I sorta want an answer from anyone who knows about Android architecture... elixir is an app that reports different specs in real time. I.e: cpu temp or ram usage. (For those that didn't know). I showed a friend and he says this stuff is kinda fishy since it can only focus on one core at a time, is it giving false info on dual core phones? How does it obtain info on the CPU temp too? I don't know what to do since I like using it and he just told me its a piece of crap...
Well without seeing the apps code, you can't really tell how the app works.
I also don't understand what your friend means by "it can only focus on one core at a time". What does that have to do with reading out ram usage or temperatures?
The cpu temperature is somtimes not the real cpu temp, but the battery temp. Not all devices have temperature sensors on/in the cpu.
haha the elixir is samsung galaxy SII the battery life is very very good thanks samsung ^^
Dual core phones have two threads of data that they churn out and apparently its impossible for the app to read both simultaneously.
shadowskorch said:
Dual core phones have two threads of data that they churn out and apparently its impossible for the app to read both simultaneously.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Cpu Usage and Ram is probably read from files like '/proc/stat'.
I'm still confused about what your problem is with dual core devices.
Related
Hi,
Does anyone know if there will be any perceivable difference in battery life between the latest batch of smartphones based on single core 45nm SoCs and the new 45 nm dual core versions.
All manufacturers state state improved performance AND lower power consumption with the dual cores, but I am wondering how this will affect my day-to-day battery life. I actually read somewhere that e.g. Tegra 2 phones may drain the battery quicker instead of saving power.
I was planning to buy the Desire Z or Galaxy S, but I may also wait for their upgrades if this will mean better battery life. I am not too eager about the performance improvements as I am not a gamer and will likely not feel the benefits (I mostly browse 3G or WiFi/use GPS/occasionally may play a movie + a couple of calls a day).
I'm expecting the battery life to be a bit low seeing that they have a "lot" of things in them.... I reckon it maybe the same as current smartphones?
Apparently battery times will be better, let´s see...
what i have learned that dual cores will save energy. (well atleast tegra 2) that soc has sth like 7 different cores if i remember right, each and every one of them made for a specific purpose (audio play/ video encode/ decode/ gpu....a nd other things i dont remember) so the soc it self will use only what YOU need at that very moment, lets say ur watching a vid, so only the video decode core will work whereas other should be in standby or sth.
(imo battery life should increase cuz of this, not sure how much tho)
and excuse me if my knoweledge isnt exatcly correct on this matter
There are two train of thoughts here:
1) as the die gets smaller (65nm[1st gen snaps] to 45nm[2nd gen snaps] to 40nm [tegra2] to 28nm[3rd gen snaps], etc), the processor tends to draw less energy. So yes, most dual cores (having a smaller die) SHOULD be more energy efficient.
2) With dual core, executions get carried out a lot faster than they were on single core. As evident by the benchmark done on dual cores (+2000 and up), it'll take less time to start/process a program and UI, in theory, should be a lot faster and smoother (that is if manufacturers don't start ****ing around with a UI and make it sluggish). Being that it's faster and a lot more versatile than single core, people will tend to youtube a lot, play games a lot, and generally use a lot more multimedia applications. Being that we don't have a self-sustaining energy source that isn't radioactive, the battery will drain from excessive use.
So at the end of the day, it depends on your use. Yes, dual cores are more energy efficient than single core, but in the hands of a 15yo teenage girl with more life than paris hilton, they probably get the same battery life as any other phone out there.
Hi guys,
thanks for the comments and predictions. My prediction would be that there would be hardly any noticeable change between the single & dual core 45 nm chips (given same usage of course), similar to how there was almost no change when switching from 65nm to 45nm chips - which are more energy efficient as well.
the better energy efficiency seems to be quickly soaked up by more power hungry hardware and software. so it all boils down to whether one needs the better performance as the battery life will likely stay the same.
But this of course is only a prediction based on past observation. I hope I am wrong and I am still considering if it is worth waiting for the dual core devices to hit the market. In the meantime if anyone has had a chance to play with such a device (tablet?), any additional info will be welcome
So I bought the application
CPU usage and Frequency Monitor (dual core support)
It's on the market, and you can find its thread here at xda:
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=1160319
The dev says there a limitation for the Sensation, but I bought it anyway:
****** NOTE ******
HTC Sensation Owners
There is a device limitation with reading the CPU Frequency. I am looking into a workaround for this problem.
****** NOTE ******
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I asked the question in the dev thread, hopping for a fast answer,but want to ask here too:
Can we trust the CPU usage, individual for each core, that is displayed by the app????
This app displays, at the top of the screen, in the notification bar, what core is used, with one column for each core
So with our asynchrone dual core, one of the column is often empty, when the other can be half full, or full, in normal use, this seem to be OK (even if the used freq for each core is not read, as the dev says, but is the usage correctly read??)
But I noticed the second column, so second core, very often starts filling too!
I used to think Android 2.3 is not supposed to handle dual core, so that almost all the time, only one is used????
That was for me, and for what I've read, the big reason why we have really bad scores on every benchmark?
If CPU monitor is right, I can see the second core easily waking up when the first one is already full, sometimes just a little, sometimes 50%, sometimes 100%
INCLUDING DURING BENCHMARKS where CPU monitors displays both cores running at 100%!!!!
So what is true here? Is CPU monitor fooled by Android 2.3 and shows the second core waking up when it's not?
Or does indeed our second core easily wake up, including in benchmarks, meaning our pittyful scores will never be greatly improved since both cores already release their power??
Need more infos on these asynchrone dual core, the way they work and are supported by Android 2.3, what HTC did to implement this, etc
Not a single answer from a dev of someone with more knowledge than me concerning dual core architecture and the way Android can handle it?
I had an answer from the dev of CPU usage monitor:
The CPU usage information is abstracted in both cases at the App level. Apps just need to read the standard CPU usage information at the OS level to gather its data. Control of when and how the dual core magic works is not a worry at the app level since the OS handles it. Hope this helps.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
So...........
=> In normal use, the app shows one core only running, very low if no app running, sometimes when the first one is full, the second one starts working a little after the first one is full, 10%, 25%, etc, for apps requiring a little more power, everything seems very logical for an asynchrone dual core CPU (wasn't I told that Android 2.3 doesn't really manage async dual core???? When we overclock, don't we overclock only one core?)
But when doing a Benchmark, or playing heavy openGL games, the app displays that both core run at 100%, CPU at its max power for both cores!
So if it is, even with a better rom once S-OFF or better drivers, our bench scores will always be very low
I need this to be confirmed or not, if we already have both cores running at 100% during bench or openGL games, we can't expect much more from our Sensation :-(
I'd be interested to understand this also.
I appears that the Gingerbread doesn't support Dual-Cores properly.
Have a look at: http://groups.google.com/group/android-platform/browse_thread/thread/b754408b9af17e55?pli=1
I guess we need an upgraded Kernel and associated libraries. I must admit I was surprised when I started looking.
I do not understand why people make a big deal about the benchmarks for. I mean does it really prove anything? For example the HTC sensation is rocking a. 1.2 processor and the atrix only a 1 but yet the atrix will smash the sensation on a benchnark. How, so I guess I'm just wondering
A. What does a benchmark prove?
B. Shouldn't a 1.2GHZ processor be faster than a 1GHZ
I mean the atrix opens apps and scrolls faster than the sensation. How could this be and are processors just a joke?
It does not prove anything.
The most common use of benchmarks is e-penis comparison.
It can be an indicator for somewhat improvements, but that is all quite relative and subjectiv.
Then what would show processor quality?
How good a processor is should be determined by its processing power, its heat production, size and power consumption.
There is no app for that.
For testing raw processing power and getting some numbers LINPACK is okay.
Dark3n said:
How good a processor is should be determined by its processing power, its heat production, size and power consumption.
There is no app for that.
For testing raw processing power and getting some numbers LINPACK is okay.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
so 1.2 dual core or in my case 1.56 would'nt necessarily be faster at opening apps and loading pages than say a 1ghz? or is it that is has more stamina? so to speak
I am basically trying to get the answers i know people have questions to. especially more so now than ever since the development of dual core. also now that custom ROMS such as revolution HD are claiming faster processing speeds but yet there isn't an indefinite way to prove such claims. so far it seems to be up to the user and opinion.
rddocke said:
so 1.2 dual core or in my case 1.56 would'nt necessarily be faster at opening apps and loading pages than say a 1ghz? or is it that is has more stamina? so to speak
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
App opening speak is not only determined by CPU clock speed.
Cpu caches, memory, system buses.
Its a whole bunch of things that determine the "speed" of a device.
In my point of view android has not been fully optimized for dual core processing, and I expect to see an improvement with icecream or what ever comes after that. Also the processors build quality, reliability and productivity is very important. As for now its just a leech sucking on the battery.
DroidFreek said:
In my point of view android has not been fully optimized for dual core processing, and I expect to see an improvement with icecream or what ever comes after that. Also the processors build quality, reliability and productivity is very important. As for now its just a leech sucking on the battery.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Exactly what I was thinking. Long term effects are what count. Consistency is the most important it goes hand in hand with battery life.. stamina stamina stamina
recently i have bought yu yureka bu micromax
- 1.5.GHz Snapdragon 615 MSM8939 Octa Core Processor / Adreno 405 GPU @ 550 MHz
- 2 GB RAM
- 5.5 Inch HD IPS Touchscreen Display
- Dual SIM Support
- 13MP Primary Camera With LED Flash
- 5 MP Front Camera
- 4G LTE
- 2500 MAh Battery.
- Customizable Cyanogen 11 OS
the phone been heating alot.. the CPU temperature is normally 45C and it raises as we use.. when gaming it goes between 60-65 C and when i run benchmark tools or play heavy games over an hour the temperature goes above 70C the top i observed is 77C..
isnt a processor supposed to shut off at 70C? as for safety reasons till it cools down?? how much this snapdragon 615 processor can get the most? will it burn or burn other internals?? please some1 clarify my doubts! i even noticed many people are facing the same kind of issues with samsung and moto phones which runs on octa core processors.. is it a hardware related issue or a software issue???
arulprabin said:
recently i have bought yu yureka bu micromax
- 1.5.GHz Snapdragon 615 MSM8939 Octa Core Processor / Adreno 405 GPU @ 550 MHz
- 2 GB RAM
- 5.5 Inch HD IPS Touchscreen Display
- Dual SIM Support
- 13MP Primary Camera With LED Flash
- 5 MP Front Camera
- 4G LTE
- 2500 MAh Battery.
- Customizable Cyanogen 11 OS
the phone been heating alot.. the CPU temperature is normally 45C and it raises as we use.. when gaming it goes between 60-65 C and when i run benchmark tools or play heavy games over an hour the temperature goes above 70C the top i observed is 77C..
isnt a processor supposed to shut off at 70C? as for safety reasons till it cools down?? how much this snapdragon 615 processor can get the most? will it burn or burn other internals?? please some1 clarify my doubts! i even noticed many people are facing the same kind of issues with samsung and moto phones which runs on octa core processors.. is it a hardware related issue or a software issue???
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
No It will not burn any material. It is not the PC Processor, but it seems that your device heats a lot, may be it is a manufacturing defect. Try asking others with the same phone. And don't overheat your phone, dont play games for hours and hours
Hit thanks if helped
Sushant Rohan said:
No It will not burn any material. It is not the PC Processor, but it seems that your device heats a lot, may be it is a manufacturing defect. Try asking others with the same phone. And don't overheat your phone, dont play games for hours and hours
Hit thanks if helped
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
i dont play games that long.. with this device its hard to play for more than an hour.. 90% of the ppl having this device facing the same issue but most of them seems to be not caring.. some even said the snapdragon615 can withstand up to 100C is that true??
the customer care ppl said...
We have identified the issues with device.It is essentially a compatibility issue with Cyanogen. Our Tech team is working on the issue.
I would request you to please give us 2-3 working days to close this issues.
We sincerely apologise for the inconvenience caused to you. We are working closely with the tech team to get a resolution for this asap.
arulprabin said:
i dont play games that long.. with this device its hard to play for more than an hour.. 90% of the ppl having this device facing the same issue but most of them seems to be not caring.. some even said the snapdragon615 can withstand up to 100C is that true??
the customer care ppl said...
We have identified the issues with device.It is essentially a compatibility issue with Cyanogen. Our Tech team is working on the issue.
I would request you to please give us 2-3 working days to close this issues.
We sincerely apologise for the inconvenience caused to you. We are working closely with the tech team to get a resolution for this asap.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I can't find any temperature values on the qualcomm website. Just write a email to qualcomm for first hand iformations Phone's kernel works with thermal throttling, means depending on the actual cpu temperature the cpu clock is lowered to protect the cpu from overheating. If your hardware works as it should, you can't overheat actual processors by using I suppose. If you can find a custom kernel you probably can set own values for thermal throttling. In any case you should try a kernel tool e.g. Trickster Mod or Performance Control for setting up the cpu. If you think its getting too hot, just deactivate some cores or lower the cpu clock, your phone will still be fast enough for all your applications.
Edit: which customer care people told you about the issue?
arulprabin said:
i dont play games that long.. with this device its hard to play for more than an hour.. 90% of the ppl having this device facing the same issue but most of them seems to be not caring.. some even said the snapdragon615 can withstand up to 100C is that true??
the customer care ppl said...
We have identified the issues with device.It is essentially a compatibility issue with Cyanogen. Our Tech team is working on the issue.
I would request you to please give us 2-3 working days to close this issues.
We sincerely apologise for the inconvenience caused to you. We are working closely with the tech team to get a resolution for this asap.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
LS.xD said:
I can't find any temperature values on the qualcomm website. Just write a email to qualcomm for first hand iformations Phone's kernel works with thermal throttling, means depending on the actual cpu temperature the cpu clock is lowered to protect the cpu from overheating. If your hardware works as it should, you can't overheat actual processors by using I suppose. If you can find a custom kernel you probably can set own values for thermal throttling. In any case you should try a kernel tool e.g. Trickster Mod or Performance Control for setting up the cpu. If you think its getting too hot, just deactivate some cores or lower the cpu clock, your phone will still be fast enough for all your applications.
Edit: which customer care people told you about the issue?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
im unable to find the direct mailid of qualcomm.. can u give me plz..
its the yu customer care for the phone.. they never attend my calls so i mailed after 3 failures today they replied
arulprabin said:
im unable to find the direct mailid of qualcomm.. can u give me plz..
its the yu customer care for the phone.. they never attend my calls so i mailed after 3 failures today they replied
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Qualcomm website is not reachable for me at the moment
thanks.. i'll try other sources
arulprabin said:
recently i have bought yu yureka bu micromax
- 1.5.GHz Snapdragon 615 MSM8939 Octa Core Processor / Adreno 405 GPU @ 550 MHz
- 2 GB RAM
- 5.5 Inch HD IPS Touchscreen Display
- Dual SIM Support
- 13MP Primary Camera With LED Flash
- 5 MP Front Camera
- 4G LTE
- 2500 MAh Battery.
- Customizable Cyanogen 11 OS
the phone been heating alot.. the CPU temperature is normally 45C and it raises as we use.. when gaming it goes between 60-65 C and when i run benchmark tools or play heavy games over an hour the temperature goes above 70C the top i observed is 77C..
isnt a processor supposed to shut off at 70C? as for safety reasons till it cools down?? how much this snapdragon 615 processor can get the most? will it burn or burn other internals?? please some1 clarify my doubts! i even noticed many people are facing the same kind of issues with samsung and moto phones which runs on octa core processors.. is it a hardware related issue or a software issue???
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
70-80 Degrees isn't a "Worry" Moment, It's actually quite normal for a Octa core to reach that high what do you expect? Since a phone doesn't have a Fan or something like a PC, so it relies on something else which needs longer time to cooldown.
My Nexus 5 using Quad Core reaches almost the same Value (65-70).
Remove the case if you have one since a case will have your phone increase in temperature too.
thanks.. i already hve done it.. i bought a flip cover which i used only for an hour... i worry only when it exceeds 70C.. i can feel the heat near the cam.. it gewts hard even to hold it. i heard meadiatek processors doesnt heat only qualcomm processors does. is it true??
is there any other phone with the same kinda heating issue? like over 70C still survive??
arulprabin said:
im unable to find the direct mailid of qualcomm.. can u give me plz..
its the yu customer care for the phone.. they never attend my calls so i mailed after 3 failures today they replied
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
LS.xD said:
Qualcomm website is not reachable for me at the moment
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
(858) 587-1121
They've got no email addresses only office locations https://www.qualcomm.com/company/facilities/offices
then i guess only the experianced/developers in this forums can help me.. all i wanna know that if its safe to have such high temperatures ( 65 when gaming and 75+ when running benchmarking-stress test) is it ok with this qualcomm anapdragon 615 processor... some said these processors can withstand upto 100c and 90c is the cutoff temprature unlike the old processors.. can some expert who is experianced with developing any apps for any quad/octa core processor out there please help me. i just want this much info only
So there are lot of questions about people asking if this heats up or not mostly by people who want to buy this phone nywas there answer is "YES" it heats but its like only the tip of the iceberg i have used lot of mid range and some high end phones before and believe me every phone heats now and then depends on the tasks you perform so is this with this phone but main reason this phone heats up are
1. Snapdragon 615 the 8 core processor is a beast in snapdragon 600 series but with great power comes great responsibility running 8 cores simply means a lot of work so yes if ur playing a game or something that actually uses 8 cores the phone will heat up more compared to a 4 core processor(do the math).
2.Compact motherboard you have to understand that the phone is remarkably slim and compact.
The above are the two main reasons due to which this phone might be getting a little warm. But that doesnt mean this is only phone in the world that heats up the above mentioned are only reasons for this phone
My experience with the phone..
Yes it get got hot during games but believe me it didnt surprise me because the other phones i have used got hot too. And when i say hot i dont mean hot as in a freshly baked cake hot but you can tell its hot (kinda hot)
Edit
1 2
Nd have a nice day
1st point is BS
ruffain said:
So there are lot of questions about people asking if this heats up or not mostly by people who want to buy this phone nywas there answer is "YES" it heats but its like only the tip of the iceberg i have used lot of mid range and some high end phones before and believe me every phone heats now and then depends on the tasks you perform so is this with this phone but main reason this phone heats up are
1. Snapdragon 615 the 8 core processor is a beast in snapdragon 600 series but with great power comes great responsibility running 8 cores simply means a lot of work so yes if ur playing a game or something that actually uses 8 cores the phone will heat up more compared to a 4 core processor(do the math).
2.Compact motherboard you have to understand that the phone is remarkably slim and compact.
The above are the two main reasons due to which this phone might be getting a little warm. But that doesnt mean this is only phone in the world that heats up the above mentioned are only reasons for this phone
My experience with the phone..
Yes it get got hot during games but believe me it didnt surprise me because the other phones i have used got hot too. And when i say hot i dont mean hot as in a freshly baked cake hot but you can tell its hot (kinda hot)
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
FYI its not a true octa core phone which means that all the 8 cores never simultaneously work together. The processor is a combination of 4 low power cores for balanced performance and four high power cores for gaming and intensive tasks. They switch as and when required. So your "math" is complete bull ****. However everything else is sane and meaningful. It will be a pity if you bought the phone thinking that the 8 cores work together considering the fact that there exists true Octa core phones in which all the 8 cores really work together.
ruffain said:
So there are lot of questions about people asking if this heats up or not mostly by people who want to buy this phone nywas there answer is "YES" it heats but its like only the tip of the iceberg i have used lot of mid range and some high end phones before and believe me every phone heats now and then depends on the tasks you perform so is this with this phone but main reason this phone heats up are
1. Snapdragon 615 the 8 core processor is a beast in snapdragon 600 series but with great power comes great responsibility running 8 cores simply means a lot of work so yes if ur playing a game or something that actually uses 8 cores the phone will heat up more compared to a 4 core processor(do the math).
2.Compact motherboard you have to understand that the phone is remarkably slim and compact.
The above are the two main reasons due to which this phone might be getting a little warm. But that doesnt mean this is only phone in the world that heats up the above mentioned are only reasons for this phone
My experience with the phone..
Yes it get got hot during games but believe me it didnt surprise me because the other phones i have used got hot too. And when i say hot i dont mean hot as in a freshly baked cake hot but you can tell its hot (kinda hot)
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
So you just mean to say that all other phones with this processor heats so that gives Xiaomi a lame excuse for heating.
If they are aware of the extreme heating problems of the processor, why to launch such a lowly device in the first place.
One should not blame and compare other devices just because you are incapable of producing a good phone.
Shameful act by Xiaomi.
raviprakashji said:
So you just mean to say that all other phones with this processor heats so that gives Xiaomi a lame excuse for heating.
If they are aware of the extreme heating problems of the processor, why to launch such a lowly device in the first place.
One should not blame and compare other devices just because you are incapable of producing a good phone.
Shameful act by Xiaomi.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
No it means dont buy a phone with this processor if ur a power user coz this processors known issues are heating up
shubhstiws said:
FYI its not a true octa core phone which means that all the 8 cores never simultaneously work together. The processor is a combination of 4 low power cores for balanced performance and four high power cores for gaming and intensive tasks. They switch as and when required. So your "math" is complete bull ****. However everything else is sane and meaningful. It will be a pity if you bought the phone thinking that the 8 cores work together considering the fact that there exists true Octa core phones in which all the 8 cores really work together.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Hey man i guess u didnt read till the end i never said all cores work lol i know how it works i also know no app uses 8 core for real (threading and all) anywas i wrote" if they actually work" i guess u didnt read that part.
shubhstiws said:
its not a true octa core phone which means that all the 8 cores never simultaneously work together
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
All 8 cores can be active at the same time. Please check your facts before posting.
Source: 1, 2, 3
my bad :|
stivinnaura said:
All 8 cores can be active at the same time. Please check your facts before posting.
Source: 1, 2, 3
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You are absolutely right, it is established that all 8 cores can be used together, however I am still researching on the fact that how much do we gain on performance by using both the low and high performance cores together (at least for benchmarks and tests). The tools which I am using for benchmarks have a lower resolution rate than the amount of time a core reports to complete a thread and thus the delay.
However apologies for the wrong info, thanks for noticing and correcting.
---------- Post added at 04:08 PM ---------- Previous post was at 04:07 PM ----------
ruffain said:
Hey man i guess u didnt read till the end i never said all cores work lol i know how it works i also know no app uses 8 core for real (threading and all) anywas i wrote" if they actually work" i guess u didnt read that part.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Read my reply to stivinnaura
lol sorted
stivinnaura said:
All 8 cores can be active at the same time. Please check your facts before posting.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
current firmware (V 6.5.5) has options for change max.freq. for cores ?
Or only switch between "high perf." and "balanced" modes ?
No manual frequency modes as of yet. Just the in-built PERFORMANCE & INTERACTIVE governor modes. I guess we are all waiting for root.
- Hit Thanks :thumbup: if you found it useful!
- Sent from my Mi 4i