Hello,
I wanted to ask is it legal to create WM6 ROMs for the HTC Wizard . Thnx in advance .
We are not CREATING ROMS, we are EDITING them to our needs and specifications.. for instance u dont like something that comes in the rom, or u want to add something to the rom (thus saving u space, for storage and Program) you just EDIt the rom.... by using the kitchens and packages.. hope i have answered your question
funkadesi said:
We are not CREATING ROMS, we are EDITING them to our needs and specifications.. for instance u dont like something that comes in the rom, or u want to add something to the rom (thus saving u space, for storage and Program) you just EDIt the rom.... by using the kitchens and packages.. hope i have answered your question
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Sorry but still my questions remains but a changed a bit now, IS EDITING ROMS TO OUR NEEDS ILLEGAL? Thnx to funkadesi.
i would say this with some certainty, but maybe a senior member can correct me:
to edit a ROM to your own specifications and put on your device for your own personal use is not illegal, as long as the method by which the original rom was obtained was not illegal.
to edit a ROM and redistribute it to others likely crosses a legal line.
Why Does It Matter???
I'm curious why it matters so much. Fact is, for the Wizard, we would not and never will have a true WM6...and frankly, I could care less if I have a cooked rom, especially since my rom is better than what I would get from Tmo...who also will not provide any updates. So if I am to be held to pay for a new device for hundreds of dollars to have a WM6 rom, or use one of XDA's talented chef/developer's rom's...well hands down, I will stick with xda. If that makes me illegal, screw it. I refuse to use the crappy stock Tmo WM5 rom that came on my device...it is slow and buggy and needed daily rebooting. The only time my phone gets a reboot now is when I have to do it for a program install or uninstall. My beloved Jaguar is so dependably stable...I will never go back to a stock rom!!
I honestly do not know the ethics/morality behind cooking a rom, and really don't care either!! All I know is that XDA has given more to the "Wizarding" community than M$, Tmo, AT&T or any of those other greedy bastards ever have or ever will. I sleep just fine at night despite my use of NTS's rom.
Tell me this...let's say you bought a designer suit, but it didn't quite fit right...would tailoring it to your needs be in some violation? You bought the suit, you need it to fit you, so you modify to do so.
I bought the MDA. Someone somewhere also bought a device with WM6...it got tailored to my needs. Not point by point the same thing as my suit example, but since M$ refuses to produce a WM6 for a my device, why should I be punished and forced to buy a different device when my Wizard works so well?? Why buy another suit to wear when you can simply get the one you have tailored to fit you?
xsbeats said:
i would say this with some certainty, but maybe a senior member can correct me:
to edit a ROM to your own specifications and put on your device for your own personal use is not illegal, as long as the method by which the original rom was obtained was not illegal.
to edit a ROM and redistribute it to others likely crosses a legal line.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I didn't understand that, u mean that if i edit a ROM and redistribute it for free on my site, would it be illegal? Sorry for my lack of understanding. Thnx to xsbeats too .
xda2_haseeb said:
I didn't understand that, u mean that if i edit a ROM and redistribute it for free on my site, would it be illegal? Sorry for my lack of understanding. Thnx to xsbeats too .
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
See, now more info is coming out from you. You are not wondering if it is illegal...you are wondering if posting a cooked rom on YOUR WEBSITE illegal. That would be something for the mods to answer...
I do not know the legality behind it, but XDA developers share their rom's here. Now I think if you tried to SELL a cooked rom, you could definately end up in some legal issues.
basically it doesn't really matter if it's illegal or not, it's nothing that will ever come back to you...
picture this...a cop jumps out of his car and is on fire, and you pee on him to put the fire out...yeah, you pee'd on a cop, but you also saved his life. lol, that probably proved nothing, but i found it kind of funny. basically it may be illegal it may not be, but nothing will ever come of it, so i wouldn't even ponder on it too much
All I'd say is that you make sure the rom you post is your work...because if you post another cook's rom without their permission or without giving them the credit, you will most probably have a pissed off XDA developer on your ass...and I'd think that could be worse than any BS legal threats that M$ will probably never do!!!
xda2_haseeb said:
I didn't understand that, u mean that if i edit a ROM and redistribute it for free on my site, would it be illegal? Sorry for my lack of understanding. Thnx to xsbeats too .
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
XDA-Dev used to store the roms right here on this website. Due to pressure from cell companies (as I understand it), Microsoft used legal threats to force xda-dev to remove all the roms (that was almost a year ago, and many felt that would kill this site). Thats why you mostly have to deal with getting them via rapidshare or whatever.
The Eula says WM is not to be modified or redistibuted.
I do know that some people from htc, Microsoft and AT&T watch this site and actually love the work that goes on here (Others definetly don't feel the same).
Just my thoughts...
mfrazzz said:
I do know that some people from htc, Microsoft and AT&T watch this site and actually love the work that goes on here
Code:
That is because XDA kicks ass!
(Others definetly don't feel the same)
Code:
Well that would probably be similar to having penis envy...
they know XDA rocks and that they don't match up!
.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
^^^Well at least that is my view on the subject!^^^
Here's the bottom line, when you get down to it.
You kill a resource like this, a lot of Wizard owners will buy a Nokia.
Then Microsoft and HTC never sell that person another device/OS on a mobile platform.
That's kind of a problem for them. Unlike the desktop PC where you pretty much have to run Windows for a lot of purposes, on the mobile side there is no particular need to use a HTC device or Windows Mobile - there ARE other, competing alternatives that in fact have majority market share.
The carriers "efforts" in this regard are beyond lame and border on stupid. The instability in most of the stock ROMs are nutty bad and there is no "retail" upgrade option available (that is, unlike my home PC, for which I CAN go buy Vista, the option doesn't exist for my HTC Wizard)
Here's an ineresting article that has a Microsoftie recommending using some rom tools to pull out products like rdp for various reasons
msmobiles article
Money Quote:
MSMobiles said:
Scott Yost from Windows Mobile division of Microsoft USA, who specializes there in code signing, security policies, revocation and certificates, admits:
There are unsupported tools externally available that are able to copy the modules out of ROM and then try to reconstruct the original file. If you still need to extract those bytes, you can probably find one of those tools.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Thnx everybosy for there replies my question is now answered, i have come to the point that:
""I can edit and keep a ROM on my own site""
Do correct if mistaken.
Thnx to all.
Hi all
Due to being confused i have posted the same thread in Desire Genereal, Desire Q&A, General, WebOS Hacking&General and WebOS Development.
Please delete the wrong ones.
I was just wandering would it be possible and if there is any brave soul to port Web OS to desire. I have read a bit and would like to try this OS myself. Not rich enough to owe 3 mobiles though :/.
Just let me know if I'm asking/wanting impossible or it is doable and someone may take it on board.
thnx in advance for all replies
Regards
Kirior
I'd LOVE to run webOS on my Desire too but webOS isn't open source so you can't, legally speaking, put it on your phone
what you can do though is test it via an emulator on your desktop
you just have do download the SDK at developer.palm.com
i have a palm pre for sprint i am not using, i've been playing around with it, but if you want it, msg me, we can work something out.
A large majority of the OS is in fact open source.
http://opensource.palm.com/packages.html
etx said:
A large majority of the OS is in fact open source.
http://opensource.palm.com/packages.html
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Indeed, but none of the user interface.
If you want a command-line Linux box, no problem. It will be the same as any other OpenEmbedded-based Linux development machine with no graphical user interface.
If you want what most people refer to as "webOS", that bit is proprietary.
I wouldn't say the open source part is a "large majority" either.
-- Rod
If this just can be like the Nokia N900 that can handle WebOS APP just installing some things.
Ok guys, it's been brought to my attention that my post was
1. Cantankerous.
2. Seemingly disrespectful of devs great work on here.
3. Taken too seriously for being an internet forum.
I would like to say sorry, and explain what I mean I tihnk it would be awesome to pull together the necessary funding for our very talented developers to create an XDA exclusive, completely original ROM. I'm not sure if it is possible, but something that is just for the Thunderbolt alone and isn't sense, isn't AOSP, isn't MIUI, and DEFINITELY not like Motorboat... I mean Motorblur. I think we really are on to something with the work that the Dev's are doing with taking different roms and porting them/using other roms as bases and then building from them; lets see what we can do to completely change the way that this stuff is done(if possible) by polling ideas(not unreasonable wishlists) and putting it all together. Possibly coordinating between Team BAMF, Chingy, and some other the other recognized DEV's.
What does everyone else think?
htcdesirezgeorge said:
I'm not sure if it is possible, but something that is just for the Thunderbolt alone and isn't sense, isn't AOSP, isn't MIUI, and DEFINITELY not like Motorboat...
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Click to collapse
If it isn't sense/blur/touchwiz, it is AOSP. Miui is just modified AOSP (with no sources given back), just like all the other roms not sense/blur/touchwiz are also based on AOSP. You do know what AOSP means right? Android Open Source Project as in the android operation system that is the basis to all android phones just modded by the OEMs. What you're asking is similar to saying:
"Hey, I'm bored with linux, unix, osx and windows, can we make a new operating system totally not based on any of those for our computers?"
Perhaps rephrase your question one more time in a way that makes more sense? Third time is a winner
yareally said:
If it isn't sense/blur/touchwiz, it is AOSP. Miui is just modified AOSP (with no sources given back), just like all the other roms not sense/blur/touchwiz are also based on AOSP. You do know what AOSP means right? Android Open Source Project as in the android operation system that is the basis to all android phones just modded by the OEMs. What you're asking is similar to saying:
"Hey, I'm bored with linux, unix, osx and windows, can we make a new operating system totally not based on any of those for our computers?"
Perhaps rephrase your question one more time in a way that makes more sense? Third time is a winner
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Ya got a point, I actually didn't know that! BUT, regardless of how its phrased, what do ya think it would require to do somethig like I mentioned? I, personally would love to see something excitingly new put out here. Like with the miui project, any chance of people putting their heads together to figure it out?
You've got OS's and you have UI's. Obviously it is entirely possible to custom build a UI, but its FAR more difficult than porting one over or mixing and mashing parts of Sense together. UberBAMF is definitely something new and out of the box. That's more radical than anything I ever expected... Or have ever seen elsewhere. UIs do a lot to sell a device, so its worth it for HTC or Samsung to invest in building one. Not so much for a team of volunteer devs.
htcdesirezgeorge said:
Ya got a point, I actually didn't know that! BUT, regardless of how its phrased, what do ya think it would require to do somethig like I mentioned? I, personally would love to see something excitingly new put out here. Like with the miui project, any chance of people putting their heads together to figure it out?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Chances are unlikely to get a new user interface geared to only one phone built from the ground up from the android source by a team for a few reasons:
1) Lack of like-minded (knowledgeable) developers for one device that are currently free. Developers are very opinionated (just from my own experience even if they don't want to admit it). What should/shouldn't go into it would be a mess to deal with and debate alone, especially since the opinions of developers are generally not the same as those that don't develop. The ones already developing most likely don't want to give up their current projects as well. Basically, the developers that want to develop already have their projects and most treat them like it's their "baby" and most likely not willing to give them up or put them on hold. That moves into issue #2
2) Time. It would take considerable amount of time and organization to do that. Probably to get something stable that's original would take longer than most people would keep their Thunderbolt. Guys that work on their phones do this part time for fun as well and that combined with other side projects would press for time.
3) True developers & designers. There's a big difference between hacking some already made stuff to work with things and actually writing object oriented software from scratch. Obviously some guys putting stuff out for the thunderbolt are true developers that code professionally and others are just hacking around making things work done by others. Both have their uses, but you need real development for something like this and I don't think there's enough of those willing.
Forgot to add that the only way change happens is to build interest, so don't let my pessimistic observations detour anyone from posting their thoughts and ideas in this thread
Starting a new thread here.
YES I A NEWBIE!!!
(when it comes to Android at least).
That said. Nobody has to point it out. I know where I stand and I don't know much about Android. I know quite much about Unix/Linux so that's
a start. I know some electronics. I own a Note 3 that I think is mostly the same and want to try to take it parts from there.
It's not about stealing, "kanging", code. Please see it as a journey of fun. Of learning. Making something!
Newbie or not. I think we could be a fun bunch. Since we all want to learn!
I see more want the same. So why don't we pool? Why not make a "Hello I9506!"-Rom?
It's something I want to learn. Today I don't know something. Tomorrow I will. But just the satisfaction of doing something is worth it.
So if someone is interested. Message me. Hell. All the devs where newbies once.
Some are very helpful and some are jerks. We have the whole spectrum here and met both sides. But I don't care if a "elite-dev" snorts at me.
I want to produce something. From there on? Who knows?
A quick question:
Do we have some bloatware-list we can use or it the same? Still would need it thank you
I got some strange behavior of it yesterday (yes, I rooted it and tripped Knox, knowingly). It says it doesn't have space.
Folderspace says otherwise but saw that the /system was 89% and that feels just like it needs a real good cleanup.
I need to do the same with my Note 3. There I think there are scripts, but not for this. Is it the same TouchWiz as on the '05?
I contacted the "head developer" (I think, the one that made the first post) from FoxHound Rom since they
1) Makes a really nice rom
2) Have a release it on Note 3
So I asked for some help, hints. I'm sure he answers when he sees it.
What I like is the AOSP-feel of it. I'm like all the time running, between them. Flash, flash, flash. Ok dual boot now, but not the same!
Was same on my HTC until Venom released Viper for One X. The rom of roms! Venom Team. They are damn skilled.
So you find your "fav-rom". Me I like Foxhound just because it connects the two worlds. It's aiming for the best of the both worlds. Innovative.
Granted TouchWiz as a base is stable. They have a whole stab of people working on it.
It's fun to play around with both Probam or Pac-man (as it's built on) but it has drawbacks.
I can't use my Flipcase, and on the Note the pen and then we have some bugs on it. As all the rest.
Nothing that I can't complain about, since then I should take my butt and fix them or report them at least.
Please. Report. Never complain of bugs, because they happen. It's their hobby project ffs!
I really hate people that start to "demand" or are very unfriendly in their bug reporting.
It goes the other way around as well. Sauerkraut-devs with snotty answers.
Having worked with several closed and open source projects bug-reports are good, ideas for change. You can voice.
Sometimes strongly, about a new direction you don't like but you can NEVER demand, complain. Want something that badly? Ok. Pay me.
Over the years I've been on the net (like since 1991) I've seen this circle over and over.
The circle of Open source development
1) Enormous enthusiasm. The start! The first little halting buggy rom. So proud. Full of energy.
2) Taking in own and others ideas and develop, develop, develop - this is the happy times
3) The bugs start to be complicated as the code complicates so they are not that "fun" as to implement new stuff - and here starts the spiral
4) Here it's a combo that can go two ways or together
a) Constant nagging, demanding users without positive feed back makes them think that the users are just ungrateful. Because they are.
The coding is done on spare time. You can't "demand" someone from an Open source project. You can ask, propose.
In some you can expect it holds high standards and you can sometimes question if the decision in some part is wise and made a good and sound argument.
Give an alternative. But never demand and the final decision is up to the project.
b) The coders starts to seem themselves as the best on the earth and starts to see the users as something unavoidable.
This is a big error because then they should stop releasing version and just have their own. So they stop listen to ideas, and feel that the users
are ungrateful ****heads that should just follow the path and be happy that they get some app at all.
That is the negative spiral.
The frustration and the worst scenario, a rouge programmer, that go it's own way in the project. That makes a schism. Quarrels
Either the code is then forked (parted) or the whole structure starts to fall apart in who is the leader, owner, and never-ending discussions
because everybody knows BEST. Here the users are totally ignored since the internal conflicts takes over the whole project.
5) The coders gets tired of all this. Have bugs they don't care to fix and if someone files a report or do a suggestion they get a "Do it yourself" back.
6) Abandoned code or a restructure, a new way of working and uniting, some people leave, some new joins.
Healing and a fresh start or the project dies, often with the last version full of bugs that people still use because it's still what they want.
If there is luck, an new bunch of coders take that code and start from 1
I've seen this so many times and it's always the same.
In commercial projects you try to identify when the coder comes to this frustration point, because then it's time to move him/her to something else.
Because a disgruntled and unhappy person is never good, in anything. So it goes both ways.
So how to avoid it?
Basics. Planning. Setting goals. Having a real bugtracking system. Making clear that suggestions are suggestions and have a civil tone from both ways.
And then talk, yell, have big arguments inside the group, but make a real case for it. Like having your own space, where you give proposals.
But in the end. ALWAYS RESPECT.
A round table is not a bad thing, but there has to be respect and it has to be someone that has the final word that you have enough respect
for and trust that he/she decide what he/she think is the best and accept it. Else it's a chicken-yard. Never ending back and forth.
If you can't live with it because YOUR proposal was not granted either leave in a good way or make a fork. Or be a good player and not a crybaby.
A proposal should be in the form of What, Why, Time, Benefit (and if you are mature enough - potential problems and implications).
And then have a discussion about it. Advocate your case. Have a chat in the group.
There is nothing to say that a program can't have two different versions. Sometimes an experimental branch just to test things.
Time can tell which is the best. Be humble and respectful. Have heated discussions, as I have in a current project, challenge something.
That way, you see if it holds. It's the basis of research as way.
Postulate something. Try to prove it. Find someone to disprove it. Have an argument. See if it holds else start over. Boring? Yepp.
Does it give results? Oh yes. This is how mature people work.
Especially when it comes to medicine (that is my field now). Proving something is not easy. And think of those who sit for 20 years with a problem,
try 200 ways that fails, but don't give up. Persistence towards a goal. I met a professor. She has been working with HIV for something like 20 years.
She told me how many times they thought they where close. How it looked so nice. How it looked "THIS IS THE KEY" to see that it held for that part of the virus,
but not for the other 18 mutations and that it doesn't do any real benefits compared to the disadvantages. Finding a "hook" as they thought a few years back.
That was the most promising. Because a specific "hook" in something means that you can do something that grabs it. But it failed.
Or the people working on Malaria that kills so many. It's a complicated parasite and we have been so close, so close, but not yet.
The really big big thing. Documentation. I know, this is sooo damn boring, but to write out what you are doing in this block of code
(if obvious, just one line), If more complicated, explain.
Don't over complicate.
Don't insert numbers that you forget lie *1024 or +2, use a label for that. Document!
Try to write as general code as possible. KISS! (Keep it simple, stupid).
There is this case that we always get. It's about a coder in a project. He has this subroutine. He has been writing it to "perfection". Rewriting it.
Over and over. The machine went for years. Then it called that function and it crashed. Oh the irony,
In Sweden we call code that is in total disarray for spaghetti-code, because YOU know it, can navigate, but for someone new, it's hard or impossible.
Modularize as much as possible! Can't stress this enough.
That way, even if it take a bit extra time you have "boxes" that are taking in stuff and spitting out stuff.
Example.
We need a database to store things. We chose X. We work with X and then the X is not ideal, we need to make compromises in the code.
Mend it to work with X. But we come to a point where we want and need Y. But since the code is so intertwinned with X it's a hell to change it to Y.
Making an "interface", where you define clearly, the function of the database simplified (creations etc), boils down to this:
Search for something, read that something, write (change/add/delete) that something. That is it.
So yes, you write a few more lines, but today, we don't need to count how many clock-cycles the penalty it get (as I did way back).
We have damn fast things. When Java came it was like syrup. So zzzlooooowww. People just scratched their heads.
The only thing was that it worked over platforms. Today we have computers that can run it just fine. Fluid. Our phones for instance.
Same with C++. And yes, you can still make it zzzzloooow. So it's good to have some books (I have ebooks) on functions.
Don't reinvent stuff.
A sort function is mathematical. It will not change. When I started my masters we had this "little" book called "Introductions to algorithms".
It's like 3000 pages! Written in "pseudo code" 20 years ago but still holds. I can teach why we should not use this and why we should use that.
But I have not coded since 1997 or so and so much has changed!
But an Android is a Linux in the bottom. I've worked as a Unix specialist for many years before I changed path. So I know my way around there.
I DO need to update myself. I'm honest. I can spend time in clusters. Sometimes I have personal matters that hinders me. Like most people.
But first and foremost. It has to be FUN. This is our spare time. We do this for free. It SHOULD be fun.
Writing not fun is something you get paid for. Get a specification. Do this and that.
We still need that and it can be an obstacle but it still should be a goal to want to do this.
Persistence. Ask for help. Get a no? Ask another. We all have to start from square one. That is the beauty of this in a way.
So I'm asking if someone wants to make a group and do a ROM? I want to try. We seem to be an enthusiastic bunch here right now. Let's pool!
Let's make our "Hello Worlld! I9506 rom!
So if anybody else, newbie or not, feel it would be fun, message me. Cause I will try anyway and I would love some company.
I've had "some" project leading experience, and I still sit as a bit "advisor/pain in the but".
I don't code but most probably need to start again. But I do voice advice/concern from time to time. I try to propose some solution based on experience.
Call it "meta-coding", but it can be just as important to know how to move code fast then to be able to write the lines.
"Paradigms" don't change. If you look at a language, Java, C etc. You can boil it don't to rules. And the rules are basically the same.
The syntax, how you write it, is different. Some special solutions that is unique for just one language is there.
It's a pain to work with strings of text in C but easy peasy in Perl for instance.
And if we find someone that can give us hints help. That would be kind of them. We can ask. The worst response we can get is a "no", right?
As you see I'm known to write long. "Walls of text" is something I first got a bit mad at, now I find it funny. Sure, I "chat" in a written form.
But I'm full of ideas and enthusiasm here.
I have no plans to enforce me as some "boss". We are a team. Later on, someone will lead. We are a bunch of enthusiasts.
Right now. Baby steps. At least this is how I look at things. You might look at it otherwise.
Nothing stops us from exchanging ideas, even if we don't work on the same thing? I think that is the spirit. Helping each other.
This is not an competition. I don't care if 5 people uses the rom or not. It's not about that. The next one will be cooler. But competition?
Isn't that a bit childish? People have different tastes. I like the AOSP. If my flipcase etc worked I would move from TouchWiz since I even don't use it.
My subproject that takes precedence
KNOX. I will not give up on Knox. That is my main goal right now.
It affects me personally. If we don't stop it. Stop wasting time how to circumvent the bootloader. That is irrelevant.
If not stopped NOW. We will have an S5 with a chipped version of it. Then it's too late.
I see, in some despair, people whining in the threads, but no action. Why don't 20 people start to reg at user-forums and start to spread this?
I have MY theory. You can have that. I think it's for spying. Because I can't any other reason. My employee would give me a phone.
It has no place in our phones. But whining in a thread in a special forum like XDA, where there are people who are wizards when it comes to
developing and people that want to custom their hardware doesn't do it.
We need to spread it to the forums where the "normal" users sit. That probably never noticed it's even there. The ones that ask how to change
the different levels of volume, for calls and system. The user-base. Make them understand in simple terms. Telling them that this place, where the
best people frequent, doesn't really know what it does, because Knox is more then a bootloader that you want to circumvent not to trip that "flag".
That is the only place where we can reach the masses. Make people think. NSA. Snowden. Reading my mails? Recoring my calls?
I don't know. Do you? But it's possible. Who am I to know if my provider feeds my government with data. We already feed them with positiondata.
Make people aware. Make this crowd DO SOMETHING...
[/I]
When you turn on Skype it tries to make a tunnel through in a very sneaky way to "somewhere". I see it each time I turn it on since I tap my ethernet.
My webcam is on a switch. When I Skype I turn it on. Else it's off. And aimed at the wall, if I would happen to forget to turn it off.
So they can make happy pictures. So did Hitler. I just don't buy their bull**** of security for individuals that they added a few days ago.
if I don't want to use a firewall and a viruskiller on my PC. That is my choice. If I look at the downloaded movie Intel won't blow up my CPU.
But here, if this e-fuse is true. That is a deliberate active action. Then they are destroying my property. That is not acceptable.
But to make the "whiners" do something. Damn. That takes energy.
Ok, I stop here. If someone IS interested in experimenting together, message me. I think it can be a fun journey
All the best,
Absolon (yes I got my real nick back!)
:good: Nice explanaition of your opinion and you plan!!!
Never Seen such one!!
.........Few things about me...
1. I AM A NEWBIE TOO IN ANDROID AND LINUX!!
2. I want learn more about LINUX and ANDROID
3. Everything that i know about LINUX and ANDROID i learned here from Instructions of some people( cant remember all nicks - but BIG THANKS to THEM!!! ) that are posted on XDA Forums or Googled it!! And that is not much since i can not even compile a CWM from CM source - after 2 weeks of investigation and always getting error - - i understand its not easy to do that with my less experiance!!!
4. I have a wife and 2 kids around me - so thats top priority 1 for me!
5. I do things in Android when i got time for that - thats mostly on weekends in the evening or night when wife and kids are in bed!!
6. My english is not the best!!
7. Yes of course i am interested in experimenting and learning with other interested people!!!!
8. If you can live with that 7 points before this point - you can call me a member of the ROM "Hello I9506!"
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Cheers
absolon said:
Starting a new thread here.
YES I A NEWBIE!!!
(when it comes to Android at least).
.....
.....
......
.......
Ok, I stop here. If someone IS interested in experimenting together, message me. I think it can be a fun journey
All the best,
Absolon (yes I got my real nick back!)
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
xenix96 said:
:good: Nice explanaition of your opinion and you plan!!!
Never Seen such one!!
.........Few things about me...
1. I AM A NEWBIE TOO IN ANDROID AND LINUX!!
2. I want learn more about LINUX and ANDROID
3. Everything that i know about LINUX and ANDROID i learned here from Instructions of some people( cant remember all nicks - but BIG THANKS to THEM!!! ) that are posted on XDA Forums or Googled it!! And that is not much since i can not even compile a CWM from CM source - after 2 weeks of investigation and always getting error - - i understand its not easy to do that with my less experiance!!!
4. I have a wife and 2 kids around me - so thats top priority 1 for me!
5. I do things in Android when i got time for that - thats mostly on weekends in the evening or night when wife and kids are in bed!!
6. My english is not the best!!
7. Yes of course i am interested in experimenting and learning with other interested people!!!!
Cheers
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
DEAL!
ALL programming books starts with how to write a "Hello World!" program. That's why I thought of the name
So "Hello I9506"?
/Absie
Looks interesting, i have only build a buggy CM rom for S3 but never released it, can i join ya .
Sent from my GT-I9505 using Tapatalk
absolon said:
DEAL!
ALL programming books starts with how to write a "Hello World!" program. That's why I thought of the name
So "Hello I9506"?
/Absie
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yes "Hello I9506" sounds nice and the Rom Name got also a background by this way why we call it so.
cheers
Sent from my GT-I9506 using XDA Premium 4 mobile app
Hey man, i agree with your point. I'd like to help even if I own a I9505. That shouldn't be a problem though! Count me in as a developer! :good:
My I9506 is ready for testing!
A lot of being a good developer is mindset and enthusiasm. I'm sure you'll do great!
Sent from my GT-I9505 using xda app-developers app
I hope the ROM also includes support for the E330S variant....
GO young Dev's !!
@Absie
Hi, my mate.
If u need help/some knowledge in decompiling/compiling of apks and framework jar files and building yr own ROM, PM me.
I have done my ROM projects in the S2 forums and some mods in I9505.
But I'm not a C++/java programmer freak.
I didn't have time to study in this field .
Just a tiny bit of xmls, themings and smali codes here and there that I can help u.
I'm sure u can make a good ROM in this forum.
U need more "real" devs to help u in making yr own ROM.
Cheers.
You are not alone on this. if you can do a clean system dump of 4.3 for me when it released I will take on some projects for you folks
Absolon said:
She told me how many times they thought they where close. How it looked so nice. How it looked "THIS IS THE KEY" to see that it held for that part of the virus,
but not for the other 18 mutations and that it doesn't do any real benefits compared to the disadvantages. Finding a "hook" as they thought a few years back.
That was the most promising. Because a specific "hook" in something means that you can do something that grabs it. But it failed.
Or the people working on Malaria that kills so many. It's a complicated parasite and we have been so close, so close, but not yet.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yup, that about sums up the majority of time I spend troubleshooting, with the answer often being something very simple that I overlooked in the beginning.
As for de-bloating, once you get familiar with what's what it can usually be done pretty quickly.
The first thing to always do is make nandroid of everything and save it your desktop just in case. Having a zip with the stock ROM handy can also save you a lot of time if you need to replace just one app.
There are four main places you have to remember when doing this:
/system/app - primary location for system apps
/data/data - where the app's data is stored
/data/app - where upgraded copies of the apps are saved
and the dalvik-cache (usually /data/dalvik-cache or /cache/dalvik-cache)
If you're using an odexed ROM you'll want to get both the .apk and .odex files at the same time. Many apps will also have two or three widget providers, etc., be sure to get all that stuff. Just keep a list of everything you've removed.
Facebook is usually the first thing I nix as it often uses ~50MB, is redundant when it's going to install itself from the market anyway, and always has way to much access to your personal information as a system app. Twitter, flickr and any other apps like that, which you don't need or want as a system app, can all go too. Some devices also ship with keyboards for every language ever created, you can get rid of any that don't apply to you.
Once you've cleaned out the easy ones take your list and open up Settings -> Apps. The apks may be gone from /system, but all their data and updates are still taking up space. So to finish removing them look under the "All" tab and when you see one hit wipe cache, wipe data & uninstall.
Now just return to the recovery so you can wipe your dalvik-cache and create another nandroid. If you want to clean even more this will give you a good checkpoint to revert back to if needed.
xHausx said:
Yup, that about sums up the majority of time I spend troubleshooting, with the answer often being something very simple that I overlooked in the beginning.
As for de-bloating, once you get familiar with what's what it can usually be done pretty quickly.
The first thing to always do is make nandroid of everything and save it your desktop just in case. Having a zip with the stock ROM handy can also save you a lot of time if you need to replace just one app.
There are four main places you have to remember when doing this:
/system/app - primary location for system apps
/data/data - where the app's data is stored
/data/app - where upgraded copies of the apps are saved
and the dalvik-cache (usually /data/dalvik-cache or /cache/dalvik-cache)
If you're using an odexed ROM you'll want to get both the .apk and .odex files at the same time. Many apps will also have two or three widget providers, etc., be sure to get all that stuff. Just keep a list of everything you've removed.
Facebook is usually the first thing I nix as it often uses ~50MB, is redundant when it's going to install itself from the market anyway, and always has way to much access to your personal information as a system app. Twitter, flickr and any other apps like that, which you don't need or want as a system app, can all go too. Some devices also ship with keyboards for every language ever created, you can get rid of any that don't apply to you.
Once you've cleaned out the easy ones take your list and open up Settings -> Apps. The apks may be gone from /system, but all their data and updates are still taking up space. So to finish removing them look under the "All" tab and when you see one hit wipe cache, wipe data & uninstall.
Now just return to the recovery so you can wipe your dalvik-cache and create another nandroid. If you want to clean even more this will give you a good checkpoint to revert back to if needed.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Thank you!
Right now, all we have is the original rom, that is "normal" so I gess it's "dexed". I have no clue how to make it odexed, since what I understood it makes
the whole rom smaller?
The thing that worries me is the bootloader, since we only have the one with Knox in it and I don't know how other bootloaders work or are compatible.
But that means that we are locked into SELinux, right? So until having a "Knox-free" bootloader we can't do **** when it comes to customizing roms?
Because we can't add our own kernel or is there some code that Samsung have, because I found out that Samsung had a code-repo (wow), but
not for this phone yet.
I tripped the Knox-flag when I rooted it. Found no other way really. And I don't know if this is Knox-related or something else. I noticed this on the i9505
as well. I have space but when I try to install things it says that it's out of space and can't install it. The "funny" thing is if I push the install from the webpage
of Play it installs just fine so it's seems to be something preventing it?
I don't recall if I had it before or after Knox since I tripped Knox unknowingly on my other phone before we even found out what it was.
So I need to clean it out. Yes, /system is 76% full with the original. Since all I have done so far is just rooted the phone.
If someone has an I9505, can you do
1) df -k
The partitions (not counting the sd.) on I9506 are:
The root partition (/)
/efs
/firmware-modem
/data
/persist
/system
I'm too tired to write out a good coomand, but best is to use "find" and with some -printf options and then start to hunt.
Then we can compare the phones. The special parameters for SELinux are the next step. But this is a start to see how
The SELinux special parameters part is also something that I want to see, but I want to start with this.
Btw. On my Note 3 I got an "update" of the SELinux rules. Anyone else? (Will ask in the Knox-tread as well).
That is not rooted but totally plain vanilla and I didn't even noticed that there was an update function but got "update 16".
See my post: From Knox-thread
I read and read this night, and to just condense it since I write too long anway and I'm tired. Since the bootloader
is loading an SELinux, that won't boot if it's not compared with an unique X.509 cert in every phone and see if the
loader checksums we really get an virtual environment. That is the "wrong" feel I've had I think. And I think that we need
to sit down and test some things to verify this theory. Get some programs that can do some deep probing of the hardware.
If I'm right, and they have made a VM out of the phone we should probably notice it somehow, because it's easy. I looked,
SEAndroid that NSA created is a VM with Xen.
That means that the SELinux can just run in the background with it's processes that it will never show to you and you think
you have a rooted and Knox-free phone when you never have it since the bootloader loags a SELinux and makes a sandbox.
If's perfect. Unique id on each phone. Your signature on the papers with the serial numbers which identify you as the owner.
So perfect that I could cry if I was an engineer at Samsung...
/Abs
Please make a custom ROM that works for the SHV-E330S as well
THank you very much!
sheesha_straw said:
Please make a custom ROM that works for the SHV-E330S as well
THank you very much!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
We need to start with baby steps so a skeleton for the I9506 is the first prio.
SHV-E330S I head that before. What IS that? Can you give me details? Is that some version of the I9506?
If it is then you are most welcome to help out!
/Abs
Absolon said:
We need to start with baby steps so a skeleton for the I9506 is the first prio.
SHV-E330S I head that before. What IS that? Can you give me details? Is that some version of the I9506?
If it is then you are most welcome to help out!
/Abs
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I think it's the Korean SK Telecom version of the i9506
It has the same LTE-A support & Snapdragon 800 processor and everything
GSMarena description of the phone
Also known as Samsung Galaxy S4 with LTE+
Available as Samsung SHV-E330S Galaxy S4 LTE-A for SK Telecom.
Inventory
First,
I need to know if it's ok that I take the Project leader role here a bit? I have sat down and identified the things we need to even start and I have some pretty good idea.
But I can only be a Project leader if you let me. If I'm allowed to spread out the work. Else we can close this. I can't do this alone. It's too much work.
But I think that the work WE can do is the base that will benefit all rom-makes. Because this is the starting point that anyone that want to make a
rom has to start from.
The difference is that I want this to be here. In the open, and not at some closed webpage. I want all to benefit from what we do.
Either we do this openly or not at all.
And so you know. There will be a bit of work. I have my Unix knowledge and I run several Linux/BSD machines at home. I did a small calculation.
I have now been playing/then having it for getting bread on the table with Unix for 23 years.
I don't know everything. Far from. Even though I been working with it that long, the part I did as a consultant was within a certain part and I never learnt
other. Simply because I was hired for knowing just that part really well.
The problem with Unix (and why I use Unix is that everything is basically Unix, even though it called differently. It would be called Unix today if it didn't
happen to be a patent fight over the NAME. The one that held the patent of the name Unix wanted money for people to use it (it might have been SCO,
they tried to get money for anything they could. Really despise that company).
So instead of paying the companies invented their own names, Sun went for SunOS and then Solaris, Hp (HP-UX), IBM (AIX) etc.
So it's hard to say that Linux is not a Unix because it's not a Unix Unix (that doesn't exist anymore) but when I say Unix I mean the whole spectrum
of very very closely related OS to it, ok? So I will sometimes say Linux and can say Unix, but I mean basically the same.
The thing with Unix is that the learning curve is steep. You install it and have a black screen with a ">". It's a bit more easy now with Ubuntu (that I hate),
but it's better for you, that never worked with it to have something to "point and click". When it comes to the real work you will have to open up a
terminal anyway and TYPE command. See it a bit as a DOS-windows in your Windows.
There is two distinct flavors though. The one is BSD and the other is the Linux, bla bla. Those two are a fork that happened long ago and you tend
to feel like a newbie again, once you sit in from of a FreeBSD after being a homie on Linux because everything is different.
There is a standard basically on how to start up things. There is now a new thing that comes more and more that should be less conservative then
what has been the case the last 20 years but that is another thing. The Linux that Android is based on has a normal "init.d"-structure and that is
where the different scripts are that start up, in an order you decide, different parts of the system, or do what ever really. They are just scripts and
could write "Hello I9506!" on the screen if you would like that.
Did you all see the post I made about the i9506?
PLEASE ALL. I need to verify this so it's not some duckup from my part but I will do a odin today to be sure
Take a look at what I wrote: http://forum.xda-developers.com/showpost.php?p=48320189&postcount=1402
Anyone here that tripped Knox? Anyone got any strange things?
We need to know this before making any attempt at all.
I don't cry wolf here. This is true. No bulltitting. I KNOW I had this.
If you look my sig, you might think I know has build a Faraday's cage around me and have a folio-hat while looking through a magnifying glass at my
monitor at a Youtube-video showing taped in a tv that was recorded by a CC-camera from a TV in the 80-ies about the (pick one):
Moon landings
Kennedy
Roswell
9/11
Ilumatnii/NWO
And I wish I where. But the phone is erratic and I really think it's tampered. Did someone get a notice with rule-updates? I didn't get it to this one
but I got it to Note 3.
-------------------------------
So in case that you let me lead the project here in the start and be able to have work that I can "assign", or I rather want to list work and have volunteers for it.
Then I can say "Ok, test that then" etc. And we have a dialog that is open and never that someone feels forced over it, ok?
We need a BASE. Something to start from and we need to see what we have so this is the inventory part. What we have, where we start.
The first step
And I need someone that can do some deep probing for me of the hardware. We need to start comparing.
Can all do a *#1234# and post it?
I have:
AP: I9506XXUAMI3
CP: I9506XXUAMHD
CSC: I9506NEEAMI1
I noticed it only works on the original "Phone app".
This is what I think we need as a base to start with.
I9505
As close stock rom as possible. Now I saw that Hotfile was closed down (did a post about it) so I hope we get
Base
I9505 - Plain vanilla rom. As close we can get
I9506 - Depends here what you have. Here I would ask if someone has an unrooted and a rooted version.
Note 3 - I have an unrooted version. Anyone has a rooted? Knox tripped? I tried to root it with that Universal thing that doesn't trip know but it hangs.
This are the things we need to start with at least. Make nandroid-backups on them. When you have them I'll prepare a space for them on my g-drive
where you can upload them and then I can start to compare them.
Also, anyone with a Knox-tripped I9506. Please PM me. I got really strange behavior and I don't know if it's Knox or something else.
The ones with Note 3, did you get an "SELinux rules upgrade #16" a few days back? I didn't see that was an option to turn them off.
As I wrote in my other thread. My I9506 started to behave real strange. REALLY strange. There are a whole bunch of programs missing.
The are gone. I have 3 icons on them in launcher but they are just not there. So what gives?
Is this only me or is this something that we all get when we trip the Knox?
After I did a clean with the CleanMaster and removed the Knox apps, I can't get into settings, so I need to try a nandroid restore or in worst case
try to install a odin-version and reroot it. Or maybe play with it unrooted for a while.
This is serious things is this Knox-flag tripped something. I talked with my provider today about this.
So an inventory! What do we have for hardware to test on?
Things to investigate - Here I start list things that any of you can do. As I said. I can't do all and I have so much IRL that I shouldn't be here at all...
Hardware
We know it's closer to Note 3 then to 05. When I look at specs it seems like the same phone.
But I need a rooted Note3 to get the app that list ALL hardware, sensors etc, to compare it. An unrooted Note 3 will not get that access.
My theoryI is that a BL from Note 3 will probably work but one from 05 will not.
But that need to be verified. And I need to see that Odin can reflash if we do something that hangs the phone. This is the risk I will take.
What is on it?
Here I could start to compare. But I need backups of the phones!
If you happen to have any personal password for your wifi, I can give my word that I will overlook it.
Besides, what do I need it for? Not like I would come home to you and hack your Wifi
So here is a list of things:
There is no source released on their webpage about the i9506 yet.
We don't have any "pre-knox" BL for this one.
Can someone check the Note 3 forum if there is some pre-knox. Did a 4.2.2 even existed or was it a 4.3 from the start?
And then backups of the partitions for comparison.
That is the first steps to even start to move this.
/Paul
Absolon said:
First,
I need to know if it's ok that I take the Project leader role here a bit? I have sat down and identified the things we need to even start and I have some pretty good idea.
But I can only be a Project leader if you let me. If I'm allowed to spread out the work. Else we can close this. I can't do this alone. It's too much work.
But I think that the work WE can do is the base that will benefit all rom-makes. Because this is the starting point that anyone that want to make a
rom has to start from.
The difference is that I want this to be here. In the open, and not at some closed webpage. I want all to benefit from what we do.
Either we do this openly or not at all.
And so you know. There will be a bit of work. I have my Unix knowledge and I run several Linux/BSD machines at home. I did a small calculation.
I have now been playing/then having it for getting bread on the table with Unix for 23 years.
I don't know everything. Far from. Even though I been working with it that long, the part I did as a consultant was within a certain part and I never learnt
other. Simply because I was hired for knowing just that part really well.
The problem with Unix (and why I use Unix is that everything is basically Unix, even though it called differently. It would be called Unix today if it didn't
happen to be a patent fight over the NAME. The one that held the patent of the name Unix wanted money for people to use it (it might have been SCO,
they tried to get money for anything they could. Really despise that company).
So instead of paying the companies invented their own names, Sun went for SunOS and then Solaris, Hp (HP-UX), IBM (AIX) etc.
So it's hard to say that Linux is not a Unix because it's not a Unix Unix (that doesn't exist anymore) but when I say Unix I mean the whole spectrum
of very very closely related OS to it, ok? So I will sometimes say Linux and can say Unix, but I mean basically the same.
The thing with Unix is that the learning curve is steep. You install it and have a black screen with a ">". It's a bit more easy now with Ubuntu (that I hate),
but it's better for you, that never worked with it to have something to "point and click". When it comes to the real work you will have to open up a
terminal anyway and TYPE command. See it a bit as a DOS-windows in your Windows.
There is two distinct flavors though. The one is BSD and the other is the Linux, bla bla. Those two are a fork that happened long ago and you tend
to feel like a newbie again, once you sit in from of a FreeBSD after being a homie on Linux because everything is different.
There is a standard basically on how to start up things. There is now a new thing that comes more and more that should be less conservative then
what has been the case the last 20 years but that is another thing. The Linux that Android is based on has a normal "init.d"-structure and that is
where the different scripts are that start up, in an order you decide, different parts of the system, or do what ever really. They are just scripts and
could write "Hello I9506!" on the screen if you would like that.
Did you all see the post I made about the i9506?
PLEASE ALL. I need to verify this so it's not some duckup from my part but I will do a odin today to be sure
Take a look at what I wrote: http://forum.xda-developers.com/showpost.php?p=48320189&postcount=1402
Anyone here that tripped Knox? Anyone got any strange things?
We need to know this before making any attempt at all.
I don't cry wolf here. This is true. No bulltitting. I KNOW I had this.
If you look my sig, you might think I know has build a Faraday's cage around me and have a folio-hat while looking through a magnifying glass at my
monitor at a Youtube-video showing taped in a tv that was recorded by a CC-camera from a TV in the 80-ies about the (pick one):
Moon landings
Kennedy
Roswell
9/11
Ilumatnii/NWO
And I wish I where. But the phone is erratic and I really think it's tampered. Did someone get a notice with rule-updates? I didn't get it to this one
but I got it to Note 3.
-------------------------------
So in case that you let me lead the project here in the start and be able to have work that I can "assign", or I rather want to list work and have volunteers for it.
Then I can say "Ok, test that then" etc. And we have a dialog that is open and never that someone feels forced over it, ok?
We need a BASE. Something to start from and we need to see what we have so this is the inventory part. What we have, where we start.
The first step
And I need someone that can do some deep probing for me of the hardware. We need to start comparing.
Can all do a *#1234# and post it?
I have:
AP: I9506XXUAMI3
CP: I9506XXUAMHD
CSC: I9506NEEAMI1
I noticed it only works on the original "Phone app".
This is what I think we need as a base to start with.
I9505
As close stock rom as possible. Now I saw that Hotfile was closed down (did a post about it) so I hope we get
Base
I9505 - Plain vanilla rom. As close we can get
I9506 - Depends here what you have. Here I would ask if someone has an unrooted and a rooted version.
Note 3 - I have an unrooted version. Anyone has a rooted? Knox tripped? I tried to root it with that Universal thing that doesn't trip know but it hangs.
This are the things we need to start with at least. Make nandroid-backups on them. When you have them I'll prepare a space for them on my g-drive
where you can upload them and then I can start to compare them.
Also, anyone with a Knox-tripped I9506. Please PM me. I got really strange behavior and I don't know if it's Knox or something else.
The ones with Note 3, did you get an "SELinux rules upgrade #16" a few days back? I didn't see that was an option to turn them off.
As I wrote in my other thread. My I9506 started to behave real strange. REALLY strange. There are a whole bunch of programs missing.
The are gone. I have 3 icons on them in launcher but they are just not there. So what gives?
Is this only me or is this something that we all get when we trip the Knox?
After I did a clean with the CleanMaster and removed the Knox apps, I can't get into settings, so I need to try a nandroid restore or in worst case
try to install a odin-version and reroot it. Or maybe play with it unrooted for a while.
This is serious things is this Knox-flag tripped something. I talked with my provider today about this.
So an inventory! What do we have for hardware to test on?
Things to investigate - Here I start list things that any of you can do. As I said. I can't do all and I have so much IRL that I shouldn't be here at all...
Hardware
We know it's closer to Note 3 then to 05. When I look at specs it seems like the same phone.
But I need a rooted Note3 to get the app that list ALL hardware, sensors etc, to compare it. An unrooted Note 3 will not get that access.
My theoryI is that a BL from Note 3 will probably work but one from 05 will not.
But that need to be verified. And I need to see that Odin can reflash if we do something that hangs the phone. This is the risk I will take.
What is on it?
Here I could start to compare. But I need backups of the phones!
If you happen to have any personal password for your wifi, I can give my word that I will overlook it.
Besides, what do I need it for? Not like I would come home to you and hack your Wifi
So here is a list of things:
There is no source released on their webpage about the i9506 yet.
We don't have any "pre-knox" BL for this one.
Can someone check the Note 3 forum if there is some pre-knox. Did a 4.2.2 even existed or was it a 4.3 from the start?
And then backups of the partitions for comparison.
That is the first steps to even start to move this.
/Paul
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Main:
AP: I9506XXUAMHE
CP: I9506XXUAMHD
CSC: I9506VF6AMH4
It's GOOD!!!
Ap : E330sksuamg5
cp : E330sksuamg4
csc : E330ssktamg4