Related
Pronounced "say candy", the goal of SecAndy is to come up with as secure and private of an OS as possible. So as not to reinvent the wheel, we'll base this initiative on our open source code of choice (Android or maybe other developers' choice).
I am not a developer myself but I can without a doubt, because of former professional experiences, organize a project and gather the right people together as a community in order to make sure that project sees the light of day after it has acquired a life of its own if needed, which I think we will agree is something that this kind of project requires because of the scrutiny it will quickly attract.
I am officially calling upon this post all interested developers that could help us fork Android or other open source OS.
Let's get a kickstarter funded and let the party begin. I will update you later today on the advancement of such.
This thread welcomes constructive ideas and developer participation, but here are beginning requirements we'll need to fulfill eventually to privatize and secure android :
- default browser allowing custom search engines such as https://ixquick.com or duckduckgo
- default system search pointing to those custom engines for online component
- control of gps at firmware level to allow full disability
- peer to peer file exchange (think BitTorrent sync) with 1024 to 2048 bit encryption
- implementation of secure sms and mms exchange (think textsecure)
- implementation of encrypted voice channels (think redphone or SIP with end-to-end encryption)
- root vpn for all online access
- systemwide warning of insecure solutions (example : wanting to use gmail or regular email)
- PGP transparent email solution
- Tor option for root vpn (subject to mitm attacks but more on that later)
- peerguardian type auto-updated database to identify suspicious IP address ranges
- systematic in-out firewall control auto updated with peerguardian database and community based rules database
- hardened malware protection and app permissions with automatic permission audit based on application type
- full device encryption and lockup (in case of unauthorized user)
- full remote wipe out and bricking with auto IMEI reporting (in case of theft, might have to be amended because of attack vector)
- full remote location capability with real time tracking (that one might have to be scratched, high security risk because of attack vector)
This obviously doesn't cover all the bases but would be a good start... I know a lot of these options can be implemented with a mismatch of apps and custom Roms but having it all at an OS level AOKP style would greatly help in building an android by the people for the people community that could eventually loosen the stranglehold of less than transparent corporations.
60 views in 24 hours and not one comment. Obviously I'm approaching this the wrong way. More news at 11.
e-motion said:
60 views in 24 hours and not one comment. Obviously I'm approaching this the wrong way. More news at 11.
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I don't want to be insulting, but no programming work has been done on your part, and you're just asking for people to dive in this project to get managed by someone they never heard of. It's not really surprising no one has commented yet.
I understand what you're saying but any comment, even if only just to show interest in such a project, will be key to drive developers to it.
I might not have started any development but I have clear understanding of how to design secure solutions. I can't go into details of why that is, however you can clearly see with my 2nd post that some research has been done. If I wanted a solution for me alone, I could just go on with my own little pudding of custom ROM and security apps.
However, because of the recent news events that SHOULD have awaken this population, I thought now might finally be the right time to try to get such a project off the ground. But without anyone even showing any interest, why would any developer be drawn to it ? If people would rather focus more on content consumerism than on what might happen under an umbrella of spooks that they're paying for with their taxes, then they have learned nothing from history and deserve what's coming to them, simple as that.
This is NOT a development thread in case you haven't noticed, so telling me I haven't developed anything yet is not even relevant.
In case anyone cares, this will be moved shortly in the t-mobile Note 2 Android development thread as a Touchwiz proof of concept ROM. Little steps, little steps...
Sent from my SGH-T889 using Tapatalk 2
mobile sec
While I am not a developer I would be interested in this project. I've been thinking about this a bit lately given recent events. I think a useful privacy preserving security related app and phone combo might have these features:
-some way to separate the baseband processor (radio) from the OS. It seems most phones share memory with the radio and this fact can and has been exploited. Own the bb processor and you own the phone. Perhaps a 3g dongle plugged into an android phone in host mode would work. Some of these usb "data only" radios can be unlocked for voice too. I believe a rooted phone with IP tables/firewall running would be much more secure than a conventional mobile phone.
-an anonymising network for connecting to servers/peers. I think the i2p network is well suited for this purpose. Rather than connect to services that are not designed with your anonymity/privacy in mind, connect to hidden/darknet servers that make it extremely difficult to ascertain your real IP and location. Perhaps an i2p router running on your home computer relaying i2p traffic while also maintaining a long lived encrypted connection to your mobile in order to "push" data to it. In this way the user benefits from the anonymising network, contributes to the network, but doesn't have the battery drain of relaying packets from the phone (if this is even possible).
-end-to-end encryption. Perhaps OTR messaging for texting and perhaps openPGP for transferring binary files as I don't believe file transfer in OTR is available at this time.
-an app that uses the above network that is capable of sending/receiving encrypted text, audio, video, gps location etc and does not leak any personal information that you don't want leaked. XMPP might be a good choice (with perhaps out-of-band binary transfers for efficiency). Giving your unique identifier to another person that is using the same app would allow you to communicate with them while not revealing your phone number, imei, imsi, etc. There would be some latency in the communication especially with binary transfers but I would gladly accept that for the added security.
anyway, just wanted to add this to the conversation and hope to see this project take shape as we definitely need more security enabled os's and apps.
Ive been through the entire security forum. Must say till a little raw but it will mature hopefully. Still a lot of noobs talking and no serious dev talk. Im not a developer but I have done some research esp on encryption systems and keep myself updated with the loopholes in various apps. Until such time when they do join in I think it would be a good idea (esp if the higher-level know-its) would share their list of apps they use for their everyday functioning and especially how you currently protect yourself best against unwarranted attacks to the types other forums are talking about.
My list is:
K-9 mail : for email. I use APG with that though im still not convinced its worth it cause the keys would be a easy to 'reverse engineer' as you can easily detect the device you use to send the mail and thus an estimate of the computing power essentially showing them the narrow range of prime numbers in which the key could have been generated. But you would need to be a dedicated target for that. Plus its open-source and very popular.
Xprivacy: its good for apps with too many unnecessary permissions but it wont protect you against intruder attacks.
network connections: just switched over to this from wire shark. Still undergoing testing. But it tell you the current internet connections and seem promising. You can block the suspicious IPs using xposed framework called peerblock (look into the xposed mod index). Needless to say but I think blacklisting google would be perhaps make you life considerably old-fashioned esp if your plugging the google 'backdoor' access they provide to 'he-who-shall-not-be-named' organizations.
Browser: im using the native AOSP browser. Firefox would be a better alternative in my opinion to chrome or others. I wish we had chromium for android.
Quickpic: using it instead of the native gallery after i found that it was connecting to the internet.
Calander: using the native AOSP calander but deleted the calander sync cause i try to avoid relying on google too much. selectively Denied internet permission.
ES file manager: a very complete tool. root explorer with checksum built-in. denied internet permissions.
TextSecure : Using this for standard texting because it seems to offer more encryption that any other texting app at the moment. Plus its going to be the default messaging app in Cyanogen ROMs in the future. Offers One-Time-Pad system encryption which is encryption theoretically secure (what that means for the common man is that this encryption is the only one that has stood the test of time to be unbreakable of used properly. All other encryption systems rely on the fact that the decrypting systems used to 'crack' the encryption lag behind the algorithms. Lets hope the devs did implement it properly)
Remove Google from CM10+ ROMs : http://www.xda-developers.com/android/remove-the-google-from-cyanogenmod-with-freecygn/
"Not every user particularly cares for Google’s proprietary bits and its tendency to put them everywhere. As such, XDA Senior Member MaR-V-iN has created a script to clear out Google proprietary binaries from all CM10+ ROMs. Freecyngn disassembles the CyanogenMod settings app and replaces Google Analytics library with the free NoAnalytics. The whole process doesn’t break the Settings app, and turns your device into one that is Google-free"
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Click to collapse
Thanks to @SecUpwN for the site: www.prism-break.org As you will see by visiting this site its not secure but just a list of more open-source projects.
I dont use a lot of google products like gmail or chrome or maps but i would like to minus the uneasiness that i have using it. And i dont use public wifi at all. The great things in life are hardly ever free!
Needless to say but i use CM 10.1 since its well developed and open-source. Looking forward to omniROM by chainfire and other great devs. I do believe we need some serious stenographic programs for android because encryption alone is not the way to go. Maybe they will take this more seriously. This remains a work in progress. As always hit thanks if it helps.
CM is now for profit. It's CyanogenMOD Inc. Anyway, this is a pretty naive approach, IMHO. You want to keep something secret you can't tell technology about it. Check out "Schneier on Security."
where did you download "network connections" from?
@aejazhaq: See www.prism-break.org!
runwithme said:
where did you download "network connections" from?
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I downloaded it when the dev was giving the pro version free for a limited time to XDA members. How ever its available on the play store...https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.antispycell.connmonitor&hl=en
SecUpwN said:
@aejazhaq: See www.prism-break.org!
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Click to collapse
Yes i cam across that just a week ago. It seems to me as my knowledge progress' that the apps available are just to keep the selective data eg your mails private if you use APG with that. @pan.droid I think anything on your device is still as vulnerable as can be honestly and don't think, at least as of now that you can protect your data on you device with any satisfactory means, at least not yet. I'm interested in stenographic means more now than ever because I think encryption alone wont cut it esp keys generated on the phone; the prime numbers needed for a foreseeable future (3+ yrs) protection are elusive on the phone, perhaps the PC can do a better job, but again with its fallacies esp with emails being stored in the cloud permanently means that there's an expiration date on such material you choose to share. And given it lacks forward secrecy and anyone using PGP in emails is definitely shouting encrypted msgs being transmitted perhaps arousing more suspension and the subsequent package.
Thus I do agree the list is currently very naive but perhaps the best we can do at the moment. Thats why I'll leave people to share their opinions on this because this is perhaps an ongoing discussion.
I'm really interested in a contacts replacement. I hate the new style google version but I don't trust ANYTHING free from the app store. They all download your contacts!
You didn't mention AFWall+, the iptables firewall I consider instrumental in blocking most phone home attempts.
SecUpwN said:
@aejazhaq: See www.prism-break.org!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Actually, pretty great site!
pan.droid said:
Actually, pretty great site!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You're welcome. If you're interested in security projects, have a look!
I'd totally jump on board with that, but all I have is a WI-FI tablet, ATM. Great activist project for anyone serious about security.
pan.droid said:
I'd totally jump on board with that, but all I have is a WI-FI tablet, ATM. Great activist project for anyone serious about security.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Sadly, our project is missing real security enthusiasts and DEVELOPERS. Do you know anyone I should get in touch with?
I use "Keepass2Android Offline" to manage my passwords. This "offline" version removes Internet access permissions which I consider essential for security of my database.
== THREAD PURPOSE ==
I'm opening this thread to share and learn ideas about privacy solutions, please respect the purpose and keep this thread clean. My main language isn't English so if you spot errors or omissions please PM to me so I can correct them. Thank you.
All trolling or demotivating posts, disbelieving about privacy concerns or defending Google honor will be reported for cleaning.
== PROBLEM, HYPOTHESIS, TESTS, CONCLUSION ==
For years I've been very annoyed about privacy abuse on Internet and since Snowden and Assange revelations my concerns raised. I'm sure my personal and professional life is common and boring but I want privacy with my things just like I don't want a guy next table in the coffee shop listening to my talking subjects.
My first decision was to deploy a personal server, in my home, with OwnCloud. All went fine for some months until I realized the pain it was maintaining the system working, from server attacks and system fails to energy bills nothing could justify such paranoia. The OwnCloud Android client was also very bad those days.
The second idea was hosting OwnCloud and mail services on a private host, but this didn't made any sense because data wasn't encrypted and every employee could easily see my thermonuclear projects and my banana pancakes secret recipes. It was also a paid solution for nothing.
Finally I thought "If you're using German services you should be fine, Germany privacy data laws are the toughest in the world (even better than Swiss in this matter)". I'm in Europe so using European services was a no brainier decision, preferably in Germany and owned by German companies. Yes, I know you can't trust anyone but even so I think it's a well balanced solution.
== SERVICES ==
These are my services right now, share yours and try to justify why they're equal or even better. This list will be changed as needed:
Mail - GMX (Germany)
- Generally I really don't like 1&1 services but GMX is really good and working only on European servers. I advise you to don't use their other service, mail.com, because this one use USA servers. Unfortunately all other free German providers have low storage space. If you're willing to pay for privacy try Dutch StartMail but it's beta at the moment.
Contacts & calendar - fruux (Germany)
- Amazing services, great philosophy. For privacy and decentralization purposes I've opt for don't have this services on my mail provider. Unfortunately their servers are on Amazon Ireland, but I believe fruux have implemented cryptographic code on their system.
Cloud - HiDrive (Germany)
- I NEVER upload sensitive information to the cloud, even encrypted (remember Heartbleed and AES backdoor theory?). I was using Wuala for years but gave up after have been acquired by LaCie (USA). Tresorit shouldn't be trusted either, they're using Microsoft Azure servers, each uploaded and shared link pass through USA. Mega is darkness, I don't like the smell of it.
Apps - F-Droid (UK/France)
- FOSS is the way you should go, F-Droid is the obvious choice. F-Droid client was forked from Aptoide's source code.
Aptoide (Portugal) it's good but not consensual. Recently they're processing Google with Antitrust Complaint in EU proving they're concerned. You can only trust Aptoide IF you choose to install apps from their main centralized store (the default one, be ware and don't trust any other user store). http://m.aptoide.com/about
If you can't find what you're looking for then you can use Blank Store or Opera Mobile Store. Never choose Amazon Appstore, apps installed from there have proprietary code inserted.
Search engines - DuckDuckGo (USA!)
- Technically DuckDuckGo is a meta-search engine. It's amazingly good and you have lots of options to choose (did you know you can directly search images from Google if you search !gi [image you're searching for]?).
Another great alternative is Startpage (Netherlands).
== ANDROID SYSTEM ==
My Android system:
- CyanogenMod + freecyngn + NOGAPPS + SuperSU
- TWRP recovery
- Hardening Android for Security and Privacy
== APPS ==
My essential apps are:
Apps client - F-Droid (FOSS)
- See services above.
Privacy and cleaning - AdAway and AFWall+ (both OSS)
- Obvious choices on each privacy concerned system. Block almost everything, trust no one.
Android browser - Boat (proprietary code)
- I just love the options, specs, interface and speed. I know this choice will be highly controversial for some because it's a Chinese made browser, but isn't a cloud browser (like the also Chinese Maxthon) and it's really easy to firewall it from calling home (something somehow difficult with Dolphin). The obvious FOSS choice for almost everyone would be Firefox but I really hate their Android app and I have some bad thoughts about their Google connections. The FOSS best shot would be Tint or Lightning, but they're rather limited and AOSP it's even worse. Chrome it's obviously excluded for privacy sake.
Boat devs also used to be active on Xda with many supporters. For security precautions block port range 192.241.158.0/24 and 211.151.0.0/24.
Email app - K-9 (FOSS)
- The oldest, most forked and trusted email client. Needs a deep design/interface Overhaulin' (hey, Chip Foose...)
Contacts and calendar sync - Fruux + Birthday Adapter (FOSS)
- See services above.
Password & confidential safe - KeePassDroid (FOSS)
- Believe me, I don't know a single password of my accounts and I have hundreds. The only really big and complex password I know is the one from KeePass.
Antivirus - NONE, JUST DON'T
- I will not discuss here about the needs or true benefits of these apps but I can assure your data is leaking each time you go online. All them claim about privacy but they're always collecting "unidentifiable data".
== I will post links for everything soon. Please include links in your posts when justified. Thanks. ==
== Android Alternative FOSS ==
This is a list of some well known apps and their open source alternatives. Incredibly some of them are even better than "official" or paid apps, some others are quite limited but evolving and much secure.
It's impossible to put everything here, only the best apps I've tried with success will be listed. Please keep posting your suggestions.
BitTorrent Sync > Syncthing
Chrome > Firefox
Dolphin > Tint Browser
Dropbox > OwnCloud, Seafile
Facebook > Tinfoil for Facebook
Gmail > k-9 Mail
Lux Auto Brightness > YAAB
Tasker > SwiP
Titanium Backup > oandbackup
Twitter > Twidere
Reserved, just in case.
Really great thread sancho_panzer. I never thought someone can be as paranoid as I am, but I found you.
I'd like to add a few services:
Posteo (Mail):
A german email provider that doesn't claim as much data aa most of them do. It just needs your mail, pw of course and you can add your mobile phone number if you like to (it will be saved hashed in their database). Posteo has great SSL connections and uses a the first (german) provider the new protocol DANE as well as DNSSEC. You can use their CalDav and CardDav server and choose to encrypt your address book and your calendar. The service costs 1€ per month (10 cents for additional aliases and 20ct for the next gig), that can be paid by post mail, PayPal or bank transfer. The last two way won't get linked to your account.
CalDav/CardDav
To manage my addressbook and calendar on multiple devices I use aCal from F-Droid.
For googling issues there is a browser add on for PCs that tunnels the Google searchs for you called disconnect.me
Greetz, and i appreciate your love to FOSS very much!
@traceless There are lots of people on Xda concerned about privacy on Android and the Internet. I really hope this thread could help them to take some measures about it and share alternatives.
Thank you for https://posteo.de/ suggestion. Could be a great service problem is I don't speak German. I really don't understand why the website don't have an English version. I'm also concerned with recent leaks news about *.de domains ( http://www.bbc.com/news/technology-25825784 ).
I've tried CalDav-sync and CardDav-sync and they're great little apps, but if you want a FOSS solution try DAVdroid and the very new Flock from F-Droid.
I really can't trust https://disconnect.me/ . ( http://www.darkreading.com/document.asp?doc_id=1251070& ) or Ghostery, both track you ( http://www.reddit.com/r/firefox/comments/1qkc2b/disconnect_vs_ghostery/ ). If you're using Firefox on PC or Android my advice is to install Adblock Edge (Adblock Plus is worse and heavy) + Self-Destructing Cookies (BetterPrivacy is also great) + NoScript. You should also consider CleanQuit.
@sancho_panzer
I knew, that Disconnect was founded by a former Google employee but didn't know he was linked to the NSA. Anyway my current FF configuration looks just as you recommended, but I additionally installed a plugin that's called FireGloves. This is especially useful if you want to make fingerprinting your browser harder. It disables or disguises trackable settings; if you'd like to every browsing session. How unique ones configuration is, can be seen here at Panopticlick.
I agree, that it's a pity some services aren't available in the most common languages. Posteo's webmailer can be changed to English, but the whole service is German. Btw you don't have to be worried about the de ccTLD, the 16m mail that were compromised earlier this year were most likely taken due a hack of a german online shop and as the most customers were germans, the majority of the mails end up with *.de. So it doesn't mean every german domain is compromised and mail provider are insecure.
As you don't speak german you could take a look at Secure-Mail, a mail service provided by the mainly german VPN Perfect Privacy. It hosts in NL and supposes to store no identifiable data and is also encrypted. I found no setting to change the language to english on Secure-mail, but I thought I've seen it once in english, maybe it canges only if your country is english-speaking.
Flock is really nice, but I stay with aCal, cause it comes with a calender other than the integrated one and I'm not dependent on the built-in one with the (also switchable) Googl sync.
Excellent thread, thank you for starting it.
Edit : I think HTTPS Everywhere by the EFF should be mentioned in a thread like this.
https://www.eff.org/https-everywhere
sancho_panzer said:
I'm sure my personal and professional life is common and boring but I want privacy with my things just like I don't want a guy next table in the coffee shop listening to my talking subjects.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
It doesn't matter if you think you life is important enough to be watched or if it's just boring. The fact that you know you *could* be watched in every move you make, automatically changes your behaviour. It changes the way you think, it changes the way you speak and write. It influences the way you interact with others. Feeling watched makes you fear of what you do!
Opening a thread like this is a good thing to begin to overcome this fear. :good:
Good linux expert, my colleague, told me some finding, android wise.....
He has installed Android Firewall, and blocked every possible application and system modules, including kernel.
In apk log, found that all ip packets sent by android kernel are routed through some chinese ip address, regardless of theirs final destination.
After some research, turned out that this IP is used by NSA. Yes, all ip packets going out of our android phone are sniffed by NSA. Embedded in kernel.
My 2 cents here, and sorry if ot.
Cheers!
Sent from my GT-I9195 using Tapatalk
Nice thread, thanks! :good:
Some thoughts from my side:
I generally distrust every online service, especially if I don't pay for them. I think it is better to decentralise services and host them on self managed servers in families, groups of friends,... and thus basically only give data to trusted persons you know in real life.
Here are two good links that show alternatives to proprietary software/cloud services:
https://prism-break.org/en/
https://wiki.debian.org/FreedomBox/LeavingTheCloud
== SERVICES ==
Mail -
I think mails are generally difficult to self-host. So you need a good mail service. Posteo was mentioned here, another similar reliable german mail provider (with english translation) is mailbox.org. They even encrypt unencrypted incoming mails with your PGP-key before they store them.
Contacts & calendar -
Posteo and mail.org also include contact and calendar synchronisation via CalDav/CardDav. Even better: Host it by yourself.
Instant Messaging -
XMPP (Jabber) is an open decentralised protocol with lots of implementations for almost every platform. You can host it by yourself or use an existing server. There are also very good clients for Android like Conversations or Xabber
== ANDROID SYSTEM ==
Two additions:
Free Your Android! - campaign of the Free Software Foundation Europe
IMSI Catcher/Spy Detector
== APPS ==
sancho_panzer said:
Android browser - Boat (proprietary code)
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Don't do this! Firefox for Android is also a good choice. And Orweb not to forget!
traceless said:
I use aCal from F-Droid
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
DAVdroid is also a very good FOSS CalDav/CardDav-provider that integrates with the contacts/calendar app of android. And it is under active development (in contrast to aCal)
I can only agree that using posteo.de is a must. Completely anonymous. I put cash in an envelop (didn't actually touch any of it myself ) and they opened my account no problem. Last time I checked their site alao had an English version. Feel free to pm me with translation issues. I speak both languages fluently. Also a thread like this without XPrivacy?
For those interested in tor along with afwall, I have posted instructions on getting them to work together in the afwall thread
I prefer the Android system to be: OMNI + NOGAPPS + SuperSU
Note that freecyngn & NOGAPPS author has switched to OMNI
Regarding OwnCloud: it's a great software, but you're right not to trust it when it runs on some server that is not under your control. That's why I run OwnCloud on a Raspberry Pi that is running at my home, behind my firewall. Syncing is made with CardDAV and CalDAV, and both apps use SSL. I think I can trust that one.
dvdram said:
Regarding OwnCloud: it's a great software, but you're right not to trust is when it runs on some server that is not under your control. That's why I run OwnCloud on a Raspberry Pi that is running at my home, behind my firewall. Syncing is made with CardDAV and CalDAV, and both apps use SSL. I think I can trust that one.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
And what connection are you using? I thought about exactly the same solution, but it's nearly useless with ADSL.. (6 MBit/s down and just 60kbits upstream)
Thank you guys for your contribution on this thread.
Ultramanoid said:
I think HTTPS Everywhere by the EFF should be mentioned in a thread like this.
https://www.eff.org/https-everywhere
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
@Ultramanoid You're absolutely right I forgot to mention it, I use it with Firefox on my laptop and it's great.
dvdram said:
Opening a thread like this is a good thing to begin to overcome this fear. :good:
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
@dvdram I agree and don't understand why so much people just don't care to talk about it.
jukyO said:
Good linux expert, my colleague, told me some finding, android wise.....
He has installed Android Firewall, and blocked every possible application and system modules, including kernel.
In apk log, found that all ip packets sent by android kernel are routed through some chinese ip address, regardless of theirs final destination.
After some research, turned out that this IP is used by NSA. Yes, all ip packets going out of our android phone are sniffed by NSA. Embedded in kernel.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
@jukyO Lookout, the real test here should be made on a clean system, just ROM and a Firewall. That's the only way you can say it's kernel coded. Some apps use kernel to send and receive packets, your alert could be related to one of these.
Another debatable subject should be SElinux. Many ROMs, like CyanogenMod, have it in enforcing mode by default. If you install another kernel, like Alucard, SElinux become permissive. Even if SElinux is considered OS we all should not forget that was developed and implemented by NSA (!).
bastei said:
Here are two good links that show alternatives to proprietary software/cloud services:
https://prism-break.org/en/
https://wiki.debian.org/FreedomBox/LeavingTheCloud
== SERVICES ==
Mail -
I think mails are generally difficult to self-host. So you need a good mail service. Posteo was mentioned here, another similar reliable german mail provider (with english translation) is mailbox.org. They even encrypt unencrypted incoming mails with your PGP-key before they store them.
Contacts & calendar -
Posteo and mail.org also include contact and calendar synchronisation via CalDav/CardDav. Even better: Host it by yourself.
Instant Messaging -
XMPP (Jabber) is an open decentralised protocol with lots of implementations for almost every platform. You can host it by yourself or use an existing server. There are also very good clients for Android like Conversations or Xabber
== ANDROID SYSTEM ==
Two additions:
Free Your Android! - campaign of the Free Software Foundation Europe
IMSI Catcher/Spy Detector
== APPS ==
Don't do this! Firefox for Android is also a good choice. And Orweb not to forget!
DAVdroid is also a very good FOSS CalDav/CardDav-provider that integrates with the contacts/calendar app of android. And it is under active development (in contrast to aCal)
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
@bastei Thanks for your useful input. I know Boat would be controversial talk but if you read my comments you'll see I'm aware about the dangers of such decision. Even so I'm convinced about the safety of it.
Firefox is my primary choice on my laptops since the earlier version 3. Even if I tried alternatives on some occasions I've always returned to Firefox security and true development power (I always use it to analyse code and test all websites I make), the only real alternative was Opera (the original one with Presto engine, not the crap they use these days).
Android Firefox is a completely different beast. It's heavy, buggy, need extras for simple tasks like automatic close and clean or user agent changing, but above all WHY THE HELL CAN'T WE MAKE FOLDERS and organise favorites at will? The only solution I found for favourites was to sync them with my PC, organise all there and sync them back. Did I mentioned the ridiculous times it FC? Maybe in the future, right now the only FOSS I could consider is Tint Browser.
an0n981 said:
Also a thread like this without XPrivacy?
For those interested in tor along with afwall, I have posted instructions on getting them to work together in the afwall thread
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
@an0n981 XPrivacy and Xposed could be all we need IF they were OSS. The other problem are the inevitable lags introduced by these layers.
I've tested several configurations on my phones and tablets over the time but ultimately my OP describes my options at this moment. This subject isn't closed and will never be, there aren't perfect security systems, and that's the purpose of this thread, I'm sure the OP will be changed on some occasions. Please keep suggesting alternatives and solutions, your contribution will be greatly appreciated.
aelmahmoudy said:
I prefer the Android system to be: OMNI + NOGAPPS + SuperSU
Note that freecyngn & NOGAPPS author has switched to OMNI
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@aelmahmoudy OMNI is a valid CM alternative, developed and maintained by well know Xda developers. Unfortunately I don't really like the excessive cleanliness and limitations. The only way I could advise it would be complemented with Xposed+XPrivacy+GravityBox, besides NOGAPPS and SuperSU.
I can't talk for them but I believe @MaR-V-iN and many other ditched CM after the group became comercial oriented, the inclusion of analytical and proprietary code didn't helped either. CM it's still the base for lots of ROMs and I'm still convinced it's the best for me, provided that are VM snapshots and thoroughly cleaned and modded like mentioned on my OP.
sancho_panzer said:
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@an0n981 XPrivacy and Xposed could be all we need IF they were OSS. The other problem are the inevitable lags introduced by these layers...
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Both are 100% open source, just not distributed through F-Droid. You can compile them yourself, source is on GitHub. Security software will always add some lag.
an0n981 said:
Both are 100% open source, just not distributed through F-Droid. You can compile them yourself, source is on GitHub. Security software will always add some lag.
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You're absolutely right, my mistake. Still when I used them my system felt somehow lagging.
:delete:
err on the side of kindness
traceless said:
And what connection are you using? I thought about exactly the same solution, but it's nearly useless with ADSL.. (6 MBit/s down and just 60kbits upstream)
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I admit I have a bit more speed than you, but it depends on what you want to use OwnCloud for. I use it only for syncing calendars and contacts, and for that few bits of information even your speed is more than enough, although you should consider to do the first time syncing over WiFi. Later, when you add contacts and calendar entries, you won't notice much disadvantage.
Of course, if you want to sync pictures and movies, that speed will not be enough. But do you really need that? Is it not much more efficient to copy pictures and photos via USB cable, when you're at home? Do you really need to sync them while on the road?
That is what you need to ask yourself. Like I said: contacts and meetings are very small pieces of information, less than a text message. A 60k download (from your phone's point of view) is more than enough for that.
dvdram said:
I admit I have a bit more speed than you, but it depends on what you want to use OwnCloud for. I use it only for syncing calendars and contacts, and for that few bits of information even your speed is more than enough, although you should consider to do the first time syncing over WiFi. Later, when you add contacts and calendar entries, you won't notice much disadvantage.
Of course, if you want to sync pictures and movies, that speed will not be enough. But do you really need that? Is it not much more efficient to copy pictures and photos via USB cable, when you're at home? Do you really need to sync them while on the road?
That is what you need to ask yourself. Like I said: contacts and meetings are very small pieces of information, less than a text message. A 60k download (from your phone's point of view) is more than enough for that.
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Thanks. Firstly I wanted to use it for an alternative to Dropbox but then I found out the Cal- and CardDAV support. And you're totally right with syncing after first initialisation. Maybe I get an RPi later and try this one and also the owncloud feed reader [emoji2]
Any idea how to use the FF sync of owncloud, since FF only supports upgrading old accs to the new mozilla ones but personally I'd prefer the old way.
Greetz
Hello all! I'm sure most of you are familiar with Google Play Services, the base of Google's Android framework and the brains behind all the Google things you do on your phone. Less of you, however, might also know that Play Services is notorious for being a beast of an application that no one truly knows the function of.
Below here is a rough explanation of Play Services from what I know about it. You can skip this if you already know and move on to the bread and butter of this post.
Play Services is proprietary software, meaning that its source code is not available to the public. All of Google's apps are proprietary like this as well. While developers like Chainfire have legitimate reasons to close off their app source code so others don't steal it, and so does Google, it is extra worrying from a company that makes a profit off of collecting userdata. Many people, including me, do not trust Google with our data, so we try to avoid their products as much as possible.
I thought that it would be nice to create a megathread of sorts with various users' suggestions on how to subvert the constant surveillance of Play Services, while also attempting to maintain the useful functionality of it. Below are some of the primary methods that I have thought of, and that I and some others have tried:
LineageOS/CyanogenMod Privacy Guard - If you are using LineageOS or any derivative thereof, you can go to Privacy Guard and deny certain permissions from Play Services. I and another user have denied permissions from Play Services without side effects, but your mileage may vary. @javelinanddart said on Reddit that Privacy Guard does indeed block permissions from Play Services and other system apps, so rest assured that Privacy Guard actually does something rather than being a placebo.
XPrivacyLua - This is an Xposed module that feeds false data to apps rather than blocking it entirely. I haven't tried this method myself, but the XDA post I linked above reports that XPrivacyLua works, even in tandem with Privacy Guard.
microG - microG is an open-source alternative to Play Services. It emulates many key functions of Play Services - push notifications, location services, etc - without the data collection running alongside such functionality. To clarify, this is a full replacement for Play Services, so you would flash a microG package instead of a GApps package. There are lots of bugs, though, even admitted by the developer. If you want to learn more, I suggest you visit the XDA thread for it, or view the implementation progress for various pieces of functionality.
There is nothing else that I know of, so if anybody knows of another viable method or can provide their own experiences with the above ones, your contributions would be appreciated by me and the rest of the privacy community.
Thanks for thread.
My only reason to use custom ROM is because they are GApps-free. In nearly every other aspect stock ROMs are better. Phones without good custom ROM I simply setup without Google account and install f-droid and yalp stores.
Another idea:
Imagine: Google is not as evil as we think: there are many privacy related settings in your Google account. You can login with a web browser and try through all these settings - and hope.
Device is a Samsung i9305 with RR-N-v5.8.5-final, Magisk v16.0, XPosed, XPrivacyLua, microG (via NanoDroid). No genuine Google services; Google Play Store is the one and only Google application installed.
I hope it suits into this thread (thanks very much for creating it!), and I'd like to share my settings. Please refer to the screenshots; I think it's self-explaining where they where taken from.
Actually no restrictions to microG, only to Play Store.
Remarks: µG has no restrictions in the firewall (AFWall+ Donation Beta); Play Store only granted internet access via WiFi and VPN. Just for completeness; running a RaspberryPi in the home network with Pi-Hole installed and acting as the DNS-server in the network. Unless using the home network i.e. using a foreign WiFi network or mobile data, ALWAYS establishing my own secure VPN to my RaspberryPi (with PiVPN installed) via OpenVPN and again the Pi acting as the DNS-server. If interested in further details please refer to this thread.
Thanks for this.
I was considering asking for a forum section here devoted to privacy, but it doesn't seem like a popular subject here. (After all, most of the people who have already picked the most snoopery OS in the world could be assumed to be not particularly worried about privacy. ? )
I come from a different motivation: the hope that by using a somewhat hackable OS, one can theoretically modify it in ways to achieve one's objectives, including privacy. But the last few years have made it rather clear that the Big G is working determinedly to foil such efforts.
Lately that seems to take the form of pushing more and more essential services into the Gplay frameworks, and deprecating perfectly working things like GCM in favor of intertwining it with Firebase, which may saddle us with that analytics data vacuum in order to get another essential service, push notifications.
Re: revoking permissions from Gplay frameworks, I feel like Google's determination to get their hands on data by hook or by crook (eg their ignoring of user preferences to disable various radios and enabling them in the background anyway, to track location and such) means they will quite possibly circumvent these preferences at some point as well.
As I mentioned in another thread I've experienced various problems in the past when I tried to aggressively restrict perms on the Gplay services using CM/LOS Privacy Guard, but perhaps some of that came from choosing interactive restriction prompts rather than blanket revoking. I do know that so many essential services are tied-into the Gplay frameworks these days that blocking tons of perms will inevitably cause breakage of some things depending how you use your device.
Jrhotrod said:
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There is nothing else that I know of, so if anybody knows of another viable method or can provide their own experiences with the above ones, your contributions would be appreciated by me and the rest of the privacy community.
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Due to your request above, please allow me to draw your attention to two threads by me. In these threads I tried about one and a half year ago to initially capture but also to update how I believe to have enhanced the battery duration, privacy and security of my GT-i9305 and how I went for a GApps-free device with microG.
Over the time until today, some of the described implementations, applications and measures became absolete or were replaced by others (e.g. using NanoDroid - or Nanomod as it was called in the beginning, since it has come out). Some changes occured due to the step from Marshmellow to Nougat or the non-availabilty of the official Xposed framework for Nougat in the very beginning. However, over all the time I've tried to maintain both threads updated and amended but currently not to much occuring on that frontline, probably because I've received a privacy status on our devices that obviously satisfies me in my personal opinion.
Oswald Boelcke said:
Due to your request above, please allow me to draw your attention to two threads by me. In these threads I tried about one and a half year ago to initially capture but also to update how I believe to have enhanced the battery duration, privacy and security of my GT-i9305 and how I went for a GApps-free device with microG.
Over the time until today, some of the described implementations, applications and measures became absolete or were replaced by others (e.g. using NanoDroid - or Nanomod as it was called in the beginning, since it has come out). Some changes occured due to the step from Marshmellow to Nougat or the non-availabilty of the official Xposed framework for Nougat in the very beginning. However, over all the time I've tried to maintain both threads updated and amended but currently not to much occuring on that frontline, probably because I've received a privacy status on our devices that obviously satisfies me in my personal opinion.
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Wow, this is really great! Very high-quality thread.
Will add to OP later today
I apologise for the double post (original in my thread here) but I guess it also suits in this thread.
Found the below quoted post by @jawz101 in the XPrivacyLua thread here. Pretty interesting, and therefore I like to share:
Looking around on Data Transparency Lab website http://datatransparencylab.org/ - they fund grants for research in privacy stuff.
...I found an app called AntMonitor, an academic research project that does a MITM SSL cert + local VPN to look at sensitive traffic - even that which is encrypted. https://play.google.com/store/apps/d...it2.anteatermo
Anyways, it shows some apps trying to send my gps coordinates even though it doesn't have Android permission. Like, my coordinates are actually attempting to be sent encrypted to a destination. XPrivacyLUA doesn't trigger so I can only assume they grab my coordinates in a way that circumvents the traditional Android permission model.
To test, just try the app and open a few apps. I think it's apps with the Facebook graph API that is maybe doing it.
If you like ANTMonitor another app that does an SSL cert+ VPN is Lumen Privacy Monitor- a project by Berkely, but it doesn't seem to detect raw coordinates like ANTMonitor does.
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However, I suggest to also follow the discussion/conversation between jawz101 and M66B, which has developed after this post.
Oswald Boelcke said:
Found the below quoted post by @jawz101 in the XPrivacyLua thread here. Pretty interesting, and therefore I like to share:
However, I suggest to also follow the discussion/conversation between jawz101 and M66B, which has developed after this post.
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This is certainly an important discovery, thanks for the news.
Now for the sidenote that's 10x longer than the main comment. ?
One of the key issues I have with the various "privacy tools" is trying to figure out whether or not I trust all these entities that produce these diagnostic things to not be a solution worse than the problem when it comes to possessing and safeguarding my sensitive personal data.
It's getting to the point where I'm no longer enamored of giving *anyone* access to such stuff if I can help it, no matter *who* they are.
Even if they're not lying about their intentions and their commitment to security/privacy, there are still matters like carelessness/incompetence and targeted attacks to worry about.
@Exabyter: You're statement and expressed concerns are abolutely correct. Nothing to add except that I wouldn't limit it to "privacy tools" but especially include all applications that require root (and get it granted by the user) or all Magisk and Xposed modules. The latter should definitely concern.
My personal decision:
I'm not willing to trust anybody from the very beginning but I'm willing to trust single persons, groups or agencies. I've developed my own, private criteria, to which I stick but I've also admit the final decision isn't always based on rationality but also a lot on my feeling (in my stomage).
I don't held any confidential data on my device but privacy related ones, and I don't use my device for any kind of banking, shopping or payments.
I consider to use tools, modules and applications if their functionality rests within my defined specifications for the use of my device. Then I go for "the shopping tour" while I try to look into the details of the tools under closer examination, which includes where is it from, who's the developer etc.
I'll continue with the measures already described in one of my threads.
Oswald - I think we have largely similar stances on such things. In my case I will sometimes sway towards the pragmatic over the pedantic when the pedantic involves so many inconveniences that the tech becomes more of a burden than a help to me.
For example, I really don't like the idea of 3rd-parties keeping data pertaining to my daily geographic movements, but I also use several tools and services that by their nature rely on location data which could in some cases end up in the hands of parties I'd rather didn't have access to it. So I have to regularly weigh the apparent cost/benefit of such services and there are certainly some of them which have a high enough value to me that I willingly lower my default "protection level" in order to keep the other benefits of such tools/services.
Certainly microG is an important tool in that toolchest as it has a major disruptive impact on some of the most common ways Google and other parties snoop on users. But some of its imperfections also threaten to keep me from my ultimate goal of carrying a single phone which performs all the tasks I need to accomplish with it without undermining my privacy in a major way. (And ultimately, my freedom and agency as a citizen in a nominally and allegedly "free and democratic society", which is the actual "big picture" problem with privacy incursions in general IMHO)
I have spent several years now, with varying degrees of effort and success, trying to come up with a hardware/software solution to this problem, and I've never reached a point where I'm fully satisfied with the results. The fact that I am still carrying several mobile devices with me everyday is proof enough that I haven't achieved my objective in this regard and it gets tiring. As does all the time spent on venues such as XDA, researching, discussing and keeping-up with all the relevant issues, not to mention the large amount of time spent tinkering with HW/SW in order to keep all the special measures working. (And after we finally get things working more or less the way we want, we are faced with the particularly customized hardware wearing out, becoming unsupported, 3rd-party ROM and other compatible and necessary software being abandoned/deprecated, and so on and so forth.)
Truth to tell I'm a bit bitter about the amount of time/energy I have to spend to achieve something which should have been part of the mobile platforms in the first place. The current de-facto mobile platform duopoly certainly doesn't help matters.
---------- Post added at 03:39 PM ---------- Previous post was at 02:57 PM ----------
Now that I've gotten that philosophical rant out of the way ? ...
So as far as technical specifics:
microG of course is a big help as it either neuters or removes many troublesome anti-privacy vectors. For example, at the present time it does not support Firebase Analytics at all, which means (as far as I can tell) any app that expects to get telemetry on users via Firebase Analytics will not get anything if the app user's device is Gapps-free and using microG instead. (It remains to be seen if adding Firebase Cloud Messaging capability to microG will negate this presumed benefit. Cynics like myself are inclined to think one of Google's key objectives in deprecating Google Cloud Messaging and rolling push notification frameworks into Firebase instead was specifically to undermine the ability of users to avoid/circumvent Firebase Analytics)
XprivacyLUA looks interesting and is on my list to test. I found its predecessor Xprivacy to be an extremely tedious and labor-intensive option so I never seriously pursued it after my initial testing.
There are various tools I find handy to help get a sense of how dangerous certain apps may be to privacy. Here are a few:
AppBrain Ad Detector
https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.appspot.swisscodemonkeys.detector
Addons Detector
https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.denper.addonsdetector
Checkey (also on f-droid)
https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=info.guardianproject.checkey
Applications Info (also on f-droid)
https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.majeur.applicationsinfo
Permission Friendly Apps
https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=org.androidsoft.app.permission
I got a good Custom rom overview from this post, especially the google spreadsheet: https://forum.xda-developers.com/oneplus-6/how-to/custom-rom-t3867290
I looked into a coupe of those, and found some questioable features. For example: Havoc OS lists something like wather info on lock screen. This made me think about where this functionality would get the telemetry for my location.
TLDR; Are there any Custom Roms that are especially focused on user privacy or with this concern at least in mind?
In general I know about the custom rom Replicant but they only support very old smartphones. I decided that the Oneplus 6 is the perfect phone for me I also want to find the perfect custom rom.
If searched on google and the only the other os showing up is lineage. Other than beeing open source what would be the difference to lets say aosp extended regarding special features and privacy?
I won't be using gapp and i am still thinking about microg. Since Google is such a great company I wont get notifications without going though their ****ing gcm unless sacrificing significant battery life (more info: https://www.reddit.com/r/fossdroid/comments/9ayrgc/privacy_on_gcm_microg/ ).
Hi, I think when it comes to privacy, regular custom ROMs have little impact. As long as you're not using OOS or a port (like MIUI), all ROMs should be pretty good, as long as you don't install gapps.
Lineage has a good reputation, it's well known and they made a lot of basic apps so you don't need to rely on others (they're often based on older AOSP apps). LOS also comes with Privacy Guard, which is similar to the default Android permissions manager, but with a few extra options, including a very basic firewall. If you want to use microG, you have to go for a special edition that you can find here: https://lineage.microg.org/
But other ROMs are fine as long as you have the proper apps installed and a proper setup overall. You can check my thread which is related to microG but also privacy: https://forum.xda-developers.com/oneplus-6/how-to/guide-microg-oneplus-6-source-ligthway-t3874469/
Depending on your current knowledge, it's mostly a lot of reading about what apps you can use, what browser you should use, what firewall, what ad/tracker blocker, etc.
If you're on telegram, I'd recommend you join @nogoolag , it's full of useful notes about what apps to use, what settings are ideal, infos related to VPNs, etc.
EDIT: about weather in custom ROMs: you can usually very easily disable the service or even remove the related APKs, so it shouldn't be a criteria imo.
@Tomatot-
Thank you very much for you awesome reply. Your thread about microg helped me a lot. I will follow your guide there.