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It would be nice to hear some opinions on this following thoughts I've had, ever since I upgraded my phone last year from an iPhone 3G (2.5mp camera I think) to an Xperia Arc S, which at the time was the highest quality / size MP camera on a phone at 8MP, which is still a decent size for a phone camera today, as mid-ranged phones usually start at around 5-8MP and the super smart phones these days are running upward of 10MP, I think 13MP is the highest, at least on Android, that Nokia Symbian phone was like... 42MP? Or at least the fidelity / quality resembled that due to its massive lens housing, god knows what was in there, but if I remember rightly it was only 5MP images... Someone correct me.
Anyway, with my Arc S at 8MP, the images are fairly decent, I mean they're never going to be used for print, so it doesn't really need to be higher. However, as an art graduate, I spend time when I can taking photographs, and I have a 14MP Sony NEX 5, which as standard is already a better quality sensor than the tiny ones that make it into a phone.
My first point is it's still only 1MP higher than these smartphones, which makes me think; say I upgrade my phone in 1 year when 16MP is the highest, now we've gone over, for me I'm reluctant to go higher than my camera because I'd probably be swayed to using the phone more for photography, though the phones would probably have to be double the MP of a decent camera to really compare.
Secondly, Lenses, well the one on my Arc S is fairly standard, though probably more complex than some others as I think it has 7 layers of various shaped pieces of glass. But when it comes down to it, any photographer will tell you it's almost 100% the lens that really makes a photograph what it is, the phones are getting better quality, but the lenses probably aren't, the phones are constantly trying to get thinner which doesn't help matters, but phones have actually gotten fatter sue to bigger screens needing bigger battery, so I'm unsure on this part of the topic.
The lenses I use on my NEX are Canon FD mounts, a format from the early to mid 70's all the way up to about 1994, they are manual lenses because of their age and incompatibility with modern auto-focus, but the quality is superb, and I'm not just saying it, one of the lenses is a 1.4 50mm prime, and can do some great shots, though the camera isn't full frame so the lens works out at 75mm, but I also have a 28mm 2.2 (I think?) prime, which works out around 42mm and is really good.
Both lenses are dated between 1972 and 1982, and no current phone could replicate the fidelity, bokeh and colour, which is one of the reasons why proper cameras will always have the advantage. (The NEX doesn't have a mirror inside so can replicate the original setup of older cameras easily, meaning a huge number of adaptors allows tons of different lenses to become available)
However with the Nokia pureview phone (still don't remember its name... 850?...) It had a body capable of housing some very interesting tech, that hasn't really been used since, at least to my knowledge. Seeing some pictures online really showed you what this phone was capable of, I think the resolution of the images were in the ten thousands X whatever, and remained really sharp, for a phone at least. Maybe it's lack of success is due to it been on a non-leading OS at the time, I can imagine people would want a camera with maybe an Android phone? (Which apparently, Nokia are working on) so maybe it will see it's true colours shine on a larger base OS. If this tech is worth the larger body size of a phone, people are going to want it...
And lastly, Convenience. One of the main points of having a camera is to be able to capture moments WHENEVER, and having a decent camera on a phone has been a growing trend over the past few years, with the growth of social networks, YouTube and Instagram. And you're more likely to have a phone with you than a camera for a situation that's spontaneous.
So what are peoples thoughts? A few months back Jessops one of the leading camera sales company in the UK went into administration, with only a few stores been saved;
Will we see a heightening trend amongst phones been used instead of standalone cameras?
Will they (DSLR's etc) be phased out completely?
Are you an avid photographer with your phone, or do you use a standalone camera?
Am I wrong?
I'd like to hear some opinions, hopefuly some educated ones on the subject will give a sense on the spectrum of issues.
Another point to consider, Smart-Cameras, the new trend of cameras running Android, though I don't think any have interchangeable lenses.
Thanks for reading, also... You may need to change some 'if's to 'of's because my phone has a habit of changing my words.
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I use my phone for everyday rubbish shots (whatsapp and such) and storing information (bustimes, lists, important stuff i take a snapshot of.) .
It will NEVER replace my DSLR.
It simply lacks the functionalities of one. So long as I can't set aperture and change lenses, it's not a real camera. I need my telezoom and macro lenses.
You can't seriously expect a phone, even that 42mp one to be as high - quality as a dslr. Too many pixels crammed into way too small a sensor. As it has always been with phones.
Not to mention, phones lack the power of a dslr. Ever tried taking nightshots with a phone? They're bad. Very bad. Or high speed shots. Nuhuh, they cant. Or far-zoom?
Lets face it, cameras on phones are not meant for professionals. They're meant for people on facebook, twitter and instagram.
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ShadowLea said:
I use my phone for everyday rubbish shots (whatsapp and such) and storing information (bustimes, lists, important stuff i take a snapshot of.) .
It will NEVER replace my DSLR.
It simply lacks the functionalities of one. So long as I can't set aperture and change lenses, it's not a real camera. I need my telezoom and macro lenses.
You can't seriously expect a phone, even that 42mp one to be as high - quality as a dslr. Too many pixels crammed into way too small a sensor. As it has always been with phones.
Not to mention, phones lack the power of a dslr. Ever tried taking nightshots with a phone? They're bad. Very bad. Or high speed shots. Nuhuh, they cant. Or far-zoom?
Lets face it, cameras on phones are not meant for professionals. They're meant for people on facebook, twitter and instagram.
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Man how can you compare a DSLR with a smartphone camera??, a DSLR is a camera with an awesome quality and the smartphone camera is only a phone with a decent camera and not for pro- photographers.. i would always choose a DLSR over a smartphone camera. And by the way i agree with ShadowLea that you can't cram 42mp in a small lens!!! it is outrageous!
Well, it's to do with trends, if you agree or not is a different matter, but lots of pro photographers and teachers will tell you if you ask, about how important this new revolution is, the quality you can get is pretty good, even compared to digital cameras less than 10 years ago.
If it can take photographs then it's a valid form, there are pro photographers then spend lots of their time using phones for photography, 5MP and decent light is enough, some of these phones are better quality than the point and shoot cameras of recent past.
Instagram, though trendy is a very valid post processing tool, just because the majority of people use it recreationaly it doesn't diminish its power, and usage.
People use Polaroid cameras all the time, and they're quite limited, and the quality can vary greatly. You can't change the lens, and you can't really adjust any settings.
Polaroid is probably most comparable to the quality of the mid range smartphones.
As for the Nokia 41MP camera phone, if you actually look at the images you can get a good sense of the quality. The short article can be found here:
http://www.extremetech.com/electron...review-camera-finally-coming-to-windows-phone
You can also easily find examples by doing an image search on Nokia Pureview.
The convenience of a very good quality camera phone can allow for great photos, which is why it's really taking off as a trend.
Denying it is the same arguments as saying Digital is better than Film, though there are still counter arguments, benefits and people still use film cameras and Polaroid.
There's a statistic recently that goes something like; there have been more photographs taken in 2012 than all previous years since photography's invention combined.
I'm not sure if that's word for word correct, but I think it was on a Vsauce YouTube video not long back.
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I think you need to understand that Professional stands for "getting paid for your work" or "being an accomplished/awarded photographer" and not "I can hold a camera!".
Yes, there have been more photo's taken in the last year than since the invention of the photograph. I do hope you are also aware that this includes every halfbrained moron on Instagram and Facebook posting their friday-night drunk shots.
No selfrespecting real photographer uses a phone's camera for his or her work. The only ones that do are either A, doing an experiment, or B, people on the internet fooling themselves into thinking they're photographers.
PHONE CAMERAS DO NOT HAVE APERATURE SETTINGS. And that's where it all ends. There isn't a single pro or semi-pro who uses a fixed aperature camera.
42MP doesn't make a bloody difference if the sensor is meant for 2MP. The photo's may look fine on the internet, but newsflash: Your monitor is 72DPI, not 300. And a 6000x6000 pixel image is always going to look amazing when downsized to 1920x1080 or lower. (which is what every website does.)
As for trends, they're for the common cattle, not semi/professionals. People with knowledge and experience pay attention to specs, not to hypes.
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ShadowLea said:
I think you need to understand that Professional stands for "getting paid for your work" or "being an accomplished/awarded photographer" and not "I can hold a camera!".
Yes, there have been more photo's taken in the last year than since the invention of the photograph. I do hope you are also aware that this includes every halfbrained moron on Instagram and Facebook posting their friday-night drunk shots.
No selfrespecting real photographer uses a phone's camera for his or her work. The only ones that do are either A, doing an experiment, or B, people on the internet fooling themselves into thinking they're photographers.
PHONE CAMERAS DO NOT HAVE APERATURE SETTINGS. And that's where it all ends. There isn't a single pro or semi-pro who uses a fixed aperature camera.
42MP doesn't make a bloody difference if the sensor is meant for 2MP. The photo's may look fine on the internet, but newsflash: Your monitor is 72DPI, not 300. And a 6000x6000 pixel image is always going to look amazing when downsized to 1920x1080 or lower. (which is what every website does.)
As for trends, they're for the common cattle, not semi/professionals. People with knowledge and experience pay attention to specs, not to hypes.
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I think you're missing my point, I meant professional photographers that use iPhones for photography for non print, recreation, street photography etc.
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For those interested in hearing a pro talk about it, I present, Chase Jarvis.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=buDa-m65RyA&feature=youtube_gdata_player
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I've been recording a few 4k clips. I think its pretty pointless A) No OIS , you need a tripod only reall for using it B) Frame rate not 30fps all the time stutters a bit.
Other than that its the most detailed amazing video on my 2560 x 1440p monitor (No 4k monitor yet), but with no OIS its really not practical at all. Or usable. And not to mention the 5 minute clip limit...
Anyone here going to honestly be using it over 1080p? (Unless you carry a tripod) Guess i'm too use to the G2's OIS camera which gives much smoother videos.
Honestly, mostly I just use 720p. In my opinion the 4k function is an marketing trick by Samsung. Well it works but the mainstream market needs a few more years until it's the non+ ultra. It's nice to have but I'm quietly sure I won't use it at all.
Lenniitsch said:
Honestly, mostly I just use 720p. In my opinion the 4k function is an marketing trick by Samsung. Well it works but the mainstream market needs a few more years until it's the non+ ultra. It's nice to have but I'm quietly sure I won't use it at all.
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Agreed. 100% marketing gimmick. Other than playing with it for a few minutes, doubt I will ever use it again. If it was 4K 30fps with image stabilization yes.
Chaialo says
I was actually thinking of filming a commercial with it. I do have a tripod, slider and a clamp to hold it. I will also be shooting the same scenes in 1080P on my HPX300 just in case.
Hendrickson said:
I've been recording a few 4k clips. I think its pretty pointless A) No OIS , you need a tripod only reall for using it B) Frame rate not 30fps all the time stutters a bit.
Other than that its the most detailed amazing video on my 2560 x 1440p monitor (No 4k monitor yet), but with no OIS its really not practical at all. Or usable. And not to mention the 5 minute clip limit...
Anyone here going to honestly be using it over 1080p? (Unless you carry a tripod) Guess i'm too use to the G2's OIS camera which gives much smoother videos.
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I wish you guys would quit with the whining.. the camera (from what I have seen) is clearly better than its predecessors or just about anything on the market for a smartphone. Samsung has clearly improved this phone in every way, its by far the best phone on the market. No other phone can anywhere close to what this phone offers, the features are endless. So stop crying and be happy that you are fortunate to own the best phone on the market. IMO
I don't think that the 4k ability is outstanding but someone has to take the first step. And that the note 3 can handle the bandwidth needed for 4k is enough to wow me right there.(it is very compressed I'd imagine)
And to people saying its a marketing gimmick, isn't the iphones slow mo feature the same? The note 3 can do 720p 120fps just like the iphone but there not hyping it up. 4k is more exciting then watching every video on YouTube in slow mo. If I want to watch slow mo I want to see it at 1000fps with a true slow mo camera.
Lenniitsch said:
Honestly, mostly I just use 720p. In my opinion the 4k function is an marketing trick by Samsung. Well it works but the mainstream market needs a few more years until it's the non+ ultra. It's nice to have but I'm quietly sure I won't use it at all.
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Uh, 4K is a feature of the snapdragon 800 chipset. Samsung had nothing to do with it. Blame Qualcomm for it being less than desirable.
I imagine xda devs will get around the 5 minute limit soon enough.
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I'm so tired of coming to this forum and seeing people constantly complain about things that are either superficial or not mind blowing (etc. speakers not putting out surround sound 7.1, 4k not being worlds better than 1080p).
Keep these negative post in:
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=2458640
Agree Sgt. Beside that I would add permission that people with less of 200 (maybe 100) cant open new threads in general..Only qa.
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Sounds great, they should also make it that Samsung fanboys can only start posts too? Fanboys here don't let people express their opinions which is what forums are all about discussions and sometimes there are topics you might not like.
Edit: I've request this thread be lock and buried incase more don't like it
Mod Edit
Thread closed at [OP] request
malybru
Forum Moderator
https://www.dxomark.com/sony-xperia-xz-premium-first-sony-tested-with-our-new-protocols/
As expected, Sony's premium flagship gets an unimpressive score of 83 from DXoMark's revamped benchmarking (now including zoom, bokeh effect, artifacts, among other testing).
While i don't agree with the score per category (especially on having a low video stabilization score; seriously, Sony's 5-axis is arguably the best in video stabilization right now) but DXoMark does raise some good and valid points on what's wrong with Xperia phones. Hope Sony camera devs read the review as well so they know what to improve on (i.e. software algorithm on superior auto, noise and texture, lowlight performance, zoom in and bokeh effect).
Having said that, still one satisfied Xperia user here. The cons don't affect me that much; unless you're a person who's really nitpicking on every small detail, the Sony Xperia XZ Premium does a good job of being a solid performer in both photo and video capture.
Lawliet918 said:
https://www.dxomark.com/sony-xperia-xz-premium-first-sony-tested-with-our-new-protocols/
As expected, Sony's premium flagship gets an unimpressive score of 83 from DXoMark's revamped benchmarking (now including zoom, bokeh effect, artifacts, among other testing).
While i don't agree with the score per category (especially on having a low video stabilization score; seriously, Sony's 5-axis is arguably the best in video stabilization right now) but DXoMark does raise some good and valid points on what's wrong with Xperia phones. Hope Sony camera devs read the review as well so they know what to improve on (i.e. software algorithm on superior auto, noise and texture, lowlight performance, zoom in and bokeh effect).
Having said that, still one satisfied Xperia user here. The cons don't affect me that much; unless you're a person who's really nitpicking on every small detail, the Sony Xperia XZ Premium does a good job of being a solid performer in both photo and video capture.
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Sony no paid dxomark= dxmark trolling Sony.
Apple paid Dxomark= dxomark 96 points
Glad I don't use zoom on my XZP... Or I never even used it in my life. Truth is I cant expect from camera big as fingernail to catch photos like pro digital camera. Also every model with only one main camera will fail this test. Still I am happy with xzp camera for taking pictures, even the front camera is finally good for selfies.
https://flic.kr/s/aHsm4ZdMbV
https://flic.kr/s/aHsm4ZdMbV
https://flic.kr/s/aHsm4ZdMbV
https://flic.kr/s/aHsm4XtNwH
https://flic.kr/s/aHsm2QjnKd
https://flic.kr/s/aHsm2QjnKd
https://flic.kr/s/aHsm4AWDDW
Also we should wait for xz1 review, maybe they did some update on img processing...
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smitrovic said:
Glad I don't use zoom on my XZP... Or I never even used it in my life.
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Yeah, I'm not sure why this is even part of the test. If there is no actual optical zoom, what are they really testing? I see people zoom in on their smartphone cameras all the time and I wonder what the point is. Just crop the photo later. You get a better picture, and the "zoom" is effectively the same.
It's really sad and bit disappointing. I think most of the stuff they were saying true.
Couldn't care less. I didn't buy this phone for it's camera
Come on Sony... 83
Come on Sony'
I bought the XZ Premium because I already own Sony cameras. Sony is obviously the leader in sensor technology and by teaming up with Zeiss there should be no questions about the hardware. So... That only leaves one thing. Software! Apple uses Sony Sensors. Samsung likewise. Even Huawei. So we know their sensors are no better, it must be the software. Please Sony, get off your arrogant asses and give us something that's competitive. I know this 83 could be brought up to 93 if you can just give us a new update and a little software support.
I guess that wont happen ever, because Sony needs to save digital camera market tho. If they made this camera use all potential, they wont sell any 200-400 euro digital cameras.
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The initial purporpose of dxomark is to diminish any phone that lacks a second lens for bokeh and zoom and from the other side to favor the phones that have it. So i cannot take this test into consideration because it lacks any professionalism and puts double standards.
I know people love slating DXoMark with remarks like "Sony no paid dxomark= dxmark trolling Sony." I also know that we can't say if that is true or not but to be honest we don't even need DXoMarks score. The camera is poor compared to 2017 flagships. Just take an objective look and test for yourself. The problem on this forum is that people are so blind sighted and such massive fanboys they can't step back and go wow yeah this is awful. I spend £649 on this phone sim free and I understand a lot of people have done the same and want to back up the purchase with claims like the above.
The point of the matter though is that Sony's whole marketing for this thing was the camera and weather you look at a DXoMark score or not, it is not up to scratch . Its low light performance is miles of the competition, the dynamic range is shockingly bad compared to phone like the Pixel, Galaxy S7 or iPhone 7 all of which where released last year. Not even looking at the quality of the photos there is also many other issues such as camera distortion etc.
I just wish Sony would acknowledge these issues and say "Hey we are working on it" but they don't. What i would also like is a camera 2 API so at least we can use another camera app.
jms.flynn said:
I know people love slating DXoMark with remarks like "Sony no paid dxomark= dxmark trolling Sony." I also know that we can't say if that is true or not but to be honest we don't even need DXoMarks score. The camera is poor compared to 2017 flagships. Just take an objective look and test for yourself. The problem on this forum is that people are so blind sighted and such massive fanboys they can't step back and go wow yeah this is awful. I spend £649 on this phone sim free and I understand a lot of people have done the same and want to back up the purchase with claims like the above.
The point of the matter though is that Sony's whole marketing for this thing was the camera and weather you look at a DXoMark score or not, it is not up to scratch . Its low light performance is miles of the competition, the dynamic range is shockingly bad compared to phone like the Pixel, Galaxy S7 or iPhone 7 all of which where released last year. Not even looking at the quality of the photos there is also many other issues such as camera distortion etc.
I just wish Sony would acknowledge these issues and say "Hey we are working on it" but they don't. What i would also like is a camera 2 API so at least we can use another camera app.
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Then go and pay 1200 pounds to get your iPhone X to shoot in auto mode, and let the people who know about photography to shoot better photos in manual mode with almost half the price.
jms.flynn said:
I know people love slating DXoMark with remarks like "Sony no paid dxomark= dxmark trolling Sony." I also know that we can't say if that is true or not but to be honest we don't even need DXoMarks score. The camera is poor compared to 2017 flagships. Just take an objective look and test for yourself. The problem on this forum is that people are so blind sighted and such massive fanboys they can't step back and go wow yeah this is awful. I spend £649 on this phone sim free and I understand a lot of people have done the same and want to back up the purchase with claims like the above.
The point of the matter though is that Sony's whole marketing for this thing was the camera and weather you look at a DXoMark score or not, it is not up to scratch . Its low light performance is miles of the competition, the dynamic range is shockingly bad compared to phone like the Pixel, Galaxy S7 or iPhone 7 all of which where released last year. Not even looking at the quality of the photos there is also many other issues such as camera distortion etc.
I just wish Sony would acknowledge these issues and say "Hey we are working on it" but they don't. What i would also like is a camera 2 API so at least we can use another camera app.
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You can use other camera apps, just not the free versions. If you can handle a couple of euros for Camera Zoom FX you will find that the camera is not as you describe it!!! By any chance have you unlocked your bootloader? I'm sure you know that currently there is no way to backup your TA partition wich means the loss of your DRM unique key which enables camera features, and more.
I've been an xperia fan for a long time and finally Sony are releasing sw updates more frequently and this handset will get Oreo once the sony team puts it together. This will transform this handset which has great HW, as all xperia handsets
Katsigaros said:
Then go and pay 1200 pounds to get your iPhone X to shoot in auto mode, and let the people who know about photography to shoot better photos in manual mode with almost half the price.
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Wasn't really my point was it. You can go buy a year old S7 or LG G6 and shoot in manual mode or in auto mode and smash the Sony out of the water.
And if you want a more stock android experience buy a Moto G5 Plus and that also beats the Sony.
The reason I know is because i have them. The way the sony was sold with improved lens, better low light due to bigger pixel size and hybrid auto focus this was supposed to be a beast of a camera. Which it isn't, not even close.
---------- Post added at 02:07 PM ---------- Previous post was at 02:05 PM ----------
WildBit said:
I've been an xperia fan for a long time and finally Sony are releasing sw updates more frequently and this handset will get Oreo once the sony team puts it together. This will transform this handset which has great HW, as all xperia handsets
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Lets hope so, I am a huge Sony fan and want them to succeeded. I've had all the xperia's since the z3 compact. I just want a camera experience which is as good as the rest of the software and hardware.
This new DXO formula is idiotic... It gives adventages to dualcam phones.
whats the point of doing bokkeh test if there is actually no bokkeh...It should be a feature, it should not affect the score, because many other phones have their own features which are not measured by DXO tests.
for example. XZP has no bokkeh, but it has wider lens, which is a big advantage for me, but there are no additional point for that in the test.
Beside that, DXO tests started to be incomparable.
Look at Iphone 8 review and XZP review. I8 review is 10x more complex - it contains way more tests than XZP review.
There are also inconsistencies like:
At the first paragraph, in the "Test Summary" section they wrote, quote:
"the XZ Premium features relatively strong autofocus performance for both photography and video, as well as very good stabilization for video."
But at the end, in the "Conclusion" section they wrote, quote:
"Video performance is also competent, but marred by problems with loss of detail and mediocre stabilization."
it is really pathetic and not professional.
jms.flynn said:
I know people love slating DXoMark with remarks like "Sony no paid dxomark= dxmark trolling Sony." I also know that we can't say if that is true or not but to be honest we don't even need DXoMarks score. The camera is poor compared to 2017 flagships. Just take an objective look and test for yourself. The problem on this forum is that people are so blind sighted and such massive fanboys they can't step back and go wow yeah this is awful. I spend £649 on this phone sim free and I understand a lot of people have done the same and want to back up the purchase with claims like the above.
The point of the matter though is that Sony's whole marketing for this thing was the camera and weather you look at a DXoMark score or not, it is not up to scratch . Its low light performance is miles of the competition, the dynamic range is shockingly bad compared to phone like the Pixel, Galaxy S7 or iPhone 7 all of which where released last year. Not even looking at the quality of the photos there is also many other issues such as camera distortion etc.
I just wish Sony would acknowledge these issues and say "Hey we are working on it" but they don't. What i would also like is a camera 2 API so at least we can use another camera app.
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Do you even know what is a good photograph?
You don't like the camera quality? Seriously?
I take night photos like never before. Low light photos that are fantastic, videos in slow motion at night that are perfect.
And you compare with s7 and iPhone?
gengi said:
Do you even know what is a good photograph?
You don't like the camera quality? Seriously?
I take night photos like never before. Low light photos that are fantastic, videos in slow motion at night that are perfect.
And you compare with s7 and iPhone?
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Ok, now I know you're seriously trolling. ha ha
Please show me one of your "videos in slow motion at night that are perfect".
The 960FPS is cool, if not gimmicky, but it only really works well in very very good light
jms.flynn said:
Ok, now I know you're seriously trolling. ha ha
Please show me one of your "videos in slow motion at night that are perfect".
The 960FPS is cool, if not gimmicky, but it only really works well in very very good light
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960 fps, at night and 500 meters (at least) apart, I would say it's very good.
https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B3HA5nmqdPh0SFFLVHpXRjBxRDA/view?usp=drivesdk
gengi said:
960 fps, at night and 500 meters (at least) apart, I would say it's very good.
https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B3HA5nmqdPh0SFFLVHpXRjBxRDA/view?usp=drivesdk
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I know in certain lighting conditions it causes alot of flicker. I thought at night it would flicker but it doesnt so thats really cool. Nice video by the way.
Its like alot of people say though, as soon as Samsung or Apple do something new everyone in the world is like wow look at this. Then Sony does it and everyone is quiet about it. Our device the XZ Premium is the first to have a 4K HDR screen and is also the only device alongside the XZS and XZ1 to record at 960fps. Nobody in the world understands how cool it is to have those two features in the palm of your hand. If Samsung or Apple did it then im sure they would understand. As soon as another company besides Apple or Samsung do something cool they get criticised by their 'big bezels' which shouldnt even matter when you take into consideration the features packed into the device.
The score given for our device, I dont think its fair. If you want something fair watch a YouTube video on a comparison or review of the camera, im sure they will be more on point and accurate.
I didnt buy the phone for its camera. If someone wants to say they have an iPhone 8 with a higher score than my XZ Premium they can but I believe the scores are biased and that the rest of their scores are one-sided.
Don't want to bag Sony down but I have compared the XZ Premium(company issued to me) against the Pixel (I own), Pixel 2 (wife owns) and hands down, it is definitely inferior than the Pixels... It takes crappy low light photos with lots of noise. It also struggles with photos where the background is brighter. Again, I think Sony's problem really is software, just like with most Sony phones I owned.
However, I'm not saying that it doesn't do decent photos, it does. I think 86 is too low. Personally, I'd rate it around 90-92.
chefnoob said:
Don't want to bag Sony down but I have compared the XZ Premium(company issued to me) against the Pixel (I own), Pixel 2 (wife owns) and hands down, it is definitely inferior than the Pixels... It takes crappy low light photos with lots of noise. It also struggles with photos where the background is brighter. Again, I think Sony's problem really is software, just like with most Sony phones I owned.
However, I'm not saying that it doesn't do decent photos, it does. I think 86 is too low. Personally, I'd rate it around 90-92.
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I think everyone knows already that the Pixel has a better camera.
According to this article all the rear cameras has ois and not just one as Huawei informed us about. Are they trying to make their AI software looking better than it actually is? All other phone makers would have bragged about ois on all three cameras
https://www.theverge.com/circuitbre...pro-optical-image-stabilization-triple-camera
easycure1974 said:
According to this article all the rear cameras has ois and not just one as Huawei informed us about. Are they trying to make their AI software looking better than it actually is? All other phone makers would have bragged about ois on all three cameras
https://www.theverge.com/circuitbre...pro-optical-image-stabilization-triple-camera
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If that's true why is their 4k recording so shaky?
lawtq said:
If that's true why is their 4k recording so shaky?
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Yes is seems very strange - it will be interesting to read more about this
lawtq said:
If that's true why is their 4k recording so shaky?
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Hardware is useless, if the software haven't being configured to use it.
I hope huawei add the stabilisation to 4K mode soon
otonieru said:
Hardware is useless, if the software haven't being configured to use it.
I hope huawei add the stabilisation to 4K mode soon
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Why do you think they haven't already? Cause the 970 isn't capable. Hopefully they do though. This phone would be exciting if it wasn't for the old chipset! Sigh
lawtq said:
Why do you think they haven't already? Cause the 970 isn't capable. Hopefully they do though. This phone would be exciting if it wasn't for the old chipset! Sigh
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Well it's not really old, end of 2017. It's definitely powerful enough. Just not as powerful as Qualcoms latest on paper and in benchmarks. That's to be expected though. Even much older less powerful chips can handle 4k with ois.
There is nothing on android that can even push the SoC's from 3 years ago. The hardware is just way ahead of the software. It's all a race to get the best looking specs on paper now, regardless of whether it's actually needed or not.
In my own testing the P20 Pro is just as quick in pretty much anything other than benchmarks, which in real life usage mean nothing. Its all about the user experience. There isn't a game to push the latest hardware and won't be even towards the end of life of all these new gen devices.
Not sure why they didn't include it. The hardware is more than capable.
Highspeed123 said:
Well it's not really old, end of 2017. It's definitely powerful enough. Just not as powerful as Qualcoms latest on paper and in benchmarks. That's to be expected though. Even much older less powerful chips can handle 4k with ois.
There is nothing on android that can even push the SoC's from 3 years ago. The hardware is just way ahead of the software. It's all a race to get the best looking specs on paper now, regardless of whether it's actually needed or not.
In my own testing the P20 Pro is just as quick in pretty much anything other than benchmarks, which in real life usage mean nothing. Its all about the user experience. There isn't a game to push the latest hardware and won't be even towards the end of life of all these new gen devices.
Not sure why they didn't include it. The hardware is more than capable.
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Good points! I hope you're right. 1080p ain't enough anymore
easycure1974 said:
According to this article all the rear cameras has ois and not just one as Huawei informed us about. Are they trying to make their AI software looking better than it actually is? All other phone makers would have bragged about ois on all three cameras
https://www.theverge.com/circuitbre...pro-optical-image-stabilization-triple-camera
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I really hope that they add the stabilisation to 4k videos because now is terrible... And videos shot in full HD look very poor quality...
If hardware is on board I don't want to be cheated by Huawei
lawtq said:
Why do you think they haven't already? Cause the 970 isn't capable. Hopefully they do though. This phone would be exciting if it wasn't for the old chipset! Sigh
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This is simply not true. 970 is almost as capable as 2017 exynos and snapdragon.
But honestly. I've been living around thousand people everyday, and i find, there's less than hundred of them would record video on daily basis,
And when they did, they either do it in 1080 or 720.
Why ? Because most of it would end in social media. And uploading something as huge as 4K simply wont do for most people,
Not to mention most of phone out there which used to watch the video later on are mostly still on full HD resolution as well.
I understand the argument from people who said they shoot it to be watch on their 4K TV. But they are not majority in the community.
Heck, i even can count with my finger, how many times i have recorded a video using my mobile phone from january last year up to today. LoL. Am simply a "still image" guy
Thats why,
As bad as missing 4K stabilisation in spec sheet, it wont have that as huge impact in daily life user.
But, surely thats bad for marketing communication. And reviewer will use it again and again as a weak point.
I shoot videos occasionally but only in 1080p regardless of which phone or camera I use.
It's just amateur video for my personal view not for commercial so no point to waste space.
Regarding there being nothing that even taxes older SoCs to their limits - anyone who does emulator gaming can tell you there certainly are use case scenarios that do. My Mate 10 handles a lot of emulation well enough, but the likes of Dolphin are better on better performing SoCs nevertheless (this is not all down to raw power though, how well drivers are implemented also makes a difference, however most mobile drivers are rubbish across the board, so the brute force of higher chip speeds is welcomed here).
otonieru said:
And when they did, they either do it in 1080 or 720.
Why ? Because most of it would end in social media. And uploading something as huge as 4K simply wont do for most people,
Not to mention most of phone out there which used to watch the video later on are mostly still on full HD resolution as well.
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Exactly this, most video is used for social media now, where it gets compressed to helll and viewed on tiny screens. There is no real need to push for 4K recording and those that really want it will probably buy dedicated recorders or a gimbal.
Btw the super slo-mo on this is good! Saw Diversity at the weekend, apologises for the shake at the start, daughter was bouncing up and down lol
https://twitter.com/DaveP2611/status/983071212984299521
@DaveP2611 quick question about the slow-mo, how do you actually setup the device for slow mo recording?
Is is similar to older Samsung devices where you record a video using the slow mo function and then select which part of the video to slow down and by what ammount?
---------- Post added at 12:44 PM ---------- Previous post was at 12:44 PM ----------
[/COLOR @DaveP2611 quick question about the slow-mo, how do you actually setup the device for slow mo recording?
Is is similar to older Samsung devices where you record a video using the slow mo function and then select which part of the video to slow down and by what ammount?
5nak3 said:
@DaveP2611 quick question about the slow-mo, how do you actually setup the device for slow mo recording?
Is is similar to older Samsung devices where you record a video using the slow mo function and then select which part of the video to slow down and by what ammount?
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It's an option within the camera, under More, you then have a Slow-Mo option, under x4/x8 there doesn't seem to be any recording length limit, the x32 seems to be a snapshot of ten seconds and picks when it slows down itself as seen in the clip I posted.
Awesome, thanks for the quick reply!
Shame you can't pick out the section of the video you want to slow down at x32. It's one of the things I think my note 4 did well despite only having x8 slowmo capture.
---------- Post added at 12:58 PM ---------- Previous post was at 12:58 PM ----------
Awesome, thanks for the quick reply!
Shame you can't pick out the section of the video you want to slow down at x32. It's one of the things I think my note 4 did well despite only having x8 slowmo capture.
I really think that all the stabilization in pictures is done via OIS and they just claim it’s the magic of AI just to use that as a differential marketing advantage.Maybe AI is not so smart / cutting edge...
djmaxi said:
I really think that all the stabilization in pictures is done via OIS and they just claim it’s the magic of AI just to use that as a differential marketing advantage.Maybe AI is not so smart / cutting edge...
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Thats not really the case as well, since by using it to shoot, i can definitely tell that sometimes, there simply no OIS. OIS movement will always seen in preview prior to shoot. You can see it move the picture to the opposite direction of your hand movement. And when there's no feedback/counter movement, you can tell that no OIS in action.
delete me
justyourimage said:
Well, and an AI isn't an AI if it isn't intelligent.
That's marketing for you.
They simply named their Auto-Mode to AI-Powered because they managed to implement a few "new" things that don't work properly for what it was intended for (shooting good pictures from the hip).
I mean it's not like there were things like Dual Pixel AF and Laser AF were invented for no reason ... and they work most of the time (for what they were made for) unless the manufacturer ****s really up.
Now I can die happly. Especially knowing that they haven't even enabled OIS for the photos AND video.
I would have never guessed some manufacturer to **** up so badly ... let's see if they will ever "fix" or even "admit" it.
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It's more amazing you would jump to conclusion so easily.
https://www.anandtech.com/comments/12633/cadence-announces-tensilica-vision-q6-dsp/596655
Look in the comments section. Wait for the full review if you want to know all the technical details.
All that that tear-down showed is that the modules have an auto-focus mechanism. Just because the lens wobbles doesn't mean it's OIS.
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Just go to the shop and try it out and make up your own minds instead of following what people complain nonstop on the internet. The echo chamber is ridiculous. The 1080p video stabilization for example is amazing trying it in person, the most likely reason they aren't doing it on 4k is that the hardware is not capable of doing it.
I'm not sure the kirin 970's isp is powerful enough, or have the bandwidth, to stabilize 4k. I imagine it would be there if it was possible.
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Hello fellow Pixel users,
In my country Google is not selling their phones officially, so from my perspective it's a tough decision to make. I will be buying it from Germany within my business travel. I am currently using OnePlus 8 Pro and before that I had a Samsung S10+ (Exynos variant). So I am familiar with having a processor that is way better than Exynos is quite the difference.
1- So my first question is how good is the Tensor chip inside Google's phone. I am aware of the better usage as we can see with Apple maintaining the iphone's own silicone. They are trying the best power output of the smartphone within it's hardware capabilities. I am no gamer with the phone so all I expect is watch some videos, use basic social media and open many chrome tabs and sometimes take pictures from my travel.
2-My second question is the material used in the phone. As I said before I never seen or used a pixel phone. I expect it to be maintain basics or better than overall quality but from the social media I am hearing that camera frame has getting damage, power button is falling inside the phone. A fellow youtuber JerryRigsEverything said about bending issue in his teardown video too. Is anyone here experienced issues like this? Or is it a %1 manufacturing mistake that can happen to anyone.
3-My third question is the battery life and camera performance from your experience. I have watched some youtube videos from MKBHD, which is just praising the Pixel 7 Pro and I am trusting his channel. Meanwhile I have watched some unbiased compare videos with the S23 Ultra and iphone 14 Pro Max and usually photos and videos from Pixel phone looks much worse than how it's announced. Maybe they are not editing their photos, just comparing them with the way it is looking straight from the camera. But since nobody here is doing a sponsorship with pixel I trust your words over them.
Thank you for your response
Clearly these are only my own opinions.
1. Tensor 2 is great, it might not look good on paper thanks to all the benchmarking people do but in the real world it is more than enough.
2. You are never going to bend the phone like Zack does on JRE and lets be fair here, the P7P didn't snap or remain bent in his test. My P7P is now 5 months old and remains scratch free with all its buttons in place.
3. Battery life in my experience is good, i don't recall having to charge in the day even when going mental with the camera on a day out or on Holiday. Photos are good but they do have that pixel look about them and despite Googles "real tone" claims it sometimes makes a right pigs ear of skin tones regardless of colour. Mainly though you will end up with a good photo just about every time, whether it is framed right is down to you. As for video, well it is a Pixel, its never been any Pixels strongest attribute but i find videos from it perfectly acceptable.