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Heya all,
I've been searching for over an hour now and haven't found a response, so please forgive me and direct me to the appropriate thread if one exists. Here's my problem. When I went to bed last night, my TF101 was fine. No errors, running smooth, no problems. Plugged into the dock, and I put it on the charger, as I do every single other night, before I went to sleep. This morning, however, it's as if a band of demons has run amok in my TF101. I'm lagging all over the place, crashing, freezing- you name it, it's happened, short of the device fully erasing itself (I backed everything up a bit ago, just in case). NOTHING has changed. I've managed to resolve all the problems short of this one: I'm getting (and appear to be) damn near out of space in my app memory. I have the 32gig model, rooted, stock rom but Guevor's kernel v22.1, OC to 1404 per SetCPU default profiles. No app updates have installed, and no new apps have been installed, and I cannot for the life of me figure out how in the world I suddenly have no space left when last night I still had over half my memory empty in this device. I'm not a major Linux person, but am capable of following clear directions for troubleshooting, and any help is welcome.
Thanks in advance folks!
Sent from my Transformer TF101 using Tapatalk 2
(edited because I can't spell for crap this morning)
Your transformer may in fact have been possessed by a demonic horde. I recommend you factory reset in CWM (wiping cache and dalvik-cache as well) reinstall your ROM and have a priest perform a proper exorcism on the device. See if that helps.
Damn. Thanks for the reply, Thing. I think this is one of those cases where one seeks advice because even though they know the answer, they don't want it to be true. I was really hoping to manage this without having to reset. As ridiculous as this will sound (because it is ridiculous), I don't want to lose all the work and progress I've made on my Sims Freeplay game. I've got MyBackup Pro, but that doesn't seem to play well with SU, as I just get the "SuperUser has been granted access" or whatever it says when it tries to run, and it's never backed up the app quite like that before, the full progress. It only re-installs the .pkg file. I wonder if Titanium Backup would work better. Your thoughts?
Incidentally, Thing O Doom, you were the one who saved me from the horrible doom of being unrooted. I was not thinking, and updated to .24 without making sure to back my root up, and sure enough, got stuck. Your method was the one that worked for my rather touchy and pissy, although beloved, Transformer. I swear, this thing is possessed by VIKI from I, Robot.
Which brings me to my next question.... Please bear in mind that this is WAY out of my depth, so if it's ridiculous please be careful when you fall out of your chair laughing, but is there some way to extract my Sims game, with all it's progress and data bases, from a nandroid backup, and then just insert/install that back onto my TF101 after the wipe?
Sent from my Transformer TF101 using Tapatalk 2
Titanium backup.....backup app and data (not system)(do a batch backup for all your apps)
Free on play store.
Just redownload and then reinstall tb after flashing any rom & batch restore your apps with data.
Use the tick in the top right corner to see the batch options. Regularly redo your backups for modified data aswell.
Thanks Scotty.
Unfortunately, I may be out of luck. It seems like no matter what I uninstall, I can't clear any space at all. It stays at around 225MB free, despite me having uninstalled around 300MB of apps, clearing caches, and not having more than 13gigs full in the first place. I wonder if there is a way to side-load it. Like, download the .apk file and install from there... Hmmm.... I'll try that, see if there's any luck there. I paid for Titanium a while back. I just downloaded the Revolver zip (if I have to flash, I'm putting a rom on here, and not messing with ASUS's silliness anymore), so it will let me DL from the web...
Sent from my Transformer TF101 using Tapatalk 2
OK, I managed to get TB to install, and now have backups. I noticed that TB has a feature called "Extract from Nandroid", and am hoping that if the backup fails somehow, I can pull it from the nandroid. Here goes nothing. Thanks for the help guys!
Sent from my Transformer TF101 using Tapatalk 2
@Thing, the restore worked. Whatever the Horde of Demons THOUGHT it was going to get away with has failed, and I now have a quietly behaving TF101 again. I'm giving Revolution a test spin.
@Scotty, thank you again for your EXCELLENT suggestion. My Sims backed up and restored beautifully from TB, and it's now my daily driver for backups. They've made a lot of improvements since I stopped using it in favour of MyBackupPro.
My TF101 is purring along, better than before now, and I'm quite pleased with it. Thanks again guys.
Sent from my Transformer TF101 using Tapatalk 2
I have the same problem also.. every weeks or so my TF would run out of space..
I read somewhere. Here in XDA that to check the logs folder in. /DATA/LOGS
Some apps keep making a bunch of log files and it would filled up my TF free space.. now I just check the logs folder and delete those pesky files (I use es file explorer)
Hope that help you..
Thanks for that! I've bookmarked this thread so I can try that before wiping next time. I've also switched to Titanium Backup, since it actually restores the app data as well.
Sent from my Transformer TF101 using Tapatalk 2
Hi basic question regarding my internal sdcard.
Im having an issue and was told I should format my sdcard (I dont have an external sd).
I hooked my phone up via USB and opened it with windows explorer. I see my device and see "Internal Storage", which contains every folder within it. I dont see something specific for "sdcard" and Im unsure how to find it. Is the entire "Internal Storage" folder what Im looking for? Is that what I should completely back up on pc, format and then repopulate? Im nervous about bricking the phone so want to confirm this...
Thanks.
The internal memory is the sd card referred to. You will lose all of your data.
Sent from a galaxy far far away.
luc.highwalker said:
The internal memory is the sd card referred to. You will lose all of your data.
Sent from a galaxy far far away.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Thanks for the reply. So if I first copy every folder here onto my PC, format it and then put all those folders back, should I expect the phone to restart without any problem and everything fully intact?
lirong said:
Thanks for the reply. So if I first copy every folder here onto my PC, format it and then put all those folders back, should I expect the phone to restart without any problem and everything fully intact?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yup, works just fine.
Sent from a galaxy far far away.
thanks really appreciate this guidance.
i know it seems obvious, but doing it your first time is scary so its really helpful to get affirmation that my understanding of what may seem basic and obvious is correct
Haha I know that feeling, first time I tried to root a phone I almost bricked it probably one of my scariest moments. YouTube helps a lot, there's plenty of step by step guides on how to do pretty much everything to your phone.
Sent from a galaxy far far away.
luc.highwalker said:
Haha I know that feeling, first time I tried to root a phone I almost bricked it probably one of my scariest moments. YouTube helps a lot, there's plenty of step by step guides on how to do pretty much everything to your phone.
Sent from a galaxy far far away.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
OT: First time i modded a phone (a razr v3i) i did brick it. after a week of research (the v3i scene is a huge mess) i was able to both save it and do some weird stuff like changing imei for fun
as for the topic, luc.highwalker has covered it so you are safe lirong.
I have an issue with my internal storage mount.... Not the ones with my system files but the one were all my program/game files go. I have orthus 8 now and ever sense I don't have it anymore showing up. Can someone help my fix it?
Sent from my SGH-I727 using xda app-developers app
I'm running the stock OS on my sidekick and am running out of memory on the internal SD card. It can't run the updates. I have only a handful of apps downloaded. T-mobile won't let me delete a whole host of stupid apps I never use. I went through and moved everything to the external SD card that would move (very few apps are willing to move, grrrrr). I even deleted the updates to all the stupid apps that can't be moved on the assumption that they always get larger over time (is this a correct assumption?) and turned off the auto en masse updating.
Anyway, I'm out of ideas. I guess this is a rant because I don't have much hope. It annoys me no end that the idea of android and having control of the device gets destroyed by the carriers.
Still loving the keyboard. I'd marry it if it was legal to.
[I just want a phone that does a few things reliably and I don't want to spend the hours I did with my last android rooting and re-rooting it, I added it up and it was 16 hours, at least, at 125 an hour for my personal time it was the single most expensive thing I've ever owned.]
Rooting this phone will fix your problem and will take a novice 20min and a pro 3-5min, choice is yours though
Sent from my myTouch_4G_Slide using xda premium
As demkantor said, rooting the SK4G is not very tough even for newcomers. Pretty straightforward and once you finish the process you can use those shiny new root permissions to delete things like the app-pack, qik-vidchat, and all that other bologna. Check the dev section and it's all there.
I agree, just root and install a lightweight ROM. It's not that difficult or time-consuming. Then you can tailor the phone to your liking. Or you can try Googling "android remove bloatware without root." Quite a few how-tos will come up, although I can't vouch for any of them.
Easy remove
rareasasparagus said:
I'm running the stock OS on my sidekick and am running out of memory on the internal SD card. It can't run the updates. I have only a handful of apps downloaded. T-mobile won't let me delete a whole host of stupid apps I never use. I went through and moved everything to the external SD card that would move (very few apps are willing to move, grrrrr). I even deleted the updates to all the stupid apps that can't be moved on the assumption that they always get larger over time (is this a correct assumption?) and turned off the auto en masse updating.
Anyway, I'm out of ideas. I guess this is a rant because I don't have much hope. It annoys me no end that the idea of android and having control of the device gets destroyed by the carriers.
Still loving the keyboard. I'd marry it if it was legal to.
[I just want a phone that does a few things reliably and I don't want to spend the hours I did with my last android rooting and re-rooting it, I added it up and it was 16 hours, at least, at 125 an hour for my personal time it was the single most expensive thing I've ever owned.]
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
For the easy then, SuperOneClick works for root. it's super and one click for the sk4g. "Titanium backup" can then delete everything that has a neon pink icon (TMO bundled crap, there is lots) Most of the "neon pink" is safe to remove, please someone correct me if something doesn't fit the large generalization.
Should be less than an hour.
For your problem root the phone then update superuser an download /system/app an you can delte the useless apps from tmobile or stuff you don't use
Or you can install a rom which would fix a lot of problems
P.s. also after root download clean master an run it every few days go through an delete the bs stuff you don't use folders that were not deleted
Sent from my SGH-T839 using xda app-developers app
Let's try to keep all Q&A's for this tablet in one thread for now. Wonder if I should drop tips here too?
Autocreates junk files
ONE folder gets filled with junk files which renders the entire tablet almost unusable. I can't even delete the files.
All I can do is to shut down the tablet, connect the SD to a pc and backup all files, EXCEPT the backup folder as it's corrupted.
My tablet is running on Android 4.1.x (it DOES say "x" in the phone info) stock rom with root access.
It's ONLY folders called something with "Backup", like "Backups" and "TitaniumBackup" that have been affected so far.
It's also only the folder with that name on my EXTERNAL SD that's affected.
Several virus scans have been performed which came up clean.
I even wiped the entire unit including System/data/cache, also to no avail.
This issue happens MORE than once per day. The tablet gets very sluggish, and the files are there.
I found out that when I did NOT have a folder with "backup" in it, then it runs for days with no issues.
Note that I also have a phone (LG Optimus 2X) which have NO problems. The phone uses a rooted Android 4.2.2 custom rom.
I attached a dual screenshot showing a clean folder and one full of junk. Note dates for creation.
Anyone have any ideas as to what causes it?
Further testing shows that other folders are ALSO affected, but ONLY folders containing Titanium Backup Pro backup files.
Even more testing shows that even if I try to use a sub-sub folder, then it still happens.
I even tried using a folder name containing spaces and danish national letters:
"/mnt/external_sd/Titanium/Sikkerhedskopier/HÃ¥ber at denne mappe virker/"
Still get the junk files, as seen on the screenshot.
Note the reported size and date of the files.
Dates seem very random, and although all file managers shows the SDCard is almost empty,
then the files put together adds up to much more than the 16GB the card is in size. So something is NOT right.
I have also noted that I can delete SOME of them with Root Explorer, but as soon as I do a refresh then new files are already made.
Logcat only shows files deleted, but not added.
I could REALLY use some help with this.
FURTHER testing shows the files are ONLY created when Titanium Backup Pro is set to do regular backups, so I am beginning to suspect it's a combination of my tablet AND Titanium that is the cause.
I have noticed my tablet kills the menu at what to ME is random intervals.
It doesn't matter if I even USE the tablet, just as long as it's on.
Anyone have an idea what might be the cause and maybe how to fix it?
I have attached an alogcat file, from a point where it happened.
I WANTED to attach it, but it seems like I am not allowed... can't even use smilies????
Managed to attach the logcat that failed the other day.
Must admit that I an beginning to wonder if I just write for my self, or somebody is actually READING this?
OFFICIAL FIRMWARE PACKAGE FROM ODYS:
http://rapidshare.com/files/2035920130/ODYS Xelio 10 Pro Firmware 20130506.zip
The manual is in german though.
If someone can/want to translate that to english for me then I'll add it to the package.
Looks like I am the only one in the world who bought this tablet
Sent from my Xelio10Pro using xda app-developers app
Odd thing is that when I don't set Titanium Backup schedule then I don't get junk files.
But the tablet still write protect the SD card at random intervals. Even when Titanium Backup isn't installed.
Sent from my Xelio10Pro using xda app-developers app
TIP!
How to add GPS functionality to the tablet using an Android phone:
1. Download "Bluetooth GPS" from Google Play to the tablet.
2. Download "GPS over BT" from Google Play to the phone.
3. Pair the two devices.
4. Start up the programs and connect from the tablet to the phone.
This has been tested with a 4.2.3 phone and a 4.1.x tablet.
Sent from my Xelio10Pro using xda app-developers app
Just ordered my 10", and was wondering if anyone could give me a quick rundown on installing Google Play Store on it, is it just a matter of side loading the apk or is there more to it ?
TTgowings said:
Just ordered my 10", and was wondering if anyone could give me a quick rundown on installing Google Play Store on it, is it just a matter of side loading the apk or is there more to it ?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
It's pre-installed, so no worries
All you have to do is enter your Gmail address and password during setup and you are all set.
Sent from my Xelio10Pro using xda app-developers app
Thanks for the quick reply, but I believe we are talking/looking at 2 different versions of the same thing though. Probably same hardware with just a little bit different versions of firmware/software. Odys/Xelio. I don't have mine in hand yet, should have sometime next week and will defiantly let you know how it goes when I get it, still learning the Android OS, have had a Nexus 7 for a little over a year now, and a HTC Evo 4G LTE for some months now, so this tablet was purchased just for the 10" screen for reading and have sold my Nexus waiting for the 7-2 (STILL)..
I had links to both, but still can't post URL's yet, sorry
Eh what were you thinking about then, when talking about Google Play Store?
I want to help when I can
Update: Early morning here so...
It's not the Xelio10Pro you are getting?
Sent from my Xelio10Pro using xda app-developers app
Well, I got it yesterday sideloaded the Play Store and several other apps & apk's with no issues, it seems to be a very light a sleek little tablet with no bloatware at all, I really want to like this tablet but the LCD screen is just awful. I really wish I could adjust contrast or something more then just brightness, the glossy face on it and the res just make it really hard to read or look at any sort of pictures, to just read text isn't bad but with pics it just has such a glare and brightness it's just weird to explain. I had already ordered some generic 10.1" tablet screen protectors and they should be here in a few days, so I am really hoping that they are a little bit matte and it'll help or fix the glare issue as I really want to like this tablet.
I know how you feel.
I generally have issues with the touch sensitivity, but have gotten used to it now.
I also noticed the reflection from the screen, which is pretty bad. Makes the tablet useless in sunlight. Hope you can give some good news on that when you get the cover.
It IS good as an ebook reader as long as your surroundings isn't too bright.
I also think it is quite powerful, considering the price.
Sent from my Xelio10Pro using xda app-developers app
I have been in contact with Odys support with a few questions.
They told me that they will NOT update the tablet. Not even to 4.2.2. They claim it requires too much of the hardware,
even though I told them I have a phone with only one fourth the memory of the tablet and a smaller CPU running 4.2.2 smoothly.
It seems like they have decided to solve all problems with a standard answer: reflash the stock firmware.
They even told me to do that AFTER I told them I already tried that.
Sent from my Xelio10Pro using xda app-developers app
I decided NOT to use my external SD card after the last two restores to factory default (including full flash of factory firmware).
First time after that restore, I installed Titanium Backup Pro, and set up a schedule as always.
This resulted in my INTERNAL SD card became read-only.
Only way to fix that was another firmware flash.
I then decided NOT to install Titanium Backup Pro again.
The tablet has been working perfectly ever since.
Sent from my Xelio10Pro using xda app-developers app
Thanks a lot!
SnowmanDK said:
OFFICIAL FIRMWARE PACKAGE FROM ODYS:
The manual is in german though.
If someone can/want to translate that to english for me then I'll add it to the package.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
First, thanks a lot for your monologue
And no, you're not the only person with this tablet. And this was the only place where I found firmware... thanks so much for uploading this, helped me a lot as I nearly bricked my tab while rooting it. Now after flashing it with the new FW, everything works smooth again And this without contacting Odys, and late on a saturday night, perfect, made my day!
Btw., I have the same issue with the huge Titanium Backup folder... :/
Now that I know that I am not alone, then I have this to say:
You are all welcome to post your experiences with this tablet (both good and bad)
Sent from my Xelio10Pro using xda app-developers app
Does anyone own this phone?
I may have to get one and was just wondering if its a decent phone or not.
Things are tough right now and I don't think we are going to be able to pay our Verizon bill and I may have to just go spend the $40 at walmart to pick this up
Anyone had any success rooting this phone? How about CWM?
Please let me know.
Thanks!
I have one and root is possible, but the bootloader is locked because virgin mobile is bein stupid so cwm is out of the question so if u get one and root it be careful. I suggest a different carrier like at&t Go Phone
Sent from my Event using xda app-developers app
my experience so far
sgirard1991 said:
Does anyone own this phone?
I may have to get one and was just wondering if its a decent phone or not.
Things are tough right now and I don't think we are going to be able to pay our Verizon bill and I may have to just go spend the $40 at walmart to pick this up
Anyone had any success rooting this phone? How about CWM?
Please let me know.
Thanks!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Just bought this phone a few days ago from amazon. I got it to replace a Kyocera Rise that I unceremoniously managed to boot loop when I went NUTS with checking too many options using the Pimp My ROM app. I nearly had that one for a year, so in a way, not a big loss for me, as I paid around $50 for the Event (incl. one day shipping).
I haven't activated the phone yet, but doing everything else on it seems to be all right. I've tested a couple of 3D games on it already: Temple Run 2, and Raging Thunder. Seems to run both fine, with only a tiny bit of lag on TR2. That can be improved once the phone is rooted. For now, I'm using my older, rooted LG Optimus V as my cell phone. I'll probably load a couple of benchmark apps to see how the phone holds up.
I loaded a full MP4 movie (rip from DVD) onto the Event to test 2D video.
The Event has about 1.2 GB of internal storage available, but the more important issue is the system RAM. It has 360 MB available out of 512 MB. That's only 3 MB more than the Rise... aack! But that can be improved upon once the thing's rooted. Ordered a case + screen protector for the Event earlier this morning... as soon as that arrives, I'll have the phone activated. Then I'll root it. I might skip out on doing any big fixes on this one. The main issue I had with the Rise anyway was with the wifi reception. It seems to be much better with the Event, from my own usage. Also, the cell phone signal bars seem to light up higher with the Event, so I shouldn't have too many problems with phone calls and texts. That usually means better 3G reception as well.
When this phone's rooted, these are the only fixes I'd do to it:
1. Editing the /system/lib/egl/egl.cfg file. Back up the original, name it egl.cfg.bak, then edit the original like this:
0 1 adreno200
# 0 0 libEGL
It looks something like that, but basically, put hashtags on the other lines to uncomment, or delete them. That fix enables the Event to use only the hardware drivers for 2D and 3D full time. Makes a huge difference in phone performance. Edit the permissions first, from r-- to rw- before editing the file. Once it's saved, put the permissions back to r--, then reboot. If you don't do this, the phone may boot loop!
2. Titanium Backup. This can backup all the apps on the phone, including some system apps. TB can be used to freeze unwanted apps as well. Some folks suggest uninstalling the bloatware, but I wouldn't do it, in case the phone gets a system update. Freezing should be fine.
3. Link2SD. This is essential if you want to free up space in internal storage. I use this to link any app that can't be installed to the SD card. It requires a second partition; I used FAT32 (2 GB partition) with the Rise, as it didn't have a custom ROM that had the ext4 modules. This will probably be the same for the Event. When formatting the SD card for this, make sure that the main partition that the phone reads upon booting has the boot and lba flags checked. I use gparted in Linux to partition and format SD cards
4. Greenify. This allows apps to hibernate when the phone is idle. It even hibernates some apps while you're using the phone, saving you some memory and CPU cycles. That can help save some battery power.
For now, I'm using Advanced Task Killer to maintain some free memory and help reduce unwanted CPU cycles. Green Power Premium cuts off the 3G/WiFi when the phone is idle. ATK kills apps, but I set it to work every two hours. That lets the phone do its memory tasks, while ATK kills the more stubborn apps (mostly the bloatware I don't use).
Hope that helps you out, and good luck.
Thanks for the input guys.
Sent from my SCH-I535 using xda app-developers app
WOW that's some good input. Didn't want to get rid of this phone, now it doesn't look like I'll have to.
Sent from my Event using xda app-developers app
I got this phone for $20 at Walmart's Black Friday sale. For that price who could pass up Android 4.0x? Despite its apparent lower quality, I am quite pleased with its overall performance and the virtual keyboard, surprisingly, works better than a many other phones I have tried.
permission question
Hey all,Ive never messed with changing permissions,I have an Event and Im wonder ing when I open the permission page with root explorer it reads like this
READ WRITE EX
OWN X X
GROUP X
GLOBAL
In the post it says "from r-- to rw- before editing the file" Dopes this mean OWN has 1 X,GROUP has 2 X,and GLOBAL is blank correct? Then edit file and change to how it was in the begining? Thanks alot!!!!
Sorry to rehash and old thread but this one seemed to fit the best to what I am experiencing and what I'd like to ask.
I have owned this phone a little over 3 months now, switching from LG Optimus V, I have some grief from the day one.
First and foremost, it is very unstable. On the average, I have to hard reset it once a day, most of the time, more than just once. And when I say Hard Reset, I mean holding the power button down forever for the phone to reboot as the screen doesn't show anything. A few times, I went as far as removing the battery.
Question 1. I looked around hard and I didn't see any custom ROMs or any custom recovery modules, likes of clockwork. Am I missing something ?
My main concern was the ability of running FoxFi and as expected, it did not run on this one. So, I took the advie of some guys over at the android forums and loaded up poot to root it. It seems to have no problems with rooting. But afterwards, I have tried few hotspot apps and never been able to turn on this fjunctionality. I know the apps I chose required root access and I turned it on before starting the app, but nada...
Question 2. How can I get either FoxFi working on this thing ? Or short of it, how can I make any (suggestions welcome) WiFi hotspot app working with it ?
Thanks in advance
virgin mobile kycera event
]
sgirard1991 said:
Does anyone own this phone?
I may have to get one and was just wondering if its a decent phone or not.
Things are tough right now and I don't think we are going to be able to pay our Verizon bill and I may have to just go spend the $40 at walmart to pick this up
Anyone had any success rooting this phone? How about CWM?
Please let me know.
Thanks!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yes I own a virgin mobile kyocera event and sucessfully rooted device with no problems at all. The process is much more simplified now than it was when I rooted, so lucky you And your going to want TWRP so you can use the recovery stored on SD if you do come across and bootloop or brick issues. Its worth the $30 I spent It's not the best by far, but its really pretty capable once rooted. Much better than I had expected. I hope I was of help to you, and if u decide to buy it and need help rooting I'm down.
Chryss13 said:
]
Yes I own a virgin mobile kyocera event and sucessfully rooted device with no problems at all. The process is much more simplified now than it was when I rooted, so lucky you And your going to want TWRP so you can use the recovery stored on SD if you do come across and bootloop or brick issues. Its worth the $30 I spent It's not the best by far, but its really pretty capable once rooted. Much better than I had expected. I hope I was of help to you, and if u decide to buy it and need help rooting I'm down.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
howd u manage to get TWRP on this phone?
Sent from my N800 using XDA Free mobile app
Chryss13 said:
]
Yes I own a virgin mobile kyocera event and sucessfully rooted device with no problems at all. The process is much more simplified now than it was when I rooted, so lucky you And your going to want TWRP so you can use the recovery stored on SD if you do come across and bootloop or brick issues. Its worth the $30 I spent It's not the best by far, but its really pretty capable once rooted. Much better than I had expected. I hope I was of help to you, and if u decide to buy it and need help rooting I'm down.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
JHell said:
howd u manage to get TWRP on this phone?
Sent from my N800 using XDA Free mobile app
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
yes! please, do tell! Inquiring minds need to know!
any one know how flash firmware on this phone..and how make a full backup..i have 20 of this phones..and some of them has a bootloop or stuck at event logo..please