Database Info

Ok, I lied :-)

Ok guys, it's been brought to my attention that my post was
1. Cantankerous.
2. Seemingly disrespectful of devs great work on here.
3. Taken too seriously for being an internet forum.
I would like to say sorry, and explain what I mean I tihnk it would be awesome to pull together the necessary funding for our very talented developers to create an XDA exclusive, completely original ROM. I'm not sure if it is possible, but something that is just for the Thunderbolt alone and isn't sense, isn't AOSP, isn't MIUI, and DEFINITELY not like Motorboat... I mean Motorblur. I think we really are on to something with the work that the Dev's are doing with taking different roms and porting them/using other roms as bases and then building from them; lets see what we can do to completely change the way that this stuff is done(if possible) by polling ideas(not unreasonable wishlists) and putting it all together. Possibly coordinating between Team BAMF, Chingy, and some other the other recognized DEV's.
What does everyone else think?

htcdesirezgeorge said:
I'm not sure if it is possible, but something that is just for the Thunderbolt alone and isn't sense, isn't AOSP, isn't MIUI, and DEFINITELY not like Motorboat...
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If it isn't sense/blur/touchwiz, it is AOSP. Miui is just modified AOSP (with no sources given back), just like all the other roms not sense/blur/touchwiz are also based on AOSP. You do know what AOSP means right? Android Open Source Project as in the android operation system that is the basis to all android phones just modded by the OEMs. What you're asking is similar to saying:
"Hey, I'm bored with linux, unix, osx and windows, can we make a new operating system totally not based on any of those for our computers?"
Perhaps rephrase your question one more time in a way that makes more sense? Third time is a winner

yareally said:
If it isn't sense/blur/touchwiz, it is AOSP. Miui is just modified AOSP (with no sources given back), just like all the other roms not sense/blur/touchwiz are also based on AOSP. You do know what AOSP means right? Android Open Source Project as in the android operation system that is the basis to all android phones just modded by the OEMs. What you're asking is similar to saying:
"Hey, I'm bored with linux, unix, osx and windows, can we make a new operating system totally not based on any of those for our computers?"
Perhaps rephrase your question one more time in a way that makes more sense? Third time is a winner
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Ya got a point, I actually didn't know that! BUT, regardless of how its phrased, what do ya think it would require to do somethig like I mentioned? I, personally would love to see something excitingly new put out here. Like with the miui project, any chance of people putting their heads together to figure it out?

You've got OS's and you have UI's. Obviously it is entirely possible to custom build a UI, but its FAR more difficult than porting one over or mixing and mashing parts of Sense together. UberBAMF is definitely something new and out of the box. That's more radical than anything I ever expected... Or have ever seen elsewhere. UIs do a lot to sell a device, so its worth it for HTC or Samsung to invest in building one. Not so much for a team of volunteer devs.

htcdesirezgeorge said:
Ya got a point, I actually didn't know that! BUT, regardless of how its phrased, what do ya think it would require to do somethig like I mentioned? I, personally would love to see something excitingly new put out here. Like with the miui project, any chance of people putting their heads together to figure it out?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Chances are unlikely to get a new user interface geared to only one phone built from the ground up from the android source by a team for a few reasons:
1) Lack of like-minded (knowledgeable) developers for one device that are currently free. Developers are very opinionated (just from my own experience even if they don't want to admit it). What should/shouldn't go into it would be a mess to deal with and debate alone, especially since the opinions of developers are generally not the same as those that don't develop. The ones already developing most likely don't want to give up their current projects as well. Basically, the developers that want to develop already have their projects and most treat them like it's their "baby" and most likely not willing to give them up or put them on hold. That moves into issue #2
2) Time. It would take considerable amount of time and organization to do that. Probably to get something stable that's original would take longer than most people would keep their Thunderbolt. Guys that work on their phones do this part time for fun as well and that combined with other side projects would press for time.
3) True developers & designers. There's a big difference between hacking some already made stuff to work with things and actually writing object oriented software from scratch. Obviously some guys putting stuff out for the thunderbolt are true developers that code professionally and others are just hacking around making things work done by others. Both have their uses, but you need real development for something like this and I don't think there's enough of those willing.

Forgot to add that the only way change happens is to build interest, so don't let my pessimistic observations detour anyone from posting their thoughts and ideas in this thread

Lack of AOSP for Sensation - I'm going crazy!

Why is it that ever since the Sensation has come out that there is very little to no AOSP support and/or development for it?
The closest we ever seem to have are Sense-stripped ROMs, and it's so annoying.
Now the CM9 team has stopped Sensation development? What the hell is going on?
Is it the Sensation's architecture that renders it just that difficult for our very respected and talented developers to provide such content?
I despise Sense with the deepest passion imaginable. May someone please explain the lack of AOSP support for this amazing device?
Excuse my ranting but I can't hold out for much longer without knowing a clear answer.

i agree with u

Dude, seriously get a grip. Our very own devs are working on it and have a 2nd alpha release already out. Look in the dev section and you'll see the be from virtuous. It's got it's bugs, but it's we'll on its way to stardom. Forget cm9, those people don't know what it means to finish what they start. Take stock in our devs, as they are working their butt off as we speak.
And yes, it's no easy task. Ics is radically new and different. Give it some time and some more Htc release before we have a solid rom.
Matt

First off, yes there is an alpha AOSP ICS from the virtuous team that looks promising. Second, CM did not drop the sensation. Dunno where you got that info. Kmobs just posted this on twitter: https://twitter.com/#!/kmobs/status/160440102626136066

mrg02d said:
Dude, seriously get a grip. Our very own devs are working on it and have a 2nd alpha release already out. Look in the dev section and you'll see the be from virtuous. It's got it's bugs, but it's we'll on its way to stardom. Forget cm9, those people don't know what it means to finish what they start. Take stock in our devs, as they are working their butt off as we speak.
And yes, it's no easy task. Ics is radically new and different. Give it some time and some more Htc release before we have a solid rom.
Matt
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Click to collapse
For sure, I understand, I'm not trying to be ignorant, I just love AOSP.
Also, with my previous Android device being the myTouch 4G, it received an AOSP ROM, actually a variety of them rather quickly.
Like I said I respect our developers and love them to death, I'm just having AOSP withdrawals. HTC Sense is tearing me apart

moh0 said:
First off, yes there is an alpha AOSP ICS from the virtuous team that looks promising. Second, CM did not drop the sensation. Dunno where you got that info. Kmobs just posted this on twitter: https://twitter.com/#!/kmobs/status/160440102626136066
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Click to collapse
I knew about the Alpha ROM, just wish it wasn't the only one in development. I believe I saw the CM9 info in another thread. Apparently it was mistaken.

moh0 said:
First off, yes there is an alpha AOSP ICS from the virtuous team that looks promising. Second, CM did not drop the sensation. Dunno where you got that info. Kmobs just posted this on twitter: https://twitter.com/#!/kmobs/status/160440102626136066
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Click to collapse
I'll believe it when I see it. If he's telling the truth, then communcation is key...his g+ paints a different picture. One with the GN getting all the attention.
Oh well, I feel team virtuous is well ahead of him anyways and they also are more than one or two dudes working on a charity case.
Matt

mrg02d said:
I'll believe it when I see it. If he's telling the truth, then communcation is key...his g+ paints a different picture. One with the GN getting all the attention.
Oh well, I feel team virtuous is well ahead of him anyways and they also are more than one or two dudes working on a charity case.
Matt
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
And I thank the Virtuous team for tackling the project. No one else seems to care, guess Sense has everyone by the neck.

mrg02d said:
I'll believe it when I see it. If he's telling the truth, then communcation is key...his g+ paints a different picture. One with the GN getting all the attention.
Oh well, I feel team virtuous is well ahead of him anyways and they also are more than one or two dudes working on a charity case.
Matt
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I highly doubt a respected developer such as kmobs would be lying to our faces. While the way CM team operates might be infuriating to us flashaholics, they are secretive for a reason. They want a high quality release with initially all internal efforts. And hey, its gotten them to a millions users, so they must be doing something right.

moh0 said:
I highly doubt a respected developer such as kmobs would be lying to our faces. While the way CM team operates might be infuriating to us flashaholics, they are secretive for a reason. They want a high quality release with initially all internal efforts. And hey, its gotten them to a millions users, so they must be doing something right.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
+1
No one from cm7 has said that development has stopped. These devs have lives and other things to do and other problems to deal with. Kmobs doesn't want to release a buggy Rom which I think is good.
Sent from my HTC Sensation XE with Beats Audio using xda premium

When you pay the CM developers a salary, then you can complain about their release schedules.
When they give you their work for free, it'll come out when they are ready for it to come out and you ought to be grateful.
If it doesn't come out at all, you've got nothing to complain about because you didn't do anything to help it come out.

Skipjacks said:
When you pay the CM developers a salary, then you can complain about their release schedules.
When they give you their work for free, it'll come out when they are ready for it to come out and you ought to be grateful.
If it doesn't come out at all, you've got nothing to complain about because you didn't do anything to help it come out.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
News flash, they are playing with the idea of charging for things in the future. They want to have their own marketplace and make money on the side for this and that. Check Kmobs g+ for more information. They're going to have to get used to quite a bit more if they want to be successful. Communication is key, and in this case, king. They better get used to a whole lot more the second they receive money for an app.
Also, no one is *****ing about not having cm9 yet, they are *****ing about the secrecy as to whether or not it is even still a possibility. I believe it was mentioned that many other OLDER phones have some version of cm9 already, yet we don't.
Also, they never said cm7 was over either, yet the consensus says that it is. We've heard zip officially about cm9 or cm7.
If this is how they run their future paid for apps business, I'll steer clear as will most. As for now, I'm sure they enjoy the free beers they get from all the donations. It would be a nice gesture of them to give an update about cm9.
Aside from Kmobs and company, it's refreshing to see a group of people working hard on an ics aosp. Once they get a few more things ironed out, I'm sure they will see a lot more donations coming their way.

mrg02d said:
News flash, they are playing with the idea of charging for things in the future. They want to have their own marketplace and make money on the side for this and that. Check Kmobs g+ for more information. They're going to have to get used to quite a bit more if they want to be successful. Communication is key, and in this case, king. They better get used to a whole lot more the second they receive money for an app.
Also, no one is *****ing about not having cm9 yet, they are *****ing about the secrecy as to whether or not it is even still a possibility. I believe it was mentioned that many other OLDER phones have some version of cm9 already, yet we don't.
Also, they never said cm7 was over either, yet the consensus says that it is. We've heard zip officially about cm9 or cm7.
If this is how they run their future paid for apps business, I'll steer clear as will most. As for now, I'm sure they enjoy the free beers they get from all the donations. It would be a nice gesture of them to give an update about cm9.
Aside from Kmobs and company, it's refreshing to see a group of people working hard on an ics aosp. Once they get a few more things ironed out, I'm sure they will see a lot more donations coming their way.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
And I'm stoked about the Virtuous project.
I also understand these concerns of "you're not doing much to help" yet all I'm saying, is that I think a powerful and amazing device such as the Sensation should have more of an AOSP ROM variety. Most other devices have all kinds of AOSP ROMs.
I wish all of us, the Sensation community, would have worried more about AOSP ROMs other than our huge database of Sense based ROMs. Don't get me wrong, however, our Sense ROMs are absolutely amazing and they've helped my patience along with, I'm sure, many other user's patience as well.

This is what i have been thinking since i moved from mytouch 4g to sensation. I just don't know why but it looks like sensation users/developers is not interested in MIUI rom ( i only see 1 MIUI rom, and it not fully working, no update recently).

tritran18518 said:
This is what i have been thinking since i moved from mytouch 4g to sensation. I just don't know why but it looks like sensation users/developers is not interested in MIUI rom ( i only see 1 MIUI rom, and it not fully working, no update recently).
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Actually, the MIUI ROM in the dev section has been updated as of a few days ago. Also there is another highly functional MIUI ROM floating around but linking to it is forbidden. Hit up google if interested.

I think CyanogenMod has to be secretive to function.
You make a good point, I haven't seen hardly any AOSP roms for the sensation besides cyanogenmod. Although I think cyanogenmod 7 is ridiculously fast, and it's aosp, I quite like it...and cm9 beta is available for the sensation, but I agree with the fact that they don't announce ANYTHING...their last update on cm9 was like december 9th.
However, if you think of it from their perspective, can you possibly imagine releasing a buggy beta rom to THAT many people? I mean, the first rom a lot of people hear about is cyanogenmod, so all of the new people would flash that, and we all know how many new people can't read a set of clear instructions...
So, i think that it is almost required for them to keep it on the down low, to avoid mass confusion and complaining from every single user who can't read...It's like when you read the comments morons leave in the market...
anyways, sorry to rant. but Yeah, I think that they pretty much have to be more secretive, not all of their users are active forum members seeking to better the community and not be ignorant.

I've always been curious why A2DP bluetooth and the camera are always the hardest things to fix on most phones when compiling an AOSP ROM. I thought the ROM source would help with that, but I don't know exactly how it works.

DeezNotes said:
I've always been curious why A2DP bluetooth and the camera are always the hardest things to fix on most phones when compiling an AOSP ROM. I thought the ROM source would help with that, but I don't know exactly how it works.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
From what I understand, both of those things (including wifi hotspot) are kernel related. It's hard to dev's to fix those things without the proper kernel source.

aNYthing24 said:
From what I understand, both of those things (including wifi hotspot) are kernel related. It's hard to dev's to fix those things without the proper kernel source.
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Click to collapse
Ah that helped me understand a lot more.

just an fyi that xda isn't the only place to find roms...

KERNEL source released

So exciting
http://www.androidpolice.com/2012/0...rnel-source-code-including-that-of-the-one-v/
EDIT: http://dl4.htc.com/RomCode/Source_and_Binaries/doubleshot-gb-crc-2.6.35-f3a1982.tar.gz
Sent from my DoubleShot Lite using Tapatalk 2

ac3theone said:
so exciting
http://www.androidpolice.com/2012/0...rnel-source-code-including-that-of-the-one-v/
sent from my doubleshot lite using tapatalk 2
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Click to collapse
yyyyyyyyyyeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeessssssssssssssssssssssssss
Soo.... Does anyone think we could see some pure AOSP action now? Or someone could update the kernel for CM7? As you will see in general someone -whom I suspect is not alone - would love an AOSP ROM on our HTC Doubleshot.

Maybe this kernel isn't that good as we suppose...

Nusferatu said:
Maybe this kernel isn't that good as we suppose...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Well.... What did u expect? we don't have an ICS ROM in our future that we have been made aware of, and it is truly great news as this is something that has made many a dev stray away from this device - now we might be able to get CM7 stable - and others to work off of CM7 such as blahblah

Good news nevertheless
We need to get CM7 STABLE ASAP
We may be late in the running, but that doesn't mean we still can't get merged into the main tree

Nusferatu said:
Maybe this kernel isn't that good as we suppose...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Its worse than you thought... The source code was released a really long time ago. This is just an updated kernel, so the real reason for lack of development isn't because the source code wasn't available. :/

michaelmab88 said:
Its worse than you thought... The source code was released a really long time ago. This is just an updated kernel, so the real reason for lack of development isn't because the source code wasn't available. :/
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Click to collapse
Updated source is awesome though. Tried to get it earlier and couldn't - can't on shift and will be working straight until Friday afternoon so won't have a chance to try again for a few days.
Any percieved lack of development is due to people not putting any effort into it - everyone who cries about a lack of development should do something about it instead of waiting for someone else to do so.
Why come here if you don't want to get into dev, worse, come here and complain about yourself not doing anything? Kinda silly.
Whenever I see people complain about a lack of development I wonder why they would basically make fun of themselves? It gives me a laugh at their expense...
Sent from a digital distance.

Yeah i just got the source downloaded because it matches the new ota I'm running now, I've never seen what a dual core source looks like, or if I'll even be able to compile a kernel for this device, I've only compiled a few for the EVO shift, which was straight forward with a little help from my boy drob...who knows o may get it to boot ha-ha.......nope I fudged something in my toolchain It's broke....again.....LOL
Sent from my myTouch_4G_Slide using Tapatalk 2

strapped365 said:
Yeah i just got the source downloaded because it matches the new ota I'm running now, I've never seen what a dual core source looks like, or if I'll even be able to compile a kernel for this device, I've only compiled a few for the EVO shift, which was straight forward with a little help from my boy drob...who knows o may get it to boot ha-ha
Sent from my myTouch_4G_Slide using Tapatalk 2
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
http://dl.dropbox.com/u/62701184/arm-eabi-4.4.3.zip
That link is for the toolchain you need, i've been hosting it on dropbox for a while until I get it over to a more permanent host.
I can walk you through it later if you want.
I have it written up on how to set up your linux environment and make changes, including versioning instructions, just haven't found the time to polish off a part of it and add it to the dev reference yet.
Got a whole space reserved for the how to from start to finish on making kernels for the doubleshot, and i've already walked people through it with no kernel dev experience so if you've done it for another device it'll be a cakewalk.
I'm eating breakfast now and gotta run out to another job, and going straight from there to dodgeball practice, then work again tonight and from there right to the job i'm about to do again tomorrow this time, so tomorrow night i'm doubtless going to sleep - maybe as early as saturday evening I could go through it with you on IRC if you are interested.
Otherwise I hope to have that in the dev ref next week, work permitting.

Blue6IX said:
http://dl.dropbox.com/u/62701184/arm-eabi-4.4.3.zip
That link is for the toolchain you need, i've been hosting it on dropbox for a while until I get it over to a more permanent host.
I can walk you through it later if you want.
I have it written up on how to set up your linux environment and make changes, including versioning instructions, just haven't found the time to polish off a part of it and add it to the dev reference yet.
Got a whole space reserved for the how to from start to finish on making kernels for the doubleshot, and i've already walked people through it with no kernel dev experience so if you've done it for another device it'll be a cakewalk.
I'm eating breakfast now and gotta run out to another job, and going straight from there to dodgeball practice, then work again tonight and from there right to the job i'm about to do again tomorrow this time, so tomorrow night i'm doubtless going to sleep - maybe as early as saturday evening I could go through it with you on IRC if you are interested.
Otherwise I hope to have that in the dev ref next week, work permitting.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I might have my little one on Saturday night so that maybe a no go for then, the tool chain I currently have is 4.4.1, because anything newer for the speedy breaks a ton during the compile.....I changed some commands around for ****s and giggles and got a zimage in arch/arm/boot so I split it with the ota ramdisk and I'm just gonna try....if that goes south I'll setup your tool chain....thanks blue your like the DoubleShot dictionary....
Also I'm gonna grab one of your kernel zips for test flashes if that's ok
Sent from my myTouch_4G_Slide using Tapatalk 2

Blue6IX said:
Updated source is awesome though. Tried to get it earlier and couldn't - can't on shift and will be working straight until Friday afternoon so won't have a chance to try again for a few days.
Any percieved lack of development is due to people not putting any effort into it - everyone who cries about a lack of development should do something about it instead of waiting for someone else to do so.
Why come here if you don't want to get into dev, worse, come here and complain about yourself not doing anything? Kinda silly.
Whenever I see people complain about a lack of development I wonder why they would basically make fun of themselves? It gives me a laugh at their expense...
Sent from a digital distance.
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Click to collapse
Hey I'm not complaining, and I am working on it! I just have to balance between school and work and learning how to build cm7/cm9 from source.
You can check out a little bit of what I've been working on github.com/mafischer

michaelmab88 said:
Hey I'm not complaining, and I am working on it! I just have to balance between school and work and learning how to build cm7/cm9 from source.
You can check out a little bit of what I've been working on github.com/mafischer
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Lol no worries my friend, was a general comment and not aimed at you in particular, just a perspective I wanted to put out there and you were the first opportunity to do so.
I still haven't found the time to get git set up and learn how to use it - that whole life getting in the way of living thing. Given you have git going that makes you a more responsible dev then I in my book -
@ strapped: all my work available is a contribution to the open source community at large, and the members of XDA in particular. If any of it can be useful, especially as a teaching tool, I wholeheartedly encourage it!
Sent from a digital distance.

Where did all of you come from?
Never knew there was this many people working on the Doubleshot in the background...

gtmaster303 said:
Where did all of you come from?
Never knew there was this many people working on the Doubleshot in the background...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I've been here since i preordered my doubleshot... I just haven't had time to work on much of anything, so there's no point in advertising to the community that I'm gonna work on things that may or may not ever get finished. I don't want to spread false hope or anything.
I am however, graduating in may; I'm going to be working over at walmart isd for a summer internship, and I should have more time on my hands once school is over!

How integrated is the Sense stuff into the kernel? As I understand it, we've had trouble removing the Sense underpinnings from the operating system to get it working with things such as Sixaxis. I'm aware that this is entirely a lack of understanding on my part.
I would quite love to get involved in building a ROM myself, perhaps even setting up CM9 from scratch. I just have no idea how to get started. I've mucked around with custom kernels and embedded linux (not android) devices in the past, but I'm not sure how that knowledge would apply to this system. I also have no history of proper programming languages or anything like that. I'm vaguely familiar with how to compile things with the ARM toolchains.
I'm also a tad nervous about bricking the device by writing to a memory location that I really shouldn't be touching.

Kanerix said:
How integrated is the Sense stuff into the kernel? As I understand it, we've had trouble removing the Sense underpinnings from the operating system to get it working with things such as Sixaxis. I'm aware that this is entirely a lack of understanding on my part.
I would quite love to get involved in building a ROM myself, perhaps even setting up CM9 from scratch. I just have no idea how to get started. I've mucked around with custom kernels and embedded linux (not android) devices in the past, but I'm not sure how that knowledge would apply to this system. I also have no history of proper programming languages or anything like that. I'm vaguely familiar with how to compile things with the ARM toolchains.
I'm also a tad nervous about bricking the device by writing to a memory location that I really shouldn't be touching.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Sorry for quoting the whole post just to address one thing, but in regards to sixaxis I'm sure it's a safe bet that if one were to simply replace the stock bluetooth stack with the one kornyone used for cm7 in my bulletproof rom it would work fine, and I doubt much other, if any modification would be necessary.
I haven't had time to try, and truthfully i'd rather build my own so am kinda intentionally not trying - I am more interested in the project then just jumping into a solution.
It really depends on what you are trying to do - some sense things can be replaced with relatively little effort, other things are so interwoven it would take considerable effort and time to unravel, reverse engineer and implement a new solution.
A lot of people have been working on different parts of unravelling sense since back in august, and around the middle of that month we got s-off and really started digging in.
There is a considerable knowledge base lurking here to address this kind of stuff if people make it known they are working on things - dig back through the history of the device here at XDA and you can catch a glimpse of it and get some direction on who you can approach when you hit a roadblock, depending on what kind of roadblock it is.
It's better for us as a community to have that kind of knowledge out on the public forum, but there's much more here then what face value suggests.
I've been trying to get that kind of stuff and a general 'start here' knowledge base built in the developers reference stickied here in dev, reading through that would be a good place to start getting oriented on devving for the dubleshot.
I just go through some crazy work cycles and sometimes can't be around much for a time here and ther, so my contributions come in groups and gaps.
Sent from a digital distance.

michaelmab88 said:
I've been here since i preordered my doubleshot... I just haven't had time to work on much of anything, so there's no point in advertising to the community that I'm gonna work on things that may or may not ever get finished. I don't want to spread false hope or anything.
I am however, graduating in may; I'm going to be working over at walmart isd for a summer internship, and I should have more time on my hands once school is over!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
It doesn't matter whether or not you finish. Status updates would be nice though. At least that way people can know what you're up to, and they may even be able to help you and vice versa.
No one here is demanding an ETA or even a completion at all. We're all in for the fun of it.
Either way I think I can safely speak for everyone when I say, we're excited to see what you got cooking

Blue6IX said:
Sorry for quoting the whole post just to address one thing, but in regards to sixaxis I'm sure it's a safe bet that if one were to simply replace the stock bluetooth stack with the one kornyone used for cm7 in my bulletproof rom it would work fine, and I doubt much other, if any modification would be necessary.
I haven't had time to try, and truthfully i'd rather build my own so am kinda intentionally not trying - I am more interested in the project then just jumping into a solution.
It really depends on what you are trying to do - some sense things can be replaced with relatively little effort, other things are so interwoven it would take considerable effort and time to unravel, reverse engineer and implement a new solution.
A lot of people have been working on different parts of unravelling sense since back in august, and around the middle of that month we got s-off and really started digging in.
There is a considerable knowledge base lurking here to address this kind of stuff if people make it known they are working on things - dig back through the history of the device here at XDA and you can catch a glimpse of it and get some direction on who you can approach when you hit a roadblock, depending on what kind of roadblock it is.
It's better for us as a community to have that kind of knowledge out on the public forum, but there's much more here then what face value suggests.
I've been trying to get that kind of stuff and a general 'start here' knowledge base built in the developers reference stickied here in dev, reading through that would be a good place to start getting oriented on devving for the dubleshot.
I just go through some crazy work cycles and sometimes can't be around much for a time here and ther, so my contributions come in groups and gaps.
Sent from a digital distance.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I've been trying to go through the dev reference that you posted and track down as much scattered information as I can, but I'm still not quite sure what I'm doing. Alas.
Regarding bluetooth: would the gingerbread stack be compatible with ICS?

gtmaster303 said:
It doesn't matter whether or not you finish. Status updates would be nice though. At least that way people can know what you're up to, and they may even be able to help you and vice versa.
No one here is demanding an ETA or even a completion at all. We're all in for the fun of it.
Either way I think I can safely speak for everyone when I say, we're excited to see what you got cooking
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Well what I'm currently up to is making a stable version of cm7 for the doubleshot. I have made lots of progress as far as learning all the tools necessary to compile android from source, which is a relatively simple task. The not so simple part is trying to put together like a puzzle, the source code from other devices. I've hit some roadblocks and I'm currently asking some devs for help, but while I'm at it I guess I can ask for help here on xda.

michaelmab88 said:
Well what I'm currently up to is making a stable version of cm7 for the doubleshot.
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Yeehaaa!

[Q] Cyanogenmod vs. Liquidsmooth (JB 4.2.1 Comp)

Wondering if anybody could provide compelling reasons to be utilizing Cyanogenmod or Liquidsmooth over the other? I believe that Liquidsmooth is based on the CM tree, but am having trouble finding differences between the two at this point (with both using JellyBean 4.2.1 builds). Does anybody have experience with one of these recent builds running more stably than the other?
FYI, I'm running an unlocked Verizon Galaxy S3 (and loving it!).
Thanks in advance!

IMHO, Liquid is more stable. The difference with their rom is that they add their own tweaks and apps and such. Cm is like the base 4.2 for all aosp roms. They each have their own unique features but with my experience, Liquid has been more stable
Sent from my SCH-I535 using Tapatalk 2

um i dont think we can choose between the 2 if im not mistaken liquidsmooth is Cyanogen based

Alright, I'll be the bad guy.
Most notorious thiefs in the biz. Refuse to give credit (even when asked numerous times by mods -- I've seen the PMs) and basically a paid service with the sheer amount of times they ask for donations. Almost begging -- pathetic.
If you've been around long enough, you'd know their OP did NOT read like it does now. That took years. I used to run Liquid on my D1, then I heard (and saw) from a little birdy what they're all about. Saw the evidence and my eyes were opened.
I swiftly blocked both Liquid team members from my gtalk and haven't ran it since. I pity the fool who gives them a dime. Way better alternatives that don't beg for money like a panhandler...
Flame on.
Sent from my SCH-I535 using Tapatalk 2

1ManWolfePack said:
Alright, I'll be the bad guy.
Most notorious thiefs in the biz. Refuse to give credit (even when asked numerous times by mods -- I've seen the PMs) and basically a paid service with the sheer amount of times they ask for donations. Almost begging -- pathetic.
If you've been around long enough, you'd know their OP did NOT read like it does now. That took years. I used to run Liquid on my D1, then I heard (and saw) from a little birdy what they're all about. Saw the evidence and my eyes were opened.
***SNIP***
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Thanks 1ManWolfePack - I appreciate the candid response. Hopefully the LS team is operating a bit more honestly these days, but I'll give base CM another go and hope I can get it to run stably. I've actually had similar experience so far as BraddahBoi808 in that the LS 4.2.1 builds have been more stable, but I'm looking for better battery life and hope recent CM builds will provide it (perhaps in conjunction with a new kernel).

In my experience, I've found CM to be a lot smoother than Liquid. In fact, I never really found Liquid to be as "LiquidSmooth" as they say. I only used it when I did because it was one of the only roms available at first on the N7 and Verizon GN.
Of course I'll choose the Big Three over Liquid anyday.

SwiftLegend said:
In my experience, I've found CM to be a lot smoother than Liquid. In fact, I never really found Liquid to be as "LiquidSmooth" as they say. I only used it when I did because it was one of the only roms available at first on the N7 and Verizon GN.
Of course I'll choose the Big Three over Liquid anyday.
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Thanks SwiftLegend - really appreciate the feedback. I've installed the latest nightly of CM10.1 successfully, but it's still got a bluetooth issue so I'm looking around at other options (which I enjoy doing anyway). Excuse the question, but what are the big three that you've referred to? One is clearly Cyanogenmod, guessing a second is AOKP, and is the third by chance MIUI?

I ran Liquid ICS and 4.1 on my Nexus for a while. Was nice, didnt have any issues and had a little more of the customization pulls included.
Have run CM also. Would have liked a little more customization, but again no big issues here either.
Try both.What do you have to lose? 30 min
BTW, where do you see a liquid build for our device?

Sir-Lancelot said:
**SNIP**
BTW, where do you see a liquid build for our device?
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I actually did run both... have used CM in the past and was using LS recently. Couldn't really find any significant differences and was wondering if others had found them.
Sorry to have gotten your hopes up re: a LS build for the Galaxy Note II - I realized after the fact that I posted in the wrong device forum (I'm using a Galaxy SIII) but still got relevant responses so left the thread as-is. Hope a build comes out for the Note II soon for you though!

carpdeeem said:
Thanks SwiftLegend - really appreciate the feedback. I've installed the latest nightly of CM10.1 successfully, but it's still got a bluetooth issue so I'm looking around at other options (which I enjoy doing anyway). Excuse the question, but what are the big three that you've referred to? One is clearly Cyanogenmod, guessing a second is AOKP, and is the third by chance MIUI?
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CyanogenMod, AOKP, and Paranoid Android (PA)

This is the Note II section
I will move to the S3 for you
Thread moved

kennyglass123 said:
This is the Note II section
I will move to the S3 for you
Thread moved
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Thanks Kenny - realized my error after the fact. I appreciate your assistance!

SwiftLegend said:
CyanogenMod, AOKP, and Paranoid Android (PA)
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Very interesting... hadn't noted PA before... looks like a VERY interesting ROM, but unfortunately not available (as I can tell) for the VZW G3, and certainly not in 4.2.1 flavor yet.
In the meantime, I think I'll be monitoring CM & LS for the first stable 4.2.1 build that includes functional bluetooth, GPS, and streaming audio. LS beta 1 version A has actually been the closest I've found thus far, but the battery life was horrendous.

CM 10.1 works a lot better on my phone than liquid smooth. The latest of liquids betas freeze up my phone, won't let it wake up, and I have to keep toggling data on and off to keep it.

Well this is an interesting thread.
I'm the team liquid communications guy. Here's what I can tell you about what we do. Bear in mind, I'm not a dev - I'm here specifically to handle releases, etc.
The team is made up of a few core devs. Liquid0624, nocoast, and winner00. Occasionally hiemanshu as well but lately I think he's travelling. By far Liquid0624 makes up the core of what this rom is.
We were based on CM briefly for 4.1.2, but are back to AOSP. We didn't care for the CM base. Here's what we do - we take the AOSP code, and optimize the hell out of it. Our roms are ~100mb. We then start to add in features. We tend to go for the same popular features everyone else likes. Generally more than CM, but not so jammed with features as AOKP can be. Sometimes too much of a good thing is too much.
Credit is always given. If we miss it, it's an oversight. Given I'm not really a dev, I can see that happening and I shall endeavor to ensure that better care is taken for such things. I absolutely agree that such things deserve credit, always.
Do we need donations? You bet. We're a tiny little team, and Liquid0624 does this as his job. He works at least 12 hours a day on this, and is often pestering me at all hours of the night about new releases, etc. This is his life. So yeah, we need donations. Without them Liquid (whose name is Ryan, by the way) can't afford to keep doing this, and that means the rom dies. I'm doing this for free simply because I saw a need for a dedicated communications guy and wanted to keep that from happening. I know there's a rep. I understand why. I even agree that in the past things were stated in such a way as to make it seem like this was a pay-for-play operation. That's why I joined the team - I knew how it was on the inside and I saw the perceptions, and they didn't match.
That's the thing, really. This is not a pay-for-play operation. Literally the second a release is completed, I'm getting pings from Ryan. He doesn't like to hold onto things. I wish he would sometimes, and have actually started a group that helps to address that - more on that later. But there is no release we've ever held onto or not released to the public. Ever. Never, ever, ever. This is an open source based rom, and our code is freely available, our builds are freely available - always will be.
I'm always working on ways to make things even better. We created a "producers" group for folks who donate a certain amount. These folks get slightly better access to our devs via a google groups community - mostly chitchat back and forth. I've taken to posting builds there a little (couple hours) sooner, just to get some early testing done, but I think I've done that a total of twice. Most of the time Ryan is hot to get things out the door and into your hands. It's a way of us to say thanks to our supporters. We also are working on other ways to do so as well, because without our supporters we wouldn't exist. One of these days we'd like to have a paid app of some kind so folks can donate that way as well if they want. Maybe we will.
So that's the deal. We're in a place that all devs are in who can't afford to do this for free. We're passionate about android, we want to bring you the best rom possible - this is our daily driver too - but we need to literally keep the lights on and keep Ryan's family fed. So we need to ask for donations constantly. Would we rather not? You bet. But it is what it is, and it's a line we walk. Believe me when I say that no one is making retirement money, here. I have a family myself, and sometimes I think Ryan might be insane. There's zero doubt that he's passionate about this stuff, or he wouldn't be doing it.
But 1ManWolfePack, I'm going to argue to the end that we're a team of thieves. We work with other devs, we contribute code, we use code and credit it - just like the rest of the dev community. If you want to converse more about this privately, I'm more than willing. I will always take suggestions. It's a difficult line to walk - we think we've got something great, and want to give it to the world - but we do need to get something for the amazing amounts of time we spend, or we physically can't do it anymore.
Derek
Team Liquid

You don't have to donate if you don't want to.. It's free to the population... And imo its the best out there.. They get my money because I like the rom and it's my gift of gratitude back...
I don't know if you're broke or cheap, but to slander them for something that is technically free? You don't wanna donate? Don't.. Simple as that
Sent from my galaxy nexus using Xparent Purple Tapatalk 2

You must be rich. Maybe you should make a rom and give it for out free. Fail to understand your "Most notorious thiefs"
Your comment is worth a grain of salt.
1ManWolfePack said:
Alright, I'll be the bad guy.
Most notorious thiefs in the biz. Refuse to give credit (even when asked numerous times by mods -- I've seen the PMs) and basically a paid service with the sheer amount of times they ask for donations. Almost begging -- pathetic.
If you've been around long enough, you'd know their OP did NOT read like it does now. That took years. I used to run Liquid on my D1, then I heard (and saw) from a little birdy what they're all about. Saw the evidence and my eyes were opened.
I swiftly blocked both Liquid team members from my gtalk and haven't ran it since. I pity the fool who gives them a dime. Way better alternatives that don't beg for money like a panhandler...
Flame on.
Sent from my SCH-I535 using Tapatalk 2
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Click to collapse

I just want to chime in the LS will have many more useful features than CM will have. CM is a great ROM, and I have ran it much more recently than I have ran liquid, but if I had to choose one it would probably be liquid. The team is very engaging and kind.
Yes, they ask for donations, but there are reasons for it, and it has no affect on your access of the ROM. I am running AOKP JB M1 at the moment, but once liquid has their first stable version of 4.2.1 ready for the GNex I will probably jump on.
Also, they base off of AOSP more often than not, and yes...I have been around since the D1 days.
Best,
RC3

Liquidsmooth on Gnex has been stellar for me. Everytime I stray to a different ROM I always end up back to Liquidsmooth. Everything else has been laggy and slow for me. Can't answer for the SIII.
As far as the begging for money comment, I have never felt any kind of pressure to donate. When I do donate, I don't expect anything, just saying thanks to their team for the countless hours spent on putting the ROM together and they sure appreciate it.
Edit: Just to add, they don't treat me any different than anybody else whether I donate or not. I still get the ROM's in a timely manner either way. Matter of fact, just when I finished setting up Beta1D, here somes Beta2.

This may not be my place to chime in but i will anyways. I've been using LiquidSmooth roms since the OG Droid days, they were always what i expected back then and deeply contributed to my keeping that phone for so long. I donated a few times simply because i wanted to show my appreciation for there work (its like when doormen at hotels carry your bags to your room and you give them a few bucks, its to show appreciation, its not mandatory but it helps them) did i ever receive benefits for these donations? Hell no, did i expect them? Hell no. I simply did it because i wanted to show my appreciation for there work its that simple.
Now onto this "team of thieves" i see plenty of credits given in there posts.
Example A:
toxicthunder said:
Ours is an open source project. Please feel free to look at our code on LiquidSmooth GitHub
We would like to thank CyanogenMod for their device trees, framework/settings mods and their code that was incorporated into this project.
Furthermore, we also extend our gratitude to AOKP, Team CNA and Team EOS for parts of their code that we have incorporated.[/SIZE][/FONT]IMPORTANT NOTE:
​
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Now that doesn't look like a post that's 'stealing' its giving credit to others code that has been incorporated into the rom. Its not stealing at all. They also leave there entire project as open source, again if somebody is stealing why leave it open source? They leave it that way so if another developers see's something they like, they can contact them about using it in there rom. EVERY single rom created is almost guaranteed to have some idea borrowed from another developer, why? Because its open source, and each developer wants to try and give the users what they want. Stealing would be taking code without asking and then not giving credit, but this is the opposite. So again are they thieves? Nope, you might wanna get your facts checked, and knowledge checked, and evidence checked before making outrageous accusations.
Onto the "begging" thing, where in there thread are they begging for money? Posting a release with a link to the rom, gapps and donation link is NOT begging at all. Posting on twitter that liquids computer died and asking for donations to help him fix that so roms can continue to be developed is NOT begging. Its simply reminding "hey we have a donation link just in case you're feeling generous" when have they ever said "No donation, no rom!" lets see.... never, because that's not how it works. If you want to donate then that is your choice, you don't have a gun to your head, and you aren't paying for the rom. I still donate because i appreciate the work, and know how much time and effort goes into it. I also know that computer parts aren't cheap and that every donation helps. Asking for a simple donation that's a DONATION (not mandatory, not required, etc) is nowhere near begging. Sitting on the corner everyday on your hands and knees asking people for money that's begging. Telling someone "you can only have the download link if you donate 5$" is considered "pay to use", saying "Here's the link, gapps, and donation link" that's not 'pay to use' that's free to use with an option to donate.
And my finally, for somebody who claims liquid is this big bad terrible thieving team, i see no evidence of it, and i highly doubt there is any because its not true. You made some pretty big claims with nothing to back it up except "a little birdy told me" okay well a little birdy also told me that i could fly if i jumped off a bridge, but we both know that's not true Anyways i'm done <3
***I am in no way affiliated with team liquid, and do not represent them in any way, i'm simply chiming in my opinion***
<3 NeverEndingXsin​

Steve Kondik Leaves Cyanogen - CM to Reorangize?

Things have been interesting for Cyanogen at best lately, but it things maybe get even more interesting for Cyanogenmod soon:
[Updated] Steve Kondik blames Kirt McMaster for Cyanogen Inc's failure, CyanogenMod to reorganize and regroup (Android Police Link)
Some of the article above, I'm sure is Steve, venting, but below is a quote from the article above:
A big part of "next" is CM. It costs a lot of money to keep the servers running at this scale, and I figure we have about two months to GTFO. There are also IP issues. And the haters are getting to be too much to handle. On the other hand, it's been a huge part of my life for 8 years now and I don't want to let go of it.
A few questions for the community first..
1. Should we keep going? Is it worth it? I'm sure I can crowdfund the project, especially if we did something like "Darkside" and really revitalized it. I'm not sure of the endgame yet, though.
2. The main IP is the brand and trademarks. I don't know if I can get it back without a fight, and I'm tired of fighting. We will likely need to fork and rebrand, which might not be a bad thing. Would you support it?
3. If we reboot, what should we do differently?
4. The rest of the ROM community seems to be highly dependent on us, but simultaneously wants us dead. How on earth do you fix this?
5. WWJBQD?
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It is an interesting read.

Meh. CM's been dead to me for quite a while anyways, but hope everything gets figured out
Sent from my Nexus 5X using Tapatalk

Is it me or am I the only one that is surprised by the fact that this is not front-paged on this site?
For most custom ROM "normies" who don't use anything other than Cyanogen(Mod), this is pretty major news.

aha360 said:
Is it me or am I the only one that is surprised by the fact that this is not front-paged on this site?
For most custom ROM "normies" who don't use anything other than Cyanogen(Mod), this is pretty major news.
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Before I posted this I looked all over for some sort of coverage on this, as I figured there would be something. I can't believe there is still nothing. I realize there has always been drama at Cyanogen, but this is starting to look like it might actually affect Cyanogenmod.

OhioYJ said:
Before I posted this I looked all over for some sort of coverage on this, as I figured there would be something. I can't believe there is still nothing. I realize there has always been drama at Cyanogen, but this is starting to look like it might actually affect Cyanogenmod.
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I'm actually thinking the same thing, now that Steve Kondik has left the sinking ship.
People can say what they want about Cyanogen(Mod) all they want, and all the bad things said about them would be accurate, but sadly, this might be a major, perhaps negative, change for the Android enthusiast/hobbyist scene.

And on Slashdot today....:
All Cyanogen Services Are Shutting Down
From that link:
A very brief post on Cyanogen's blog says it all really: "As part of the ongoing consolidation of Cyanogen, all services and Cyanogen-supported nightly builds will be discontinued no later than 12/31/16. The open source project and source code will remain available for anyone who wants to build CyanogenMod personally.
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