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Regarding Samsung's "Warranty Bit" Sh**(Originally from http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?p=49345592)
For those of you who are as ticked off as I am about Samsung's new warranty bit/voided warranty behavior due to a suspected E-fuse in their latest devices, YOU (yes, YOU) need to speak up and make sure that Samsung executives are starkly aware of who pays for their 50' yachts and their effing Bentleys! Tell them that your support for them is easily dissolved and that this new "practice" of theirs is one of the quickest and easiest ways to dissolve it.
Consumers are the ones who pay Samsung's bills. This is a truth that they would rather not acknowledge, but given a force that's great enough in numbers, they will yield to the will of their consumers.
Just look at Microsoft and Windows 8 (8.1), as well as their recent release of Office 2013 (license transfer). Microsoft has got to be one of THE most stubborn corporations in the world right now, but even they have yielded to the overwhelming force that is the consumer, and more specifically, their bank accounts. Ever heard the phrase "money talks"? Oh, it most certainly talks.. We as consumers have the ability to make our money talk collectively, so, if we want to see an end to this new way that they're giving their customers the shaft, we need to join voices and speak UP.
Drown them with emails, light up their tech support lines, and paint this picture for them as clearly as you can. Tell them that you WILL NOT continue to purchase their devices when they deny warranty service simply because of a "warranty bit", or for other ridiculous and non-sensical reasons, and tell them that Knox should come as an OPTION and NOT A MANDATE. I've listed a few ways to do that below. If anyone else has other/better ways of doing so, then by all means, share with the class.
Samsung USA's online customer feedback form: https://contactus.samsung.com/customer/contactus/formmail/mail/MailQuestionProduct.jsp?SITE_ID=1&titleCode=1
Samsung USA's toll-free customer service phone number: 1-855-SAM-USA1 (1-855-726-8721) 9am – 9pm ET, 7 days a week
Samsung Mobile USA's Facebook page: https://www.facebook.com/SamsungMobileUSA
If there's a forum on XDA Developers or ANY OTHER WEBSITE where you think this post might help spread the word about this, then you have my expressed written consent to copy this entire post (verbatim, from beginning to end please, including this part at the bottom) and re-post it WHEREVER you think it might help this cause. I've attached a text file that includes this post, as well as all the formatting/coloring (Attention Re-Poster: please re-attach the same text file).
Go, contact Samsung NOW!
(Reserved)
Every Android phone I've ever bought came out of warranty when rooted. In Note 3, Samsung just found a way to detect rooting, that's all. Nothing else changed, so I don't think this is going to have much effect.
aydc said:
Every Android phone I've ever bought came out of warranty when rooted. In Note 3, Samsung just found a way to detect rooting, that's all. Nothing else changed, so I don't think this is going to have much effect.
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But you even cant flash stock FW, nor downgrade, which will lead to 0x1 flag. Also, did you see amount of RAM tat knox uses? And you tell me % of users that need knox? Most expensive device, with many weaknesses that they didn't address, but they forced us to accept knox. No choice, or to stay on 4.2.2. And everything with no clear explanation!? I won't buy their product soon!
Sent from my GT-I9505
jjnhl68 said:
But you even cant flash stock FW, nor downgrade, which will lead to 0x1 flag. Also, did you see amount of RAM tat knox uses? And you tell me % of users that need knox? Most expensive device, with many weaknesses that they didn't address, but they forced us to accept knox. No choice, or to stay on 4.2.2. And everything with no clear explanation!? I won't buy their product soon!
Sent from my GT-I9505
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Good - don't.
Knox is included and everyone knows that, it's in the box and everywhere.
Downgrading is a security risk and rooting is technically an exploit.
Knox uses very little RAM (if you uninstall the main apk which doesn't even require root)
I can't believe we're still talking about ram usage of some small apps even if we've got 2/3 gbs of ram to spare...
Skander1998 said:
Good - don't.
Knox is included and everyone knows that, it's in the box and everywhere.
Downgrading is a security risk and rooting is technically an exploit.
Knox uses very little RAM (if you uninstall the main apk which doesn't even require root)
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But then, KNOX using no RAM would be better. If half the owners of Note3 don't use KNOX, what's the point in it even using any?
Why have a device that's so powerful but then put on software that just hogs. 2.5GB memory yet the TouchWiz and the other crap that Samsung put in it take up so much.
OP, after reading your post, I find it very difficult to comprehend the exact purpose and reasoning that you are trying to convey. After all, it sounds that you are merely butthurt that you got denied warranty because you tampered with your device.
However, you must try to understand how the business world works first.
Your issue is a problem that a miniscule portion of the market experiences. Those of us who consider themselves "leet haxxorz" tend to enjoy tinkering with their devices to streamline the user experience. However, things often go wrong - phones and tablets get bricked. Then the frustrated consumer heads back to Samsung to demand repair/exchange.
As a corporation, Samsung must have noticed that this was costing them a significant amount of money, and hence KNOX was created as a comprehensive tool with a feature to instantly diagnose whether product has been tampered with.
The average user that understands absolutely nothing about technology could care less whether KNOX exists or not.
And as long as KNOX will save the company money in the long run, your persistent complaints will accomplish absolutely nothing. Don't forget that we represent a fairly insignificant portion of the market. Encouraging users to tamper with products encourages liability which costs money. Money that no company is willing to pay.
The only advice I can offer you is to ensure you are not voiding any sort of warranty before you partake in certain activities. By doing research I was able to avoid the 0x1 situation, and retain my warranty. Of course, I had to sacrifice rooting and installing a custom ROM.
jjnhl68 said:
But you even cant flash stock FW...which will lead to 0x1 flag...
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no ppl have flashed stock roms without tripping their knox..
jjnhl68 said:
...nor downgrade, which will lead to 0x1 flag...
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as the other user said this can be considered a security issue so you have no argument..
jjnhl68 said:
...Also, did you see amount of RAM tat knox uses? And you tell me % of users that need knox?...
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its like any other "bloat", do you use any of those apps? do you cry about those apps?
jjnhl68 said:
..Most expensive device, with many weaknesses..
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what weaknesses? and it isnt most expensive anymore... :angel:
jjnhl68 said:
...No choice, or to stay on 4.2.2...
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how do you plan on doing that? as the note 3 came with 4.3
jjnhl68 said:
...And everything with no clear explanation!?...
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the word "knox" is printed EVERYWHERE.. what more are they supposed to do to make users "aware"
jjnhl68 said:
... I won't buy their product soon!...
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only part of your post that i agree with :laugh:
PS- next time you want a big company to do what YOU want...try doing research and not make silly mistakes that can make your argument really weak
Khizar said:
no ppl have flashed stock roms without tripping their knox..
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Also ppl have flashed with tripping their knox!!!
Khizar said:
as the other user said this can be considered a security issue so you have no argument..
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And I should loose my warranty because of that???
Khizar said:
its like any other "bloat", do you use any of those apps? do you cry about those apps?
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See my point!!! No need for bloat, ok?
Khizar said:
what weaknesses? and it isnt most expensive anymore... :angel:
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It was when i have bought it!!! For 6 months my phone was 3 times in service for repairs under warranty (microphone, speaker, display defects)
We all know about weak points of S4, we are using them, aren't we?
Khizar said:
how do you plan on doing that? as the note 3 came with 4.3
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I was on 4.2.2 in time of buying
Khizar said:
the word "knox" is printed EVERYWHERE.. what more are they supposed to do to make users "aware"
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Khizar said:
only part of your post that i agree with :laugh:
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Khizar said:
PS- next time you want a big company to do what YOU want...try doing research and not make silly mistakes that can make your argument really weak
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As I already said, in summer 2013. you couldn't know Samsung's intentions, ok?
On any phone rooting or tampering with your phone voids your warranty no questions asked.
On every root thread the first thing is a warning telling you your warranty is now void.
Your malicious intentions to break the rules of your warranty and fake it to get free servicing is now not possible hence the whining.
PS: flashing stock firmware will never void your warranty unless it has an older bootloader version (security risk)
Personally I mostly agree with the OP. I actually posted a couple of posts in here detailing my email to Samsung Australia and responses and they have vanished - no explanation.
I think the argument that, 'it is clear it has Knox so don't whine about it' is specious and ignores the fact there are 5.4 million members on XDA, most of whom would take exception to being told they can't mod their phones.
I have rooted and not lost Knox, but I also would like more access to my phones without voiding warranty. There are reasons. I want root because the apps I prefer to use require it. Titanium and Greenify are very handy to have and both require root.
I want a custom recovery because a Nandroid backup is the only way I know of to back up a phone that includes all screens, all screen layouts and widgets and can put your phone back just like you had it without having to sit for hours recreating the layout. I backup my calls, SMS, contacts and apps, but the restore is painful. A nandroid makes it simple and you can't do it in stock recovery.
I have no complaints at present about the kernel, but I had a lot of pleasure with my S3 playing with different ROM's using Siyah or GoogyMax - when I have a few months on my Note 3 I will venture down that path, but electronics follow the bathtup curve so I'd like to make sure I'm on the bottom of the bath before I risk warranty.
As I said to Samsung, they appear to have made a choice to follow the Apple line, but more extreme, (you can jailbreak an Apple and return it to stock for warranty purposes) most likely in the hope of becoming the next Blackberry. (i.e. Corporate standard phone) but I think they would have been far better to NOT annoy their current customers who are mostly private individuals and bring out a different but similar phone for Corporates. (I make the assumption about the type of users because I can't recall seeing anyone in the S3, Note, S4 Zoom or Note 3 forums with problems to do with Enterprise sysapps, Enterprise setups, or even Exchange services - to me that suggests very few users are using them)
Journyman16 said:
Personally I mostly agree with the OP. I actually posted a couple of posts in here detailing my email to Samsung Australia and responses and they have vanished - no explanation.
I think the argument that, 'it is clear it has Knox so don't whine about it' is specious and ignores the fact there are 5.4 million members on XDA, most of whom would take exception to being told they can't mod their phones.
I have rooted and not lost Knox, but I also would like more access to my phones without voiding warranty. There are reasons. I want root because the apps I prefer to use require it. Titanium and Greenify are very handy to have and both require root.
I want a custom recovery because a Nandroid backup is the only way I know of to back up a phone that includes all screens, all screen layouts and widgets and can put your phone back just like you had it without having to sit for hours recreating the layout. I backup my calls, SMS, contacts and apps, but the restore is painful. A nandroid makes it simple and you can't do it in stock recovery.
I have no complaints at present about the kernel, but I had a lot of pleasure with my S3 playing with different ROM's using Siyah or GoogyMax - when I have a few months on my Note 3 I will venture down that path, but electronics follow the bathtup curve so I'd like to make sure I'm on the bottom of the bath before I risk warranty.
As I said to Samsung, they appear to have made a choice to follow the Apple line, but more extreme, (you can jailbreak an Apple and return it to stock for warranty purposes) most likely in the hope of becoming the next Blackberry. (i.e. Corporate standard phone) but I think they would have been far better to NOT annoy their current customers who are mostly private individuals and bring out a different but similar phone for Corporates. (I make the assumption about the type of users because I can't recall seeing anyone in the S3, Note, S4 Zoom or Note 3 forums with problems to do with Enterprise sysapps, Enterprise setups, or even Exchange services - to me that suggests very few users are using them)
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i cannot agree with you more.
its all about consumer rights and samdung has no rights to force enterprise solutions on private individuals who have no use for NSA grade security.
however,we have samdung fanboys here who keep defending corporate right more than consumer rights...even going as far to judge who deserve warranty or not.
The logic of not being able to downgrade to a older bootloader and not tripping knox is absolute bullcrap.afterall,it is samdung's official ROM and flashing it trips knox and samdung claims you are trying to be funny with their devices(yeah,that's right,you pay top dollars for their phones and it does not belong to you.PERIOD),so what does that tell you?
samdung going the way of apple and trying to be a corporate phone ala blackberry????
Bi*ch please, blackberry was the top corporate device coz its secured as hell.but jus look at how many ppl actually want to use a blackberry to take pictures,listen to music,surf the net,play games on it or hell even show it to frds they have a new model.
samdung,you have the best hardware in the market,i'll give you that.but your TW sucks,loaded with bloatware and is at best irritable when compared with any custom rom and laughable when compare with CM.
with knox,you can have it.no more samdung's knox-pox time for me to switch to something more friendly.
I do not know why everyone is *****ing about KNOX, I had a look at it after reading the OP's post, from what I can see, and I might be wrong, BUT you actually need to INSTALL it first, otherwise it it just sits there doing nothing. do not like it or want to use it, then DO NOT INSTALL IT, or just disable the KNOX install file, SIMPLE.
frostmore said:
however,we have samdung fanboys here who keep defending corporate right more than consumer rights...even going as far to judge who deserve warranty or not.
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This is really uncalled for, it has ALWAYS been the case that if you root your phone, you lose your warranty. In this case samsung track it by flipping a bit, so they know when you have voided the warranty, many other devices handle this in the form of bootloader unlocks. Once you unlock a bootloader on other devices the process is recorded, purely to void your warranty. This is nothing new, perhaps attaching the name KNOX to it has given you the idea that it is corporate security etc. If it were simply called "Warranty void bit" it would be no more or less related to knox (it just happens that knox shares some of the security mechanisms with how the bit is controlled).
And while we are talking about consumer rights. As the manufacturer of a product it is their right to refuse warranty due to tampering with the software. Maybe with the warranty void bit they can save a few bucks in warranty fraud from people who break their devices with root. As for "going as far to judge who deserve warranty or not" I've already stated that it has always been the case that if you tamper with the software your device warranty is void. Hell, Samsung have had some of the most lax security policies over their devices for the past few years with regards to tracking tampering. Next thing you know you will be complaining that unlocking the bootloader on your sony device is irreversible, or that unlocking your HTC device leaves traces even after relock.
lilstevie said:
This is really uncalled for, it has ALWAYS been the case that if you root your phone, you lose your warranty. In this case samsung track it by flipping a bit, so they know when you have voided the warranty, many other devices handle this in the form of bootloader unlocks. Once you unlock a bootloader on other devices the process is recorded, purely to void your warranty. This is nothing new, perhaps attaching the name KNOX to it has given you the idea that it is corporate security etc. If it were simply called "Warranty void bit" it would be no more or less related to knox (it just happens that knox shares some of the security mechanisms with how the bit is controlled).
And while we are talking about consumer rights. As the manufacturer of a product it is their right to refuse warranty due to tampering with the software. Maybe with the warranty void bit they can save a few bucks in warranty fraud from people who break their devices with root. As for "going as far to judge who deserve warranty or not" I've already stated that it has always been the case that if you tamper with the software your device warranty is void. Hell, Samsung have had some of the most lax security policies over their devices for the past few years with regards to tracking tampering. Next thing you know you will be complaining that unlocking the bootloader on your sony device is irreversible, or that unlocking your HTC device leaves traces even after relock.
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Voluntarily voiding your warranty is one thing,unilaterally voiding warranty for trying to downgrade to an earlier version of rom is considered what again?
no one says manufacturer rights shouldn't be protected.but what samdung is doing here is voiding warranty based on the knox bit.unilateral refusing warranty coz knox bit is tripped.and consumer should have the right of full access to their phone.not some two bit restricted access based on samdung's specfications.
rooting so that we can use apps like TB or Greenify is what i called reasonable.Rooting so that you can overclock the cpu and then crying for warranty when its burnt is what i called being a fraud.and most of us want root is mainly due to the former and not latter.so why should consumer be penalized for wanting full admin access to their phones?
i have no qualms about sony or htc's open door policy when it comes to voiding your warranty.at least they are open about it and giving you a choice to do it and also allowing you to have an unlocked bootloader.with samdung,they are like "oh we are ok with rooting,but hey we keep the bootloader locked,so no downgrade,no warranty and sucks to be you".
Yeah,consumer rights my baby smooth behind.
and dun worry too much about being called a samdung fanboy.that wasn't directed at you,rather a certain individual who has been championing samdung's knox warranty void (and their corporate interests)with arguments like security risk,malicious intentions to break the rules of your warranty and the mother of all bullcrap "flashing stock firmware will never void your warranty unless it has an older bootloader version (security risk)".
frostmore said:
Voluntarily voiding your warranty is one thing,unilaterally voiding warranty for trying to downgrade to an earlier version of rom is considered what again?
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And compared to some devices that don't even let you downgrade at all, whether you want to void your warranty or not are any different because?
frostmore said:
no one says manufacturer rights shouldn't be protected.but what samdung is doing here is voiding warranty based on the knox bit.unilateral refusing warranty coz knox bit is tripped.and consumer should have the right of full access to their phone.not some two bit restricted access based on samdung's specfications.
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Okay, first of all, using terms like "samdung" is just making you sound like a petulant child. It really does not help your case at all. Secondly, you are contradicting yourself in one swoop here, saying that they should be able to protect their rights, but they shouldn't have a mechanism to be able to protect their rights.
frostmore said:
rooting so that we can use apps like TB or Greenify is what i called reasonable.Rooting so that you can overclock the cpu and then crying for warranty when its burnt is what i called being a fraud.and most of us want root is mainly due to the former and not latter.so why should consumer be penalized for wanting full admin access to their phones?
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Please tell me what the difference is. Sure I get why you want to use Greenify, or TB, but tell me how from the perspective of the manufacturer how they can tell the difference on a broken phone. Why should the OEM have to pay for all those devices bricked through stupid actions of users with root access (and it is more common than you think) for the benefit of the few that will not destroy their device in the process.
frostmore said:
i have no qualms about sony or htc's open door policy when it comes to voiding your warranty.at least they are open about it and giving you a choice to do it and also allowing you to have an unlocked bootloader.
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Samsungs policy towards warranty is your device is excluded through the act of modification, that is to hardware or software. Sony and HTC have a similar policy rooting, in fact I don't think I have seen any device on the market where the warranty is maintained on rooting. Please note here, I'm not saying that people haven't gotten their devices repaired after rooting. I'm simply noting the act of rooting in most territories around the world constitutes breach of terms for the warranty and therefore makes that null and void.
frostmore said:
with samdung,they are like "oh we are ok with rooting,but hey we keep the bootloader locked,so no downgrade,no warranty and sucks to be you".
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Um, no. Samsung are like "we are okay with everything, but note that modification of the software on your device constitutes voiding your warranty". Unless you have a carrier variant like an AT&T device or Verizon device the bootloader is unlocked, as in, it was never locked down in the first place, you can open up heimdall or odin with the device connected in download mode, and flash it to your hearts content. Downgrading is a tricky situation. Samsung are well within their rights, and in some cases required to as per IP licensing to keep the boot environment secure.
frostmore said:
Yeah,consumer rights my baby smooth behind.
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You mean consumer rights that people have been abusing for years?
frostmore said:
and dun worry too much about being called a samdung fanboy.that wasn't directed at you,rather a certain individual who has been championing samdung's knox warranty void (and their corporate interests)with arguments like security risk,malicious intentions to break the rules of your warranty and the mother of all bullcrap "flashing stock firmware will never void your warranty unless it has an older bootloader version (security risk)".
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I don't worry I'm no fanboy of any device. I am however one that is a firm supporter that if people hadn't been abusing the warranty procedures that these sorts of measures would never have been implemented.
If I have administrator rights in my computer why I can't have the same in my phone?
Does being an administrator in your windows desktop computer void your warranty?
Why I can't unninstal all the apps that I don't use?
Sent from my SM-N9005 using Tapatalk
frostmore said:
Voluntarily voiding your warranty is one thing,unilaterally voiding warranty for trying to downgrade to an earlier version of rom is considered what again?
no one says manufacturer rights shouldn't be protected.but what samdung is doing here is voiding warranty based on the knox bit.unilateral refusing warranty coz knox bit is tripped.and consumer should have the right of full access to their phone.not some two bit restricted access based on samdung's specfications.
rooting so that we can use apps like TB or Greenify is what i called reasonable.Rooting so that you can overclock the cpu and then crying for warranty when its burnt is what i called being a fraud.and most of us want root is mainly due to the former and not latter.so why should consumer be penalized for wanting full admin access to their phones?
i have no qualms about sony or htc's open door policy when it comes to voiding your warranty.at least they are open about it and giving you a choice to do it and also allowing you to have an unlocked bootloader.with samdung,they are like "oh we are ok with rooting,but hey we keep the bootloader locked,so no downgrade,no warranty and sucks to be you".
Yeah,consumer rights my baby smooth behind.
and dun worry too much about being called a samdung fanboy.that wasn't directed at you,rather a certain individual who has been championing samdung's knox warranty void (and their corporate interests)with arguments like security risk,malicious intentions to break the rules of your warranty and the mother of all bullcrap "flashing stock firmware will never void your warranty unless it has an older bootloader version (security risk)".
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Ha ha, Samdung!! Like Samsung but like dung. Aww man, did you come up with yourself? That is brilliant
AllanJ60 said:
I do not know why everyone is *****ing about KNOX, I had a look at it after reading the OP's post, from what I can see, and I might be wrong, BUT you actually need to INSTALL it first, otherwise it it just sits there doing nothing. do not like it or want to use it, then DO NOT INSTALL IT, or just disable the KNOX install file, SIMPLE.
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*grins* Yep, you are right... you're wrong. It isn't the Knox software people are upset about, it is the Knox counter that is built in. It is set at 0x0 and if you do anything with your phone except take Samsung OTA updates, which have been tightened even further once they realised the Devs had found a way around their little booby trap, you trigger a change of state in that counter to 0x1.
It is supposed to be irreversible and you can trigger it by doing things Android users have been doing since Android came out. A good number of what are now standard apps require root access and providing that will trigger Knox. As pointed out, if you decide you don't like a particular OTA update (say to KitKat) and try to go back to a previous version (say the one your phone came with) you trigger Knox.
And Samsung is voiding warranties because Knox is triggered. Blanket voiding as far as can be determined. Doesn't matter if there's a hardware issue (say the charge circuit stopped) they will void because that trigger is at 0x1.
Deleted...
Leaving Verizon.
Sharpie603 said:
Recently Verizon has shown their true colors. They do NOT want to give us control of a device that we bought and paid for. (That's like buying a radio that only plays Country).
In my eyes. If we pay you monthly then why do you care what we do with our device? We own it right?
However, after days of researching and very knowledgeable co-workers..... The solution is here.
ODIN 3.10. That's Correct. ODIN 3.10 has the ability to look past the locked bootloader and grant access to roll back. This was not made to be public but (Thank GOD) was leaked on Aug 26th.
You can download ODIN 3.10 here: http://www.theandroidsoul.com/download/download-odin-3-10-6/
I have not yet tried to root after rolling back to the BOA8 Kernel. Anyone want to test this out and let me know if you were able to root after downgrading?
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So you were able to downgrade from OG5 to OA8, just by using the 3.10 version of ODIN? Has anybody else tried this yet?
scadilla said:
So you were able to downgrade from OG5 to OA8, just by using the 3.10 version of ODIN? Has anybody else tried this yet?
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Just the Kernel, not the firmware. Which in reality.... Serves no purpose.... The bootloader still remains locked and prevents from downgrading the firmware. However, this method works for downgrading kernels...
I'm still looking into ways to obtain root with a downgraded kernel. Not saying it's possible, but I'm not giving up just yet.
Sharpie603 said:
Just the Kernel, not the firmware. Which in reality.... Serves no purpose.... The bootloader still remains locked and prevents from downgrading the firmware. However, this method works for downgrading kernels...
I'm still looking into ways to obtain root with a downgraded kernel. Not saying it's possible, but I'm not giving up just yet.
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I'm definitely following this thread!!! Thanks for the info Sharpie603!!! Man... I really hope you're successful!!! I'm ROOTing for you! (Pun intended! Damn I'm funny! No?!?! Anyone???) LOL
Sharpie603 said:
Just the Kernel, not the firmware. Which in reality.... Serves no purpose.... The bootloader still remains locked and prevents from downgrading the firmware. However, this method works for downgrading kernels...
I'm still looking into ways to obtain root with a downgraded kernel. Not saying it's possible, but I'm not giving up just yet.
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Ah, OK, that makes sense so the thinking is if you are on OG5 with the locked bootloader that you could downgrade the kernel and then root. I'll be following closely as well.
scadilla said:
Ah, OK, that makes sense so the thinking is if you are on OG5 with the locked bootloader that you could downgrade the kernel and then root. I'll be following closely as well.
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Not looking very promising.
Can you downgrade APNHLOS?
Terribly misleading title. OE1 and OG5 didn't do anything about locking the kernel, they were bootloader locks. As you said, unless you can downgrade which you can't. The only way this would be useful is if we could get root by only downgrading the kernel, which we cannot. We could access safestrap if we HAD root access, because we could flash the NI2 kernel to get access, but no root = no safestrap.
I don't think you made a discovery, I think you just came across what wasn't stated bluntly, simply because it wasn't necessary information to tell people. As for your quest to find a way to root.... I'm just going to say, have fun.
In regards to the OP's statement - Verizon could care less about the rooting community and allowing you to do what you want with your "owned" devices. Verizon and AT&T locked the phones down tight as they should because this is a portable personal computer with all your financial information being transferred back and forth. Tightening the security of the phone against hackers trying to steal all your information and identity had the unfortunate side effect of making root near impossible currently. The device performs exactly as advertised on the box and in the specifications. Your analogy of a radio stuck on country is a poor one. Think more like you bought a car and it will not go 200 miles an hour. There is nothing preventing you from purchasing a car that can, or replacing the engine to do so which would have other downfalls such as gas mileage going to crap. In the same analogy you can purchase a T-Mobile motherboard, swap it out, be able to root, but not get certain LTE bands. Verizon has not targeted you at all...you can blame the hackers constantly trying to get information off the phones. Verizon and AT&T took steps to try to prevent that and of course increase profits by being rated the most secure phones out there. Verizon never gave you the keys to root...ever! So they are not keeping this info from you. Just like every device that took a little time to find root, it is up to you and the developers to find away around it.
This is the same as saying Acme safe company is trying to keep you from being rich because they made their safes more secure.
Spartan117H3 said:
Terribly misleading title. OE1 and OG5 didn't do anything about locking the kernel, they were bootloader locks. As you said, unless you can downgrade which you can't. The only way this would be useful is if we could get root by only downgrading the kernel, which we cannot. We could access safestrap if we HAD root access, because we could flash the NI2 kernel to get access, but no root = no safestrap.
I don't think you made a discovery, I think you just came across what wasn't stated bluntly, simply because it wasn't necessary information to tell people. As for your quest to find a way to root.... I'm just going to say, have fun.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The title is not misleading at all. It does exactly what I described. Gives you the ability to downgrade the Kernel. and the Kernel only. I clearly mentioned this in post #3 that this still leaves the bootloader locked. then in later posts went on to mention that it looks like we are still SOL. Take it how you want, sorry for actively trying to find a solution...
KennyG123 said:
In regards to the OP's statement - Verizon could care less about the rooting community and allowing you to do what you want with your "owned" devices. Verizon and AT&T locked the phones down tight as they should because this is a portable personal computer with all your financial information being transferred back and forth. Tightening the security of the phone against hackers trying to steal all your information and identity had the unfortunate side effect of making root near impossible currently. The device performs exactly as advertised on the box and in the specifications. Your analogy of a radio stuck on country is a poor one. Think more like you bought a car and it will not go 200 miles an hour. There is nothing preventing you from purchasing a car that can, or replacing the engine to do so which would have other downfalls such as gas mileage going to crap. In the same analogy you can purchase a T-Mobile motherboard, swap it out, be able to root, but not get certain LTE bands. Verizon has not targeted you at all...you can blame the hackers constantly trying to get information off the phones. Verizon and AT&T took steps to try to prevent that and of course increase profits by being rated the most secure phones out there. Verizon never gave you the keys to root...ever! So they are not keeping this info from you. Just like every device that took a little time to find root, it is up to you and the developers to find away around it.
This is the same as saying Acme safe company is trying to keep you from being rich because they made their safes more secure.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I'm not worried about my phone being hacked. I have nothing to hide. I do not bank online or make purchases online. If there is fraudulent activity on my bank account, my credit union will inform me. This is besides the fact. I could care less if I made a "bad" analogy. I'm not sitting here thinking "Hmmm I wonder if anyone will have a problem with this statement" when writing up a comment. Your paragraph is nothing but slander "Something XDA strongly discourages". A simple "I don't think this will work, and here's why" would of been suffice.
On a side note. I'm leaving Verizon so you won't have to worry about me trying to find root and help you guys out anymore.
Sharpie603 said:
The title is not misleading at all. It does exactly what I described. Gives you the ability to downgrade the Kernel. and the Kernel only. I clearly mentioned this in post #3 that this still leaves the bootloader locked. then in later posts went on to mention that it looks like we are still SOL. Take it how you want, sorry for actively trying to find a solution...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
It is misleading because you mark it as solved as if it was a puzzle that nobody else can figured out, like you had new information to provide. If I'm not mistaken, the kernel was never locked, and you can use any Odin to push a different kernel. It was never a question if the kernel was locked. So you didn't do anything except state what was redundant. The people who confirm that the bootloader is locked say so because it means you can't downgrade. They didn't say you can still downgrade the kernel because it's absolutely meaningless. That's like saying, the bootloader is locked, but you can still Odin and flash any file you want even if it doesn't work.
There are countless people like you in other threads who claim they're trying to find a way to root. Neither you nor I are smart enough to come up with an exploit, as I have detailed countless times before. So why don't we leave that up to the developers?
Sharpie603 said:
I'm not worried about my phone being hacked. I have nothing to hide. I do not bank online or make purchases online. If there is fraudulent activity on my bank account, my credit union will inform me. This is besides the fact. I could care less if I made a "bad" analogy. I'm not sitting here thinking "Hmmm I wonder if anyone will have a problem with this statement" when writing up a comment. Your paragraph is nothing but slander "Something XDA strongly discourages". A simple "I don't think this will work, and here's why" would of been suffice.
On a side note. I'm leaving Verizon so you won't have to worry about me trying to find root and help you guys out anymore.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
It doesn't matter if you don't care yourself, because you are not everyone. You are a single person. If you were everyone, obviously Verizon wouldn't make money off you, and wouldn't secure their phones. But this is flawed reasoning yet again.
A bad analogy shows you have flawed reasoning. It doesn't matter if you care or not, you don't have a problem with stating things that don't make sense, then by all means, continue (which I don't even have to say, because you do indeed continue).
Slander? Are you serious? You acknowledge the reason for his post, which claims you have a bad analogy, and explains why Verizon does what it does. Then you make an insane, baseless claim that says xda discourages root. Yet XDA was where the original root method was released in detail, with the newsworthy 18k bouty.
Why does he need to explain why it wouldn't work, when you yourself have already done that? It's the same when you responded to me. You answer your own question but then argue against people when they confirm with your latter findings that it doesn't work?
I don't understand why people like you are so happy to see 1 posters support you, but then immediately get hostile when anyone with any knowledge comes in to speak. You running from Verizon doesn't solve any problems and shows you weren't invested to begin with, which is fine, since you wouldn't have accomplished anything anyway. Unless you're claiming to be smarter than those who found the original root.
You want to know why it won't work? All these people have similar ideas to yours, they either want root, or want to "try" with little to no knowledge at all about what they are doing.
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showpost.php?p=62378933&postcount=19
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showpost.php?p=62380538&postcount=23
http://forum.xda-developers.com/verizon-galaxy-s5/help/vz-replacement-s5-oe1-t3190365
http://forum.xda-developers.com/ver...g5-verizon-t3192598/post62746265#post62746265
Spartan117H3 said:
It is misleading because you mark it as solved as if it was a puzzle that nobody else can figured out, like you had new information to provide. If I'm not mistaken, the kernel was never locked, and you can use any Odin to push a different kernel. It was never a question if the kernel was locked. So you didn't do anything except state what was redundant. The people who confirm that the bootloader is locked say so because it means you can't downgrade. They didn't say you can still downgrade the kernel because it's absolutely meaningless. That's like saying, the bootloader is locked, but you can still Odin and flash any file you want even if it doesn't work.
There are countless people like you in other threads who claim they're trying to find a way to root. Neither you nor I are smart enough to come up with an exploit, as I have detailed countless times before. So why don't we leave that up to the developers?
It doesn't matter if you don't care yourself, because you are not everyone. You are a single person. If you were everyone, obviously Verizon wouldn't make money off you, and wouldn't secure their phones. But this is flawed reasoning yet again.
A bad analogy shows you have flawed reasoning. It doesn't matter if you care or not, you don't have a problem with stating things that don't make sense, then by all means, continue (which I don't even have to say, because you do indeed continue).
Slander? Are you serious? You acknowledge the reason for his post, which claims you have a bad analogy, and explains why Verizon does what it does. Then you make an insane, baseless claim that says xda discourages root. Yet XDA was where the original root method was released in detail, with the newsworthy 18k bouty.
Why does he need to explain why it wouldn't work, when you yourself have already done that? It's the same when you responded to me. You answer your own question but then argue against people when they confirm with your latter findings that it doesn't work?
I don't understand why people like you are so happy to see 1 posters support you, but then immediately get hostile when anyone with any knowledge comes in to speak. You running from Verizon doesn't solve any problems and shows you weren't invested to begin with, which is fine, since you wouldn't have accomplished anything anyway. Unless you're claiming to be smarter than those who found the original root.
You want to know why it won't work? All these people have similar ideas to yours, they either want root, or want to "try" with little to no knowledge at all about what they are doing.
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showpost.php?p=62378933&postcount=19
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showpost.php?p=62380538&postcount=23
http://forum.xda-developers.com/verizon-galaxy-s5/help/vz-replacement-s5-oe1-t3190365
http://forum.xda-developers.com/ver...g5-verizon-t3192598/post62746265#post62746265
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Listen I came here thinking I found a way. In no way was trying to start a war among like minded individuals. All you are doing is trying to ream me out for what? For a mistake I made, thinking I had a solution? Way to be professional. Sorry for cluttering the forum. Sorry for everything I have done thus far. Sorry for bothering you sir. Sorry for not being as knowledgeable as you are. I'm sorry for everything! F*ck
Sharpie603 said:
Listen I came here thinking I found a way. In no way was trying to start a war among like minded individuals. All you are doing is trying to ream me out for what? For a mistake I made, thinking I had a solution? Way to be professional. Sorry for cluttering the forum. Sorry for everything I have done thus far. Sorry for bothering you sir. Sorry for not being as knowledgeable as you are. I'm sorry for everything! F*ck
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The problem is, you just assume things without actually comprehending what people say. That's why you believe this is apparently a war. Ream you out? You miss the entire point, repeatedly. All it is is people telling you why your statements don't make any sense.
Sharpie603 said:
I'm not worried about my phone being hacked. I have nothing to hide. I do not bank online or make purchases online. If there is fraudulent activity on my bank account, my credit union will inform me. This is besides the fact. I could care less if I made a "bad" analogy. I'm not sitting here thinking "Hmmm I wonder if anyone will have a problem with this statement" when writing up a comment. Your paragraph is nothing but slander "Something XDA strongly discourages". A simple "I don't think this will work, and here's why" would of been suffice.
On a side note. I'm leaving Verizon so you won't have to worry about me trying to find root and help you guys out anymore.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
As stated that is just YOU. 99.9% of people do not want their phone hacked or their identity stolen.
How is stating the facts slander? And I think I would know best what is encouraged here and what isn't. Now you are just lashing out for no reason and making no sense.
I guess we can close this as you wished. Thanks for trying.
I've been searching around the thread and it looks like there hasn't been big news since August? It's hard to track the chronology of Root/Rom development so I wanted to ask here to be sure about my understanding.
•Is there currently any way to root the G920V 5.0.2-OF1 or 5.1.1-BOG9 without tripping KNOX?
- What are the methods? (If any)
•What are the methods that DO trip KNOX? (If any)
•When KNOX is tripped, can Samsung refuse to honor warranty for hardware malfunction along with software issues?
I remember when rooting my tablet, I read they would honor warranty if physical defects occurred on a tripped device (such as screens cracking due to bad design or headphone jacks being poorly wired).
Thanks if you know the answers to my questions
I am also interested in the rooting topic, which is a bit hard to follow. I don't really care if it trips Knox or not, I just want to OWN the device I bought. I'd really like to disable/uninstall alot of crap apps which are stock on this phone and taking up space. I am just going to follow this thread for future information on rooting availability.
lonelyastronaut said:
I've been searching around the thread and it looks like there hasn't been big news since August? It's hard to track the chronology of Root/Rom development so I wanted to ask here to be sure about my understanding.
•Is there currently any way to root the G920V 5.0.2-OF1 or 5.1.1-BOG9 without tripping KNOX?
- What are the methods? (If any)
•What are the methods that DO trip KNOX? (If any)
•When KNOX is tripped, can Samsung refuse to honor warranty for hardware malfunction along with software issues?
I remember when rooting my tablet, I read they would honor warranty if physical defects occurred on a tripped device (such as screens cracking due to bad design or headphone jacks being poorly wired).
Thanks if you know the answers to my questions
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
1. No
2. No methods will trip knox because there are none.
3. Yes.
Reading around this forum I've seen many different answers about the consequences of tripping Knox. Unfortunately, those answers are sometimes contradictary. So I'd like to create a thread with direct answers for me but also everyone else.
For instance, will it void your warranty? In most places, yes so might as well take for granted that it will.
Can it be reset? No, no matter who says what, it is NOT possible to reset it to 0x0.
Those are the answers I know. Now for the answers I'm still clueless about:
Once reverted to stock :
Will OTA's Work?
Will Samsung Pay work?
Will the fingerprint scanner work?
Will Samsung Pass work?
Other than the warranty, what will I lose?
While searching for the consequences of tripping Knox I've actually found claims about these (Samsung Pay, fingerprint scanner and whatnot).
Thanks for your help! :good:
What I can say about warrantee and this is pretty straight forward is, the guarantee is something the brands give only because they are obliged by consumer laws and regulations. If they could they would give it by any means.
Understanding this, is half way to understand why they can also refuse to guarantee and eventual hardware fault, for example, because they detected your phone was rooted. Nothing related with the problem, however brand can and will use these sort of excuses to not honour the guarantee.
Now, they can be as extreme or they cannot. It’s a Russian roulette so the question you should do, to yourself and not to anyone else, is:
“Am I fine to go ahead and accept any consequence resulting from my acts?”
Prosis said:
Reading around this forum I've seen many different answers about the consequences of tripping Knox. Unfortunately, those answers are sometimes contradictary. So I'd like to create a thread with direct answers for me but also everyone else.
For instance, will it void your warranty? In most places, yes so might as well take for granted that it will.
Can it be reset? No, no matter who says what, it is NOT possible to reset it to 0x0.
Those are the answers I know. Now for the answers I'm still clueless about:
Once reverted to stock :
Will OTA's Work?
Will Samsung Pay work?
Will the fingerprint scanner work?
Will Samsung Pass work?
Other than the warranty, what will I lose?
While searching for the consequences of tripping Knox I've actually found claims about these (Samsung Pay, fingerprint scanner and whatnot).
Thanks for your help! :good:
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Will OTA's Work?
Will Samsung Pay work?
Will the fingerprint scanner work?
Will Samsung Pass work?
Other than the warranty, what will I lose?
1. Yes
2. Don't think so with Nougat unless you upgrade from MM iirc
3. Yes
4. Not sure but haven't seen anyone saying that it doesn't
5. S. Health (Same as Samsung pay, if you upgrade from MM they still work afaik) possibly others I haven't remembered
Djuganight said:
What I can say about warrantee and this is pretty straight forward is, the guarantee is something the brands give only because they are obliged by consumer laws and regulations. If they could they would give it by any means.
Understanding this, is half way to understand why they can also refuse to guarantee and eventual hardware fault, for example, because they detected your phone was rooted. Nothing related with the problem, however brand can and will use these sort of excuses to not honour the guarantee.
Now, they can be as extreme or they cannot. It’s a Russian roulette so the question you should do, to yourself and not to anyone else, is:
“Am I fine to go ahead and accept any consequence resulting from my acts?”
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yes but the point of this thread is to lay down what those consequences are. If I tell you "You can have a chocolate bar" you're probably going to accept it. If once you've eaten it I cut your hand off I can't turn around and tell you "By accepting my chocolate bar you were willing to accept the consequences". Samsung gives us a basis obviously with the warranty thing. But all the consequences are not necessarily known by all. That's what I want to list here so everyone knows.
*Detection* said:
Will OTA's Work?
Will Samsung Pay work?
Will the fingerprint scanner work?
Will Samsung Pass work?
Other than the warranty, what will I lose?
1. Yes
2. Don't think so with Nougat unless you upgrade from MM iirc
3. Yes
4. Not sure but haven't seen anyone saying that it doesn't
5. S. Health (Same as Samsung pay, if you upgrade from MM they still work afaik) possibly others I haven't remembered
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Nice! Thanks so much!
So before flashing LineageOS for instance, one has to make sure one is willing to never use most Samsung services again.
Prosis said:
Nice! Thanks so much!
So before flashing LineageOS for instance, one has to make sure one is willing to never use most Samsung services again.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I think it's pretty much anything that uses 'My KNOX' that won't work once you trip 0x1 KNOX
What is My Knox exactly that is such a buggyman and casev of such concerns?
Djuganight said:
What is My Knox exactly that is such a buggyman and casev of such concerns?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
http://bfy.tw/ArQ6
Very funny indeed....
S health is not working anymore even if you reflash to stock rom. Anyone tried downgrade it to below 5.0 with workａｂｌｅ one?
Hi mates,
I've unlocked the bootloader to root with magisk, but since this phone as lots of problems I would like to sell it, but how I can sell it with that stupid warning message about the bootloader unlocked.
I flashed the stock firmware but I saw that is it impossible to Re-Lock the bootloader or better I didn't find a way. (unlocking is so easy damn)
Is there anyone with a possible solution?
Just to be clear my Knox has been tripped 0x1 and I guess this will complicate the overall things.
thinking:
Just wondering why doing things so complex, it is just the root permission . i'm administrator of my laptop and nobody is worry about it even if I'm using bank application on it...So don't say it is for security reasons this is to frustrate people avoiding them to do their own business with a device they paid...
No words!!
thanks
Once your Knox has been tripped, you can't revert it.
The 0x1 you are reading is a hardware fuse that is physically blown. you can' "unblow" that fuse.
You are stuck with the warning screen forever.
That has been stated in all tutorials for unlocking bootloader with knox though.
thank for you reply.
I know about Knox state and e-fuse but I want to re-lock the bootloader not set know to 0x0 that is not possible..
Maybe there will be the warning forever but it is in Chinese and nobody understand it (ahahah) but locking back the bootloader should give me back Netflix on play store (if you sell the phone everybody wants Netflix imho) all the rests I don't care.
Hi, I got it and solve my problem, thanks to this guide
https://forum.xda-developers.com/showpost.php?p=79698366&postcount=44 .
Thanks to @robbo1947 for posting the solution for the S10 that is working also for the Note 10
Just for everyone information the boot warning disappear when you re-lock the bootload.
have good day
at least you should tell the seller about that situation, or I wish the seller will quickly figure out what you are doing and return the phone to you. To be honest, if I am the seller and I know you are hiding something, I will be pissed off. Never think you can escape from your cheating so easily. cheers.
It is not my intention to fraud anybody. I will sell the phone clearly specify the situation to the future buyer.
My intention was just putting the phone usable for a normal person that doesn't care about Knox 0x1 and the not working Samsung apps (pass, pay, secure folder).
I'm honest and I would avoid problems when I sell something, so don't be worry I will explain everything as I have always done!
However thanks for sharing your opinion that I 100% agree.
p3dr01978 said:
It is not my intention to fraud anybody. I will sell the phone clearly specify the situation to the future buyer.
My intention was just putting the phone usable for a normal person that doesn't care about Knox 0x1 and the not working Samsung apps (pass, pay, secure folder).
I'm honest and I would avoid problems when I sell something, so don't be worry I will explain everything as I have always done!
However thanks for sharing your opinion that I 100% agree.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Personally, I think it good of you to share what you have accomplished. That is what forums like this were created in thr first place. I think the previous comment was an insult to your character and based on assumption with a warning. Whatever lol, I wil say honest is the best policy and a disclosure a must.
On a litter note, Dam you sure took a big risk on such an expensive phone.
I'm aware of risks and it was intentional doing root since I bought the n9700 snapdragon version in China and i'm European and I did it to unlock all the bands and aggregation available in the world .... it worked using QPST and QDXM but I discovered later that rooting was not needed ...my fault ...
if someone would like to understand how to unlock bands and aggregations let me know
Bye bye
p3dr01978 said:
I'm aware of risks and it was intentional doing root since I bought the n9700 snapdragon version in China and i'm European and I did it to unlock all the bands and aggregation available in the world .... it worked using QPST and QDXM but I discovered later that rooting was not needed ...my fault ...
if someone would like to understand how to unlock bands and aggregations let me know
Bye bye
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I would like this info....
I was just thinking to myself whether anyone has tried this.
Sent from my God Mode 8
louforgiveno said:
I would like this info....
I was just thinking to myself whether anyone has tried this.
Sent from my God Mode 8
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yeah me too. I will be living in Jakarta and just picked up the Snapdrgon 10 plus from the USA unlocked. I know bands in use are different for each carrier and have tried the ×#*#4636#*#* with some success on an LG v30 rooted.
Hi,
I will write a specific guide. But it is tested only on the Note 10 - N9700 not any other version.
Give me few days to write it.
mayad79 said:
Yeah me too. I will be living in Jakarta and just picked up the Snapdrgon 10 plus from the USA unlocked. I know bands in use are different for each carrier and have tried the ×#*#4636#*#* with some success on an LG v30 rooted.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I am considering buying the HK version of the Note 10+.
What were the problems that resulted in your decision to sell?
Hi
I decided to sell it due to the Samsung ecosystem itself. nothing specific I was curious of testing it with the s-pen but at the end I strongly prefer a more stock experience.
p3dr01978 said:
Hi
I decided to sell it due to the Samsung ecosystem itself. nothing specific I was curious of testing it with the s-pen but at the end I strongly prefer a more stock experience.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Hopefully you'll make that guide up still, Please!
Sent from my God Mode 8
Yes I will,
But I'm a bit busy..be patience !
I wrote the guide here
https://forum.xda-developers.com/ga...ow-to-unlock-lte-bands-note-10-n9700-t3983257
I'm not responsabile for any damages
Let me know.
-P3dr0-