had washed my hands off the WM platform after the 6.5 nightmare.
Probably the biggest reason I'm enjoying the WP7 is because I knew fully well before buying the phone what features to expect and what it won't have out of the box so that saved me the headache of buying first and then whining about it in these forums. I mean what part of 1.0 don't you understand? Personally I think the 6.5 fan boys are even worse than android fan boys. For me the 6.5 offers quantity over quality and I guess some people are fine with that but not me and that's why I chose WP7.
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Mm, the 6.5 people are really starting to piss me off. They seem to think that WP7 is a sequel to WM6.5 - which it quite obviously isn't. Microsoft are quite obviously trying to forget WM, as it was, and still is, total rubbish. At least the Android guys actually have a semi-decent OS to whine about :/

It Will Get Better.
adesonic you have my support ,just wait for the updates and be happy.

I agree with everything said. Winmo users hate it because they can't tweak it (though it doesn't need tweaks so you can actually use the phone instead of always trying to fix it).
Android users are complaining about how "closed" it is. I think android is the one that needs to worry. Android has climbed quickly due to it's "open" nature, which means its on more devices than any other OS. The problem being is that most of those devices are pure crap. There is definitely not an across the board experience on android. Hell, some devices are still on 1.5/1.6 of android. Fragmentation has exploded at a much higher rate than on winmo, which has started to lead to developer frustration because their apps don't run smoothly on all phones.
I see the really dedicated tweakers heading over to android, and people that only tweaked to make their phone run properly to switch to wp7. It will be a better overall OS in the next year than android.

f1restarter said:
For me the WP7 is perfect in the sense that I am done with the whole power user/modding thing. I used to have a TP2 and tried a lot of ROMs but in the end I just wanted a phone that did two things i.e fluid and give me exactly the information I needed at a glance so I could get on with my life rather than tinker with it all the damn time. And this is where the WP7 serves me very well..
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Click to collapse
Happy to see some people still face the reality. Thumbs up

I love my Omnia 7 as unlike 6.5 I have not yet reset the phone since I have purchased it and it's still running silky fast. And thank god for not having a task manager and just hitting the back button. I never want to go back to fiddling with my phone to try and get it running properly.

I had a G1 when it was first released and upgraded to a Desire. In my opinion, this is why WP7 will do better than Android has...
Peoples Reactions:
Desire: "Oh you have a HTC?"
HD7: "Oh you have one of them new Windows Phones?"
The point? People know what Windows Phone 7 is. The only reason why Android has been successful up to now (in the UK at least) is because people want a smartphone with apps. 90% of the people I know who have an Android device had no idea what Android was before they bought the phone (and some still don't really understand). Google do little to no marketing.
Soon people will walk into a shop looking for a HTC AND be further persuaded by Windows Phone.

brummiesteven said:
I had a G1 when it was first released and upgraded to a Desire. In my opinion, this is why WP7 will do better than Android has...
Peoples Reactions:
Desire: "Oh you have a HTC?"
HD7: "Oh you have one of them new Windows Phones?"
The point? People know what Windows Phone 7 is. The only reason why Android has been successful up to now (in the UK at least) is because people want a smartphone with apps. 90% of the people I know who have an Android device had no idea what Android was before they bought the phone (and some still don't really understand). Google do little to no marketing.
Soon people will walk into a shop looking for a HTC AND be further persuaded by Windows Phone.
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Click to collapse
i thought this was supposed to be a positive thread, specifically for wp7 ? it seems like just another comparison thread, or a "but we're doing good stuff now too!" thread.
anyway, i like the OP's idea of being a positive promoter. you may find it easiest to just start a youtube channel with your mission stated, and provide good tips, avoiding buzzwords, all while filtering the negative. people relate to a video demonstration of capabilities so very well.
good luck

brummiesteven said:
I had a G1 when it was first released and upgraded to a Desire. In my opinion, this is why WP7 will do better than Android has...
Peoples Reactions:
Desire: "Oh you have a HTC?"
HD7: "Oh you have one of them new Windows Phones?"
The point? People know what Windows Phone 7 is. The only reason why Android has been successful up to now (in the UK at least) is because people want a smartphone with apps. 90% of the people I know who have an Android device had no idea what Android was before they bought the phone (and some still don't really understand). Google do little to no marketing.
Soon people will walk into a shop looking for a HTC AND be further persuaded by Windows Phone.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
i've not seen a 'you have htc' comment, once.
here, in the southeastern US, people ask "Is that a google phone ?". associating google + phone = awesome; is what it seems to be. at family/friend gatherings, i have yet to see a wp7 device. the wp6.x holdouts that i've personally known have changed to iphone or more commonly, android. phone envy ? i dunno, possibly. it seems more than anything the young folks i run into -know- the iphone from 30 feet away, know the android devices from 10 feet away, and know wp7 is still beta ware. i'm sorry, but that's the impression the young folks have here.
that being said, the older (than me) folks tend to gravitate to iphones. the large, easily read/understood apps and icons seem to attract them, along with the ease of use with their newish apple desktops. at physical therapy a few weeks ago, one gentleman was commenting about a recipe his aunt emailed him. on his phone. then he facetime'd her, and showed her the exercises that were going on. gimmicky ? i think not. i questioned him about android, wp7, and who made his phone. he didn't care, he just wanted "something that works very well, and doesn't require calling his nephew to fix."
that kind of attitude is what i'm seeing, here. people really don't -care- what the device is, what it runs, or who makes the software. all they want is a device that is mature, easily used, and easily maintained.
word-of-mouth is definitely in my neck o the woods(order of popularity/importance):
iphone
android (google phone more commonly known)
other
wp7 isn't on the radar. at all. it needs a ton of marketing, the current 'really' ads are funny, sharp, and true to life. what they -don't- do is show the phone. iphone ads on the other hand, show the phone (speeded up of course) doing what it does. android phones, show what they do. the wp7 commercials (which i love) point out the flaws of people, not the positives of the phone. we -all know- that people text and drive, are distracted everywhere in life by their phones. what we don't know is how the windows idea is going to solve this. SHOW IT !
hopefully this can be read, understood and not taken as fanboy bashing. it's very difficult for people to read a comment that isn't complete praise for a product and agree usually.

brummiesteven said:
Desire: "Oh you have a HTC?"
HD7: "Oh you have one of them new Windows Phones?"
The point? People know what Windows Phone 7 is.
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Click to collapse
Interesting-- guess MS has done a much better job marketing WP7 in the UK than the US. The WP7 ads are on TV, but in NY I haven't come across anyone outside of techie circles who's aware of WP7 (awareness seems on par with Windows Mobile -- which is basically none -- whereas Android (which, as ohgood mentioned, is often known as "the Google phone") is almost approaching iPhone mindshare now). I'm the only WP7 owner I know of (and now the only WM owner as well-- everyone else switched to iPhones or Android handsets).
On the retail front, most WP7 displays I've seen at AT&T stores are hidden in the corner, and T-Mobile shops just have the HD7 on display along with the HD2 and a million Android phones, so it's pretty hidden (interestingly the HD7 is still in stock everywhere in retail, unlike even the HD2, which sold out almost immediately).

ohgood said:
i've not seen a 'you have htc' comment, once.
here, in the southeastern US, people ask "Is that a google phone ?". associating google + phone = awesome; is what it seems to be. at family/friend gatherings, i have yet to see a wp7 device. the wp6.x holdouts that i've personally known have changed to iphone or more commonly, android. phone envy ? i dunno, possibly. it seems more than anything the young folks i run into -know- the iphone from 30 feet away, know the android devices from 10 feet away, and know wp7 is still beta ware. i'm sorry, but that's the impression the young folks have here.
that being said, the older (than me) folks tend to gravitate to iphones. the large, easily read/understood apps and icons seem to attract them, along with the ease of use with their newish apple desktops. at physical therapy a few weeks ago, one gentleman was commenting about a recipe his aunt emailed him. on his phone. then he facetime'd her, and showed her the exercises that were going on. gimmicky ? i think not. i questioned him about android, wp7, and who made his phone. he didn't care, he just wanted "something that works very well, and doesn't require calling his nephew to fix."
that kind of attitude is what i'm seeing, here. people really don't -care- what the device is, what it runs, or who makes the software. all they want is a device that is mature, easily used, and easily maintained.
word-of-mouth is definitely in my neck o the woods(order of popularity/importance):
iphone
android (google phone more commonly known)
other
wp7 isn't on the radar. at all. it needs a ton of marketing, the current 'really' ads are funny, sharp, and true to life. what they -don't- do is show the phone. iphone ads on the other hand, show the phone (speeded up of course) doing what it does. android phones, show what they do. the wp7 commercials (which i love) point out the flaws of people, not the positives of the phone. we -all know- that people text and drive, are distracted everywhere in life by their phones. what we don't know is how the windows idea is going to solve this. SHOW IT !
hopefully this can be read, understood and not taken as fanboy bashing. it's very difficult for people to read a comment that isn't complete praise for a product and agree usually.
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Click to collapse
There then seems to be a massive division between the US (and I assume) the Rest of the World (or at least the UK/Europe).
Over here hardly anybody knows what Android is. We have no little to no android advertisements.
The major problem with Google is they don't seem to want to advertise themselves, am I correct here? U.S. Advertisements are done by Verizon/Maunfacturers etc etc?
Manufacturers do advertise their phones over here but none of them mention that the phones have android. The samsung adverts have the android robot in them but they don't really explain them. HTC adverts don't mention android at all (they just have the "you" campain).
There are a few things. The CarphoneWarehouse (mobile phone store) has started advertising android instore but this doesn't extend to TV or billboards etc. The G1 had minor "With Google" stamps on it's adverts but most people I know assumed this just meant it came with Google Maps, Google Search etc and had nothing to do with the OS.
When Networks (Carriers) get android phones they may promote them instore but this will be for the phones themselves and nothing on them running Android.
Compare this to WP7:
- Adverts on TV All the time (They might not be the best, but they're there at least)
- Massive billboard adverts, showing the phones "This changes everything Gizmodo Quote".
- o2 promoting the HD7 specifically highlighting that it's a Windows Phone
- Orange doing the same with the Omnia and Mozart
- Product Placement (see http://sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos...0089751101228_525696227_7296354_3969070_n.jpg)
Over here hardly anyone knows what Android is and it really used to piss me off how Google did no advertising whatsoever.
To the OP: Apologies that I took this post offtopic, I'm going to contact a Mod now and ask them if they will split the marketing discussion into a new topic.

Thumbs up here also. I've known about the differences between all the O/S and WP7, I actually came from 6.5. I brought one home, and the wife almost immediately said, go back and get me one too.
When I am using the phone in public places, sometimes I can feel people stretching to see what I am using. That usually generates a little conversation. About 70% say, "Oh, I've heard about those new Windows phones", or else they have seen the commercials and have not seen the phone. I tell them overall, this is a great system now, but not without its drawbacks (namely no custom ringtones.. and a few other things that will be addressed in the near future). Not the same old MS products. Go out and get one.

I am heartened to see so many positive comments, I may take up the earlier suggestion abou showing off some features of wp7 on YouTube

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