Related
I'm the lead developer of a space MMO called Vendetta Online. We announced a port to Tegra/Android back in June (see vendetta-online.com/android), and we're looking at doing an "open beta" test-release of the port in the near future (as a directly-distributed APK). Our game port has been entirely developed and tested on Tegra tablets and devkits over the past year. The Viewsonic G is one of the few released Tegra tablets, so I'm posting as a general heads-up and to gauge interest. The game trailer is on our front page, and while the Tegra detail level is dialed down a bit from the PC (on which the trailer was shot), it's actually pretty close.. and impressive on a little tablet (in my opinion, however biased ).
At the same time, I have to express some caution. We've had Malata prototype devices for a long time (on which the G is supposedly based), and there may still be some OpenGL ES driver issues present in the Viewsonic OS image (hopefully improved in the Dec 24th update? Unsure). One historical problem caused the game framerate to be drastically reduced.. let's hope this has been resolved.
I'm also not sure how many touch points the G supports. Our Z-Pad only does two, which is.. not really enough (we use two to fly and then an additional one to shoot occasionally, although you can opt for accelerometer flight). The Toshiba Folio 100 does four multi-touches, which works far better. The latency of the touch-response is also a factor, and entirely device-dependent. I've only used a G briefly, and don't really remember what the response was like. FYI.
Lastly, you should all be aware that we're a pay-to-play MMORPG, and I'm not going to be issuing free accounts to testers (that would make things a lot more logistically complex than I'm prepared to deal with right now). We do have a free trial, and if you make friends with an existing subscriber they can also give you a "friend key" that lasts a few weeks. I'm expecting most people to just tinker using the free trial.
Honestly, this "open beta" is more for non-Tegra devices than for released Tegra products.. we're widely tested on Tegra (both released and un-released devices), and we have a pretty good idea of what issues are out there in some of the OS images. But we have no clue about Galaxy Tabs, Snapdragon tablets or other things in the wild. That all being said, I thought it would be cool to include people from here, and potentially give you something that really shows the capabilities of the Tegra. Early Tegra adopters are pretty starved for content, from where I sit (we have many devices, and little to run on them). Plus, getting more people playing with the tablet version and providing usability feedback is helpful, and XDA-developers is definitely a more technically savvy crowd.
If you'd like to be involved, I'd recommend following our Twitter, Facebook or RSS feeds on vendetta-online.com, or just checking our Android forum regularly. There's no formal process to this testing, no extensive secrecy or signups (beyond making a normal account, and the usual game EULA); we're a single-universe game, so for us this is just "another port" to our existing, live MMO. All accounts can be used across all platforms (currently Mac/Windows/Linux32/Linux64). Our kind of testing is to make the APK available and then listen to what people have to say.
Humm.. we're looking at adding voice-chat support on Android as well, sometime soon. It looks like the G has no mic, but maybe it would work with a bluetooth headset.. no clue really.
I'll try to check back and answer questions if I can, but I'm going to be spending most of my time on getting the Android build ready for a test-release. I'll at least post to this thread when we make the build public.
Happy Holidays everyone.
g tab does have a mic, voice record app works great...see your learning the g tab already!
Sent from my VEGAn-TAB-v1.0.0b3 using Tapatalk
Count me in! Where can I get the APK ?
Sent from my GTablet-TnT-Lite using Tapatalk
INCARNATE
I noticed market web says android 3.0 only.
Can you pls confirm? Gtab currently does not have a 3.0 port.
~BAM~ said:
INCARNATE
I noticed market web says android 3.0 only.
Can you pls confirm? Gtab currently does not have a 3.0 port.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
It does say 3.0 but also mentions phones, so the text is a bit confusing as written.
If it will run on our current Froyo Gtabs, count me in for testing it out.
I would definitley be interested, and i can test on a tegra 2 and a snapdragon powered device
Sounds good I'll test. Where do we get the apk?
I'll help test, too, if you like.
Sent from my SCH-I500 using XDA App
Vendetta testing
I would test it for sure!
Ive been checking tegra zone on my g tab daily for a release. Unfortunatly i cant download vendetta online from my g tab. I woukd gladly pay a dollar to check it out but cant.
Im really looking forward to checking it out.
Looks like we won't be playing Vendetta until a update comes our way.
From their website...
Vendetta Online for Android released!
Vendetta Online has been released in the Android Market! The game may be installed on any NVIDIA Tegra-based tablet with a 7-inch screen (or larger), running Android Honeycomb (3.0). This includes the recently-released Motorola Xoom.
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Click to collapse
More at http://www.vendetta-online.com/h/news.html
I am pretty sure anyone running android 2.3 on their g tab can download and play this game. I tried out a 2.3 rom last night and all the tegra games showed up in the market when they would not on 2.2. I am back on 2.2 now and they wont show up.
I could flash to 2.3 and grab it off the market but the 2.3 rom I have is experimental and if I reboot it stops working. If I could get the instal files off and onto my sd card maybe I could run it when I flash back to 2.2
Someone in the comments on tegra zone said that Vendetta Online runs great on the G-Tab.
No one answered the developers ? About how many touch points we have...I know we have two, but we need more than two. Does anyone know how many touch points we have?
Sent from my VEGAn-TAB-v1.0.0B5.1 using Tapatalk
i am definately interested in testing it out. Gtab ready to go!
More Devs need to start supporting Bluetooth input devices like wii mote. Tablets don't have buttons and I don't care how strong you are, holding your tab out for gsensor control kills your arms after 20 min. Devs need to jump behind this player adopted input method and offer support within the games. Just a thought.
Online space mmo huh? I will buy in. Hope its like a 3D version of Escape Velocity by Ambrosia software.
Sent from my Chromatic Magic using XDA Premium App
I have Samuari 2 running, backbreaker football running, and monster madness running on 4.2.5 TNT lite with no probs. I am worried if i go to 5.0, or GB, i might have trouble playing them! I would give it a shot on this game too, but i need access to a apk!
Advent Vega
Hi I have an Andvent Vega tegra 2 2.2 tablet.
Don't know if you have anyone testing on this hardware, but I'll volunteer if you need one
Thanks
Rich
I actually spoke with Incarnate at CTIA Wireless this week and he mentioned the G Tab and support for it. The issue they ran into with allowing it in the market is that it required a certain piece of code that certain OS's don't recognize and thus can't see (I think there were other issues, but I can't recall). He said they're planning to get it working on GB soon, but that unless the G Tab has more than 2 touch points its useless. The game looked pretty good considering its a tablet He was also kinda disappointed on the lack of interest on here Speak up or you won't get Vendetta!
Multitouch problem already has a solution. Key mapping game controls so people can use USB or Bluetooth input devices.
I have been waiting since first post to get some play time with this title but how excited can someone get without screen shots and an apk. Even just a link to a movie of it in action would be nice. OP needs to update original post with screens and game issues so far so the community can give more feedback.
Sent from my Chromatic Magic using XDA Premium App
I'm interested in trying it if we can get a working version.
Is gTab capable playing 1920x1080 H.264 video?
Which player should I download?
thanks!
I've been pretty happy with mVideoPlayer. It's supposed to play .mkv's but I honestly haven't tried it. But it's played everything I've thrown at it and I like how it can download the posters for your movies and tv episodes.
https://market.android.com/details?id=afzkl.development.mVideoPlayer
A lot of people seem to like MoboPlayer. I see that it's been recently updated and the changelog says something about Tegra2. I might have to try it.
https://market.android.com/details?id=com.clov4r.android.nil&feature=top-free
I just noticed your signature saying that you use CM7. Supposedly CM7's hardware accelerated video playback isn't quite ready for primetime yet. You might have problems playing that HD video.
xanadu1979 said:
I just noticed your signature saying that you use CM7. Supposedly CM7's hardware accelerated video playback isn't quite ready for primetime yet. You might have problems playing that HD video.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yeah, just found out it's not working.
Any of these player can play AVCHD (file extension m2t, mts, m2ts, etc)?
Thanks!
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=881835
If above is true, then a conversion is required. This is unexpected when I read all the raves about the hardware specs.
xanadu1979 said:
I just noticed your signature saying that you use CM7. Supposedly CM7's hardware accelerated video playback isn't quite ready for primetime yet. You might have problems playing that HD video.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
What roms support HD accell?
I am also running CM7 and find the video playback wonky and was wanting to move to a ROM that supports full HW Acell for now. I assume Vegan 7 doesnt also since its based off cm7? Does HC have any HW acell?
Only the Froyo-based roms have HW acceleration. The Nvidia drivers are only available for Froyo at the moment. Hopefully that changes some time in the future.
Is that only a problem for gTab or other tablets? Thanks!
redhonker said:
Is that only a problem for gTab or other tablets? Thanks!
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Click to collapse
Just the tablets with this specific processor, the Tegra2 Harmony. There are a few out there but not many. The drivers may come out eventually, either officially or unofficially, but it might also never happen either.
There are plenty of Android tablets with newer versions of Android and hardware acceleration. They'll set you back at least $400 though.
xanadu1979 said:
Just the tablets with this specific processor, the Tegra2 Harmony. There are a few out there but not many. The drivers may come out eventually, either officially or unofficially, but it might also never happen either.
There are plenty of Android tablets with newer versions of Android and hardware acceleration. They'll set you back at least $400 though.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yeah I may go with stock 4349 for now because it seems the only ROM (ok not a ROM but u know what I mean) that supports Netflix, Hardware Accel, and Flash.
It seems vegan 5.1.1 doesnt support netflix.
I just got my gTablet last week and after playing around with the stock software, I installed TnT lite 4.4 as well as Cyanogenmod 7. I've settled for now on CM7 for several reasons, but there are a few quirks I'm hoping will get worked out soon.
The most annoying of these quirks is the video issue. From reading I understand that CM7 has some issues with hardware acceleration and the 2.2 Froyo based ROMS should be better in this aspect - but when I used TnT lite 4.4, which was Froyo based it still had the exact same issues, even using the latest rockplayer. Why is it that the stock ROM could run HD videos so well, but not TnT lite 4.4?
My advice to you guys would be to try Brilliant Corners by roebeet. I can't link you to it but Google is your friend.
I'm looking to get my first Android tablet. I've always rooted and run custom firmware on my Android phones, so I need a "cheap" Android tablet with a healthy developer community and a lot of support.
My first thought was to go for the $250 Nook Tablet, spec for spec it's better than the Kindle Fire; but didn't an update come out for it recently that made rooting it near impossible or so highly difficult that it hasn't been done yet?
Then the $200 Kindle Fire came to mind, very popular tablet must mean a very healthy/active hacking/dev community right? But isn't it also locked down in such a way it can't be rooted or modified anymore?
Then I see a $189 Lenovo A1 Tablet at Best Buy with decent specs. It's running Android 2.3 which I'd normally prefer over Android 3.0/Honeycomb but now that ICS/Android 4.0 is out, I'd definately want to run that on my tablet. So is ICS running very good/stable on any sub $300 Android tablet?
I wonder when the $250 Tegra3 based tablet from Asus (or is it Acer...) comes out. Suggestions on which route to go?
My friend has a Kindle Fire, and it's too slow to be called a tablet. It's an E-Reader that can run Apps.
Even the web browser - scrolling and loading pages - is laggy.
Colton127 said:
My friend has a Kindle Fire, and it's too slow to be called a tablet. It's an E-Reader that can run Apps.
Even the web browser - scrolling and loading pages - is laggy.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Does it run any custom firmware? Or is it 100% stock? The first thing I plan to do is run a custom ROM on it. Even if it's to remove the bloatware and put in a few tweaks, at least it'd be better than stock. My Galaxy S II right now runs a custom ROM based on the factory ROM, so it has full hardware support and such but it's got a lot of tweaks put into it and bloatware removed, etc. the end result is it's got better battery life and runs faster/smoother than any stock Galaxy S II ROM. I'm hoping to get ICS/Android 4.0 onto a tablet, as that's the way to go, but if the dev community isn't quite there yet, then I'm hoping for a custom/tweaked out ROM as a tide-me-over.
glitchsys said:
Does it run any custom firmware? Or is it 100% stock? The first thing I plan to do is run a custom ROM on it. Even if it's to remove the bloatware and put in a few tweaks, at least it'd be better than stock. My Galaxy S II right now runs a custom ROM based on the factory ROM, so it has full hardware support and such but it's got a lot of tweaks put into it and bloatware removed, etc. the end result is it's got better battery life and runs faster/smoother than any stock Galaxy S II ROM. I'm hoping to get ICS/Android 4.0 onto a tablet, as that's the way to go, but if the dev community isn't quite there yet, then I'm hoping for a custom/tweaked out ROM as a tide-me-over.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
He runs stock rooted with Android Market and a custom launcher.
I tested Opera Mobile on it - which uses full hardware acceleration. It was the smoothest browser I tested on the device, but it was still jittery and lagged while scrolling. The GPU and CPU are obviously not that great.
Colton127 said:
He runs stock rooted with Android Market and a custom launcher.
I tested Opera Mobile on it - which uses full hardware acceleration. It was the smoothest browser I tested on the device, but it was still jittery and lagged while scrolling. The GPU and CPU are obviously not that great.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Well it is a cheap tablet new, but I thought it was dual core. Kind of disappointing it's sluggish even with HW acceleration. I just checked the Kindle Fire Android Development forum and it looks like they have ICS/Android 4.0 ROM's for it but the 3 main issues are no HW UI Acceleration; 720p and HD video in general; No bluetooth. I don't care too much for Bluetooth and the 720p video thing isn't that important at the moment (I think), but the no HW UI Acceleration could pose a problem, especially if the CPU is as sluggish as you say.
glitchsys said:
Well it is a cheap tablet new, but I thought it was dual core. Kind of disappointing it's sluggish even with HW acceleration. I just checked the Kindle Fire Android Development forum and it looks like they have ICS/Android 4.0 ROM's for it but the 3 main issues are no HW UI Acceleration; 720p and HD video in general; No bluetooth. I don't care too much for Bluetooth and the 720p video thing isn't that important at the moment (I think), but the no HW UI Acceleration could pose a problem, especially if the CPU is as sluggish as you say.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
It is Dual-Core, but it was still laggy when I had tested it. I guess it really bothered me because I was so use to the extremely smooth and fluid iPad 2 & Galaxy S II I own and use day-to-day.
I never tested any custom ROMs, but wish I was able to. It seems to have a lot of popular ROMs and a good developer community.
Please use the Q&A Forum for questions &
Read the Forum Rules Ref Posting
Moving to Q&A
Sorry about that. Thanks for moving this thread/keeping things organized, I really appreciate what you guys do.
Right now I'm leaning toward the HP Touchpad or the Kindle Fire. Seems CM7 is the better option for both devices and good enough as a daily driver; but CM9 is further along on the Fire than it is on the Touchpad.
I'm in about the same situation.
I vastly prefer the 7" form factor, although I could probably be persuaded to a 10" for the same price range...
Currently, I'm leaning towards the 16G Nook Tablet, mostly because of the RAM advantage it has vs the Kindle Fire.
The fire seems to have a more active dev community, but, once it is rooted & has a working ROM (ICS preferred), isn't that the main thing to be looking for?
However, I am not set on any specific tablet, and am very open to suggestions...
I'm still rocking the original Nook Color. Runs CM7 like a champ, and CM9 builds are showing great progress.
For a thread revival, I figured I would state my final decision & reasons for it, just in case anyone else is looking for similar information...
I ended up going with a Nook Tablet...
I considered the Kindle Fire, but it has 512MB vs the 1G of RAM that the Nook has.
Checking the dev status for the Nook, there is a CM7 running (fairly well, now that I've given it a shot). Once that is 100% (and, in my opinion, it is very nearly there), there really isn't much of a reason to avoid it.
In the day I've had it, I have to say that it has ended up being much better than I was expecting.
check out this tablet
/watch?v=JUhiQZE4_VE&feature=g-u-u&context=G2a75f87FUAAAAAAAHAA
it's a youtube link to a NCIX review on a new tablet seems nice for the price I can't post full link cause I don't have enough posts maybe someone can help me out and post it for me? thanks
EDITED as more information about other platforms were found.
Based on my reading here, it sounds like there are two theories exist currently.
1, ASUS using old kernel
2. Tegra chip issue
However, following information seems to challenge these hypothesis..
According to this http://forum.xda-developers.com/show....php?t=1722799, Iconia A700 has very similar result and also Kernel info shows 2.6.39.4+.
So based on this, I think we can hypothesize couple things:
Hypothesis 1: Kernel is the issue
One flag goes against this is that Nexus 7, which uses the latest kernel did not outperform transformer line by much. So it may boost some, but unlikely to be the sole cause of the problem.
Hypothesis 2: Tegra chipset is the issue
On the andropolice benchmark page, they included HTC One X with Tegra 3 version. It actually outperformed it counterpart and in fact was one of the best I/O benchmark result producing unit excluding Nexus Phone. So it is hard to believe Tegra 3 is the issue.
Hypothesis 3: ASUS is the issue
This well may be true, but when you look at Acer Iconia 700 Tegra 3 HD Screen model, it is as bad or perhaps slightly worse than the Transformer Infinity. So perhaps there is a part of kernel that they share or provided by someone?
Hypothesis 4: Tablet SSD/Flash or other common denominator hardware is the issue
Again this is something based on the Iconia vs. Infinity. Infinity has superior CPU and RAM yet the difference in IO is so subtle. This to me suggest bottleneck lies somewhere else. Such as SSD/Flash drive itself? Though I am not sure if that is major advantage of HTC One over Tablet as you would think smaller drives are tends to be slower and more expensive...
I know we still have not answered anything here, but at least, this result make a step further to suggest underlying issue is NOT unique to infinity but perhaps wider problem across the android tablet. If so, the chance of it getting fixed would either depend on the Google or individual manufactures to put unexpected amount of resource into this...
What do you all think?
HoushaSen said:
Based on my reading here, it sounds like there are two theories exist currently.
1, ASUS using old kernel
2. Tegra chip issue
However, following information seems to challenge these hypothesis..
According to this http://forum.xda-developers.com/show....php?t=1722799, Iconia A700 has very similar result and also Kernel info shows 2.6.39.4+.
So based on this, I think we can hypothesize couple things:
Hypothesis 1: Kernel is the issue
If so, who is actually making this kernel? Is it vendors of tablet or Google? i.e. Samsung doing its own customization which includes the newer Kernel? One thing that does not make sense here (at least to me) is that if you look at http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Android_version_history, the Kernel is based on the version of Android i.e. sounds like NOT dependent on the manufacture. However, clearly the picture above shows Iconia A700, which runs Ice Cream Sandwitch is not running on newer kernel as stated by the Wiki... So I am a bit confused here...
Hypothesis 2: Tablet SSD or other common denominator hardware is the issue
Considering the faster Tegra 3 (not by much but some), and better RAM (DDR3 vs. DDR2) and minimal differece between the two systems, my guess is Tegra 3 chip or memory is not the bottle neck, but rather SSD or other common component is the issue.
I know we still have not answered anything here, but at least, this result make a step further to suggest underlying issue is NOT unique to infinity but perhaps wider problem across the android tablet. If so, the chance of it getting fixed would either depend on the Google or individual manufactures to put unexpected amount of resource into this...
What do you all think?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Kernels are created by the manufacturer, they're what tell the OS about the hardware and how to use it. Google makes the Operating system, not the kernel. Each kernel is different on each device because each device has different hardware.
So I'm thinking it's just a software issue. I haven't really looked into it, but I haven't heard a ton of complaints about I/O issues from One X users. I think this whole issue is just normal Android stuff that people are blowing out of proportions because it may be a little worse on this right now. I know on my Bionic when a lot of I/O operations are happening, it slows down a bit. Especially with restoring Titanium Backup files and moving big files around. I'm thinking with a little help from Asus and/or indy devs this won't be a big issue.
If you use old software, you always miss out on some features. (Office 95 won't open OpenDocument-formatted documents, AFAIK. ) That being said, it is quite common for SSDs to use a number of controllers that is suboptimal for the number of memory units. That might be a problem.
Given that I perceive the TF700 to be quite a bit snappier with the SuperCharger, I think it's quite possible the issue is in fact caused by an interaction of multiple factors: standard Android policies (not being able to clear out finished-and-not-to-be-used-anytime-soon apps, filling RAM to the brim py preference), suboptimal hardware (crippled I/O controller(s)?) and software (kernel issues).
The second component obviously is out of reach in terms of solutions.The first component could be alleviated partly -- this going head-on with the considerations for earlier and less capable Android systems -- by using a task killer, or optimizing the system (SuperCharger), and the third component could be solved by some of the unbelievably able kernel enthusiasts we have in the XDA ecosystem.
I think we might have a case on hand here for arguing that the current versions of Android are not really optimal for these high-end devices. Scaling issues are not that rare: Windows scales like crap to less capable devices, whereas all *nix systems I've worked with ran beautifully on pretty much archaic systems, and the latter don't gain as much when upgrading hardware, in my experience. From a cynical point of view, you might argue that that's because they ran REALLY well initially anyway.
The policies in force for both scenarios are necessarily different. It might be beneficial to change some of them a little bit. If Google does not institute that by its mighty self, we can at the least take matters in our own hands.
KilerG said:
Kernels are created by the manufacturer, they're what tell the OS about the hardware and how to use it. Google makes the Operating system, not the kernel. Each kernel is different on each device because each device has different hardware.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
So I guess Wiki is not correct... They often amazes me how much detail there are and quite frequently right. But I guess not this time as Wiki clearly assigns each Android OS version as based on XXX Linux Kernel. But what you say actual make sense as Kernel is like interface between the OS and underlying hardware so my understanding is Kernel just simply provides set of API that meets the OS demand.
But if this is indeed the case and Kernel is the real conundrum then the chance of it being fixed may be much lower, isn't it? Because fixing kernel or upgrading kernel to newer version probably requires extensive amount of work, which I am not sure any company is willing to do when the machines are already sold.
If it was Google, perhaps they could have indeed updated kernel along with Jellybean, but that's out of picture now except of XDA members.
MartyHulskemper said:
I think we might have a case on hand here for arguing that the current versions of Android are not really optimal for these high-end devices. Scaling issues are not that rare: Windows scales like crap to less capable devices, whereas all *nix systems I've worked with ran beautifully on pretty much archaic systems, and the latter don't gain as much when upgrading hardware, in my experience. From a cynical point of view, you might argue that that's because they ran REALLY well initially anyway.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Interesting argument there. One hope I have here is that if Nexus 7 succeeds, developers are more willing to put apps specific for tablets. yes. they may be 7 inch... but better than 4 or 5 inch scaling to 10.1 inch. Plus Nexus 7 has very similar spec as Transformer Prime, so supporting of such device seem to make ASUS ahead of packs and in fact, (if they decide to do so) they can easily port those knowledge and resources into Transformer line.
But this IO issue may be one reason why iOS avoids true multitasking. I can never download files or load files in a application in background on my iPAD2. It basically freezes the application where left off i.e. not really multitasking. But because of it, most application won't see any issue what other application is running in background (well actually nothing is running in background..but you know what I mean).
So I am not saying, Android should take this approach but perhaps we may have to take that into consideration and appreciate true multitasking in Android. and when the task becomes large (such as IO issue here), we may simply have to understand some tasks are not for multitask friendly...
Mostly interesting questions but when it comes to nvidia and i/o problems lets blame it on the kernel drivers.
Look at around 48 min mark.
www . youtube . com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=MShbP3OpASA
Do you think Asus seriously cares about its customers??
HoushaSen said:
So I guess Wiki is not correct... They often amazes me how much detail there are and quite frequently right. But I guess not this time as Wiki clearly assigns each Android OS version as based on XXX Linux Kernel. But what you say actual make sense as Kernel is like interface between the OS and underlying hardware so my understanding is Kernel just simply provides set of API that meets the OS demand.
But if this is indeed the case and Kernel is the real conundrum then the chance of it being fixed may be much lower, isn't it? Because fixing kernel or upgrading kernel to newer version probably requires extensive amount of work, which I am not sure any company is willing to do when the machines are already sold.
If it was Google, perhaps they could have indeed updated kernel along with Jellybean, but that's out of picture now except of XDA members.
Interesting argument there. One hope I have here is that if Nexus 7 succeeds, developers are more willing to put apps specific for tablets. yes. they may be 7 inch... but better than 4 or 5 inch scaling to 10.1 inch. Plus Nexus 7 has very similar spec as Transformer Prime, so supporting of such device seem to make ASUS ahead of packs and in fact, (if they decide to do so) they can easily port those knowledge and resources into Transformer line.
But this IO issue may be one reason why iOS avoids true multitasking. I can never download files or load files in a application in background on my iPAD2. It basically freezes the application where left off i.e. not really multitasking. But because of it, most application won't see any issue what other application is running in background (well actually nothing is running in background..but you know what I mean).
So I am not saying, Android should take this approach but perhaps we may have to take that into consideration and appreciate true multitasking in Android. and when the task becomes large (such as IO issue here), we may simply have to understand some tasks are not for multitask friendly...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I hope (and actually expect) that JB will fix a lot of these issues, as it seems to tweak lot of elements that might be in the way of Android really deploying on capable hardware. As far as the Nexus 7 goes, it probably is a really nice device, but I am too much infatuated with the HD screen and the battery/keyboard/dock I currently have to even consider going over.
And yes, maybe we just have to accept that, for the time being, real mobile multitasking (i.e., relatively limitless) may be out of reach. According to your experience with the iPad2, it may show that Apple actually did some real-life testing and came to the same conclusion. That may have been the reason for the much criticised decision to not support multitasking.
Someone mentioned on our Infinity fora here that all the flash memory used in today's tablet is the same chip, so it's not somebody in ASUS or Acer didn't want to spend an extra 10$ per device, it must be something else.
I'm still wondering why I get ca. 10MB/s write and ca. 20MB/s read on internal storage and the other way around with (micro)SD or USB storage.
I think all of us are waiting for JB right now.
Its definitely a kernel issue. If you look in the Prime forum, there's a lot of people raving about the IO performance of Motley's kernel. In the TF300 forum, there's been some mention that CM9 improves the browser performance Once we get a bootloader unlock I'd be shocked if we didnt get a better kernel, if Asus hasn't fixed it already by then.
The old kernel is caused by NVidia because in every Tegra 3 device the kernel is the same: 2.6.... Nexus 7 seems to have 3.1 kernel and hopefully all Tegra 3 devices which get JB will get updated kernel. Old kernel isn't Asus' fault. It is NVidia's fault. Google built ICS with 3.0 kernel and that is why almost all other devices except Tegra 3 devices have Linux kernel version 3.0.
attelaut said:
The old kernel is caused by NVidia because in every Tegra 3 device the kernel is the same: 2.6.... Nexus 7 seems to have 3.1 kernel and hopefully all Tegra 3 devices which get JB will get updated kernel. Old kernel isn't Asus' fault. It is NVidia's fault. Google built ICS with 3.0 kernel and that is why almost all other devices except Tegra 3 devices have Linux kernel version 3.0.
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Wait correct me if I am wrong. So you are saying, as stated in the Wiki when original Android OS is developed e.g. ICS it used Linux kernel version 3.0.x but then when ASUS or other manufactors using Tegra 3 chip only got access to Kernel 2.6 because it is what Nvida provided? So blame is actually on the Nvidia?
So how did Nexus 7 got new kernel? It uses Tegra 3, ASUS is involved... Is it google that forced NVida to upgrade to newer kernel? In any event, do Kernel usually get updated along with OS update?
One pessimistic comment though.. If we look at Andropolice benchmark Nexus 7 was included there, and their IO result was not much better than Transformer line.
HoushaSen said:
Wait correct me if I am wrong. So you are saying, as stated in the Wiki when original Android OS is developed e.g. ICS it used Linux kernel version 3.0.x but then when ASUS or other manufactors using Tegra 3 chip only got access to Kernel 2.6 because it is what Nvida provided? So blame is actually on the Nvidia?
So how did Nexus 7 got new kernel? It uses Tegra 3, ASUS is involved... Is it google that forced NVida to upgrade to newer kernel? In any event, do Kernel usually get updated along with OS update?
One pessimistic comment though.. If we look at Andropolice benchmark Nexus 7 was included there, and their IO result was not much better than Transformer line.
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Its entirely possible that Asus decided backporting 3.X's features to a 2.6 kernel would be easier than to do a 3.X kernel from the ground up. Its the route many devices without official ICS have taken to get their community builds and for most of those devices it works just fine.
The Nexus 7 had the advantage of being being handled by Google for software, and as such had no legacy code to be based on. The 700, on the other hand, was close enough to the Prime that Asus probably decided to use the kernel of the later as a base.
This is just speculation though.
jdefi3ebuggdsf32 said:
Mostly interesting questions but when it comes to nvidia and i/o problems lets blame it on the kernel drivers.
Look at around 48 min mark.
www . youtube . com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=MShbP3OpASA
Do you think Asus seriously cares about its customers??
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So NVIDIA is the issue then? I like his comment, at the end. "So NVIDIA, F*CK YOU."
Jotokun said:
Its entirely possible that Asus decided backporting 3.X's features to a 2.6 kernel would be easier than to do a 3.X kernel from the ground up. Its the route many devices without official ICS have taken to get their community builds and for most of those devices it works just fine.
The Nexus 7 had the advantage of being being handled by Google for software, and as such had no legacy code to be based on. The 700, on the other hand, was close enough to the Prime that Asus probably decided to use the kernel of the later as a base.
This is just speculation though.
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But reasonable speculation. I don't think you're far off with these assumptions.
Here's hoping that JB and maybe even some kernel updates and tweaks can at least alleviate the IO issues.
The kernel is a part of OS and can be updated when the OS is updated. I think the kernel is old because Nvidia hadn't lot of time to prepare the kernel to be compatible with new android. Now when nvidia have bee working with google and asus so maybe google have helped nvidia to make new kernel to work with tegra 3. If you want new kernel, find a working custom rom with new kernel and use it.
attelaut said:
The kernel is a part of OS and can be updated when the OS is updated. I think the kernel is old because Nvidia hadn't lot of time to prepare the kernel to be compatible with new android. Now when nvidia have bee working with google and asus so maybe google have helped nvidia to make new kernel to work with tegra 3. If you want new kernel, find a working custom rom with new kernel and use it.
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Well at this point, we should be waiting for the bootloader to be unlockable. Once we can load custom kernels, the tablet will zooooooooooom.
KilerG said:
Well at this point, we should be waiting for the bootloader to be unlockable. Once we can load custom kernels, the tablet will zooooooooooom.
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Did custom ROMs solve the I/O problems with the Prime entirely? (never owned one)
d14b0ll0s said:
Did custom ROMs solve the I/O problems with the Prime entirely? (never owned one)
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According to this thread, it does.
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=1768406
Jotokun said:
According to this thread, it does.
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=1768406
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no it doesnt help entirely. it helps a bit but it does not solve the problems.
for instance the browser still locks up a lot, some ANR messages every now now and then.
only way to get the browser stable is by using browser2ram.
Seems it can be a hard way out of the T3 path.
Have you tried Dolphin browser on your Prime btw? (if I assume correctly that you own one) It helps a lot on the Infinity (Chrome is slightly faster than the stock browser, but is said not to support H/W acceleration, which makes it slower on content-loaded pages)
Sent from my ASUS Transformer Pad TF700T using xda app-developers app
I am sure someone else has already noticed, but HTC One X which had one of top I/O result on Andropolice benchmark has a version with Tegra 3, which still performed well in fact often outperformed its counter part. I could not find which Kernel it uses though. But this may perhaps be one evidence goes against Tegra 3 is the actual issue, but rather something else. And also noting Nexus 7, which used Kernel 3.1 not doing that much better than transformer line also put a flag against Kernel being underlying issue. Could it really be the flash drive itself?
Now to put these in summary, I edited my opening post.
http://www.nvidia.com/content/devzone/linux-for-tegra.html
Does this apply to the specific T33 SoC in the Infinity? Hopefully someone with more knowledge on this subject can explain.
Hopefully we will see an unlocker tool soon, and perhaps some more mod development!
I'm not quite sure but I think this means that ASUS now has access to nVidia's new kernel, which is based off of linux 3. This means that we might be getting a kernel/firmware update soon which will buff our tablets' performance through linux 3.
jdeoxys is right; there's nothing in there referencing specific tweaks or changes, though, so it's unclear for now if this will actually produce anything of a solution yet. Fingers crossed, and hoped the 3.x kernel itself fixes a lot (along with JB).
This is a release of mostly binary blobs and drivers for running Linux distros (based on kernel 3.1.10) on the Tegra 2 and 3, it's not directly related to Android. Not sure how much of a use it is to CM, AOKP people and so on yet. The drivers might be of use, of course.