Related
Don't know what happened... but my alert was put into Q&A even though it's not a question.
Sorry, for the cross-posting... but this issue is very important to all of us who care about rooting/modifying our devices. We may soon lose the legal exemption to do that.
UPDATE: I see that xda-dev has an article in its main portal page...
Bumping this until Feb. 10...
when no one will be able to affect the situation...
TRIED the website but it must be having some issues. Thanks Geek for the heads up. What a freakin joke. Utter and total BS. Imagine if the government tried to tell people that they couldn't modify there car? I'll try to find a better link to the petition.
Before everyone gets hyped:
It's a little bit complicated. First off, the Federal Government (namely a member of Congress) would have to care enough to push for a law to be passed. Another thing that could happen is that there could be an Agency regulation that specifically prohibits rooting. However for that to happen, they have to authority to be able to enforce it.
As long as you are not reverse engineering, you are not breaking any U.S. law. This exemption that is expiring only clarified a defense to a law that does not exist, meaning that we specifically stated that rooting was not a crime, while there was no law stating that modification was a crime. It is a very vague, legal gray area. It's a lot like gun laws- things are not settled until they are tried in court.
So hopefully it gets renewed.
finch8423 said:
Before everyone gets hyped:
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Too late. Getting hyped is a prerequisite for being a member of xda-dev.
finch8423 said:
It's a little bit complicated. First off, the Federal Government (namely a member of Congress) would have to care enough to push for a law to be passed. Another thing that could happen is that there could be an Agency regulation that specifically prohibits rooting. However for that to happen, they have to authority to be able to enforce it.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I agree that it is complicated. But, according to EFF: Some device manufacturers claim that jailbreaking violates Section 1201 of the Digital Millennium Copyright Act (DMCA), which carries stiff penalties.there is already such a law. Granted, there has not been a court case, yet, testing that law. But it is on the books.
finch8423 said:
As long as you are not reverse engineering, you are not breaking any U.S. law. This exemption that is expiring only clarified a defense to a law that does not exist, meaning that we specifically stated that rooting was not a crime, while there was no law stating that modification was a crime. It is a very vague, legal gray area. It's a lot like gun laws- things are not settled until they are tried in court.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Well, you may wish to read, specifically, about Section 1201 of the DMCA. It is false comfort to think that a law does not exist... it does exist. The wikipedia article on the DMCA has a good discussion. If you are more of a legal geek, then the government provides congressional report 105-796 and a summary on the internet. For information on how institutions of learning can be affected, EDUCAUSE addresses the issue on its site.
finch8423 said:
So hopefully it gets renewed.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The whole point of creating this thread. To help ensure that it is renewed.
A bull****, nothing more. It is my property and I do with it what I want. They can only affect my warrenty. They can only do something if its a carrier branded and you don't buy for full price . Then device is still a carrier property
Sent from my HTC Desire S using xda premium
This country is already broke (not only financially, but also morally -- but that's an entirely different discussion), how will they go about actually enforcing this law? I know that phone companies can gather a lot of information about your phone remotely, but can they tell whether your phone is rooted or not?
I'm not trying to be pompous, so I apologize if I came off like that. I completely agree with you.
They can claim all they want. It's important for everyone to know that if it comes to that, there is no specific law addressing this, only claims under the DMCA.
In my legal opinion, root privileges can hardly be misconstrued as copyright infringement. It's mainly Macintosh that is pushing this though- they claim that jailbreaking is illegal because of the close-source nature of their products (It's also ironic to note that many of the working conditions of their factories would be considered illegal in every country that they sell their products in).
Well macintosh and... recently, ASUS, right? and one other... last summer, but I can't recall who right now.
Let's just say... for sake of argument that carriers sign agreements with manufacturerers (when, in fact, they're different companies)... that require them to deny service to "rooted" devices based on the law... or maybe not the law... but their collective interpretation of the law...
Honestly...
Ndaa, sopa, pipa... Now this???
Dammit my m4 is getting put to use soon isn't it??
Sent from my SGH-T959V using XDA App
^ add ACTA to that list.
Sent from my SGS 4G.
You do realize that google gave us source, and samsung gave us source, and they both stated that "THIS CAN BE USED FOR "ENRICHMENT" OF YOUR PHONE" google android is 100% free. Even if it expired, it wouldn't effect us. Whoever the fool that initially stated that rooting will go away is false.
As ACTA is *****. My country accepted it, **** them
Sent from my HTC Desire S using xda premium
gefilus said:
As ACTA is *****. My country accepted it, **** them
Sent from my HTC Desire S using xda premium
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Damn... is your town as beautiful in person as it looks in pictures? I had to look it up to see where the hell you lived
Watch profile and will see where I live
Sent from my HTC Desire S using xda premium
airfluip1 said:
You do realize that google gave us source, and samsung gave us source, and they both stated that "THIS CAN BE USED FOR "ENRICHMENT" OF YOUR PHONE" google android is 100% free. Even if it expired, it wouldn't effect us. Whoever the fool that initially stated that rooting will go away is false.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Are you suggesting that EFF doesn't know what the hell they are talking about?
Sent from my SGH-T959V using xda premium
Maybe. Just ask Google.
Sent from my SGH-T959V using xda premium
We might not be talking apples to apples...
I know apple has fought their phones being jail broken. But isn't it the carriers who really have the problem with it? They want to make you buy their network specific phone from them?
They can only put this law if there is one only on devices which are carrier branded. On unlocked or unbramded devices they can't do the ****. It is in my proparty and take you hand of from it, I can do with my device what I want
Sent from my HTC Desire S using xda premium
lumin30 said:
Damn... is your town as beautiful in person as it looks in pictures? I had to look it up to see where the hell you lived
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Mostly and almost the same like in pictures. And ye waterfall is or mark
Sent from my HTC Desire S using xda premium
http://fosspatents.blogspot.com/2012/02/apples-us-antisuit-lawsuit-against.html
You couldn't make this up, Apple are suing Motorola in the US so that, if successful, Motorola can never again take them to court (ever) for the patent infringements Apple specify. Not only that but if, as is expected, Apple win then courts in other countries are expected to also come down on Apples side in their countries Motorola cases.
As the article states:
"this is a very serious issue, and it could have major impact. Beyond presenting a good chance that Motorola will in the not too distant future be effectively precluded from enforcing its baseband patents against the iPhone 4S (and Apple products to be released in the near term), this could further increase the likelihood of serious antitrust trouble for Google-MMI in Europe and, in a worst-case scenario, it could reflect very unfavorably on Google-MMI's credibility in certain important circles."
The article then explains how Motorola, and Google (yes both companies), would also be liable to pay Apple damages for breach of contract and unfair licensing issues.
Seriously, how can you sue your competition so they can't sue you? I think that's just nuts.
The patent system is so broken and just needs a major overhaul. It's so disgusting how Apple is abusing this and the legal system. And taking someone's ability to sue and defend themselves is just insane!
It really frustrates me to see Apple do this I mean come on seriously, I wouldn't be surprised if apple wins this too since they seem to win most of there legal battle some how.
I think the biggest problem is these companies know that judges have no real clue when it comes to technology and they are using it to their advantage. Truth is I don't see them winning their no sue side of it. The truth here is that Apple is scared because Google is planning to sue them with the patents Motorola has and this is just a preemptive legal strike... but I don't see it working.
Sent from my Droid using XDA App
The government needs to slap Apple with so many fines.
Sent from my ADR6425LVW
What make laugh in all this is apple didn't even invent slide to unlock yet they are allowed to sue others for using ,yet the blatantly rip off pull down notifications and nothing happens,would not suprise me if they tried to patent pull down notifications
sent from my leedroid powered Desire HD
combat goofwing said:
What make laugh in all this is apple didn't even invent slide to unlock yet they are allowed to sue others for using ,yet the blatantly rip off pull down notifications and nothing happens,would not suprise me if they tried to patent pull down notifications
sent from my leedroid powered Desire HD
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Funny you should mention that as they patented push notifications already.
Dave
Sent from my LG P920 using Tapatalk
Thanks............ for info
I Am Marino said:
The government needs to slap Apple with so many fines.
Sent from my ADR6425LVW
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
They can't, technically Apple owns USA, they have more money than the entire USA treasury
Apple can buy out the entire USA debt and it will technically own USA
AllGamer said:
They can't, technically Apple owns USA, they have more money than the entire USA treasury
Apple can buy out the entire USA debt and it will technically own USA
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Apple has around $100 billion ...American debt is in the Trillions....in one month America spends around that much on the military/wars ...wtf are you talking about?
Sent from my Xoom using Tapatalk
I Am Marino said:
The government needs to slap Apple with so many fines.
Sent from my ADR6425LVW
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The government would have to slap themselves first...its the system thats complete crap and broken.
Lol...Apple could maybe buy Greece instead.
Sent from my Desire HD using xda premium
TommUK said:
Lol...Apple could maybe buy Greece instead.
Sent from my Desire HD using xda premium
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
If apple buys out Greece they can then sue even more.
Why are Microsoft Getting away from all of this
All I want is a Good Stable ROM With Ics Theme On My Droid RAZR.
(651.73.30 XT910) if you got any suggestions for me please PM ME.
I used 2 be thr main guy on the but now on the RAZR i'm asking for help @[email protected]
As much as I dislike Apple, they seem to have better lawyers. You would think Google has better coonections with all that money they throwing at lobbyist. Have them lobby to redo the damn patent system.
Sent from my Nexus S using xda premium
http://fosspatents.blogspot.com/2012/02/motorola-cant-enforce-standard.html
German courts have made a ruling that means if Motorola tries to use its most important patents against Apple in a court case the company will be in violation of European Anti trust law.
As the article says:
"Apple scored a breakthrough court victory today against Motorola. Its important can hardly be overstated. This is so huge that it even begs the question of whether Google's strategy for its $12.5 billion purchase of Motorola Mobility has failed before the deal is even formally closed (they're still waiting for some regulatory approvals)."
It would be nice to see Apple bought down a peg or two but the way things are going its likely to be Google-Motorola (and therefore also Android) that is on the losing side.
After all Motorola cannot use its genuinely essential patents in court now and yet Apple can still use dumb ones like voice search, touch screen, text completion etcetera that although every decent phone nowadays has these features Apple own the patents to and have been able to use in court cases so it seems Apple now have the upper hand.
Dave
Why, yes, Apple, you can patent intuitive actions on your devices all you please; and don't worry about those pesky other companies patenting worthwhile operating features, we'll make them play ball with you. Hahaha, let's go smoke this cigar together and laugh at all the little people.
this is getting hilarious...they all should concentrate on developing new devices instead of sueing each other. I hate Apple for all these lawsuits...
Firetribe said:
this is getting hilarious...they all should concentrate on developing new devices instead of sueing each other. I hate Apple for all these lawsuits...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
They can't develop new devices without violating apples patents anymore. When the new phones with android get released after mwc you'll see more lawsuits against those models too.
Apple will win because they have patents that are not subject to frand so don't have to let people use them.
Odd thing is that apples licence offer to motorola, which stopped the injunction on iphones in Germany, is still less than motorola asked for yet judges order them to not sue apple as a result.
Dave
Sent from my LG P920 using Tapatalk
Yeo, I know it was Apple who started it all... I just feel sorry for the time wasted in court, only to slow down the other side, time and money which could be used much better.
Sent from my HTC Incredible S using XDA App
Firetribe said:
Yeo, I know it was Apple who started it all... I just feel sorry for the time wasted in court, only to slow down the other side, time and money which could be used much better.
Sent from my HTC Incredible S using XDA App
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Things got worse for motorola today as apple won court case over the android gallery and they have to change it or all their products running android get banned and recalled.
Dave
Sent from my LG P920 using Tapatalk
First of all you have to consider the source of this information to be able to evaluate the spin on this. Florian Mueller is a anti Google/Android pro MS mouthpiece who tends to be clueless.
This is a lifting of the preliminary injunction. The case itself is still pending, but It'll likely to take quite a while to finish up. Granted this isn't good news for Motorola, but it's NOT the end of the road.
Check out Groklaw for a different slant on this and other issues (eg Oracle/Google)
jcmm11 said:
First of all you have to consider the source of this information to be able to evaluate the spin on this. Florian Mueller is a anti Google/Android pro MS mouthpiece who tends to be clueless.
This is a lifting of the preliminary injunction. The case itself is still pending, but It'll likely to take quite a while to finish up. Granted this isn't good news for Motorola, but it's NOT the end of the road.
Check out Groklaw for a different slant on this and other issues (eg Oracle/Google)
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Actually he uses android devices as he has a Samsung that was affected by the german court case against them last year and he is actually very knowledgeable.
I follow his work and have not noticed any pro apple bias but the things he states are facts, motorolas cannot sue apple using their patents for the duration of the appeal which is between one to two years so how would any bias change the facts?
Dave
Sent from my LG P920 using Tapatalk
He said "pro MS" and not "pro apple"
mistermentality said:
Actually he uses android devices as he has a Samsung that was affected by the german court case against them last year and he is actually very knowledgeable.
I follow his work and have not noticed any pro apple bias but the things he states are facts, motorolas cannot sue apple using their patents for the duration of the appeal which is between one to two years so how would any bias change the facts?
Dave
Sent from my LG P920 using Tapatalk
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Sent from my PC36100 using Tapatalk
atljatl said:
He said "pro MS" and not "pro apple"
Sent from my PC36100 using Tapatalk
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
He said anti android as well which if the guy uses android as he does is unlikely.
Dave
Sent from my LG P920 using Tapatalk
Sucks for Motorola. I really had hope this would be a big battle for the long lasting.
starable said:
Sucks for Motorola. I really had hope this would be a big battle for the long lasting.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I thought that steve jobs was gone, apple would stop these law suits but it seems to be differing
OMG. Counter Strike On Android! http://cs-portable.net/
The patent trolling will never end.
Patent fraud is some really easy money, especially when you've got easy victories guaranteed, like Apple does.
Firetribe said:
Yeo, I know it was Apple who started it all...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Motorola sued apple first, which started the ball rolling..
Tone_ said:
Motorola sued apple first, which started the ball rolling..
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Motorola sued after apple didn't pay licencing fees in 2010, something apple still won't pay. Bit different to apple suing because phones can auto complete text for example.
Motorola sued for a good reason but apple do so to stifle competition.
Dave
Sent from my LG P920 using Tapatalk
So ridiculous.
European courts seem to be all over Apple's side.
mistermentality said:
Motorola sued after apple didn't pay licencing fees in 2010, something apple still won't pay. Bit different to apple suing because phones can auto complete text for example.
Motorola sued for a good reason but apple do so to stifle competition.
Dave
Sent from my LG P920 using Tapatalk
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
saw this and i thought i would say that apple originally started all of this by suing google and HTC first
they r trying to hold back developemnet becuz thats all apple has done is steal and try and stop competition
in the long run apple will fall
and ppl only buy apple products cuz they br pretty i buy google products for quality and interfacing
all in all apple products r made for the stupid and wealthy while android/windows r made for ppl that want to improve thru the reason y google is open source
Long live open source!
Apple are thieves.
Buy an Apple product and you support your own demise.
Wake up people!
Sent from my Inspire 4G using XDA
Do your own research and decide. His name is mud on Slashdot and Groklaw. Here's one article. found at m.paidcontent.org/article/419-is-patent-expertblogger-florian-mueller-getting-too-cozy-with-microsoft/
Partial quote:
The problem lies not with Mueller’s analysis—but with his impartiality. The engineer is right when he says that Mueller has the knives out for Google. Even a casual reader of the FOSS blog can easily discern that Mueller is quick to amplify any legal setback for Google’s Android or its affiliates. His tone can be crowing and haughty—see the tendentious “Google scores an Own Goal” post about Motorola (NYSE: MMI)—and for all the world echoes Microsoft’s own “they’re getting what they deserve” attitude to Google.
Sent from my Galaxy Nexus using XDA
1.http://decryptedtech.com/editorials...about-peace-or-a-warning-from-google-to-apple
2.http://decryptedtech.com/news/apple-and-qualcomm-lose-billion-dollar-exclusive-bid-with-tsmc
Post What you think
(i think its great, apple's trolling cought up with them)
google doesnt care about right or wrong. They are probably negotiating with Apple to have a peace treaty then Apple will go after Samsung and when thats done break whatever agreement they have with Google. Google will act blindsided but they should of seen it coming a mile away.
It wouldnt be the first time Google sold everyone down the river. Anyone remember the mobile net neutrality meetings with the FCC
I think the point of Apple not being able to provide LTE speed is an interesting point but may not be a major factor...ease of use may win out over speed for users that are less than savvy...although we know our devices are pretty common sense, I watch my mom try to use her Desire HD and cringe lol.
All we can do is wait and see...
Apple is getting what they deserve. When you use someone's technology and hen try to claim it as your own and sue your competition, companies will start to take notice. They really do take other people's innovations and use it against them. People do notice this stuff. And after suing the makers of one of the key components of their phone, they really did bite the hand that feeds them.
Google was smart to go with Motorola because they have lots of patents, and this should mean android will continue to take over apple. And I do think that the Samsung and apple case findings will be overturned so I really do think apple has cooked their own goose.
Sent from my SGH-T989D using xda premium
jim93 said:
google doesnt care about right or wrong. They are probably negotiating with Apple to have a peace treaty then Apple will go after Samsung and when thats done break whatever agreement they have with Google. Google will act blindsided but they should of seen it coming a mile away.
It wouldnt be the first time Google sold everyone down the river. Anyone remember the mobile net neutrality meetings with the FCC
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
For all we know, Apple may have started talking to Google about the patents because they're scared sh*tless.
Sent from my GT-I9100 using xda app-developers app
I doubt
I wonder what would happen to Apple if Google blocked all Apple devices from accessing any Google service. This would hurt Google badly, but it could serve to cripple Apple. Yahoo! would be estatic, but Google is currently intertwined so intricately into the fabric of the internet any device without access to Google services is a child's toy.
Apple is scared.... Samsung makes the majority of iPhone chips and their contract is almost up
Sent from my SGH-T989 on Jelly Bean goodness!
Lol samsung confirmed it will sue Apple immediately if it releases an LTE device
Sent from my SGH-T989 on Jelly Bean goodness!
grassyloki said:
Lol samsung confirmed it will sue Apple immediately if it releases an LTE device
Sent from my SGH-T989 on Jelly Bean goodness!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Note it is advanced lte 4.5G, not regular lte unfortunately
Sent from my LG-P930 using xda premium
How is that not still LTE?
Sent from my T989D running some serious Jedi Knight Beats injected power
HTC and Apple have just confirmed that they've settled all of their ongoing patent disputes, ending all of their lawsuits and opting into a 10-year licensing agreement. To refresh your memory, this particular saga begin back on March 2nd, 2010, when Apple filed lawsuits with the International Trade Commission and US District Court. That initial filing covered 20 patents related to iOS, which it accused HTC of infringing upon, and since then it has only been an ever-expanding battle. Essentially all the juicy details of the settlement between the companies are completely under wraps, but both HTC's CEO, Peter Chou and Apple's man-in-charge, Tim Cook have issued brief words for the official joint statement (the whole of which can be seen after the break):
"HTC is pleased to have resolved its dispute with Apple, so HTC can focus on innovation instead of litigation," said Peter Chou, CEO of HTC.
"We are glad to have reached a settlement with HTC," said Tim Cook, CEO of Apple. "We will continue to stay laser focused on product innovation.
Notably, this settlement applies to all past and future patents for the companies, meaning we shouldn't be witnessing the two fight it out in court for years to come -- at least on the patent front. Hopefully we'll soon begin to see more of the same with other ongoing patent wars -- Apple vs. Samsung, anyone?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
via http://www.engadget.com/2012/11/10/apple-htc-patent-settlement-10-year-license/
Hopefully now HTC will start rolling again!!! This is actually good news...
Sent from my HTC One XL using xda app-developers app
I've been free of linkify for months.
Linkify was just one annoyance mass user base has to deal with due to Apple patents. Obviously XDA users know their way around it. I'm just looking forward to less feature squashing and more innovation.
Sent from my One X using Tapatalk 2
mgxplyr said:
Linkify was just one annoyance mass user base has to deal with due to Apple patents. Obviously XDA users know their way around it. I'm just looking forward to less feature squashing and more innovation.
Sent from my One X using Tapatalk 2
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I never actually found a working fix for 2.20, hopefully this deal will get rid of it permanently.