I am posting this because of what this user said and got flamed because it,
so about posting and searching on XDA...
As it turns out when I do a search for a topic the little search bar gives me EVERYTHING I dont need.. and NOTHING about what I do.. I understand that a lot of people just post new threads about the same crud but still, instead of just jumping down their throats take time to listen and tell them and, if you know, where to find the topic they are looking for .. perhaps with a link and a polite comment.
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Guy's in case you are not aware of it....here are new rules are regarding Flaming etc etc....And with the recent flaming of a member here...here is a quote from the new rules ...
http://forum.xda-developers.com/announcement.php?f=263
by Flar Administrator
2. Be polite and respect your fellow xda-dev user.
There is no need for cursing, flaming, racism or personal attacks. There are a lot of different nationalities on this forum all with different cultures, this means that no matter what you're like, you'll have to adjust to people that are most definitely not like you. It will gain you a lot of respect if you help to keep the peace. It's disrespectful and therefore not permitted to create Alias Member names in an attempt to deceive others.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Now this user post a thread and even stated he had trouble with the search not finding what he was looking for, and yet several member just had to flame him , mostly newbies that have been here a short time themselves.
And I ask the mods to help re-enforce these rules and send the message to we need to be respectful of each other....and yes I know this is in the Development forum, but since it is happening in here , many of the users need to be reminded of it..
As to the Search engine here on XDA well it does lack the ability to weed out Il-Revelate info so till it can , keep in mind that many users do attempt to search for the info but the search results do not give them what they seek, so let just help out the user and answer there question and move on...
or just do not reply period if you can not be helpful..
There's a rule before that one that says to "Search Before Posting"
the only time I am hard on newbies is if they don't search or do work themselves. And if you're referring to the thread I think you're referring to, you should know that I've actually received a PM from that individual, and we have both explained our views very plainly and I am awaiting his reply.
I'm actually working on a project to avoid these problems in the future. You'll like it. But note that this is also kind of an attack against everyone here, though you have a valid point, perhaps this would be better personally and politely sent to those whom you think are at fault in a PM?
Edit: yeah, you're right, it does often turn up irrelevant info, but if you see threads getting pulled up, click the thread and search within the thread to find relevant posts in the thread. Also, the thread title for this thread, though I see you're trying to get everyone's attention for it, is misleading and inappropriate for the topic at hand.
I respect both of you and see that you both have valid points, there is a fine line to be walked when it comes to this, I think it comes down to treating others as you would want to be treated. I am amazed at how much I learn when I am just trying to help someone else out! So that being said, I think it can do a person some good to devote some of their time on XDA everyday to helping someone out, even five min can make a difference to somebody, might even save them a $300 phone! And thats all I have to say about that! (Forest Gump)
Trav ,
first off this is not meant as a attack but it did need to be strongly word...granted you are correct that it does comes off that way...and i know that there are a great many here do go out of there way to help others..To those this thread is not directed at you.
As to the title ...well it seems that the banner displaying the new rules info is not getting the attention of small group that still continue the flaming...hence the title...
More users and mods need to get the message across to those that do the flaming and are disrespectful to others needs to stop...
Cal-El said:
(Forest Gump)
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Click to collapse
y'know my momma always said that life is like a box of chocolates, you never do know which one you're going to get.
Travito said:
y'know my momma always said that life is like a box of chocolates, you never do know which one you're going to get.
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{
"lightbox_close": "Close",
"lightbox_next": "Next",
"lightbox_previous": "Previous",
"lightbox_error": "The requested content cannot be loaded. Please try again later.",
"lightbox_start_slideshow": "Start slideshow",
"lightbox_stop_slideshow": "Stop slideshow",
"lightbox_full_screen": "Full screen",
"lightbox_thumbnails": "Thumbnails",
"lightbox_download": "Download",
"lightbox_share": "Share",
"lightbox_zoom": "Zoom",
"lightbox_new_window": "New window",
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}
[/IMG]
can you post link to this flamed thread so that others can look at it?
I see this thread has been moved...
I have a suggestion then...if the mods are going to remove threads like this that bring attention to issues that are going on in the forum then more attention needs to be paid to those users who flame and disrespect others in those forums........
Here is my suggestion on how to handle them.. when mods read a thread that has flaming going on in it...before locking it...they need to make a post addressing the flaming issue and point it out what will happen if it continues..
Maybe consider bringing on more mods to help with the work load that the current ones are dealing with, I am not knocking the current ones, .they do a great job , but this is a huge site and it is growing fast .
BTw this thread was originally in the Kaiser Rom forum where the problem originally occurred and still continues..
F2504x4 said:
I see this thread has been moved...
I have a suggestion then...if the mods are going to remove threads like this that bring attention to issues that are going on in the forum then more attention needs to be paid to those users who flame and disrespect others in those forums........
Here is my suggestion on how to handle them.. when mods read a thread that has flaming going on in it...before locking it...they need to make a post addressing the flaming issue and point it out what will happen if it continues..
Maybe consider bringing on more mods to help with the work load that the current ones are dealing with, I am not knocking the current ones, .they do a great job , but this is a huge site and it is growing fast .
BTw this thread was originally in the Kaiser Rom forum where the problem originally occurred and still continues..
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they have 60 mods and will not be bringing on more, thats what i was told by a mod, do you have a link to the thread in question?
msd24200 said:
they have 60 mods and will not be bringing on more, thats what i was told by a mod, do you have a link to the thread in question?
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Hmmm 60 mods interesting..
Link? just look in many of the forums..this is not a new problem...
but it is a very easily fixable one ...
by enforcing this
by Flar Administrator
2. Be polite and respect your fellow xda-dev user.
There is no need for cursing, flaming, racism or personal attacks. There are a lot of different nationalities on this forum all with different cultures, this means that no matter what you're like, you'll have to adjust to people that are most definitely not like you. It will gain you a lot of respect if you help to keep the peace. It's disrespectful and therefore not permitted to create Alias Member names in an attempt to deceive others.
Here is a link so that people can read the WHOLE thread, instead of the tiny bit you took out of context. http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=494625
The guy got flamed ( and I did not consider that flaming) because he posted a belligerent and antagonizing thread in the ( wrong ) rom development forum, not because he was a noob politely asking for help.
If you are going to take the members of this forum to task, do it with all the information please.
denco7 said:
Here is a link so that people can read the WHOLE thread, instead of the tiny bit you took out of context. http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=494625
The guy got flamed ( and I did not consider that flaming) because he posted a belligerent and antagonizing thread in the ( wrong ) rom development forum, not because he was a noob politely asking for help.
If you are going to take the members of this forum to task, do it with all the information please.
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Click to collapse
If you really want to get to the real reason behind this thread ...what caused him to make that post in the first place huh? do you know ? could it be that he asked a simple question and got the usual responses ? nawww
I was not going to drag that user into this thread like you have....I felt he has caught enough flak as it is...so what do you think will be gained by you dragging his name into this...?
Cause and effect...and his thread is not the only time someone got flamed for asking a simple question is it now ? EVEN AFTER they stated they had tried to use the search .
I wonder if you will answer these questions / or was your intent to attempt to turn the tables away from the real issue at hand ?
Btw that thread was closed with only one response from a mod..
As to the part i used....that is the main point of this thread incase you missed it..
F2504x4 said:
As to the Search engine here on XDA well it does lack the ability to weed out Il-Revelate info so till it can , keep in mind that many users do attempt to search for the info but the search results do not give them what they seek, so let just help out the user and answer there question and move on...
or just do not reply period if you can not be helpful..
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Click to collapse
Well, I agree with you and believe me that most mods are actually enforcing the flaming when they see it. I have seen full threads stopped in their tracks prior to becoming flame wars.
Now, the search engine thing is kinda like a vicious cycle. All the new threads and posts started with commonly asked questions will only add more to the results coming out in the search engine. So, each time someone else uses the engine, he/she will get one million plus one posts. After being annoyed due to not finding the answer they were looking for after the first few posts they go through, they feel they need to make their voices heard and hence a new thread is born.... adding more stuff that the search engine will pull up each time someone looks for that particular subject.
Is there a way around this? Maybe...
Do we know it? Sure as hell not yet, but we have to keep on fighting...
F2504x4 said:
If you really want to get to the real reason behind this thread ...what caused him to make that post in the first place huh? do you know ? could it be that he asked a simple question and got the usual responses ? nawww
I was not going to drag that user into this thread like you have....I felt he has caught enough flak as it is...so what do you think will be gained by you dragging his name into this...?
Cause and effect...and his thread is not the only time someone got flamed for asking a simple question is it now ? EVEN AFTER they stated they had tried to use the search .
I wonder if you will answer these questions / or was your intent to attempt to turn the tables away from the real issue at hand ?
Btw that thread was closed with only one response from a mod..
As to the part i used....that is the main point of this thread incase you missed it..
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Unlike you, when I see a post like this I go straight to the persons profile page to see where they are coming from.
This was his sixth over all post, out of the five previous posts, he received immediate answers to 2 of his questions, one of his questions went unanswered in a 150 page thread and his other two questions were answered by Noonski ( mod ). Noonski answered his final question with a polite, " the question has already been answered in thread."
Noonski said:
Aah that Menu.
Since it has been noted before in the thread i won't anwser the qwuestion, but i will hint.
There is a mortscript in the folder \Windows\Startup.
Removing one of those files will get rid of the menu.
**** i answered the question anyway.
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At which point he switched from the wizard to the Kaiser and without any further posts, started this ranting ( no question, mind you, just ranting ) in the Kaiser Rom Dev forum.
The thread speaks for itself. What I am saying, is if you want to take the other members of this forum to task, then do it with your own thoughts and opinions. Or at least use credible examples of abuse,
You lose all credibility when you carefully edit, out of context, examples like you did, that really had nothing to do with your point. If you want to rant, stand up and rail away ( I'm not a real big fan of some of the moderation on this site either ) against the other members, but please note that this guy ( in the wrong forum ) came totally out of left field with this rant, so can you please find better examples, perhaps from people who have in fact been polite and courteous and have gotten flamed anyway for asking a simple question.
I wonder if you will answer these questions / or was your intent to attempt to turn the tables away from the real issue at hand ?
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My track record for helping people speaks for itself, you are more than welcome to review each and every one of my 980 posts, along with the 1300 posts I have over at htcwiki.com , for any flaming. While sometimes I use humor to chide people, I am one of the good guys.
denco7 said:
Unlike you, when I see a post like this I go straight to the persons profile page to see where they are coming from.
My track record for helping people speaks for itself, you are more than welcome to review each and every one of my 980 posts, along with the 1300 posts I have over at htcwiki.com , for any flaming. While sometimes I use humor to chide people, I am one of the good guys.
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Denco7,
I do not go to a persons profile, why not ? well i look at the post just like most users do....and part of the problem is that newbies will see flaming and will think that it is okay to do it, especially after if a mod has replied to the thread and says nothing about the flaming and or disrespect that went on , so this small group will think it is okay to post insults , non revelate comments, basically they think since a mod did not say anything, they feel it is okay to do it...
As to your track record I have seen you help out newbies with out really flaming them, so i do not consider you part of the overall problem..
but I do have issue with why you felt the need to bring this user and post up his info...when it was not necessary, I am still wondering why you did it..when this issue surrounds flamming those that state they used the search engine but with no luck...
F2504x4 said:
but I do have issue with why you felt the need to bring this user and post up his info...when it was not necessary, I am still wondering why you did it..when this issue surrounds flamming those that state they used the search engine but with no luck...
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Because many people read that thread and I thought your overall good message was getting over shadowed by your choice of examples. Unfortunately the person you used as the rallying point of your message was belligerent and antagonistic, which is why he was written off by the other members and eventually the mods. He was never wronged and his rant was baseless and unconstructive, I didn't want to see your message written off by a the poor example you chose as a rallying point.
He did not use the search engine because he had no question, only a rant in an inappropriate forum.
People are to lazy to search
While behaviour breeds behaviour. So starting a flame war is not great. IMO. I will just normally reply with something helpful especially when the search can be somewhat daunting on any site.
I think! here is a good example of someone clearly fabricating the truth about "I tried searching" when they clearly haven't.
Here is a quoted message from another forum...
Quote:
Originally Posted by infection0
I lay in bed so I turn the phone on its side a lot. Unfortunately this results in the phone rotating Opera so I can't see it. I tried searching but I can't find it... how do I disable Opera Auto rotate by registry?
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This is my reply.
Searching in google with the phrase "disable Opera Auto" yields many results.
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I even included the cab file and a link to a post.
Well, thats just me.
It's nice to be important, but it's more important to be nice.
denco7 said:
Here is a link so that people can read the WHOLE thread, instead of the tiny bit you took out of context. http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=494625
The guy got flamed ( and I did not consider that flaming) because he posted a belligerent and antagonizing thread in the ( wrong ) rom development forum, not because he was a noob politely asking for help.
If you are going to take the members of this forum to task, do it with all the information please.
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Click to collapse
thanks denco, i had already read that thread, but didn't know that was the thread in question, but i did have a feeling it might have been.
EDIT: WHAT DOES THIS THREAD HAVE TO DO WITH RULES OF SEX?
every one that can read will have a different opinion on what is considered flaming i guess. how about we just sticky to the first page of all forums a new thread entitled:
"i need help, ask your questions here if you don't know where to properly ask them"
then newbs & old but rarely on here members can go and ask there questions, and those of us that are extremely active can go into that thread if we choose to, to help out those people?
xda could even fix it to where if you post a new thread it would have to be viewed by a mod or admin and get approval before it showed up on a forum?
msd24200 said:
. how about we just sticky to the first page of all forums a new thread entitled:
"i need help, ask your questions here if you don't know where to properly ask them"
then newbs & old but rarely on here members can go and ask there questions, and those of us that are extremely active can go into that thread if we choose to, to help out those people?
xda could even fix it to where if you post a new thread it would have to be viewed by a mod or admin and get approval before it showed up on a forum?
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Good idea, and instead of having mods approve the question , just set the thread to automatically purge the posts after 48 hrs..
Is it just me, or does it seem that there are more an more people posting things in the wrong section? For instance this thread was posted in the ROM Development section. Shouldn't it be in the Software section? It doesn't make sense to me. If people would take the time to read the wiki, the posting rules, and the Section Titles, then we wouldn't have such a chaotic mess on this forum. Is it possible to implement rules for new users requiring that the spend so many days just reading before they are able to make their first post?
I think its because some people see xda as a place to get quick answers, great roms, and nice apps.....but not interested in what this site is all about, as far as working with everyone, being disciplined enough to search first, ask for help second, and be respectful. Its just a sign of the times.....people want more but dont want to take simple steps to work within the guidelines.....just my 3 cents...
The Moderators move the thread that I mentioned in my original post to the appropriate section.
Does anyone else want to weigh in on this? If so, I will try to post a poll.
Yeh, you're right but it's not like you can tell them what to do and a poll isn't really necessary don't you think?
so what should we title this thread? the *****ing thread? it happens...it's the internet after all, as one of the prior posters had mentioned, people just act rude on the net because they can.... i just try and ignore them...
Got some cleanup requests already, so I figured this might help.
The thing with dev thread "spam" is that it is really in the eye of the beholder. :cyclops:
Ultimately it is up to us mods of course but getting some guidance by the devs would be helpful. We can do a thread cleaning on request of the OP, but what I view as "spam" is not necessarily the same as wardfan220's definition of spam. Or the OP's definition of spam.
Everybody knows it when they see it, but what I see is not what you see.
Please do not respond to those posts or troll or flame the poster. Instead, click on the little triangle button in the upper corner of the post and report it so that wardfan220 and I might deal with it appropriately. We aren't trying to stop people from posting, we are trying to teach them to post appropriately.
Some general types of posts that get reported are:
"Thanks for a great ROM" posts
"ETA" posts
"Bug reports" without proper troubleshooting or logging
"Didn't read the OP" posts
Off Topic for various reasons
Please consider this from two angles. What is unacceptable from a new user with 10 posts is often tolerated or even acceptable when done by a senior member or a dev team member for each example above. This can often lead to a perception of unfairness, from both sides.
We will get PM's by new users asking, "why did you delete my "thanks" post in the dev thread and not delete member xxxxxxx's "thanks" post? Is it because member xxxxxxx has 150 posts and I have 10?"
We will get PM's from current users asking "why did you delete my Only-Slightly-Off-Topic post in the dev thread? I have been a good member and it was just a little off topic and the dev doesn't mind".
If the devs could write up some general rules or guidelines as to what they find acceptable or not in their first or second post, when they ask for a thread cleaning or when members report posts as "dev thread spam", it would be very helpful to us making a more informed decision on what is spam and what is not, and have a better chance of getting the dev/OPs desired results, whether in avoiding posts or after the party cleanup.
Discussions and thoughts are welcome.
Thank you,
mf2112
^^ I agree that there is a very fine line between what's acceptable and what's not.
Earlier, I planned on making an "Etiquette thread" just for general guidance, but seeing some replies from fellow members on other thread, gave up on it.
One thing I believe in is that asking for ETA is definitely spam, irrespective of what beautiful wrapper it's wrapped in, because it basically undermines whatever the developer has done so far, in her/her personal time. So, if reported, these posts should be warned.
Other thing I believe is people should be more lenient towards "New users". Instead of scaring them away, or instead of spoonfeeding them with answers, they should be directed to correct thread, where they can read/understand what's going on, and maybe be directed towards development/modding/porting/etc. That's the only way 9003 would be out of "low activity device"
Will add more(got some more as I did a lot of thinking on this) later on, as I need to get a haircut now.
Thanks for this discussion.
Well i admit i am pretty aggressive to noobs which is wrong and against the rules in the first place, but some of them just get on my nerves.
They sometimes just call me or a dev fags / (place world's insults here) for helping them with their question and then sticking a "It's not the right place to ask such questions' note or because a dev is taking his time and not updating something every second.
Others also ignore all other posts / instructions, ask the same question and keep spamming and not accepting to follow the installation instructions again, they don't even post a logcat/whatever to support their claims.
I mostly resort to being a little aggressive and reporting the post if they don't cooperate.. Now i am not a mod, but i don't like being treated like that or seeing some respected member getting insulted because of a fat lazy noob not doing anything and insulting everyone.
Conclusion:
I agree with everything you said here and i do think mods should work with devs and members directly and should take some serious actions against offenders from now on.
I really feel bad for you with having to deal with such issues daily
Goodluck!
Has there been any luck with this idea?
Have devs even attempted it or just ignored this post?
Sent from my GT-I9100 using xda premium
Not much response, but that's ok.
That's a shame really because it's a really good idea.
Sent from my GT-I9100 using xda premium
Coming from an AT&T Galaxy S4 to a Nexus 5, does anyone have any rom/kernel suggestions for me before I get it? Which do you use?
nklenchik said:
Coming from an AT&T Galaxy S4 to a Nexus 5, does anyone have any rom/kernel suggestions for me before I get it? Which do you use?
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Nope. Use what you test that you like. We won't recommend what you like because we don't know you. What's best for you is not best for me. Thats why "best" or "recommend me" threads are against the rules.
Which phone are coming from?
Sent from my Nexus 5 using Tapatalk
nemofbaby2010 said:
Which phone are coming from?
Sent from my Nexus 5 using Tapatalk
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The first 6 "words" of post 1 address this.
rootSU said:
The first 6 "words" of post 1 address this.
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Derp my bad I came from a s4 as well first thing I noticed was the screen so the kernel I use is Franco with stock because of the different color profiles which allows you to make your screen look close to a s4's amoled display
Sent from my Nexus 5 using Tapatalk
---------- Post added at 04:25 PM ---------- Previous post was at 04:23 PM ----------
And stock nexus 5 is already good, but before rooting read up and try to avoid toolkits
Sent from my Nexus 5 using Tapatalk
Unlock bootloader. Install custom recovery. Root. Install Xposed + GravityBox. Done.
marleyfan61 said:
Unlock bootloader. Install custom recovery. Root. Install Xposed + GravityBox. Done.
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Yeah I was thinking about just doing that but I've had really good luck on CarbonROM on my S4
nklenchik said:
.... any suggestions for me before I get it?
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I would read this ....
Hello, and welcome to the forum,
Before you click the "New Thread" or "Post Reply" buttons, please take the time to read some rules/guidelines for posting in this forum:
1) Read and follow the Forum Rules:
Plain and simple. No further explanation needed
2) Post your message in the proper subforum (see above):
All questions, requests, and help & troubleshooting needs, go in the Q&A Help & Troubleshooting subforum, if one exists for your device, and any misplaced messages will be promptly moved to their respective location. Users that make it a habit of posting in the wrong forum will be addressed accordingly. If you're unsure of where your post or thread belongs, please read the Forum Rules again.
3) No off-topic discussion:
While some Moderation Teams may allow some off-topic discussion and the creation of off-topic threads, we do not. There is an entire General Off-Topic forum devoted to this type of discussion and there are enough threads already available to meet anyone's off-topic needs. All off-topic threads, and posts containing off-topic discussion, will be deleted promptly and without warning. If you're concerned with the amount of off-topic discussion and misplaced questions in the Development forums, please consider making a Q&A Thread for your ROM/Kernel/Project/etc.
4) No threads or posts asking for the best/most stable ROM/Kernel/Mod/whatever, or created for the purpose of comparing Phones/ROMs/Kernels/Mods/whatever:
These threads/posts will be deleted promptly and without warning. They have a history of causing problems due to trolls, and fanboys, along with various troublemakers, and therefore are no longer allowed. Regardless of that, there is really no way to judge whether or not a particular piece of work is better than another because it's all relative to begin with. If you want to know what piece of work is better for you, install something and try it out for a while. If you don't like it, try something else. Our Developers work hard to provide us their contributions, free of charge. Please show them the respect they deserve by trying something out and giving them your feedback.
5) Don't ask for an ETA (Estimated Time of Arrival):
Asking for an ETA is the XDA equivalent of telling a Developer that the free work they do just isn't enough for you. It usually comes across as rude and/or demanding, and most developers will take offense to it. Even if a particular Developer doesn't mind being asked for an ETA, there are many that do, and there's a good possibility that it will incite arguments in the forum. In the end, it's just best to avoid doing it altogether. If you have no other choice but to ask for an ETA (i.e. the work you're doing absolutely depends on it), then please, do it through a private message and keep it out of the public forums.
6) Keep your signatures at a respectable size:
While members are given a great deal of freedom in creating personalized signatures, it is expected that this freedom is not abused. Abnormally large signatures are obnoxious to most users and they tend to be a major distraction from the topic at hand. If your signature is double the size of an average post or larger, expect be asked to change it. If you're not sure whether the size of your signature is within the respectable limits, feel free to contact a member of the Moderation Team that is assigned to this forum for clarification.
7) Be nice:
It's not that hard. If you can't say something nice to someone, don't say anything at all. If you feel the need to respond negatively to someone, please refer to #8.
8) Report all violations of the aforementioned rules/guidelines and DO NOT respond to them in the open forum:
If you happen to notice a rule violation, use the "Report Post" button in the upper right hand corner of the offending post, or send them a polite reminder through private message so they may resolve the problem on their own (for minor violations of course). Please do not respond to posts that are in violation of the rules in public. Regardless of the fact that it leaves more work for us to do when cleaning the forum, responding to them in public only compounds the issue and it puts you at risk of getting in trouble yourself. Moderators have much more effective ways of dealing with these situations than by arguing back and forth and disrupting the entire conversation, so please, let us handle it.
If there are any questions or concerns regarding this or any other matter, please feel free to contact a member of the Moderation Team that is assigned to this forum. You can find a list of the assigned Moderators at the top of each sub-forum page.
With that, here are a few great threads to help you get the most out of your experience here...please take advantage of them:
Get the most out of XDA!!
How to make a good THREAD, POST, QUESTION or POLL
Why you get short/one word answers! (The Long Answer)
How to give constructive feedback to developers
How To Logcat
GPLv2 tips for developers
Getting a moderator's help
And as always...
Thank you, and have a great day!
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thread closed
I just joined to this forum, and have found few insightful information
But sometimes, I found that few members are so arrogant just because they understand how to mod, root, etc
Do we need to become an android-expert first here, so other members can respect us as well?
Usually because the poster has not bothered to even read the basics and require spoon.feeding .
One could ask why you post three identical posts .
aliarroughi said:
I just joined to this forum, and have found few insightful information
But sometimes, I found that few members are so arrogant just because they understand how to mod, root, etc
Do we need to become an android-expert first here, so other members can respect us as well?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
XDA is a great place for learning and sharing informations As most members are probably humans it may happen that they act like that...
It was great if every new member would read the FORUM RULES before posting. That would avoid some of the trouble you mentioned.
A great example:
"1. Search before posting."
(I suppose 50% of my answers are generated by typing the exact same thing someone asks for into google and press search...)
This thread has been posted in a few places. Please don't make duplicate threads.
Thread closed.
Thanks,
Darth
Forum Moderator