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Nvidia dropping support for older tegra 2's
Hi all,
Someone just threw this link up in the #epic irc room.
http://www.ubergizmo.com/2011/04/nvidia-tegra-2-support-stops/
Haven't seen it posted over here yet I figured I'd throw it out there.
skeeterslint said:
Haven't seen it posted over here yet I figured I'd throw it out there.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Did you look?
There are at least 5 topics about it on the first page.
This was posted in the Nvidia forums yesterday:
Mar 16 2011 at 12:07 AM #1
NVIDIA is only supporting the Ventana platform for android releases going forward. At the moment we have released Froyo and Gingerbread OS images for Ventana and will release Honeycomb after Google has done so.
UPDATE 12 APRIL 2011:
Sorry folks looks like I caused a bit of confusion. Since this is a developer forum my comments
were targeted at Tegra Honeycomb developers and for this we’d like to focus on Ventana. For shipping or production products, customers should contact the device makers directly for OS support plans. They are responsible for the OS shipping on their device.
In relation to our linux kernel git repository, NVIDIA will continue to provide full open-source support for all of our kernel components and will push more of that upstream over time.
Andrew Edelsten
Tegra Developer Relations
NVIDIA Corporation
Funny I did look and didn't see anything about it otherwise I wouldn't have bothered to post it.
Sent from my PC36100 using Tapatalk
UPDATE 4-13 - Nvidia Tegra 2 Harmony Support
This comes from Andrew over at Nvidia (http://developer.nvidia.com/tegra/forum/honeycomb-harmony?page=3):
UPDATE 13 APRIL 2011
A lot has been read into a very short post about a Tegra development kit. I'd like to clear up a few points.
First, nothing changes in what we’re delivering to the open source community or customers. NVIDIA will continue to post the Tegra kernel to kernel.org and publish our Android code to our public git servers. Additionally, we will continue to make our BSP (codecs, GPU driver etc) available to all our hardware partners. We will continue to do this and nothing about these processes has changed.
For our partners' Android devices, NVIDIA provides support until the hardware partner chooses to no longer support the device. So, for instance, NVIDIA will support the Xoom on all versions of Android Motorola requests until Motorola ceases to support the Xoom. The same goes for ViewSonic with the G-Tablet, Notion Ink with the Adam, Acer with the Iconia, LG with the Optimus 2X and so on.
In relation to my original reply, that was a response to a specific question about a Tegra 250 Development Kit. Given the confusion, we will work with owners of Tegra 250 Development Kits individually to determine their needs. The term "Harmony" is an internal codename for the Tegra 250 Development Kit. It is not a tablet reference design. Each shipping tablet is a custom design with varying hardware components and requires a custom OS image from the OEM who made the tablet.
Finally, while we cannot support or give out third party peripheral drivers or provide the Android 3.0 source before Google does, we do want to explore whether we can assist the open source ROM makers. We will be reaching out to them today.
Andrew Edelsten
Tegra Developer Relations
NVIDIA Corporation
UPDATE 13 APRIL 2011
A lot has been read into a very short post about a Tegra development kit. I'd like to clear up a few points.
First, nothing changes in what we’re delivering to the open source community or customers. NVIDIA will continue to post the Tegra kernel to kernel.org and publish our Android code to our public git servers. Additionally, we will continue to make our BSP (codecs, GPU driver etc) available to all our hardware partners. We will continue to do this and nothing about these processes has changed.
For our partners' Android devices, NVIDIA provides support until the hardware partner chooses to no longer support the device. So, for instance, NVIDIA will support the Xoom on all versions of Android Motorola requests until Motorola ceases to support the Xoom. The same goes for ViewSonic with the G-Tablet, Notion Ink with the Adam, Acer with the Iconia, LG with the Optimus 2X and so on.
In relation to my original reply, that was a response to a specific question about a Tegra 250 Development Kit. Given the confusion, we will work with owners of Tegra 250 Development Kits individually to determine their needs. The term "Harmony" is an internal codename for the Tegra 250 Development Kit. It is not a tablet reference design. Each shipping tablet is a custom design with varying hardware components and requires a custom OS image from the OEM who made the tablet.
Finally, while we cannot support or give out third party peripheral drivers or provide the Android 3.0 source before Google does, we do want to explore whether we can assist the open source ROM makers. We will be reaching out to them today.
Andrew Edelsten
Tegra Developer Relations
NVIDIA Corporation
Now this is a little more in line with what I was hoping for as a response from nvidia.
Robeet, any chance they reached out to you directly?
-Lil'
life02 said:
UPDATE 13 APRIL 2011
A lot has been read into a very short post about a Tegra development kit. I'd like to clear up a few points.
First, nothing changes in what we’re delivering to the open source community or customers. NVIDIA will continue to post the Tegra kernel to kernel.org and publish our Android code to our public git servers. Additionally, we will continue to make our BSP (codecs, GPU driver etc) available to all our hardware partners. We will continue to do this and nothing about these processes has changed.
For our partners' Android devices, NVIDIA provides support until the hardware partner chooses to no longer support the device. So, for instance, NVIDIA will support the Xoom on all versions of Android Motorola requests until Motorola ceases to support the Xoom. The same goes for ViewSonic with the G-Tablet, Notion Ink with the Adam, Acer with the Iconia, LG with the Optimus 2X and so on.
In relation to my original reply, that was a response to a specific question about a Tegra 250 Development Kit. Given the confusion, we will work with owners of Tegra 250 Development Kits individually to determine their needs. The term "Harmony" is an internal codename for the Tegra 250 Development Kit. It is not a tablet reference design. Each shipping tablet is a custom design with varying hardware components and requires a custom OS image from the OEM who made the tablet.
Finally, while we cannot support or give out third party peripheral drivers or provide the Android 3.0 source before Google does, we do want to explore whether we can assist the open source ROM makers. We will be reaching out to them today.
Andrew Edelsten
Tegra Developer Relations
NVIDIA Corporation
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Wonderful news!
life02 said:
This comes from Andrew over at Nvidia (http://developer.nvidia.com/tegra/forum/honeycomb-harmony?page=3):
UPDATE 13 APRIL 2011
A lot has been read into a very short post about a Tegra development kit. I'd like to clear up a few points.
First, nothing changes in what we’re delivering to the open source community or customers. NVIDIA will continue to post the Tegra kernel to kernel.org and publish our Android code to our public git servers. Additionally, we will continue to make our BSP (codecs, GPU driver etc) available to all our hardware partners. We will continue to do this and nothing about these processes has changed.
For our partners' Android devices, NVIDIA provides support until the hardware partner chooses to no longer support the device. So, for instance, NVIDIA will support the Xoom on all versions of Android Motorola requests until Motorola ceases to support the Xoom. The same goes for ViewSonic with the G-Tablet, Notion Ink with the Adam, Acer with the Iconia, LG with the Optimus 2X and so on.
In relation to my original reply, that was a response to a specific question about a Tegra 250 Development Kit. Given the confusion, we will work with owners of Tegra 250 Development Kits individually to determine their needs. The term "Harmony" is an internal codename for the Tegra 250 Development Kit. It is not a tablet reference design. Each shipping tablet is a custom design with varying hardware components and requires a custom OS image from the OEM who made the tablet.
Finally, while we cannot support or give out third party peripheral drivers or provide the Android 3.0 source before Google does, we do want to explore whether we can assist the open source ROM makers. We will be reaching out to them today.
Andrew Edelsten
Tegra Developer Relations
NVIDIA Corporation
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
So does this mean that we may get Gingerbread Hardware acceleration after all? (let alone Honeycomb)
CodeNinja said:
Wonderful news!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Exactly, which puts the ball back in VS's court.
My reading comprehension may be off, but I took this:
Additionally, we will continue to make our BSP (codecs, GPU driver etc) available to all our hardware partners.
As meaning we'll have to rely on Viewsonic to get the GPU driver for GB or Honeycomb.
life02 said:
This comes from Andrew over at Nvidia (http://developer.nvidia.com/tegra/forum/honeycomb-harmony?page=3):
UPDATE 13 APRIL 2011
A lot has been read into a very short post about a Tegra development kit. I'd like to clear up a few points.
First, nothing changes in what we’re delivering to the open source community or customers. NVIDIA will continue to post the Tegra kernel to kernel.org and publish our Android code to our public git servers. Additionally, we will continue to make our BSP (codecs, GPU driver etc) available to all our hardware partners. We will continue to do this and nothing about these processes has changed.
For our partners' Android devices, NVIDIA provides support until the hardware partner chooses to no longer support the device. So, for instance, NVIDIA will support the Xoom on all versions of Android Motorola requests until Motorola ceases to support the Xoom. The same goes for ViewSonic with the G-Tablet, Notion Ink with the Adam, Acer with the Iconia, LG with the Optimus 2X and so on.
In relation to my original reply, that was a response to a specific question about a Tegra 250 Development Kit. Given the confusion, we will work with owners of Tegra 250 Development Kits individually to determine their needs. The term "Harmony" is an internal codename for the Tegra 250 Development Kit. It is not a tablet reference design. Each shipping tablet is a custom design with varying hardware components and requires a custom OS image from the OEM who made the tablet.
Finally, while we cannot support or give out third party peripheral drivers or provide the Android 3.0 source before Google does, we do want to explore whether we can assist the open source ROM makers. We will be reaching out to them today.
Andrew Edelsten
Tegra Developer Relations
NVIDIA Corporation
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Click to collapse
Much more like it.. I guess our voice is being heard.. I am impressed Folks.. lets all keep up the good work and thank our devs for making this all possible.
Thanks again to all of you.
best regards
CodeNinja said:
Wonderful news!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
IMO the real question is, whether any enhancements made to the BSP (codecs GPU drivers) etc made for Ventana for honeycomb, will also be released for the Harmony.
Sure they will not stop the downloading of existing Harmony drivers, but will they enhance them for Honeycomb? Or at least release the codec, driver code to the OEMs (or general public?).
Does "continue to support" mean add enhancements, or merely fix bugs and make available.
If they do not add enhancements to Harmony, maybe they should rename Harmony based products to have Tegra 1.5
--
we need to continue to keep the pressure on until they release new drivers
dfin13 said:
My reading comprehension may be off, but I took this:
Additionally, we will continue to make our BSP (codecs, GPU driver etc) available to all our hardware partners.
As meaning we'll have to rely on Viewsonic to get the GPU driver for GB or Honeycomb.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I agree. Viewsonic wants to make a Giner or Honey ROM and Nvidia will support them with the proper driver. Hear that Viewsonic...? HEllllloooooooo?
rbansal2 said:
we need to continue to keep the pressure on until they release new drivers
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Click to collapse
I completely agree with you... We need to stay on top of them to make sure that we are pushing this to the limit.. we want out Gtab with the latest drivers and the latest OS..
cbay said:
IMO the real question is, whether any enhancements made to the BSP (codecs GPU drivers) etc made for Ventana for honeycomb, will also be released for the Harmony.
Sure they will not stop the downloading of existing Harmony drivers, but will they enhance them for Honeycomb? Or at least release the codec, driver code to the OEMs (or general public?).
Does "continue to support" mean add enhancements, or merely fix bugs and make available.
If they do not add enhancements to Harmony, maybe they should rename Harmony based products to have Tegra 1.5
--
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
If Harmony is just an SDK then why can't they just use the SDK codenamed Ventana? He eluded to the idea that the hardware hasn't changed and only the SDK has. If this is the case then Viewsonic would just need to use the newer SDK when coding their new ROM's for the Gtab. No?
UPDATE: So after some research these aren't SDK's they are Dev Kit's which basically seem like barebone tablet making kits.
Harmony:
http://developer.download.nvidia.com/tegra/docs/harmony_hw_setup.pdf
Ventana:
http://developer.nvidia.com/tegra/devkit-ventana
As you can see from the material, they are very different hardware.
whiplash13 said:
If Harmony is just an SDK then why can't they just use the SDK codenamed Ventana? He eluded to the idea that the hardware hasn't changed but maybe the SDK has. If this is the case then Viewsonic would just need to use the newer SDK when coding their new ROM's for the Gtab. No?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I don't think Harmony and Ventana are the same hardware. The chip is the same (Tegra 2), but the hardware around the chip on the board is probably different. This causes low level software like device drivers to be different (not binary compatible) between Harmony and Ventana.
Based on simple browsing, (and someone may correct me on this), it seems that the codecs and drivers are released by Nvidia are in binary form, and not source code, and are therefore not "hackable". Such things are usually proprietary (not open source) and thus only distributed in binary format.
Not sure if the above is true for release to OEMs.
If the OEMs like ViewSonic get the codec/driver source code, they could theoretically adapt it to the new features of Honeycomb, and the burden would be on OEMs like ViewSonic. But it would be more difficult for OEMs.
Post deleted.
NVIDIA drops support for Viewsonic, Advent and Notion ink tablets, falls prey of new Google rules
NVIDIA has announced that they're dropping driver support for their Harmony line of tablets. This affects the Viewsonic gTablet and ViewPad7, Advent Vega, Toshiba Folio 100, and Notion Ink Adam, as well as the many users that jumped on the mostly cheap-ish tablets, not wanting to wait for Honeycomb. The announcement seals the fate of the above mentioned tablets, as without drivers, no future version of Android will get hardware acceleration. Not that the heavily customized UI they employ that mostly damages the eyes of customers would have ever gotten Rubin's blessing, but this leaves the dev community out of luck, too, pretty much. More info past the break.
Some of the tablets are merely months old and smiten with some pretty ugly UIs, Adam tablet aside (though it looks nicer than it's actually useable), but none are more than a year old. That's a very short shelf life, even for high-tech devices, especially considering a lot of users were hanging on for future updates to finally be able to start enjoying their tablets instead of living with compromises. Sure, there's a bunch of development around these tablets, mostly the Viewsonic and Advent, since they're based on the same exact hardware and fugly UI, but without hardware support, there's not much more coming but bug-fixes. Andrew Edelstein, an NVIDIA employee, posted the following on the developer forum
targeted at Tegra Honeycomb developers and for this we’d like to focus on Ventana. For shipping or production products, customers should contact the device makers directly for OS support plans. They are responsible for the OS shipping on their device. [...] In relation to our linux kernel git repository, NVIDIA will continue to provide full open-source support for all of our kernel components and will push more of that upstream over time.
The Ventana platform refers to the XOOM, Galaxy Tab 10.1 and the Eee tablets and all other newer tablets for which support will, quite obviously, continue. Older models of phones often get neglected with updates, but nothing of this magnitude so far. NVIDIA's move is pretty clearly a reaction to Google's new policy on who gets updates ; after all, why should they continue spending money on the development of tablets that are never going to see an update again. Of course, Advent and Viewsonic could renounce their Tap-n-Tap UI for something more AOSP-like and beg Google for mercy, but at this point, it seems to late.
i have read some post from Nvidia.. im just kinda confuse..
http://www.androidcentral.com/nvidia-stop-supporting-harmony-platform-past-froyo
do they really trashing our tablet ? no more drivers for future updates?
that's an old article and speculation has been around since it's original release. From updated stories, Nvidea claims that it WILL provide support IF the manufacturers request it. It's confusing becuase Nvidea says it wants Honeycomb from Google, Viewsonic wants drivers from Nvidea. Google won't approve use of their market or code for Viewsonic, and of course, WE want it all.
So, as it stands right now:
Google will only release Honeycomb to their approved vendors
Nvidea wants Honeycomb, and will support Harmony boards IF manufactureres request it
Viewsonic will update what they currently have, but can't advance their Harmony based products without Nvidea's cooperation.
WE are sitting with Froyo systems with no hardware acceleration becuase either Nvidea isn't providing it, or Viewsonic is not requesting it (or it cant be done) and getting Honeycomb is a pipe dream, since that all depends on Google.
I think I summed it up nicely, but there are a plethora of posts dealing with this exact topic.
That's why my next device is gonna be an apple ipad. They support their devices after more than 3 years. I will never buy anything with the damn android logo or OS on it. Screw you Google, screw you all android companies, you deserve it. I can't believe that I bought 2 new gtablets to become obsolete and without future in the moment I opened the box. If that's the "experience" that google want from android users, so well I got the "experience", now you can make a roll with android and stuck where you know, Google and Android
By the way I know this is old news, but each company is throwing the ball to others and I see they don't give a damn about users.
It's not Google's fault.
It is Google fault for not given permission to companies for using the sources needed, and the companies for no giving support to android. It is Google fault for the mess a Google Market, being not accessible to a most devices, and for the mess with all android versions.
So go and kiss Google if you a fan of them, but don't take out the blame from them because they are guilty as the companies. For me is the end of all Google related products , I'm sick of them. They become the Microsoft of the 2000's.
Bye bye Google and Android.
kekinash said:
It is Google fault for not given permission to companies for using the sources needed, and the companies for no giving support to android. It is Google fault for the mess a Google Market, being not accessible to a most devices, and for the mess with all android versions.
So go and kiss Google if you a fan of them, but don't take out the blame from them because they are guilty as the companies. For me is the end of all Google related products , I'm sick of them. They become the Microsoft of the 2000's.
Bye bye Google and Android.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Well, only "Google experience" devices get full Market access... anyone can build an Android device... anyone can use Android... but they have to partner with Google to get Market access and early access to Android... Viewsonic does not have this partnership... (No, I'm not a die hard fan of Google, but I do love Android).
It's basically up to the manufactures to ask for Google support (and pay for it)...
kekinash said:
It is Google fault for not given permission to companies for using the sources needed, and the companies for no giving support to android. It is Google fault for the mess a Google Market, being not accessible to a most devices, and for the mess with all android versions.
So go and kiss Google if you a fan of them, but don't take out the blame from them because they are guilty as the companies. For me is the end of all Google related products , I'm sick of them. They become the Microsoft of the 2000's.
Bye bye Google and Android.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Not really.
Google sets certain standards that have to be met (primarily hardware features) on a device for that device to have "google support" which it basically Market, Gmail, Gtalk, etc....all the Google provided apps.
As mentioned....anyone can build a device and run Android on it.....download the source code from AOSP and go to town. However...AOSP doesn't have or support the Google proprietary apps (Market, Gmail, etc..).
So, it's not Google's fault, it's the device manufacturers fault for being cheap and not adding the required hardware components to the devices to gain Google support.
This is also another reason why Honeycomb (OS 3.0) hasn't been released to open source yet.....hardware requirements are changing (3G not required, etc...) but they are still wanting a cohesive tablet design.
All these cheap android tablets are built to be cheap....because most people only want to pay xx amount. This gets you a "non supported" device....but if you are on this board.....you know that going in on the purchase. It's the community of developers that increase the overall function and use of these cheap "non supported" tablets.
If you wanted a "Google supported" device, buy one. Xoom, Acer Iconia, ASUS Transformer, etc.... Not a Viewsonic Gtabet, 10s, Nook Color, Coby whatever, Folio 100, etc...etc...etc...
Apple makes the iPad and the iOS running on it.....of course they support it.
Viewsonic makes neither the device or the OS.
thank you tcrews. well said
with all of this being said, I bought a G-tab knowing that it wouldn't be an exceptional piece of hardware out of the box. I knew that it took tweeking. I love my Vegan 5.1.1 system, and enjoy using it every day for games, surfing, news, adding sheet music to it, downloading PDFs for upcoming meetings. It's much more convenient than taking a binder full of music, or a stack of papers into a meeting. My son can watch movies on it, or play games, and the battery lasts longer than my Acer netbook.
Is it the best thing on the market, HELL no...but it's also not the most expensive, either.
AAs far as Google partnerships, I suspect that it's their pressure that intimidates companies. After all, as was mentioned, if you want full Google support, you need to buy a partnered piece of hardware. They typically cost more, simply due to the partnership. SO, in the case of viewsonic specifically, the great devs here have devised a way to bypass the partnership (limited bypass, but still a bypass) So, what's Viewsonic's motivation to acquiring said partnership? If Nvidea is trying to get one, perhaps it was Google that stipulated that Honeycomb will not be available on their Harmony platform.
We all know that if the devs here have hardware drivers for Harmony, and eventually code for Honeycomb, EVERY g-tab owner will have both, without requiring Viewsonic to get a partnership with Google.
So, fault lies in a few places (although definitely not warrented or deserved)
1st, to viewsonic for making such a hackable device. We ALL love the fact that we can put on it, basically, whatever we want. this thing is easier to "jailbreak" than an iPod touch.
2nd, to the devs on this site. They have done WONDERFUL work, for FREE to make our experience what it should be. Indirectly, though, the fact that they've made it "look" so easy, would certainly lead to companies doing whatever it takes to protect their assets.
Think of it this way...Since Google makes profit on the sales of their "approved" devices, why on Earth would they want to give the devs here a chance to make the G-Tablet be able to keep up with the devices that are yet to come? It would be Google that would need to explain to Asus, Motorola, HTC, etc. why people aren't buying their golden tablets, over the discount priced G-tab.
My only complaint in all of this is that Gingerbread is a potential reality on the G-tab. The Harmony board will obviously support it and run it. I would be happy if Nvidea would continue development to make a "STOCK" G-tab perform the way that it's hardware was designed to perform. After that, the devs here could tweak it to make it perform better than anticipated. Once Nvidea updates their drivers to utilize all of the hardware acceleration that the Harmony board is capable of, then I would be fine if their abandoned it.
Hell, in all of this discussion, I find that of the 3 computers I own, 2 are running XP, one is running Vista. I'm obviously not a person that is into the "MUST HAVE THE NEWEST" mentality. I'm sure my Acer would nearly explode if I tried running Windows 7 on it, but I'm not upset...XP works fantastically on it. Same with the G-tab. Honeycomb may run, it may be glitchy, it may have bugs, it may make my G-tab explode...regardless, I'm happy with what I have, but would like the hardware acceleration that I know it can handle.
Todd
Thanks tcrews for the explanation, but I think that companies must put somewhere that the device they sell you doesn't have the blessing of google, or they can't access the market and that you will end with an unsupported and obsolete device after you bough it. for a mere 150 dollars more I can have a device that I know for sure is gonna be supported for more than a year. The same happened with my 2 android phones. I bought them and didn't see any update or fix for all the mess with the Android OS, and the same happens with a lot of devices or phones. The companies just put them on the market knowing that they will not be supported in the future. When it was a cheap phone, that was OK for me, but for a phone you pay more that 400 bucks it's an insult.
Simply put Android right now is a big mess, and will stay in the future far from it, until they fix the mess and companies start giving support to what they sell.
I share your view kekinash.
I don't care who's fault it is, the point is Android is a mess unless you want to get into development, hacking, etc. (All of which I can do to an extent).
I have an android phone made by Samsung, I've got the G-tablet, and I used to have a Motorola android phone. Each device has had a number of unexplained issues, of which no one tends to take responsibility for or any level of accountability. The fingerpointing I observed with my current Samsung phone is nothing short of comical. It's AT&T's issue, oh no, it's Samsung that does the software, oh no, you have to call Google "Android support". Nonsense.
My wife has had to iphones, and as much as I despise Apple, any issues (and they were minimal) were resolved quickly. And, you don't have the issue of the same app not working on the same version of the OS. Yes, Apple will discontinue support for older devices just like anyone else, but I've never fought with the iphone as much as I have to do circus acts with these Android-based devices.
Everyone is entitled to their opinion, and I respect everyone's opinion. I love the Android "concept", but the execution, for me, is far from worth my time.
That's why, whether good or bad, an ipad costs what it does.
kekinash said:
That's why my next device is gonna be an apple ipad. They support their devices after more than 3 years. I will never buy anything with the damn android logo or OS on it. Screw you Google, screw you all android companies, you deserve it. I can't believe that I bought 2 new gtablets to become obsolete and without future in the moment I opened the box. If that's the "experience" that google want from android users, so well I got the "experience", now you can make a roll with android and stuck where you know, Google and Android
By the way I know this is old news, but each company is throwing the ball to others and I see they don't give a damn about users.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Why must we be bothered with cr-apple plugs on a Android forum? Just go over to cr-apple you don't have to announce it. These type of posts leads us to believe you are just a fanboy trolling.
Yeah, typical answer from a fanboy. I not married to either company, I just pointing the differences between both OS, on one (IOs) you get support, on the other (Android) you're at your own.
It's my right to criticize the things I see wrong, you may like it or not, agree or not, but you can't take this right from me, at least here at the States. And saying what another company is doing right is not to be a fanboy.
And by the way, if the developers here and in another places weren't doing a great job with Android, the OS will be a Sh*t, specially with the g tablet, so a big thanks goes to them. I using a non stock rom and this is the only thing that avoided to send back the 2 tables I have.
This thread is not being productive at all. Closed.
Viewsonic announced it's Honeycomb tablet @ 7 inches. Which means they have the HC source code... which means they hate the gtab community.... because we don't get it, even for modding purposes.
http://www.engadget.com/2011/05/12/viewsonic-7x-shrinks-honeycomb-to-7-inches-for-the-tiny-handed/
They don't hate the Gtab community. Don't try to anthropomorphize a corporation because you will only end up sad and depressed. All Viewsonic wants is to make money by putting out products and then putting out more products. We are numbers, not faces.
Fair enough. I suppose I am a bit idealistic that they would continue to support something older. Perhaps more my frustration is the lack of source code when it could be given... but that it an entitlement mentality I suppose.
forgiventhief said:
Fair enough. I suppose I am a bit idealistic that they would continue to support something older. Perhaps more my frustration is the lack of source code when it could be given... but that it an entitlement mentality I suppose.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
stop caving because one person says something!!!!
and to the user that commented to the OP, thought the info you stated (numbers, not faces) is true, STOP ACTING LIKE IT'S ACCEPTABLE.
To many 300 to 500 dollars is a lot of money and the company has a moral obligation to support it for a reasonable amount of time. This was in no way accomplished by viewsonic. Horrible business ethics and I WILL NEVER BUY ANOTHER VIEWSONIC PRODUCT. you vote with your purchasing power and viewsonic lost mine, my family's and my friend's votes.
as an aside, I suspect seeing all the progress made viewsonic might try to "save the day" and eventually release something for our g tab honeycomb flavored. I'm not fooled and you shouldn't be either. Your support should be for the devs like roebeet. If your running honeycomb and you haven't donated to him or the adamdevs you should feel worse than viewsonic.
vote with your money, I VOTE FOR OUR DEV COMMUNITY!
(before I get any posts about talking about donation, donation doesn't imply 3,000 dollars. Even if it's only a dollar, it says something.)
You do realize viewsonic just slapped their name on the Malta, right? You're mad at the wrong company.
schettj said:
You do realize viewsonic just slapped their name on the Malta, right? You're mad at the wrong company.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Doesn't matter, though. As soon as VS slapped their name on it, they've adopted it.
The way VS is treating the gtab is worse than just numbers. They have intentionally ignored it, not giving it any press or anything at all. There isn't even a direct link to the gtab from their main website.
The gtab is doing way better than other "real" VS devices. It's the number 1 seller on amazon for goodness sake. I'm still baffled why VS isn't putting more energy into the gtab. It's like they don't even wanna mention it.
I think it is a way to get more people to move to their ViewPad line and off of the GTab. I will not switch to their new line just because they put 3.0 on it. Our Devs will get a port over to the GTab and it will blow their new line out of the water. Shady tactics if you ask me.
goodintentions said:
Doesn't matter, though. As soon as VS slapped their name on it, they've adopted it.
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But they don't have any code... they have no development resources. They have a brand name. Whooo.
Seriously.
goodintentions said:
It's the number 1 seller on amazon for goodness sake.
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Yes, it was for the week it was on blowout $280 clearance. Look, it's a great bit of first gen tegra2 tablet hardware with a dreadful screen that would make it unsellable at any price other than "half of what everyone else charges".
That's dropping under $200-$225 now, which is probably well below the breakeven point. So enjoy it, and support the hackers hacking away, but forget about any serious support for it from VS. You'll be much happier.
yes, the code for our G-tabs belongs to Malata, but so does the code for the Vega and the Adam. They are rumored to be at least getting official GB roms WITH hardware acceleration. VS is to blame for not providing us with that as well. If they do, but are keeping it hush-hush, I'll change my opinion.
Of course, Vega and Adam are running on the new 1.2 bootloader (always have been). Now VS teases us with an update that they pull, that is on the 1.2 bootlaoder? In essence, VS provided our devs, very briefly, with the tools needed to port any updates from Adam or Vega. So, while not actually giving us what we've requested, they are letting other companies, and third party developers do their work for them.
It may be that Malata has abandoned VS for their lack of support for the G-Tab, so Malata cut them off from future development releases.
snapz54 said:
and to the user that commented to the OP, thought the info you stated (numbers, not faces) is true, STOP ACTING LIKE IT'S ACCEPTABLE.
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I didn't say it's acceptable. In fact it makes me just as mad as it seems to have made you and I have made my opinion on that fact known many times on this board and the Nvidia developer board. I'm just saying that the people who want these updates are currently in the minority. I agree that we should get updates but we have to realize that might not happen. In fact I'd much rather use homegrown software from the fine developers on XDA, Cyanogen, and any other dev website that's working for better things for the Gtab than anything Viewsonic/Malata/Nvidia puts out anyhow.
This whole frequently updated software thing is new to the world. I mean think about Apple and Microsoft. Microsoft updated like once every five years. Apple was better, but in both cases users were made to pay for the updates. Now we buy these devices and expect free software updates indefinetly? Sounds good to me, but what about these companies? Where is the money for them? What incentive to they have to churn out more software at no charge to the customer? I'm just saying that there are two sides to this argument and both should be represented.
adampdx said:
This whole frequently updated software thing is new to the world. I mean think about Apple and Microsoft. Microsoft updated like once every five years. Apple was better, but in both cases users were made to pay for the updates.
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What color is the sky in your world?
The problem with Android is exactly the problem Google is trying to get a handle on....
Fragmentation.
When you leave updates up to the the hardware manufactures, you're guaranteed to screw your customers. Because the only way the HW guys make any money at all is by having the customer buy new hardware to get the shiny new features.
Hopefully Google will be able to beat these guys into submission, but I do feel for them... they thought they were getting in on a great thing with a cheap OS for their hardware, and instead they were turned into commodity manufacturers delivering Google ad revenue to Google. Ah well.
I'd much rather use homegrown software from the fine developers on XDA, Cyanogen, and any other dev website that's working for better things for the Gtab than anything Viewsonic/Malata/Nvidia puts out anyhow.
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But it's these updates that custom rom devs use to get the information they need to make their roms. If we ever get official hardware acceleration it will be bundled into one of the officially released updates. The drivers can then be added to existing roms, or future roms. The bottom line is that we NEED official updates if we are to ever get the G-tablet to reach it's full potential.
Now we buy these devices and expect free software updates indefinetly? Sounds good to me, but what about these companies?
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These companies, namely VS knows that they put out a crap product, in regard to software. In fact, they, at one point, directed their customers HERE for support for their device. They released a product in which the hardware outclassed the software. What we paid for was hardware, plain and simple. only recently have people actually said they're using stock firmware and it doesn't suck. Prior to the latest updates (3588 and later) I would suspect that everyone that bought a G-tablet, including myself, KNEW that they were going to have to flash a custom Rom. Just a few days ago, another 850+ G-tabs were sold on Woot, again. At one point it was the top seller on Amazon. VS has to save a little face and continue to support their software, and yes, provide updates.
Fortunately for VS, Notion Ink seems more interested in updating their product for us...of course, VS had to sneak in the 1.2 dev branch that's shared by the Adam.
some good points have been made, but none of the ones supporting VS have been valid.
slapping your name on something instantly slaps responsibility on you, this "passing the buck" mentality is a big part of whats wrong with the world. Everyone can blame someone else and nothing gets done.
The consequences in some small part are now realized. Myself and others will not support viewsonic in any capacity in the future. Actions like this catch up with you, VS is a horrible company that saw an opportunity to make a quick buck without a moments thought of how it might affect anyone.
stop supporting these type of actions, they are wrong.
snapz54 said:
some good points have been made, but none of the ones supporting VS have been valid.
slapping your name on something instantly slaps responsibility on you, this "passing the buck" mentality is a big part of whats wrong with the world. Everyone can blame someone else and nothing gets done.
The consequences in some small part are now realized. Myself and others will not support viewsonic in any capacity in the future. Actions like this catch up with you, VS is a horrible company that saw an opportunity to make a quick buck without a moments thought of how it might affect anyone.
stop supporting these type of actions, they are wrong.
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So you bought an $800.00 xoom?
snapz54 said:
stop supporting these type of actions, they are wrong.
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That would be "don't buy the product"
Since I wanted a device I can experiment with, and didn't want to spend more than $280, this was the only device available.
I bought it knowing what it was. An orphan device with no significant Vendor support.
i thought google said they aren't going to release honeycomb SDK? so doesn't that mean manufacturers are not allowed to release it?
but i guess if we buy the next VS tablet. we can port a honeycomb rom from that to the gtab.
ninditsu said:
i thought google said they aren't going to release honeycomb SDK? so doesn't that mean manufacturers are not allowed to release it?
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You're confusing SDK (Software Development Kit) with Source Code. That said, up to this point, Google has been reluctant to release the Source Code for Honeycomb for - what I can only assume is - the purpose of reducing hardware fragmentation and QA purposes.
schettj said:
What color is the sky in your world?
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Ha! Always good to get a laugh out of these heated discussions. As far as fragmentation goes, I agree. It's a problem that Google created and now they're trying to fix. I'm not sure I can imagine a world where there are several hundred different pieces of tech floating around from different manufactures that all use software provided by a singular, separate company. Oh, wait...that sounds like WINDOWS. He he... I wouldn't dare compare our beloved Google to the likes of Microsoft. Never.
schettj said:
That would be "don't buy the product"
Since I wanted a device I can experiment with, and didn't want to spend more than $280, this was the only device available.
I bought it knowing what it was. An orphan device with no significant Vendor support.
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Thank you. These things are on clearance for a reason. A lot of people here have unrealistic expectations. Companies don't make money by pouring resources into devices that nobody bought. I remember buying an Atari Lynx back in the day and only had it for about a year before everybody stopped making games for it and they were pulled off the shelves. I never once thought that Atari hated me.
I can't believe that ViewSonic took the time to release a very hypocritical statement about how HP "failed" with their webOS and that they (VS) were "dedicated" to their tablets and other products.
http://www.viewsonic.com/company/news/vs_press_release_526560.htm
I want to know what dictionary they got their warped, backwards definition of "dedication" from.
From the article...
"ViewSonic was among the first manufacturers to introduce a tablet solution back in Q4 2010," said Jeff Volpe, president of ViewSonic Americas. "Since that time, we have rolled out more tablet offerings than any other provider, focusing on particular market demands."
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Hmmm, wonder what tablet that was they introduced in Q4 2010? Oh yeah, the one they haven't wanted to support since 3 months after release. Sounds like their experiment failed more than HP's - at least HP was 100% behind their tablet.
Wow, that's rather brazen of them to reference this tablet and dedication in the same breath.
The press release also reads like it was written by a semi-literate intern. Perhaps their company would be doing better if they hired people who could actually read and write?
Tasteless, tactless, inept twits.
I bought the g tablet for the hardware. Viewsonic was an incidental middle man - I immediately flashed one of the community roms after purchasing (before my first full charge, even) and I haven't looked back since. I'll bet that more than 80% of all g tablet users aren't on the stock rom, and couldn't care less about Viewsonic once the warranty expires.
Where, exactly does "dedication" come into it?
All I can say is...
Pot, meet kettle.
JRowe47 said:
The press release also reads like it was written by a semi-literate intern. Perhaps their company would be doing better if they hired people who could actually read and write?
Tasteless, tactless, inept twits.
I bought the g tablet for the hardware. Viewsonic was an incidental middle man - I immediately flashed one of the community roms after purchasing (before my first full charge, even) and I haven't looked back since. I'll bet that more than 80% of all g tablet users aren't on the stock rom, and couldn't care less about Viewsonic once the warranty expires.
Where, exactly does "dedication" come into it?
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Because we want honeycomb or even gingerbread drivers? They aren't pressuring nvidia enough.
Sent from my Flashback HC-TAB using XDA Forum App
It seems to me like all the pressure has come from the community devs, and Viewsonic is only ever motivated by complaints, instead of having a go-get-em, let's deliver the best product we can! attitude. I could be wrong, but tbh I am rather underwhelmed by Viewsonic.
To be fair the letter is titled with "Windows Tablet Solutions". And there was something about a Microsoft partnership... Perhaps that is why the Gtab is a red-headed, forgotten step-child.
Sent from my Flashback 7.2 using XDA Premium App
WOW.
I actually just posted in another thread about the Touchpad, as was comparing the current issues with our own GTAB issues - there are a lot of similarities here. The dead OS, lack of support and future updates, lack of source code for Android 2.3 / 3.0, which will give developers obstacles as far as hardware acceleration and other specific hardware device drivers. The only difference being is that the GTAB does at least run Froyo, wheras the Touchpad cannot run any Android version (yet).
Viewsonic shouldn't even be bringing this up - if anything else, they are lot more similar to HP than they think they are. And at least HP has owned up that they have dropped the support of the product - I even heard that users who purchased the device in the last 60 days (which is all of them) will be getting partial refunds - Viewsonic, you hearing this? At least HP is doing the right thing for their customer base.
EDIT: Just tweak their own words a bit, from their news release. Notice the similarities --
“Viewsonic's move to launch a tablet with an untested and unsupported (from Google) tablet OS appears to have presented a challenge in marketing their tablet solution. The Froyo TapnTap OS, unfamiliar to both consumers and enterprises, complicated the tablet sales process and thus deemed a failed experiment. "
VS has been ignoring all our inquiries. And yet here they are jumping at the first opportunity to take a jab at HP. This proves that they are watching and reading. They just choose not to respond to us.
This statement speaks volumes about Viewsonic. No one should have any doubt about how shady they are now.
Viewsonic's Tablet support is a joke. The fact that they took that jab at HP is completely rediculous. As mentioned before, at least HP did the right thing and has a channel open to their consumers. That's more than Viewsonic has done. And HP is offering to refund the difference between what consumers paid and the clearance price or give them a full refund. That makes me wish I had bought it instead of the GTab. That's something I'll take into consideration when making my next Tablet purchase.
Came across a short article today:
http://crave.cnet.co.uk/mobiles/will-samsung-buy-hps-webos-50004917/
What do you think about this?
- Will it be good for webOS?
- Will Samsung fill it with bloatware, normalize it and make it just like Android, thus removing the slick interface we love?
I myself think it is a bad thing for webOS, because Samsung's OSs have a history of being less classy than others, and because webOS is the classiest OS I've ever seen, it would spoil the charm.
My thoughts:
I don't want to see anyone own HP's OS. I think it would be somewhat of a Utopian world if it became 'the OS of the people'
I would like to see no large corporation privately developing the OS, and so the hackers who have made Android so famous would openly do so. If some manufacturer such as Samsung took over the business, I think they should do nothing other than manufacture phones and tablets which run the OS.
I think that as soon as a 'standard' OS is loaded onto the phone/tablet, it would be root enabled, allowing people to edit it easily. Known, trusted developers such as the ones on this forum would be supplied some free handsets/tablets to get the ball rolling, and after that there would be regular software updates and custom ROMs ready to download whenever you feel like visiting the xda forums. Because it would be openly developed, it would be hugely successful with the people who love to tweak, edit and customize everything about their phones. I think that, if this happened, that the OS would be quickly adopted by many, as there would be more custom ROMs, apps, themes, hardware tweaks and, after some time, accessories.
I say this because the fact that Android is open source, easy to develop on and fairly cheap means that it has become the most popular smart phone operating system in the world.
This would make webOS hugely popular with thousands, even the people who don't read these forums on the basis that:
- As soon as you find a bug or something that you don't like on IOS or others, there is nothing you can do, but wait. On this "OS of the people" you would be able to come here and someone would already have a fix or a modification.
- If you don't like the appearance of other OSs, you have to root/jailbreak your phone to edit it. With a pre-rooted phone you would not void your warranty just to install a theme. You install all modifications at your own risk, however, so if you do so, you risk your warranty, but do not void it.
These are just my opinionated opinions, feel free to criticize.
while it'd be nice if HP were to release webOS as open-source, that is very unlikely to happen. That is the sad reality. I think if anyone were to pick up webOS, I'd rather it be HTC, just because they have proven to be very hacker friendly. Even if htc were to put sense over webOS, it has proven to be easy to modify anyway.
Samsung is so lagging with updates to their hardware. This is what scares me about them dropping the ball with webos.
I love webos and it is such a hot topic right now, it could really blow wide open if played out correctly- like simply supporting it and not mucking around with it. It just needs some big dollars behind it, get it noticed and get some solid hardware to run on- like the touchpad- ha-i actually like it a whole lot. That's it, just let it spread out from there. Don't try and tweak it, brand it, or otherwise piss all over it. Sorry bout the rant, but I agree with the above/ previous posts.
Sent from my DROIDX using Tapatalk
Better samsung then nobody at all I mean face it HP pulled the plug besides homebrew there is no more development for it unless they went ahead and release it open source which they won't so I welcome if samsung did take over as mentioned better then nothing i'd say sure would I prefer other companies no doubt but that's the current rumor. Haven't heard any other company willing to take it over.
Ideally if you can mash up webos frontal interface with the backend application support of android hell that would be a match made in heaven.
HP just acquired a European based software company to further WebOs
Tecnica001 said:
Ideally if you can mash up webos frontal interface with the backend application support of android hell that would be a match made in heaven.
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Now that's an interesting thought. Make the Android for Touchpad "look" like webOS and use the android market apps. Whoot!!
Am I the only one who agrees?
Hp should license webos with specs to make sure it runs smooth like Palm or touchpad or whatever. If such a thing is possible. Believe it or not I don't know if I'd trust webos with anyone other than hp. Ha. In there lack of support for it, they've somehow managed to keep it in this sweet virgin like state.
Let someone else take on the burden of hardware production and os brand recognition and then produce some more tabs/ phones for the newly established fan base following.
Just sayin!
Sent from my DROIDX using Tapatalk
Endgadget just reported that Samsung has stated that they are not interested in webOS. Take it for what its worth...