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It seems mister Steve Jobs is very scared of Android, as I'm sure your all aware.
http://m.engadget.com/default/artic...es-patents-appea/&category=classic&postPage=1
Apple continues to target the major Android handset manufacturers. Unfortunately it seems HTC lost its battle with Steve for now, with Samsung also under fire.
Does Apple really think they can slow down Android enough to keep its precious iPhone on top? Not likely. I don't think showing fear is good for the company.
Apple continues to rely on its brand name's reputation, instead of doing something truely innovative (the iPhone was innovative... WAS. The iPad was innovative as well, but lets just say the Xoom beats the crap out of it). Now the iPhone is small screened and slow (network and CPU wise) compaired to any high-end Android device.
Apple is only buying time. Sooner or later, the iPhone fad will come to an end, much like Facebooks current plight.
Feel free to give your input.
*NOTICE* These are my personal opinion. If you like the iPhone or Apple for that matter, then more power to you. Apple makes good products, expensive as they are. Flaming is not necessary.
Sent from my HTC Cyanogenbolt
"All Things D is reporting that the two patents in question are 5,946,647 and 6,343,263, the former of which is said to be "fundamental to Android."
Any ideas?
orkillakilla said:
but lets just say the Xoom beats the crap out of it
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Isn't the Xoom some half-finished product, both software and hardware-wise?
Other than that, I fully agree with your post - Apple is afraid. Very afraid. They're not the only ones though, Microsoft is as well. That's why they're both resorting to patent litigation. While at the same time Apple is totally copying Android's notification dropdown. Hypocrisy at it's best.
The ones who are really afraid? The ones who keep talkin' smack about Apple and MS. Otherwise they would sit back and watch it.
MartyLK said:
The ones who are really afraid? The ones who keep talkin' smack about Apple and MS. Otherwise they would sit back and watch it.
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Yes, we're talking out of fear, it's totally not about calling companies out on their crap. Sure. LOL
Totally agree bother! Didn't Microsoft get in trouble for forcing there software into pcs? Someone got paid off for win this last one with HTC. I think its totally against our rights to hold back technology for the gain of one. Plus the iphone is old school. Its time to move on to better pastures Mr jobs! Remember how technology was for apple before the iphone came out or the ipod? Apple sucked the big one! I think there running scared cause android is its competition! to bad,we the people have a right to choose!
droid charge
orkillakilla said:
It seems mister Steve Jobs is very scared of Android, as I'm sure your all aware.
http://m.engadget.com/default/artic...es-patents-appea/&category=classic&postPage=1
Apple continues to target the major Android handset manufacturers. Unfortunately it seems HTC lost its battle with Steve for now, with Samsung also under fire.
Does Apple really think they can slow down Android enough to keep its precious iPhone on top? Not likely. I don't think showing fear is good for the company.
Apple continues to rely on its brand name's reputation, instead of doing something truely innovative (the iPhone was innovative... WAS. The iPad was innovative as well, but lets just say the Xoom beats the crap out of it). Now the iPhone is small screened and slow (network and CPU wise) compaired to any high-end Android device.
Apple is only buying time. Sooner or later, the iPhone fad will come to an end, much like Facebooks current plight.
Feel free to give your input.
*NOTICE* These are my personal opinion. If you like the iPhone or Apple for that matter, then more power to you. Apple makes good products, expensive as they are. Flaming is not necessary.
Sent from my HTC Cyanogenbolt
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
hmm another android vs apple thread...hmm.. lost count on the numbers now
jags_the1 said:
hmm another android vs apple thread...hmm.. lost count on the numbers now
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Click to collapse
Hmm... another pointless post. Lost count on the number now...
If you don't want to add to the discussion, or don't like the fact that there are many of these threads, simply don't read it.
Has far as the Xoom goes, I've only read good things about it, and that it's at least on the same level as the iPad. I haven't played around on one though, so I can't say for sure.
It seems Microsoft and Apple, being the "old dogs" in the computer/tech/smartphone world, have their tails between their legs, acting like a chihuahua showing it's teeth at a pit bull...
orkillakilla said:
something about dogs
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I don't think its Apple with the problems.. check out some snippets from the link below:
http://fosspatents.blogspot.com/2011/07/itc-judge-finds-htc-in-infringement-of.html
ITC judge finds HTC in infringement of two Apple patents
Google's Android mobile operating system is in serious trouble:
Patents appear to be at the core of Android and are likely infringed by all Android devices
I have looked at those patents before and they appear to be very fundamental. They are very likely to be infringed by code that is at the core of Android.
This could in a worst-case scenario result in an import ban against many or even all Android-based HTC products in the U.S. market.
In a slightly less negative scenario, HTC might have to remove certain functionality from its products, and that could result in a significant or even substantial degradation of the quality of those devices.
Since those patents don't appear to relate to HTC's own extensions of Android but to Android itself, they may affect all of the other makers of Android-based devices. Apple could soon be in a strong position to obtain import bans against dozens of device makers.
Apple unlikely to grant a license -- but might make damages claims
Android is also under fire in dozens of federal lawsuits. By my count, there are 49 Android-related infringement suits (federal and ITC). A very prominent one is Oracle's lawsuit against Google, and the judge presiding over that case has raised very serious questions about the possibility of Google's intentional infringement of Java-related intellectual property.
Tone_ said:
I don't think its Apple with the problems.. check out some snippets from the link below:
http://fosspatents.blogspot.com/2011/07/itc-judge-finds-htc-in-infringement-of.html
ITC judge finds HTC in infringement of two Apple patents
Google's Android mobile operating system is in serious trouble:
Patents appear to be at the core of Android and are likely infringed by all Android devices
I have looked at those patents before and they appear to be very fundamental. They are very likely to be infringed by code that is at the core of Android.
This could in a worst-case scenario result in an import ban against many or even all Android-based HTC products in the U.S. market.
In a slightly less negative scenario, HTC might have to remove certain functionality from its products, and that could result in a significant or even substantial degradation of the quality of those devices.
Since those patents don't appear to relate to HTC's own extensions of Android but to Android itself, they may affect all of the other makers of Android-based devices. Apple could soon be in a strong position to obtain import bans against dozens of device makers.
Apple unlikely to grant a license -- but might make damages claims
Android is also under fire in dozens of federal lawsuits. By my count, there are 49 Android-related infringement suits (federal and ITC). A very prominent one is Oracle's lawsuit against Google, and the judge presiding over that case has raised very serious questions about the possibility of Google's intentional infringement of Java-related intellectual property.
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As far as HTC goes, they are likely to settle with Apple, paying them god knows how much money, if Apple even accepts an offer like that.
I have read some about the Oracle case, but I haven't really read all about it yet. I'll definitely give that a look.
Also, I would like to thank you for making a productive post that isn't negative, and that actually adds to this discussion.
Well it's not really a surprise here. Every software dev does this kind of thing. They ask patents on certain elements that they know would slow down or make another product less appealing.
Otherwise spending thousands of dollars on patents would be kinda pointless.
And like MS did and does it sues those that so called took there patent without asking or paying. I don't see anything new here. Sure it's again the big companies Apple vs Android but heck those are the 2 biggest players for home usage.
The point of all these lawsuits is:
Try and get money from competition even banning devices
Showcase all features you have but others can't get
Advertise
And for the other company sympathy. Besides ads even if they are bad are always good for sales
And a good lawyer stretches it till it either expires or till they invent something better.
orkillakilla said:
As far as HTC goes, they are likely to settle with Apple, paying them god knows how much money, if Apple even accepts an offer like that.
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HTC bought S3 recently and Apple has been found infringing on S3 patents. This stupid game works both ways. So there may not be a one-way settlement, but instead a cross-licensing deal.
@Tone_: Apple resorting to patent litigation is because it is them with a problem. Android's growth is much faster than iOS's. And Apple doesn't like that.
Also, it begins, the backlash because of this software patent stupidity: http://www.guardian.co.uk/technology/appsblog/2011/jul/15/app-developers-withdraw-us-patents <- It's app developers for now, but I'm really, really waiting for the day when hardware makers simply pull out of the US market. Let the US companies sue each other into oblivion, while the saner parts of the world flourish in actually moving things forward.
orkillakilla said:
As far as HTC goes, they are likely to settle with Apple, paying them god knows how much money, if Apple even accepts an offer like that.
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HTC bought out the rest of S3 and apple infringed them so who knows, would most likely be other Android manufactures that cop it..
http://www.thinq.co.uk/2011/7/4/apple-found-guilty-s3-patent-infringement/
Gusar321 said:
@Tone_: Apple resorting to patent litigation is because it is them with a problem. Android's growth is much faster than iOS's. And Apple doesn't like that.
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They say there is no smoke without fire also a lot of people buying Android probably could not afford or do not want iphones so Apple probably aren't that worried as its a sale they would not have made.
Tone_ said:
They say there is no smoke without fire also a lot of people buying Android probably could not afford or do not want iphones so Apple probably aren't that worried as its a sale they would not have made.
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That's not necessarly true. Before Android, if you wanted a smart phone, you either got a WMP, crapberry, or an iPhone. Most people probably wouldn't want a windows phone. Blackberries were good, but moslty for business people. That leaves iPhone. If Android weren't in the picture, you can bet a lot of people would be getting iPhones.
Sent from my HTC Cyanogenbolt
orkillakilla said:
That's not necessarly true. Before Android, if you wanted a smart phone, you either got a WMP, crapberry, or an iPhone. Most people probably wouldn't want a windows phone. Blackberries were good, but moslty for business people. That leaves iPhone. If Android weren't in the picture, you can bet a lot of people would be getting iPhones.
Sent from my HTC Cyanogenbolt
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True but I would say wanting rather than getting at the time they were expensive, still are in comparison. All Android sales are not sales lost to Apple as I alluded to earlier.
Apple are probably more bothered about all the taglines the iworshipers love to hear that they can no longer use..
Isn't another selling point of Android the screen size of some devices? I mean alot of people can't type or anything on the iPhones tiny screen
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Jmatch said:
Isn't another selling point of Android the screen size of some devices? I mean alot of people can't type or anything on the iPhones tiny screen
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I remember going to the Apple store when the iPhone came out to try it. I couldn't type with my sausage thumbs. So I was banned to sliders and flippers until the newer 4.3 Android phones. And now Apple winning against HTC... WTF. Go to hell Apple. I'd rather reactivate my VX8300 than buy a iTurd.
I remember when the iPhone first came out. The only smartphones we had were low-quality, low-tech devices with resistive, un-finger friendly LCDs. The best we had was Treos or other stuff. There were no smartphones with all the tech the iPhone employed at that time. When the iPhone came out, it included all that futuristic tech we all dreamed of but could never get. It was like going from vinyl records to CDs. For you young-uns, that was a huge and exciting step.
The iPhone opened up a whole new world. Here in the US, companies were either too scared or too lazy to make an effort to incorporate solid reliability and high-tech into a smartphone. Then comes Apple. They not only made a world record phone, but made it genuinely reliable and usable. Sure...other companies had smartphones. But they didn't have the simplicity and cleanness and reliability or contain all of the high-end hardware the iPhone contained. Apple did for us consumers what the rest of the industry at that time did not want to do: make a fully developed and reliable smartphone that they (Apple engineers) wanted to use. Apple made a phone that they, themselves, wanted. You don't get that anywhere else in industry. Companies only make what their bean counter, lawyers, committees or shareholders want them to make. The other companies are only interested in putting out just barely good-enough products that will sell. Apple basically said to hell with the committees, lawyers, bean counters and made what they wanted to make. *THAT* is why the iPhone became a world-wide phenomenon. When a company makes something you truly want and wish a company would make, it will sell wildly and take over the world.
That is Apple. The company that did us all good and right and now, because other companies are copying Apple's success, and spreading lies and mis-information about Apple, people hate Apple. Apple gave us all what no other company had the stones to give us. And people are hating them for it. People look at all the smartphones we have now and say Apple's stuff is ****. But they never stop...or are too young to realize...that before the iPhone, the only thing we had was nothing like or as good as an iPhone.
MartyLK said:
I remember when the iPhone first came out. The only smartphones we had were low-quality, low-tech devices with resistive, un-finger friendly LCDs. The best we had was Treos or other stuff. There were no smartphones with all the tech the iPhone employed at that time. When the iPhone came out, it included all that futuristic tech we all dreamed of but could never get. It was like going from vinyl records to CDs. For you young-uns, that was a huge and exciting step.
The iPhone opened up a whole new world. Here in the US, companies were either too scared or too lazy to make an effort to incorporate solid reliability and high-tech into a smartphone. Then comes Apple. They not only made a world record phone, but made it genuinely reliable and usable. Sure...other companies had smartphones. But they didn't have the simplicity and cleanness and reliability or contain all of the high-end hardware the iPhone contained. Apple did for us consumers what the rest of the industry at that time did not want to do: make a fully developed and reliable smartphone that they (Apple engineers) wanted to use. Apple made a phone that they, themselves, wanted. You don't get that anywhere else in industry. Companies only make what their bean counter, lawyers, committees or shareholders want them to make. The other companies are only interested in putting out just barely good-enough products that will sell. Apple basically said to hell with the committees, lawyers, bean counters and made what they wanted to make. *THAT* is why the iPhone became a world-wide phenomenon. When a company makes something you truly want and wish a company would make, it will sell wildly and take over the world.
That is Apple. The company that did us all good and right and now, because other companies are copying Apple's success, and spreading lies and mis-information about Apple, people hate Apple. Apple gave us all what no other company had the stones to give us. And people are hating them for it. People look at all the smartphones we have now and say Apple's stuff is ****. But they never stop...or are too young to realize...that before the iPhone, the only thing we had was nothing like or as good as an iPhone.
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Click to collapse
Yes, Apple opened the doors to the modern smartphone, but if it wasn't them, someone else would have.
As for Apple as a company, the ONLY thing they did right was the iPhone/pod/pad. Their computers were crappy as hell (WERE). They have done better with computers recently, though not for the price in my opinion. I don't necessarily hate apple, I just think most if their products are way too expensive for my taste (mainly their computers).
Sent from my HTC Cyanogenbolt
I saw this in another forum and thought I would also share it here in the Sensation Forum.
Well I'm not a Apple or MS fan, but Apple is throwing all it's punches towards Android it seems. Just shows how much of a impact Android has had on them and will have in the future.
Anyway read this article about the ITC and HTC violating Apples Patents. I hope HTC comes back a wipes the **** out of Apple in the end.
http://allthingsd.com/20110715/itc-rules-htc-violated-two-apple-patents/?refcat=news
And here http://news.cnet.com/8301-1035_3-20079905-94/itc-says-htc-violating-two-of-apples-patents/
Apple is just full of crap.
This will blow over, it wont have a huge impact, they wont be able to sue much for damages even if HTC did loose. Android is open source, they will either find a loop hole or just work around it for future releases. No worries here.
That's crap.. The patents are 15 years old. Looks like Android is starting to be a threat to them.
Sent via HTC Sensation
They are very paranoid of all the Android success...hope HTC wins the appeal!
Google need to take action to protect its eco system.
Send from: gplus.to/everyday
I like to see Apple suing more OEMs so they will gang up on Apple and sue back togather in revenge, and if at the end of the day HTC loses and got banned from selling Android devices in the US market, American consumers will probably be stuck with smuggled products.
Patent enforcement is a big and lucrative business. All the major players have a portfolio of patents they use defensively to protect themselves from being sued. This quote sums up HTC's particular position:
HTC is considered the most vulnerable legally of the Android partners because it lacks a robust portfolio of patents that act as a potential shield. Earlier this month, HTC purchased S3 Graphics, largely because of a collection of patents that the ITC administrative law judge recently determined were used illegally by Apple.
http://news.cnet.com/8301-1035_3-20079905-94/itc-says-htc-violating-two-of-apples-patents/
dhumil said:
That's crap.. The patents are 15 years old. Looks like Android is starting to be a threat to them.
Sent via HTC Sensation
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They're that old??
Hmm.....IIRC,international patents last 17 years.
Two years of appeals....
I suspect that in the end,Apple will get theirs.
The sad part is that I don't dislike Apple,they just don't impress me.
It was only judge who ruled in Apple's favor. It's still going to be reviewed by the whole panel of judges. This isn't even close to a "victory" for Apple. Yet.
BarryH_GEG said:
Patent enforcement is a big and lucrative business. All the major players have a portfolio of patents they use defensively to protect themselves from being sued. This quote sums up HTC's particular position:
HTC is considered the most vulnerable legally of the Android partners because it lacks a robust portfolio of patents that act as a potential shield. Earlier this month, HTC purchased S3 Graphics, largely because of a collection of patents that the ITC administrative law judge recently determined were used illegally by Apple.
http://news.cnet.com/8301-1035_3-20079905-94/itc-says-htc-violating-two-of-apples-patents/
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Thanks for the link, I added it to the first post as well. It looks like HTC might be buying the patents as defense.
Like others said it is a long way from over.
everyday48 said:
Google need to take action to protect its eco system.
Send from: gplus.to/everyday
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It really sucks they lost out on the Nortel patents. It would have helped a lot. But honestly, this patent trolling has to stop. It's getting ridiculous now.
The only reason why android is getting all these random lawsuits is because its a threat.. Apple never cared before Google bought android. YES android existed before the G1 from Google, Google bought android out and took it to new levels, which we all thank lol.. The big players do this all the time, Apple Vs Microsoft, Apple Vs. Samsung, Apple Vs. Android... Well microsoft owns part of Apple's stocks, and vise-versa, its a way to move money around without being blunt obvious..
aNYthing24 said:
this patent trolling has to stop.
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+1
Even if HTC loses, it won't really change anything except their profit margin. They'll end up paying Apple something per handset for use of their intellectual property but won't have to redesign the handsets. But now that they own patents that Apple's theoretically infringing on the whole thing could be a draw anyway.
Apple has resorted to patent trolling hopefully...the appeals court will overturn the ruling
Bloody Apple...why don`t they just create great products instead of suing competitors. Stupid American thinking - if you can`t beat your competitor, sue him.
But no to worry - Google reported that every day there are 550 000 Android devices activated.
I cannot believe that Apple is actually trying to claim that they invented SCROLLING and TOUCH SCREENS. And all this as they're blatantly copying Android's notifications for iOS 5. I hope Google sues the living **** out of them.
This company is the very definition of scum.
I don't like Apple at all
Sent from my HTC Sensation 4G using XDA App
When your own pool of innovation has run dry, sue the other guy for having a bigger pool
Steve Jobs fostered this sort of thinking by Apple back in the garage days, and although they have found ways over the years to manipulate their groupthink disciples and the non-techie commonman into believing that they have changed, it's never really been any different. Small wonder, since Microsoft and Apple basically created each other, and forged their own business personas together... an endless game of backstabbing between two foul companies, whilst at the same time they attempt to destroy anyone else in the middle.
Companies like Microsoft and Apple make me wish that anti-trust investigations were more centered around *groups* of corporations, rather than simply individual ones. A lot more of the real dirt going on in the tech markets would maybe get scrubbed off of the floor, so to speak
Check the link below what do you think funny or what me=FUNNY
http://www.dailytech.com/Apple+Cries+About+Samsung+and+Motorolas+Patent+Monopoly/article22586.htm
LG O1 Running Cm7 Mik_OS 2.35
Apple is the one who is abusing the patent laws
BlackRose 22 said:
Check the link below what do you think funny or what me=FUNNY
http://www.dailytech.com/Apple+Cries+About+Samsung+and+Motorolas+Patent+Monopoly/article22586.htm
LG O1 Running Cm7 Mik_OS 2.35
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Click to collapse
I do know they all are abusing my patient system...
Nice find. The I love that article. The main reason I will never buy apple. Their products are decent, not my taste but decent. Even if they came out with a great phone I would be hard pressed to put my money on a company like this.
Sent from my GT-I9000 using XDA App
Someone needs to put a patent on customers, that way they can sue when someone else steals them
Oh look, another biased tech site. Apple isn't abusing the patent system, they're utilizing it for its intendd purpose. There is a big difference. The fact that google steals everything is, and should be their downfall. People treat it as though they're innovating and yet everything they build and everything they utilize is stolen, to top it off the whole point of their platform is to steal your information.
z33dev33l said:
Oh look, another biased tech site. Apple isn't abusing the patent system, they're utilizing it for its intendd purpose. There is a big difference. The fact that google steals everything is, and should be their downfall. People treat it as though they're innovating and yet everything they build and everything they utilize is stolen, to top it off the whole point of their platform is to steal your information.
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Your right apple would never steal ideas.
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z33dev33l said:
Oh look, another biased tech site. Apple isn't abusing the patent system, they're utilizing it for its intendd purpose. There is a big difference. The fact that google steals everything is, and should be their downfall. People treat it as though they're innovating and yet everything they build and everything they utilize is stolen, to top it off the whole point of their platform is to steal your information.
Click to expand...
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The attention whore is back! You want to talk about stealing?? Youtube search Steve Jobs on stealing. He says word for word, "Good artists copy, but great artists steal." Youre just a biased android hater. Jobs said himself that stealing is a good tactic so obviously Apple has done a lot of that.
Sent from my HTC Desire Z
This is the same Apple that has initiated a patent war with its smartphone rivals. And it's the same rival that has tried to remove competing products from the market, rather than agree to negotiate a licensing fee. And it's the same company that patented multi-touch gestures 26 years after they were invented at a research university. And it's the same company that allegedly doctored evidence in European courts to support its lawsuits against Android. And yet this company claims android-based smartphone manufacturers are abusing the patent system.
Yes, it does seem like Android has been abusing Apple's patience
slapshot30 said:
The attention whore is back! You want to talk about stealing?? Youtube search Steve Jobs on stealing. He says word for word, "Good artists copy, but great artists steal." Youre just a biased android hater. Jobs said himself that stealing is a good tactic so obviously Apple has done a lot of that.
Sent from my HTC Desire Z
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
and again you put forth senseless insults, shocker. I'm not, nor could I ever say that apple doesn't steal, however, they also innovate. Google has failed to do this and makes it their business to steal from different hardware/software providers, and even their consumers. Google is a company founded on stealing and you all act as though you're offended by someone mentioning it.
z33dev33l said:
and again you put forth senseless insults, shocker. I'm not, nor could I ever say that apple doesn't steal, however, they also innovate. Google has failed to do this and makes it their business to steal from different hardware/software providers, and even their consumers. Google is a company founded on stealing and you all act as though you're offended by someone mentioning it.
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Click to collapse
First of all Google only provides the software HTC, Samsung and other companies provide the hardware. Secondly Google android looks nothing at all like iPhone ui. IPhone is plain where as Google has customization with Widgets notifications and an open source market. Google android is so good that apple decided to implement it into there phones through ios 5, so I wouldn't be talking if I were you.
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ameedi600 said:
First of all Google only provides the software HTC, Samsung and other companies provide the hardware. Secondly Google android looks nothing at all like iPhone ui. IPhone is plain where as Google has customization with Widgets notifications and an open source market. Google android is so good that apple decided to implement it into there phones through ios 5, so I wouldn't be talking if I were you.
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I'm fully aware that googlr only provides the software, the software is what is used to steal everything. You CAN customize android to look however but by default its the same boring 4x4 slab of icons and that's how your average consumer will keep it. Android looked like blackberry OS until they saw the iPhone. Android has an open source market which has made it the 2nd biggest target for malware, it is expected that almost 1/3 of android users will encounter malware on their phone within the year. The most common varieties of this malware end up adding a hefty sum to your bill, these can be found on the "open source marketplace" that you're so proud of. As for your last statement saying apple is implementing android into iOS5 the only thing they've got that was stolen was the notifications bar. I'm no apple fan, but I feel justified in calling you an idiot.
Man everything that you mention makes you sound like an apple fan. Just get the hell out of here because no one likes a whiner who *****es about Google and says he's no apple fan. If you don't like Google so much then don't use any of their products as well as their search engine. No one cares what you think and I don't care what people think of my opinions. I'm not going to keep whining about it.
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Funny once apple sues samsung its all ok , block their sales all good , but once apple gets hit back with same meassure then everyone else is abusing pattents.
Lets face it apple wants to put a stop on so fast and developing android phones and software, all they can is try to find loopholes and sue.
We will see where apple will be in 2 yr time and where android will be.
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If it wasnt for these android oem's apples hardware specs would still remain mediocre. U can bet iphone 5 would have been iphone 4 repackaged with same hardware specs.
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z33dev33l said:
and again you put forth senseless insults, shocker. I'm not, nor could I ever say that apple doesn't steal, however, they also innovate. Google has failed to do this and makes it their business to steal from different hardware/software providers, and even their consumers. Google is a company founded on stealing and you all act as though you're offended by someone mentioning it.
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Click to collapse
Hang on, in another thread your posts stated that Google do innovate (ok you were claiming that they didn't by arguing that they do innovate, but if crazy paradoxical logic is your thing, then go for it).
z33dev33l said:
Oh look, another biased tech site. Apple isn't abusing the patent system, they're utilizing it for its intendd purpose. There is a big difference. The fact that google steals everything is, and should be their downfall. People treat it as though they're innovating and yet everything they build and everything they utilize is stolen, to top it off the whole point of their platform is to steal your information.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The RDF strikes again!
But this time I won't even bother with a rebuttal, it's useless anyway, in the next thread people will be spouting the same nonsense again and again.
It at least makes me a bit happy that most of the people in this thread do see it the way it *really* is - which is that Apple are being total and complete hypocrites.
I'll end with something I've asked in another thread, and of course didn't get a reply: How do you "steal" IP?
z33dev33l said:
and again you put forth senseless insults, shocker. I'm not, nor could I ever say that apple doesn't steal, however, they also innovate. Google has failed to do this and makes it their business to steal from different hardware/software providers, and even their consumers. Google is a company founded on stealing and you all act as though you're offended by someone mentioning it.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Apple does not innovate. They steal many ideas and clump them into one nicely built product. However, most tech companies do take other's ideas and build on them. Apple, HTC, Samsung all feed off of eachother. However, it is a problem when Apple decides they can steal but no one else can, and thus this stupid patent war.
z33dev33l said:
and again you put forth senseless insults, shocker. I'm not, nor could I ever say that apple doesn't steal, however, they also innovate.
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You're on some serious hallucinogenic class a sh1t if you think Apple innovate anything.
100% everything they sell is not original and was done 10 years prior. They also specifcally leave out basic features just so retards buy the next product to get what should have been in the first.
The ONLY thing Apple are good at is their marketing, And that is convincing sheep like you that they bring things new to the table. Do some fking research dude.
Eye candy/marketed well yes, Something new/innovative absolutely not!
Just wanna share guys. If this is not the appropriate section then mods can either move or close this thread. I hope apple won't bribe patenet officials
http://phandroid.com/2012/02/17/goo...tion-pull-down-bar-yeah-back-in-09-fun-facts/
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Awesome. I face-palmed the first time I saw Apple's "Notification Center". XD
Patent will be disallowed, apple will patent it later and sue google. Pretty sure with apples money and "luck" that's what will happen.
Dave
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People don't seem to understand a lot of the phone company litigation (despite Apple being the clear market leader on spurious litigation) is tit for tat, and it was that way in mobile phone manufacture before Apple came along.
In many cases both (or even more ) companies all use patent infringement against each other as nothing more than a leverage tool. Bit like a wild west card game where everyone has sawed off gauge under the table.
What often happens is ........ essentially nothing, the lawyers get rich and the marketing depts screech about stolen tech (often tech that was developed by other companies ages ago), but behind the scenes everyone agrees to allow use of their stolen tech.
Sounds bonkers but it happens a lot, think companies litigate to see if any competitor will blink, But its like a card game .... everyone has a hand and the result is often a classic Mexican stand-off.
This seems like one of the main reasons Google acquired Motorola (in case you where wondering) Google with Motorola's old patents is a PROPER mobile phone contender (Google has its own gun under the table now mofos), without the patents they would have been very vulnerable to the court room battle tactic, now they can just play the same game.
As litigate and counter litigation can actually stop phone manufacture and sales for everyone involved as manufactures can be legally forced to halt sales or production .... if everyone involved fires a suite at the others ........ everyone gets shut down ...... so you see there is a perverse self interest in everyone eventually agreeing to carry on as before the litigation.
I know it sounds nuts, yes they do spent millions on these cases, often to achieve nothing but the same equilibrium that existed before the court case.
Can Google really do anything against apple since android is open source? I'd love to see apple get a taste of their own medicine.
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Let's see how Apple responds.
Slide to Unlock now belongs to them.
but not by ICS, which is too different.
We have been lucky again
even better....
http://phandroid.com/2012/02/16/goo...finds-work-around-for-apples-slide-to-unlock/
to be honest this whole patent fight b/w the two is getting a little redic. The Apple v. Samsung dispute that includes apples slide unlock is absolutely absurd to begin with. Apple filed for that patent AFTER another phone manufacturer had already had a device out using it. Which was the basis for one judge dismissing the patent all together. Fact that its gotten through others is comical to me...
spunker88 said:
Can Google really do anything against apple since android is open source? I'd love to see apple get a taste of their own medicine.
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Yes they can. Their ideas are their intellectual property. Open source has nothing to do with it.
Well, sadly, in another thread regarding the shipment delays I made the poor mistake of defending Apple and claiming the shipments being held by the ITC was likely a routine screening and not being held up because of Apple.
Turns out, I was wrong. Apple has filed a formal grievance with the US ITC today saying that HTC hasn't actually resolved the software issues and should meet as an emergency and re-enact the ban blocking imports of HTC phones.
http://www.phonescoop.com/articles/article.php?a=10560
This is just more over-aggressive bull**** lawsuits for no reason. HTC is in no position to even directly compete against Apple in the market, and ultimately is doing some of the most unique software and hardware design in the industry.
At what point does this whole mobile lawsuit nonsense come to a boiling point?
Also, as a point of full disclosure, and because I don't really want to ***** about Apple being the worst company on earth, I do own use and love my iPad, Macbook Air, and iMac. I do own an iPhone 4S but as of recently it sits off in a drawer while I use my HOX.
This thread was not started with the intention of people piling in to say how Apple is terrible, or builds ****ty products, but rather have a conversation about the challenges of the mobile industry moving forward. As each company tries to innovate and release compelling products the likelihood of overlapping features and functionality is inevitable. How does the industry encourage innovate without trampling intellectual property rights? (or in other words, **** Software Patents)
Apple is just pissed the one x is better than the iPhone
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This is so ridiculous...
What gets me is how many of these patent disputes are actually FRAND (fair use) issues.
I'm waiting for some judge to put down his iPhone and see things clearly. Patent law is out of control and companies are only using it to maintain a monopoly or remain profitable to their stockholders when their product is actually no longer inovative and has lost market share (see also TiVo)
Apple sees a threat in Android a threat that will screw the company I hate apple but now its the devil to me .
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But this is bs! Why would they do that, apple needs competition, its basic business 101. Does apple think since I can't get a htc one phone imma get me some ios?? Hell no and im sure like me, that's just gonna piss others off and make it a point NOT to buy any apple products.
Maybe a boycott of apple is in order.
Man anyone see the original apple commercial for the first imac from the 70's or whatever? Oh the irony
.
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They should start focusing on a new iOS or putting something extraordinary in the iPhone 5 instead of law suites. Hop off android. Power users choose android and the rest use iOS their lawsuits won't convert anybody. They're always suing somebody haha. Samsung, HTC, might as well sue Google and the rest of the world.
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This has little to do with rightfully protecting intellectual property, and everything to do with patent trolling and using the law to attack competitors.
Android has gobbled up market share due to the fact that manufacturer are willing to give people variety and choices. Meanwhile, Apple is trying to lock everyone into one device form factor.
This also more represents Apple's failure to innovate, rather than the opposite. The iPhone has hardly changed its looks after 5 iterations. Aside from different backing material, it has looked almost exactly the same. And few internal hardware innovations as well. Aside from moving to a better screen, and a better camera, the hardware has only had incremental improvements (CPU and memory) over its entire lifespan.
The one form factor business model has benefited them in many ways, but we've come to a point where people now want bigger screens on their smartphones. Apple has simply run out of new ideas in the present form factor. Their biggest recent innovation. . . Siri (chuckle). They are stuck and they know it. If they move to a larger iPhone (and also a smaller iPad, or "iPad Mini" as its rumored) they begin to experience some of the OS fragmentation that they have criticized Android for so many times in the past.
I don't mean to complain about Apple so much, or sound like a hater. They make some nice devices, and have contributed some nice interface design to the smartphone world (earlier in the iPhones history). But its clear that they have stopped innovating. Instead of coming up with new ideas, they have chosen to use petty methods of attacking their competitors.
freakboy13 said:
Man anyone see the original apple commercial for the first imac from the 70's or whatever? Oh the irony
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It was the first Mac (or Macintosh back then) not iMac and the year was 1984. It played during the Superbowl. The irony is that 1984 (spelled out) is a book by George Orwell which was published in 1949 that dealt with a society under total government control. Apple's claim during the Macintosh commercial was that they were going to show the world how 1984 (the year) was not going to be like 1984 (the book). Apple has become the antithesis of what it proclaimed back in 1984.
I really tend to agree. While no one can argue that iOS and the iPhone were amazing innovations, and helped spur the mobile industry as it stands now, iOS has really stagnated on innovate.
There haven't been amazing new features / innovations to the platform in awhile and it seems Apple cares more about others not doing what they have done in the past then focus on what they can do in the future.
I think everyday there are more examples of software design that should be open and licensed rather than closed IP. Things like "pull to refresh" and "pinch to zoom" are functionalities that exist in natural user interface and simple should be able to freely licensed to all software developers.
If Apple approached HTC and simply said pay $X dollars per device to have open cross licensing with Apple's software licenses this whole bull**** could be put to bed in a legal manor.
I just feel like software patents are going to be increasingly difficult to develop and protect and that these major players in the market need to understand there will be functionality overlaps. As such I want to see this bull**** end and cross-licensing begin.
fungflex said:
If Apple approached HTC and simply said pay $X dollars per device to have open cross licensing with Apple's software licenses this whole bull**** could be put to bed in a legal manor.
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That is rational. Apple has no interest in negotiating nor being rational. They are the highest valued company in the world. They have no intention of licensing IP. They have so much cash that they don't know what to do with it and there is no sign of their revenue stream stopping any time soon, so they don't need the money. This is just a pissing match at this point. Apple's intention is total "Thermo-Nuclear-War" annihilation of Android. Things might start to get a bit different now that Steve Jobs is not around...but perhaps it is too soon. Not that I agree with Apple.
I just think patent reform is needed. Competition is good though. In some ways I think Apple has helped HTC. Now HTC has notoriety. Everyone I've recently showed my One X to asks to hold it, and then while holding it they are wowed and act as if they are handling a rare illegal piece of contraband. This HTC One X is now notorious. So even though sales were stopped because of customs I think more people now know what HTC is and that it represents a credible threat to Apple. People will want what they are told that they can't have....human nature.
This is why i got away from apple products not going to support their lawsuits... im tired of hearing this stuff but of course its not going to stop...
Instead of innovating they use wide spread patents to squash competition.
It's not just a problem in the phone industry, patents are way too wide sweeping, long lasting, and powerful these days. Try and remember patent law was created to promote innovation not crush it.
galfert said:
Everyone I've recently showed my One X to asks to hold it, and then while holding it they are wowed and act as if they are handling a rare illegal piece of contraband.
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I have experienced this too and with my old Samsung Captivate as well. When people see an Android phone they are wowed by it and by the ability to make it what YOU want. When they see an iPhone, it's just another iPhone, there's nothing special anymore, nothing "magical." I used to get excited over iPhone announcements back in the days where I was a poor high school student yearning to have a smartphone. Now, howveer, I find the annoucements boring because really, there's nothing to be excited about anymore.
Apple where we invented the lawsuit
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fungflex said:
If Apple approached HTC and simply said pay $X dollars per device to have open cross licensing with Apple's software licenses this whole bull**** could be put to bed in a legal manor.
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galfert said:
Apple has no interest in negotiating nor being rational. They are the highest valued company in the world. They have no intention of licensing IP.
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Well, it looks like that's exactly what happened, and HTC refused to license.
"Apple reportedly asked for $5 - $15 per device to settle Android patent dispute" (I'm not 'allowed' to post my source link, but if you google that headline, you should find it on the Dow Jones website. Article is dated May 5th, 2012.)
So HTC just went on their merry way and knowingly infringed on the patent. If they didn't see this coming, then they're idiots.
That said, I LOVE this damn phone! I see why Apple might have a little envy smeared on their faces!
Does anybody know what exactly it is they are claiming infringes on their patent still? I thought this was resolved with the adding of HTC Linkify Dispatcher. I've used the AT&T ROMS and I've seen how annoying this has made the UI compared to the Rogers version, what more do they want?
kilo89 said:
Does anybody know what exactly it is they are claiming infringes on their patent still? I thought this was resolved with the adding of HTC Linkify Dispatcher. I've used the AT&T ROMS and I've seen how annoying this has made the UI compared to the Rogers version, what more do they want?
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Money plain and simple friggin monopoly
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galfert said:
It was the first Mac (or Macintosh back then) not iMac and the year was 1984. It played during the Superbowl. The irony is that 1984 (spelled out) is a book by George Orwell which was published in 1949 that dealt with a society under total government control. Apple's claim during the Macintosh commercial was that they were going to show the world how 1984 (the year) was not going to be like 1984 (the book). Apple has become the antithesis of what it proclaimed back in 1984.
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Thanks for clearing up my ignorance, that's totally what I meant to say, (reference to the book by G.O.), and the point I was trying to make, lol.
I don't totally hate on apple my MacBook pro still best computer I have, and its almost 4yo, and still kicks ass media wise. But this lawsuit thing is just out of control.
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Boycott Crapple and encourage others to do the same. Enough already.
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