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I hate the way Apple chooses to lock down their devices with iTunes and the App Store, but I'm equally as frustrated with every damn Android device running proprietary crapware on top of Android. There, I said it.
I mean, the selling point is, or should be, Android. Not Samsung or HTC's poor attempts to create superfluous software that does what Android (2.2 anyway) already does, only worse and laggier. I just started up a new contract on Vodafone (Germany) and got a Galaxy S for 149 Euro. I jailbroke and carrier unlocked my old iPhone 3G (from T-Mobile) and popped in my new Vodafone SIM and I'm probably going to put the Galaxy S on eBay to reap the profit off it while it's still high priced. (our contract phones are not carrier locked)
I mean, yea the iPhone 3G is laggy with iOS4, but with jailbreak it's still overall less frustrating than the Galaxy S has been for me. Google needs to *****slap the manufacturers into installing vanilla Android and vanilla Android ONLY. Let them install their proprietary apps like Samsung App Market (and third party apps like some carriers do). That can all be deleted once they are rooted anyway. It's this annoying ROM juggling that is ruining the Android experience for a lot of people who want to get away from Apple, RIM, Microsoft, etc. The only real option for a vanilla experience for most users right now is the Nexus One, which is no longer produced and to which there will be no successor. Why can't we just be given vanilla, and THEN decide whether we want Swype or Sense, or whatever else?
I'm not trying to slag the Android community, because they are great. And I'm far, far from an Apple "fanboy", it's just the manufacturers that are creating too much differentiation within Android. I mean of course Android will experience differentiation with multiple hardware manufactuers. It's part of being an open platform. The problem is it's exacerbated exponentially by the mountains of crapware shoveled onto each different phone.
That it appears Samsung decided to use an internal SD to run the OS and apps is frustrating as well. All that fantastic hardware paired with a slow internal SD with crap I/O performance is kind of....?! Shouldn't have to buy a class 6-10 microSD and partition it with ext4 just to get the phone running the way it should. Especially with the rest of the hardware being wonderful.
I mean.....maybe this is heresy here, but jailbreaking an iPhone4 and using Cydia, et al, seems to be less of a hassle than rooting and ROMing something like the Galaxy S. At least with the iPhone you don't need to remove third party crapware (although the case can be made for Apple's YouTube app being worthless non-removable third party crapware).
The reason I, co-workers and friends of mine find Android so appealing is the ability to install whatever we want, whenever we want. The ability to circumvent an "App Market" and install a Torrent manager to control torrents at home on the go, or to install third party browsers that may offer better performance/options, or other third party applications that technically "compete" with the native Android apps written by Google.
That's what we find so appealing. What we hate, and what keeps us holding out a little on Android (those of us without Nexus Ones) are the aforementioned problems. If the phones simply came with Vanilla Android or if there were a simple option for reverting the phones to Vanilla Android that didn't involve rooting and hunting around for custom ROMs (which often have their own superfluous crap installed) it would draw people towards the Android platform at an even quicker rate. At least with iOS4 we know what we're getting. With Android devices it's a grab bag of poorly written, superfluous crapware, where the only hope is that you can find a device with the least amount.
What is wrong with simply handing us Android devices with vanilla Android? Is every manufacturer afraid that without them guiding us through the experience with their own interpretation that the commonfolk will get lost in the vast sea of open source Android? I mean it's like the blind leading those with 20/20 vision at this point.
Or is it just greed reaching through trying to somehow claim that loading their devices up with crapware increases their profit margins and compensates for the people they wind up driving or keeping away from Android?
I'm just rambling at this point and need coffee. And a vanilla Android device.
I completely agree. I haven't tried the alternate UIs like HTC Sense, but I feel like if it does anything better than vanilla Android, then whatever it does that's better should just be added to vanilla Android.
1st off I too find Android to iPhoney to use. So after testing android for a couple weeks I'm back to WM. I just don't like hitting 6 buttons to do anything. That being said its not fair to compare a brand new phone that been on the market a couple weeks to a phone that launched in 2007. Thats really not fair to android or Samsung.
Standard Android is extremely unattractive to look at. Therefore manufacturers try to enhance it.
addicus said:
Standard Android is extremely unattractive to look at. Therefore manufacturers try to enhance it.
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I actually prefer the minimalistic look and feel of the standard Android, but that is probably just me.
I can see why you like the minimalist look but the eye candy is for attracting people. If you have never used a smartphone or come from the notmephone you want to be able to navigate through to the essentials the first time you pick it up. HTC Sense allows that, SPB Mobile Shell allows that but standard Android doesn't. Veteran users or Windows Mobile users like myself are fine with it.
Just returned from Xmas shopping and thought I was going to get some tablets for family members but found them to be frustratingly slow when compared to the iPad--which is what people are going to do, even though they shouldn't, they're going to. Google did announced that Android <2.2 is simply not ready for tablets and I couldn't agree more.
I have an iPad at home and the cheapest iPad competes successfully with the best tablets Android has, the Dell Streak and Samsung tab. Those tablets are <$600, so's the iPad. Unless there's a specific reason why you'd rather use an Android tablet when the screen is smaller and the whole tablet is overall slower, the choice is easily iPad.
I heard a shopper try to use one and comment how slow Android is. I showed him my Evo to tell him that Android's still in progress, it'll get faster. Unless you don't mind paying for $300 or less for frustration, (inexpensive) Android tablets are just not ready. I hear Honeycomb will have a tabler-optimized system.
** mind you, I'm a Phandroid so...
Couldn't agree more. The galaxy tab is an embarrassment. I tried using one in a store the other day and got 3 force closes in ten minutes, plus a jerky UI and ****house resolution.
I liked the Tab a lot, thought it was really great. Didn't have any issues with it when I played it with it. But I agree to an extent. Problem is, most Android tablets are made poorly. Archos is about the only one that has made decent tablets aside from Dell and Samsung. It could be better though, I'll say that. Right now Android is suited for mobile phones. For a good reason, it's a phone OS.
More reason to look forward to honeycomb. The flagship Google tablet should set the standard for android tablets.
tknz said:
More reason to look forward to honeycomb. The flagship Google tablet should set the standard for android tablets.
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Yes! And they're going to kick butt. Apple optimized the iPhone's OS for three years before they brought out the iPad. Android is only about three years old, isn't it? I just hope that the crappy tablets out there now haven't damaged Android's rep.
Or Google should've just thrown ChromeOS on tablets. Chrome is basically what I use on my Ubuntu powered netbook. I rarely see the desktop anymore.
I have had a galaxy tab for about 27 days..I also have an ipad that i've had for awhile....I like the tab but it's going back tomarrow...Had 3 and all 3 had dead pixels..I think the screen is better than ipad and using the apps and playing with OS is peppy like my Vibrant but start browsing and it becomes sluggish...Some sites are much worst than others...The stock browser is by far the slowest thing ever..dolphin hd is better but still sluggish..I tried all browsers and disabling flash/plugins and different settings ...No matter what i try browsing is not smooth like my ipad...I hoped a fix came out or a ROM that would fix the laggy browsing but nothing yet....I really like the tab because of A: Android OS vs the boring basic ios4 and B: The screen is better than my ipad...While the ipad screen is very nice the tab is better and once samoled starts coming on them ohhh my!
Google had plenty of time to make the OS smooth, 2.3 is a big fail. I don't know what google has given to people but everyone believes that android will be the next big thing. Seems like we will never reach the promised land.
People had so much expectations about gingerbread, new UI, gpu accelerated graphics, the smoothness, new integration with social networking... Instead you get a 2.3 with a new keyboard and few little things people don't care.
After 2 yrs and some the OS still is not smooth, it lacks in visual appearance, the apps are crap. I don't know how much longer i'll stay with this OS. Everytime i get a new phone is always read the stickies, flash new roms rinse and repeat. I am so tired of this, i don't know how long is going to stay like this but is like google doesn't give two ****s about it.
I bought an ipad this past weekend, jailbroke it, and started installing apps and end of story. I have games that i have fun playing with and apps that doesn't look like crap. If iphone had 3g in tmobile i'd consider getting an iphone.
greenstuffs said:
After 2 yrs and some the OS still is not smooth, it lacks in visual appearance, the apps are crap. I don't know how much longer i'll stay with this OS. Everytime i get a new phone is always read the stickies, flash new roms rinse and repeat. I am so tired of this, i don't know how long is going to stay like this but google don't give two ****s about it.
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It seems like you're the type that just wants their computer to work..[period]. This is not a criticism, you must just not be interested in hacking and modding your phone and why should you have to? There are so many choices out there, you don't have to use an Android phone--unless you were forced into using one.
Some of the apps are crap and some are are not but the choice is yours. The good apps filter to the top and bad ones never surface. I only choose apps that are four stars or better so my apps aren't crap--not to me at least. Don't you think that sort of freedom is nice? I do!
I, for one am glad that Google doesn't give two-****s about it ( I think they do ), it's an open source project and what you do with "your" phone is up to "you". We've never had this sort of freedom and I'm grateful we finally have it. But you don't have to try new ROMs or read any stickies if you don't enjoy it. I know Android phone users who have absolutely no plans to ever root their phone because they're happy with the way the carrier set it up for them--great!
I came from the Blackberry world and the only thing I could do with that was change the wallpaper and the size of the fonts *yawn*. RIM did everything for me and I had no clue what they were doing. Also, I've had Apple products, they magically patch things for me--what's going on? I'd like to know... Apple says, "no you don't--just use it, m'kay?" Microsoft does the same... No... Let's keep this open, I'm having a blast!
semperlux said:
It seems like you're the type that just wants their computer to work..[period]. This is not a criticism, you must just not be interested in hacking and modding your phone and why should you have to? There are so many choices out there, you don't have to use an Android phone--unless you were forced into using one.
Some of the apps are crap and some are are not but the choice is yours. The good apps filter to the top and bad ones never surface. I only choose apps that are four stars or better so my apps aren't crap--not to me at least. Don't you think that sort of freedom is nice? I do!
I, for one am glad that Google doesn't give two-****s about it ( I think they do ), it's an open source project and what you do with "your" phone is up to "you". We've never had this sort of freedom and I'm grateful we finally have it. But you don't have to try new ROMs or read any stickies if you don't enjoy it. I know Android phone users who have absolutely no plans to ever root their phone because they're happy with the way the carrier set it up for them--great!
I came from the Blackberry world and the only thing I could do with that was change the wallpaper and the size of the fonts *yawn*. RIM did everything for me and I had no clue what they were doing. Also, I've had Apple products, they magically patch things for me--what's going on? I'd like to know... Apple says, "no you don't--just use it, m'kay?" Microsoft does the same... No... Let's keep this open, I'm having a blast!
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Wow, well said mate, agreed except for Microsoft phones (WinMo), you can also buy them with the idea of tweaking, hacking, configuring everything to your liking, etc. in mind, unlike blackberry and apple.
XtriFe said:
Wow, well said mate, agreed except for Microsoft phones (WinMo), you can also buy them with the idea of tweaking, hacking, configuring everything to your liking, etc. in mind, unlike blackberry and apple.
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Oh? I didn't know that about WinMO. I think that to a point you can hack and mod anything you want. I've seen OS 7 running on an iPhone and thought that was impressive but have no idea if that's difficult or not. But that's not Apple's corporate philosophy where as AOSP, by definition will lends itself to extensive modification and is almost encouraged--man, I've dreamed of this.
greenstuffs said:
Google had plenty of time to make the OS smooth, 2.3 is a big fail. I don't know what google has given to people but everyone believes that android will be the next big thing. Seems like we will never reach the promised land.
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Android is pretty big right now and still growing.
People had so much expectations about gingerbread, new UI, gpu accelerated graphics, the smoothness, new integration with social networking... Instead you get a 2.3 with a new keyboard and few little things people don't care.
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The UI has different elements from previous versions, but this isn't the first time this happened. This happens with other platforms all the time. Windows Phone 7 for not having Copy and paste off the bat, or any decent homebrew support. Apple with the lack of multitasking, or Blackberry with something actually new and specs that can rival current Android phones!
After 2 yrs and some the OS still is not smooth, it lacks in visual appearance, the apps are crap. I don't know how much longer i'll stay with this OS. Everytime i get a new phone is always read the stickies, flash new roms rinse and repeat. I am so tired of this, i don't know how long is going to stay like this but is like google doesn't give two ****s about it.
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It's not just google mind you, Google can only do so much. If you're gonna blame Google, then you have to blame Qualcomm, Samsung, TI, HTC, etc etc for making the phone and some of the drivers. And I don't know about you, but I didn't flash a new rom every day now. I just get a rom that's best for me, and if it needs updated, I update it. Same thing with stock roms. If Google didn't give 2 ****s about it, then why is Google still supporting Android as much as they are? I like the UI of Android a lot. Easy to customize and change, where as for the longest time in Ios and mostly still now, black background? Windows Phone 7, black background or a different color? For the apps, it's open source. That's what the reviews in the Marketplace are for. I've have good experiences with the apps.
I bought an ipad this past weekend, jailbroke it, and started installing apps and end of story. I have games that i have fun playing with and apps that doesn't look like crap. If iphone had 3g in tmobile i'd consider getting an iphone.
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Ios is also completely locked down in terms of development. Iphone 3g is also nothing compared to current Android phones now. An Arm11 v6 cpu, versus say an Arm Cortex a8? About 400-440mhz underclocked from 600mhz or so, versus even the Droid only being clocked at 550mhz, but having a huge advantage of better instruction sets and Adreno gpu? You obviously haven't done much homework either, Tmobile will support Iphone on their network, and there's even unlock codes in Cydia available. All you need to do, setup a plan with Tmobile, and get a Tmobile Sim card for that plan. It might now have the 3g network enabled, but there's your Iphone for you.
I'm not bad mouthing Apple, Iphone, Windows, Microsoft, WP7, or anything like that. But Apple has complete control over the Iphone and Ios(There isn't even an AT&T logo on the Iphone), WP7 is still young so we'll see how it turns out, and Android is still growing.
I would agree that the iPad is much more advanced. But the Galaxy Tab is pretty decent and I actually love the color nook. It is great for what it does...
Once released, Honeycomb should have a positve major impact on new futere Tablets.
semperlux said:
Just returned from Xmas shopping and thought I was going to get some tablets for family members but found them to be frustratingly slow when compared to the iPad--which is what people are going to do, even though they shouldn't, they're going to. Google did announced that Android <2.2 is simply not ready for tablets and I couldn't agree more.
I have an iPad at home and the cheapest iPad competes successfully with the best tablets Android has, the Dell Streak and Samsung tab. Those tablets are <$600, so's the iPad. Unless there's a specific reason why you'd rather use an Android tablet when the screen is smaller and the whole tablet is overall slower, the choice is easily iPad.
I heard a shopper try to use one and comment how slow Android is. I showed him my Evo to tell him that Android's still in progress, it'll get faster. Unless you don't mind paying for $300 or less for frustration, (inexpensive) Android tablets are just not ready. I hear Honeycomb will have a tabler-optimized system.
** mind you, I'm a Phandroid so...
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I completely disagree. You must not have done your homework well. Right now the best tablets are the tegra tablets. They own the ipad in every way possible and are receiving alot of development. As far as I know there are 4 out now: Toshiba Folio 100, Viewsonic G Tablet, Advent Vega, and the Elocity 7". I'm on the Viewsonic G Tablet, so far the rims developed by our Dev team are 1337! They can play flash, have full market, and are hella fast!
I was curious to hear from former Android users how you like WP7. Mainly what are your main gripes and what functions did you actually use that are no longer available. Also, are the tradeoffs worth it in the end and what features really *make* swapping worth it. I have loved android for a long time but I'm kind of wanting something new and have liked the wp7 interface from day one. Thanks!
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Here goes:
Mainly what are your main gripes
No apps, and if there are apps they are over priced and crap alternatives to Android versions.
Homebrew is going to cost money.
I know its a phone and should mainly just be a phone, but there is nothing to do on it, I never leave my Android phone alone always playing with something but this I treat it like a nokia 3310 lol.
What functions did you actually use that are no longer available
I don't know what it is but there are some things missing but Mango is looking good but still not as good as Android and Ice Cream Sandwich will be coming out around the same time.
Are the tradeoffs worth it in the end and what features really *make* swapping worth it.
Only thing that is making me want to swap over is the Xbox Live thing other than that Android is far superior.
I have loved android for a long time but I'm kind of wanting something new and have liked the wp7 interface from day one.
I love Android also and also wanted to try something new but Windows Phone 7 isn't something new. Stick with Android and Launcher7 lol ^^
I think I'm fine with paying for my phone to be unlocked personally, one time fee for the latest beta builds forever? Honestly I don't know why HTC Samsung and Motorola aren't looking into this for android devices so they can make some extra $ and make us impatient (or reasonable people that don't like waiting for their craptastic skins) people happy.
I don't care much for Xbox live like I use to but I definitely like Zune pass (really its probably the top single feature that has me wanting wp7 as I use my phone for music a lot).
I love android but honestly, I'm tired of trying to throw on custom ROMs (its fun but tiring) on every phone I get trying to keep up with the updates. I think the only thing that is holding me to android at this point is the ability to wifi tether my phone to my tablet and the fact that mango phones are on their way (fall is only 2-3 months away so announcements should be made soon?)
So guys, is there some feature that I am missing that you really either miss from android or you really like that wp7 had when you made the swap?
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i switched from my old Desire Z and X8 (both of em are still in use sometimes) to a 7 Pro.
so in my own personal opinion, a small "comparision":
1. UI & Customization
I like the UI of WP7 alot more, you can use Launcher7 on Android but it doesn't feel as good. Its smoother and a lot faster, mostly due to inability of "customization" but i really don't miss it. The tile system works surprisingly well, and yeah i don't have a lot to complain about.
No wallpapers, no app launchers etc. It's a locked phone pretty much. If you don't mind, well just don't care
If you want customization stay with Android, else both of em are good in their own ways -> personal preference.
2. Apps
For most people an important point. If you compare Android market to WP7 market, WP7 looses.. big time!
You are charged for almost every app (and a good bunch of em are overpriced!). While free apps, and sometimes test versions of the paid apps are good enough, its still nothing in comparision to Android.
If you want specific apps, check prices first! (i'd recommend it before buying the phone )
There are some social features integrated into WP7 but at the moment (Pre-Mango for me still), they aren't complete. The replacements for those features are at best mediocore, sometimes they shut off randomly etc. There might be some better apps for those, but since i don't use em very much, i havent searched for them.
Otherwise the quality of the apps and games i downloaded is really good, though some of em are missing. As i said, check before you buy the phone, if you didnt already.
3. Features:
Well again the points goes to Android. Bluetooth File Transfer, Tethering and stuff like that, you won't find it on any current WP7 phone (unless you are a Mango user, but i don't know if they implement some of those features). If you need it, well i wouldn't recommend buying a WP7 as of now.
Other than that, i don't really miss any important ones.
4. Final Thoughts:
Since i don't have the WP7 for too long forgive me if i missed or overexaggerated on somethings.
In the end i think, WP7 is a real good OS. While locked down very hard, it just works (just like the hated Apple). While it does feel kind of inferioer to Android (due to the lack of some importants features mostly), it really isn't. There are workarounds for everything, though they are complicated sometimes
With Mango.. well no, even now in MY opinion (which means only for my needs etc), i equal WP7 to Android. While i still use my Androids sometimes (mainly for tethering etc), i often see myself not missing those phones.
I'd recommend WP7 everytime, as well as Android. Just get some information on both, maybe if your friends have said phones, compare them ( or go to the store and do the same).
In the end it comes down to one's need and preference
If you want, you could wait for Mango devices. Though i guess they won't up the hardware too much, maybe add some features like Front Facing Camera and stuff like that, but that's it.
I hope i could help some
BartJJ said:
I was curious to hear from former Android users how you like WP7. Mainly what are your main gripes and what functions did you actually use that are no longer available. Also, are the tradeoffs worth it in the end and what features really *make* swapping worth it. I have loved android for a long time but I'm kind of wanting something new and have liked the wp7 interface from day one. Thanks!
Sent from my ThunderBolt using XDA App
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This entire WP7 OS is simply beautiful and fluid. Rather than 95% of all other android devices, all WP7s are completely lag free while still having a very attractive and intuitive interface. I have 28k apps at my disposal and that means one for everything I would want. The WP7 community here is amazing and hacking / development itself isn't fragmented. I've owned 3 android devices and 2 iOS devices in the past and I'm honestly never looking back.
Android too me seems very slow and inconsistent. Running a Samsung Galaxy I often find when the thing lags, it lags to the extreme. The whole app-store mechanism I find a mess, especially because to much power is given to the app developers. More often then not, they abuse these powers which destroys your battery life.
I like the way WP7 is headed, and I like what Microsoft is doing to keep it a reliable platform. What I don't like however, is the update-procedure as it's very poorly performed. I'm not blaming any company in particular, but I do think updates needs to rolled out faster. Why do ISPs have to test every minor update?
Other then that, the WP7 UI is far superior, and app support is coming along well now. We just need a major bump and hopefully Nokia will spark this? I'm looking forward to purchasing a 2nd gen phone, namely a Nokia.
I went from iphone 3gs to blackberry torch to palm pre 2 to samsung focus to atrix 4g to iphone 4 and back to samsung focus and i love it.
The largest difference to me is that WP7 lacks customization. With android you will hardly ever find 2 phones that have the same ui and settings. All windows phones home screens look the same. I am ok w/ lack of apps. Honestly there is pretty much something for everything already. What would make me happy and never go back to android is being able to personalize the home screen. Maybe some transparent tiles and a wallpaper background for homescreen. that would be awesome.
I'll try to keep this succinct. I had an Evo 4G for the last year, then switched to an HTC Arrive a couple days ago.
Like:
-Most of the apps I used on Android are available on WP7
-As a Zune Pass subscriber, having that ecosystem on my phone is awesome
-It feels like for tasks I do often, I can do all of those tasks in a lot less time than it took on Android
-I primarily develop in .NET, so the dev tools are way friendlier to me than Android's.
Dislike:
-WP7 doesn't have anything that comes close to the awesomeness of Google Navigation
-I'm pretty heavily into the Google Voice ecosystem. Losing the tight integration there is annoying.
-As a Zune Pass subscriber, the lack of expandable storage is agonizing. I can never completely get rid of my Zune HD because it's still the device I have to go to if I want access to all of my music/podcasts.
-The Amazon Android App Market's free app of the day has spoiled me so badly on the pricing race-to-the-bottom front that I am finding it very hard to convince myself to buy any of the games on WP7.
Overall, I am having a good time so far. There is some functionality I am missing, but nothing that I'd consider a showstopper. I still have my Evo 4G, so I might end up switching between the two devices every couple months or so.
I just switched from a samsung mesmerize to a HTC TP7.
My first impression was WOW. I instantly liked the tp7. it's more responsive, it's faster, i can do stuff faster, and everything loads faster. Typing on the screen is more accurate and fixes my screw ups better.
As for apps, the android market has tons more, but in my experience 99.99999% of them are completely and totally useless and the ones that aren't useless i found to be lacking. There were a few that were good, but not many. So far the ones i've tried on WP7 actually seem to be of decent quality and i can find an app for everything i need so far. Some are still obviously in the early stages and need some more features but the app feels higher quality. Of course the windows marketplace has it's share of fart, burp and police light apps. (who downloads these stupid things?)
My ONLY complaint so far is the fact i can't do custom colors on the tiles. the stock colors frankly suck. I tried unlocking the phone and chevron doesn't find the phone at all so i'm wondering if this phone just isn't unlockable with that method. Not being able to do custom tile colors just seems like an obvious omission that should have been fixed allready.
Other than that i like this phone MUCH better, it's faster and doesn't hiccup as much as android did. The loss of customization sucks a bit but honestly, who really cares. I'd rather have the phone work well than be able to customize the wallpaper. The tile color though is killing me.
lots of very good points expressed already, and I agree with most.
However: wm6.5 was far superior to my android in all the little area's that I liked / wanted to tweak... which left me disappointed when I switched to android and frustrated with the infancy of the android based os / app wanting some of the simple things that I was used to on wm6.5.
Then I jump back to windows mobile (thinking it will be great to reg edit again) only to find... tile overlay with no access to the good stuff, and on top of that extremely limited in more ways than android... apps (android copycat) extremely limited and very high priced... I never needed apps to do what I wanted. windows already had it, I just needed to turn it on or off and or tweak it the way I wanted it. customize to no end.
Now I really like the smooth integrated feel, and I took a step down in hardware just to get the operating system. I am back to hacking a android wanna be like device just to get to the meat of the phone, so I can use the power of wm7. I think...
Morrisme said:
Now I really like the smooth integrated feel, and I took a step down in hardware just to get the operating system. I am back to hacking a android wanna be like device just to get to the meat of the phone, so I can use the power of wm7. I think...
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It's WP7 !
I think all we have to do is to wait a bit. My only problem is, that the application store is pretty empty(and overpriced), but hopefully it's gonna change.
What I see is, that Microsoft tries to copy Apple in terms of system optimisation, and simplicity, and so far I say it's successful.
I hope once the marketplace will be flooded with applications, there will be a serious filter on what apps they allow, and what they don't. The main criteria of selling on marketplace should be to have a perfectly smooth application on every windows based mobile, because what I see now is far away from that. Applications seem to just thrown together for wp7 in a day or 2.
Otherwise coming from android myself, I miss certain apps, or games, or functions, but the other hand I'm impressed by it's UI, and smoothness.
WP7 has potential, but it's time is not yet here. Once a great poet said in youtube comments: "Iphone is the past, Android is the present, WP7 is the future"
I came from evo 4g and I love it I got an arrive. Its so quick. And something no one mentioned battery life is great sure if I game for a while I will need a top off bit other then that a work day is no problem btw my work day is 12 hrs
There are some surprising holes in WP7 which I didn't expect compared to other OS.
1) No common Compass API - it's down to individual hardware manufacturers to supply drivers and they all implement it in a different way. So what works on an LG won't work on a Samsung or HTC. Really hinders the use of maps and star gazing apps etc. This is despite the compass being a mandatory part of MS' hardware spec. So much for MS' tight hardware platform control. And don't think about trying Mango - even if you have the compass working in NoDo it won't in the Mango Beta - and MS say it wont be availible until the OEMs release their final versions. The whole point of a Beta and RTM is so developers can test and adapt their software ready for launch - but with the compass augmented apps (one of the killer features of modern smartphones) they are screwed. We have a common API for GPS, why not Compass?
2) No PIN delay - even the most basic phone that offers Exchange support allows a configurable delay before the phone is PIN locked, or respects the delay imposed by an Exchange security policy. Everytime my screen goes off - I have to enter an 8 character password - despite the Exchange policy allowing a max 20 minute delay. Is this fixed in mango? Is this how MS works with MS?
..and relax...
This is what i think the real and biggest problem with android is, the battle is not with apple, their os or their phone. The actual problem is this-
"Google has done an extremely awesome job with jelly bean, the 'project butter' has really changed the Android experience, experience is fast and ultra responsive, devices dont lag when u turn them on or when u wake them from sleep. Google Now is pretty instant and gives some delightfully satisfying answers which the software is all about, offline voice typing is also pretty accurate, fast and an actual step forward with voice typing, the animations are wonderful, the lockscreen is simple and easy to use and its pretty fast, and what to say about notifications they are just a treat to use.
But all of what google has done is waste, total waste.
Cause OEMs wont be able give JB to their devices. Why? Because they will be busy to make stock JB look ugly, they will be busy to just change the way the UI looks so that their device can look be different no matter if its uglier than stock, they will be busy to add stupid features like 'direct call' when the call button is just their above the messages(I MEAN ITS JUST ONE FREAKING TAP ON THE CALL BUTTON AS ITS JUST RIGHT THEIR, U R LOOKING AT THE SCREEN ANYWAY SO U CAN JUST PRESS THAT FREAKING BUTTON TO CALL THAT PERSON), features like 'Tap to Top' (CAN'T U JUST FLICK UR FINGER ON THE SCREEN TO SCROLL BACK TO TOP, IT TURNS OUT THAT U CAN BUT OEMs HAVE TO ADD THESE FANCY FEATURES TO SHOW THE WORLD THAT THEY CAN DO FANCY 'CODING'), they have to add fancy and weird lockscreen. I know some features are important to add for ur company like various camera settings that google don't add cause they simply dont feel the need of those settings, BUT WHY THE HELL OEMs HAVE TO ADD THEIR FREAKING CUSTOM UGLY SKINS AND USELESS FEATURES.
I think google should do something to stop this madness, i see tons of bulls*** on internet just to compare the iphone and android. Most of the comments is people saying that they have older version of android on their device and 'not the one shown in the video' but on iphone they have latest software that is even in 'iphone4s' so they still think iphones are better. It ALL ABOUT UPDATES, GOOGLE WORK REALLY HARD ON ANDROID AND THE RESULT IS THAT MAJORITY OF ANDROID DEVICES ARE STILL ON '2.3.3.
Its pretty dissapointing to see how idiotic OEMs behave about updates, skins and fancy features. I hope the google PDK help OEMs to give faster update.
Some comapnies are still struggling to push ICS to their old devices and JB is out, they are busy in working on their new devices and some few people from their team work on OS updates to old devices, and the process is so slow because they are busy in adding ****ty skins and features.
P.S. Other OEMs should learn from HUAWEI, they also wanted to add some features that they feel are useful to their ICS phones, but they didnt ****ed the UI, they have their file manager, their cloud services, some additional camera app features in their ICS phones but they dont **** the UI."
This is what i think, i was pretty angry about OEMs and updates so i shared all my thoughts on a g+ post and this quote is the same g+ post.
Here is my g+ profile- https://plus.google.com/117638526643371847672/posts
I think/hope Google is having this very revelation, since they are supposedly releasing some more Nexus devices in November. I know I'm waiting to see if one of those devices is a slider, as the rumor goes. I'm definitely with you on this!
You are absolutely right. Maybe not every OEM's ROM is bad, but they shouldn't try to make things better because it takes a lot of time and usually makes the system look ugly. That makes Android different on almost every manufacturer's device...
Sent from my E15i using XDA Premium App
One thing that I have decided that I am just going to buy devices that come under Google's NEXUS program. That way even if I may get not the latest and greatest hardware, I am still assured that I will get updates for at least 2-3 years and instant updates is what we are talking about.
Feel You
Hahahahahha
Anger is good
you were right about every single word
OEMs ruin the Android
trying to make it better
while the only thing happening is Android getting S*** taste instead of vanilla taste
well
on my side
i would prefer if the Stock android was available to all phones beside the OEMs one
in that way we have a choice
also
the Android pure Rom is much better than any other
i came to that after a lot of flashing
---------- Post added at 11:26 PM ---------- Previous post was at 11:17 PM ----------
yogi2010 said:
I think/hope Google is having this very revelation, since they are supposedly releasing some more Nexus devices in November. I know I'm waiting to see if one of those devices is a slider, as the rumor goes. I'm definitely with you on this!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Slider +1:victory:
Haha, I also was getting myself worked up the other day thinking about carriers: I'm sure they also have a lot to do with how long updates take to come out. And, they get you on a 2-year contract, and then you're lucky if they support the device with updates for even 1 year!
I'm hoping PDK begins to lock down a bit of what they can do. Also, Carriers are a huge problem too. They don't want you to get updates.
Sent from my LG-E739 using Tapatalk 2
You know I see a lot of people thinking that all OEM do is make it look ugly ( to be honest all the OEM and ICS default themes look like crap)
But they do alot more. Take the SGS3 for example. All the nice software that made people excited about it would not be there if OEM didn't add their spin. All the nice features people enjoy wouldn't be there either. I mean if all that stuff didn't matter then people would be running a nexus as it is pure android.
Sent for a corner cell in Arkham
zelendel said:
You know I see a lot of people thinking that all OEM do is make it look ugly ( to be honest all the OEM and ICS default themes look like crap)
But they do alot more. Take the SGS3 for example. All the nice software that made people excited about it would not be there if OEM didn't add their spin. All the nice features people enjoy wouldn't be there either. I mean if all that stuff didn't matter then people would be running a nexus as it is pure android.
Sent for a corner cell in Arkham
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I understand what u mean, i have also mentioned in op that many OEMs feel the need of some features that stock android doesnt have and they can add and they should obviously add them but amount of these features are really low, most of the features we see are just fancy features that show that they can also 'code'.
I know a bit about android ICS (stock) as i make themes for theme engine and i made roms earlier. Its divided into two parts or two UIs, one is the dark part or the dominating part that we see across ICS, the grey backgrounds with blue text, other is the light UI, that is the white backgrounds with blue and black text. I am also not a big fan of they grey part of the UI but the white part is just wonderful. Also no OEMs' ui i have seen is better than stock ICS UI so they are clearly making it worse.
I hope google go full on with their white/light UI in next version of android.
Also i agree to the fact that many required features that a consumer wants these days with software these days are lacking in stock android like some settings, options and features in camera app, that actually all consumers these day want. I have seen many nokia users who still buy nokia phones cause they have these small features to mess with in camera app. There are many things that android team have not thought of added in stock android, and i think the main reason for that is the fear of people declaring their OS as 'complicated' and non-user friendly.
What worse it can get. Now Gnexus may get banned.
From now on Google is going to allow OEMs to gain access to upcoming versions of Android sooner than the general public so that they can get updates out sooner.
OEM skins annoy me as well. Most people care more about the apps than the OEM skin and all these differences between carriers default skins creates some fragmentation. OEM bloatware that can't be uninstalled also annoys me but at least with ICS apps can now be hidden without rooting.
Good point.
spunker88 said:
From now on Google is going to allow OEMs to gain access to upcoming versions of Android sooner than the general public so that they can get updates out sooner.
OEM skins annoy me as well. Most people care more about the apps than the OEM skin and all these differences between carriers default skins creates some fragmentation. OEM bloatware that can't be uninstalled also annoys me but at least with ICS apps can now be hidden without rooting.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
But still, Google is doing so that OEMs are ready to push updates along with Google. If Google is gonna give them new versions earlier we can assume they will give 1-2 months earlier and they will still be working on it so they will also give new source code later maybe 10-20 days earlier. So OEMs like Samsung or HTC who take 5-7 months for an update will still not be able to catch up with Google's announcements and updates.
Sent from my GT-I9000 using xda premium
I agree and disagree.. I never used stock roms until i purchased the droid razr. I know blur makes it look better and also realize that motorola has a **** ton of bloatware that i have to freeze but i've been happy with gingerbread and now the ics stock roms. I do however think that needs to include an option to root the device on the configuration when you first setup the device. I think it shouldn't have locked bootloaders or things like that because it is linux underneath the nice ui and you should be able to mod it the way you like without having to hack everything. Long story short, most stock roms do look like crap and are bloated but some do a good job.
Sent from my DROID RAZR using xda premium
Another thing I forgot about is carriers, they need to get their hands out of the software. My broadband ISP doesn't care what updates or OS I am running, they just provide me internet.
Ideally we would get all software upgrades from Google sort of like Windows, but I'm not sure if this is possible with Android. At least just let us update direct from the OEM, carriers shouldn't have to approve updates.
Guys support me and others who are with me and retweet #OmlyNexus and #****AndroidOEMs .
The OEMs don't care what you think, because they want you to run THEIR software - which they will be putting on their phones instead of Android eventually.
That's why Google is pushing their Nexus line to the next level, they know this to be true.
Look up Tizen and read about what Samsung is planning on doing.
With the open source nature of Linux, mfg's don't care about Android. That's why they are getting their customer's used to their "flavor" of Android, whether it be Sense UI or TouchWiz. They aren't spending all this time and money so that their developers can learn to make Android better.. they're getting ready to launch their own projects.
Google knows their time is limited as far as Android being the only major Linux player in the mobile phone business, and it's coming faster than people realize. Firefox, Tizen, Ubuntu.. just watch.
Half of these Android users won't even be on Android in two years, because they are loyal to HTC or Samsung, not Google.
Hence, the Nexus line.
ingenious247 said:
The OEMs don't care what you think, because they want you to run THEIR software - which they will be putting on their phones instead of Android eventually.
That's why Google is pushing their Nexus line to the next level, they know this to be true.
Look up Tizen and read about what Samsung is planning on doing.
With the open source nature of Linux, mfg's don't care about Android. That's why they are getting their customer's used to their "flavor" of Android, whether it be Sense UI or TouchWiz. They aren't spending all this time and money so that their developers can learn to make Android better.. they're getting ready to launch their own projects.
Google knows their time is limited as far as Android being the only major Linux player in the mobile phone business, and it's coming faster than people realize. Firefox, Tizen, Ubuntu.. just watch.
Half of these Android users won't even be on Android in two years, because they are loyal to HTC or Samsung, not Google.
Hence, the Nexus line.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Actually u r a bit wrong here. As people are getting more informed and educated about android they are getting to know it, once they know and love android. They won't buy a new Samsung device with tizen or bada in it. I live in India, people here are slowly starting to know about android. And as u all know India is not one of the developed countries, still if people can like and know android and be loyal to it then why can't other countries' people do the same. We are going into a new era, its not about hardware anymore, firmware comes first. Most of the companies are able to produce good hardware and mostly on a similar level, what matters is the software and OS.
bhu1 said:
Actually u r a bit wrong here. As people are getting more informed and educated about android they are getting to know it, once they know and love android. They won't buy a new Samsung device with tizen or bada in it. I live in India, people here are slowly starting to know about android. And as u all know India is not one of the developed countries, still if people can like and know android and be loyal to it then why can't other countries' people do the same. We are going into a new era, its not about hardware anymore, firmware comes first. Most of the companies are able to produce good hardware and mostly on a similar level, what matters is the software and OS.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I'll have to respectfully disagree here.
When the Samsung GS4 or the next HTC flagship device comes out, no one is going to care if it's running Android or not, except die-hard Android fans. All they will care about is the new features that the phone offers. And the mfgs are smart, they will make their platform compatible with Android apps, allow Google Market (and others). Look at Amazon, guarantee they will have their own Linux dist. as well eventually
and in regard to "We are going into a new era, its not about hardware anymore, firmware comes first"
Uh, I don't think so. Minus the Nexus crowd, nobody buys their next phone because it is going to have JB, they buy it because it's going to have the newest/fastest dual/quad core, XXMp Camera, the newest 'smart' feature, the bigger screen, etc. Nobody ran out to buy the GS3 because it has ICS...
XDA is about 1-2% (if that) of Android users. And even on XDA, half of the users don't know enough about Android to even matter. Maybe it's somewhat different in India, but my guess is the people you are referring to are just starting to understand what Android/Linux really means, so that isn't really relevant to this discussion.
ingenious247 said:
I'll have to respectfully disagree here.
When the Samsung GS4 or the next HTC flagship device comes out, no one is going to care if it's running Android or not, except die-hard Android fans. All they will care about is the new features that the phone offers. And the mfgs are smart, they will make their platform compatible with Android apps, allow Google Market (and others). Look at Amazon, guarantee they will have their own Linux dist. as well eventually
and in regard to "We are going into a new era, its not about hardware anymore, firmware comes first"
Uh, I don't think so. Minus the Nexus crowd, nobody buys their next phone because it is going to have JB, they buy it because it's going to have the newest/fastest dual/quad core, XXMp Camera, the newest 'smart' feature, the bigger screen, etc. Nobody ran out to buy the GS3 because it has ICS...
XDA is about 1-2% (if that) of Android users. And even on XDA, half of the users don't know enough about Android to even matter. Maybe it's somewhat different in India, but my guess is the people you are referring to are just starting to understand what Android/Linux really means, so that isn't really relevant to this discussion.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I don't think a die hard fan of a flagship phone from Samsung or HTC is gonna buy the new flagship phone if the company changes the OS. I know people care about hardware but that doesn't mean they go totally mad about it, not looking the software at all. Btw, play store access is only for Google/android phones.
Also, nobody bought Gs3 cause it just had a quad core or it had a 8mp camera. If Samsung had bada or maybe android 2.1 on it then believe me it would have been samsung's worst selling phone.
Edit: Will u buy a new i7 3rd Gen laptop if it had windows 2000 and a restriction that u can't change it??? For same price that u buy a normal i7 laptop or even higher.
I just saw an ad on TV for an android device on one of the big us carriers (I forget which one) and it was really bad. It made me realize something I've never agreed with before: that indeed android fragmentation is a hinderence.
Hear me out. Obviously being an active xda member I'm pro-android, but most people with android devices aren't on xda and wont root or even use a different launcher. So that is why I realize carriers like Verizon or whoever have to show generic commercials with no or little focus on the actual operation system. Don't get me wrong, I'm not sticking up for the carriers, they are the ones that take forever to update android versions. But they don't have to. That's the "beauty" of android.
But this has never been more of an issue than right now, I argue. Android 4.2.x is excellent and beautiful. It is the first time an iPhone user could try android and actually feel like it could be in the same competition as iOS in terms of looks and general UI. Meanwhile only a very tiny percent of android users have the latest version.
So to bring it back around to the commercial I saw, which goes for pretty much all android commercials I've ever seen, they do not display android at all! Its always generic futuristic music and background fx and distractions. Meanwhile iOS always shows a closeup of the phone with a mere finger navigating the os.
The ironic thing is that android is better now! But carriers take months or a year to update so they can only advertise their ****ty versions of android which are always stale at the time so instead they just show the phone dancing to dubstep music in front of lightning. They should be showing how Google Now is already way better than siri, how the notification drop down was started by Android (taken by iOS) and is now beautiful and functional, and how the recents button has become essential, not just usable.
There should be a SHORT grace period for carriers to update to the newest version of Android. Only then will they realize that their biggest asset isn't their ability to have 20 different android phones, or their attempt at theming a ROM (sense, touchwiz), but you actually have the best operating system out now! You just don't have the latest version because you're a phone network company and not a software development company.
But I put the blame on android because surely they are able to have a bit more control over how the big carriers manipulate their os? Why wouldn't a company like Verizon want to display the freshest os and advertise that they have the newest version of android and will always be this first to update because they don't change a thing? They would advertise that if Google had some sort or mandate on update time periods. Then android wouldn't always be thought of as the poor mans iOS .
Sent from my Galaxy Nexus
The problem is, I don't think the average user - the one you're talking about - cares about "updates". They're just something annoying that happens and you have to restart your phone for a while. They don't care if it has the "newest" Android OS, just that it does what they want - this is the rest of my family feels, and even some of my friends who ARE interested in tech.
My dad couldn't give a crap if he has ICS or JB and wouldn't be able to tell the difference. If you put 4.2 in front of him, I doubt he could tell you the difference without spending half an hour hunting it down - and after that, I would question if the changes are anything he would actually care about. That kind of a user doesn't really WANT fast change - they care that things are familiar and easy to use, they don't want to have to re-learn parts of their phone in a few months - that's one thing I can give to iOS - as boring as it is, it's well, the same.
People have always said that one particular iteration of Android is when it's "finally ready to take on iOS". I think ICS is fine in that regard. iOS is so stylistically "stagnant" that Android really doesn't have to do much to match it. The advantage of iOS is that it's always the same, that it's not changing, that you can upgrade your phone hardware and still have everything work exactly the way you knew.
"Constantly updating" appeals to tech geeks who love learning new things and better ways to use them - and that's what the Nexus line is for - that's what flashing ROMs is for. People that want that find it.
Basically, your average Android phone shopper is Windows, not Linux. They're there because they want a phone that fits their needs and price-point - something Apple isn't offering. Sure, some people are Windows people for other reasons - but we're talking the average person who just wants a computer they can afford that "just works".
A good example is my mom - I just helped her buy a tablet. She was a little afraid of the idea of an Android tablet because she had no brand familiarity. She'd seen people using iPads to do what she wanted, and was worried because she'd never heard of ASUS and better knew Samsung as an appliance-maker. These ads, the most important thing they can do is just get people to recognise the name. There have been studies done on this, and it's true - getting people to know your brand's name is one of the best things you can do. That way, the "average Joe" goes into the store and thinks, "Hey, that's Samsung - I've heard of that" and the human brain tends to go, "I've heard of that, so it must be good" - true or not. They aren't looking at the specs and comparing, they're looking for a device they can trust. Trust starts with familiarity. The iPhone came from a company that already had name-recognition, but they grew that into a much larger market by using exclusivity and ease of use. It's like with liquor - people see an expensive liquor and assume that it must be a better liquor. Simply jacking up prices has totally worked for some brands to gain success. I'm not even kidding. People do this with expensive purses and jeans and crap, too - even if it's all made in the same exact Chinese factories.
Um.
Sorry for the novel.
tl;dr : Our brains are often illogical
sd0070 said:
Android 4.2.x is excellent and beautiful. It is the first time an iPhone user could try android and actually feel like it could be in the same competition as iOS in terms of looks and general UI.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Android has been able to compete in looks and general UI since 4.0 IMO, and easily since 2.2 with Sense. Smoothness is a completely different factor, but the actual look and feel of Android has been decent for a while. iOS isn't even a UI anymore, it's an app launcher and that is all. You can't do anything at all in iOS outside of the apps, which is frankly pathetic. iOS works as Apple wants it to, Android works like you want it to.
As a developer I do think Android fragmentation is a huge issue. I agree that Android 4.0+ is nice looking and has some very nice API's however developing Android applications that run consistently accross different devices is very difficult. I find more and more that a good portion of my code ends up being wrappers and reflection calls to support API's and classes not found in previous Android versions. For example, If I want to add media player lock-screen controls to my application it's not a problem in Android 4.0+ but the class isn't available in versions below 4.0. So, what am I supposed to do? Do I release a version to the play store and say my application supports lock screen controls ONLY if you run a specific version of Android? That certainly won't ecourage people to use the application. Just my opinion.
I agree it can be a problem for development.
However, I think it's reasonable to say, "this feature will only work on 4.0+" - people are used to that, if you have a Windows 98 machine still, I hope you're not expecting to be able to run everything a Windows 7 machine could, for example. I see things like designations requiring XP/Vista/7, et cetera on packages - I don't think it's unreasonable that at some point Android is the same - you can only reasonably support so far back because at some point it's just not worth your time.
If it's possible to implement below 4.0 and it's worth your time to make it happen - that's the cost of business to decide if it's worth it or not to support the older devices based on what your market looks like.