Related
The current state..
The last few days have been difficult. What has become clear now is that the Android Open Source Project is a framework. It’s licensed in such a way so that anyone can take it, modify it to their needs, and redistribute it as they please. Android belongs to everyone. This also means that big companies likes Google, HTC, Motorola, and whomever else can add their own pieces to it and share these pieces under whatever license they choose.
I’ve made lots of changes myself to the AOSP code, and added in code from lots of others. Building a better Droid, right?
The issue that’s raised is the redistribution of Google’s proprietary applications like Maps, GTalk, Market, and YouTube. These are not part of the open source project and are only part of “Google Experience” devices. They are Google’s intellectual property and I intend to respect that. I will no longer be distributing these applications as part of CyanogenMod. But it’s OK. None of the go-fast stuff that I do involves any of this stuff anyway. We need these applications though, because we all rely so heavily on their functionality. I’d love for Google to hand over the keys to the kingdom and let us all have it for free, but that’s not going to happen. And who can blame them?
There are lots of things we can do as end-users and modders, though, without violating anyones rights. Most importantly, we are entitled to back up our software. Since I don’t work with any of these closed source applications directly, what I intend to do is simply ship the next version of CyanogenMod as a “bare bones” ROM. You’ll be able to make calls, MMS, take photos, etc. In order to get our beloved Google sync and applications back, you’ll need to make a backup first. I’m working on an application that will do this for you.
The idea is that you’ll be able to Google-ify your CyanogenMod installation, with the applications and files that shipped on YOUR device already. Or, you can just use the basic ROM if you want. It will be perfectly functional if you don’t use the Google parts. I will include an alternative app store (SlideMe, or AndAppStore, not decided yet) with the basic ROM so that you can get your applications in case you don’t have a Google Experience device.
I’ll have more updates soon as I get all the code hammered out.
Thanks for all the support thru all of this.
http://www.cyanogenmod.com/home/the-current-state
The stuff Dreams are really made of....
I knew! Where there's a will there's a way! You can't keep a real boss down! Cyanogen I look forward to playing with this new stuff in the works. Rage on brother rage on, I for one honestly didn't want to leave android really, but I will continue to research back-up plans in case Google has anymore monkey wrenches laying around itching to be thrown...Good luck Cyanogen. We all owe you donations...real recognizes real! Dueces
This is great news Thank you!
fkn awesome!
this exactly what i thought and hoped would happen. everyone got in a tizy over nothing. so we have to back up before we flash which is just another way that the basic moder like myself can better understand the phone.
Does this means we need to wipe every time we flash a new rom?
tomvleeuwen said:
What do you guys think of sharing the 4.0.4 version over p2p networks?
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Everyone already has it.
Great
This sounds good, there is more than one way to skin a cat. I think they got upset when the new market app was released before they could get it out. They had to do something, but I think it will die down.
don't go there
tomvleeuwen said:
What do you guys think of sharing the 4.0.4 version over p2p networks?
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Cyanogen is doing his best to respect Google's legitimate copyrights, so suggesting that XDA get involved in distributing proprietary applications without a license only serves to undermine what is going on here. Mods: please remove.
ei8htohms said:
Cyanogen is doing his best to respect Google's legitimate copyrights, so suggesting that XDA get involved in distributing proprietary applications without a license only serves to undermine what is going on here. Mods: please remove.
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I posted this in another thread but it would seem to be pertinent to here too:
Loccy said:
Let's face it, strictly speaking, all ROMs are warez.
Personally I'm surprised that it wasn't the Hero devs who got into trouble first, but this was all just a matter of time. I never understood the bizarre fixation that cropped up recently with QuickOffice and everyone going "omfg it's warez can't include it in romz!!!111!1one!". Why QuickOffice and not, say HTC_IME, or Work Email, or any number of other binary blobs that ROM cookers include as a matter of course now that have been "acquired" from non-orthodox source?
The Hero ROMs, let's face it, give people a means of "turning" their old phone into the latest and greatest HTC device. Each stable Hero ROM on the Dream/Magic potentially means a Hero device purchase lost. HTC are being far more hit in the pocket than Google are here - which is why I'm surprised the cease and desist wasn't directed at them.
I do think, however, this site and the people who run it are going to have to pick a side at some point. Either the position is "this is a site for developers, and as long as copyrighted material is not hosted on here in a fashion that would make us liable*, we will not suppress the work of individual devs". Or, their position is "no copyrighted material in any form, be that in the form to links to offsite storage repositories (eg. Rapidshare), or any other method". XDA doesn't *need* to do this in order to ensure the site does not get into legal hot water. I suspect they *might* do it, however, as some kind of misguided moral stance (and in my view the QuickOffice preoccupation was an example of just this). But in my opinion if they choose the latter then XDA is over as a site for realistic Android ROM development (and indeed, Windows Mobile and other OSes, if they apply the same standards across all their boards).
* elaborating on what I mean here - if people attach zips directly to their posts, and those zips are stored on the XDA servers, then XDA as a site is potentially liable. Alternatively, if instead people give a URL or a search string whereby people can find a ROM, but those files are not physically stored on XDA, they are not - any more than Google is liable for the many copyrighted MP3s you can find links to via their search engine.
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The bottom line is that if ROM devs decided they were going to respect ALL legitimate copyrights, there'd be no Hero ROMs, no Windows Mobile ROMs, in fact no ROMs apart from barebones AOSP ROMs which do less than a stock ROM.
ei8htohms said:
Mods: please remove.
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And I'm sorry, that's just ignorant. Just because you don't agree with a sentiment doesn't entitle you to demand the mods remove it. If the mods want to remove it they will (and in my view that would indicate which "side" they were choosing.) Personally, I don't know what it's like elsewhere around the world, but here in the UK one is at least allowed to speak freely, if not necessarily act freely.
kudos to cyanogen!
Loccy said:
If the mods want to remove it they will (and in my view that would indicate which "side" they were choosing.) Personally, I don't know what it's like elsewhere around the world, but here in the UK one is at least allowed to speak freely, if not necessarily act freely.
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I think common U.S. practice is: if you speak freely, you get called names by people until you either cry or shoot them, thus proving to everyone that your original point is invalid.
But XDA has always had a policy of "if it doesn't get the site admins in trouble, it's probably ok." If memory serves, the site is in the Netherlands, and is subject to EU laws as to copyright, etc. I think that's important to remember when it comes to such things, since the EU laws as to intellectual property are in flux and not quite the same as those in the US or UK.
But the official policy is available in one of the toplevel forums here:
Flar said:
Hi Everybody,
We noticed that there is some confusion when it comes to posting sensitive material on xda-developers.com and mostly about what can and can't be posted.
We would like to clarify our point of view through this post.
Since the start of xda-developers this has always been a site that once in while has some sensitive material online, through the years this site has grown so big it's no longer possible to check every file on our servers or every post on the board, we also feel it wouldn't benefit the community if we did.
However with increased popularity comes an increased amount of legal complaints when sensitive material is found on our servers. Which is the reason why we have been more careful lately. Recently some sensitive material has shown up on the servers and we received legal complaints from companies who have the copyrights for this material, although we all feel this is very interesting and valuable material we cannot risk the future of xda-developers by ignoring the legal requests we receive, therefore this material has been taken offline.
We understand that maintaining the balance between legal and illegal is sometimes confusing and/or difficult but that is unfortunately how it works.
When it comes to posting sensitive material there are a couple suggestions we can make:
- if possible do not post the files on the xda-developers servers.
- use your common sense (if you feel something might not be legal it probably isn't).
- always keep in mind when posting software of any kind, that we will take it offline if there is a legal complaint from the copyright owner.
Warez is in no way accepted and will be removed upon discovery.
I hope this post will serve as a clear and valuable guideline.
Greetz,
Flar
Site admin.
P.s. When you have any questions you can always contact me or one of the moderators.
Last edited by Flar; 17th January 2007 at 10:14 AM..
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Everyone has an opinion, and they have, or should have, the right to decide for themselves what is correct. I am on the side of Cyanogen. I do not think what he did caused any harm or loss of revenue to anyone. We can not always have our way though, and I think that's the case here. I don't know him, but I do think he's smart enough to keep doing what he is EXTREMELY good at without putting himself in a bad position. It's just a stumbling block to get past. We are puting a lot of effort into pointing fingers and throwing around ideas, but if we placed this much energy into finding a fuctional solution, we might get past it a whole buch faster. A good army fights the war, not the battle.
Warez is in no way accepted and will be removed upon discovery.
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But every single ROM on here is warez to some extent or another! Certainly (just for example, I'm not picking on anyone specific here) Drizzy doesn't own the IPR for the contents of his Hero ROMs. I'm pretty sure the WinMo ROMs aren't being posted by Microsoft. If the policy is that "warez is in no way accepted and will be removed upon discovery", they're not doing much of a job, are they - every other post is "warez", if you take a strict interpretation.
I suppose I'm saying that "warez is in the eye of the beholder". I fully endorse the attitude "if it doesn't get the site admins in trouble, it's probably ok" - but I can't help thinking that relaxed attitude has been firmed up of late for whatever reason, given the QuickOffice oddness. I'm pretty sure no-one who own the IPR for QuickOffice was ever in touch (although do correct me if I'm wrong), so why the odd fixation recently?
Bottom line: stick to the attitudes and approaches that have made this site what it is, please don't start getting over zealous when there's no reason to.
Honestly did this need another topic though? I mean I'm all for good news like this, but add it on to one of the many topics that are out there. -.- (ready for flaming)
easy now
Loccy said:
The bottom line is that if ROM devs decided they were going to respect ALL legitimate copyrights, there'd be no Hero ROMs, no Windows Mobile ROMs, in fact no ROMs apart from barebones AOSP ROMs which do less than a stock ROM.
And I'm sorry, that's just ignorant. Just because you don't agree with a sentiment doesn't entitle you to demand the mods remove it. If the mods want to remove it they will (and in my view that would indicate which "side" they were choosing.) Personally, I don't know what it's like elsewhere around the world, but here in the UK one is at least allowed to speak freely, if not necessarily act freely.
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First off, I'm not demanding anything. I politely requested that the mods remove a suggestion that clearly seeks to circumvent the policies of XDA: We won't distribute warez. The poster knew the suggestion was specifically aimed at getting around the XDA policy, otherwise there would be no reason for a P2P distribution alternative in the first place.
A key component of intellectual property and copyright laws (at least in the US) is that the holder of the copyright must act to defend the copyright to some reasonable extent (no, I'm not a lawyer and I don't know what this entails exactly). Now that Google has acted to defend their copyrights in these instances, the line is clear. Google apps are paid apps (licensed to the handset manufacturers or service providers) and are not free to distribute without a license. Consequently, there shouldn't be much further debate about the fact that these are warez and are not to be distributed on or through XDA.
I'm not trying to attack anyone (the original poster, ROM devs or certainly yourself), but I am interested in XDA maintaining the high ground here and continuing to operate in a respectful and respectable manner.
Perhaps we should stay on topic?
te5ter said:
Perhaps we should stay on topic?
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Fair point. Maybe we should take the "warez is in the eye of the beholder" debate to this thread. I do actually think it's a fascinating debate, personally. Oh, incidentally, just re-read my earlier post, and want to apologise to ei8htohms - I didn't mean to come off quite so brusque.
First, I'm very happy that there seems to be a workaround that Cyanogen feels comfortable in using.
However, I see it as a band-aid to a much larger problem. Yes, it addresses those few apps that Google specifically mentioned. But there seems to be potential future conflicts that could adversely affect this whole Android community.
What about all the other apps in there? The Camera/Camcorder/Gallery app for instance. The UI? Other HTC bits? And the biggie, the Search component? Does Google also lay claim to unified search, the widget, the particular framework involved in that?
I don't know the answer to that, I'm just asking. So much is left unanswered, I just feel this is only the beginning. For now, I guess it may be enough. But it still leaves so much up in the air.
Now the 2nd major issue: Cyanogen should be commended for taking the high road here and doing his best to adhere to Google's current request. I think we all know that there was never ever any question that no one saw this coming. It came from left field and shocked everyone beyond belief.
But will other rom devs be as diligent as Cyanogen? Will theme developers adhere to this? And with all of these added steps required to get a functioning "Google Experience", consider the flood of newbie questions this forum is about to endure. We all thought "brick" and "hardspl" questions were tedious at best ... prepare yourselves for the onslought of mass confusion. That fun has just begun.
I still believe the burden lies with Google to make this right. I'm not saying they should make their apps open source by any means. I'm just saying that there must be a way for Google to allow the inclusion of their apps (perhaps a different license or maybe some encryption trick that protects the apps from modification <I don't know, I'm not that smart>). Google needs to step up to the plate in this. They also need to save-face and stifle this PR nightmare. Android does not need this, Google does not need this, HTC does not need this, carriers do not need this, Cyanogen does not need this, and users do not need this. Growth of the entire Android project is simply too important. I see this as speed bump. They just made the bump too big and it needs to be shaved down some so everyone can get it over without damaging anything else.
this is great news indeed. can't wait to see what is to come!
Google should change policy stating any changes to the google experience they can keep and use as there own. If people want to make there stuff better with out getting paid for it so be it. Instead of a liability they have developement for what ever dessert they plan on cooking up next. We are a small community the masses don't know what they are missing and it seems like google dosent know what they are missing either
1. http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=565510
2. how is the related to development of the android platform for the htc dream
3. in before the lock
We really really really didn't need a new thread started about this.
Feel free to add your comments to the other 21,348 XDA threads about the same subject.
hotadef said:
Google should change policy stating any changes to the google experience they can keep and use as there own. If people want to make there stuff better with out getting paid for it so be it. Instead of a liability they have developement for what ever dessert they plan on cooking up next. We are a small community the masses don't know what they are missing and it seems like google dosent know what they are missing either
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UUUUUuuuuuuuuggggggghhhhhhhh
Google should change policy stating any changes to the google experience they can keep and use as there own. If people want to make there stuff better with out getting paid for it so be it. Instead of a liability they have developement for what ever dessert they plan on cooking up next. We are a small community the masses don't know what they are missing and it seems like google dosent know what they are missing either
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thanks for your input but when you learn to post in the corrent place your thoughts will be considered inane
Why should they? Do you donate all your earnings to charity?
We all need a level of profitability, and google, being a corporation, is pretty greedy about theirs, but you know what, that's their decision.
The community needs to stop bickering about policy and start working towards fixing the problem.
As jbq said, we need to make AOSP usable, right now it's not, and devs have been very negligent about this aspect. Mostly, devs have been making their own apps (which improve nothing over AOSP) or modifiying the existing google builds, but AOSP, the only public domain aspect of android, has remained untouched and up to now only google has been contributing to it.
It's time us, as devs, start making of Android an OS, not just a framework that OEMs can take and add their proprietary bits on top and of little use to anybody else.
david1171 said:
1. http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=565510
2. how is the related to development of the android platform for the htc dream
3. in before the lock
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dude you must post like 50 times a day .. i gotta step my game up
i think xda should just start temp banning whoever posts another anti-google thread just for idiocracy
and lastly RE to the PORTED
xidominicanoix said:
dude you must post like 50 times a day .. i gotta step my game up
i think xda should just start temp banning whoever posts another anti-google thread just for idiocracy
and lastly RE to the PORTED
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Meh ... Yea .... I'll 2nd that.
~enom~
Google is a monster ...!
Whatever is said on the Google - Cyanogen afair ... one facts remains: Google has become a defacto monopolist which intends to make the Internet a "Pay for Use" business finally ... you will learn it. Microsoft has proved how to suck the money from everybody in the world and Google intends to make it even better.
This saying a person who himself is leading a company struggling for a maximum profit!
Regards
7
Automization said:
Whatever is said on the Google - Cyanogen afair ... one facts remains: Google has become a defacto monopolist which intends to make the Internet a "Pay for Use" business finally ... you will learn it. Microsoft has proved how to suck the money from everybody in the world and Google intends to make it even better.
This saying a person who himself is leading a company struggling for a maximum profit!
Regards
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honesty stop beating this dead horse. Seriously. Everyone just stop. All you're doing is cluttering the forum that helps noone.
My asus and my four year old inspired me to publish my first android app: Removed the name till OP informs me what he wants too do . Impress no one at the coffee shop when you go from laptop to tablet and the sound of your favorite childhood toys transforming emerges.
Are you geek enough?
can't post a link as a noob but if you are the kind of person who wants an app like this then chances are you are capable of finding it in the android market.
jerarts said:
My asus and my four year old inspired me to publish my first android app: Androidabot Transformer. Impress no one at the coffee shop when you go from laptop to tablet and the sound of your favorite childhood toys transforming emerges.
Are you geek enough?
can't post a link as a noob but if you are the kind of person who wants an app like this then chances are you are capable of finding it in the android market.
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I was waiting for someone to make this
Cool idea...
Others sounds?
We have a small issue.
You can not publish too an app that has too be bought
Rule 12:
11. Don’t post with the intention of selling something.
Don’t use XDA to advertise your product or service. Proprietors of for-pay products or services, may use XDA to get feedback, provide beta access, or a free version of their product for XDA users and offer support, but not to post with the intention of selling. This includes promoting sites similar/substantially similar to XDA-Developers.com.
Do not post press releases, announcements, links to trial software, or commercial services. unless you’re posting an exclusive release for XDA-Developers.com.
Encouraging members to participate in forum activities on other phone related sites is prohibited.
Off-site downloads are permitted if the site is non-commercial and does not require registration.
Off-site downloads from sites requiring registration are NOT encouraged but may be permitted if the following conditions are met:
A) the site belongs to a member of XDA-Developers with at least 1500 posts and 2 years membership who actively maintains XDA-Developers' support thread(s) / posts, related to the download,
B) the site is a relatively small personal website without commercial advertising/links (i.e. not a competitor forum-based site with purposes and aims similar to those of XDA-Developers.com.)
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I thought about making it configurable to switch from cartoon transform sound to the movie one. I had a version that was my kid saying "doot doot doot doot" which was awesome for no one but his parents. Other ideas? I guess I could just make it so that you could point it to your own sound file easy enough.
Sorry about that Mikey. I'm sure I probably clicked through those rules somewhere without reading them close enough (or at all ).
I'm fine with leaving the edit you made as is, or whatever. I would like to keep the thread open to continue to get feedback about the applet if possible.
Thanks!
jerarts said:
Sorry about that Mikey. I'm sure I probably clicked through those rules somewhere without reading them close enough (or at all ).
I'm fine with leaving the edit you made as is, or whatever. I would like to keep the thread open to continue to get feedback about the applet if possible.
Thanks!
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or make a free version for xda users or separate the app on the market with a donation app for the main app
can anyone tell me about their experience with these donation apps? Does anyone actually donate?
funny. How about Optimus saying "Autobots, Roll Out"? Cartoon version, not the movie!
jerarts said:
can anyone tell me about their experience with these donation apps? Does anyone actually donate?
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If the app or live wallpaper is worth it, also if i keep it on my phone for more then 4 days, yes i will hit up their donation link.
Most of them are .99-1.49.......that in no means will break me.
Or link the donation in the settings menu of your app.
I never made much with the donation approach. The freemium (free version / premium paid version) model works pretty well though.
Sent from my PC36100 using XDA App
shamwich said:
funny. How about Optimus saying "Autobots, Roll Out"? Cartoon version, not the movie!
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sure, why not both?
bedoig said:
I never made much with the donation approach. The freemium (free version / premium paid version) model works pretty well though.
Sent from my PC36100 using XDA App
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Haha, I guess I'd have to come up with some more features before that was an option. How about embedding AdMob and the like? Any experience/luck with that model?
Depends on the type of app. I'm guessing your user wouldn't spend much time in the app other than changing a few settings. I have an app that's similar (basically just an on/off switch for a function), and it makes essentially nothing from adds. It has around 25k users, but over the last four months or so I've made about $15 from ads.
On the other hand, ads can be an incentive to upgrade to the premium, ad-free version.
I'd say add extra sound effects, remove the ads, and sell the premium version for a buck. In my experience, one dollar is the psychological barrier where the user has to be really convinced how awesome something is to spend any more.
bedoig said:
Depends on the type of app. I'm guessing your user wouldn't spend much time in the app other than changing a few settings. I have an app that's similar (basically just an on/off switch for a function), and it makes essentially nothing from adds. It has around 25k users, but over the last four months or so I've made about $15 from ads.
On the other hand, ads can be an incentive to upgrade to the premium, ad-free version.
I'd say add extra sound effects, remove the ads, and sell the premium version for a buck. In my experience, one dollar is the psychological barrier where the user has to be really convinced how awesome something is to spend any more.
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Thanks for the tips! Good point about not spending time in the app. When enabled my service launches itself on startup so I was thinking I could throw an add in users face then.
FWIW I tried the flip side of AdMob (advertising through them) and didn't notice even the slightest bump in sales. Have you had any better luck with that?
Can u add the ability to choose our own sound?
Sent from my HTC Glacier using XDA Premium App
jerarts said:
Haha, I guess I'd have to come up with some more features before that was an option.
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Just a suggestion, perhaps have as free the bare basic 1 sound, one function, then premium gives more sounds and the ability to add your own. And then possibly add sounds to more functions (if possible) such as screen on, or hinge up or down, stuff like that.
KeeperXV said:
Just a suggestion, perhaps have as free the bare basic 1 sound, one function, then premium gives more sounds and the ability to add your own. And then possibly add sounds to more functions (if possible) such as screen on, or hinge up or down, stuff like that.
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Good suggestions. I'm thinking I'll def'ly add more sounds since I've had several requests for that now. I'm trying to decide if the set-your-own-sound feature should belong to a new app, since this one is transformer themed, and that would make it more general purpose.
Never tried advertising through admob. If I ever make enough money from admob to buy a campaign I might try advertising. Might take awhile, lol.
I'd be careful about introducing ads outside of your own UI. Personally, I don't think an app that I'm not actively using should have the right to show me ads. I know apps have gotten banned from the market for doing similar. There's even some company that offers a drop in solution for creating notification bar ads outside of your app; seems a bit shady to me.
Sent from my PC36100 using XDA App
XDA, remove Gift Celestial Fury Ad-Free from my 'thank you' columns.
I did NOT give you permission to add it to all my posts.
Gifting 'me' is actually gifting YOU money and NOT me.
STOP the deception. I mean it.
lol...sorry?
We don't need your permission to add a forum feature. Never have, never will.
Also, please explain this Gifting 'me' is actually gifting YOU money and NOT me.?
You DO get gifted. The gift you receive is an ad-free experience on XDA.
I already have an ad free experience. I don't need any gifts from XDA. Don't presume that it's in my best interest to have it there when we all know it's in XDA's best interest. XDA can't even be up front about it. Now, it's called a forum feature? Right. . . This point is where your LOL is more suitable.
It's obvious who the money is going to. XDA can just stop leeching off our thanks - that's my point but your second line suggests that XDA is too arrogant to care what its users think. Good job.
Celestial Fury said:
your second line suggests that XDA is too arrogant to care what its users think. Good job.
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Had your post been the least bit mature, I would have responded accordingly.
There is nothing immature about my complaint. Had XDA given us an option to turn it on or off there would be nothing to complain. I support XDA with my threads/posts but not with something I have no choice over and XDA is all about choice.
Celestial Fury said:
It's obvious who the money is going to. XDA can just stop leeching off our thanks
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What does this mean Sir? I'm thinking you have misunderstood this feature, as it has zero to do with thanks.
This 'feature' is placed in the same row as 'thanks' so it's basically saying: instead of or besides thanking me you can also thank me by paying on behalf of me to get ad-free XDA, except that:
I'm not the one asking for it but since it's there people might think that I am (and I've never asked for money or anything and don't even have my Donate button activated)
The implementation is not across the board and people might think that it is individually activated (until, like me, it appears for them and they go look for the setting to turn it off and find that there is none)
Clicking on that link for any user leads to an option to pay money to KC Online Media, LLC (which is most likely acting on behalf of XDA or its top management) so that XDA can remove ads for a certain user - meaning that the money goes to XDA and never to the user which is how the remove ads from XDA for the user will work
It is only ethical for XDA to get its users' consent (see first point). Anything else is just sly marketing and considering how often XDA puts down companies who engage in devious promotional tactics, I would think XDA would hold itself up to the same high standards.
Bottom line, forum feature leads to social ramifications.
Celestial Fury said:
This 'feature' is placed in the same row as 'thanks' so it's basically saying: instead of or besides thanking me you can also thank me by paying on behalf of me to get ad-free XDA, except that:
[*]I'm not the one asking for it but since it's there people might think that I am (and I've never asked for money or anything and don't even have my Donate button activated)
[*]The implementation is not across the board and people might think that it is individually activated (until, like me, it appears for them and they go look for the setting to turn it off and find that there is none)
[*]Clicking on that link for any user leads to an option to pay money to KC Online Media, LLC (which is most likely acting on behalf of XDA or its top management) so that XDA can remove ads for a certain user - meaning that the money goes to XDA and never to the user which is how the remove ads from XDA for the user will work
[*]It is only ethical for XDA to get its users' consent (see first point). Anything else is just sly marketing and considering how often XDA puts down companies who engage in devious promotional tactics, I would think XDA would hold itself up to the same high standards.
Bottom line, forum feature leads to social ramifications.
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You are over thinking this big time my friend.
It is across the board, for one. Only present on 2015 theme I think. So no one is thinking you yourself are asking for a gift. It's under every users posts. Except perhaps those that already have ad free. (if it isn't, then it could be a glitch, as new features can have)
XDA is not really advancing income on this, as they lose ad revenue obviously for anyone with ad free. And at the end of the day, a site that is free to register on, with over 7 million members has every right to earn a little where it can to help keep the site running. There is nothing unethical or abnormal about it.
The owners decided to offer ad free to members, and make it giftable, and they don't need my, yours, or anyone's permission to do so. This is a private site, and they own it.
I can say that with 7 million members, only one has complained about this completely optional feature, that I'm aware of.
And let's be realistic, many use ad blockers anyway, so it's definitely not a mandatory feature. Is it?
Your opinion is noted though. :good:
Celestial Fury said:
The implementation is not across the board and people might think that it is individually activated (until, like me, it appears for them and they go look for the setting to turn it off and find that there is none)
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It most certainly is across the board. As Darth said, it's not on all forum themes. But you're no different to anyone else.
Celestial Fury said:
meaning that the money goes to XDA and never to the user which is how the remove ads from XDA for the user will work
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If you're here for money, you're here for the wrong reasons. Plus you haven't set up your donate button, so it obviously isn't that important to you. If you are expecting donations, setting up your donation button might be a good idea.
Celestial Fury said:
It is only ethical for XDA to get its users' consent (see first point). Anything else is just sly marketing and considering how often XDA puts down companies who engage in devious promotional tactics, I would think XDA would hold itself up to the same high standards.
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Bottom line, forum feature leads to social ramifications.
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You really are missing the point here. The point of it is to give something back to the user. Just like on Reddit if someone "gives you gold". That's all it's intended for. I have no idea why you think it's all about the money coming back to XDA. A few dollars is going to make absolutely zero difference to the XDA funds. If anything, the loss of ads is going to mean they lose income.
You need to stress less and stop overthinking this.
It's not across the board and even for the same person with the same forum theme, some posts have it and some don't. I doubt XDA is losing money over this otherwise they would not be promoting it by sticking it onto every other post. If they were then they would be incompetent and unable to maximize profit and XDA is anything but incompetent. Just because something is free doesn't mean we have no say it in especially when they stick it to the bottom of our posts and make it seem like the USER is asking for it and they most certainly need the users' permission if they're going to stick it to our posts. Otherwise, they can stick it somewhere else where it is clear it is not the user asking for it but XDA itself. If this feature is optional, where's the button to turn it off? Fix that and there won't be anything left to say. Why the reluctance? The first person to notice a rot has the obligation to speak up lest the rots spreads by which time it will be entrenched and even harder to remove.
Since, I've specifically said that I haven't asked for money or anything or even have my donate button active it beggars the mind to imply that I am here for money. I don't want users to think that I am now asking for money with that 'ad-free' ADVERTISEMENT placed on our behalf without our consent. XDA is missing the point. Compare their editorials and opinion pieces where they lambast others when they do something wrong or unethical with what they are doing now. The amount is not the issue but the principle and the ethics - that is don't link XDA's request for money (in the form of gifting users) with users posts when the users are NOT the ones asking for it. It's certainly not a language problem but a cultural one, maybe. Do as I say but not as I do, and all that. XDA needs stress less and stop monetizing through sly means.
Celestial Fury said:
It's not across the board and even for the same person with the same forum theme, some posts have it and some don't.
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As I said, it IS across the board. It will appear on every post that has been thanked by someone.
Celestial Fury said:
XDA needs stress less and stop monetizing through sly means.
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I think you need to stress less. We haven't had anyone else make any complaints about this. 1 out of 6 million is a pretty good indication.
Hi everyone,
I must confess Microsoft Launcher is my favorite third-party launcher. I like the look and feel of it, and the weather-and-clock widget looks more natural and is more accurate than all the other weather widgets I've used since I switched to Android a few years back.
However, it seems that this launcher is using much more battery than others. It may have to do with the localization service kicking in every time I wake up the screen to update the weather widget, but it also seems to tap battery out in other, more invisible ways.
Are there Microsoft Launcher users around here, who have noticed that too? If so, what did you do to improve battery life while using this launcher?
Yes, high battery consumption is a feature of this launcher, which is not just a launcher. I stopped using after the interface and settings changes happened too often. I went back to Nova (pro).
ze7zez said:
Yes, high battery consumption is a feature of this launcher, which is not just a launcher. I stopped using after the interface and settings changes happened too often. I went back to Nova (pro).
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Yeah, I figured as much. Color me cheap, but paying for a launcher really irks me, because I think it goes the same as for Web browsers: they should be free, or at least offer enough of a good end-user experience without having to shell out the dough.
I know devs have to make a living and that's perfectly normal, but we're talking about an app launcher here, not some complicated pro application.
Anyway, my reasoning is probably faulty as frunk, but I'm really reluctant to pay for something like that.
Anyway, I'm going to pay more attention to Microsoft Launcher's battery consumption. I've disabled My Feed because I don't use it. I'll see what it nets me in terms of battery life.
Thanks for your input!
UglyStuff said:
Yeah, I figured as much. Color me cheap, but paying for a launcher really irks me, because I think it goes the same as for Web browsers: they should be free, or at least offer enough of a good end-user experience without having to shell out the dough.
I know devs have to make a living and that's perfectly normal, but we're talking about an app launcher here, not some complicated pro application.
Anyway, my reasoning is probably faulty as frunk, but I'm really reluctant to pay for something like that.
Anyway, I'm going to pay more attention to Microsoft Launcher's battery consumption. I've disabled My Feed because I don't use it. I'll see what it nets me in terms of battery life.
Thanks for your input!
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Lawnchair 12 launcher is also very good if you don't want to buy Nova launcher pro features
UglyStuff said:
Y
Spoiler: post
eah, I figured as much. Color me cheap, but paying for a launcher really irks me, because I think it goes the same as for Web browsers: they should be free, or at least offer enough of a good end-user experience without having to shell out the dough.
I know devs have to make a living and that's perfectly normal, but we're talking about an app launcher here, not some complicated pro application.
Anyway, my reasoning is probably faulty as frunk, but I'm really reluctant to pay for something like that.
Anyway, I'm going to pay more attention to Microsoft Launcher's battery consumption. I've disabled My Feed because I don't use it. I'll see what it nets me in terms of battery life.
Thanks for your input!
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I bought in a promotion for 0.99, after using the free version for a year.
I believe that any application that does not impose ads on me is worth the small fee.
UglyStuff said:
Yeah, I figured as much. Color me cheap, but paying for a launcher really irks me, because I think it goes the same as for Web browsers: they should be free, or at least offer enough of a good end-user experience without having to shell out the dough.
I know devs have to make a living and that's perfectly normal, but we're talking about an app launcher here, not some complicated pro application.
Anyway, my reasoning is probably faulty as frunk, but I'm really reluctant to pay for something like that.
Anyway, I'm going to pay more attention to Microsoft Launcher's battery consumption. I've disabled My Feed because I don't use it. I'll see what it nets me in terms of battery life.
Thanks for your input!
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"reasoning is probably faulty as frunkv"
Blatantly, and your intellect is on display using the MS launcher and trying to find solutions for it.
People like you dont just need to think before they speak, they need to research.
TimmyP said:
"reasoning is probably faulty as frunkv"
Blatantly, and your intellect is on display using the MS launcher and trying to find solutions for it.
People like you dont just need to think before they speak, they need to research.
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Well, I'm certainly glad I entertained you. Thanks for your input.
Everything that is developed has work put into it. It really irks me the wrong way when someone just randomly states they believe certain software should be free followed by some asinine "its just a launcher not some..."
Same thing when people fault developers for not being open source, demanding they post the source on github for something like an emulator which just blows my mind completely. Its just such a blatant and ignorant display of entitlement...
I could point out you're wrong in more ways than one, but that would be a waste of time, I presume. I develop ad-hoc software for companies, mostly console/CLI jobs to crunch numbers in relation to database management (statistics, probabilities, etc...), and I do get paid FOR SOME OF IT.
Not ALL OF IT.
SOME OF IT.
Why? Because the purpose of some of my work is to facilitate other people's jobs, and it's deeply appreciated. I could wrap a nice eye-candy GUI around what I do, package it nicely and sell it... Or not.
Most devs I know don't do dev to get outrageously rich. They do dev for the challenge, to learn how to code better, and yes, because they want to help other, not very fortunate people.
Otherwise, why would there be free Web browsers, office suites, PDF-editing tools, video encoding software, and so on, and so forth?
If you are a good developer and you want to make money, good for you, and I wish you the very best, but free software, open-source or otherwise, serves a purpose.
You've got to give a little to get a little.
Wow you have got to have some major social issues. I dont even know how to respond to that.
You have some very serious issues dude. I wont be responding to your nonsense or propagating your personal problems. Get help please.
MODERATION INFO
A reminder to all members, especially those who may have forgotten that you are on a sharing forum.
This is about sharing ideas, solutions, helping and not being nasty in the answers.
Here is a reminder of the rules of conduct on this forum.
2. Member conduct.
2.1 Language: XDA is a worldwide community. As a result, what may be OK to say in your part of the world, may not be OK elsewhere. Please don't direct profanity, sexually explicit language or other offensive content toward Members or their work. Conversely, while reading posts from other members, remember that the word you find offensive may not be offensive to the writer. Tolerance is a two-way street.
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2.3 Flaming / Lack of respect: XDA is about sharing and this does not involve virtual yelling (flaming) or rudeness. Flaming or posting with a lack of respect is unacceptable. Treat new members in the manner in which you would like to have been treated when you were a new member. When dealing with any member, provide them with guidance, advice and instructions when you can, showing them respect and courtesy. Never post in a demanding, argumentative, disrespectful or self-righteous manner.
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I think these are simple rules to know and apply.
So I invite all those who have forgotten them to reread them and apply them for .... ad vitam eternam
I hope that no mod will have to take sanctions in the future.
Have a good time on xda and good sharing
Sib64
Moderator
UglyStuff said:
paying for a launcher really irks me, because I think it goes the same as for Web browsers: they should be free, or at least offer enough of a good end-user experience without having to shell out the dough.
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UglyStuff said:
my reasoning is probably faulty as frunk
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You have answered yourself there.
Every work requires time and effort. It is very strange to expect something to be free when you understand that. That really would be called 'entitlement' which has absolutely no justification.
UglyStuff said:
Most devs I know don't do dev to get outrageously rich. They do dev for the challenge, to learn how to code better, and yes, because they want to help other, not very fortunate people.
Otherwise, why would there be free Web browsers, office suites, PDF-editing tools, video encoding software, and so on, and so forth?
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As a developer yourself, you probably already know that a majority of so called free stuff aren't really free. They are just a means to collect data and earn revenue through advertising or tracking.
UglyStuff said:
free software, open-source or otherwise, serves a purpose.
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That purpose need not necessarily be for the benefit of the consumer. Open source is a just as risky as closed source because:
1. There is no one auditing the software continuously. One can always release an open source malware that can do a lot of damage before being caught.
2. There is zero accountability, because developers are often anonymous.
Well, to each his/her own, I guess. All I know is, given the chance, I would contribute again to some free software project, especially if it's open-source.
(And by the way, you're wrong about open-source being more dangerous than closed-source, because there IS some auditing being performed on a regular basis, and since the code is readily available, anyone can contribute and point out what's wrong with it, if anything.
Software companies that chose the proprietary route are more prone to sweep the dust under the rug than open-source vendors, precisely because no one really knows what's inside their code. You know what they say, about how you don't wanna know how sausages are made? Well, there you have it.)
Anyway, thanks for your input. Let's consider this topic as solved and closed, since the battery life on my 9 is better now that I have disabled my Feed.
Cheers guys, and don't let bitterness invade your heart! 🫶
What is happening to society? The passage of knowledge? This sort of thing is happening everywhere, and its ruining everything.
*Like Uglystuff you are being blatantly insulting to potentially millions of people rn. Do you just not care?