[Q]Hardware/software questions about Xoom - Xoom Q&A, Help & Troubleshooting

Hey all,
I have a few questions about the Xoom since I'm thinking about getting one (and yes, I am comparing it to the iPad 2).
First off, we've all seen Anandtech's graphical benchmarks of the Xoom. I'm taking those with a grain of salt though because from what I've seen from the Xoom when I've tried it at Best Buy, the Xoom seems to perform perfectly fine.
That said, do you think the Xoom's bottleneck in terms of graphical performance is more on the software end? Or is it more because of the hardware? Right now, I see myself doubting the Tegra 2.
Next, how well does the HDMI video output work? Has anyone tried it directly from the tablet? Or do you actually need the dock (I've read this somewhere) to use the HDMI video output? I assume it's easy to do, right?
I know this has been discussed before, but while I'm here asking questions, I figured I might as well: how's the office productivity with the Xoom? I won't necessarily need apps to edit Word/Excel/Powerpoint documents (though it'd be nice), but to at least view them and perhaps display them via the HDMI out could be very useful for me at work.
Lastly, how have your experiences with the video chat been so far? With Fring (I would like to be able to do cross-platform video chat, specifically with iOS devices since I have friends/family who use them)? Google Chat?
That's all I've got for now. Thanks!

I have had the xoom for almost a month. I think the performance is great, but I have no I pad experience other then playing with them in the verizon store.
I like this long battery life, the cameras have been fun though the app support is still lacking. I still can't video skype etc. But I am biased towards android and will wait for the market to catch up.
I have purchased a micro hdmi cable to regular hdmi from microcenter and it works fine, I think it defaulted to 720p. But everything shows up on the screen except for the bottom menu bar. Like the bottom 10 pixels or something.
Sent from my Xoom using XDA Premium App

This is an uneducated guess compared to some of the realllllllllllllly smart people on xda but i think that if you can play games like Samurai II: Vengance in full screen full res the hardware schould have no trouble playing back a video file at that resolution (it doesnt have all that GPU work to do!). So i personally think the issue is software.

norsairius said:
Hey all,
I have a few questions about the Xoom since I'm thinking about getting one (and yes, I am comparing it to the iPad 2).
First off, we've all seen Anandtech's graphical benchmarks of the Xoom. I'm taking those with a grain of salt though because from what I've seen from the Xoom when I've tried it at Best Buy, the Xoom seems to perform perfectly fine.
That said, do you think the Xoom's bottleneck in terms of graphical performance is more on the software end? Or is it more because of the hardware? Right now, I see myself doubting the Tegra 2.
Next, how well does the HDMI video output work? Has anyone tried it directly from the tablet? Or do you actually need the dock (I've read this somewhere) to use the HDMI video output? I assume it's easy to do, right?
I know this has been discussed before, but while I'm here asking questions, I figured I might as well: how's the office productivity with the Xoom? I won't necessarily need apps to edit Word/Excel/Powerpoint documents (though it'd be nice), but to at least view them and perhaps display them via the HDMI out could be very useful for me at work.
Lastly, how have your experiences with the video chat been so far? With Fring (I would like to be able to do cross-platform video chat, specifically with iOS devices since I have friends/family who use them)? Google Chat?
That's all I've got for now. Thanks!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
1. I'm not an expert in this area, but my time with the Xoom indicates that it's a software issue. There are several games available in the market that look absolutely great on the Xoom, and run very smooth without any hiccups. Emulation, which is all done in software, tends to be a good stress-test for hardware. You should see StarFox 64 on N64oid, it's smooth as butter. I have no doubt the software will catch up and in time show off this hardware platform - don't forget there are several tablets being released with very similar specs running Honeycomb.
2. HDMI output works great, it's a full mirror. Just the other day, I was waiting in a building lobby that had a huge Panasonic HDTV hanging on the wall, but there was some issue with the cable TV service. So I took out the Xoom, plugged in the HDMI cable, and fired up some episodes of The Office. Employees walking by were surprised and said "it's about time they got that thing fixed!", not knowing my Xoom was providing the content. Gotta admit, that felt pretty cool.
3. There are plenty of office productivity apps for Android, like Documents To Go. Some are free, and have a paid version that allows you to edit documents as well. As I said before, the Xoom allows for full mirroring via HDMI-out, so this should work for you. I don't to a whole lot of Office-document editing, mostly viewing of Excel, Word, or PDF attachments, which works just fine on the Xoom.
4. I don't use Fring anymore, ever since Skype blocked them, so I migrated to Tango on my EVO, and it works just as well on the Xoom. I've made video calls over 3G on the Xoom, and it works as expected. Really looking forward to a full Skype client. I haven't tried GChat yet.
Hope this helps. Just remember that the Apple vs Google mentality is in stark contrast: Google's stuff is always in development, so the software often needs time to catch up to the hardware, whereas Apple's stuff is ready to go right out of the box. Is Honeycomb incomplete? I'd say yes, but it's already off to a good start.

Thanks for the feedback, everyone!
Now, do you all think the Xoom may become a "developer device" similar to what the Nexus One/S are since the Xoom runs stock Honeycomb? Do you foresee any issues with installing any future updates that come straight from Google since the hardware runs the stock OS just fine?
Also, have any of you tried emulators like SNESoid on the Xoom yet?

norsairius said:
Thanks for the feedback, everyone!
Now, do you all think the Xoom may become a "developer device" similar to what the Nexus One/S are since the Xoom runs stock Honeycomb? Do you foresee any issues with installing any future updates that come straight from Google since the hardware runs the stock OS just fine?
Also, have any of you tried emulators like SNESoid on the Xoom yet?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
It already is the developer device for honey comb, it's what Google used to show off honeycomb first and it's what Google gave devs early on and gave away at the game developers conferences a couple weeks ago for devs to make games on. it's what nvidia uses to show off demos and games.

Gotcha, well, that certainly increases the longevity of the device!
It would seem then that in my iPad2 vs. Xoom comparison going on in my head, the Xoom is edging ahead.
I'm not a particular fanboy of either Apple/iOS or Google/Android, so this comparison has been tough for me.
So what I've concluded so far then is that the iPad is certainly the more refined and mature product now, but the Xoom is easily more versatile. I have no doubts that the Xoom, with updates, will easily be as good, if not better than the iPad.
And especially given the fact that the Xoom will be able to use updates directly from Google when they come out, the device should have a relatively long and useful life (unless I'm misinterpreting what people are saying around here).

Nope, you hit the nail on the head. the Xoom will have a long and fruitful life from everything I can tell.
I remember when the Macintosh had very few software options, while PCs had EVERYTHING. I see it as the same kind of situation now when comparing the Xoom to the iPad 2. I'm also predicting the same level of success for Honeycomb tablets... just a matter of time!
XoomTech.net

Related

G-Tablet still worth it, or..

Alright, short and sweet;
I'm in the market for a Tablet - this will be my first, although I'm not new to smartphones/android - and I'd decided to get the G-Tablet.. until I read about the Motorola Xoom.
I like how clean the Xoom looks, how thin it is and how small the frame around the display is. I also like that it's a Motorola product, meaning there will probably be an abundance of spare parts on ebay in the following months should I need a digitizer or what have you. I don't like that I'll probably have to wait to root and modify - judging it based on Motorola's recent history with Android devices and how well they're locked down.
I like the hardware and hackability of the G-Tablet, and the fact that I can pick one up tomorrow at-will. Is there any reason NOT to get the G-Tablet right now?! This tablet will need to last me until around Christmas.
So, in your opinions, throw some pros and cons at me and lets decide which route I should go.. G-Tablet or Xoom (once it's out).
I think the biggest pro would be...it'll be a lot cheaper than the Xoom. Aside from a better screen, camera, and form factor...the gtablet should be up to par with the Xoom.
I'm pretty sure that the Gtablet will get honeycomb so it should keep the device fresh. I think it'll last you til next Xmas but I'm sure temptations to ditch the gtab will be abundant next year.
Yea the price-point for the xoom, I'm guessing, will be on par with the Galaxy Tab, if not slightly more, which would put it out of my price range.
Hows the display on the Gtablet? I've heard mixed reviews.. but I'd expect alot of viewsonic.. pics would be great if anyone has any.
Sent from my Evo 4G running AvaFroyo w/ MakMod using TapaTalk Pro
.mak said:
Yea the price-point for the xoom, I'm guessing, will be on par with the Galaxy Tab, if not slightly more, which would put it out of my price range.
Hows the display on the Gtablet? I've heard mixed reviews.. but I'd expect alot of viewsonic.. pics would be great if anyone has any.
Sent from my Evo 4G running AvaFroyo w/ MakMod using TapaTalk Pro
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The screen isn't so great on the gtablet, but if you are mostly using it from straight on it isn't a problem.
As for the Xoom, I think I'm going to be looking at other tablets. Viewsonic is supposed to release a newer tegra 2 tablet at the end of the first quarter, which looks design-wise more like the Xoom.
I would maybe, maybe get another motorolla phone to replace my droid x because it is something I rely on and don't modify it that much. However, I would never buy a locked down motorolla tablet. And worse yet, I've heard the locking down is only going to get worse with them. It's too bad because they make nice hardware.
I agree. Locked down=deal breaker. If you want to go locked down why not go ipad?
The screen on the gtab is fine for my needs (but who wouldnt prefer "better").
The developer support for gtab seems top notch and it will get better by the month for at least six months to a year. With any thing too locked down what started out as better than a competiting device could easily be getting its a$$ handed to it by said device 4 months later.
I think with CES in the first week of this year you will have a number of announcements of tablets, where I expect shipments by mid-year. I for one don't want a tablet with a data plan and I believe the Motorola will ship with a cellular data modem which will drive higher cost, carrier ties, etc.
The Acer tablets look interesting, but from the pictures on the web it isn't clear if their displays are any better.
.mak said:
Alright, short and sweet;
I'm in the market for a Tablet - this will be my first, although I'm not new to smartphones/android - and I'd decided to get the G-Tablet.. until I read about the Motorola Xoom.
.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
vsc said:
I think with CES in the first week of this year you will have a number of announcements of tablets, where I expect shipments by mid-year. I for one don't want a tablet with a data plan and I believe the Motorola will ship with a cellular data modem which will drive higher cost, carrier ties, etc.
The Acer tablets look interesting, but from the pictures on the web it isn't clear if their displays are any better.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I would have to agree, part of the reason why I went with a G-Tablet was because I don't want any type of cellular support. That's why I have a cell phone with hotspot capabilities.
After seeing what the folks here have been able to do with the tablet, especially after going Vegan, this thing is simply amazing. The fact that even Viewsonic even recognizes (in a roundabout way), on their own site, the work that is being done here is "icing on the cake" for me...
It depends if you want to wait or not. Point is the CES products will be MONTHS away and almost certainly more expensive. THEN you will have to wait for a dev community to acclimate and publish software for the product.
1. Gtablet is here NOW
2. Less than $400
3. Tegra 2 (like the best of those devices will have)
4. Dev community is producing NOW
5. Easy market hack NOW. No guarantee for future products.
6. Speaking of guarantees, do you think the products being shown at CES will be as root friendly?
Agree with what others have said already about Gtab. I used my Gtab 99.9% of the time in landscape mode so viewing angle wasn't a problem for me (though in portrait mode you need to tilt a little sideway but not much to get a good viewing angle).
If you are a hobbyist (which I think you are based on the # of projects you are currently working on) and like to tweak things then Gtab is definitely worth looking at. It is so hackable and unbrickable that it's a dev heaven for Android development. I have learned a lot by playing with different ROMs on the Gtab. Dev guys like Roebeet, Rothnic, Gojimi, Clemsyn, etc., have been keeping us busy around the clock with new builds/tricks/support that I probably will still play with it around Xmas 2011
If you are lucky you might be able to snatch a refurb Gtab from Sears outlet for $279. I got mine on sales at Sears for $349 last month brand new.
Cons:
No built-in kickstand (I modified an iPad kickstand from 5Below for $5; works perfectly though)
No perfectly fit screen protector yet (I modified an iPad screen protector to fit my Gtab screen)
No rear camera (I don't miss it but not sure about you)
No multi-finger touch (two fingers only on Gtab; not sure if it's s/w or h/w limitation but I don't find it to be an issue but would like to point it out)
No built-in GPS (but works with Bluetooth GPS to grab GPS data from your phone or other bluetooth GPS devices)
Does not support smooth playback of H.264 High Profile Encoded HD Video (you will have to convert to Main Profile before watching it on Gtab)
Hard-to-find case holder for Gtab (unlike iPad where tons of them are available)
Video Conferencing app support is still not yet widely available (only Yahoo Messenger seems to work so far but image quality is not great; others like Fring & Tango have failed on Gtab but I believe it's software on the app itself)
rothnic said:
The screen isn't so great on the gtablet, but if you are mostly using it from straight on it isn't a problem.
As for the Xoom, I think I'm going to be looking at other tablets. Viewsonic is supposed to release a newer tegra 2 tablet at the end of the first quarter, which looks design-wise more like the Xoom.
I would maybe, maybe get another motorolla phone to replace my droid x because it is something I rely on and don't modify it that much. However, I would never buy a locked down motorolla tablet. And worse yet, I've heard the locking down is only going to get worse with them. It's too bad because they make nice hardware.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The screen is my only concern at this point.. I guess GPS is an issue for me since I'd want to use this thing as a giant navigation unit on occasion, but I always have my Evo around so whatever I guess..
rushless said:
It depends if you want to wait or not. Point is the CES products will be MONTHS away and almost certainly more expensive. THEN you will have to wait for a dev community to acclimate and publish software for the product.
1. Gtablet is here NOW
2. Less than $400
3. Tegra 2 (like the best of those devices will have)
4. Dev community is producing NOW
5. Easy market hack NOW. No guarantee for future products.
6. Speaking of guarantees, do you think the products being shown at CES will be as root friendly?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
All very good points that I'd taken into account, but was hoping someone would point out to further my belief that the G-Tablet is a wise investment.
samepic said:
Agree with what others have said already about Gtab. I used my Gtab 99.9% of the time in landscape mode so viewing angle wasn't a problem for me (though in portrait mode you need to tilt a little sideway but not much to get a good viewing angle).
If you are a hobbyist (which I think you are based on the # of projects you are currently working on) and like to tweak things then Gtab is definitely worth looking at. It is so hackable and unbrickable that it's a dev heaven for Android development. I have learned a lot by playing with different ROMs on the Gtab. Dev guys like Roebeet, Rothnic, Gojimi, Clemsyn, etc., have been keeping us busy around the clock with new builds/tricks/support that I probably will still play with it around Xmas 2011
If you are lucky you might be able to snatch a refurb Gtab from Sears outlet for $279. I got mine on sales at Sears for $349 last month brand new.
Cons:
No built-in kickstand (I modified an iPad kickstand from 5Below for $5; works perfectly though)
No perfectly fit screen protector yet (I modified an iPad screen protector to fit my Gtab screen)
No rear camera (I don't miss it but not sure about you)
No multi-finger touch (two fingers only on Gtab; not sure if it's s/w or h/w limitation but I don't find it to be an issue but would like to point it out)
No built-in GPS (but works with Bluetooth GPS to grab GPS data from your phone or other bluetooth GPS devices)
Does not support smooth playback of H.264 High Profile Encoded HD Video (you will have to convert to Main Profile before watching it on Gtab)
Hard-to-find case holder for Gtab (unlike iPad where tons of them are available)
Video Conferencing app support is still not yet widely available (only Yahoo Messenger seems to work so far but image quality is not great; others like Fring & Tango have failed on Gtab but I believe it's software on the app itself)
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Accessories, rear camera and multi-touch aren't a problem for me.. two-finger zoom is all I use on my devices anyway. Video conferencing is important, but only to an extent.. No GPS is problematic, but I can bluetooth my Evo in.
None of these are deal-breakers but, in the end, without video chat, without gps, with jittery playback of h.264 video and poor display quality, I'm wondering what I'll use the G-Tablet for lol
I suppose I'd be using this for media playback around the house and while traveling, same with web browsing (with Flash, and I'll tether to my Evo when away from home), Netflix when it becomes available (I'm sure there'll be a hack for that) and Google Maps.. does it support v5 Maps with 3d buildings??
As for the iPad comment earlier in the thread; I thought about it, but I like widgets and expansion way too much to go with the iPad.
samepic said:
Agree with what others have said already about Gtab. I used my Gtab 99.9% of the time in landscape mode so viewing angle wasn't a problem for me (though in portrait mode you need to tilt a little sideway but not much to get a good viewing angle).
If you are a hobbyist (which I think you are based on the # of projects you are currently working on) and like to tweak things then Gtab is definitely worth looking at. It is so hackable and unbrickable that it's a dev heaven for Android development. I have learned a lot by playing with different ROMs on the Gtab. Dev guys like Roebeet, Rothnic, Gojimi, Clemsyn, etc., have been keeping us busy around the clock with new builds/tricks/support that I probably will still play with it around Xmas 2011
If you are lucky you might be able to snatch a refurb Gtab from Sears outlet for $279. I got mine on sales at Sears for $349 last month brand new.
Cons:
No built-in kickstand (I modified an iPad kickstand from 5Below for $5; works perfectly though)
No perfectly fit screen protector yet (I modified an iPad screen protector to fit my Gtab screen)
No rear camera (I don't miss it but not sure about you)
No multi-finger touch (two fingers only on Gtab; not sure if it's s/w or h/w limitation but I don't find it to be an issue but would like to point it out)
No built-in GPS (but works with Bluetooth GPS to grab GPS data from your phone or other bluetooth GPS devices)
Does not support smooth playback of H.264 High Profile Encoded HD Video (you will have to convert to Main Profile before watching it on Gtab)
Hard-to-find case holder for Gtab (unlike iPad where tons of them are available)
Video Conferencing app support is still not yet widely available (only Yahoo Messenger seems to work so far but image quality is not great; others like Fring & Tango have failed on Gtab but I believe it's software on the app itself)
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
kindle dx cases fit the gtab nicely
Gentlemen:
Lots of good thoughts and ideas -- but I have one that hasn't been mentioned.
Simply put, I'm not rich but if something really better comes out I'll go buy one!!!
I bought two G-Tabs for the fun of playing on the bleeding edge and for personal use. I already have more than justified what I spent with what I have done already!!! I'm even. And I still have a lot more playing to do.
I have accepted the fact that Viewsonic accomplished what they intended in getting a tablet with good hardware and "open" software on the market early. Did they miss the mark on the software -- we may never know except for what we have found in using the tablet.
But they have responded and the devs have catered to us and so far as I can see it we all are having a blast.
I saw a report that an estimated 80 tablet devices will be announced at CES!!!
Got to be something worth playing with in there. But most them are months away. When they are really available we'll see.....
For now, here's to a Happy New Year and lots of fun until it's time to do it again!!!!
Rev
I had mine for almost two weeks and just returned mine to Office Depot. Some of my reasoning is that while it's fast, it feels cheap and the display quality just kills me. Also the Samsung Galaxy Tab just dropped to $500 with no contract from Verizon. CES is just around the corner and I have a feeling that there's going to be a slew of tablets from different vendors. Best buy already has 3 different android tablets in the store since the Fall.
I did enjoy the aspect of it being easy to flash and VEGAn is great, but the lack of being able to run Google Location Services and VOIP kinda also killed it for me. Then the few reports of the power port being knocked loose, made me decide to return it.
After days of researching and some great replies here, I'm positive I'm going to hold off for CES to pass and see what's being offered.
I've decided I need GPS built-in and a better display, and an aluminum body wouldn't hurt either! (but it's unlikely..).
I may grab an iPad used and lowball someone, just to hold me over until CES passes and the new tablets hit stores.. by then Netflix may have the Android app out, and I'll have had a few solid months using it on the iPad.
If I get an iPad for now, I'll also grab the Desktop Connect software so can mess with my laptop through the ipad.
This should hold me over for now, thanks guys!
I just wanted to add my 0.02 for anyone else contemplating the gTab. My wife and I got an iPad this weekend from my Mom for christmas, and since we weren't really looking for a tablet, I hate itunes, I already have a droid x, and I didn't like that she spent so much money, we decided to return the ipad and get an android tablet. Since I only had a day to figure out what we wanted - if anything- I did some frantic searches on the droid x which lead me here. I read about all the issues, the ROMs, and the hardware and decided for the money the Gtab was the way to go. I also thought the screen wouldn't bother me much.
First experience with the Gtab is like everyone else's. Its total crap from the oem. I was reluctant to even let my wife touch it before I modded it. Lucky she doesn't have very high expectations, but she kept asking why everything kept "Force closing" lol.
This is my first time rooting any android device (I've rooted a few linksys routers though) but it was super easy (once I realized the + vol button was the OTHER one). My Gtab is now running VEGAn beta 5 and so far is fantastic. It runs better than my droid x and the only bummer is the missing market stuff. Seems anything GPS related is missing and I'm sure other stuff. I have the droid x paired with the Gtab for GPS and I was hoping the GTab could be my new Giant plotter in my boat but I couldn't find my Navionics software in the market to install. Will have to look into finding a way to install it.
But the real biggest let down surprised me. The screen. I thought it wouldn't matter much to me, but 99% of the time I find myself laying it flat on a desk or my lap in landscape mode and that is the worst possible viewing angle for this device. Quite annoying, but I would still buy (I guess I should say "trade an iPad for") the Gtab again.
The main use will be office productivity for my wife at home/travelling and email/facebook stuff also. I expect it to work well for that.
I was at Best Buy today and almost bit the bullet on an iPad 16GB WiFi, but decided to head to sears and see the G-Tablet on display.. turned out the genius working the counter mistook the cardboard cutout for a real G-Tablet! LOL
Anyway, I decided, regardless of the horrid return policy (30 days, 15% restocking fee unless defective) that I'd take a gTab home with me and give it a shot.
I'm liking it so far, the screen is horrible but I'll adjust. Clockworkmod install was very straightforward, as was installing zPad 3.0 and getting some apps installed (all expected..).
Only time will tell if I regret my purchase.. but if I can get hulu working and some sort of a remote desktop / vnc to control my laptop without loads of lag, I'll be a happy camper.
While I'm on the subject, is there an app similar to AirStream for the iPad? It's VERY fluid and works almost as if you're using Windows (or OSX) from the iPad.. PhoneMyPC is laggy and choppy, LogMeIn is as well.. any others I might try?
The iPad is awful, except the screen
I actually bought an iPad at Worst Buy last week - I just had to test it out. The screen is really very nice and comic viewing is PERFECT on it.
However.....
- No Flash (knew that going in)
- No USB (knew that going in)
- One speaker. That one I didn't expect.
- Mediocre video support. You have to buy an app to get XVID support, and it didn't even work 100% of the time. The GTab might choke on high profile x264's, but it shines on XVID's.
- Mediocre audio support. No WMA, no Vorbis, no FLAC. Nuff said.
- SMB access requires a paid app, and even so it only supported native extensions.
- No drag and drop, and the sharing feature is spotty at best. I would push over a CBR file to Stanza, and 50% of the time the transfer would flat out fail. And I was doing this on a Mac.
The last bullet was the one that "broke the camel's back". I can dump all my CBR's on a NAS device and read them on the GTab (with VEGan b5.1) with no problem. On an iPad, it's a chore to just add a handful of comics. Basically, the device was not designed for me, it was designed for someone who stays within Apple's walled garden and is willing to pay pay pay for all their content (even if they already own it, but it's not supported).
roebeet said:
I actually bought an iPad at Worst Buy last week - I just had to test it out. The screen is really very nice and comic viewing is PERFECT on it.
However.....
- No Flash (knew that going in)
- No USB (knew that going in)
- One speaker. That one I didn't expect.
- Mediocre video support. You have to buy an app to get XVID support, and it didn't even work 100% of the time. The GTab might choke on high profile x264's, but it shines on XVID's.
- Mediocre audio support. No WMA, no Vorbis, no FLAC. Nuff said.
- SMB access requires a paid app, and even so it only supported native extensions.
- No drag and drop, and the sharing feature is spotty at best. I would push over a CBR file to Stanza, and 50% of the time the transfer would flat out fail. And I was doing this on a Mac.
The last bullet was the one that "broke the camel's back". I can dump all my CBR's on a NAS device and read them on the GTab (with VEGan b5.1) with no problem. On an iPad, it's a chore to just add a handful of comics. Basically, the device was not designed for me, it was designed for someone who stays within Apple's walled garden and is willing to pay pay pay for all their content (even if they already own it, but it's not supported).
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yep. It's why I never even bothered to look at an iPad when they came out even though I had wanted a tablet ala Newton Messagepad 2100 for YEARS!
h.264 HP: I still think that it's just a driver problem, and all Tegra 2s currently have the same problem. nVidia is still claiming full h.264 and I doubt that they'd continue on with that if the hw wasn't capable... so it's a wait for nVidia to fix thing, or admit that they have a hw bug that they can't workaround w/sw...
My only thing with the gTab was that I wished that the camera was higher res... it's not really extra horrible, but it's not awesome either... just kind of meh...
Still using my gTab mainly for web browsing, occasional video, and I have used it to read in portrait mode before in the past although in that function it's been retired since I picked up a NC last week... but I can see situations where I might revert to it if the NC battery is almost dead and I need something backlit to read on... that said in portrait orientation as a reader it just wasn't comfortable to hold to begin with... NC much better for that...
NC screen: yeah better viewing angles, but turns out not to be very selling to me. OTOH the pixel density is VERY nice, unfortunately B&N QA sucks. (My first NC had a defective USB port, and I had a b!tch of a time getting the yahoos in the store to exchange it, so they have a sh!tty cs experience as well... as in if anything goes defective on #2 in the next week it's going back for cash because of their horrid cs.)
Just for what it's worth, take a look at last year's CES and the one before it and see how many products seen there actually hit the market, and of the ones that did, how many were there that actually made it out in the first 2 quarters?
Any tablet at CES that magically passes those 2 barriers will be so proud of itself, it's going to slap a pricetag of $700+ on itself. History repeats itself, CES is all hype specifically to try and rally you into thinking $700 is a great deal.
I would strongly suggest the $350 gtab for this reason hands down, besides, the $700 one if it even does materialize before Q3, will be sporting an approximation of the hardware of the gtab so we will get all their softwares anyway..
See I don't know about that. I think that carriers and manufacturers learned from the massively overpriced galaxy tab. Over $500 is asking a lot of the average consumer, and my guess would be that a majority off these will be around or below that price. For example the notion ink with the lcd is sub 500, and there are plenty more coming out half as nice looking.
Sent from my T-Mobile G2 using XDA App

[Q] HELP: Save me from going to the Apple side

Hey guys,
So here's the situation:
I've been excited about the Transformer for weeks. I'm getting one as my birthday/graduation present as soon as I can. But, thanks to the delayed US release, my mind has been wandering to other tablets, and, inevitably, the iPad popped into my mind. Right now, I still want to purchase the Transformer, but the thought that the iPad might be more worth it still lingers in my mind...
Here's what convinced me to even THINK about the iPad:
65,000+ apps for iPad vs <100 for Android Tabs
More responsiveness on the iPad's end vs the Transformer (seen only through videos)
Better camera on the iPad: the Transformer looks like it isn't showing the true color
Video playback on the Transformer seems choppy.
At the moment, the only PLUS for the Transformer in my mind is that you can purchase a dedicated dock for it which will make taking notes in college a lot easier + extend the battery.
PLEASE, can you guys convince me that the Transformer is the better choice so I don't feel like I should have purchased the iPad when I eventually do purchase a Transformer? Tell me why *you* would purchase a Transformer over an iPad.
(Perhaps I'm overlooking/misjudging some critical features of the Transformer that outperform the iPad; if so, please address them!)
EDIT: I suppose before recommending a device you guys should know how I plan to use the device:
Mostly as a productivity/entertainment device:
Taking notes in college classes
Standard internet use
Gaming
Movie and music use
Maayyyyybe as a GPS if it is capable of acting as one
Good luck taking notes on an iPad lol. But really, that's a huge reason why I'm going with the transformer, I'm also a college student who needs that keyboard dock.
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The two devices are so different. If price isn't an issue and you're not opposed to a more closed environment with fewer options and tweaking potential, then the iPad may just be the right tablet for you.
Transformer. Because it's not apple. Haha no but seriously I would go with the transformer. IMHO I think apple is to restrictive to do may of the things you can do with android.
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If you like a grid of squares, the iPad got you covered. And it is an AWESOME looking grid of squares.
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PuerkitoBio said:
If you like a grid of squares, the iPad got you covered. And it is an AWESOME looking grid of squares.
Sent from my Atrix
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Hahaha
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OP "thanks to the delayed US release"... As far as I've heard and read from these posts and other sites the US release is not delayed and on track for Tuesday Apr 26. There is a UK delay, but not US.
Dan76 said:
OP "thanks to the delayed US release"... As far as I've heard and read from these posts and other sites the US release is not delayed and on track for Tuesday Apr 26. There is a UK delay, but not US.
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Click to collapse
What he said ^
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gubiguy said:
65,000+ apps for iPad vs <100 for Android Tabs
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Demonstrably untrue. Apple's iPad is limited to running non-iPad native apps as a tiny window in the center of the screen; Android has no such limitation. Hence iPad apps had to be recoded; most Android apps work just fine on tablets as-is.
This is just spin -- a fictional advantage created by Apple to hide their own disadvantage.
More responsiveness on the iPad's end vs the Transformer (seen only through videos)
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Probably is true right now -- nobody except Google and their hardware partners know if they can catch up here.
Better camera on the iPad: the Transformer looks like it isn't showing the true color
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Easily fixed if it's just color accuracy / white balance. The Transformer's camera currently has bigger issues in terms of stuttering and huge shutter lag. Hopefully those will be resolved. Ask yourself this though -- are you really going to use a large tablet for photos and videos, rather than a compact camera or cellphone?
Video playback on the Transformer seems choppy.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Video capture from the rear cam is. Video playback isn't. I've seen numerous examples online playing even Full HD (1080i) videos downsampled by the Transformer to fit its own screen, and the reviewers have said they played smoothly. I'm confident that at 720p, the Transformer is more than capable of smooth video.
At the moment, the only PLUS for the Transformer in my mind is that you can purchase a dedicated dock for it which will make taking notes in college a lot easier + extend the battery.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Which even without all of the above is a huge plus. Nobody can type on an on-screen keyboard as fast as a good touch-typer on a reasonable keyboard, and the reviews of this keyboard are pretty much all positive. Plus you get a touchpad, so you don't have to keep reaching over the keyboard to make selections like you do with bluetooth keyboards.
PLEASE, can you guys convince me that the Transformer is the better choice so I don't feel like I should have purchased the iPad when I eventually do purchase a Transformer? Tell me why *you* would purchase a Transformer over an iPad.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Beyond the above, companies that emphasise openness and listen to the end users, not a company that locks everything down, does its best to prevent any competition with its own software, and in the latest scandal, continues to record your entire GPS location history even when specifically told not to do so.
Maayyyyybe as a GPS if it is capable of acting as one
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It is. You'll just either need a device to tether to, or an offline mapping solution. Personally I'm waiting eagerly for Route 66 (http://www.66.com) to release; they're based on TomTom data, and I've been using a TomTom for years, so I know their data is great.
Honestly I think both of the tablets do what you want fairly well. Here's what you have to consider and decide if these things matter to you.
Do you care about flash content on the web and viewing it on your tablet?
Are you concerned with price?
Do you like to tinker and mess around with Android/OSs?
The iPad is a great all-around tablet. If you don't mind spending some extra money, or the lack of flash, it might be a better option for you. There are some good keyboard options for it. I dislike trying to get documents off of iOS products. I like being able to connect an Android device like a flash drive and drag and drop stuff off (which is super helpful for using computer labs that may not have itunes at school).
Why am I buying this tablet?
I'm invested in Android (own apps/heavy google app user)
$400 feels like a good entry point to try out tablets
I like the community and dealing with fixing my issues on my own and changing ROMs and kernels, tweaking the looks and performance.
gubiguy said:
65,000+ apps for iPad vs <100 for Android Tabs
More responsiveness on the iPad's end vs the Transformer (seen only through videos)
Better camera on the iPad: the Transformer looks like it isn't showing the true color
Video playback on the Transformer seems choppy.
At the moment, the only PLUS for the Transformer in my mind is that you can purchase a dedicated dock for it which will make taking notes in college a lot easier + extend the battery.
(Perhaps I'm overlooking/misjudging some critical features of the Transformer that outperform the iPad; if so, please address them!)
EDIT: I suppose before recommending a device you guys should know how I plan to use the device:
Mostly as a productivity/entertainment device:
Taking notes in college classes
Standard internet use
Gaming
Movie and music use
Maayyyyybe as a GPS if it is capable of acting as one
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Okay, first, the choppy video recording and poor camera quality has apparently been addressed in a recent firmware update that came out shortly after most reviewers received their units. Some reviews noted this.
Second, on a related note, comparing the iPad 2's camera to the Transformer's is kind of funny (once the firmware issues are resolved), since the TF has a 5MP camera vs. the <1MP camera on the iPad 2.
Third, sure, the iPad 2 is more "responsive," because iOS itself is a glorified app launcher. Honeycomb does more, and Android runs background apps, and so sure it might be a little less smooth. Particular in its current 3.01 (really 1.01 for Honeycomb) iteration. It will improve, but iOS will remain for the foreseeable future nothing but a glorified app launcher. For myself, I find Honeycomb itself vastly more useful--turn on the screen and BAM!, useful information.
Fourth, apps will come, and while there aren't so many Honeycomb-optimized apps (although more every day), many non-optimized apps run just fine. So far I've only run into a handful of apps that just don't work on a tablet, and by that I mean don't benefit from its advantages.
Fifth, the iPad 2 wifi-only version doesn't have GPS. So, if you want to use a tablet for GPS, then you'll need to get the 3G iPad 2.
Sixth, and finally, you'll need a keyboard for taking notes. Period. So either get an iPad 2, case, and a Bluetooth keyboard (and make sure you have the right workplace to support all three) or get the TF + keyboard dock and use it pretty much anywhere.
jurrsaix said:
Honestly I think both of the tablets do what you want fairly well. Here's what you have to consider and decide if these things matter to you.
Do you care about flash content on the web and viewing it on your tablet?
Are you concerned with price?
Do you like to tinker and mess around with Android/OSs?
The iPad is a great all-around tablet. If you don't mind spending some extra money, or the lack of flash, it might be a better option for you. There are some good keyboard options for it. I dislike trying to get documents off of iOS products. I like being able to connect an Android device like a flash drive and drag and drop stuff off (which is super helpful for using computer labs that may not have itunes at school).
Why am I buying this tablet?
I'm invested in Android (own apps/heavy google app user)
$400 feels like a good entry point to try out tablets
I like the community and dealing with fixing my issues on my own and changing ROMs and kernels, tweaking the looks and performance.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Aside from everything else I have to +1 this post...first off the iPad camera is horrible, but that aside, there's a reason you're on xda developers, you want to do more with your device than what you're told you can do with it by the manufacturer...
I've been around the PC industry since the 80's (using linux since early 90's) and phone industry since the late 90's.. and I love the fact that I can tinker and hack something and play with it, something extremely difficult on apple products.
Google devices are fun to play with, and you aren't controlled like cattle to the slaughter ... unless you want to be a mindless apple drone, I would stick with an android tablet...
Just my $0.02
If the only plus to you is that it has a dock, then you're probably better off getting an iPad 2. The iPad 2 is a great tablet, and most people who own it love it. I know that's not the right thing to say here, but it's the truth. Personally, I would feel completely stifled with an iPad, but you might be perfectly content.
jurrsaix said:
I'm invested in Android (own apps/heavy google app user)
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
This. It wouldn't make much sense for me to have to re-purchase all of my apps, while giving up the Google integration I've come to rely on, just to have access to the App Store (which is, to me, the only real plus the iPad has over the Transformer, assuming the camera glitches are fixed and Honeycomb is refined).
knoxploration said:
Demonstrably untrue. Apple's iPad is limited to running non-iPad native apps as a tiny window in the center of the screen; Android has no such limitation. Hence iPad apps had to be recoded; most Android apps work just fine on tablets as-is.
This is just spin -- a fictional advantage created by Apple to hide their own disadvantage.
Probably is true right now -- nobody except Google and their hardware partners know if they can catch up here.
Easily fixed if it's just color accuracy / white balance. The Transformer's camera currently has bigger issues in terms of stuttering and huge shutter lag. Hopefully those will be resolved. Ask yourself this though -- are you really going to use a large tablet for photos and videos, rather than a compact camera or cellphone?
Video capture from the rear cam is. Video playback isn't. I've seen numerous examples online playing even Full HD (1080i) videos downsampled by the Transformer to fit its own screen, and the reviewers have said they played smoothly. I'm confident that at 720p, the Transformer is more than capable of smooth video.
Which even without all of the above is a huge plus. Nobody can type on an on-screen keyboard as fast as a good touch-typer on a reasonable keyboard, and the reviews of this keyboard are pretty much all positive. Plus you get a touchpad, so you don't have to keep reaching over the keyboard to make selections like you do with bluetooth keyboards.
Beyond the above, companies that emphasise openness and listen to the end users, not a company that locks everything down, does its best to prevent any competition with its own software, and in the latest scandal, continues to record your entire GPS location history even when specifically told not to do so.
It is. You'll just either need a device to tether to, or an offline mapping solution. Personally I'm waiting eagerly for Route 66 (http://www.66.com) to release; they're based on TomTom data, and I've been using a TomTom for years, so I know their data is great.
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Click to collapse
Thank you very much for that thorough analysis! I really appreciate it
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The versatility of the Transformer is the only reason I'm considering it. As Anand said about the iPad, it couldn't replace the laptop, so he eventually stopped using it.
The Transformer can be a tablet or light-duty laptop. What other device (not just tablet) can do that???
As for apps, it's mostly Apple BS. Ever hear Mac users complain about the lack of apps or games vs. PCs? A lot of iPad "apps" are really just websites due to lack of proper web support.
And as others have said, at least Android apps tend to scale, and not just pixel-double like iPhone apps.
The freedom of choice... being locked-in to iTunes forever? No thanks. Heck, the only choice Apple gives is the "all-new" white iPhone. That's right, WHITE... be a rebel! LOL!
in my opinion all the plus of the ipad are negated by the fact that you have to use itunes to do anything on your device.
Example if you were going away for a few days and you owned an ipad you would have to take your laptop which defeats the purpose of owning a tablet, with an android device you can just take that and download all the files/movies/music etc right to the device.
Congrats for a least attempting to get the facts before you buy. Personally, there is no debate, the iPad is far inferior, and most "techie" types here on XDA are not just wanting to spend $$$ for a freaking apple on a limited use device...
I can't believe no one commented on the camera bit, the iPad 2's camera is only 0.92MP, how is it in any way better? Sure it can record video smoothly but that will also be possible on the transformer after a software up date.
Nastrodamous said:
in my opinion all the plus of the ipad are negated by the fact that you have to use itunes to do anything on your device.
Example if you were going away for a few days and you owned an ipad you would have to take your laptop which defeats the purpose of owning a tablet, with an android device you can just take that and download all the files/movies/music etc right to the device.
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Click to collapse
This is not correct. You can access iTunes on the iPad without a computer.After the initial sync when you buy the iPad, you do not need to be connected to a laptop unless you are updating software or transferring files, or backing up files
dufran3 said:
Congrats for a least attempting to get the facts before you buy. Personally, there is no debate, the iPad is far inferior, and most "techie" types here on XDA are not just wanting to spend $$$ for a freaking apple on a limited use
Not sure what you mean by inferior but that is your opinion.
Like people have said,it depends on what features are important to the OP. Simple easy interface with lots of tablet specific apps vs more "open" system much less apps(currently),ability to customize and tinker.
Ultimately, you should go into a store and try both to see what you can live with as there are compromises with going with either.
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Ipad 2 or Motorola Xoom

As stated above I'm getting either one of them but not sure which to get though .
Need some light from u guys and sry if the post was posted before , using my phone D:
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I purchased an ipad2 and traded it for a Xoom as soon as I could. It was a great deal.
The Motorola Xoom is just a nicer piece of equipment. Its heavily customizable. And it has support now to add a SD card which can effectively double your hard drive space.
Oh yeah, and you don't have to use itunes.
kristenm said:
I purchased an ipad2 and traded it for a Xoom as soon as I could. It was a great deal.
The Motorola Xoom is just a nicer piece of equipment. Its heavily customizable. And it has support now to add a SD card which can effectively double your hard drive space.
Oh yeah, and you don't have to use itunes.
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Click to collapse
What kristenm said. Ipad2 is for those that just want what's in the box. Xoom is for those that want to make the device really, truly their own.
Hmm hmmm . Its a win win for xoom when comes to customability . How bout its office apps ? Cuz i am going to do docs editing and ppt editing .
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LanceAmr said:
Hmm hmmm . Its a win win for xoom when comes to customability . How bout its office apps ? Cuz i am going to do docs editing and ppt editing .
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I like the Office Suite Pro app. It's for a tablet and with some limited testing, seems most capable and most like MS Office of the 5 available decent office apps. It's available for a free 30 day trial, so check it out. There are also good peripheral apps for printing, scanning, working with pdfs, etc. I would recommend the Hacker's keyboard (just like a pc keyboard), or use the Moto BT keyboard and mouse of your choice (I use MS BT mouse) for much better editing experience.
Hacker's keyboard also incorporates a keypad if you need to enter a lot of numbers.
I own an iPad 2 currently, and I am really considering selling it for a Xoom. Even jailbroken, it just doesn't offer the functionality I want/need. Since the 3.2 update, I think Honeycomb is much better suited for me.
Other than that, I think the iPad is a great device. As long as you don't want to do anything too advanced, it is one of the best tablets on the market. However, since Apple essentially killed the use of USB devices, my personal usage has been hindered drastically.
USBOTG, SD card support, and a useable file system are the biggest reasons, I feel, to go with the Xoom. If you don't need those things, check out the iPad.
On a side note: I have used many Xooms in stores, and I just don't see the big stink about the screen. Yeah, it's not quite as sharp or bright as the iPad or GT 10.1, but honestly, I don't see a big enough difference to warrant how much noise is being made about it.
okantomi said:
I like the Office Suite Pro app. It's for a tablet and with some limited testing, seems most capable and most like MS Office of the 5 available decent office apps. It's available for a free 30 day trial, so check it out. There are also good peripheral apps for printing, scanning, working with pdfs, etc. I would recommend the Hacker's keyboard (just like a pc keyboard), or use the Moto BT keyboard and mouse of your choice (I use MS BT mouse) for much better editing experience.
Hacker's keyboard also incorporates a keypad if you need to enter a lot of numbers.
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Thx will have a look at the app . Hope its good.
---------- Post added at 01:07 PM ---------- Previous post was at 01:02 PM ----------
Plagiarising said:
I own an iPad 2 currently, and I am really considering selling it for a Xoom. Even jailbroken, it just doesn't offer the functionality I want/need. Since the 3.2 update, I think Honeycomb is much better suited for me.
Other than that, I think the iPad is a great device. As long as you don't want to do anything too advanced, it is one of the best tablets on the market. However, since Apple essentially killed the use of USB devices, my personal usage has been hindered drastically.
USBOTG, SD card support, and a useable file system are the biggest reasons, I feel, to go with the Xoom. If you don't need those things, check out the iPad.
On a side note: I have used many Xooms in stores, and I just don't see the big stink about the screen. Yeah, it's not quite as sharp or bright as the iPad or GT 10.1, but honestly, I don't see a big enough difference to warrant how much noise is being made about it.
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Hmm hmmm , seems that ipad still limits i see . My main concern is office work and internet browsing =l . But thx for the heads up
Xoom definitely or any other Android 3.2 tablet for that matter. I just purchased a 1TB External Seagate drive and loaded it with about 400GB's of movies, shows, anime, etc and I'm loving it. Just the ability to do more things than the iPad 2 are worth it.
I owned the iPad 2 for a week. It was lame and I hated that I couldn't plug in a PS2/PS3, WiiMote, Xbox controller to it to play my emulators. You just get more options with third party peripherals.
I love my Xoom and I also own the 1st Gen iPad. My 2 year old plays with the iPad and knows how to navigate it and play her games. That right there tells you a lot. I don't even look at the thing when I get home.
okantomi said:
What kristenm said. Ipad2 is for those that just want what's in the box. Xoom is for those that want to make the device really, truly their own.
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Click to collapse
100% agree...
Simply wanna play great apps? - ipad2
Wanna 'play' the device? xoom
greedy? take both
unless you buy an iFAD you're NOT COOL and have no STATUS!..at least that is what mindless "individuals"who only want to be unique in a group (oxymorons...) Would want you to think....open source rules all. Let the mindless drones who only want a giant iPod touch have them...I will keep my xoom with expandable storage, otg support, custom recovery, rooting, overclocked dual processing, awesome stargate theme, developer supported community, wifi tethering wonderfulness, etc etc etc etc
I was thinking between gt 10.1 and ipad 2 and it was (FOR ME) still a hard choice. The price was the same, gt had better hardware, but the tablet was supposed to be a toy, so I chose ipad.
for or so, you can buy cck, which allows you to use sd cards and usb.
with iFile, available in cydia u can totally manage your file system on the ipad.
with some plugins in safari you can download any file, even torrents
You can install an ssh client on the ipad
I'm not an apple fan, I use android phone and it's great, but for entertainment my weapon of choice was apple. Because of the apps (more games) and 4:3 screen which is better for web viewing.
Another thing was the battery which is said to last about 2 hrs longer than the GT's (dunno how about xoom, though)
It has access to dropbox, good vnc clients, office apps (quickoffice or pages, the second one seems very intuitive, haven't used it for real yet).
Both cams are sh*tty, and it's a very delicate word to describe them
The ipad isn't as customizable as any android, which everyone knows, but, for myself, it's a very nice toy. I'm still trying to turn it into work device
Summarizing, it all depends on what you want to do with the tablet, ipad is better for games, has better tailored apps(because of the sick apple policy), seems better for web browsing because of screen proportions.
Android is better for films, and ofc customization, connecting external devices, (but there are also some apps for the apple allowing to do some of that stuff), dlna. And, of course, android has flash, which I don't use but sometimes can come handy. there is though iSwifter, a browser that supports flash enough to watch online movies.
Plagiarising said:
I own an iPad 2 currently, and I am really considering selling it for a Xoom. Even jailbroken, it just doesn't offer the functionality I want/need. Since the 3.2 update, I think Honeycomb is much better suited for me.
Other than that, I think the iPad is a great device. As long as you don't want to do anything too advanced, it is one of the best tablets on the market. However, since Apple essentially killed the use of USB devices, my personal usage has been hindered drastically.
USBOTG, SD card support, and a useable file system are the biggest reasons, I feel, to go with the Xoom. If you don't need those things, check out the iPad.
On a side note: I have used many Xooms in stores, and I just don't see the big stink about the screen. Yeah, it's not quite as sharp or bright as the iPad or GT 10.1, but honestly, I don't see a big enough difference to warrant how much noise is being made about it.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The iPad is a TOY for people who sold their souls to steve jobs. Xoom is a great corporate, multimedia, Productivity, gaming, Personal device all packed into one extremely well built device
No question: XOOM.....
i would have to say both have their merits. I have both the iPad 2 and the Xoom. the Xoom is a very nicely build device. However, most people look for apps to play on the device. when i got my Xoom and looked for well written native HC apps, i was sorely disappointed. yes, HC is great for customization, but the lack of natively written apps are what hurt HC in the long run. Most people don't care about how much you can customize a device, they just want it to work, have a great experience and lots of native apps. And i can hear you say, well you can run regular android apps on it. Yes, you can. however, they all have a stretched look. I can also hear you say "iPad does that with iPhone apps too. Yes, it is true, however, they double in pixel, not stretch. i love my Xoom and i love my iPad, but for a device that has a better fit, finish and works right without having to resort to what i said above, I'm sorry to say, my iPad 2 has first dibs in my shoulder bag.
kenfly said:
The iPad is a TOY for people who sold their souls to steve jobs. Xoom is a great corporate, multimedia, Productivity, gaming, Personal device all packed into one extremely well built device
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Just because someone uses an Apple product doesn't mean they "sold their soul to Steve Jobs." That logic doesn't work, and could be turned around to use as a weapon against ANY company.
The way I see it, if you want something that solely relies on apps to accomplish a task, the iPad is a fantastic product. The quality of apps for it are great, something that Android has not accomplished yet, but I feel will come eventually. My biggest gripe is the fact that I don't really use apps on my iPad. The things I want to do with it are mostly done with a web browser and in the file system. I know this makes me the minority, but I just don't need thousands of apps on a tablet.
I was initially going to buy a Xoom, but with the $800 launch price tag, I couldn't justify it. Now that the WiFi model is readily available, I think now is as good of a time as any to pick up a Xoom.
I stopped playing games on my iPad because stupid in app purchases in order to get further in the game. It seems like mostgames are heading in that direction.
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Lol Ipad 2 is no match for xoom!
These type of threads are usually started by Apple Fanboys that are personally insulted everybody does not like to live by every Apple whim.
The best tablet is one where you get all of your content slaved to a PC ( um Mac ), where you get to use only one method that counts for buying stuff ( iTunes ). where you get the best interface in the world a grid of icons and folders containing icons. Things like having a variety of hardware manufactures and customizing are not important they confuse people. The best tablet has "Facetime"...... and is advertised by 100s of commercials that say this is so.
I am not much of an Apple fan I sold my iPad2 to get my Xoom and never been happier.

Top hardware but lots of stuttering: do we deserve better?

OK, I bought an Android Tablet. Although the iPads probably are better for the average user, that's not the case for me: I'm a developer, a tweaker. I want to root stuff, to play with widgets, customisations, and so on. That's why I feel more related to Google than to Apple.
So I went for an Android tablet. I did not want a cheap, slow, outdated one like the ones you can buy at the supermarket for no money.
I was going for quality, so I bought an Asus Infinity. The tablet with the fastest hardware you can get. Splendid HD screen. Nice hardware keyboard included. This should be a top buy!
I have the tablet for some days now, and yes, the hardware is quite good. Decent aluminium unibody, although the color is not my style and the shiny metal catches all finger prints. The 1920 x 1200 display is really outstanding. No complaints here.
But where it goes wrong is the software ...
Android ICS, with minor tweaks by Asus, looks ok. But the OS and apps don't run smooth at all...
Apps run slugish or even freeze for seconds. Even keyboard input hangs sometimes. The stock browser and the Google Chrome browser can render basic sites quite well, but more advanced stuff like animations and video is just bad.
I compared with an iPad 1 and the iPad almost always wins involving smoothness of scrolling and interacting with inline video. An iPad 1, more than 2 years old, is faster than the Android tablet with the fastest hardware available on tablets. That's just ... sad. Very disapointing.
Another problem is the fact that no sites are well tested on Android, resulting in quirks that probably are solved on iOS because every decent site developer does test on his iPhone and iPad. But not on the huge number of Android devices out there. And being a developer myself, I know by experience that each device can have its own quirks.
A good example is wrong platform detection, resulting in bad user experience at the best, lack of features, or even no content at all at worst. 'You need to install Flash to run this site' ... Ok, Android can run Flash, but its days are over, as we all know.
So, what's up next?
Shall I make use of the 'cooling down period' and return this tablet? Exchange it for an iPad3? Will Jelly Bean solve some issues? Will these problems be solved by a system update? Will future sites be rendered better when html standards are used more often and Android browsers improve?
That’s a lot of if’s, no?
Apps running slow:
-stock browser
-Chrome
-Dolphin browser: better than the above, but css3 transformations/animations still very bad compared to iOS
-Google plus: scrolling the items is really bad
-Pulse: swiping between pages of an open article is slow and stutters
-Google Earth: slow and even crashes
Apps running ok:
-gmail: smooth
-currents: rather ok, sometimes
-Plume: ok
-Google maps: smooth
I guess, the situation will improve over time. But when will that be? If ever?
Did I expect too much? Am I exaggerating?
Your thoughts please!
My thoughts are that you cannot compare ipad and Android. Everyone keeps saying how smooth is ipad but everyone seems blind to all of the things iPad cannot do and Android (especially the Infinity) does.
I will not make an extensive list but just mentioning browsing the Web, half the websites are gone with iPad: no flash support and even the supposely replacement html5 renders quite poor on iPad. Check the html5rocks slides for instance.
If you are not sensible to that, get an iPad and you will be stuck but happy. Otherwise, open up and discover what Android had to offer.
the change log for jelly bean are out.check them out, that brings quite some news and fixes.
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chevdor said:
My thoughts are that you cannot compare ipad and Android. Everyone keeps saying how smooth is ipad but everyone seems blind to all of the things iPad cannot do and Android (especially the Infinity) does.
I will not make an extensive list but just mentioning browsing the Web, half the websites are gone with iPad: no flash support and even the supposely replacement html5 renders quite poor on iPad. Check the html5rocks slides for instance.
If you are not sensible to that, get an iPad and you will be stuck but happy. Otherwise, open up and discover what Android had to offer.
the change log for jelly bean are out.check them out, that brings quite some news and fixes.
Sent from my GT-I9100 using Tapatalk 2
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Don't get me wrong, I am very aware of the benefits of Android. That's why I bought an Infinity ;-)
But I have a strong feeling that surfing the web is just a better experience on an iPad ... and surfing is a primary task for me and most of us.
Dolphin HD works the best, but still regular freezes of seconds. I guess this should be better with the outstanding hardware of the infinity, no?
Tnx for your response.
Gert Stalpaert said:
I guess, the situation will improve over time. But when will that be? If ever?
Did I expect too much? Am I exaggerating?
Your thoughts please!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I know this is not the ideal answer regarding a device you just paid top dollar for but: it may have some software issues but it also has highly capable hardware. Thankfully, there will be many great developers paying attention to this device. Either via official updates or through the combined efforts of the community (or both), I expect most of the issues will be worked out. At the very least, the updates Jelly Bean brings address the lagging and stuttering on Android, and this device will most likely get it soon enough. You can rest assured knowing this is one of the best Android 10-inchers out there and with the proper support it can only get better.
I have only had android tablets up to this point.
I have had the Asus Tf101 and 201. I always found something laggy, or apps crash, etc. Even putting custom ROMS on them caused them to have unique issues based off of whatever ROM I put on it. SO I was constantly re flashing to the new ROM, hoping it fixes the issues and doesn't cause additional issues.
I spent more time flashing, than just using them. What fun is that?
So after I heard all the weird Asus Infinity issues, I canceled my Asus order. I ordered an Ipad 3. Should have it thursday of next week.
But I am using the Ipad 1 that is a work tablet, and it just works. No crashes, no weird little issues.
I am sold. I can't believe I hated the Ipads so much.
One negative to the Ipads though, that I will miss. And that are the widgets and live wallpapers. Other than that, Ill kepp my android phone, but the tab will be an Ipad.
acdcking12345 said:
I have only had android tablets up to this point.
I have had the Asus Tf101 and 201. I always found something laggy, or apps crash, etc. Even putting custom ROMS on them caused them to have unique issues based off of whatever ROM I put on it. SO I was constantly re flashing to the new ROM, hoping it fixes the issues and doesn't cause additional issues.
I spent more time flashing, than just using them. What fun is that?
So after I heard all the weird Asus Infinity issues, I canceled my Asus order. I ordered an Ipad 3. Should have it thursday of next week.
But I am using the Ipad 1 that is a work tablet, and it just works. No crashes, no weird little issues.
I am sold. I can't believe I hated the Ipads so much.
One negative to the Ipads though, that I will miss. And that are the widgets and live wallpapers. Other than that, Ill kepp my android phone, but the tab will be an Ipad.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I had been considering getting a new iPad rather than waiting for Android to get the tablet basics right; however, the main reason why I haven't is my dislike for Apple's motto of litigation over innovation. So I will give Android tabs another chance and get the Infinity. There will definitely be another *new* iPad and this will certainly not be my last tablet. Hopefully Jelly Bean will improve the whole experience. If it gets it and I love it, then great. Otherwise, I am sure I will be able to sell it for a decent price.
I see what you mean. I figure when you can get a tab with Jelly Bean, I hope that android tabs will work better. I hope so. Android is open source and great things go on with newly developed ROMS.
I just can't handle all of the crap wrong and all of the constant issues having to be fixed. For awhile, Ill use the Ipad 3 and wait until android really kick ass. Unless the new MS Tablet is even better.
Android will never compete with UI experience in comparision to Apple unless they change the underlying system.
Apple gives all power to the UI first which results in a smooth experience. But that will also cost power for background tasks. So while you can smoothly scroll your pages in a PDF suddenly it takes ages to load a page, I have seen it.
Android is balanced. So you might see stuttering while scrolling through PDF's but pages will load a lot faster.
That as an example.
It is up to you what system you prefer.
There is a detailed blog post by some google dev somewhere, couldn't find it, sorry.
Jelly bean will definetly smooth out anything having to do with touch response such as scrolling and pinch zooming. That is if it does what its supposed too.
Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I727 using xda premium
My suggestion is to go try out a Nexus 7 and see how smooth it is. The Infinity will be very similar to that once it's updated to Jelly Bean.
KilerG said:
My suggestion is to go try out a Nexus 7 and see how smooth it is. The Infinity will be very similar to that once it's updated to Jelly Bean.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
This is only our wishful thinking, not a fact yet.
I don't see iPad outperforming Infinity in real life performance however, apart from lags when copying large amounts of data (I can't seem to notice iPad 2 being better for browsing, tried it with iPad 2 today - and remember that on the Infinity it is 1920x1200; iPad 3 with a somewhat better resolution has been reported to become burning hot btw).
What bothers me is not the issues with Android, but the shortcuts and crappy manufacturing that seems to plague the category. Asus, for example, comes out with innovative stuff but seems to chronically release devices before they're ready. Samsung came out with a solid, if uninspiring, 10 inch tablet last year, but the new one has been getting reviews that say it's inferior to the previous model. The Nexus 7 is finally rolling out, but with reports of sloppy build -- Asus strikes again? The Acer has decent specs on paper but doesn't make the target in terms of real-life operation.
I hate Apple with a fire deep in my belly. But, most of the time (iPhone 4 antenna excepted), when they release a mobile product, it's ready to roll -- functionally and aesthetically. Much higher initially quality than the Android products I've had or shopped.
Seriously, how fooking hard can it be to put together a decent feature set and build it properly?
I see your point. There have been numerous bugs in every single iPhone version however. My friend who was apple-lover has returned 80% of their devices in the recent years - from iPad 2, through MacBook Air to LCD.
Sent from my ASUS Transformer Pad TF700T using xda app-developers app
It lags due to the weak Tegra 3 GPU not able to run at full 60fps for the 1920x1200p.
Heck it even lags on 1280x800 sometimes. Even with Jelly Bean, it will still have hiccups due to the GPU limitation.
MrPhilo said:
It lags due to the weak Tegra 3 GPU not able to run at full 60fps for the 1920x1200p.
Heck it even lags on 1280x800 sometimes. Even with Jelly Bean, it will still have hiccups due to the GPU limitation.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You say this, yet the Tegra 3 used in the Nexus 7 isn't as good as the one in the Infinity. The GPU is plenty capable, as it's buttery smooth in Jelly Bean. There is no GPU limitation, it's software at the moment.
So here is my quick background.
I have been a huge fan of tablet. I started out with Windows based tablet back when it was Windows XP that was like 7-8 years ago. Then I moved onto very first android tablet Xoom. Switched to Samsung Galaxy 10.1. Due to specific application only available on Ipad, I had to go with Ipad so I bought iPad 2 and sold Galaxy 10.1, which I still have. I then got Galaxy 10.1 4G Verizon back, which I sold in anticipation of Transformer infinity..
So with that, here is my take on iOS vs. Android.
"Really depends on what you do."
Stability/Fluidity: iOS
It is indeed the fact iPad runs smoother. Though there are some test showed higher stability rate of Android over the iOS, my personal experience goes along with crowd i.e. iOS is more stable. BUT I have not tried ICS (nor New iPad).
Also there is another catch here. iPad is not fail safe. It does still crush and if it crush, it crushes constantly i.e. simply cannot open the file or perform the action.
Multitasking: Android
As someone else suggested earlier in this forum, this is probably due to difference in the underlying focus/design motto between iOS and Android. iOS DOES NOT do real multitasking. I know some say it does, but it's not true for at least the current iOS version and with my iPad 2.
It basically freezes/hibernate the background application. I tried to download files in background several times, or have some application load files into, which usually takes several minutes as it tries to decompress or do whatever it needs to. So after launching these tasks, I go surf web with different browser or application. I go back there is nearly zero progression. There may be minimal multitasking as I have seen progression of downloading file for like 1MB after 10 minutes but this happened more like within the initial few minutes or seconds and since then it had to be frozen in background because I did check this after 2 minutes and still the progression were the same.
Alternatively, needless to say but Android allows you to download files in background but sounds like transformer line suffers from hanging when this happens. I never used torrent on tablet but I remember downloading some files like 100MB+ on web in background while I was using some other application, which usually worked no problem but my foreground application was not demanding.
Applications: Mixed
This is where it really comes down to what you want. Many says Apple store is better, which I agree with games. So if games are your priority, I go with iPAD. It may change in the future, but by the time it changes basically you can buy newer better tablet anyways. So for now for games, go with iPad. But personally, if truly want to play games, I'd rather by portable gaming system like 3DS or PS Vita... But that's just me. Apple store certainly have more selections, and better optimized for iPad. However, many of iPad applications are not free and no real trial. So you have to sort of buy and see.
Whereas, android has tons of applications that are free with ad. This may be one reason why app developers are not making much money on Android market hence avoiding or deprioritizing... who knows. But some applications are simply better on Android. For instance, I use Anki which is perhaps the best cross platform flashcard application. If you want to have the real version of Anki on iPad it costs $20+. You can sort of do a work around with cheaper $5 application but you won't get autosynch of decks, no statistics transfer etc. Whereas on Android.... It's FREE and does autosynch. Other application is ebook reader like epub and pdf. When comparing iPad applications to the Android at least iPad 2 vs. Galaxy 10.1, large files like 300+MB epubs opened much quicker on Galaxy 10.1. Not sure if this is due to pure CPU advantage vs. application difference.
Notifications: Android
Sort of fits into the multitasking but iOS notification is less invasive (using good term), less evident (more of cons for me). When I get new email, Android nicely shows pop up on the corner. In IOS, I generally have no clue until I close my application and check my email. Though notification works with iMessage so may be its just Apple deciding who gets what access to the notification.
File Transfer/Management: Android
Huge downside of Apple. In last 6 months or so, they have added wifi file transfer/synching but this happens only when you have your iPad plugged into outlet.
Individual applications may decide to offer wifi file transfer, but generally slow and its individual application based.
Files are local to each application so very easy to have duplicated files consuming your hard drive space. For instance, if you have a book in iBook, opening it in other EPUB reader you simply have to make a duplicate copy within the other application.
Android is basically simply drag and drop and generally most files can be open from any application anywhere though some does make its own local copy. As far as transfer, AirDroid is such an awesome application.
Jellybean:
The theme of this is amazing. The functionality is not ground breaking but Google finally decides to put emphasis on the UI fluidity. So if it achieves what its intended, I think overall Android simply becomes better ecosystem as it already offers more functionality and flexibility but the major drawback/downside was the UI fluidity. Though as far as application stability, I am not sure if Jellybean is answering that part as I never read anywhere specifically stating such. In any event, ASUS generally so fast in pushing the latest version of Android, I would personally wait until Jelly bean comes out and see if it truly solves the issues. Its definitely a possibility but no gurantee so buying something based on the speculation may not be an optimum unless you got tons of money to spare.
Nexus 7:
Just like Jellybean. This is simple speculation, and probably we should not buy a system based on "what will likely to happen" because there is no guarantee. But I am speculating/hoping when Nexus 7 sells well, which probably does. Developers will have much better support on tablets. Even though Nexus 7 is 7 inch tablet, its resolution is compatible to non-high def android tablet i.e. in theory all the nexus 7 optimized applications will look native on the non-high def android tablet though button layouts may be slightly suboptimal. This is definitely much better than scaling phone app onto the tablet resolution.
I also 'hope' that ASUS gets their act together and resolves the IO issue and lag, or that JB really does the trick. But care should be taken I'm afraid: I'm sure there were many Transformer Primer users who went ahead and purchased 'hoping' the GPS issue was software resolvable; they weren't, it was terminal, and GPS was removed form the official specs. ASUS has a track record.
Lets face it, the camera click issue on 'press to focus' is a hardware design fault (they have not insulated the microphone/s from the focus mechanism). Hard to see how that will ever be solved. It is not an issue that will bother many but what is significant is that it is a sloppy, muppet mistake like the GPS issues on the Transformer Primer that could have been easily avoided - a mistake that camera manufacturers like Casio were making 10 years ago on early digital cameras (I know, I had one). That's just not good enough ASUS.
robhorsefield said:
I also 'hope' that ASUS gets their act together and resolves the IO issue and lag, or that JB really does the trick. But care should be taken I'm afraid: I'm sure there were many Transformer Primer users who went ahead and purchased 'hoping' the GPS issue was software resolvable; they weren't, it was terminal, and GPS was removed form the official specs. ASUS has a track record.
Lets face it, the camera click issue on 'press to focus' is a hardware design fault (they have not insulated the microphone/s from the focus mechanism). Hard to see how that will ever be solved. It is not an issue that will bother many but what is significant is that it is a sloppy, muppet mistake like the GPS issues on the Transformer Primer that could have been easily avoided - a mistake that camera manufacturers like Casio were making 10 years ago on early digital cameras (I know, I had one). That's just not good enough ASUS.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Good job copying and pasting from your other thread.
The I/O issue isn't hardware related from what I can tell. It really just seems like something that just needs to be resolved in the kernel.
robhorsefield said:
I also 'hope' that ASUS gets their act together and resolves the IO issue and lag, or that JB really does the trick. But care should be taken I'm afraid: I'm sure there were many Transformer Primer users who went ahead and purchased 'hoping' the GPS issue was software resolvable; they weren't, it was terminal, and GPS was removed form the official specs. ASUS has a track record.
Lets face it, the camera click issue on 'press to focus' is a hardware design fault (they have not insulated the microphone/s from the focus mechanism). Hard to see how that will ever be solved. It is not an issue that will bother many but what is significant is that it is a sloppy, muppet mistake like the GPS issues on the Transformer Primer that could have been easily avoided - a mistake that camera manufacturers like Casio were making 10 years ago on early digital cameras (I know, I had one). That's just not good enough ASUS.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
ASUS has problems with attention to detail. Failing to notice these issues is completely indicative of poor engineering and lacking quality control. Users have been identifying problems right away. I can deal with minor software discrepancies; those can eventually be solved. However, basic hardware problems like these are alarming. On their own they might seem minor, but compounded (camera, I/O, screen ripples, SD card support, ...) I wonder if ASUS just took a bunch of hardware components, fit them together like a puzzle, and then sat on it for months without testing waiting for release. This device is coming half a year after it was announced. These issues could have been corrected.
KilerG said:
Good job copying and pasting from your other thread.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
It wasn't exactly the same. ...same poor design and manufacture problems, so same opinions and comments apply, sorry, fact.
cipherbreak said:
ASUS has problems with attention to detail. Failing to notice these issues is completely indicative of poor engineering and lacking quality control. Users have been identifying problems right away. I can deal with minor software discrepancies; those can eventually be solved. However, basic hardware problems like these are alarming. On their own they might seem minor, but compounded (camera, I/O, screen ripples, SD card support, ...)
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Bang on the point, thanks. And compounded also with the Prime GPS debacle.
I doubt Apple will let another Antenna-gate slip out, we'll see.

Where is the development?

Seems that custom ROMs are nonexistent, and things have come to crawl around here. I thought for sure we would have been further along by now. Anyone?
What sort of custom development would you like to see for this device? Anything in particular?
Not sure how it would work out, but I think it would be interesting to see a port of Ubuntu Touch for SHIELD myself.
CM, Miracast games to TV, more hmdi options such as screen off while stream movies without 3rd party apps. I really don't care for PC to shield, a waste of time in my book. Hope Nvidia presses devs to add Shield controls to their games. Need a better option for games+data to SD card. Their apk fix is an [email protected]@ joke.
Ubuntu is a joke theses days, they force feed their eco system. Their vision in mid 2000s was great now just lost. That's what happens when outside sources fund your business. Slackware is what really makes me enjoy Linux. Stays true to its roots despite what others say. Mark my words CM will be lost now that its a business with funding only a matter of time. Thxs
shawnchalfant said:
CM, Miracast games to TV, more hmdi options such as screen off while stream movies without 3rd party apps. I really don't care for PC to shield, a waste of time in my book. Hope Nvidia presses devs to add Shield controls to their games. Need a better option for games+data to SD card. Their apk fix is an [email protected]@ joke.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
so many problems with this device that affect a lot of the trivial functions for the main reasons i bought it for (GAMING?!?!).
im not trying to come off as a "hater" on these Shield forums here as im actually somewhat of a nvidia fanboy but, ive been wanting this device since before it was even a idea on Nvidias dry erase board. now after owning it since launch i barely use it because of all these issues...
- horrible D-pad (which may never have a fix since its hardware)
- SD card limitations
- 0.5 second audio lag in 100% of emulators i use
- noticeable input lag in 100% of all the games ive played (not streaming)
- sleep/wake performance issues
- stripped screw holes (also a hardware thing).
all in all im just really disappointed and i think its sad that my Xperia play is still my main Android gaming device and my Shield is just collecting dust
really close to listing this thing on eBay and it breaks my heart. :crying: but i just cant see myself using this thing until all the issues are fixed. looks like ill get burned on this Tegra just like i did on the ZuneHD...
I am getting really close to selling mine for the same basic reasons.

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