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I've been honor 8 since one week and i have found one thing that when even i cover right side lens it capture black image but when ever i cover left side sensor it's take snappy sharp image like it's ideally take . So i think so it's just fake second camera is dummy or any other problem ? please let me know i'm worried for my money
Are the pictures good? If so then don't worry about it.
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From my experience the second camera is mostly used for background blur effect. If you cover the lens, everything is in focus.
It is also used for minor noise reduction. If you take a picture in low light and cover the secondary lens there is a little bit more noise. But you won't really notice it unless you enlarge the image.
well the fact that when you block one lens, the other works is proof that neither is dummy. perhaps the post processing is not that dramatic as you were expecting. try taking low light pics with both and just the normal lens then compare them by zooming.
no difference found
I've tried in low light too but second lens is just a fake . it's don't enhances quality i think so i have to wait for android N update
sn9691 said:
well the fact that when you block one lens, the other works is proof that neither is dummy. perhaps the post processing is not that dramatic as you were expecting. try taking low light pics with both and just the normal lens then compare them by zooming.
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I love the pictures the Honor 8 takes when using the Wide Aperture mode. It seems the second camera is essential for creating the blur effect. If you haven't noticed you can go into the Stock Huawei Gallery and adjust the wide aperture pictures after the fact. Even if you took a picture that looked like you focused in on the wrong thing, just go into the Gallery, click on the wide aperture button (only shows up on wide aperture pictures) and select what you wanted to focus on.
Sure enough, without the second camera the wide aperture mode doesn't work properly if at all.
Second lens is for focusing, depth of field, and additional light. As well, when covering the second lens, it persistently gives a warning about not covering the lens while shooting, especially when refocusing. I think this should be enough to disprove your "fake camera" theory.
Hi all, I did a thorough analysis and posted it in reddit so the Essential staff can see it. Here it is... Please post your replies and comments here along with your comparisons and settings listed please. Thank you!
https://www.reddit.com/r/essential/comments/7gjxcm/comparisons_of_new_essential_camera_update/
xterminater07 said:
Hi all, I did a thorough analysis and posted it in reddit so the Essential staff can see it. Here it is... Please post your replies and comments here along with your comparisons and settings listed please. Thank you!
https://www.reddit.com/r/essential/comments/7gjxcm/comparisons_of_new_essential_camera_update/
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I have read your post. I did see the update that Essential released and although the file size is about 1 MB bigger than before the update, still the image quality didn't change. I am using this version: MGC_5.1.016_7.0+C2API_v.1.3a_AllinOne. How is it different from your version of Google Camera app?
why do you think the portrait mode does not use the second camera?
hs911 said:
why do you think the portrait mode does not use the second camera?
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Well two reasons, they never really mention what focal length the second camera is, most flagship say its a 2x optical which is a typical 52mm lens. Second, you can see the stapphy's pic, the bokeh is way off.
well i can not fully agree with you. i admit that i have no technical details for constructing pictures with two cameras but i made a simple test: i put my finger on the mono cam:
monochrome cam covered:
both cams free:
hs911 said:
well i can not fully agree with you. i admit that i have no technical details for constructing pictures with two cameras but i made a simple test: i put my finger on the mono cam:
monochrome cam covered:
both cams free:
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Interesting, I was only saying that because most true portrait set up needs a telephoto lens bc of the focal length 52mm used. The latest OP5 removed their telephoto lens and created portrait solely by upscaling pixels taken by the second lens. There is a article on gsmarena that explains this, so maybe essential is doing the same?!? But to me, anything not using a 52mm setup for portrait is all software emulated.
Essential had mentioned that both cameras are the same focal length (or at least appear to be, they didn't give specs). The difference is color vs mono. And if you look into stereo photography, which has existed since almost the dawn of photography, it's composed of 2 lenses at the same focal length slightly offset from one another similar to the dual camera setup on this phone. It produces 3d images. This is because each image is slightly offset from the other, producing a slightly different perspective. This is also how we see depth with our own eyes.
If you can produce 3d/stereo images with 2 lenses next to each other, then you could calculate how far the images are offset from one another by overlapping them. Where the offset is further, you might assume the object is further and thus produce a shallower depth of field there.
Where I'm unsure is how the expected to combine the 2 images because they won't match identically. Either they're so close that stereo imagery as I described has little to no offset, making my point above completely irrelevant and allowing them to be combined as originally planned, or there's enough offset that they're having difficulty in combining the images which is why there has been very little confirming it's actively doing this.
gk1984 said:
Essential had mentioned that both cameras are the same focal length (or at least appear to be, they didn't give specs). The difference is color vs mono. And if you look into stereo photography, which has existed since almost the dawn of photography, it's composed of 2 lenses at the same focal length slightly offset from one another similar to the dual camera setup on this phone. It produces 3d images. This is because each image is slightly offset from the other, producing a slightly different perspective. This is also how we see depth with our own eyes.
If you can produce 3d/stereo images with 2 lenses next to each other, then you could calculate how far the images are offset from one another by overlapping them. Where the offset is further, you might assume the object is further and thus produce a shallower depth of field there.
Where I'm unsure is how the expected to combine the 2 images because they won't match identically. Either they're so close that stereo imagery as I described has little to no offset, making my point above completely irrelevant and allowing them to be combined as originally planned, or there's enough offset that they're having difficulty in combining the images which is why there has been very little confirming it's actively doing this.
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Excellent analysis! The prior 2 lens system that existed was used for 3D purposes only. However, now there's softwares involved that pretty much said to ignore anything that is behind the main focus point regardless of how minimal the depth differences are. The 7 Plus didn't even make use of the telephoto until it detects an X amount of lighting present. There was a video just surfaced to show how the iPhone X turns on it's telephoto at a lower lighting than the 7 Plus or 8 Plus, I forgot which one. Most dual camera phones without telephoto lens is pretty much just like you said color and mono, and the mono allows for better color. The camera system would merge the two together to enhance color, not needing a larger aperture for low lighting since the mono takes care of that.
xterminater07 said:
Excellent analysis! The prior 2 lens system that existed was used for 3D purposes only. However, now there's softwares involved that pretty much said to ignore anything that is behind the main focus point regardless of how minimal the depth differences are. The 7 Plus didn't even make use of the telephoto until it detects an X amount of lighting present. There was a video just surfaced to show how the iPhone X turns on it's telephoto at a lower lighting than the 7 Plus or 8 Plus, I forgot which one. Most dual camera phones without telephoto lens is pretty much just like you said color and mono, and the mono allows for better color. The camera system would merge the two together to enhance color, not needing a larger aperture for low lighting since the mono takes care of that.
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I don't think you're accurate on one aspect, but otherwise yes. The mono camera doesn't do anything for color. It is physically impossible to capture color data on the monochrome sensor. Rather, that sensor is missing the layers/components that filter light into red, green, and blue. The benefits are less objects on the sensor blocking light passing through and possibly (depending on design) more surface area to capture light. So the mono sensor captures more light and more detail. Combining the 2 images is supposed to offer more detailed images and help with exposure. Anything to do with color is from the color sensor and post-processing. Quality lenses can also help the color accuracy, but it's unclear if the lens on the camera is as good as it can be or not.
gk1984 said:
I don't think you're accurate on one aspect, but otherwise yes. The mono camera doesn't do anything for color. It is physically impossible to capture color data on the monochrome sensor. Rather, that sensor is missing the layers/components that filter light into red, green, and blue. The benefits are less objects on the sensor blocking light passing through and possibly (depending on design) more surface area to capture light. So the mono sensor captures more light and more detail. Combining the 2 images is supposed to offer more detailed images and help with exposure. Anything to do with color is from the color sensor and post-processing. Quality lenses can also help the color accuracy, but it's unclear if the lens on the camera is as good as it can be or not.
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Oops, I don't mean enhance color as in Saturation and color itself. What I mean is like making the pictures more details with color and contrasts that sort, shadows and lighting. However, it is interesting the guy above cover the second lens and bokeh went away.
Any one able to compare the camera with the Samsung S10? Is it better or worse?
Having both phones, I can say it's worse.
The main issue really is the exposure and whatever HDR+ algorithm they're implementing in the stock camera app. Even though they said it's the same HRD algorithm that was applied by google for pixel phones, I still think it's over exposing everything especially the low tones and shadows - this produce a very unnatural looking picture. (If I wear a black shirt, my pic came out as if I'm wearing a gray shirt due to overexposure on the shadows).
On the other hand, I'm really loving the flip camera and the ability to use wide angle for selfie/group selfie and video. That is definitely the highlight of this hardware. But I will be lying if I say I'm not struggling to love the quality of the pictures produced by this phone.
Have you tried the GCAM port? for me it produces better pics...
The Asus stock camera is hit or miss. Too inconsistent for me, especially the HDR++ mode.
But with arnova's GCam port it is simply amazing and blows away even the pixel 3 cameras.
The wide angle camera in our Asus does not focus as good as the main camera ..try it..also the slow motion videos are not that sharp and crisp.
baymon said:
Having both phones, I can say it's worse.
The main issue really is the exposure and whatever HDR+ algorithm they're implementing in the stock camera app. Even though they said it's the same HRD algorithm that was applied by google for pixel phones, I still think it's over exposing everything especially the low tones and shadows - this produce a very unnatural looking picture. (If I wear a black shirt, my pic came out as if I'm wearing a gray shirt due to overexposure on the shadows).
On the other hand, I'm really loving the flip camera and the ability to use wide angle for selfie/group selfie and video. That is definitely the highlight of this hardware. But I will be lying if I say I'm not struggling to love the quality of the pictures produced by this phone.
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Agreed, that there is sometimes overexposure, but I like more Asus camera's bright photos instead of GCAM darker photos. GCAM is better in very dark, but I prefer Asus camera often, specially for low light photos. Well, I have exposure compensation + 0,4 in GCAM, but still ...
I can easy say that this is the best cellphone camera on the market now, I installed Gcam and activaed raw.
I have never seen a phonecamera produce such a good raw files, even in low light.
Skintones, natural colors is great on this camera, Samsung, Sony, Huawei. and lot of other manufactors are terrible when it comes to natural skintones, overuse of noisce reduction....
Also the 4K 60fps is very natural and doesn't have the unatural look that almost every other brand have.
Hello,
I have bought just yesterday the normal version (non pro) and I would like to ask if anyone knows the differences at the pictures between the 7p and 8p lenses? In theory the 8p can capture more light, but how is this translated in real life? Does it worth the extra money for that difference? (I have a 14 day window to return it this is why I ask)
Thanks
You will be blown by the photos you take with the normal version so you don't need to buy the pro version 6GB ram and 128GB Storage is enough for everything from gaming to taking photos, browsing and anything i can say.
No I really don't care about the more RAM and Rom. Just curious about the photos only!
I ordered the Pro. Should arrive next week. Frankie Tech on youtube will upload a camera comparison of the two very soon.
cycloholic said:
Hello,
I have bought just yesterday the normal version (non pro) and I would like to ask if anyone knows the differences at the pictures between the 7p and 8p lenses? In theory the 8p can capture more light, but how is this translated in real life? Does it worth the extra money for that difference? (I have a 14 day window to return it this is why I ask)
Thanks
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amount of lens group doesnt mean you can capture more light. Extra lens is used for correcting distortion, color aberration etc. The apperture itself is the same pro or not pro. So it should be able to capture same amount of light.
in daily usage, difference in camera result will be minor
Xiaomi said it should capture more light.
Why did I go for the Pro
Sorry if out of topic, I have a plan to buy this device, at the moment speak about lens (and apperture), some one says (mkbhd & droidlime) this device have a small focus area, and create a small focus object and large blur area, event the object is large in frame.
Maybe it's personal preference, but can this character can fix (create focus area larger) by software update or it's a hardware character and cannot change with software ?
Kasallamacher said:
Xiaomi said it should capture more light.
Why did I go for the Pro
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Click to collapse
If anything, extra lens element is actually one extra layer of glass/plastic that will filter any light captured. So, better image maybe yes (by slight), but more light ? Am not sure how that works in photography logics, lol
---------- Post added at 07:27 PM ---------- Previous post was at 07:16 PM ----------
adira.mardiani said:
Sorry if out of topic, I have a plan to buy this device, at the moment speak about lens (and apperture), some one says (mkbhd & droidlime) this device have a small focus area, and create a small focus object and large blur area, event the object is large in frame.
Maybe it's personal preference, but can this character can fix (create focus area larger) by software update or it's a hardware character and cannot change with software ?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
To understand this, you will need to understand the correlation between sensor size and depth of field.
Put it simple, bigger camera sensor have capability to geta shallower depth of field.
This is an advantage if you like to shot some scene which have a distinct foreground object, and want to have good separation with background. Think portrait, for example.
But this might become disadvantage when you try to get a lot of object to be in focus. Example would be a group shot with some people standing behind others. The one stand behind might be already out of focus range.
This is hardware characteristic, which applied to any camera out there. Back in film era, this happen to medium format cam. In digital camera era, you can compare the depth of field between full frame camera, APS-C camera and Micro 4/3rd camera. Image from full frame camera (which has bigger sensor than other) will always have smaller focus area (shallower depth of field) when being used in same apperture setting.
This is physics. Even if you try to compensate it using software (by put sharpening in object that located further from camera), it still there, the effect.
The only thing can change this is if smartphone camera start having an active apperture system (you can change F value). But since by today, all smartphone still using fixed apperture in its lenses, nothing can be done related to what you ask.
For more details about how sensor size affecting focus area :
https://www.cambridgeincolour.com/tutorials/digital-camera-sensor-size.htm
otonieru said:
If anything, extra lens element is actually one extra layer of glass/plastic that will filter any light captured. So, better image maybe yes (by slight), but more light ? Am not sure how that works in photography logics, lol
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yeah doesn't make sense but at the same time Xiaomi didn't add another lense for the lols and didn't give that exact version to Dx0Mark for no reason...
Kasallamacher said:
yeah doesn't make sense but at the same time Xiaomi didn't add another lense for the lols and didn't give that exact version to Dx0Mark for no reason...
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Click to collapse
As i wrote above,
The extra lens definitely not for lol. Extra lens element is used for variety of reasons, mostly to correct distortion and color aberration. But definitely not for extra light reasons.
Kasallamacher said:
Xiaomi said it should capture more light.
Why did I go for the Pro
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Click to collapse
Usually in a Lens group, more len can capture more light is true.
for example, 8p lens maybe capture 99.5% of light, but 7p lens maybe only 99.2%.
The different is not big.
But "more light" is not the major benefit.
Usually more lens may correct the image better to fit the sensor.
Mi note 10 pro has problem focusing
otonieru said:
To understand this, you will need to understand the correlation between sensor size and depth of field.
Put it simple, bigger camera sensor have capability to geta shallower depth of field.
This is an advantage if you like to shot some scene which have a distinct foreground object, and want to have good separation with background. Think portrait, for example.
But this might become disadvantage when you try to get a lot of object to be in focus. Example would be a group shot with some people standing behind others. The one stand behind might be already out of focus range.
This is hardware characteristic, which applied to any camera out there. Back in film era, this happen to medium format cam. In digital camera era, you can compare the depth of field between full frame camera, APS-C camera and Micro 4/3rd camera. Image from full frame camera (which has bigger sensor than other) will always have smaller focus area (shallower depth of field) when being used in same apperture setting.
This is physics. Even if you try to compensate it using software (by put sharpening in object that located further from camera), it still there, the effect.
The only thing can change this is if smartphone camera start having an active apperture system (you can change F value). But since by today, all smartphone still using fixed apperture in its lenses, nothing can be done related to what you ask.
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Hi otonieru
I appreciate you explaining the relationship between sensor size and depth of field.
My new note 10 pro main camera seems to have trouble focusing even in good day light, it repeatedly focuses on the background instead of the person i want to photograph, even though i physically tap the person's face on screen. The 5x camera focuses fine though.
Do you think this is a hardware or software issue?
Many thanks!
Hello everyone. Am I alone who is getting horrible photos from the main camera here? It seems that every shot has disgusting blurry smudges at the sides. Basically only central part of the photo is in focus? Is it faulty camera module???!!! Again? If so where is the quality control then? Seriously I can't remember a single flagship smartphone I used to have in the past with such photo "quality"! What's wrong? I can quarantee that there're no dirty fingerprints on the camera glass cover. Please help!
Did you take the pitures in portrait or landscape?
What App did you use?
If you used HDR I would suggest using a tripod to reduce the camera shake
Something like a head on shot of a brick building is more revealing. Make sure to brace the cam for test shots. Dead center focus it.
No lense is consistent throughout its whole field of view. Center softness is the least desirable, edge softness to some degree is normal. The more from the center you can go before blur* increases noticeably the better.
Edge softness can even be desirable at times.
This isn't a 6 optic lense so the degree of compensation for various optical phenomenons is more limited. With lens it's always a compromise with various desirable qualities and the tradeoffs this brings; there is no perfect lense.
To tell if this is a bad copy a side by side comparison with a known good copy is best.
You can always crop it out if it really bugs you...
*see blur charts, which is one of the ways how lens are tested and compared