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With the advent of iPhone (love or hate), and Android devices the broadcast media seem to be touting this technology as new, ignoring that us faithful WinMo users have been creating, downloading and using 'apps' and generally customising our phones for years.
I never hear of new releases for WinMo, but plenty about iPhone and increasingly Android - I'm thinking Spotify client and the new actual reality stuff where data is superimposed on the camera view; but there are many others.
I know there's loads of us out there, and we tend to look after ourselves, but the mainstream appears to be shunning the WM operating system.
I'd pay for a Spotify client, a WM version of Dynolicious, and I'm quite excited about actual reality, but I'm fast thinking WM is a dead technology.
So if we refute that, and laud the benefits of winmo.. will that reaffirm your belief in this mobile o/s?
Always dangerous letting others dictate whats relevant to your world.
66mustang said:
With the advent of iPhone (love or hate), and Android devices the broadcast media seem to be touting this technology as new, ignoring that us faithful WinMo users have been creating, downloading and using 'apps' and generally customising our phones for years.
I never hear of new releases for WinMo, but plenty about iPhone and increasingly Android - I'm thinking Spotify client and the new actual reality stuff where data is superimposed on the camera view; but there are many others.
I know there's loads of us out there, and we tend to look after ourselves, but the mainstream appears to be shunning the WM operating system.
I'd pay for a Spotify client, a WM version of Dynolicious, and I'm quite excited about actual reality, but I'm fast thinking WM is a dead technology.
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Click to collapse
IMHO, the reason that you hear more regarding the other o/s's is that they are newer and have much less testing and use than winmo does, not to mention less apps as well as more more problems and issues! Each time a new version of winmo comes out, we have to deal with the same types of problems, but as it is a more developed platform, it does not take as long to work out the bugs.
A good example here is when MS created that p.o.s system known as Vista! It was JUNK! Then over time, it got a bit better, but MS finally got smart and gave up on fixing it's many issues and has now developed Win 7.
Later............
Phen0m said:
So if we refute that, and laud the benefits of winmo.. will that reaffirm your belief in this mobile o/s?
Always dangerous letting others dictate whats relevant to your world.
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Click to collapse
What a rediculous argument. I know WM is the best mobile OS, but then Betamax was the best video system.
I'm not talking about what's important for me, I'm talking about what people see as available - WM gets no mainstream media coverage, no-one goes into shops asking for it (just try going into an O2 shop or Carphone Warehouse and attempting to get an informed conversation from the sales staff about any WM device) and then we get a snowball effect where none of the 'killer' apps are being devloped for it - all efforts are being made towards the iPhone because it's sexy, WM is much better, more flexible, but ultimately nerdy (not that the general public even know it exists).
Maybe it'll remain as the business class mobile OS, which I'll be happy with as there's always the skilled people on here and similar sites to keep the software coming. Thanks guys.
I think one of the main reasons why WinMo is being left behind is because other people are intimidated by it. iPhone and Android are more user friendly with less things to worry about. Whenever I suggested a WinMo phone to my friends, they always say something along the lines of "I don't want to get stuck with a bunch of problems"
I will say, that it does take some kind of persistance and knowledge of how this OS works in order to be able to fiddle around with it. In the mean time, I guess android and iPhone are the "go-to" devices for people who want something easy to start with.
I honestly would never choose an iPhone, and I've never used an Android, so I wouldn't know how closely Android resembles WinMo.
theomni said:
I honestly would never choose an iPhone, and I've never used an Android, so I wouldn't know how closely Android resembles WinMo.
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While the iPhone 3GS is becoming what the iPhone should have been in the first place - I would never get an iPhone either for all the familiar reasons. The iPhone's main UI is an icon fest. I'd like to seem more information on the home screen. Also, the control freakery of Apple when it comes to what apps are allowed to run is unacceptable to me.
Android on the other hand is leaving WM completely behind. The HTC Hero is just amazing. It makes WinMo look very clunky indeed. You have the power, flexibilty and openness of the WM platform, with almost the polish and usability of the iPhone platform - but with multi-tasking.
What's worse is that this does not have to be the case. PointUI shows what's possible with existing WM technology but for some reason M$ hasn't gone there up to now.
I have not seen WM6.5 or WM7 yet so I can't comment on how they are addressing the issue in these new versions.
Android need a while longer to mature. But at this moment it seems like Android is the new windows mobile. Customizable, opensource, HTC, app store, its like the bastard step child of what would happen if the IPHONE and WINMO had a one night stand. That said, I don't feel like Winmo is being left behind. You only need to look at the Samsung who makes phones for everyone but the Omnia was its "THE PHONE" and it ran on windows. HTC will not abandon windows, look at the anticipation for TD2 TP2. Toshiba is getting into the fray. Nvidia will soon be throwing some love into windows (based upon the look of the Zune HD, we could be in for some fun). Lets be honest, the phone market is Winmo'd out. Every brand except Nokia is cranking out phones and its an oversaturated market. Which is why its hard for any particular brand to make a big splash unless they innovate, innovation will push this market foward. This is an exciting time to have windows.
However, i do believe the problem is this, hardware. Clearly Winmo is a huge system to carry. Simple things need to disappear..huge load times, massive lag. These things make our devices, no matter how current the software is, seem ancient. This is up to M$ to fix, and for developer (HTC) to start addressing by using proper hardware...I'm tired of having underpowered devices, I'm tired of key things missing, companies need to step up to the plate. I applaud Toshiba for loading the TG01 to the teeth with hardware, but am disappointed in them letting a 5 year old design their interface. Like it or love it....this is where we sit. I wouldn't trade it for any other OS.
I think you're right when you say that every man and his dog are knocking out winmo phones - how many X1 users are aware that behind their panels is WM? It's not a must have for the average punter, at least not like the iPhone, that is just lovely to look at, but that's where it ends for me. When their adverts brag that you can cut and paste - to me that's the measure of the device. I would have been gutted if I'd got one and found it wouldn't do the simplest of tasks - almost like making a Walkman with no headphone socket; pointless.
I've no experience of Android, so i can't comment, but it appears to be going where WM should be.
I just wish that the mainstream media were a little more informed about WM and it's benefits, not least the adaptability and flexibility and the years of experience that is available.
I'm stuck on Windows Mobile because it's the only platform with the functionality I demand.
Android shows promise, and it may even have a decent Office suite if someone's ported OpenOffice.org (to help me overcome the lack of SoftMaker Office), but I don't know if the multimedia format support will be as good as TCPMP on Windows Mobile, and I certainly don't know if it has a PIM suite worth dirt, let alone capable of standing up to the good old Pocket Informant + PocketBreeze combo (or, better yet, an Apple Newton MessagePad 2000/2100, which is actually still a better device than the new iPhones and iPod touches in some respects, especially if it's PIM and battery life).
I must admit, though, the Creative Zii Egg enticed me with its specs. It just fell flat by not having a hardware keyboard and only having a 480x320 screen when I'm used to 640x480 and want to move all the way up to 800x480. Then again, the other device I want-the Samsung Mondi-has only a microSDHC slot as opposed to a full-size SDHC slot and only 4 GB of internal storage instead of a whopping 32 GB. It also lacks multitouch, but at least the resistive digitizer permits a stylus with a fine point. Finally, it's 50 US$ more expensive than the Zii Egg.
(Also, you might notice something in common with those two devices: they are NOT phones. What happened to the non-phone Windows Mobile devices, ruggedized GETAC units aside? I mean, Apple has the iPod touch for those who want most of the iPhone experience, but don't want to be tied to AT&T and may not even care for the phone part. The Samsung Mondi was a surprising exception to that rule, though it veers close to phone territory with that WiMAX radio. Just wait 'til Clearwire gets some actual coverage, and Mondi owners are gonna Skype/Google Voice/VoIP it up...)
I believe Windows Mobile is being left behind in terms of processing speed of its applications. Sure they are releasing devices with powerful processors to cope up, but I believe the best solution is to redesign WM from within, so that even slow processors can handle humongous applications. Other than that...I don't think I have any other complaints against WM. That is why I have always been praying for more powerful devices.
Honestly, I think the truth is that WM6 is going to be dead in the near future. I expect WM7 to be a radical departure from previous versions, and I think we'll see a more powerful, more functional, more consumer-friendly ecosystem emerge. Unless, of course, it tanks.
WM6 isn't dead yet from a user standpoint and there IS new software being released, especially cool little user-made apps. For flashy commercial apps, though, I think it's largely a dead platform. Windows Mobile was developed as an OS for executives and tech geeks, not mainstream consumers. That won't change until WM7.
Lets be honest, if winmo came out properly and had all the OS functionality the we crave, this site would be severely lacking. The majority of the apps for WINMO are used to do things that the should be successfully doing in the first place. Finger friendly menus, better functionality (calendar,appointments,settings..etc), and more eye pleasing apps (SMS,contacts,taskmanager)....these are the short comings of winmo....but our biggest flaw might honestly be our biggest perk.
I like tweaking, I like to choose what I want, skin it how I want it, I can go from Vito-contacts to I contacts, to finger friendly contacts...I can play with SPB3, Winterface, Pointui....I can make my phone whatever I want it...do that with an Iphone....matterfact, I'll take my Touch HD and do the Iphone UI for you, hell give us a few months and I'll show you android as well.
It seems with Manila 2.5 coming, and Samsung's Omnia2 rolling, windows is doing just fine. If you want to see a TV commercial about it...don't blame M$, they just create the OS...blame the companies who make the phones for not advertising, but I don't believe advertising is needed because our phones sell themselves. M$ just needs to tidy up some of the UI, make it snappy make it transition, make it not hog memory, and the Hardware will make it sing. Right now we have the hardware with the software which is why the Omnia2 still lags and runs slow even though its running 800MHz. WINCE ftw.
Right now honestly, I hold my breath for the X3...it makes android look so silky
66mustang said:
What a rediculous argument. I know WM is the best mobile OS, but then Betamax was the best video system.
I'm not talking about what's important for me, I'm talking about what people see as available - WM gets no mainstream media coverage, no-one goes into shops asking for it (just try going into an O2 shop or Carphone Warehouse and attempting to get an informed conversation from the sales staff about any WM device) and then we get a snowball effect where none of the 'killer' apps are being devloped for it - all efforts are being made towards the iPhone because it's sexy, WM is much better, more flexible, but ultimately nerdy (not that the general public even know it exists).
Maybe it'll remain as the business class mobile OS, which I'll be happy with as there's always the skilled people on here and similar sites to keep the software coming. Thanks guys.
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Sorry if this gets off topic, but I find Phen0m had a valid point, and in fact, philosophically a sound argument. Even more so when you say "I'm fast thinking WM is a dead technology."
On topic, the question for me is left behind "in what areas?" I believe you are absolutely right about the press coverage, the hype etc and that the more consumer oriented, mass market kind of apps could end up not being developed for the WM platform if the market is too small. Possibly you could always speculate that there will be some differentiation in the market, where one brand/and or platform could become the premier consumer product, and other platforms become more corporate centric. This type of niche development would be natural in most markets.
On the other hand, many consumers don't care what the OS is, and so we've seen reasonable success with Samsung's Omnia and HTC's Diamond. As long as there is widespread consumer acceptance of WM phones it's likely consumer oriented apps will be developed.
In comparison to the iPhone and Android, WinMo has been around for quite a long time. As such it has to be backwardly compatable with programs written to run on WM2002. It is no use if you release a super wizzo updated OS, if all previous stuff is rendered unservicable overnight. Programs, whether they are written in Win32 or .NET, still have to work.
In some respects Microsoft has one hand tied behind its back on this one. As the iPhone and Android develop further they will also hit the same problem. CE 6.0 may allow a few major changes but that will probably be WinMo 7. 6.5 seems a bit half-baked as yet.
stephj said:
In comparison to the iPhone and Android, WinMo has been around for quite a long time. As such it has to be backwardly compatable with programs written to run on WM2002. It is no use if you release a super wizzo updated OS, if all previous stuff is rendered unservicable overnight. Programs, whether they are written in Win32 or .NET, still have to work.
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Click to collapse
I have a feeling that WM7 might not support previous WM apps (though I assume it'll be easy to port, especially .NET stuff). I could be wrong, but I have a definite suspicion that MS actually WANTS a clean break.
typo said:
I could be wrong, but I have a definite suspicion that MS actually WANTS a clean break.
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Click to collapse
You could be right.
WM certainly needs a clean break. Android is a breath of fresh air.
stephj said:
In comparison to the iPhone and Android, WinMo has been around for quite a long time. As such it has to be backwardly compatable with programs written to run on WM2002. It is no use if you release a super wizzo updated OS, if all previous stuff is rendered unservicable overnight. Programs, whether they are written in Win32 or .NET, still have to work.
In some respects Microsoft has one hand tied behind its back on this one. As the iPhone and Android develop further they will also hit the same problem. CE 6.0 may allow a few major changes but that will probably be WinMo 7. 6.5 seems a bit half-baked as yet.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I disagree here, because a lot of developers have dumped everything prior to Windows Mobile 5 already. It puts me between a rock and a hard place when it comes to deciding which OS to run on my hx4700, at least until I can afford the Samsung Mondi.
Windows Mobile 2003 SE and earlier have no decent Web browsers (about the best you're going to get is IBM J9 + Opera Mini, and getting that running in full VGA is a hassle), no new Skype client support, no new media players, and who knows what else.
If Windows Mobile 7 gets a focus on the finger, though, then they'll definitely need a clean break. Heck, it's even stated to have multi-touch as a REQUIREMENT. I just hope it doesn't come at the expense of the stylus.
This thought has occurred to me in the last few months. WM is nothing in the public eye due to a lack of press. There is a flip side to this though.
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Luckily it can be skinned so Samsung, HTC, Toshiba, etc... can spice it up, put their own spin on it and actually brand it with their phones. Once HTC created TouchFlo and the other companies picked up on this feature, WM became much more valuable to the phone manufacturers. It allows them create a brand identity without spending the time and money on creating a new OS. They get the tried and true while looking innovative. The hardware and interfaces will need to improve for WM to retake the market again.
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I've never used Android so no comment. The iphone is all about apps and advertising. The clones love it and that is a powerful market tool, but eventually it will have to graduate to a true multitasking system to hang on. Palm, Blackberry and WM are always adjusting when forced so I expect major improvements in what we get once the world economy changes course.
What I'm thinking is that Microsoft waited a little too long to start catching up. Maybe they didn't think the iPhone was a threat...or maybe they thought that HTC and others could do things like TouchFlo3d and TouchWiz and "cover up"...but as it stands now, we've had a few years, the iPhone has had several iterations, Android is releasing its second go-around of products, the Pre is now on stage one, and the "old guys" like WinMo, BlackBerry, S60, are left holding the bag.
6.5 is too little, too late. ZuneHD's interface is AMAZING...so if Microsoft thinks to put something like it with WM7, it won't be too little, but it may still be too late.
(As far as I'm concerned, Nokia and RIM are in the same boat, and they are actually doing worse at catching up than Microsoft with the OS or HTC with software around the OS and hardware)
From a public standpoint, WinMo has suicided its mindshare. This doesn't mean WinMo is technically worthless...but rather it's not in the spotlight.
i cannot believe some of you people actually prefer WM over Webos or the IPhone's OS.
i switched from a IPhone 3G to a TMO Tp2 wednesday(8/12) when it came out. i believe everything i read on here that WM is not that bad. now i know you all either have your head so deep in the sand you have no idea what other OS's are capable of or your not willing to admit it.
Opera 9.5 is good. but the scrolling is erratic. this is probably a product of Resistive touchscreens. so it's hard to fault the OS here. but even the built in IE has nicer scrolling (to me at least)
Random slow downs, in a call no less having Touchflo slow down to the point that the person you are sending a text to gets the text, AND replies to you before the OS even confirms the message was sent is insane.
lack of software, i know WM has more applications then any other phone OS. but where do i find them all? google works. but i spend hours searching for something decent. much less free. and then i have my personal information spread out all over the place on the web. great.
don't get me wrong. i LOVE the hardware on the Tp2. the keyboard is fantastic, the screen looks amazing and the battery life rocks. but WTF is going on with the software? i've spent more time fighting with the OS to accomplish what i want in the last few days then i spent in the previous 15 months playing with an IPhone.
hopefully WM6.5 and cooked roms bring something decent to the table. because this is just a train wreck.
/rant
Ok... I am a die hard NON apple kind of guy. My wife bought her Iphone a year ago leaving me and verizon to fend for ourselves. Then I suggested she buy a Mac book as she has been slamming windows for as long as we have been married. So, after loving angry birds on my Gtab for the past month, I thought, what a perfect gift for her (and me to compare) an IPAD would be. So I bought her one for Christmas.
I have to say, the screen really is fine. The lighter weight and the form factor is sweet too. But, to have to have an app (which they do have an app for everything many free for sure) to view most web sites in a "standard" mode such as to see video on them etc., I still can not see that. And, no add on memory and no real interface... the battle is on!
I will update you periodically as I try and see it from an Apple user perspective.
That IPS screen is very nice. Did some after Xmas shopping today and took another look at the iPad. It's the one thing that really stands out on the iPad, versus the GTab.
I know that, in time, Android tablets will catch up (Notion Ink? please don't be vaporware).
roebeet said:
That IPS screen is very nice. Did some after Xmas shopping today and took another look at the iPad. It's the one thing that really stands out on the iPad, versus the GTab.
I know that, in time, Android tablets will catch up (Notion Ink? please don't be vaporware).
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Hold off, since rumors of some form of USB, microsd, and additional camera functionality will not die in regard to iPad 2011 models.
I can not look at the iPad display, since I then have to reacclimate to G's dispaly. ..... ....
Man, just think of the Gtablet with at least a Galaxy Tab level display.....
Here's my guess on the iPad v2 - it will almost certainly have a camera. Makes sense for Facetime.
A USB port and / or a microSD slot would be a major shocker, so I highly doubt that would happen. It goes against the walled-garden approach that Apple loves so much.
I have been an iphone user for two years. You may heard this before but lack of flash of support equals COMPLETE FAIL as I an an avid news junkie and enjoy news clips.
Now if only Netflix and google can work out their differences and bring official support for streaming netflix to droid devices then I will be switching to droid in the spring when my phone contract is due for renewal.
PS, I have owned an apple PC and it would not run 1/5th the software that was available while the apple had software support for virtually NOTHING that I needed on the PC and couldn't get.
My brother and I had this same argument about a year ago where he was praising the superiority of the Mac, about a month later he embarrassingly admitted to me I was absolutely right about the Apple causing him to not have acess to most of the software out there.
At the time I bought my last Dell laptop I spec it out with the 2G Duo Core, a wireless N1 card, a Geforce mobile GT8600, a 7200spd hard drive and 2G of Ram. I went to the apple web site and spec' out the SAME configuration, it was over $1,000 MORE!
Same hardware, LESS software, nearly double the price.
Come on...how is that EVEN a contest? I have since upgraded that same laptop to Win 7 32b and it STILL runs like a champ (do you think that would have been the case with a macbook?)
By the way, my viewsonic (although a tad buggy at this time) was 25% cheaper than an ipad and the only real advantage I can see of the ipad was superior screen while it has weaker hardware, and I am 100% confident that the Droid 2.2 and coming honeycomb will equal or surpass the ipad in the coming year.
Gauntlet thrown, Apple failed.
I do love my iphone but I have physically thrown it after getting literally thousands of video errors with flash videos news sites not to mention the fact that the vast majority of "apps" are just dumb downed versions of web pages that I do not really care for (there are quite a few with functionaity for actual mobile use but many apps are just "internet for idiots". What I am saying here is that I am not impressed with "who has the most apps" I just need certain specific ones (which you can get from EITHER company pretty much).
I personally have a love/hate relationship with Apple.
My first laptop was a greyscale PowerBook, I've used all the older pre-10 iterations and I think OSX is an outstanding achievement. But iOS just burns me up and I can see that they are expanding this walled-garden mentality into their Mac products, as well. No standard external ports like USB, no external storage, nothing allowed on the device except through iTunes, no Flash just because Jobs is pissed off that Adobe dumped them for MS. I just hate that with a passion. And the iPad v1 is the culmination of everything I loathe about them.
But, it does have a really nice screen.
I am a veteran of the Windows/Mac Wars of the 90s and the one thing I learned is: If it does what you want and I can run what I want, then I don't care what you run. If you like Apple, if you like Win7, if you like Linux, if you like iOS, if you like Android, if you like webOS... then bully for you! I happen to like some of those myself, so whoop de do!
But tell me my platform sucks or try to spend 30min telling me WHY my platform sucks, well, I have better things to do, thanks.
-=Sent from my VS GTablet (VEGAn b4) using Tapatalk=-
I Gave My iPad to my Wife
I gave my iPad to my wife to read her Kindle books on. I bought my gTablet on November 17th, and I have not missed my iPad. I am loving my gTablet, and it is just getting better and better with time. I am running TNT Lite 3.1.2 on mine. With flash, adhoc wi-fi support, and the full market, I am plenty happy. I am looking forward to the bright future of the gTablet.
Doing some research on video out on the IPAD. It has a selection of cables for composite, component and vga, but guess what? Only very few apps output to video such as movies, photos and not much else.
When I hooked up my HDMI to my dock today, EVERYTHING I saw on the screen was showing on the big screen.
roebeet said:
I personally have a love/hate relationship with Apple.
My first laptop was a greyscale PowerBook, I've used all the older pre-10 iterations and I think OSX is an outstanding achievement. But iOS just burns me up and I can see that they are expanding this walled-garden mentality into their Mac products, as well. No standard external ports like USB, no external storage, nothing allowed on the device except through iTunes, no Flash just because Jobs is pissed off that Adobe dumped them for MS. I just hate that with a passion. And the iPad v1 is the culmination of everything I loathe about them.
But, it does have a really nice screen.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You are far more qualified than me to make this assessment but if you are only designing your OS to have functionality with very specific in house written end user software, I would think it would be EASY to achieve a tighter higher performaing OS.
Do the circumstances of how osx exsists in the first place not SIGNIFICANTLY diminish its level of "oustanding" as an achievement?
popezaphod said:
I am a veteran of the Windows/Mac Wars of the 90s and the one thing I learned is: If it does what you want and I can run what I want, then I don't care what you run. If you like Apple, if you like Win7, if you like Linux, if you like iOS, if you like Android, if you like webOS... then bully for you! I happen to like some of those myself, so whoop de do!
But tell me my platform sucks or try to spend 30min telling me WHY my platform sucks, well, I have better things to do, thanks.
-=Sent from my VS GTablet (VEGAn b4) using Tapatalk=-
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Fair points. Although unfortunately for all of us here, if a thing sucks it is going to suck regardless of what any individual really thinks. Suckage is an absolute and will be unaffected by all the good will of the world. Rotten meat will not become premium meat because 1000 people love it. Unfortunately this seems to be the casse with apple. In the 80s A Team and Knight Rider were top shows, just because people were watching did not make them actually good. Just because lots of people are buying Ipads does not over come the facts of an absolute and unavoidable conclusion based on the facts (listed above about ports, camera, storage devices, flash, cost, etc etc.). Its not really about convincing or anyones opinion. Its just a fact that it sucks, kind of like how the world is round (regardless of if anyone likes said fact or not).
insight3fl said:
Ok... I am a die hard NON apple kind of guy. My wife bought her Iphone a year ago leaving me and verizon to fend for ourselves. Then I suggested she buy a Mac book as she has been slamming windows for as long as we have been married. So, after loving angry birds on my Gtab for the past month, I thought, what a perfect gift for her (and me to compare) an IPAD would be. So I bought her one for Christmas.
I have to say, the screen really is fine. The lighter weight and the form factor is sweet too. But, to have to have an app (which they do have an app for everything many free for sure) to view most web sites in a "standard" mode such as to see video on them etc., I still can not see that. And, no add on memory and no real interface... the battle is on!
I will update you periodically as I try and see it from an Apple user perspective.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
LOL, well your credibility for providing a non-bias Apple user perspective is tainted by stating you're a "die hard NON apple kind of guy". jk. My sister in law has an Ipad and I think its just a great big Ipod touch which is actually a compliment. It's so smooth and pretty to look at. Did you download skyfire on the Ipad? I heard it was out as an app. I'm curious to see how it runs on the Ipad.
Let us know.
Thanks
roebeet said:
Here's my guess on the iPad v2 - it will almost certainly have a camera. Makes sense for Facetime.
A USB port and / or a microSD slot would be a major shocker, so I highly doubt that would happen. It goes against the walled-garden approach that Apple loves so much.
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Click to collapse
I agree, a ff camera will be on the Ipad 2. You know Apple was gonna do that anyways but decided to leave it out so people will be more likely to upgrade. That's why I'm so leary when buying apple products or any product for that matter. I want it to have my minimum requirements at least for me to consider buying it.
I also agree that it will not have expandable memory which is a shame.
xmr405o said:
I agree, a ff camera will be on the Ipad 2. You know Apple was gonna do that anyways but decided to leave it out so people will be more likely to upgrade. That's why I'm so leary when buying apple products or any product for that matter. I want it to have my minimum requirements at least for me to consider buying it.
I also agree that it will not have expandable memory which is a shame.
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Click to collapse
I think folks will be surprised and there will either be USB function, or micro sd options (both?). The only thing holding Apple back from complete market domination are those issues and people that hate Apple. Though Apple can do nothing for the latter, they can compromise with the former.
There should be some decent "leaks" in about a month. We shall see.........
My first computer back in the late 70's was an Apple ][. That was back in the days of Steve Jobs and Steve Wozniak. Even back then it was clear that the Woz only really cared about the technology and Jobs only really cared about the money. I was an avid Apple defender back then but a few years later we had Apple taken over, Woz and Jobs were out and Peter Skelly was in. Skelly had been the CEO of Pepsi Cola and his knowledge of technology consisted of being able to flip the on/off switch on lights, computers and various electrical items. Eventually he had the sense to bring Jobs back in.
Here's the problem, Jobs is glorious at design and ergonomic functionality, he is also a true technophile. He designs magnificent looking machines with super friendly GUI's that people love. But, once you get past the look of his machines you find that they offer simple AND limited functionality, and that is the very reason that the great masses love Apple machines.
Because people love the look and feel of the machines they are willing to pay bloated prices for what they see as "superior" technology when really the only thing superior is the physical design and ease of use for the technically unannointed. That is GREAT business, but lousy geekiness.
You can't knock Apple's ability to design machines that sell and make piles of money and you can't knock their success. For me, the problem is that I don't want to give them my money anymore because their machines aren't "fun".
My first priority is that my techno gadgets be functional and a close second is that they must be fun. Apple doesn't fit into that nook. Even so I did buy three Mac's a couple of years ago and found that their build quality was poor and that surprised me a lot. But in business, public perception is a bigger selling point that anything else and Apple got that right, too bad they didn't get the technical end right.
R
I came across this old thread while researching the GTablet. The only thing that is really holding me back from buying one is the screen. The videos I see on Youtube make the screen look really bad, especially one that has a side by side comparison of the Gtablet vs Ipad. Since the GTablet has been out for awhile now, are those who own it still happy? I need to find a B&M store that has one so I can check it out, I really wish it had an IPS screen like the iPad though. I dont get why somebody doesnt come out with a killer Android tablet that can really compete with the iPad.
androidmonkey said:
I came across this old thread while researching the GTablet. The only thing that is really holding me back from buying one is the screen. The videos I see on Youtube make the screen look really bad, especially one that has a side by side comparison of the Gtablet vs Ipad. Since the GTablet has been out for awhile now, are those who own it still happy? I need to find a B&M store that has one so I can check it out, I really wish it had an IPS screen like the iPad though. I dont get why somebody doesnt come out with a killer Android tablet that can really compete with the iPad.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I picked the gtab because I like to customize the gtab and try different Roms. I am very happy with mine using vegan tab. Flash has been a big bonus. The screen works surprisingly well. Sure, its not perfect, but this gtab has some power and is 400 bucks less than xoom. If you like out of the box OS and don't like to tinker, then get the 16GB iPad from best buy for $399. Battery life on the gtab is awesome. I wake up at 4am and use it throughout the day and heavy use by evening. I will have several hours left on the battery when I go to bed around 9pm. Try Office depot, as many have them in stock to play with. Good luck.
androidmonkey said:
I came across this old thread while researching the GTablet. The only thing that is really holding me back from buying one is the screen. The videos I see on Youtube make the screen look really bad, especially one that has a side by side comparison of the Gtablet vs Ipad. Since the GTablet has been out for awhile now, are those who own it still happy? I need to find a B&M store that has one so I can check it out, I really wish it had an IPS screen like the iPad though. I dont get why somebody doesnt come out with a killer Android tablet that can really compete with the iPad.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
So I was having the same issues before I picked up the gtablet, and having used it for a few days, the screen isn't really that bad. I also love the more widescreen aspect of it vs the ipad allows for better media watching. But it does mean you have to dive more into the device and its setup (custom roms, etc) and if that is daunting to you then I would skip the gtablet.
No issues with geek stuff like flashing ROMs. Ive been an Android user since the G1, member here on xda since then. I currently have a SGS Vibrant, rooted with Bionix.
So, what would you compare the screen to? I have a nearby Office Depot, will try to check it out tomorrow. Is the GTablet the best thing going right now? From the specs, it seems so. One last thing, what are you using to protect it? Screen protector? Case?
androidmonkey said:
No issues with geek stuff like flashing ROMs. Ive been an Android user since the G1, member here on xda since then. I currently have a SGS Vibrant, rooted with Bionix.
So, what would you compare the screen to? I have a nearby Office Depot, will try to check it out tomorrow. Is the GTablet the best thing going right now? From the specs, it seems so. One last thing, what are you using to protect it? Screen protector? Case?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
With the newest official and unofficial VS update, you may not need to use an alternative ROM.
I would compare the screen directly to a netbook screen. It is by no means imho as horrid as some would have you think, but it's not for everyone. Some people feel you should be able to see what's on the phone/tablet screens while they sit flat on a desk and you're in a chair - while I think it's nice to be able to, I certainly don't think it's necessary to enjoy it and this is just something again, imo vendors have used to inflate the cost of these devices beyond their 'real' practical value. "why is our tablet $800 when so and so is selling one with the same internals for $300? well, have you SEEEEEN our screen? BIG difference!" yeah, you get my drift.
Spec-wise, I think it's a toss-up between the GTablet and it's siblings (interpad, hanspree tablet, malata zpad, avent vega, etc.) or the Notion Ink Adam. As you probably know, the iPad is pretty nice but it's def. lacking in terms of (imo, again) certain little details where the GTablet and other Android devices with similar specs excel and you would have to either learn to live in Apple's walled garden or do some 'techie' stuff in order to jailbreak anyway. Is it the BEST right now? I don't know - probably not. It was released in Nov. 2010, there's bound to be something with similar specs and a 'better' screen by now, if not then yeah it's probably the best VALUE for what you get as of right now.
I would have got her an ipad too.
Don't get me wrong I love my gtab, but I exhaust so much time modifying and fixing my own one. I don't mind that for myself but stuffed if I'm gonna spend my entire free time fixing someone elses tablet. Ipad can't do as much but in return I don't have to ever look at it or maintain it hence freeing up my spare time.
Sent from my VEGAn-TAB-v1.0.0b5.1.1 using Tapatalk
I just spent the past two days at CES and in fact spent time in the Viewsonic booth.
There are so many tablets on display that one person in my party suggested that if you threw a Coke can 100 feet in any direction you would hit a tablet...
Overall in my opinion on a relative scale the Viewsonic G-tablet is not that bad given everything I have played with. Some other tablets might be a little leaner, maybe a little tighter build quality, but the main difference I see is the display in the Viewsonic.
And yes I did play with the Motorola tablet. While it is leaner and a better built I was shocked on how hot the tablet was when the Motorola person handed it over for me to play with. The G-tablet no matter what I have asked it to do, never gets "hot".
With respect to the Viewsonic tablets introduced at CES, their smaller tablet seems cheep in its constructions. Perhaps that is due to the use of silver colored plastic. And their dual-boot tablet... It was shown running Android 1.6. We asked Viewsonic and were told reboot it to get into Windows. After a power off and power on, I was presented with a boot manager window with Android and Windows as options. But it appeared to be looking for an arrow key press to move the selection bar. Basically I don't think Windows really is useful on the tablet without a keyboard. Perhaps this is why they were showing the tablet with Android. Thus I was never able to get into Windows and try that out.
The RIM tablet is very well built but running QNX. QNX is a realtime operating system and they were in the booth with RIM. QNT is something that is embedded in a product and normally never sees the light of day with respect to the end user. To be honest I worry about the ultimate availability of applications as QNX has nothing to do with Linux, Android, Windows anything, etc. Basically RIM is starting out from scratch. Their user interface is different. Not bad, just different. My opinion, shared with others that I talked with, is that this tablet will appeal to corporations who already have a RIM infrastructure in place and have users complaining they need a tablet. Note that the device on display was WiFi only, where RIM claimed that a unnamed carrier 4G device is near release.
Did you by chance check out the Notion Ink Adam tablet?
Sent from my SPH-D700 using XDA App
vsc said:
Note that the device on display was WiFi only, where RIM claimed that a unnamed carrier 4G device is near release.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
That would probably be Sprint, who is already advertising the Playbook's imminent release...
Wow! You found better build quality that the gTab? Even my Nook Color seems to have poorer QA as far as actual build goes, and I TRULU expected MUCH better of B&N... defective USB port on my first one OOB, and the casing feels "loose" on returned & exchanged units... however both are better than the Pandigital Novel(white v1) or Augen Gentouch78... although neither of these had defective ports, etc. OOB...
VPAD 10(dual boot one, I presume): Only runs Android 1.6 as it's the latest version that "officially"(?) supports Android for the x86 arch...
To be honest I could find a booth for them and they clearly are not in the show directory. The bloggers are finding them but they have armies of people all over the show floor.
cadillax02 said:
Did you by chance check out the Notion Ink Adam tablet?
Sent from my SPH-D700 using XDA App
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Overall there is a lot of junk Android tablets at the show.
It is notable that when the basic software is the same you have two ways to differentiate product. Industrial design, build quality, etc or a software framework such as TnT. Many products simply do neither.
Another notable fact is most tablets are running v2.2 of Android, even when their writeups for their product cite Android 3.0. I was put off by this.
I returned a NookColor because it developed 16+ hot pixels in the middle of the display. At night on a plane ride they just lit up to the point I decided this is too much it goes back. B&N gave me a lot of trouble returning the device, but after three hours of standing my ground they accepted the return. I decided to take a pass on the NookColor for now. And I agree the USB connector choice could have been much better. Also why go with a unique connector in the first place?
I want to say the coolest phone at the show is the LG Optimus 2X. I want one. NOW. We couldn't get it to lag, even when doing our best to crush it. The display quality is also very good. LG won a best of show award for a display and I think it is the same one used in the 2X.
cutterjohn said:
Wow! You found better build quality that the gTab? Even my Nook Color seems to have poorer QA as far as actual build goes, and I TRULU expected MUCH better of B&N... defective USB port on my first one OOB, and the casing feels "loose" on returned & exchanged units... however both are better than the Pandigital Novel(white v1) or Augen Gentouch78... although neither of these had defective ports, etc. OOB...
VPAD 10(dual boot one, I presume): Only runs Android 1.6 as it's the latest version that "officially"(?) supports Android for the x86 arch...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
How was the Viewpad 10s? Better screen?
Nope
japhule said:
How was the Viewpad 10s? Better screen?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Sent from my GTablet-TnT-Lite using Tapatalk
One of my co-workers bought back some info after the CES about the MOTO XOOM, he said that the software was very unstable and lot of FCs. He said that most hardware were ready and just google holding them up..
VSC: did you get your hands on the XOOM, was it unstable? We may need to wait for a few more months then...
tyy10002 said:
One of my co-workers bought back some info after the CES about the MOTO XOOM, he said that the software was very unstable and lot of FCs. He said that most hardware were ready and just google holding them up..
VSC: did you get your hands on the XOOM, was it unstable? We may need to wait for a few more months then...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I may be mis-reading this article:
http://www.engadget.com/2011/01/09/motorola-xoom-pretend-ui-hands-on-walkthrough-video/
but it sounds like they (MOTO) were showing a "fake" Honeycomb UI on the Xoom? Maybe that's why it was "unstable" ??
Jim
jimcpl said:
I may be mis-reading this article:
http://www.engadget.com/2011/01/09/motorola-xoom-pretend-ui-hands-on-walkthrough-video/
but it sounds like they (MOTO) were showing a "fake" Honeycomb UI on the Xoom? Maybe that's why it was "unstable" ??
Jim
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
That article was kind of confusing.. Said they were running a fake UI on top of the REAL Honeycomb? How is that any different from running say, Launcherpro on top of Froyo? So we aren't running Froyo if we use a different launcher? Maybe they mean the Motorola specific launcher is unstable, I don't know..
At least they haven't put it up for sale as a totally unstable device like Viewsonic did, yet...
I imagine that by the time people can buy one of those surely overpriced, probably locked down tablets they will have all the kinks worked out. Just seeing the Verizon name makes me not want one.
So would you say the viewing angles of all these new tablets are light years ahead of the Viewsonic, tad better or the same?
Reason why I am asking... Should I wait or not on a G-Tablet with the expectation of upgrading in about 9 - 12 months.
vsc said:
I just spent the past two days at CES and in fact spent time in the Viewsonic booth.
There are so many tablets on display that one person in my party suggested that if you threw a Coke can 100 feet in any direction you would hit a tablet...
Overall in my opinion on a relative scale the Viewsonic G-tablet is not that bad given everything I have played with. Some other tablets might be a little leaner, maybe a little tighter build quality, but the main difference I see is the display in the Viewsonic.
And yes I did play with the Motorola tablet. While it is leaner and a better built I was shocked on how hot the tablet was when the Motorola person handed it over for me to play with. The G-tablet no matter what I have asked it to do, never gets "hot".
With respect to the Viewsonic tablets introduced at CES, their smaller tablet seems cheep in its constructions. Perhaps that is due to the use of silver colored plastic. And their dual-boot tablet... It was shown running Android 1.6. We asked Viewsonic and were told reboot it to get into Windows. After a power off and power on, I was presented with a boot manager window with Android and Windows as options. But it appeared to be looking for an arrow key press to move the selection bar. Basically I don't think Windows really is useful on the tablet without a keyboard. Perhaps this is why they were showing the tablet with Android. Thus I was never able to get into Windows and try that out.
The RIM tablet is very well built but running QNX. QNX is a realtime operating system and they were in the booth with RIM. QNT is something that is embedded in a product and normally never sees the light of day with respect to the end user. To be honest I worry about the ultimate availability of applications as QNX has nothing to do with Linux, Android, Windows anything, etc. Basically RIM is starting out from scratch. Their user interface is different. Not bad, just different. My opinion, shared with others that I talked with, is that this tablet will appeal to corporations who already have a RIM infrastructure in place and have users complaining they need a tablet. Note that the device on display was WiFi only, where RIM claimed that a unnamed carrier 4G device is near release.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Sprdtyf350 said:
That article was kind of confusing.. Said they were running a fake UI on top of the REAL Honeycomb? How is that any different from running say, Launcherpro on top of Froyo? So we aren't running Froyo if we use a different launcher? Maybe they mean the Motorola specific launcher is unstable, I don't know..
At least they haven't put it up for sale as a totally unstable device like Viewsonic did, yet...
I imagine that by the time people can buy one of those surely overpriced, probably locked down tablets they will have all the kinks worked out. Just seeing the Verizon name makes me not want one.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I was a little confused by the article too, which is what I started with "I may be mis-reading...".
Jim
jimcpl said:
I was a little confused by the article too, which is what I started with "I may be mis-reading...".
Jim
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I saw that Just a general observation... Guess if it doesn't make sense it must be right! Right?
Well I was at CES also and the only thing I saw for Viewsonic was a little office and I was everywhere. Do you remember where they were? I played with the rim playbook for a bit the interface was nice then I watched for 20 minutes and I didn't see a single crash but I like that when you open different tabs in browser or media you could see all the pages that are open in small windows similar to when you have multiple pages open in Firefox on windows 7 rim playbook is a small platform.
Sprdtyf350 said:
That article was kind of confusing.. Said they were running a fake UI on top of the REAL Honeycomb? How is that any different from running say, Launcherpro on top of Froyo? So we aren't running Froyo if we use a different launcher? Maybe they mean the Motorola specific launcher is unstable, I don't know..
At least they haven't put it up for sale as a totally unstable device like Viewsonic did, yet...
I imagine that by the time people can buy one of those surely overpriced, probably locked down tablets they will have all the kinks worked out. Just seeing the Verizon name makes me not want one.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
It was basically a demo video of Honeycomb playing in the Android video player in Honeycomb. The actual 3.0 on the Xoom was pretty much unpopulated. Empty screens and almost no apps. The only way to experience it was through the video.
All is very strong. Most of the tablets at the show have a similar display and are no better with respect to the viewing angles.
After talking to the display suppliers it would appear that in general the 10" displays have limited viewing angles (e.g. 90/50 degrees). Smaller panels (e.g. 5" and 7") have much better viewing angles (e.g. 160/140 degrees).
stanglx said:
So would you say the viewing angles of all these new tablets are light years ahead of the Viewsonic, tad better or the same?
Reason why I am asking... Should I wait or not on a G-Tablet with the expectation of upgrading in about 9 - 12 months.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
i wonder if this could run on Gtablet.. Lol. D
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p92QfWOw88I&feature=player_embedded
amazing UI..
but i'm still loyal to android.. D its an OS WAR on 2012 ,
iOS 5, Google Icecream Android, Windows 8..
That looks like a hell of a lot of processing power for a mobile device.
well tegra 3 is on the way...
boltgd said:
well tegra 3 is on the way...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
But it's not compatible with windows.
Eh. Its a Mickeysoft product. Overpromise, Overhype, and Underwhelm. There are promised features from Vista that have yet to be developed and introduced. So I am not gonna hold my breath.
yeah they have a lot of work to do.. since the release is way too far ahead, 2012.. i guess ICEcream won't give up easily with this kind of UI..
Impress us GOOGLE.. your'e still my bet.. LOL
juntunen said:
Eh. Its a Mickeysoft product. Overpromise, Overhype, and Underwhelm. There are promised features from Vista that have yet to be developed and introduced. So I am not gonna hold my breath.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
What features, exactly, are you referencing? I only ask because I have been Alpha and Beta testing MS operating systems for almost 20 years.
And why on earth would they work to introduce features on an OS that was replaced by a better one only about a year after release (thank god)?
Kind of like saying "when is Android 1.6 going to support HTML5?" Not going to happen because Android 2 added that support.
Maybe you should hold your breath.
That actually looks pretty amazing, Google has some work to do, they are the modern day version of the old Microsoft with the bugs and such, seems the new Microsoft has figured out that making it work is more important, so now google ditch the Linux kernel and find your own way. I am an Android fan and a GTab owner, but I have to say I hate tinkering with this thing and would rather it wake up and do what I want it to do, and do it consistently. I don't even mess with my GTab anymore, I hate to say it but I have reverted back to my iPad, simply it works consistently. Just my 2 cents.
goodintentions said:
But it's not compatible with windows.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Win 8 will be compatible with ARM processors.*
*Not official, but one of the demos of Win8 a few weeks ago was running on an ARM. Before you ask, the Tegra2 (and Tegra3) is an ARM processor.
scrantsj said:
Win 8 will be compatible with ARM processors.*
*Not official, but one of the demos of Win8 a few weeks ago was running on an ARM. Before you ask, the Tegra2 (and Tegra3) is an ARM processor.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
That could change everything then.
Android better get way better, way faster.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7MnEndww2YQ&feature=player_embedded#t=0s
I am going to try to hold on to my G-Tablet until the Tegra 3 tablets are out. Should be able to put Win8 on it, maybe even dual boot Android.
I also saw a video somewhere of a Xoom running build 7955, and it ran really well. 1 ghz processor with 1 gb ram should be the system requirements for ARM and Tegra 2 chips. IOS is dead.
Honestly that ui looks like a windows phone to cartoony for me and childish. They really need to do something more innovative take ie9 for example just a down right copy of chrome ms is just worried about market share. Not to mention everything here lately from them has nothing but bloated kernels and fail coding.
Sent from my SGH-T959V using XDA App
Quote
I am going to try to hold on to my G-Tablet until the Tegra 3 tablets are out. Should be able to put Win8 on it, maybe even dual boot Android.
I also saw a video somewhere of a Xoom running build 7955, and it ran really well. 1 ghz processor with 1 gb ram should be the system requirements for ARM and Tegra 2 chips. IOS is dead.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
speaking of dead... I saw a picture of Steve Jobs.. I didn't know he was gay.. I saw a pic of his 'man' having to hold him up as they took a picture of him... he looks like death.. so thin, looks so old... poor guy... well I guess Apple wasn't good to him after all...
IOS/SJ RIP together?
that could be possible that win 8 will run anywhere... the OS core is going to be cloud base, and while most devices run a java, or specialized VB, a simple modification to be able to get market share, why not? MS wants you... With the way WP7Mobile is, and how bad of a phone it is, MS has a bigger picture in mind... and they are a lion in waiting.... and with all ur data on a server that you may have to pay 4.95 (beginning charges on MS) Money is about to come back rolling in... and since cloud based... illegal apps are going to be difficult to run... just as they can turn off your development key in MS, they will be able to turn off your system from processing as they hold all the cards... so be ready... Apple is doing same for 2012. lets hope Android won't follow, although MS has a big stake in it... we shall see.
cmiuc said:
Quote
speaking of dead... I saw a picture of Steve Jobs.. I didn't know he was gay.. I saw a pic of his 'man' having to hold him up as they took a picture of him... he looks like death.. so thin, looks so old... poor guy... well I guess Apple wasn't good to him after all...
IOS/SJ RIP together?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I give him two months - not a slant on the man, but when you step down as the CEO of the most profitable company in the world, there's a reason behind it. And given how he looked in June, I suspect that the cancer is back and he's terminal. I feel very bad for him, and for his family.
juntunen said:
Eh. Its a Mickeysoft product. Overpromise, Overhype, and Underwhelm. There are promised features from Vista that have yet to be developed and introduced. So I am not gonna hold my breath.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
O O and U -- sounds like Android, to me.
I am looking forward to Windows 8, as I think both Google and Apple need a shot in the arm. My only concern is that MS has never done well in the mobile space. But they have surprised me with Windows 7 so maybe they can work their magic again.
Windows 8 Tablet Reach Developers Soon
Windows 8 tablet builds are rumored to be coming to developers as soon as this fall, so within the next 2-3 months, maybe even sooner. This means that a Windows 8 build is close to finish and Microsoft can expect to make a Windows 8 shipment sometime next summer in 2012. There is also a Microsoft Build event on September 13-16. The Anaheim California conference is focused on Windows hardware and software developers. Supposedly, it is expected to be Microsoft’s Windows 8 coming out party to get partners and OEM’s started on developing devices and apps for Windows 8.
Having said that, the issue for the tablet is not just performance but design. Apple junkies love the design, the apps, and the uniqueness of the product. It stands apart. While Microsoft may be able to make a competent and reliable product, can they make one that consumers will fall in love with?
The question comes up is what is the Quad Core processor that is supposed to run on tablets? That isn’t clear and running the tablet with a laptop processor wouldn’t be a good move since the battery life would be limited. Note, however, earlier this year three developers NVIDIA, Qualcomm, and Texas Instruments each announced quad-core mobile chips and announced that they’d arrive before the end of 2011. Nvidia is supposed to make an announcement soon about the state of a quad-core table. Nvidia, by the way, is an ARM chipmaker, which is the preferred Windows 8 OS chip of choice, (although x86 based chips will still be used).
Windows vs Android
cotangent05 said:
i wonder if this could run on Gtablet.. Lol. D
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p92QfWOw88I&feature=player_embedded
amazing UI..
but i'm still loyal to android.. D its an OS WAR on 2012 ,
iOS 5, Google Icecream Android, Windows 8..
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I love my gTablet (and other tablets) and Android is really slick, but Android is to Windows like a toasteroven to a double oven with range and griddle. Android is made for a few functions and to be really small and compact. Again I love my tablet but it doesn't really do what my netbook does with ease. On the other hand, my netbook isn't as convenient or as much fun as my tablet.
That said, if you put my netbook with a slick, capacitive touch screen and it could do all the things my netbook can do - then wow! That would be very nice.
---------- Post added at 08:51 PM ---------- Previous post was at 08:41 PM ----------
Gilpinreid said:
Windows 8 tablet builds are rumored to be coming to developers as soon as this fall, so within the next 2-3 months, maybe even sooner. This means that a Windows 8 build is close to finish and Microsoft can expect to make a Windows 8 shipment sometime next summer in 2012. There is also a Microsoft Build event on September 13-16. The Anaheim California conference is focused on Windows hardware and software developers. Supposedly, it is expected to be Microsoft’s Windows 8 coming out party to get partners and OEM’s started on developing devices and apps for Windows 8.
Having said that, the issue for the tablet is not just performance but design. Apple junkies love the design, the apps, and the uniqueness of the product. It stands apart. While Microsoft may be able to make a competent and reliable product, can they make one that consumers will fall in love with?
The question comes up is what is the Quad Core processor that is supposed to run on tablets? That isn’t clear and running the tablet with a laptop processor wouldn’t be a good move since the battery life would be limited. Note, however, earlier this year three developers NVIDIA, Qualcomm, and Texas Instruments each announced quad-core mobile chips and announced that they’d arrive before the end of 2011. Nvidia is supposed to make an announcement soon about the state of a quad-core table. Nvidia, by the way, is an ARM chipmaker, which is the preferred Windows 8 OS chip of choice, (although x86 based chips will still be used).
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
As far as power, I have to say my 160 GB netbook runs for over 6 hours on wifi and with pretty heavy use on a charge. The processor will/can be improved, I;m sure, but the biggest (and maybe only) issue is getting windows capabilities with a capacitive touch screen. The Atom at 1.6 is about the same capability as our Tegra2 at 1 - although I'm not sure about the video side of things.
If I were designing the new system I'd make it about the same size as the current netbooks with a keyboard that folds all the way behind kind of like the Pocket Edge, whenever you only wanted to use touch but could fold around like a netbook when you wanted to rest it on a counter or use the keyboard/trackstick.
Windows and mobile
I am looking forward to Windows 8, as I think both Google and Apple need a shot in the arm. My only concern is that MS has never done well in the mobile space. But they have surprised me with Windows 7 so maybe they can work their magic again.[/QUOTE]
I sure wouldn't want to counter anything you said as you're the king of the tablets as far as I can tell, but I think you're comment about MS (which is an opinion shared by many) is heavily influenced by very recent history I think. Up until the full blown development of the capacitive touch screen in the Apple phone Microsoft's Mobile OS was the preferred choice. I had an Axim 5 which did most everything we're talking about with tablets but with a lot less elegance and functionality. Microsoft was the first major manufacturer to advance touch screens in portable devices. I had a Fuji "tablet" computer years ago and it was pretty slick BUT it used a resistive touch screen which made touch features less than elegant.
What microsoft (and others) missed was the capacitive touch screen and how it changed the world. Apple had an early in to this technology since they first adopted it for their iPod controller wheel and that led to their incorporating it into the main display. Capacitive touch screens had been around a long time but they couldn't be controlled precisely until recently (can't remember the company who did it first but it was Apple's key supplier to iPod wheels). So in the blink of an eye the slickest Blackberry or windows smart phone looked crippled compared to the slick interface the multi-touch capacitive touch screen apple produced. Since then resistive screens have actually gotten pretty good, but the technology of choice is multi-touch capacitive.
I don't know if MS will do the Windows 8 with a trimmed down tablet version or not, or even if they do it, will they do it well. But, I do know they have many more engineers than Apple and a base kernel in Windows which is fabulous to build on. Heck if they just gave me that interface on my current netbook I would be thrilled.
Why Microsoft was so late to the mp3 player and why they let Mobile Windows falter is a mystery. I did have one MS engineer (proj mgr on Office at the time) told me they took their eye off the ball on mobile as they kind of looked to the entertainment (xBox) div to push that stuff and they just never got beyond game systems.
Microsoft also missed on the spreadsheet for many years and had a couple attempts which didn't cut it (multiplan was nifty but too hard to use) but when they came out with Excel they conquered. Same with Word. Same with console game boxes, and even to some extent with keyboards and mice and web cams.
You'd think I "liked" MS. I don't really. I much prefer Linux and the whole GPL scheme of things, but I give the devil her due. I use microsoft products every day and I have to say they do a terrific job. No other tech company I know of could match them on taking care of their past customers. That legacy in many ways has been a blessing and a curse. That said, I wouldn't count them out by any means and they will do very well in mobile/tablets when they embrace the touch interface. I'm not sure about phones. I've never really seen the vision of a phone-size computing device. To me a phone size is all about sync and media (photo, music, and light video media), and of course, phone. Tablet is your GPS, planner and organizer, newspaper and email, heavier duty mobile media consumption and phone (skype). Laptop is the primary working device to actually earn an income from, and the desktop is simply a legacy for all that stuff you still want to interface with and stream on your local network.
I think MS's mobile image was damaged quite a bit by them virtually abandoning Windows mobile, the low takeup of the Zune and the piling on of the apple community. That caused MS to go after a phone which was a disaster. In a nutshell there wasn't a failure of note until the iPhone in the middle of 2007 which has led (largely) to a remake of the MS image in this arena. They certainly deserve their lumps, but like you pointed out Win 7 was great and if they do get that interface they are showing on Win 8, watch they roar back in the mobile space.
I do wonder about another competing "app" development framework. It would have been nice to see that part of the interface somehow stick with the Android model. I'm sure MS will produce a free dev kit of some kind but that doesn't replace all the work for good developers to get up to speed.
Microsoft, a titan of the software industry, entirely unmatched. Nokia, once THE hardware giant in the mobile industry, fallen from graces due to poor software. Sounds like a romance etched in the stars for bards to write soliloquys about until time dth end, right? Well, according to the press, this is just a terrible idea.
Earlier this year, Microsoft announced an exclusive partnership with Nokia granting them more power over an already beautiful OS. Numerous jobs were lost, the bad press was everywhere, but Elop and Ballmer were smiling for the camera. Things died down, a few even began to see the bright side of what such a merger might offer, but with the release of the technical specifications of nokia's new windows phone devices, windows phone users everywhere froze. They seemed to offer nothing that the other OEMs couldn't. Some were expecting Nokia to blow us away with the use of a dual-core processor on a windows phone flagship device, my only thought, why?
Nokia is a hardware company not known for excessive hardware, but rather how they use it. While android was running sluggish on a 1 GHz snapdragon, symbian was smooth on a much lesser chipset. Nokia never was the greatest manufacturer for the power in the phone, just great execution be it their battery life which is absolutely phenomenal opposed to that of most smartphones, or their build quality, which provides a durable, polished, and attractive device. Don't even get me started on the camera's they've so often been praised for since the early days of smartphones. Nokia is a hardware company to be revered, even if not for their power.
Now, with WP7's strict hardware limitations allowing very specific chipsets in their devices, the chipset is not the issue by any means. What Microsoft needs now is a beautiful device with a great camera to take advantage of the fastest camera app out there, a great battery life to provide hours of smooth, lag-free browsing, and a polished build quality to match the polished OS.
Do I think WP7/Nokia could be a game changer? I'd like to think so, but only time will tell. For now, I'll just continue salivating over the new Nokia 800.
Lol... dude... I admire your "eff you all I will still create useless threads" attitude.
Nothing useless about this thread. Please don't continue to troll it. I'm looking for valid opinions and responses.
K here is one.... I totally agree that Nokia makes great phones, and uses the OS nicely, just wish that OS wasn't windows based. Because I hate windows. Its slow, outdated, and cumbersome and lags incessantly when executing the smallest of tasks.
And cool the camera is nice!?! Polished turd.
---------- Post added at 03:29 PM ---------- Previous post was at 03:26 PM ----------
and to answer your question in the thread title, I will go out on a very strong and healthy limb and say no. Just look at junk devices of past like the dell venue pro
---------- Post added at 03:30 PM ---------- Previous post was at 03:29 PM ----------
Should have called it the semi pro
---------- Post added at 03:31 PM ---------- Previous post was at 03:30 PM ----------
or the all cons and no pros
You may call me a mad conspiracy theory believer who wears tin foil as a hat and disconnect ethernet cable and delete all the history after using Internet, but
I really believe that Elop is a trojan sent by Microsoft.
Look. N9 is doing great. MeeGo is promising and the hardware is critically acclaimed. But no - Elop says they are ditching MeeGo in favor of WP7. They put ridiculous pricetag and limit availability in other countries such as Europe and other American cities. (trollmao).
I mean the opinions of people who can discern the difference between windows phone 7 and the desktop OS windows7. The Dell Venue is an android device, the Dell Venue PRO is a windows phone 7 device and somehow I feel that prior to reading my signature you were unaware of the existence of either. You're a troll, and not even a well-educated one.
or the prohibits... because it prohibits you from having a good mobile device experience
Jaunzems said:
You may call me a mad conspiracy theory believer who wears tin foil as a hat and disconnect ethernet cable and delete all the history after using Internet, but
I really believe that Elop is a trojan sent by Microsoft.
Look. N9 is doing great. MeeGo is promising and the hardware is critically acclaimed. But no - Elop says they are ditching MeeGo in favor of WP7. They put ridiculous pricetag and limit availability in other countries in Europe and other American cities. (trollmao).
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The primary issue with MeeGo is that regardless of how well it did, it could only be a second-rate android. They wanted a software that could play on it's own field and it does. Plus as someone who attempted MeeGo development I can assure you, it never would have had half of the developer support that even a budding OS like Windows Phone 7 does. The developer tools were an abomination and with the base OS code it would not have taken too much to get sluggish.
Seriously you sound like barrack Obama when you argue. No valid points just vague descriptions
z33dev33l said:
Microsoft, a titan of the software industry, entirely unmatched. Nokia, once THE hardware giant in the mobile industry, fallen from graces due to poor software. Sounds like a romance etched in the stars for bards to write soliloquys about until time dth end, right? Well, according to the press, this is just a terrible idea.
Earlier this year, Microsoft announced an exclusive partnership with Nokia granting them more power over an already beautiful OS. Numerous jobs were lost, the bad press was everywhere, but Elop and Ballmer were smiling for the camera. Things died down, a few even began to see the bright side of what such a merger might offer, but with the release of the technical specifications of nokia's new windows phone devices, windows phone users everywhere froze. They seemed to offer nothing that the other OEMs couldn't. Some were expecting Nokia to blow us away with the use of a dual-core processor on a windows phone flagship device, my only thought, why?
Nokia is a hardware company not known for excessive hardware, but rather how they use it. While android was running sluggish on a 1 GHz snapdragon, symbian was smooth on a much lesser chipset. Nokia never was the greatest manufacturer for the power in the phone, just great execution be it their battery life which is absolutely phenomenal opposed to that of most smartphones, or their build quality, which provides a durable, polished, and attractive device. Don't even get me started on the camera's they've so often been praised for since the early days of smartphones. Nokia is a hardware company to be revered, even if not for their power.
Now, with WP7's strict hardware limitations allowing very specific chipsets in their devices, the chipset is not the issue by any means. What Microsoft needs now is a beautiful device with a great camera to take advantage of the fastest camera app out there, a great battery life to provide hours of smooth, lag-free browsing, and a polished build quality to match the polished OS.
Do I think WP7/Nokia could be a game changer? I'd like to think so, but only time will tell. For now, I'll just continue salivating over the new Nokia 800.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
all of the above, makes the phones very boring
i don't see a future for Nokia, at the very least they got MS to bail them out if they do go under after this epic fail
Development in MeeGo is in Qt framework, and it means easy porting to other platforms - you can easily recompile apps to Symbian, Debian, Tizen or even Android if you like to.
I'm surprised that the board of shareholders hasn't kicked Elop out to the moon yet.
I think your happy times with WP7 has been very damaging to your critical sense, and you ar starting to sound like these ignorant iOS fanboytrolls. OK, you love your Venue Pro, it suits your needs and it makes you happyface. But you can't say that WP7 will suit everyone, or will make unicorns and magnets, solve the African lack of food and cure cancer. Your needs != needs of everyone.
I just realized why Nokia may not have gone the Android route. It's possible Nokia knew that Android was stolen and didn't want to get involved with it.
Now, about Nokia hardware, I believe the partnership of MS and Nokia was good and will bare fruit. I believe Nokia can be MS's "iPhone" producer. And I think this is what MS is doing by keeping the size down. They are building high-quality, highly polished devices that don't blow anything away but establish a reliable brand, instead. But My opinion is, Nokia needs to step it up a bit in some of the hardware. The pentile-based AMOLED they will be using with the 800 is much lower level than the top-end Retina display the iPhone 4 uses. If MS wants Nokia to be their iPhone" producing brand, the hardware needs to be higher level.
Can someone check his ip or something to see if he's Steve Baldmer?
z33dev33l said:
The primary issue with MeeGo is that regardless of how well it did, it could only be a second-rate android. They wanted a software that could play on it's own field and it does. Plus as someone who attempted MeeGo development I can assure you, it never would have had half of the developer support that even a budding OS like Windows Phone 7 does. The developer tools were an abomination and with the base OS code it would not have taken too much to get sluggish.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I agree. Meego was born because nokia didn't want to go Android like others did, but still it was a very desperate try. Personally i can't think of a Nokia powered Android device, basically because Nokia has always managed its software like a control freak (similar to Apple's approach), they don't wanna see their precious hardware messed up by third party apps and unsupported firmware. WP7 was actually the only way to go for them if you ask me. I really, really hope this will be a success, i had so much love for my old Nokia phones: i still have my N95 in a drawer and it still feels like he's the king...that bad boy was a masterpiece, i definitely want more from Nokia
Nokia didn't go the android route because then they'd be just another mid-sized fish in an ocean of OEM's rather than the big fish on something new and promising.
Jaunzems, aside from the people who feel the need to mod I most certainly can. The developer tools are infinitely better than any other OS, it does everything pretty much anyone would need for a phone, and does it faster than the rest, not to mention the seamless integration for social networking which is an oh so integral aspect of everyday life in these times.
MartyLK said:
I just realized why Nokia may not have gone the Android route. It's possible Nokia knew that Android was stolen and didn't want to get involved with it.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
1) Android isn't stolen. Does Andro has Springboard? Syncronizing with iTunes? Did iOS have Notification area before Andro? Multitasking? Cut-copy-paste?
2) No, they moved away from Android, because using Android would be, citing Anssi Vanjoki, "peeing in their pants" like Finnish boys do to keep warm. Everyone uses it because it's cheap and fast way to get into the smartphone market and Nokia thinks that if they would choose Android, they would be treated like
And, despite the fact Nokia has very good software dev team, stock android unstableness and chaotic battery management would be too tough chalenge for loyal Nokia clients to take - business customers, "sunday" users etc.
Also there is a part in their agreement with Microsoft that states they get a big bunch of money if they never ever look towards Android.
Jaunzems said:
1) Android isn't stolen. Does Andro has Springboard? Syncronizing with iTunes? Did iOS have Notification area before Andro? Multitasking? Cut-copy-paste?
2) No, they moved away from Android, because using Android would be, citing Anssi Vanjoki, "peeing in their pants" like Finnish boys do to keep warm. Everyone uses it because it's cheap and fast way to get into the smartphone market and Nokia thinks that if they would choose Android, they would be treated like
And, despite the fact Nokia has very good software dev team, stock android unstableness and chaotic battery management would be too tough chalenge for loyal Nokia clients to take - business customers, "sunday" users etc.
Also there is a part in their agreement with Microsoft that states they get a big bunch of money if they never ever look towards Android.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yes, Android...the technology that makes it up, or its foundation, is stolen...from Apple. That being the case, anything Google invents or produces with and in Android belongs to Apple. That means the notification bar that Apple is using and the notification bar that Android is using belongs to Apple.
http://www.dailytech.com/Steve+Jobs...Because+Its+a+Stolen+Product/article23077.htm
I didn't find in that article, what's exactly stolen from iOS.
Jaunzems said:
I didn't find in that article, what's exactly stolen from iOS.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
But the fact that Schmidt tried to make a deal with Apple is proof of stolen goods.
MartyLK said:
Yes, Android...the technology that makes it up, or its foundation, is stolen...from Apple. That being the case, anything Google invents or produces with and in Android belongs to Apple. That means the notification bar that Apple is using and the notification bar that Android is using belongs to Apple.
http://www.dailytech.com/Steve+Jobs...Because+Its+a+Stolen+Product/article23077.htm
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
as much as I agree that android is largely stolen property you really can't use a quote from Steve Jobs as a source for such an argument.