Related
It was in the news recently that TMO USA Management was under pressure form the parent Company to improve their market performance in the US. The three larger carriers improved their net subscriber growth last year, while TMO experienced a net decline of 1.8% - negative "churn" and not acceptable.
Not sure where this will lead, but I would not think further throttling and other service cutbacks would be in their best interest. I would like to think on the other hand that becoming the carrier that openly supported and cooperated with developers like XDA would set them apart from the others, but we as a segment probably only reflect too small a small percentage.
TMo needs something to give themselves a marker share bump. While I think this device (especially unlocked with custom ROMs and kernels) is head and shoulder above the IPhone - never-the-less - the public is still streaming to buy them (with a contract of course) and are largely ignoring TMo's offerings (has the MT4G even come close to 1 mill sold yet?).
I personally would like to see them adopt a really "unlimited: data plan offering and public cooperation with developers, but I am not holding my breath on either of these.
Just hoping they don't go in the other direction. Also, that they do not get taken out by another carrier - this would most likely lead to cutbacks of some offerings.
First of all I do agree with some of your point. But what you failed to see is that it means nothing as the parent company naturally would voice its concern as they losing money while others carriers are adding subscribers. But at same time you have to understand that TMo actually rode the 4G bandwagon which other carriers started without honestly offering it. That is another thread of its own as you know damn well no one offers 4G in USA regardless of the BS which is now changed thus legally called current post HSPA+ and WiMax, LET to 4G. While other has virtually made huge investment in network infarstructure TMo has just simply done minor laughable upgrade. But due to the changing which others created TMo has beat them in their (other carriers) game of fake offering 4G game. Hence over night they becane the largest carrier in US to offer 4G? LOL
That being said far as other things goes they will never accept XDA or other outside source as they might scape manufacturer and directly deal with Google for development but far as support goes they don't care as it will have serious ramifications. Not everyone care to root and upgrade as they want device to work only some of are flash addicts.
Sent from my HTC Glacier
XDA and custom software is such a small segment of the market that it won't be where they find their big boom of growth. The current commercials that are ruthlessly going after the iPhone are the right move in my opinion.
I genuinely believe the mt4g is a superior product and if enough people will give it a chance they'll switch.
http://www.engadget.com/2011/08/11/t-mobile-to-begin-charging-overage-on-its-200mb-plans-on-august/
I don't even want to know what mobile data is gonna look like in a year.
This is hilarious. I was just fighting with a customer saying he was going to switch his four lines to tmo because it was 119 a month.
Sent from my Nexus S 4G using XDA Premium App
I really hope Sprint doesn't follow the path of the other carriers.
Sent from my PC36100 using XDA App
movingarrows said:
I really hope Sprint doesn't follow the path of the other carriers.
Sent from my PC36100 using XDA App
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It will happen. No avoiding it.
Sent from my PC36100 using XDA Premium App
conqu1stador said:
It will happen. No avoiding it.
Sent from my PC36100 using XDA Premium App
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There is no proof of that, pure assumption.
Aren't you in a different thread right now arguing because I'm "making a claim with no proof"? [Which I'm not but that's not the point of me asking this here]
mattykinsx said:
There is no proof of that, pure assumption.
Aren't you in a different thread right now arguing because I'm "making a claim with no proof"? [Which I'm not but that's not the point of me asking this here]
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Wait. Proof of what? What proof need there be? Sooner than later it will happen. Are you suggesting it wont? How long do you give it?
As for overages, to unlimited data (which you've seemed to confidently talk of before) something is going to give sooner than later. Would be shocking, at the rate things are going, for unlimited to last for the next couple years. Especially if that's when they complete their revision. 2-3 years ... if that long. Things change, Mox.
Sent from my PC36100 using XDA Premium App
Hmm, I wonder what happened to this comment from the now (properly) locked facebook thread:
mattykinsx said:
This will be my last thread in the in Evo subforum trying to help people out.
Honestly, its not in anyway deserved by people here.
Ill find another subforum next time.
Sad how a few people that could only be described as "trollers" ruin this forum.
Also, my posted older version has been downloaded 55 times. Which speaks louder then the few forum members that aren't here for anything but a fight.
Goodday Evo subforum.
Whole place needs a good /format
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Did you forget that you are still in the EVO subforums?
OK so here is my issue with all this "unlimited" data crap. I don't see how legally any company can use the term unlimited to describe a service when it clearly has limits.
By definition:
----------unlimited [uhn-lim-i-tid] adjective
----------1.not limited; unrestricted; unconfined: unlimited trade.
----------2.boundless; infinite; vast: the unlimited skies.
----------3.without any qualification or exception; unconditional.
I can understand lowering speeds. Then, technically, you are still unlimited because you are able to use as much as you want, just at lower speeds. But if they charge you for going "over" then how can it be unlimited. There must be a limit in order for you to go over it. I think that if Sprint is smart they will keep with the truly unlimited data and they will have customers flocking to them. The cost will be out weighed by the influx of new customers. Personally, if i had T-mobile right now and they tried to tell me that my unlimited plan had limits and i was going to get charged for exceeding that limit, I would sue the crap out of them for false advertising and breach of contract. It would only take a few people doing this before they would either remove the "unlimited" or stop charging for it. But this is all just my opinion and in a world full of them mine doesn't matter much. And to those who say that Sprint will eventually fall in line, you are probably right. Let's just hope it happens later, way later than sooner.
Would all of you please chill out and stop carrying on these silly internet arguments in every thread that gets posted? I'm sorry I ever thought it was funny now; it's just getting annoying.
Back on-topic, it looks to me like mobile data is inching backwards in terms of how they bill while at the same time providers strive to increase data rates. It's hard to determine why exactly this is, because if they're truly oversubscribing their networks they should be focusing on existing network expansion rather than building out new networks.
Of course, then they would be mocked for not having "4G" and would lose customers because consumers are, by and large, uneducated and see lightning striking a Verizon store in a commercial and they're sold.
It seems counter-intuitive that these companies would try so hard to get 10-20Mbps (and more) while at the same time working so hard to limit their customers to paltry consumption rates. At this point I think it's a cash grab until consumers won't accept it anymore.
I don't think that Sprint is being put in a position where it'll be forced to do start limiting consumption. There are no indications that their network is oversubscribed; quite the contrary. Considering that Sprint has almost nothing else to entice people to switch at this point, killing its unlimited plans would be a nail in the company's coffin. Until/unless they get something else to bring in customers, I think we're going to have unlimited plans for a long time to come.
Frankly, I think T-Mobile is taking these steps to bring themselves more in-line with AT&T so there's less reason to disapprove the merger and customers are already acclimated to the Death Star's rates and plans.
mattykinsx said:
There is no proof of that, pure assumption.
Aren't you in a different thread right now arguing because I'm "making a claim with no proof"? [Which I'm not but that's not the point of me asking this here]
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http://www.google.com/m/url?client=...QQFjAE&usg=AFQjCNHjpR7wFthZWfDJ__i_XWj19qBfBg
Sent from my Nexus S 4G using XDA App
MaxCarnage said:
It seems counter-intuitive that these companies would try so hard to get 10-20Mbps (and more) while at the same time working so hard to limit their customers to paltry consumption rates. At this point I think it's a cash grab until consumers won't accept it anymore.
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This is exactly right. If enough customers complained or threatened to sue then all this would stop.
Award Tour said:
http://www.google.com/m/url?client=...QQFjAE&usg=AFQjCNHjpR7wFthZWfDJ__i_XWj19qBfBg
Sent from my Nexus S 4G using XDA App
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Sorry, but that headline has a lot of spin in it. Of course "nothing is forever", and no CEO is ever going to promise that a feature is going to last forever. But as he also said, it's a great differentiator, and frankly the only one Sprint has right now because the wimax angle is all but dead and they'll be way behind the LTE curve when they finally start launching that network.
MaxCarnage said:
Sorry, but that headline has a lot of spin in it. Of course "nothing is forever", and no CEO is ever going to promise that a feature is going to last forever. But as he also said, it's a great differentiator, and frankly the only one Sprint has right now because the wimax angle is all but dead and they'll be way behind the LTE curve when they finally start launching that network.
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To say that article has a lot of spin on it is an understatement.
mattykinsx said:
To say that article has a lot of spin on it is an understatement.
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I think it says the reality of the situation. Unlimited data is a marketing point, the fact that Sprint has been unable to sustain the past quality of a unlimited data network proves that.
Award Tour said:
I think it says the reality of the situation. Unlimited data is a marketing point, the fact that Sprint has been unable to sustain the past quality of a unlimited data network proves that.
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The quality of Sprint's network does not necessarily correlate to their unilimited data offerings. It's an older network that uses outdated radio technology, and that probably contributes to their problems more than anything. A company that for a long time was losing customers in droves and has since only been able to maintain numbers is not likely to be over oversubscribed. Nothing is "proved" in your assertion, only assumed.
You're right that unlimited data is a marketing point, and the only one that Sprint has to offer. If Sprint got rid of it and started charging like the other carriers do, I am pretty certain that oversubscription would be the least of their concerns. I know I for one am not with Sprint because they have an amazing network; I am a customer because they save me money. The day that stops happening is the day I switch to another carrier with a better network. That's really what it all boils down to, and Hesse is saavy enough to realize that he doesn't have a whole lot else going for him.
You don't embark on a national advertising campaign touting your unlimited plans just to yank the carpet out from under yourself a short time later. This is Sprint's marketing campaign for the forseeable future, and I have seen nothing to dissuade me from that belief yet.
That article is not proof of anything.
BREAKING NEWS!
DAN HESSE HINTS SPRINT MAY TURN INTO A FARMING COMPANY
A few direct quotes from Sprint's CEO Dan Hesse the other day suggests that Sprint may change from mobile provider to farming company.
"Every few months we take a look, we take a look at tonnage, and we take a look at all the things we're doing to offload tonnage ... We'll just continue to monitor it," Dan said as he contemplated changing industries.
"Nothing is forever" says Dan, as he pined for his days as a farmer "[referring to moving to an all farming company] we think it's a terrific opportunity to differentiate ourselves in the market."
Hesse has a point. We've never heard of a company making such a drastic industry change. "Think of it as two different solar systems," Hesse said.
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If I posted this exact same link in "proof" of something you would troll the next 15 pages about how much spin and "proving of nothing" this link is.
Come on now.
mattykinsx said:
That article is not proof of anything.
If I posted this exact same link in "proof" of something you would troll the next 15 pages about how much spin and "proving of nothing" this link is.
Come on now.
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I don't know what you are trying to prove. Dan Hesse was quoted as saying that unlimited data is not promised forever. That's pretty much it. No spin just a quote from the man himself that its a possibility.
Sent from my Nexus S 4G using XDA App
Unlimited is the only thing Sprint has going good right now. Wimax is a joke. Most people are switching just for the unlimited.
Award Tour said:
I don't know what you are trying to prove. Dan Hesse was quoted as saying that unlimited data is not promised forever. That's pretty much it. No spin just a quote from the man himself that its a possibility.
Sent from my Nexus S 4G using XDA App
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Everything is a possibility and the quotes "nothing lasts forever" and "were constantly watching what we do every month" can be used to validate anything.
That's the point.
I would be scared of a company that didn't constantly re-evaluate it's options and policies.
I love how yet again a thread has been taken off topic.
Award Tour said:
I don't know what you are trying to prove. Dan Hesse was quoted as saying that unlimited data is not promised forever. That's pretty much it. No spin just a quote from the man himself that its a possibility.
Sent from my Nexus S 4G using XDA App
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Our responses are based on conqu1stador's original assertion that Sprint was likely to move away from unlimited plans sooner rather than later along with the others. There's no evidence of that being the case, other than an obscure quote from Dan Hesse saying that "nothing lasts forever" and then qualifying that statement by saying that it's their best differentiator from the other carriers right now. How that is evidence that Sprint will be dropping its unlimited plans "sooner rather than later" I don't know.
I get that there's a "trend" among the carriers towards dropping unlimited plans, but let's analyze that for a second. We really only have four big carriers; AT&T and Verizon are primarily in competition with each other so they keep their plans competitive against themselves. If AT&T drops unlimited plans, Verizon is sure to follow suit as they both go for quick cash grabs while they build out their next gen networks.
T-Mobile and Sprint were each other's main competition, but with AT&T looking to buy T-Mobile and Deutsche Telekom wanting it to happen, T-Mobile is going to slowly start aligning itself with AT&T's existing plans and policies to make the merger more streamlined.
Where does this leave Sprint? A lone wolf against two major carriers with nothing to offer other than competitive pricing; do you really see them trying to align themselves with the other carrier's pricing when they can't compete on any other level? At least against T-Mobile they have relatively comparable network coverage (though with GSM and HSDPA+ you can argue that T-Mobile has a better quality network), but other than that what is Sprint going to be able to offer against AT&T and/or Verizon?
Until or unless Sprint decides to commit corporate suicide to make itself look ripe for a buyout by Verizon, Sprint will do whatever it can to maintain its competitive pricing, and that includes its unlimited plans. There's no other reason to stick with Sprint right now. One obscure quote taken out of context doesn't prove that Sprint is going away from unlimited plans, and nothing else I have seen indicates so.
Updated 09/6/12 http://forum.xda-developers.com/showpost.php?p=31190482&postcount=81
This is a combined log of my attempt to get answers from Verizon and Samsung regarding the encrypted bootloader. I currently have a ticket with level III tech support at Samsung. It took a huge dog and pony show to get this far and I have had several forum members contact me asking to pass along info and ask questions when I finally get a hold of the right people.
I posted most of this in another thread, but it not where it should have been so I am moving it for a mod so we can keep that other development thread clean. Its 8am EST and Samsung Level III should be open in three hours as they are not staffed 24/7 like Level II/I.
For the record Samsungs Tech Support phone number is 800-726-7864
Just remember the rep you talk to regardless of what their position in the company is had no say in the encrypting of the bootloader. Its not their fault Verizon screwed us, please keep that in mind if you call. Using 5c technical words will get you past Level I but level II seemed to be on point. It took some manipulative games to get the guy to admit there was even a level III department; at first he told me level II was the highest I could go in tech support. Will update with more info when I have something.
I am also considering contacting the firm that handled the Motorola V710 lawsuit against Verizon years ago. We won that one and anyone who wanted got to trade in their phone and accessories for a full refund, no ETF, and if they wanted could also get a new device w/o extending their contract. I hate lawyers and would rather cut off my pinky finger then deal with them but it may be the only option in the end. Its like Verizon delivered us cake, then shot our dog and walked away. So mentally exhausted dealing with this crap.
Lastly, I was able to get a hold of Verizon corporate and had a low level executive call me back. This was before the device was released and we knew the bootloader was encrypted. She told me to save her number, and I am glad I did because once we found out about the lockdown I called her back and left VM. Should hear back from her Monday.
Verizon's Corporate Contact Info.
Verizon Corporate Office Headquarters:
140 West Street
New York, NY 10007
Corporate Phone Number: 1-212-395-1000
Corporate Fax Number: 1-212-571-1897
Original Post:
Ok, just an update. Level III Samsung tech support is not 24/7 like Level II/I. I have a ticket in the system regarding the issue and its been forwarded to Level III.
They will be in tomorrow (Saturday) from 8am (PST) to 7pm (PST) and I have to call back to get a hold of someone in the Level III department. I will keep dragging this up the chain of command till I can get some answers. Level II once again confirmed what we already know, Verizon did mess with the phone. Level II said don't bother with Fastboot because were not getting in that way. I don't know if he was lying but he seemed to know exactly what I was talking about when I mentioned the odin/fastboot switch.
One more thing to note, I am not sure I believe him but he said that they sent the phones to Verizon, and its Verizon that did the messing around not Samsung. I find it hard to believe Verizon was able to do this without Samsung support.
I don't have high hopes of getting anything that will be able to help us out of Level III but I will try. They have also lodged a my customer complaint and supposedly I am going to be getting a call back from someone from their corporate office in consumer relations.
I wish I could help more on the technical side but my experience only takes me to the point where everyone else has gotten with fastboot. I am however quite the people person when it comes to making noise with corporations and will keep up the good fight with Verizon / Samsung Corporate.
If there is anything specific you want me to ask Level III send me a PM by tomorrow morning and I will address it with them when I call. I know enough that I should be able to at least hold a conversation with them on the subject but more ammo would be great. I would also be willing to conference call with a repeatable dev/mod when I call them so that you don't have to jump through the two hours of crap I just did to get this escalated.
Post 2: (A reply to a forum member asking for an update)
I asked them if there is a reason I can't get into fastboot and the guy said because Verizon has locked down the device. I asked him "how" and "why" but he was unable to provide me with an answer to both questions. He then referred me to Level III as he said they were the ones who could discuss how it was done. I asked him if there was a way around it through odin using .ops he went silent for a while and said he had no information to provide on the subject and just reiterated that Verizon has made changes to the device software and I would have to refer to them regarding those changes.
With regard to the "why" question he simply said that Samsung could not comment on carrier practices only that Verizon requested the lockdown and that the phones were sent to them first to have it applied. He made it sound like Samsung told them to go take a flying leap and Verizon went ahead and did it anyway. Again, were talking about a rep here so take it with a grain of salt.
I talked about the FCC's Block C agreement regarding carriers not locking devices but the rep said he did not have a comment on the subject as he was just tech support. Block C is probably the only legal course of action we have but despite the FCC saying they were going to enforce the rule, we all know how the FCC could give a crap.
I am going to flat out ask Level III to do the right thing and leak a file for us to fix the issue. I may be nuts but I am not delusional and have no real expectoration they will help. I am however going to do my best to get them to slip something that may help a dev find a solution. If I can get at least a small puzzle piece out of Level III it might be the crack in the dam we need to blow open the floodgates.
07/11/12 Samsung Level III blew me off yesterday as well saying they were still looking into the matter. I called again today and finally received an official reply. Samsung says they have no information exactly what Verizon has done to the phone, they do not know exactly what is and is not signed/encrypted, and they have no further information. I have submitted a complaint to the president of Samsung USA but thats as far as I could go with Samsung. They have closed my case and can not provide further information. I asked if they had an original system image before Verizon gimped the phone and they said "yes but we can not provide that to our customers per carrier agreement."
Lastly I was told that there is going to be a Verizon "Developer Edition" that you can buy directly from Samsung in the coming weeks. This is in "direct response to complaints filed by customers" according to Samsung and will be distributed and supported by Samsung directly. It will cost $600+ and basically be the same phone but w/o an signed/encrypted bootloader.
Off the record information from an unnamed outside source: Verizon is releasing a OTA update to patch the root exploit in the coming days. This OTA will break and prevent re-root as well as try and stop people from using the image off of the "Developer Edition" to mess with the "normal" Verizon Galaxy S3. I don't have specific details; sorry. Do not OTA unless you want to loose root and probably not get it back. Verizon is fk'ing pissed; I mean really pissed that we have root.
From what I am hearing, Verizon's "top %5 data abusers" are all typically rooted/romed. The whole point of locking this phone down was to mess with these unlimited data customers. Verizon started this war; let us end it and make them loath the day they decided to fk with the dev community.
Again, my case Support case has been closed with Samsung. We will get nothing further from them nor any direct help. My case with Verizon corporate is also closed; they said Samsung will offer a Developer model directly and if I wanted that kind of access I needed to talk to them not Verizon.
The lawyers still have not called me back. No shock.
Up until this point I have been angry; now I am pissed. This isn't over; not by a long shot.
Will update when I have more information.
07/17/12
Samsung "Office of the President" -
Phone 877-268-2121
eMail [email protected]
FYI Samsung records phone conversations between the 4th minute and the 18th minute. Anything you say after minute 4 and before minute 18 "MAY" be recorded. I know that sounds like a strange window of recording, but its straight out of the mouth of a sympathetic to the cause tech support rep. Just had a great conversation with a guy, nothing is fixed of course but needless to say, there are people in Samsung that have been hearing rumors that the company is tired of carrier's crap and with in the next few years will be offering all Samsung headsets for a subsidized price, directly through Samsung. There will probably be trade-in specials, loyalty discounts, etc. I can't wait not to buy my devices directly through Verizon! Secondly, as of now (Verizon lies again) anything software related with this phone is coming from, programmed by, and completely influenced by Verizon. Samsung manufacturing does not touch the device or support updates after its in the hands of Verizon. The developer model is not Verizon approved, nor is Verizon happy its going to be sold [from what I am told] however per FCC open network regulations Verizon has to allow the device on the network. Updates for the developer model will be directly from Samsung.
I was able to get the Samsung Apps (store) sideloaded on my device BTW. Verizon requested it be removed which is why its not on the device pre-installed. S-Suggest is NOT the same thing as Samsung Apps. Will Write something up here on XDA later when I get a chance.
07/24/12
The Electronic Frontier Foundation called me back and said they need more info on Block C. I am out of town until next Monday and let them know I would get back to them in a few days. They also are finding a lawyer who will do it pro bono. Looks like this may actually make it to court.
So we have root but we are still locked down unlike all other carriers. Basically this is going to turn into a Droid X situation and for those who know what I am talking about you know how bad this still sucks.
I am tired of this crap guys, and think with the amount of SG3 phones sold in the US and specifically Verizon, this is the time to strike back against all encrypted devices not just the GS3. We have dealt with this garbage long enough and now its time to end nonsense.
Kirtland and Packard, (310) 536-1000, 2361 Rosecrans Ave Ste 450, El Segundo, CA 90245
That's the law firm that won the huge case against Verizon over the Motorola v710 BT lockdown. I have left them a message asking if they will take this case too. In reality this one is going to vastly larger then the Moto case because of the number of users that have this device.
Please call them and let them know on the main VM that you too have been effected by this lockdown, or any lockdown in the US on any carrier. The more people who call the more likely they will take the case. Lots of people calling is how the guys over at Howard Forums were able to get the ball rolling on the v710, so let history repeat itself for the sake of every dev, phone enthusiast, and civil rights advocate.
ROM developers usually work off of donations and by encrypting this and other devices Verizon is stealing from these developers who's livelihood is phone software development. Software developers who want an open platform also have to deal with the hassle that Verizon and other carriers have put them through by locking down devices. If the personal computer was locked down like this when it was first created and sold to people we would never be where we were today technology wise. The crippling of our mobile devices needs to stop, and it needs to stop now.
Its time to take the fight to Verizon and hopefully end the lockdowns once and for all. If the lawfirm takes the case this is going to be winner takes all. This may be our best shot to end device lockdowns in the US once and for all.
I think the push we will make is going to be Block C. Normally Verizon could argue that they locked the device [against the FCC Block C mandate] because of network security. This is going to be hard for them to argue though when every other carrier in the US and internationally has not encrypted the device. It's a long shot, and its going to be up hill, but as far as I see it this is our best chance and the time to strike on this issue is now.
Samsung Level III opens in 30 min. Will update again soon.
Level III is not in on the weekends, so I was just told by the automated message I got when the guy transferred me to that department. ok... Not what they told me yesterday but ok.
So Monday at 8am PST it is, and that's also when Verizon corporate will be calling me back too as the past two calls they have made to me have been the ass crack of dawn. If I time it right I can conference the two in and let them try and point the finger at the other one, to each others faces. No more "That's what the manufacture wanted, go talk to them" vs "That's what the carrier wanted, talk to them" runaround bull****.
Anyway, no updates till Monday then. That gives me time to root.
i'll be the first to say it but thank you
going above and beyond especially considering nobody asked you to do this. great work and i hope it leads to some results
chill145 said:
i'll be the first to say it but thank you
going above and beyond especially considering nobody asked you to do this. great work and i hope it leads to some results
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Yes thank you 100%, we are all in this together.
Also please file FCC Consumer Complaints against Verizon for potentially violating the openness requirements of the Block C spectrum purchasing agreement.
https://esupport.fcc.gov/ccmsforms/form2000.action?form_type=2000F
http://www.xda-developers.com/android/it-is-illegal-for-verizon-to-lock-some-bootloaders/
It's a long shot, but maybe worth it.
Have filed complaint with FCC and BBB, posted poor review on both Blue and White versons on VZW website, wall post ripping them apart on VZW facebook, poor reviews on every device site that will let me do so that I know of, personal contact with VZW reps filing complaints.
Any other avenues we can take?
Here's what I wrote in my FCC complaint:
The new Samsung Galaxy SIII on Verizon Wireless has a locked and encrypted bootloader, which appears to violate the openness requirements that Verizon agreed to when it purchased Block C, pursuant to § 27.16 (b) of 47 CFR Ch. I (10–1–10 Edition) available here-- http://www.gpo.gov/fdsys/pkg/CFR-2010-title47-vol2/pdf/CFR-2010-title47-vol2-sec27-16.pdf
§ 27.16 (e) clearly states "Handset locking prohibited" except under certain circumstances previously delineated. The anti-consumer actions taken by Verizon impinge upon the free of use of devices by consumers, and potentially harms the livelihoods of developers, who may not be able to do their work on the device of their choice.
I would appreciate the FCC investigating and clarifying this situation.
Thank you,
Thinking further about it, with how prominent devices are in today's world, would various news providers not want to run this story as well?
I recommend tipping off any local newspaper and news station you have access to. Lets get this story out there~!
Thalinor said:
So we have root but we are still locked down unlike all other carriers. Basically this is going to turn into a Droid X situation and for those who know what I am talking about you know how bad this still sucks.
I am tired of this crap guys, and think with the amount of SG3 phones sold in the US and specifically Verizon, this is the time to strike back against all encrypted devices not just the GS3. We have dealt with this garbage long enough and now its time to end nonsense.
Kirtland and Packard, (310) 536-1000, 2361 Rosecrans Ave Ste 450, El Segundo, CA 90245
That's the law firm that won the huge case against Verizon over the Motorola v710 BT lockdown. I have left them a message asking if they will take this case too. In reality this one is going to vastly larger then the Moto case because of the number of users that have this device.
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I know that the dev's are working there rear ends off, and I appreciate all their efforts. I am truly pulling for them and hope that they can get the bootloader figured out. I'm not an expert, but in my opinion the ROMs on the DX didn't compare to a fully unlocked device and I'd prefer not to have to suffer through 2+ years of touchwiz.
Thalinor,
I agree that this maybe turning into the Droid X. As a droid x owner, waiting and watching for 18 months to see VZW and Motorola dump on us, I don't think we'll get anywhere with them. There was a huge effort on the DX with petitions, phone calls, emails, twitter, and FB posts.
Just a thought, but what about petitioning the law firm to take up this case. We are not going to get anywhere from VZW's or Samsung's pity for us. If this bootloader is truly encrypted, and if it is anything like the DX, the only way we will get this device completely unlocked is through a legal obligation on VZW's part. I think our energy would be better spent with the Attorneys who stand to profit from this case rather than burning our energy on VZW and Samsung who probably don't give a crap. I would think that the law-firm would have some interest in this (maybe?):
File with the FCC:
http://www.fcc.gov/complaints/
Talk about the Block C complaints. Don't attack them.
Post on VZW's Facebook:
https://www.facebook.com/verizon
Talk about how dissatisfied you are and how you're looking to switch. Don't attack them.
Post on Samsung Mobile's Facebook:
https://www.facebook.com/SamsungMobile
Don't attack them. Talk about how you will reconsider purchasing their devices in the future. They don't want to have to lock bootloaders, Verizon is almost certainly making them do it.
File with the BBB:
http://www.bbb.org/us/verizon-wireless/
Talk about how anti-competitive their practices are and how dissatisfied you are as a customer. Require an answer.
Complain to Verizon Wireless' Site:
https://www.verizonwireless.com/b2c/contact/email.jsp
Don't attack them. Keep in mind you're talking to an employee, they didn't choose to lock down the bootloader. Be respectful but make your concern noted.
The problem lies with Verizon Wireless. They believe that there are not enough people concerned about this to affect their profit margin. You need to show that you will vote with your dollar and move somewhere else if this complaint is not answered. Also, bring up the Block C agreement. There are potential legal repercussions-- meaning that the FCC may be the best place to direct your complaints. Be respectful, I know we're upset, but being pissed off won't get you anywhere.
I just filled out a complaint with the FCC basically asking them to enforce the Block C agreement from Verizon.
I'll phone the lawyers posted on the first page when I get a chance at work tomorrow.
amt897 said:
File with the FCC:
http://www.fcc.gov/complaints/
Talk about the Block C complaints. Don't attack them.
Post on VZW's Facebook:
https://www.facebook.com/verizon
Talk about how dissatisfied you are and how you're looking to switch. Don't attack them.
Post on Samsung Mobile's Facebook:
https://www.facebook.com/SamsungMobile
Don't attack them. Talk about how you will reconsider purchasing their devices in the future. They don't want to have to lock bootloaders, Verizon is almost certainly making them do it.
File with the BBB:
http://www.bbb.org/us/verizon-wireless/
Talk about how anti-competitive their practices are and how dissatisfied you are as a customer. Require an answer.
Complain to Verizon Wireless' Site:
https://www.verizonwireless.com/b2c/contact/email.jsp
Don't attack them. Keep in mind you're talking to an employee, they didn't choose to lock down the bootloader. Be respectful but make your concern noted.
The problem lies with Verizon Wireless. They believe that there are not enough people concerned about this to affect their profit margin. You need to show that you will vote with your dollar and move somewhere else if this complaint is not answered. Also, bring up the Block C agreement. There are potential legal repercussions-- meaning that the FCC may be the best place to direct your complaints. Be respectful, I know we're upset, but being pissed off won't get you anywhere.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I don't even own an S3, nor am I on Verizon, but damn't...I'm doing every one of things and calling just out of principle. I'm glad I left Verizon a long time ago, but they still tried to get more for money for almost 2 years. Damn near ruined my credit...assholes are going down.
Sent from my SGH-I727 using xda premium
I'd love to see this in major media:
"The Samsung S3 is a excellent smartphone, but Verizon's software modifications have made it unlikely to be upgraded and supported long term. If that's important to you, we recommend you consider another carrier."
My girlfriend used to work for the local news, I'll talk to her about contacting her friends at the station and see if I can get a face to face, or at least an email contact. I'll have to dig up all the info I can on the block C stuff and locked/encrypted bootloaders to take to them first.
Sent from my Droid X until I get my SGS3
block c
The Block C issue relates more toward unlocked devices like the nexus on the play store than unlocked bootloaders. You may be able to press the unlocked bootloader issue under the 'open applications' provision, but obviously that did a ton of good for Google Wallet. Of course, I can't find a single device you can use on Verizon's network that isn't held in verizon's death grip, so even the open device provision seems to be being ignored. The worst part is that verizon filed suits against these provisions and LOST. But true to form, if you have enough money and pull, and are willing to screw your customers as every turn (share everything plans are such a great deal right?) you can break the law over and over in broad daylight, and no one with power will bat an eye. Also, I'm not sure why the 'open application' provision was never really used as a battering ram when in came to things like tethering applications.
I think this type of work is very important. Thanks so much. Very much looking forward to hearing more from the companies themselves about why they make these types of decisions. Can't wait for an update here.
Sent from my Incredible 2 using xda app-developers app
Complained with the FCC, here is my complaint for anyone looking for somewhat of a template.
Recently, after preordering a Samsung Galaxy s3 handset from Verizon, I learned that they have violated the openness requirements of the Block C spectrum purchasing agreement by encrypting my device. This directly impacts my ability to enjoy my phone, and take advantage of the spectrum which Verizon owns. While I understand that the purchasing agreement gives Verizon leeway in regards to "reasonable" protection of the network, no other carrier in the United States (or the world), has done this, leading me to believe that this action is indeed unreasonable. It is unfair and anti-competitive for a company to misuse frequencies they own in this way.
I appreciate your time, and would appreciate a response in this matter.
Thank you,
With Verizon Twitter claiming it was Samsung, I'm curious what both companies said.
skennelly said:
I know that the dev's are working there rear ends off, and I appreciate all their efforts. I am truly pulling for them and hope that they can get the bootloader figured out. I'm not an expert, but in my opinion the ROMs on the DX didn't compare to a fully unlocked device and I'd prefer not to have to suffer through 2+ years of touchwiz.
Thalinor,
Just a thought, but what about petitioning the law firm to take up this case. We are not going to get anywhere from VZW's or Samsung's pity for us. If this bootloader is truly encrypted, and if it is anything like the DX, the only way we will get this device completely unlocked is through a legal obligation on VZW's part. I think our energy would be better spent with the Attorneys who stand to profit from this case rather than burning our energy on VZW and Samsung who probably don't give a crap. I would think that the law-firm would have some interest in this (maybe?):
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
That's the whole point! I certainly don't have the money to go up against Verizon and do not want to make a dime out of this; that's not the point at all. I want Verizon to once and for all agree to stop ****ing with our phones. Phones should be sold locked not signed/encrypted.
Locked protects Verizon or the manufacture from having to eat the costs of a new phone when an end user breaks their device doing something irresponsible. I don't want Verizon paying for people's screwed up devices because eventually it will lead to MY bill going up. Its not my fault if someone screw's up their device. On the other hand by encrypting the bootloader Verizon is forcing people to do things that may lead to breaking your phone. If the manufacture offered a phone number for unlocking, where you would agree that unless it was something hardware defective, if you unlock and your device breaks, its not under warranty. Problem solved for everyone; no encrypted bootloader needed.
I am going after Verizon but this is really about every carrier who gimps cell phones. Smartphones have become pocket computers. They are no longer PDA's, or "like" pocket computers, they ARE pocket computers. Hell, my SG3 is got better hardware specs than the **** netbooks people waited in line for last black Friday at Walmart. If we consider netbooks in that they come giving the buyer full administrative access over the device and yet still give the end user the option to hook it up to Wi-Fi. One way or another my devices are hooking up to a company who I pay for data and/or voice service. My rights should be universal and now that the device in my pocket has evolved into a full blown computer, my access rights should evolve as well. Whether its a computer in your pocket or a computer on your desk, it can be used in accordance with your providers service agreement, or it can be abused.
Prejudging your entire customer base to abuse your network and handing down sentence as judge, jury, and executioner like Verizon has done, before people have even had the chance to make the decision to do right or wrong; to me that just violates every ideal set forth in this countries constitution. I am ****ing sick of corporate america ****ting on this countries citizens, and the whole god damn world for that matter. It needs to stop. While I despise lawyers to the core, I sincerely hope they take on this case and prove there are still people in the field who remember why their profession exists (Hint: Its NOT to make money) and that there is some justice left in this country.
/end rant
Update: Talked to Verizon Exec, they have passed info on to the lawyers to look over and may or may not get back to me; at this point its out of her hands.
Update: I have not heard back from the lawyers above, but another user here on XDA PM'd me and said they were able to talk to someone today who told them that the legal team was looking into the case and make a decision after getting more information. They have my number, if they want to call me they can; if not I could care less who spear heads this as long as the battle is fought and won.
Update: I called Samsung, talked to Level I, they tried to transfer me to level III, I was put on told and Level I came back and said they would call me back later. The call never came. I will try them again more vigorously tomorrow.
MichaelVash7886 said:
With Verizon Twitter claiming it was Samsung, I'm curious what both companies said.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
LMFAO @ Verizon's blatant bull**** lies. Why would Samsung decide, at their own free will and expense, to sign-encrypt ONLY Verizon's Galaxy S3, and not one other carrier in the world? Verizon is full of **** and the fact they think the line "Its the other guys fault" is actually going to work, is flat out ****ing insulting.
Screenshot that and post it here please. I do not use social networking; if they really need to spy on me they have my smartphone information, and know where to find me.
Ok I am just going to throw it out there. Please just hold the waves of "can't" and "not gonna work" negativity is just a waste. There are ways to get your voice heard that have worked for me in the past and here is my suggestion. The more the merrier!
Problem is Verizon put a encrypted bootloader on the Samsung Galaxy S3. The bigger problem and the angle we should have is they sold it to us with out letting us know their difference. News of the other S3's sold around the world painted a clear image of what we were getting into... "The same phone." Samsung had used their brand to deliver one device between all networks. Yes there were some cpu changes due to networks but that was noted everywhere. Verizon always note differences in how great there network is and the plus's in their service over others but nothing on the one change they had done to the Galaxy S3 vs the entire world. Obviously because its a negative. Their sales model was we are selling the Galaxy S3 and since we thought we were getting the same product we ordered it. Thats pretty big. Complaining here on xda I think is a waste.., the petition... I did sign btw but unfortunetly is just noise to Verizon. Everyone has to call with the general attitude of being frustrated like they have not been honestly sold a product and that trust was broken.
Don't get mad, don't start going threatening to jump ship... say that this really has broken our trust, don't mention technical info or just lightly because they are not going to have a clue. Say that they made no mention anywhere nor any employee informed you that their device was locked down vs any other and that they do a great job of letting you know market, network, and service differences but didn't lift a finger to let you know about the phone difference being a negative. Lastly listen to what they say as frustrating as it may be and say you want to find a way to rectify this what ever it takes.
Don't make calling your daily task, but just call when you have time... IE ride into work, ride home. Talk to the cust rep and when that fizzles ask for a super. Hang up call again then explain the same frustration and how you even more frustrated with the crappy response the previous rep and that its not acceptable. Just keep asking who you can talk to. If half there customer support traffic is from the locked bootloader and misleading sales thats going to send a pretty good message plus everything else thats going on with news online.
Lastly you could even email them, the more the better. The whole deal here is the message needs to be going to THE MAN... Big Red. Not the message being found out by the man reading it in off of some blog. The additional traffic to their general daily cycle work will send a strong concern message but with the same message of being misleading sales starts to make it a big deal. If this goes mainstream that can be very threatening. There is no guarantee it will work but the more headlines of frustrated and upset customers is really bad for them. No business wants to be linked to upset mis-informed customers...That is a trust issue in the Verizon Name.
Side note: This refocused energy may also help the DEV work with less noise and clutter. Everyone wants to help which is cool but so many none useful comments. If it was that easy these guys would have already done it. Lets let them reverse engineer things while we use our energy usefully to stir things up on the other end.
Boss428man said:
Ok I am just going to throw it out there. Please just hold the waves of "can't" and "not gonna work" negativity is just a waste. There are ways to get your voice heard that have worked for me in the past and here is my suggestion. The more the merrier!
Problem is Verizon put a encrypted bootloader on the Samsung Galaxy S3. The bigger problem and the angle we should have is they sold it to us with out letting us know their difference. News of the other S3's sold around the world painted a clear image of what we were getting into... "The same phone." Samsung had used their brand to deliver one device between all networks. Yes there were some cpu changes due to networks but that was noted everywhere. Verizon always note differences in how great there network is and the plus's in their service over others but nothing on the one change they had done to the Galaxy S3 vs the entire world. Obviously because its a negative. Their sales model was we are selling the Galaxy S3 and since we thought we were getting the same product we ordered it. Thats pretty big. Complaining here on xda I think is a waste.., the petition... I did sign btw but unfortunetly is just noise to Verizon. Everyone has to call with the general attitude of being frustrated like they have not been honestly sold a product and that trust was broken.
Don't get mad, don't start going threatening to jump ship... say that this really has broken our trust, don't mention technical info or just lightly because they are not going to have a clue. Say that they made no mention anywhere nor any employee informed you that their device was locked down vs any other and that they do a great job of letting you know market, network, and service differences but didn't lift a finger to let you know about the phone difference being a negative. Lastly listen to what they say as frustrating as it may be and say you want to find a way to rectify this what ever it takes.
Don't make calling your daily task, but just call when you have time... IE ride into work, ride home. Talk to the cust rep and when that fizzles ask for a super. Hang up call again then explain the same frustration and how you even more frustrated with the crappy response the previous rep and that its not acceptable. Just keep asking who you can talk to. If half there customer support traffic is from the locked bootloader and misleading sales thats going to send a pretty good message plus everything else thats going on with news online.
Lastly you could even email them, the more the better. The whole deal here is the message needs to be going to THE MAN... Big Red. Not the message being found out by the man reading it in off of some blog. The additional traffic to their general daily cycle work will send a strong concern message but with the same message of being misleading sales starts to make it a big deal. If this goes mainstream that can be very threatening. There is no guarantee it will work but the more headlines of frustrated and upset customers is really bad for them. No business wants to be linked to upset mis-informed customers...That is a trust issue in the Verizon Name.
Side note: This refocused energy may also help the DEV work with less noise and clutter. Everyone wants to help which is cool but so many none useful comments. If it was that easy these guys would have already done it. Lets let them reverse engineer things while we use our energy usefully to stir things up on the other end.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Such a great post :good:
I totally agree and I think this will catch their attention way more than anything we can do online. I'm in.
Wont do anything different. They'll tell you the same thing they told me after I filed a BBB complaint against thrm for my X2. "Your totally right our phones blow, so let me early upgrade you or do ypu want to terminate your contract for X amount of money?"
mike86325 said:
Such a great post :good:
I totally agree and I think this will catch their attention way more than anything we can do online. I'm in.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Thank you for the kind words, Its the same angle I talk to Verizon about on the 28th the day that they said the Unlimited Data was gone.. I told them that I found out from everyone but them and how they didn't inform me in any way.
We need to get more people on the non informed purchase angle. They make no mention online or anywhere. Sure Pocketnow and like sites do but they are not selling us the phone. Their image is even worse now that Corp and Tech release 2 different statements.
I really hope this gets unlocked easily because I really like the phone really nice feel to it.
This is a good approach. As someone who pitches in with customer service/support for a tech company, it's often the "nice" people who get better responses, and the quantity of requests can have a bigger affect.... way more than one angry person ranting and raving that you can just write off and ignore.
Also, it's still a person at the other end of the line. They probably are not aware of the situation or don't like it either, but it's their job. It's the people at the top that usually push down these horrible policies, the bean counters and such that don't have to deal with the angry public.
I work at a major utility. Please remember that if you call be nice to the customer service representative you are taking to. They are only the messenger, please remember that. They are not allowed too much latitude with what they can do for you. The reason for your call is logged and reviewed by the management of the company so if you call constantly and take up customer service minutes over the locked bootloader you WILL have an impact on daily business and cause management of the company to fix the problem. Calling customer service works.
Sent from my ADR6300 using Tapatalk 2
Boss428man said:
Ok I am just going to throw it out there. Please just hold the waves of "can't" and "not gonna work" negativity is just a waste. There are ways to get your voice heard that have worked for me in the past and here is my suggestion. The more the merrier!
Problem is Verizon put a encrypted bootloader on the Samsung Galaxy S3. The bigger problem and the angle we should have is they sold it to us with out letting us know their difference. News of the other S3's sold around the world painted a clear image of what we were getting into... "The same phone." Samsung had used their brand to deliver one device between all networks. Yes there were some cpu changes due to networks but that was noted everywhere. Verizon always note differences in how great there network is and the plus's in their service over others but nothing on the one change they had done to the Galaxy S3 vs the entire world. Obviously because its a negative. Their sales model was we are selling the Galaxy S3 and since we thought we were getting the same product we ordered it. Thats pretty big. Complaining here on xda I think is a waste.., the petition... I did sign btw but unfortunetly is just noise to Verizon. Everyone has to call with the general attitude of being frustrated like they have not been honestly sold a product and that trust was broken.
Don't get mad, don't start going threatening to jump ship... say that this really has broken our trust, don't mention technical info or just lightly because they are not going to have a clue. Say that they made no mention anywhere nor any employee informed you that their device was locked down vs any other and that they do a great job of letting you know market, network, and service differences but didn't lift a finger to let you know about the phone difference being a negative. Lastly listen to what they say as frustrating as it may be and say you want to find a way to rectify this what ever it takes.
Don't make calling your daily task, but just call when you have time... IE ride into work, ride home. Talk to the cust rep and when that fizzles ask for a super. Hang up call again then explain the same frustration and how you even more frustrated with the crappy response the previous rep and that its not acceptable. Just keep asking who you can talk to. If half there customer support traffic is from the locked bootloader and misleading sales thats going to send a pretty good message plus everything else thats going on with news online.
Lastly you could even email them, the more the better. The whole deal here is the message needs to be going to THE MAN... Big Red. Not the message being found out by the man reading it in off of some blog. The additional traffic to their general daily cycle work will send a strong concern message but with the same message of being misleading sales starts to make it a big deal. If this goes mainstream that can be very threatening. There is no guarantee it will work but the more headlines of frustrated and upset customers is really bad for them. No business wants to be linked to upset mis-informed customers...That is a trust issue in the Verizon Name.
Side note: This refocused energy may also help the DEV work with less noise and clutter. Everyone wants to help which is cool but so many none useful comments. If it was that easy these guys would have already done it. Lets let them reverse engineer things while we use our energy usefully to stir things up on the other end.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I feel for you guys. I really do. We've tried everything with the One X but to no avail. Good luck with your attempts. These carriers need to remember who gives them their money.
Sent from my HTC One X using xda app-developers app
manchild83 said:
I work at a major utility. Please remember that if you call be nice to the customer service representative you are taking to. They are only the messenger, please remember that. They are not allowed too much latitude with what they can do for you. The reason for your call is logged and reviewed by the management of the company so if you call constantly and take up customer service minutes over the locked bootloader you WILL have an impact on daily business and cause management of the company to fix the problem. Calling customer service works.
Sent from my ADR6300 using Tapatalk 2
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Thank you for the comment and good to hear your advise!
Ok now we really have been miss sold. The answers I have recieved from support are well making there position worse they said that not only the bricking of devices but that these open devices would take down their data networks do to use. If that is the case why release the "Developer Edition". Everything will break lose anyway. We all pre-ordered thinking we got a unlocked Galaxy S3 and now with out any word of additional editions they try and fix things...?
Where was an unlocked phone advertised or even realistically expected?
It sucks but VZW is so big and doesn't care at all, and won't suffer much from it.
Sent from my AT&T Galaxy SIII (SGH-i747)
yes it was expected since EVER model that has been released thats att tmo sprint international korean and us cellular ALL are unlocked.
Thats it it wasn't printed that it was locked it was advertised just like the other Galaxy s3's... They were sell you the same Galaxy S3 with the same experience you would expect unless other wise noted... which it wasn't... They should just offer to unlock our phones and void the warranty. Simple fix and essentially the same thing they have done with the Developer Edition and it would save them some returns..
I've submitted two reviews on the Verizon website giving my honest opinion of the device. They have denied posting both times due to what they say violates the guidelines. Admittedly, my first review was rather harsh. After the first denial, I went back and read the guidelines and posted a very toned down version. I didn't post anything that was specifically prohibited in the second review. They did not see it that way and denied posting the second version for the same given reason. Apparently, Verizon will not tolerate ANY criticism of their company by reviewers.
Here are their guidelines:
Verizon values your feedback!
When writing your review, please consider the following guidelines:
Focus on the product and your individual experience using it
Provide details about why you liked or disliked a product
All submitted reviews are subject to the terms set forth in our Terms of Use
We reserve the right not to post your review if it contains any of the following types of content or violates other guidelines:
Obscenities, discriminatory language, or other language not suitable for a public forum
Advertisements, “spam” content, or references to other products, offers, or websites
Email addresses, URLs, phone numbers, physical addresses or other forms of contact information
Critical or spiteful comments on other reviews posted on the page or their authors
In addition, if you wish to share feedback with us about product selection, pricing, ordering, delivery or other customer service issues, please do not submit this feedback through a product review. Instead, contact us directly.
Enjoy writing your review!
What is the text of your review?
KarlStyles said:
What is the text of your review?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I didn't keep my exact text, but this is pretty close to what I said in my edited review:
Samsung did a great job designing this device. Why isn't this device sold with an unlockable bootloader as the manufacturer intended? Power users should be able to use their own property as they see fit as long as it doesn't break any laws.
I'm disappointed that Verizon chose not to offer the 32gb version of this phone. Because of the way that Android manages memory, many apps can't be moved to the Micro SD card. For users that need a lot of apps, memory will quickly become an issue.
I'm not happy that the phone is sold loaded down with software that is designed to promote sales and marketing of other products and I'm not allowed to disable or uninstall it.
They own the site so they're entitled to filter content as they see fit.
Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G900A using xda app-developers app
mike163 said:
I didn't keep my exact text, but this is pretty close to what I said in my edited review:
Samsung did a great job designing this device. Why isn't this device sold with an unlockable bootloader as the manufacturer intended? Power users should be able to use their own property as they see fit as long as it doesn't break any laws.
I'm disappointed that Verizon chose not to offer the 32gb version of this phone. Because of the way that Android manages memory, many apps can't be moved to the Micro SD card. For users that need a lot of apps, memory will quickly become an issue.
I'm not happy that the phone is sold loaded down with software that is designed to promote sales and marketing of other products and I'm not allowed to disable or uninstall it.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I don't disagree with anything you said, but it does fall out of their guidelines. It is more a complaint against Verizon than a review of the phone. Maybe the way to go about it is to rephrase it more like a product review. For example, instead of generalizing on limited apps to card, phrase it as your experience. Something like "unlike previous phones, the new android system didn't let me move as many apps to the external card. As a result, I find the 16 gb storage is filling up quickly." Then move to disappointed that Verizon doesn't have 32gb version.
Similarly you can mention that the device runs ok, and Samsung added a feature to turn off system apps in order to conserve battery and reduce clutter. But then move to however there is a lot of bloat that can't be turned off.
I'm not sure what to do with the rooting portion, maybe keep it as a final note rather than making that your main point. I would also add a starting statement of "I've used the phone for x days and here's my impression so far". That may be enough to qualify it to their standard.
Btw, you didn't mention the fact that Verizon disabled two of the main advertised features of the phone - download boost and finger print payments.
You must be maintain guidelines.. All time..
I'm considering going back to T-Mobile over the S5 root issues. It gets worse and worse each year with them. I've been a loyal customer for 10 years and they took my unlimited away, bloated my phone with apps, raised rates and now they pretty much don't allow the truth to be told on their site. I've been due for an upgrade for a LONG time and I think I might take up t-mo's buy out your contract thing just to stick it to them.
1timer said:
I'm considering going back to T-Mobile over the S5 root issues. It gets worse and worse each year with them. I've been a loyal customer for 10 years and they took my unlimited away, bloated my phone with apps, raised rates and now they pretty much don't allow the truth to be told on their site. I've been due for an upgrade for a LONG time and I think I might take up t-mo's buy out your contract thing just to stick it to them.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I'm debating going with you to be honest.
thewebsiteisdown said:
I'm debating going with you to be honest.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Me too. Another Cincinnatian here as well. Shame T-Mo coverage isn't that great here. Neither is Sprint...only good ones are VZW and ATT and C-Bell (now VZW! I think I am gonna puke).
SOCOM-HERO said:
Me too. Another Cincinnatian here as well. Shame T-Mo coverage isn't that great here. Neither is Sprint...only good ones are VZW and ATT and C-Bell (now VZW! I think I am gonna puke).
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Look what I just read.
http://www.smh.com.au/technology/te...s-browsing-to-advertisers-20140426-zqzzq.html
thewebsiteisdown said:
Look what I just read.
http://www.smh.com.au/technology/te...s-browsing-to-advertisers-20140426-zqzzq.html
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Do you know that every other provider DOESN'T do this? Doubt it's just VZW.
jmill75 said:
Do you know that every other provider DOESN'T do this? Doubt it's just VZW.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Verizon has their phones locked down completely and T-mobile doesn't. There for I can rid the problem with T-mobile pretty easily, not so much with Verizon. That's my point what's yours?
thewebsiteisdown said:
Verizon has their phones locked down completely and T-mobile doesn't. There for I can rid the problem with T-mobile pretty easily, not so much with Verizon. That's my point what's yours?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
LOL, yes you may be able to get rid of carrier IQ type programs running on your phone. Not sure what this has to do with TMOBILE seeing what websites you are visiting using there network and selling this to advertising companies etc....
Ex 2: Just because I run Chrome in incognito mode doesn't mean Time Warner doesn't monitor my traffic.
Back to you, whats your point, you said it like "OMG LOOK AT WHAT I JUST READ" "BAD VERIZON"
LOLOLOLOLOL
jmill75 said:
LOL, yes you may be able to get rid of carrier IQ type programs running on your phone. Not sure what this has to do with TMOBILE seeing what websites you are visiting using there network and selling this to advertising companies etc....
Ex 2: Just because I run Chrome in incognito mode doesn't mean Time Warner doesn't monitor my traffic.
Back to you, whats your point, you said it like "OMG LOOK AT WHAT I JUST READ" "BAD VERIZON"
LOLOLOLOLOL
Click to expand...
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Almost all mega-corps data mine like crazy. Fine. Discover that I like rooting on XDA, have a facebook account, play video games...I don't care.
What I do care about is being able to do what I want, when I want with my device. VZW doesn't seem to care about the customer at all anymore.
SOCOM-HERO said:
Almost all mega-corps data mine like crazy. Fine. Discover that I like rooting on XDA, have a facebook account, play video games...I don't care.
What I do care about is being able to do what I want, when I want with my device. VZW doesn't seem to care about the customer at all anymore.
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Exactly thank you for summing it up for me.
VZW, and ATT, are required by law to allow you to network unlock the device, not boot loader unlock. The carrier covers warranty claims on the device, therefore it is in their interest to minimize the amount of damage "power users" can do to their devices
in my opinion, this trend of carriers locking bootloaders is the direct result of unscrupulous "modders" sending in for warranty or insurance claims after bricking their devices.
finally, we are by far the minority of smartphone users. a very very small percentage of Samsung, or the carriers, customer base and we DO have other options. the Nexus line, HTC with their unlockable bootloaders, GPE, and Dev edition devices.
/rant sorry
Russ77 said:
great input, thanks.
call it whatever you want, companies are in business to make money. if they're giving up profit margin due to fraudulent warranty claims on modified devices, they're well within their rights to sell locked devices.
was anyone here really surprised that the s5 is locked? really?
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How much profit has been lost on this? $10k? $1 million? If you took the entire user base of XDA or any other tech forum and had all of them return broken phones, then you'd attention of a company like VZW. Otherwise, they don't care. They just want to pick a fight they can win easily and make the "modding" community look bad because 1% have not followed directions or are just plain dumb.
A) if you bring in a rooted device that is bricked, they won't even offer you a claim
B) How many people are dumb enough to spend hours on XDA and other sites following instructions and asking questions, only to just give up and go back to VZW/ATT with their bricked phone and say "Idk how this happened?"
Please. These companies aren't in business to make money, they are in business to advance an agenda for shareholders while raking in the money from consumers who have a rapidly disappearing range of options to consider. Cincinnati is a great recent example. Our local provider just got bought out by VZW and at the same time, laid off a decent chunk of staff to make way for the corporate shift. All the while, these same companies lie to the customer with their marketing fluff.
I am not an advocate for one carrier over another, as I have no vested interest in any one of them over another. However, I will say that T-Mo's "in your face" approach to their new marketing is quite polarizing to the rest of the status quo in the industry of "corporate bs doublespeak" where one day you have a contract for $99/mo unlimited everything, and the next, you are paying $130 with a data cap. (Which happens to be what happened to me).
If the PC industry was this way, we wouldn't have half the progress we have seen in the last 20 years. Instead, the PC industry (mac included) embraced unique user created content (hackers included) and actually employed some of those who were great at it to work for them. But, NO, not in the telecom industry. It is the most ridiculous double standard.
So yes, these companies can go shove it. I'm done here. I won't be getting an S5 or and HTC M8 at this point. I have analyzed the phones and neither one is getting the "ok" from me anyhow. I just think it is very interesting how much a company is willing to combat what the "android community," if you can even call it one, has become.
A bunch of polarizing, angry tech loving people who never agree on anything, myself included. Get me out of here. I'm done.
Make it easy on yourself. Don't buy Samsung-Verizon ****. I got an m8. Sharp looking phone, rooted and unlocked in days. Even if you rock stock, there is far less bloat. Sense isn't the steaming pile that touchwiz is. And they sell 32 GB for the same price as this unholy garbage.
SOCOM-HERO said:
Me too. Another Cincinnatian here as well. Shame T-Mo coverage isn't that great here. Neither is Sprint...only good ones are VZW and ATT and C-Bell (now VZW! I think I am gonna puke).
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I'm from NKY and just switched from sprint to T-Mobile. I don't get LTE in NKY, and I haven't been to Cinci yet since the switch. That being said, my coverage has been pretty good and so long as I'm in anything resembling civilization I pretty much always get 4g (5-10Mbps). It's not all bad, and hopefully LTE is on the way, Unlimited data is nice, and I have JUMP, so being able to upgrade yearly is awesome as well.
1timer said:
I'm considering going back to T-Mobile over the S5 root issues. It gets worse and worse each year with them. I've been a loyal customer for 10 years and they took my unlimited away, bloated my phone with apps, raised rates and now they pretty much don't allow the truth to be told on their site. I've been due for an upgrade for a LONG time and I think I might take up t-mo's buy out your contract thing just to stick it to them.
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They didn't take away unlimited, they basically forced you to opt out of that option in order to pay for contract price phones when you upgrade. I've never had the unlimited, so it's nothing I really bothered to complain about. I did however, end up doubling my coverage for the same price one day 2 years ago when I was on the My Verizon app, and noticed they were offering it. Of course they didn't bother to advertise it anywhere else though.
I will never lose Verizon. I know it sucks how freaking crazy they are locking everything, but there are Devs out there who always find a way. I can not simply give up the best coverage just for root. As much as it might suck one day, not being able to actually use your phone due to **** service would be even worse.
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k.electron said:
Make it easy on yourself. Don't buy Samsung-Verizon ****. I got an m8. Sharp looking phone, rooted and unlocked in days. Even if you rock stock, there is far less bloat. Sense isn't the steaming pile that touchwiz is. And they sell 32 GB for the same price as this unholy garbage.
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Samsung phones are superior to HTC. Not just my opinion, but basically backed up by facts. S5 has the best display on the market, hands down. Faster processor, better camera, better layout, better extras. The only thing the HTC has over the S5 is exterior speakers, but honestly, who even uses them that much? You're either listening to music on your headphones, or plugging the phone into better speakers anyways