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Maybe I am the only one, but flashing roms and learning how to screw up my captivate, and more importantly learn how to fix it afterwords, has made me not really care about when my phone will get 2.2 or 2.3. The developers here have made roms that I believe are just as good, if not better than the "official" versions. Sure Samsung promised 2.2 a long time ago, but what is the fun in just a boring update? Am I the only one who feels this way, or am I just addicted to flashing?
Here, here!
The only thing an official AT&T update would bring at this point in the game, would be better custom ROMs.
IMVHO of course.
I respect your right not to be upset. Still, I think there are a number of things to be legitimately upset about - none of which are addressed by the ROMS on xda.
The restart issue: this problem has been known for a long time. Neither AT&T nor Samsung have made it easy to get a working phone. They denied the issue for a while. They then recognized it, but never made the exchange process easy. Look at all the random shutdown threads and see the mixed experiences people have had. To make matters worse, broken phones are often replaced with other broken phones. AT&T has been either too lazy or too cheap to pull the affected IMEIs from circulation. People have gone through 2 or 3 phones before getting one that 'works.'
My GPS doesn't work at all. I can stand out in the middle of a field and my phone will see 1 satelite. I get a lock every once in a while, but it NEVER has tracked. I've tried just about every GPS fix out there and none of them work for me (and I shouldn't need to try a bunch of fixes off some internet forum anyhow). Has there been any help from AT&T or Samsung on this issue? - No. They seem to pretend it doesn't exist. To make matters worse, some phones seem to work as expected - BUT some of those have the shutdown issue. People are afraid to turn in their screwed up phone with a working GPS because they might end up with a 'normal' phone with a broken GPS. That's outrageous. Seriously, it shows the truly pathetic quality of the Captivate and the companies that manufacture/distribute it.
There are features that came on my phone that have still not been enabled. Media Hub, for example, was billed all over the place as a great new feature - to be enabled later. It's later...much later. When do I get Media Hub? I don't see it. I can't get it to work via any custom ROMs (unless I'm missing something).
The way that AT&T and Samsung have handled this situation reads as a case study in poor customer service. Is it the end of the world? No. Is it enough to get me to avoid another Samsung phone? Probably. I bet many others would say the same.
Custom ROMs saved me from hating this phone and made it a really great device in every way I can think of, but it doesn't excuse AT&T+Samsung's lack of support on this device.
All I can say is thank goodness for people on this forum who have the interest, know how and drive to do what those companies have not done: make the Captivate a great device.
sarcasmo said:
I respect your right not to be upset. Still, I think there are a number of things to be legitimately upset about - none of which are addressed by the ROMS on xda.
The restart issue: this problem has been known for a long time. Neither AT&T nor Samsung have made it easy to get a working phone. They denied the issue for a while. They then recognized it, but never made the exchange process easy. Look at all the random shutdown threads and see the mixed experiences people have had. To make matters worse, broken phones are often replaced with other broken phones. AT&T has been either too lazy or too cheap to pull the affected IMEIs from circulation. People have gone through 2 or 3 phones before getting one that 'works.'
My GPS doesn't work at all. I can stand out in the middle of a field and my phone will see 1 satelite. I get a lock every once in a while, but it NEVER has tracked. I've tried just about every GPS fix out there and none of them work for me (and I shouldn't need to try a bunch of fixes off some internet forum anyhow). Has there been any help from AT&T or Samsung on this issue? - No. They seem to pretend it doesn't exist. To make matters worse, some phones seem to work as expected - BUT some of those have the shutdown issue. People are afraid to turn in their screwed up phone with a working GPS because they might end up with a 'normal' phone with a broken GPS. That's outrageous. Seriously, it shows the truly pathetic quality of the Captivate and the companies that manufacture/distribute it.
There are features that came on my phone that have still not been enabled. Media Hub, for example, was billed all over the place as a great new feature - to be enabled later. It's later...much later. When do I get Media Hub? I don't see it. I can't get it to work via any custom ROMs (unless I'm missing something).
The way that AT&T and Samsung have handled this situation reads as a case study in poor customer service. Is it the end of the world? No. Is it enough to get me to avoid another Samsung phone? Probably. I bet many others would say the same.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I had no issues exchanging my phone with random shutdowns...call att and exchange it
Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I897 using XDA App
delugeofspam said:
Here, here!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Where? Where?
sarcasmo said:
I respect your right not to be upset. Still, I think there are a number of things to be legitimately upset about - none of which are addressed by the ROMS on xda.
The restart issue: this problem has been known for a long time. Neither AT&T nor Samsung have made it easy to get a working phone. They denied the issue for a while. They then recognized it, but never made the exchange process easy. Look at all the random shutdown threads and see the mixed experiences people have had. To make matters worse, broken phones are often replaced with other broken phones. AT&T has been either too lazy or too cheap to pull the affected IMEIs from circulation. People have gone through 2 or 3 phones before getting one that 'works.'
My GPS doesn't work at all. I can stand out in the middle of a field and my phone will see 1 satelite. I get a lock every once in a while, but it NEVER has tracked. I've tried just about every GPS fix out there and none of them work for me (and I shouldn't need to try a bunch of fixes off some internet forum anyhow). Has there been any help from AT&T or Samsung on this issue? - No. They seem to pretend it doesn't exist. To make matters worse, some phones seem to work as expected - BUT some of those have the shutdown issue. People are afraid to turn in their screwed up phone with a working GPS because they might end up with a 'normal' phone with a broken GPS. That's outrageous. Seriously, it shows the truly pathetic quality of the Captivate and the companies that manufacture/distribute it.
There are features that came on my phone that have still not been enabled. Media Hub, for example, was billed all over the place as a great new feature - to be enabled later. It's later...much later. When do I get Media Hub? I don't see it. I can't get it to work via any custom ROMs (unless I'm missing something).
The way that AT&T and Samsung have handled this situation reads as a case study in poor customer service. Is it the end of the world? No. Is it enough to get me to avoid another Samsung phone? Probably. I bet many others would say the same.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
acctually there is a working media hub .apk in one of the forums and it works great
Wdustin1 said:
acctually there is a working media hub .apk in one of the forums and it works great
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Where? 10 characters
I agree, I love this phone and I'm thankful for samsung and AT&T not doing their job, because it's made people on these forums come up with some amazing roms/kernels/what-have-you.
The rom leaks developers are working on are part of a conspiracy. Think about it.
rwj5279955 said:
The only thing an official AT&T update would bring at this point in the game, would be better custom ROMs.
IMVHO of course.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yup! My Sentiments exactly.
fldude99 said:
Where? 10 characters
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
It was on the Epic forums.
I tried this a while ago on one of the early versions of cog and it worked fine, but I don't use it enough to keep it on my phone. But I can confirm that it did work for me.
sarcasmo said:
I respect your right not to be upset. Still, I think there are a number of things to be legitimately upset about - none of which are addressed by the ROMS on xda.
The restart issue: this problem has been known for a long time. Neither AT&T nor Samsung have made it easy to get a working phone. They denied the issue for a while. They then recognized it, but never made the exchange process easy. Look at all the random shutdown threads and see the mixed experiences people have had. To make matters worse, broken phones are often replaced with other broken phones. AT&T has been either too lazy or too cheap to pull the affected IMEIs from circulation. People have gone through 2 or 3 phones before getting one that 'works.'
My GPS doesn't work at all. I can stand out in the middle of a field and my phone will see 1 satelite. I get a lock every once in a while, but it NEVER has tracked. I've tried just about every GPS fix out there and none of them work for me (and I shouldn't need to try a bunch of fixes off some internet forum anyhow). Has there been any help from AT&T or Samsung on this issue? - No. They seem to pretend it doesn't exist. To make matters worse, some phones seem to work as expected - BUT some of those have the shutdown issue. People are afraid to turn in their screwed up phone with a working GPS because they might end up with a 'normal' phone with a broken GPS. That's outrageous. Seriously, it shows the truly pathetic quality of the Captivate and the companies that manufacture/distribute it.
There are features that came on my phone that have still not been enabled. Media Hub, for example, was billed all over the place as a great new feature - to be enabled later. It's later...much later. When do I get Media Hub? I don't see it. I can't get it to work via any custom ROMs (unless I'm missing something).
The way that AT&T and Samsung have handled this situation reads as a case study in poor customer service. Is it the end of the world? No. Is it enough to get me to avoid another Samsung phone? Probably. I bet many others would say the same.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Very well said! Btw, LOVE the screen name, lol.
I don't even own this phone, my gf does and I've done limited research so I could flash Cog2.3b8. The phone is WAAAAY better with Cog, but the gps blatantly disappeared on us halfway to our destination last weekend. I sighed and pulled out my mt4g which caught a lock in about 1/10th of a second and guided us there with absolutely no errors.
This made ME feel pretty stupid considering I gave her the phone as a gift. Thank god I bought it used and can probably sell it for what I paid for it.
From my limited experience with AT&T and Samsung I am furious. This phone had tremendous potential but I will avoid Samsung and AT&T like the plague from now on.
Delaying updates is one thing but the GPS issue is ****ing ridiculous. It's a joke!! There's no other way to describe it. You should all be irate and demand your money back.
Yes, T-mobile has had QC issues with the MT4G but everyone in the thread who has returned their phones has praised T-mobile for the way they handle their customer service, including myself. How many have had that experience with AT&T?
You should still be mad at Samsung.
Instead of making good ROMs great, we're making crappy ROMs good.
vunuts said:
It was on the Epic forums.
I tried this a while ago on one of the early versions of cog and it worked fine, but I don't use it enough to keep it on my phone. But I can confirm that it did work for me.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
It worked for me as well. I just didnt care for it. I would much rather have netflix. I have a different apk somewhere around here. If his doesnt work for you let me know via pm and I will send it... nm i just posted it
Phateless said:
You should all be irate and demand your money back.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Nah. I don't really need GPS, and last time I tried it outside my work building it got lock in about 2 or 3 seconds. I've tried it a couple of times while driving with mixed results. It seems to depend a lot on the area. As expected (or maybe not), it seemed to worked the best in the "wealthy" part of the city. I live in San Jose, Costa Rica.
Other than that I don't know. I haven't had any single random restart that I know it wasn't caused by me, same with charging death, mainly caused by bad UV settings.
I only used the stock rom for about 2 days before I moved and lagfixed it. I killed it once in a bad kernel flashing attempt. The fact that I can revive it using a home made usb jig makes me love it even more.
Right now, I just wished people could experience that same phone I'm experiencing. I think I'm in love with it.
I'm mad at both. My Captivate is my work phone, provided by my employer - so I am less comfortable flashing it to overcome the shortcomings of the standard AT&T build - yet I did root the phone and install the MobileAP so I can actually work when my client doesn't let me connect to their network.
My beef is on smaller things like - disabling tethering, not having more robust support for Exchange, the inability to sideload, or even load Android Market apps that AT&T doesn't want me to see.
As a work tool, I want my phone to let me work, and these limits, largely self-imposed are galling.
I've learned so much over the last week. I must have flashed my phone at least 20 times and got a few good bricks out of it too. Samsung and At&t can do what they want. These roms works much better than anything they could ever do.
Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I897 using XDA App
I'm not mad at Samsung or Rogers for the reasons stated above, I'm mad at them for broken promises as they relate to hardware - namely the USB-to-HDMI issue, which was a big reason for me to go with this phone over another. We were promised a software update to enable this and were even shown a cable on the official Sammy site, but nada.
Does it only boot up to the HTC screen and bootloop? Basically what I'm asking is, can Verizon Wireless tell if the phone is rooted or not? ;]
Yes.
Sent from my ThunderBolt using XDA App
So if I get someone stupid at the store, if they miss it and hand me a new device, I'm in the clear? And if I do it via mail, and I get the replacement before I mail my device in, how do they protect themselves that way?
edit: Take out the pronouns and add "one". I'm more interested for curiosity's sake, not frauding out VZW, I already went back to froyo, ha.
I don't know how they would know, but I believe they can, I think you may get a new/refurb but may see a charge for your bricked phone.
I can see it now... all these people turning in bricked phones for replacements under warranty.
Next thing you know Verizon will be checking every single phone returned to make sure there was no "tampering" that will void the mfg warranties.
Verizon employees are just regular people with regular 10$/hour jobs. The technicians aren't any sort of certified or even necessarily technologically inclined (not that they should be, they're not professionals with careers, they're working for an hourly paycheck). Hiring skilled technicians for these jobs would cost WAY too much dough so I dunno how they could feasibly do it.
miketoasty said:
Yes.
Sent from my ThunderBolt using XDA App
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I see what you did there.
-sent via 1.21 giggawatts of android.
Yufice said:
Verizon employees are just regular people with regular 10$/hour jobs. The technicians aren't any sort of certified or even necessarily technologically inclined (not that they should be, they're not professionals with careers, they're working for an hourly paycheck). Hiring skilled technicians for these jobs would cost WAY too much dough so I dunno how they could feasibly do it.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Let's see, most of the people on here are just "regular" people as well. You don't think that if Verizon wanted to, they could not write up a simple script for any employee to follow to check obvious tampering (i.e booting into hboot and checking for s-off?)
I mean, sure they wouldn't catch all of them, but don't you think they would catch some? Not that they would do it, but I'm sure they keep track of what goes on over here in no-no land (at least for Verizon).
Let's face it, trying to get around the "system" is what causes cell phone companies to keep trying to lock us down. When it starts to affect their bottom line, don't you think they may take some steps to mitigate the problem?
Just my two cents.
Dnakaman said:
Let's see, most of the people on here are just "regular" people as well. You don't think that if Verizon wanted to, they could not write up a simple script for any employee to follow to check obvious tampering (i.e booting into hboot and checking for s-off?)
I mean, sure they wouldn't catch all of them, but don't you think they would catch some? Not that they would do it, but I'm sure they keep track of what goes on over here in no-no land (at least for Verizon).
Let's face it, trying to get around the "system" is what causes cell phone companies to keep trying to lock us down. When it starts to affect their bottom line, don't you think they make take some steps to mitigate the problem?
Just my two cents.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
At least one reported bootlooping in hboot also so not sure if it's long enough to see S-OFF. Another said he was able to get into hboot and flash stock firmware and S-ON but it wouldn't boot and stock recovery bootloop'd everytime it was accessed.
The bootloop itself would be a red flag. Employees in stores would not have to do anything but note: bootloop issue.
Since the phone is tied to you, maybe they send phones exhibiting the issue to a special group of (trained) techs, who will go into more indepth diagnostics.
If it is obvious the phone was rooted (not saying they can tell or not), 1 month later you see a charge for 500 bucks for a phone!
Yikes!
Again, just my two cents.
funkybside said:
I see what you did there.
-sent via 1.21 giggawatts of android.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
At least someone did.
Verizon can't tell. Well they probably could if they wanted to but the time it would take to check the amount of phones they receive every day because of warranty replacements would not be worth it.
If I were you I would call and get a replacement the people on the phone just have you battery pull and try again then ship you a new one.
Finally, in the time it would take to tell that 1 phone was rooted they could have probably fixed 50 phones at that point and would void out any money they could charge you.
If it makes you feel better, I sent in a Droid 2 that was rooted and could still boot, got a new one with no charges.
I know this community is just "Regular" people, that's why I used the word regular; you have tons of arrogant posts of people saying "omg the verizon guy didn't even know what a kernel [email protected]!!!" when the verizon guy has no reason to care.
The problem is a lot of people in our community overestimate verizon/other carriers. Working at a verizon store, i've seen many of my less honest co workers do a warranty exchange over the phone/mail just because they didn't like the scratches they had put on the phone. A simple call to warranty saying "my phone reboots into a white screen sometimes" would get a new phone once every few months (up until the end of the one year warranty). Watching that go down really really really makes me doubt that there is some tech booting into HBOOT making sure it says S-ON. Even with a script, it's still a bunch of high school kids playing with a corporate giant's bank account: if they decide not to care and just give you a replacement, it doesn't effect them at all. I'm just curious if anyone working in a tech center can confirm that there is some second level testing going on.
Dnakaman said:
The bootloop itself would be a red flag. Employees in stores would not have to do anything but note: bootloop issue.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
This is just wrong. When someone comes up with a phone with a problem, the procedure is pretty short:
pull battery.
Check settings.
Factory Reset.
RSD Lite is no where near our dell computers. There are no fancy screwdrivers with fancy technicians. I check settings and see if there is anything out of the ordinary.
If the phone is bootlooping/white screen/otherwise inoperable there are two choices:
1) Pull the battery. If there is no water damage, try to turn it on. If it doesn't work, tell them to call 1-800-922-0204 and talk to Verizon Customer Service
2) Pull the battery. If there is water damage or obviously physical damage, call Asurian and give them 99 bucks for a new phone. That's it.
What I was asking was am I the last link in the chain? Or is someone double checking my "work"?
PJnc284 said:
At least one reported bootlooping in hboot also so not sure if it's long enough to see S-OFF. Another said he was able to get into hboot and flash stock firmware and S-ON but it wouldn't boot and stock recovery bootloop'd everytime it was accessed.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
This was me...as a last resort I used the first two files in this thread http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=1009423 and when I flashed the second file I did not receive the secitury warning so I'm taking it as the first one flashed.
When done flashing the frist two files in that thread my hboot version was S-ON
Yufice said:
I know this community is just "Regular" people, that's why I used the word regular; you have tons of arrogant posts of people saying "omg the verizon guy didn't even know what a kernel [email protected]!!!" when the verizon guy has no reason to care.
The problem is a lot of people in our community overestimate verizon/other carriers. Working at a verizon store, i've seen many of my less honest co workers do a warranty exchange over the phone/mail just because they didn't like the scratches they had put on the phone. A simple call to warranty saying "my phone reboots into a white screen sometimes" would get a new phone once every few months (up until the end of the one year warranty). Watching that go down really really really makes me doubt that there is some tech booting into HBOOT making sure it says S-ON. Even with a script, it's still a bunch of high school kids playing with a corporate giant's bank account: if they decide not to care and just give you a replacement, it doesn't effect them at all. I'm just curious if anyone working in a tech center can confirm that there is some second level testing going on.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Ya, I see what you are saying.
This is my take on this. I've had an Android device since day 1 when I got my G1. All of the phones I had got rooted at some point.
In the "early" days, you had more, shall we say for a lack of a better term... technically advanced people rooting devices.
Fast forward a bit...many "regular" people are wanting to root, seeing all the benefits that the "chosen" few have been enjoying since rooting was possible.
As a community, we accommodated these "regular" people by creating a Staples "that was easy button", in the meantime, the Android user base is growing by leaps and bounds.
Fast forward to now...technology has changed, the OS has become more sophisticated. Companies see the huge profitability in Android, so they want to hold on tightly to their treasure (locked bootloaders, etc). So now the "easy" button, is not as easy to push anymore, yet us "regular" people still want the "easy" button..."Why can't I just do a one click method???!!!!"
As Android continues to grow and get a larger base of users, there is becoming more and more exposure to the "dark side" of rooting devices for customization. Now although it sounds like things may be changing here in the future as far as how easy it may become to build customizations, at this time, it is still kind of a no no, in the eyes of corporate America. That being said, sure right now Corp America is not too concerned, but as the user base grows, it is possible that the economy of scales may tip the other direction.
Ok, stepping off my soap box now, LOL
All I know is that MANY people here (XDA) are talking about committing fraud.... Then the SAME PEOPLE complain about encrypted bootloaders.
I know this has been discussed before, but I am looking for new ideas. My problem is that due to $!#&@ TMO (I doubt this is HTC 's doing) I cannot change my voicemail from "My Carrier" to Google Voice!!
I have tried everything. In fact supposedly everything should work correctly right now. When I look at Settings>>Call>>Forwarding, all of the forwarding numbers (I.e., when busy, or no answer, etc) all forward to my GV number...and this is what T-Mobile tells me too (as if throwing their hands up in the air in exasperation). BUT, my voicemail number still says "My Carrier"
I keep racking my brain trying to figure out why this doesn't take when I enter *004*xxxxxxxxxx#. It attempts to change it, but then less than a second later I get an error. The only thing I can think of is that the TMO voicemail number still shows on my SIM card.
I don't have a SIM card reader other than this phone. So I was wondering if anyone knows how I could change this info via ADB somehow.
My only other option is to go through hours of phone tech support with TMO since regular customer service gave up. I would like to avoid wasting a half day. I would rather spend the time trying to figure it out myself instead of telling a TMO tech-support person "I can't take the God-damn battery out of the phone...do you know anything about your own branded devices??!!"
Thanks...
Sent from my HTC One-S (rooted), stock ROM
syntropic said:
I know this has been discussed before, but I am looking for new ideas. My problem is that due to $!#&@ TMO (I doubt this is HTC 's doing) I cannot change my voicemail from "My Carrier" to Google Voice!!
I have tried everything. In fact supposedly everything should work correctly right now. When I look at Settings>>Call>>Forwarding, all of the forwarding numbers (I.e., when busy, or no answer, etc) all forward to my GV number...and this is what T-Mobile tells me too (as if throwing their hands up in the air in exasperation). BUT, my voicemail number still says "My Carrier"
I keep racking my brain trying to figure out why this doesn't take when I enter *004*xxxxxxxxxx#. It attempts to change it, but then less than a second later I get an error. The only thing I can think of is that the TMO voicemail number still shows on my SIM card.
I don't have a SIM card reader other than this phone. So I was wondering if anyone knows how I could change this info via ADB somehow.
My only other option is to go through hours of phone tech support with TMO since regular customer service gave up. I would like to avoid wasting a half day. I would rather spend the time trying to figure it out myself instead of telling a TMO tech-support person "I can't take the God-damn battery out of the phone...do you know anything about your own branded devices??!!"
Thanks...
Sent from my HTC One-S (rooted), stock ROM
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Service related issues like no data or the inability to make calls is their specialty. Software issues like freezing, crashing and touchscreen issues they can assist, but when it comes to an OS that doesn't allow you to change the Voicemail number natively, thats not something that t-mobile can override let alone be at fault.
It's crazy how many people believe that the carrier is at fault for not being able to integrate a third party service or feature into their phones. Remember T-mobile is a carrier not a manufacturer. They didn't develop the OS or manufacture the device. [I just want to help put this in perspective.]
The only way this is going to be resolved is if Google develops an app that will override the default vm number. Aside from this, the only thing left is rooting your phone and finding a hack to change the number.
Im not trying to troll your post or anything. Just trying to lead you in the right direction.
It doesn't really matter if your phone says "My Carrier" or "Google Voice"...if you have GV installed, it should still handle your voicemail. You can call T-Mobile and have your conditional forwarding number manually changed on their end to your GV number but the phone will still say "My Carrier". There is a trick though...if you select Google Voice, wait a sec, then hit Home before you get the Failed message, when you go back in the call settings it will say Google Voice...Mine does!
hybridmonk said:
Service related issues like no data or the inability to make calls is their specialty. Software issues like freezing, crashing and touchscreen issues they can assist, but when it comes to an OS that doesn't allow you to change the Voicemail number natively, thats not something that t-mobile can override let alone be at fault.
It's crazy how many people believe that the carrier is at fault for not being able to integrate a third party service or feature into their phones. Remember T-mobile is a carrier not a manufacturer. They didn't develop the OS or manufacture the device. [I just want to help put this in perspective.]
The only way this is going to be resolved is if Google develops an app that will override the default vm number. Aside from this, the only thing left is rooting your phone and finding a hack to change the number.
Im not trying to troll your post or anything. Just trying to lead you in the right direction.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I don't think you are trolling, I just don't think you have your eyes wide open. Ask yourself... If the galaxy nexus from Sprint (also a carrier btw) can switch to Google Voice without a problem... Or even my TMO Androids in the past could switch from "My Carrier" (<<--hint hint, there is a test on this!) to Google Voice, but now suddenly on this new flagship TMO Android, I can't seem to switch it over... we have to ask ourselves the obvious question: if this could be done before, but now it can no longer be done, who stands to benefit from preventing Google Voice from being used instead of "My Carrier"? Ummmm.... Could it be MY CARRIER????
And please, I am not aware of the motivation which allowed your common sense to get off 3 bus stops ago but although TMO is not a manufacturer, do you think that HTC, out of some altruistic code of capitalistic benevolence, decided to generously install onto the One-S: Access My T-Mobile, T-Mobile Mall, MobileLife Contacts, Visual Voicemail, Bonus Apps, CarrierIQ, T-Mobile TV, Zinio, and Where's my Water? Each with their own HTC-designed garish magenta icons (where appropriate)? Or that HTC chose to make a many of these system apps and not regular uninstallable apps so that you needed to resort to ICS's "disable" feature (thank you Google), or, in the extreme case use Titanium Backup's 'Bloatware Melter' to rid your system of them?
Sure Google wrote the OS, and HTC was a little selfish in creating a mandatory integration of Sense into all Android phones (without having to root and flash another ROM which is not in everyone's ken), but I don't think Sense 4 is all that bad, so I commend them from removing their heavy hand at least compared to v. 3....
But without a doubt, the most greed-centric of this triad, T-Mobile, (while not a manufacturer, certainly has a few employees who can code I am sure), unilaterally directs, controls, or otherwise ordains that either HTC or another third party to integrate the above described software which has the sole purpose to create an unremoveable advertisement on your phone. This software therefore restricts, limits, egregiously impedes and restrains you from removing ~750MB from a phone which they marketed as having almost 30% more internal RAM then reality thereby duping the unenlightened masses from having full functionality of the phone they just spent $600 on.
Yeah.... You are right good sir!! T-Mobile is only a carrier... They would never try to make it difficult for a user to remove a component from the phone that only brings them value...you know such as their voicemail and visual voicemail.
I just must be a conspiracy nut.
P.S. My phone is rooted.
Sent from my HTC One-S (rooted), stock ROM
el_smurfo said:
It doesn't really matter if your phone says "My Carrier" or "Google Voice"...if you have GV installed, it should still handle your voicemail. You can call T-Mobile and have your conditional forwarding number manually changed on their end to your GV number but the phone will still say "My Carrier". There is a trick though...if you select Google Voice, wait a sec, then hit Home before you get the Failed message, when you go back in the call settings it will say Google Voice...Mine does!
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Wow that worked....Incredible.
syntropic said:
I don't think you are trolling, I just don't think you have your eyes wide open. Ask yourself... If the galaxy nexus from Sprint (also a carrier btw) can switch to Google Voice without a problem... Or even my TMO Androids in the past could switch from "My Carrier" (<<--hint hint, there is a test on this!) to Google Voice, but now suddenly on this new flagship TMO Android, I can't seem to switch it over... we have to ask ourselves the obvious question: if this could be done before, but now it can no longer be done, who stands to benefit from preventing Google Voice from being used instead of "My Carrier"? Ummmm.... Could it be MY CARRIER????
And please, I am not aware of the motivation which allowed your common sense to get off 3 bus stops ago but although TMO is not a manufacturer, do you think that HTC, out of some altruistic code of capitalistic benevolence, decided to generously install onto the One-S: Access My T-Mobile, T-Mobile Mall, MobileLife Contacts, Visual Voicemail, Bonus Apps, CarrierIQ, T-Mobile TV, Zinio, and Where's my Water? Each with their own HTC-designed garish magenta icons (where appropriate)? Or that HTC chose to make a many of these system apps and not regular uninstallable apps so that you needed to resort to ICS's "disable" feature (thank you Google), or, in the extreme case use Titanium Backup's 'Bloatware Melter' to rid your system of them?
Sure Google wrote the OS, and HTC was a little selfish in creating a mandatory integration of Sense into all Android phones (without having to root and flash another ROM which is not in everyone's ken), but I don't think Sense 4 is all that bad, so I commend them from removing their heavy hand at least compared to v. 3....
But without a doubt, the most greed-centric of this triad, T-Mobile, (while not a manufacturer, certainly has a few employees who can code I am sure), unilaterally directs, controls, or otherwise ordains that either HTC or another third party to integrate the above described software which has the sole purpose to create an unremoveable advertisement on your phone. This software therefore restricts, limits, egregiously impedes and restrains you from removing ~750MB from a phone which they marketed as having almost 30% more internal RAM then reality thereby duping the unenlightened masses from having full functionality of the phone they just spent $600 on.
Yeah.... You are right good sir!! T-Mobile is only a carrier... They would never try to make it difficult for a user to remove a component from the phone that only brings them value...you know such as their voicemail and visual voicemail.
I just must be a conspiracy nut.
P.S. My phone is rooted.
Sent from my HTC One-S (rooted), stock ROM
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Nice rant...not useful, but I hope you feel better...meanwhile the OP has solved his problem..
el_smurfo said:
Nice rant...not useful, but I hope you feel better...meanwhile the OP has solved his problem..
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Well the rant has its foundations in a valid customer complaint...you just happen to trigger it. I like TMO, as they by and large area more hacker friendly and usually their plan prices + things like Wi-Fi calling raise them far above their competitors. But it is with 100% certainty that they read these boards and know we are above average customers... Who love the hardware but appreciate them just the same. Would it be unreasonable (I am serious... Is this just too honest for a carrier to do?) To have them offer a clean Sense only version for $60 more? I didn't run the math, but it would allow them to (i) expose a practice their customers hate but that all carriers take part in for purposes of revenue generation, (II) give customers the option of getting a "better" phone without these space-stealing, CPU-hogging apps or services and still make the money up on the front end?
I know why they might be disinclined... Because it would draw focus to the fact that--just like IE in Windows NT, they would be sharing on thin ice by forcing users to use it even tolerate these apps. This in turn would expose all carriers to the scrutiny of the public (and maybe even draw official inquiries) on these issues forcing them to probably remove them, however, they would have little justification for raising the price (if they were forced to stop this practice I mean).
They all got into a little hot water over CarrierIQ, and overall, they are pushing it again with these flagrant "value-added" non-removable (and possibly illegal) pieces of software..simply for revenue at the expense of the customer; it's really a bad business practice. If they had any integrity, they would continue to act pro-customer as they have been (comparatively) thus far and try to make the word "carrier" not such an offensive one.. in other words, be different. Stop doing it, and advertise that they have stopped. Tell the truth.
Sent from my HTC One-S (rooted), stock ROM
syntropic said:
Well the rant has its foundations in a valid customer complaint...you just happen to trigger it. I like TMO, as they by and large area more hacker friendly and usually their plan prices + things like Wi-Fi calling raise them far above their competitors. But it is with 100% certainty that they read these boards and know we are above average customers... Who love the hardware but appreciate them just the same. Would it be unreasonable (I am serious... Is this just too honest for a carrier to do?) To have them offer a clean Sense only version for $60 more? I didn't run the math, but it would allow them to (i) expose a practice their customers hate but that all carriers take part in for purposes of revenue generation, (II) give customers the option of getting a "better" phone without these space-stealing, CPU-hogging apps or services and still make the money up on the front end?
I know why they might be disinclined... Because it would draw focus to the fact that--just like IE in Windows NT, they would be sharing on thin ice by forcing users to use it even tolerate these apps. This in turn would expose all carriers to the scrutiny of the public (and maybe even draw official inquiries) on these issues forcing them to probably remove them, however, they would have little justification for raising the price (if they were forced to stop this practice I mean).
They all got into a little hot water over CarrierIQ, and overall, they are pushing it again with these flagrant "value-added" non-removable (and possibly illegal) pieces of software..simply for revenue at the expense of the customer; it's really a bad business practice. If they had any integrity, they would continue to act pro-customer as they have been (comparatively) thus far and try to make the word "carrier" not such an offensive one.. in other words, be different. Stop doing it, and advertise that they have stopped. Tell the truth.
Sent from my HTC One-S (rooted), stock ROM
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Well, the did allow HTC to retain the "disable" on most of the bloat, so all we're really talking about here is Carrier IQ, pushing their own voicemail service and a few other little items...I'd say pretty good compared to the red themed monstrosities I used to get from Verizon.
Hey folks,
Does anyone know for certain (not speculation) how Verizon treats phones that have been rooted when you go to trade them in on the Edge program? Will a phone that's been rooted in the past be denied for Edge trade-in?
Thanks
So I called Verizon. They said that I would need to remove root in order to trade it in or "Edge-Up". I've read recently though that even if you unroot your phone, carriers can now detect the fact that at one point time it was rooted. Is this true?
MSmithXDA said:
So I called Verizon. They said that I would need to remove root in order to trade it in or "Edge-Up". I've read recently though that even if you unroot your phone, carriers can now detect the fact that at one point time it was rooted. Is this true?
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most phones can be returned to stock without a trace of root as long as the stock files are available.
check your phones specific forum for return to stock guides and methods to remove root indicators if that applies.
calling verizon and asking about root really was not wise. they usually make notes on your account when you call for future reference.
you may not have an issue later from calling them, but you defiantly stirred the hornets nest, so it is possible you will.
---------- Post added at 09:01 PM ---------- Previous post was at 08:55 PM ----------
MSmithXDA said:
Hey folks,
Does anyone know for certain (not speculation) how Verizon treats phones that have been rooted when you go to trade them in on the Edge program? Will a phone that's been rooted in the past be denied for Edge trade-in?
Thanks
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btw,
it doesnt matter what plan you are on, they dont allow rooting period.
as far as they are concerned, "when they find out it is rooted", your warranty is void, returns are not accepted, and trade ups are denied.
bweN diorD said:
calling verizon and asking about root really was not wise. they usually make notes on your account when you call for future reference.
you may not have an issue later from calling them, but you defiantly stirred the hornets nest, so it is possible you will.
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Well I didn't tell them it was me :silly: I pretended to be a new customer interested in service and just had these hypothetical questions. But they didn't have my account # or anything to trace it back to me. Thanks for the info though!
MSmithXDA said:
Well I didn't tell them it was me :silly: I pretended to be a new customer interested in service and just had these hypothetical questions. But they didn't have my account # or anything to trace it back to me. Thanks for the info though!
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I hope you didn't call them from the phone that's on your account.
I really wouldn't worry about returning a phone that is/was rooted, unless perhaps it was a Samsung with Knox tripped and/or a yellow triangle. It's simply not cost effective for them to check every phone. The reps at the store aren't trained for that sort of thing, and when it goes back to wherever they get refurbished, it's only the hardware that gets tested, and they flash a new factory image. They have to flash a new image, because even after a factory reset, sensitive data can still exist in the memory on the phone (data isn't actually deleted when you delete it, until it gets overwritten, formatted, or you use a special app that does that sort of thing). Certain things can remain the same after doing a factory reset as well. I did a factory reset on a Nexus 4 rooted with Towelroot, and root remained.
Case in point: When I was with Verizon, I rooted my Razr Maxx. I was new to this whole "root" thing (I did it to bypass their hotspot crap). I was having a problem with the Play Store; it wouldn't let me purchase/download ROM Toolbox Pro, regardless of if I did it on my phone or off the website. So I got clever and deleted it (with a warezed Titanium - I'm not proud, I paid for the legit version later) and reinstalled it. And every time I tried, the Play Store would FC instantly.
So I did a factory reset, and WTF? The Play Store was GONE. Some bloatware was back, like the Madden NFL demo and some stupid cartoony golf game, but the Play Store was GONE. Not so clever, I guess. So I bit the bullet and took it to a Verizon store, told them I did a factory reset and Play Store was gone (I left out the other stuff). They googled it for like half an hour before giving up and ordering me a warranty replacement.
At one point, a rep did ask me if I hacked it - I played dumb (how do you hack a phone?). If they were trained or experienced in the sort of things we do, they would have known that the only way this could have happened was if the phone was rooted and I did something. And, if I wasn't such a n00b, I would have known to change Play Store to a system app and it probably would have worked fine (this occurred to me the day after). I got the replacement, and never heard anything about the old phone. I didn't feel too bad about "screwing" them in to giving me a new (refurb) phone, because when I got the replacement, I saw that the screen on the old one was dim, yellow, and sickly compared to the newer one, so apparently there was something actually wrong with it. Months later, the battery on the replacement expanded to the point that it popped the screen loose. The battery expanded on it's replacement too. But that's beside the point.
The point is, when you return a phone, it gets tossed into a pile, and that pile gets sent back to whatever it is they do with them. The sales reps aren't trained for that sort of thing - if you have a problem they don't know off the top of their head, they just google it on the iPads they carry around, and if they come across a site like XDA, they probably ignore it because the lingo and jargon here is gibberish to them (hell, most of it's still gibberish to me, and I've been learning all I can for 2 years). So it gets tossed in to a pile and sent wherever, and wherever it's sent gets hundreds of piles a day, and it's simply not cost effective to check every device. The parts get refurbed, the factory images get flashed (to eliminate any residual sensitive data and ensure the version is up to date), and that's that.
So I really, really, wouldn't worry about it. Unless it's a Samsung and you tripped Knox, have a yellow triangle, or it reads as "custom" or whatever. If you unlocked the bootloader, relock it. Beyond that, don't worry about it. I'm not saying it's impossible that something might happen and they "find out", but it's extremely unlikely. And unlikely to have repercussions. Remember, they want your money. Above all, they want your money. Are they going to keep getting your money if they piss you off by not honoring a phone exchange plan that you're already paying more for? Are they going to keep getting your money if you're dissatisfied and choose to switch providers? Unlikely. A new phone to them is a couple hundred bucks. One more year of service is a grand. Don't worry about it.
Planterz said:
I hope you didn't call them from the phone that's on your account.
I really wouldn't worry about returning a phone that is/was rooted, unless perhaps it was a Samsung with Knox tripped and/or a yellow triangle. It's simply not cost effective for them to check every phone. The reps at the store aren't trained for that sort of thing, and when it goes back to wherever they get refurbished, it's only the hardware that gets tested, and they flash a new factory image. They have to flash a new image, because even after a factory reset, sensitive data can still exist in the memory on the phone (data isn't actually deleted when you delete it, until it gets overwritten, formatted, or you use a special app that does that sort of thing). Certain things can remain the same after doing a factory reset as well. I did a factory reset on a Nexus 4 rooted with Towelroot, and root remained.
Case in point: When I was with Verizon, I rooted my Razr Maxx. I was new to this whole "root" thing (I did it to bypass their hotspot crap). I was having a problem with the Play Store; it wouldn't let me purchase/download ROM Toolbox Pro, regardless of if I did it on my phone or off the website. So I got clever and deleted it (with a warezed Titanium - I'm not proud, I paid for the legit version later) and reinstalled it. And every time I tried, the Play Store would FC instantly.
So I did a factory reset, and WTF? The Play Store was GONE. Some bloatware was back, like the Madden NFL demo and some stupid cartoony golf game, but the Play Store was GONE. Not so clever, I guess. So I bit the bullet and took it to a Verizon store, told them I did a factory reset and Play Store was gone (I left out the other stuff). They googled it for like half an hour before giving up and ordering me a warranty replacement.
At one point, a rep did ask me if I hacked it - I played dumb (how do you hack a phone?). If they were trained or experienced in the sort of things we do, they would have known that the only way this could have happened was if the phone was rooted and I did something. And, if I wasn't such a n00b, I would have known to change Play Store to a system app and it probably would have worked fine (this occurred to me the day after). I got the replacement, and never heard anything about the old phone. I didn't feel too bad about "screwing" them in to giving me a new (refurb) phone, because when I got the replacement, I saw that the screen on the old one was dim, yellow, and sickly compared to the newer one, so apparently there was something actually wrong with it. Months later, the battery on the replacement expanded to the point that it popped the screen loose. The battery expanded on it's replacement too. But that's beside the point.
The point is, when you return a phone, it gets tossed into a pile, and that pile gets sent back to whatever it is they do with them. The sales reps aren't trained for that sort of thing - if you have a problem they don't know off the top of their head, they just google it on the iPads they carry around, and if they come across a site like XDA, they probably ignore it because the lingo and jargon here is gibberish to them (hell, most of it's still gibberish to me, and I've been learning all I can for 2 years). So it gets tossed in to a pile and sent wherever, and wherever it's sent gets hundreds of piles a day, and it's simply not cost effective to check every device. The parts get refurbed, the factory images get flashed (to eliminate any residual sensitive data and ensure the version is up to date), and that's that.
So I really, really, wouldn't worry about it. Unless it's a Samsung and you tripped Knox, have a yellow triangle, or it reads as "custom" or whatever. If you unlocked the bootloader, relock it. Beyond that, don't worry about it. I'm not saying it's impossible that something might happen and they "find out", but it's extremely unlikely. And unlikely to have repercussions. Remember, they want your money. Above all, they want your money. Are they going to keep getting your money if they piss you off by not honoring a phone exchange plan that you're already paying more for? Are they going to keep getting your money if you're dissatisfied and choose to switch providers? Unlikely. A new phone to them is a couple hundred bucks. One more year of service is a grand. Don't worry about it.
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the reason root remained after you did a factory reset is, factory reset does nothing more than wipe the data partition. root code is not inserted there, so it will remain in tact with the exception of the su app unless it is installed in system/apps..
the fact that you had bloatware return after a reset is odd, i have never heard this happen before. resetting does not modify, restore, or change the system partition in any way.
as for them finding the root, i agree it is unlikely, but it can and has happened. also, it doesn't have to happen right away. there have been several reports of charges for replacement phones applied to your bill, from modifications found after the return.
as for them caring if you leave for another carrier, they don't, plain and simple. this has been shown countless times over the years. many people leave them every day, and they don't do the slightest thing to try and stop them.
i seriously doubt they will let you strong arm them by threatening to leave after they find out you returned a modified phone.
T-Mobile will only do a 'temporary unlock' on an S8+ my friend gave me, so I've got 30 days til they lock it again (oddly enough they say we can do this 5 times....can't make sense of that but ok!)
I want to carrier-unlock/crack this handset and it doesn't matter to me if I 'trip' the CPU by rooting to do this (I don't care about not getting updates, am not even intending to use data on this handset just talk/text), though I'm not sure rooting is even required as I've read on Reddit about newer firmwares that you can flash to that, once flashed, will make the handset carrier-free - I'm hoping against hope that that's true and that there's a simple/straight-forward way to just update it and crack the lock but am doubting that, *but* if I'm OK with 'breaking' the functionality of data-usage/updates to android/etc, is there *any* possible avenue for flashing/anything to crack that lock? So long as I can still call/text I'd be happy, am more than fine 'taking it off the network' so far as data is concerned and hoping that would make *some* approach worthwhile, so far my best bet is taking a chance with sites that sell codes to unlock but I've read of people doing this only for the phone to be re-locked (presumably the carrier catches-on, this is part of why I think just disabling data completely would be a smart move for me to get&keep the handset unlocked, and losing data capabilities isn't a real issue for me in the first place as there's wifi everywhere anyways!)
Thanks for any suggestions of what I could look into, I know the 'lock' is on the cpu (snapdragon/US-based/t-mobile) so harder to get around but just can't imagine it's un-crackable w/o a tech on their side helping me (ie those 'unlock unit' sites, which I'm imagining are run by people who work within the telecom infrastructure if they're able to do what they claim- still is hard to believe they'd be able to do that very long w/o being shut-down, it's not like they're working via bitcoin-only or something!)
New1Phone said:
T-Mobile will only do a 'temporary unlock' on an S8+ my friend gave me, so I've got 30 days til they lock it again (oddly enough they say we can do this 5 times....can't make sense of that but ok!)
I want to carrier-unlock/crack this handset and it doesn't matter to me if I 'trip' the CPU by rooting to do this (I don't care about not getting updates, am not even intending to use data on this handset just talk/text), though I'm not sure rooting is even required as I've read on Reddit about newer firmwares that you can flash to that, once flashed, will make the handset carrier-free - I'm hoping against hope that that's true and that there's a simple/straight-forward way to just update it and crack the lock but am doubting that, *but* if I'm OK with 'breaking' the functionality of data-usage/updates to android/etc, is there *any* possible avenue for flashing/anything to crack that lock? So long as I can still call/text I'd be happy, am more than fine 'taking it off the network' so far as data is concerned and hoping that would make *some* approach worthwhile, so far my best bet is taking a chance with sites that sell codes to unlock but I've read of people doing this only for the phone to be re-locked (presumably the carrier catches-on, this is part of why I think just disabling data completely would be a smart move for me to get&keep the handset unlocked, and losing data capabilities isn't a real issue for me in the first place as there's wifi everywhere anyways!)
Thanks for any suggestions of what I could look into, I know the 'lock' is on the cpu (snapdragon/US-based/t-mobile) so harder to get around but just can't imagine it's un-crackable w/o a tech on their side helping me (ie those 'unlock unit' sites, which I'm imagining are run by people who work within the telecom infrastructure if they're able to do what they claim- still is hard to believe they'd be able to do that very long w/o being shut-down, it's not like they're working via bitcoin-only or something!)
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You can't (really) root US phones. You should be able to put a U(niversal) rom on it, though.
You can have it unlocked via some service, leaving out the U rom.