http://www.engadget.com/2011/03/24/htc-locks-down-incredible-s-against-custom-roms-too-starts-a-fi/
http://tweakers.net/nieuws/73423/htc-beveiligt-bootloader-nieuwe-android-toestellen.html
Why???
You have just been added next to Sony on my "Don't buy"-list.
Which phone will be the next HD2? LG?
***Update***:
Sony-Ericsson makes a tool to load custom roms onto their devices (http://tweakers.net/nieuws/73521/so...t-custom-roms-op-android-phones-mogelijk.html)
This is good news!
How much more secured is this than the traditional S-ON/S-OFF? I guess I don't really understand to what extent this new security changes over the old.
Also, it's already cracked on the Thunderbolt so likey can be repeated on the Incredible S. If it's crackable, isn't that all that matters?
This was an interesting argument, to me: NOT that the phones aren't still crackable, but rather that HTC is giving into intimidation by Verizon.. and by doing so, it's signaling that they will bow down to carriers, yet even moreso, over end users who BUY THEIR PHONES and are their actual customers.
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You may not agree, but the "rebel" in me likes that argument at least....
When you combine this with HTC America's not honoring warranties, they are not making the best moves given their fractional market share and the massive competition getting stronger and stronger from Motorola and Samsung every day ---- though I love HTC's phones and have never cheated on them once!
But keep in mind HTC *owned* the entire turf of touchscreen devices during the mighty reign of Windows Mobile... Now? Today? They are practically an asterisk. And Motorola? They were gonners. People thought there were out of the game having fallen so far behind after nothing new since the RAZR. Then the new CEO came in, targeted Android as his platform for choice, they targeted the DROID as their re-entry vehicle, and they slammed into the touchscreen market and overtook HTC like a steamroller.
When you are playing on THAT kind of playing field, you're going to go messing with your most loyal customer base -- and kiss ass with a carrier? I think HTC is blundering all over the place -- all the while they continue to make fantastic phones. But fact remains, they cannot afford to even SIGHTLY ANNOY a loyal customer these days. Once someone goes Samsung or Motorola, I don't see a big love affair where they're going to comer back to HTC. So, they better watch it, from where I sit. It's not just as simple a matter as "but we can crack anything". That's missing the point entirely.
Is HTC dual mode? Are they just doing it in the US or all over. That's why I've never liked Verizon. Started years ago over ringtones and BitPim.
What gives that person the impression that Verizon had anything to do with it? They're using the same security in the Incredible S, which from the specs on HTC's website, is a GSM phone so if this additional layer of security were a specific demand from VZW, there'd be no reason to add it to the Incredible S.
I doubt increasing security will hurt HTC sales at all. I'm thinking the majority of HTC phone users do NOT root their phones or hack them. Sure, XDA members do, but the average Joe? I don't think so. The percentage of people who buy HTC just because it's hackable is probably a pretty miniscule amount compared to the big picture.
I could be wrong, but I think the more likely answer for increasing security is to reduce warranty claims and support calls from would-be phone hackers accidentally bricking them.
GnatGoSplat said:
I could be wrong, but I think the more likely answer for increasing security is to reduce warranty claims and support calls from would-be phone hackers accidentally bricking them.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I'm with this. Go to any Android phone dev section and you see tons of people returning phones for replacement because they goof up flashing it.
I didn't realize this was posted already, I had just posted this in another section, I had said a week ago that it might be the end of an era with HTC locking down their phones, this sucks.
Sent from my Incredible with the XDA Premium App.
I wouldn't be at all surprised if this is just pressure from the carriers rather than HTC itself.
Regardless, i am disappoint!
I hope they dont do this, we need customization!
it does suck, theyll be another motorola now, except sense still owns blur lol
No no no no no. :'( this sucks. I love htc and the OPENNESS of android. Why I DIDN'T go with Motorola for an android device.
Sent from my ADR6300 using XDA App
we need to apeal to htc to please not do this!!
GnatGoSplat said:
What gives that person the impression that Verizon had anything to do with it? They're using the same security in the Incredible S...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Exactly.
Even if HTC were to start locking the bootloader at the behest of one particular network (and frankly, I find the notion that any one network would have enough clout to try and impose such measures questionable, to say the least), there'd be no reason for HTC to do this to all their handsets.
This is a decision HTC have made themselves.
GnatGoSplat said:
I doubt increasing security will hurt HTC sales at all. I'm thinking the majority of HTC phone users do NOT root their phones or hack them. Sure, XDA members do, but the average Joe? I don't think so. The percentage of people who buy HTC just because it's hackable is probably a pretty miniscule amount compared to the big picture.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Also true - XDA may be big but it doesn't compare to the number of phones being sold.
Heck, there are more than 3 times as many Galaxy S handsets have been sold as XDA-devs' entire membership and that's just one of a miscellany of handsets this place caters for.
man i hope somebody talks some sense into them
This is bonkers what are they doing this for?
GnatGoSplat said:
How much more secured is this than the traditional S-ON/S-OFF? I guess I don't really understand to what extent this new security changes over the old.
Also, it's already cracked on the Thunderbolt so likey can be repeated on the Incredible S. If it's crackable, isn't that all that matters?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Well I don't know for sure, but when you hook up you phone to your computer and flash it, your computer and phone will communicate with each other, and the computer will tell the phone what the new rom will be. Now, the people here at xda only have to figure out how to tell the phone what the new rom is.
But with this new security, not only do will we have to figure out how to tell it, we also have to answer the phones question to the computer, what the password is to flash it. This password is only known to HTC.
Step666 said:
Heck, there are more than 3 times as many Galaxy S handsets have been sold as XDA-devs' entire membership and that's just one of a miscellany of handsets this place caters for.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I was thinking the same thing. The new devices with be unlocked and made available to the people who'll use them.
If HTC locked the phones like Motorola does, then there will be no further HTC gadgets for me.
I didn't buy Motorola because of the same reason.
Every time they make a "secure lock" it takes all of a week to open and rewrite
IF they did make it uncrackable, according to the Supreme court decision it would violate ownership rights.
This is phase and as such, will pass
oka1 said:
IF they did make it uncrackable, according to the Supreme court decision it would violate ownership rights.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I think you need to re-read that.
The Supreme Court said it wasn't illegal to hack/tweak/modify software such as rooting/jail-breaking but that doesn't magically give you a right to do so.
If end-users have the right to modify their handsets, how do Motorola get away with their encrypted bootloader?
Related
Firstly, let me say that this is not a class action type petition.
This is a discussion and petition asking the Manufacturer HTC to honor it's advertised position, made by CEO Peter Chou on May 26th, promising to ship all future devices with unlocked bootloaders.
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AND
You can see the statement yourself at: http://www.facebook.com/HTC/posts/10150307320018084
I don't want to add to the legal troubles of my favorite manufacturer, I just want them to correct their mistake, unlock the bootloaders as promised & apologize for what I am sure was an inadvertent oversight that will be corrected in a few hours or a day or two.
You simply can't make advertisement directed toward increasing sales off new devices to developers & power users (the folks that review and fix bugs for you freely in many cases) and then break that bond, that trust built over the last decade.
Also, don't even try to say that you aren't using these social media outlets to market and advertise. I have been getting your posts and tweets, advertising your devices all week.
While your actions are certainly in violation of numerous trade regulations and laws, I don't care at this point. I don't want to make a name litigating over these issues, I just want the manufacturer that I support, to keep their word and market/advertise their devices in a fair and ethical manner. I am not participating in the boycott thread & I'm not asking people to stop buying HTC products. Just the opposite in fact. I want you to be successful. But I also want you to honor our relationship and keep your promises.
Please, take notice and make this right.
I ask all XDA members to support HTC in doing the right thing & pledge your support by joining this discussion and adding your name to this petition.
We, the members engaged in discussion in this forum thread ask HTC to comply with their advertised & promised claim of May 26th, that all future devices would have unlocked bootloaders.
We appreciate your timely rectification of this issue HTC.
Sincerely,
The above & below named participants.
EDIT: Please also sign the petition here: http://www.groubal.com/htc-vivid-has-locked-bootloader-contrary-to-statements-by-the-company/
Sent from my HTC PH39100 using xda premium
I agree with all the above. Tired of this crap, didn't expect it from HTC. HTC phones have always had the greatest development, but that won't carry on if they continue to lie and do this.
+1
10char
slapshot30 said:
I agree with all the above. Tired of this crap, didn't expect it from HTC. HTC phones have always had the greatest development, but that won't carry on if they continue to lie and do this.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Lying about S-LCD displays is another reason I avoid HTC phones. HTC used to be acceptably decent. Now they seem to lie their rears off.
Although I am a die hard Samsung user, I do support your cause for HTC to have unlocked bootloaders now and in the future. What they do could affect how other manufacturers treat their devices. I wouldn't want to see the same thing happen to Samsung phones either. Plus this also stifles development by the independent community as well.
+1
I would like my bootloader unlocked plus an ice cream sandwich for the wait. Thanks.
HTC, please stop lying to us
I'm not an HTC guy but i agree this is damaging for the entire community and i'm sure there are HTC guys on here so they can't play dumb
i am a HTC fan.
i agree with OP
LYING MAKE ME MAD, HULK SMASH!
Agree with OP..
Thats the only reason why i never bought VIVID...
+ 1
Wouldn't mind getting htc products. This I why I don't.
Sent from my I897 using XDA App
<Removed>
+1
I posted on Twitter and Facebook. Returning my Vivid and never buying HTC ever again if unlock doesn't come this week :-(
Sent from my HTC PH39100 using xda premium
Add me to the ranks who support this. I also posted this to a thread I started 2wks ago on the htc forums.
http://community.htc.com/na/htc-forums/android/f/182/t/14430.aspx
Posted to FB and G+ as well as Public w/ request to reshare!
I fully support that HTC should honor their promise, and unlock HTC bootloader. See my posts on the HTC Vivid forums.
I fully support this petition.
Sent from my SCH-I500 using xda premium
+ 1
I've always went with HTC phones, and I was considering going with another manufacturer until HTC made the bootloader statement. Now that I see they are not true to their own words, and I can't even trust a statement made by the CEO, how can I continue to trust your devices or quality.
I personally make decisions in my company regarding the devices we use in the field, and have mostly chosen HTC phones to meet our needs. If you continue this line of blame-shifting back and forth between it's AT&T's fault and AT&T says it's your problem, (we all know better considering other devices from other manufacturers are unlocked or unlockable on AT&T) you are going to loose a large contract, as I will have to find another manufacturer, and possibly another service provider.
adelmundo said:
Although I am a die hard Samsung user, I do support your cause for HTC to have unlocked bootloaders now and in the future. What they do could affect how other manufacturers treat their devices. I wouldn't want to see the same thing happen to Samsung phones either. Plus this also stifles development by the independent community as well.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Hav to agree with you htc shouldn't be lying cauz i don't want them to be an example for Samsung.
+100 im shocked the evo 3d owners got them to unlock the bootloader. And they posted that statement when we all told them how angry we were they locked our bootloader. I cant believe tuey flat out lied about unlocking future devices tisk tisk.
It is not HTC that is locking the bootloaders. It is the carriers. They lock them because people brick their phone and claim them under warranty which costs the carrier a fortune. There is a legal battle over this currently.
Sent from my Eris using XDA App
http://mobile.theverge.com/2012/7/16/3162319/android-jelly-bean-htc-hd2-hack
Granted the hd2 has been around for a long time and has an established base, the one s is a flagship device with great specs and seems like the developer base just isn't there. Why is that?
I actually think that's pretty damn awesome that they're able to do that. We need those devs on here
I don't disagree that its great there is continued development for the hd2, but the one s is in every way a much more capable device yet lacks a jb port that can even boot at this point. Chalk it up to the newness of the hardware and lack of experienced developers? Or is there not a lot of interest in this device?
Sent from my HTC VLE_U using xda app-developers app
It bothers me a lot. I keep saying that the community for this phone sucks but everyone just flames the hell out of me when I say that.
I mean this phone is full of flaws to begin with. Then it doesn't have the community to develop some quality roms for it. And all the tech sites are just blogging about the One X and neglecting the One S. So it doesn't attract any new people at all. Yet the One S is just as flagship as the One X. I believe that the S4 is still the best chip on the market right now.
Bohemus said:
I don't disagree that its great there is continued development for the hd2, but the one s is in every way a much more capable device yet lacks a jb port that can even boot at this point. Chalk it up to the newness of the hardware and lack of experienced developers? Or is there not a lot of interest in this device?
Sent from my HTC VLE_U using xda app-developers app
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The One S got overshadowed by the One X and then the Gal S 3. So simply put -- NO, there's not a lot of interest in the device. It's a shame because it truly is a great device, and is fast as hell. Unfortunately that's just how things so sometimes in the world of Android devices.
That being said, our dev community is by no means tiny. It's just smaller than the more popular devices like the HD2, and all the Nexus line. There's a lot of factors that play into the size of the dev community, such as specs, how hard/easy it is to unlock and root, kernel sources being released (this def hurt the One S for a while), manufacturer support, etc.
wilcoholic said:
It bothers me a lot. I keep saying that the community for this phone sucks but everyone just flames the hell out of me when I say that.
I mean this phone is full of flaws to begin with. Then it doesn't have the community to develop some quality roms for it. And all the tech sites are just blogging about the One X and neglecting the One S. So it doesn't attract any new people at all. Yet the One S is just as flagship as the One X. I believe that the S4 is still the best chip on the market right now.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You get flamed, because even though the community lacks. You cannot take ANYTHING away from the dev's who have put time into making quality Rom's for the community. The word "sucks" brings down everyone who has put in work.
When i first got my Mytouch 4g Slide. There was 2 Rom's for atleast a month. Maybe 3 roms by 2 months. Be happy for what we have. Not for what we don't have.. if the community "sucks" so bad. Pick up a book and learn to cook us up some Rom's. Until then don't bring the dev's down because you're mad there isn't 15 roms to pick from..
S4 is the best IMO right now. Eventually things will kick up. Once the phone gets some time under it's belt. TMO will start giving them out at discounted prices. That's when this phone will pick up..
By all means don't take this as a "flame" because it's not. Just a friendly reminder that we do have good dev's. And they do deserve respect.
Sent from my HTC VLE_U using Tapatalk 2
Easy, sell the ONE S, buy a HD2.
Problem Solved
solracarevir said:
Easy, sell the ONE S, buy a HD2.
Problem Solved
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
And then comes the useless comments
Sent from my HTC One S using xda premium
nickmv said:
The One S got overshadowed by the One X and then the Gal S 3. So simply put -- NO, there's not a lot of interest in the device. It's a shame because it truly is a great device, and is fast as hell. Unfortunately that's just how things so sometimes in the world of Android devices.
That being said, our dev community is by no means tiny. It's just smaller than the more popular devices like the HD2, and all the Nexus line. There's a lot of factors that play into the size of the dev community, such as specs, how hard/easy it is to unlock and root, kernel sources being released (this def hurt the One S for a while), manufacturer support, etc.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I think it's T-Mobile in general. I don't think a lot of developers are on t-mobile because we aren't known for getting the best phones.
c19932 said:
And then comes the useless comments
Sent from my HTC One S using xda premium
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I think Blaming and Bashing is more useless.
I mean, You can't compare the size and the Quality of the HD2 community with the ONE S community.
Once google releases a OS that didn't came preloaded with our phone we should not be whining about why X phone (which is inferior than mine) already have that OS and we don't.
We will get JB someday, thanks to the developer community. As I said earlier, if you cant wait to have JB don't complain, learn to build JB from source and do it yourself or buy a HD2 (which by the looks of it, they already have JB)
Hd2 is from t mobile and it's a great phone
Sent from my HTC VLE_U using xda app-developers app
And so is the HTC Sensation, which have a great developer community. If I don't remember wrong it was one of the first devices to receive ICS on late december.
Developers follow devices, I mean, some of them Do care about carriers, but if the device is good, developers will look for it.
Both phones
solracarevir said:
Easy, sell the ONE S, buy a HD2.
Problem Solved
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I have both phones. Loved, loved, absolutely loved the support for the HD2. But by no means was there always some HUGE selection. It took a lot of patience to hold out for some of the ROMs I knew were coming. I think the development for this phone will pick up.
solracarevir said:
And so is the HTC Sensation, which have a great developer community. If I don't remember wrong it was one of the first devices to receive ICS on late december.
Developers follow devices, I mean, some of them Do care about carriers, but if the device is good, developers will look for it.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Speaking of the sensation cm just posted this image on g+ hopefully this means something is on the horizon for us.
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I'm pretty sure we'll get 4.1. Even the Blaze 4G is getting ICS.
Everything is ported to the hd2. It's the swiss army knife of phones. You want windows, android, meego? Boom! It's great just watching it unfold! Going to flash jb as soon as theirs a solid rom. Don't forget the hd2 has paid its dues from booting from sd and duel booting, etc. It's been a long grueling 3 years. The hos is still in its infancy.
Sent from my HTC VLE_U using xda premium
jacewt said:
I think it's T-Mobile in general. I don't think a lot of developers are on t-mobile because we aren't known for getting the best phones.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
No, it's more that homebrew communities develop around the devices that can be used off contract or at off-contract prices.
Hence things like the HD2, the Sensation, and the Nexus become far more popular than they otherwise would be if they couldn't be used on a ton of networks without full data pricing. In fact, those devices continue to be relevant long after their hardware would indicate they should be.
Not really
The Devs have already started the JB 10 roms cooking, I think we have some good devs in here, they ave already started the JB 10 roms cooking. I for one would love a full CM9 port with a good camera. I try not to worry what roms the other phones have seeing as I don't have those phones.
Hopefully you guys can get a larger community going. The support for my Sensation has been nothing short of phenomenal. Got ICS super early, already have had JB alphas for a week. The number of ROMs can be overwhelming, and truth be told the support is what keeps me with a phone that is lacking in the hardware department.
Sent from my Sensation using xda app-developers app
People seem to be forgetting that the reason jelly bean updates are rolling out so quickly is because a lot of the work was done in ICS. And previous to that ICS was a laborious process hampered by the refusal of google to release honeycomb.
This device didn't exist during gingerbread so we didn't have a large base of developers refreshing for a code drop so they could release something for a hungry and eager audience. Also, it's difficult to develop for a device that one doesn't own. The One is still a flagship model and few people own one and even fewer want to brick their new device.
If another six months pass and development hasn't picked up then we might be able to express concern but right now being worried about where the stuff is seems premature to me.
We need to start an "S3 Unlock " campaign on Verizon's and Samsung's facebook and email to make our dissatisfaction more visible. Will this have any impact, I don't know, but it's something easily done with almost no effort that the general consumer and non-development community will easily see.
This has worked in the past with the HTC EVO 3D. If the community can get HTC, a million dollar company to notice, maybe it will work with a billion dollar company.
Why should we send to Samsung when it's Verizon that locked the bootloader? The reason for it is more then likely Verizon will try to pawn it off on Samsung; by saying they locked it or they have to build the unlock tool. So, before this becomes a “blame game” We don't care who is responsible, we just want “Developmental Equality” for all S3's
So as Bob Marley said: “Get up, stand up: stand up for your rights!” and take 3 minutes out of your day to help out the community.
What needs to be done:
Post "S3 Unlock or WE Walk" on Verizon's and Samsung's facebook. This would have a greater impact if it were posted everyday! “Don't let them forget about us!”
Email:
Under subject put: “S3 Unlock Bootloader” and in the body put “S3 Unlock ”
Samsung Contact:
https://www.facebook.com/SamsungUSA
Y.K. Kim
president and Chief Executive Officer of Samsung Electronics America
[email protected]
Dale Sohn
President at Samsung Telecommunications America
[email protected]
https://contactus.samsung.com/custo...estionGeneral.jsp?SITE_ID=591&PROD_ID=G303850
Verizon Contact:
https://www.facebook.com/verizon
Daniel S. Mead
President and CEO
[email protected]
Marni Walden
Executive Vice President and Chief Operating Officer
[email protected]
I understand what you want to do but alot of this is already being done by alot if angry customers. Verizon doesnt seem to care. All they did was blame Samsung.
Doesn't it make more sense that hitting them with a mass amount of posts and emails would do more than maybe 20 emails a day. It would get more attention if even just 1% of Verizon's customers were to flood them with posts and emails..this would be in the numbers up to 250,000 emails and facebook posts. They could still ignore it, but this would create more negative publicity. This is also why I am asking everyone to flood Samsung as well, eventually hopefully one of them will correct the issue. In time and numbers they will get tired of it and deal with us. Have you sent an email to Verizon or posted on their facebook?
Verizon might not admit that they are wrong, but any company is highly concerned about their public image. Facebook and Twitter can be a valuable tool to fight corporate arrogance.
One more thing to do... everyone should write a review on Verizon's web site slamming the locked bootloader, with a suggestion that this is a great phone on any provider but Verizon. I just clicked on the "Read reviews" link for the 32GB blue S3, and 4 out of the first ten reviews mentioned the locked bootloader.
We might never get them to unlock this particular bootloader, but at a minimum it would make them think twice about the future of locked bootloaders.
Verizon is betting on our apathy, so I applaud anyone who is willing to spend a bit of time keeping the heat on Verizon.
If you're serious about trying to piss them off, create an Anti Samsung Facebook page and / or Twitter Account basically blasting them for ****ty things they do, such as slow updates to products, locked bootloader, etc.
I once complained on Twitter about my GT 10.1 and didn't even direct it to them and I had their twitter person contact me and ask me if there was something they could do to help me.
They don't like knowing people are badmouthing them on social networks.
As for Verizon, they're used to people talking smack on them and don't seem the slightest bit phased.
If you're not part of the solution...you're part of the problem
I mean I guess anything's worth a try...but I don't think Verizon cares.
topmetsfan said:
I mean I guess anything's worth a try...but I don't think Verizon cares.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
They seem to hate me. Emailed the CEO about the bootloader, got the standard letter in the mail about "network security" from some high chair rep. His problem is he said "feel free to call with questions" in the letter, as well as his number. I have called him 5 times in the past 2 weeks, always leaving a message. I have still yet to get a call back. I wont stop til I can voice my opinion and get some answers.
I've been tweeting and posting on their facebook pages that I am unhappy about the locked boot loader and spyware on the phone.
It of course won't do any good, but maybe if other non dev/hacker types see the posts they will inquire or think twice.
dvaderx said:
I've been tweeting and posting on their facebook pages that I am unhappy about the locked boot loader and spyware on the phone.
It of course won't do any good, but maybe if other non dev/hacker types see the posts they will inquire or think twice.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
But other non dev/hacker types won't understand what a bootloader is and what the difference is between a locked and unlocked.
fluxvalve said:
Verizon might not admit that they are wrong, but any company is highly concerned about their public image. Facebook and Twitter can be a valuable tool to fight corporate arrogance.
One more thing to do... everyone should write a review on Verizon's web site slamming the locked bootloader, with a suggestion that this is a great phone on any provider but Verizon. I just clicked on the "Read reviews" link for the 32GB blue S3, and 4 out of the first ten reviews mentioned the locked bootloader.
We might never get them to unlock this particular bootloader, but at a minimum it would make them think twice about the future of locked bootloaders.
Verizon is betting on our apathy, so I applaud anyone who is willing to spend a bit of time keeping the heat on Verizon.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Why they even try to lock them I don't even get. It just seems like a waste of their time and resources. Just look at the s3, it was basically cracked before release and we already can do just about anything we want on it. It makes them look bad and does nothing and it makes even less sense when they have unlocked phones on their network. Bunch of dummies if you ask me
---------- Post added at 08:32 AM ---------- Previous post was at 08:26 AM ----------
ddggttff3 said:
They seem to hate me. Emailed the CEO about the bootloader, got the standard letter in the mail about "network security" from some high chair rep. His problem is he said "feel free to call with questions" in the letter, as well as his number. I have called him 5 times in the past 2 weeks, always leaving a message. I have still yet to get a call back. I wont stop til I can voice my opinion and get some answers.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
When you do, If you do, point out they sell unlocked phones on their network and that virtually every phone they sell has been hacked and its just a waste of their time.
piiman said:
Why they even try to lock them I don't even get. It just seems like a waste of their time and resources. Just look at the s3, it was basically cracked before release and we already can do just about anything we want on it. It makes them look bad and does nothing and it makes even less sense when they have unlocked phones on their network. Bunch of dummies if you ask me
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
If my x2 bootloader wasn't locked down like it is, ii wouldn't have purchased a new phone. Hardware is staying viable for a longer time than they would like, but, by locking down the software used they can obsolete your device long before the hardware is obsolete. Those who are savvy enough to hack it and put what they want on it also upgrade quick to the newest hardware for the wow factor and vzw knows this. Locking the device down prevents people like me from upgrading software easily, thus forcing a hardware upgrade- to achieve my desire for a software upgrade.
It's quite simple really. Phone sales. If any Joe-Schmoe could upgrade their droidx2 to jellybean, they wouldn't see that phone sale. No phone sale = no new 2 year contract.
They don't market the hardware specs at all like they market the OS.
It must be worth it to them to lock it down and hope to see a device sold. Henry Ford said he'd give the cars away for free if he can be the only one to sell the parts. Vzw has aligned themselves closely with this mentality.
Sent from my locked Verizon s3
ancashion said:
If my x2 bootloader wasn't locked down like it is, ii wouldn't have purchased a new phone. Hardware is staying viable for a longer time than they would like, but, by locking down the software used they can obsolete your device long before the hardware is obsolete. Those who are savvy enough to hack it and put what they want on it also upgrade quick to the newest hardware for the wow factor and vzw knows this. Locking the device down prevents people like me from upgrading software easily, thus forcing a hardware upgrade- to achieve my desire for a software upgrade.
It's quite simple really. Phone sales. If any Joe-Schmoe could upgrade their droidx2 to jellybean, they wouldn't see that phone sale. No phone sale = no new 2 year contract.
They don't market the hardware specs at all like they market the OS.
It must be worth it to them to lock it down and hope to see a device sold. Henry Ford said he'd give the cars away for free if he can be the only one to sell the parts. Vzw has aligned themselves closely with this mentality.
Sent from my locked Verizon s3
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
This ^^^^^
I have the Verizon Samsung Fascinate that is running Jelly Bean better than some phones out now and this phone only has 384 mb of RAM and has been out for 2 years. Through the efforts of some of the best Devs out there, this phone has lived well longer than it should have (seeing as Samsung/Verizon only supported it up to GB). I've gotten the best battery life at almost 2 days of moderate usage, it's snappy, and still is getting support from the community, because of this I've seen no reason to upgrade other than to have the latest and greatest. A locked boot loader in their mind would prevent this. Keeping hardware, that could last well longer than 2 years, from keeping up with the latest software updates. But with the hard work of the Devs and the community, even with locked bootloaders we can still keep up with the latest (ex. Kexec for VZW GS3). I hope for an unlocked bootloader, but with the great Devs out there I'm not to worried. Waiting for my locked S3 to come in the mail and plan on rooting and customizing it how I want with kexec even with a locked bootloader. I do wish those who have messaged Verizon and Samsung the best of luck. But I won't be holding my breath for them, I'll be holding it for the great Devs and the great community.
CM10 on Fascinate
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Lovely Battery Life
Sent from my SCH-I500 using xda premium
I have a fascinate as well from a while back when my wife had it. I've been strongly considering returning my s3 after I mod the fascinate like you have (since I've never done it before...) and rock it until something worthwhile comes out
Sent from my locked Verizon s3
I'm really hoping you guys get your bootloader unlocked but speaking from experience I don't think it will work. As you can see in my sig I have owned a lot of Moto/VZW phones and people were spamming FB and twitter and starting petitions and it never did anything. But I wish you luck that you can get somewhere with sammy because god knows VZW doesn't give a sh!t about there customers.
Suddenly and without warning today ... this hypothesis struck me and started to develop (much like an impending thunderstorm). I wonder: What if somehow Apple managed to coerce AT&T into sabotaging the ICS release with the intent of deflating Samsung, just in case their lawsuit didn't work out? In return, AT&T would be thrown a handful of Apple exclusives (since they were so bent out of shape about Apple cheating on them first with Verizon then Sprint; ironically about the same time that the Android lineup REALLY improved at AT&T). Naturally, greedy AT&T would jump at the chance to be Apple's main (excuse me) ***** one more time, right?
I guess this is coming from a place of substantial anger. I'm FURIOUS that the phone I LOVED so much for seven months was basically taken away from me. And there is not a SINGLE official word from either Samsung or AT&T about what I can do about it. So I suppose I can bring the thing back to Best Buy, AGAIN, and recieve another REFURBISHED edition (one that's only 300 IMEI numbers up from the original one), but honestly, I don't have the time or desire to rebuild the damn thing one more time (and then beg the guy at Android Assistant to please let me not have to pay again ... etc. etc. etc.)
I know ... I'm delving deeeeeeep into conspiracy theorism and perhaps I shouldn't play so many video games. BUT, maybe ............ anybody think it makes sense?
PS Thanks for keeping this great and informative site running. It serves as such an amazing resource. The amount of knowledge I've picked up here is invaluable.
WOW. Really?? My phones running great on AOKP JB. Sounds more like user error than a multi-business conspiracy.
JB?
hechoen said:
WOW. Really?? My phones running great on AOKP JB. Sounds more like user error than a multi-business conspiracy.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Did i miss something and AT&T officially released JB? Because I'm speaking specifically about the official release that AT&T and Samsung sent out to its customers ... you know, the legal way.
Yeah you missed the whole point of this site. lol
NYCblues said:
Suddenly and without warning today ... this hypothesis struck me and started to develop (much like an impending thunderstorm). I wonder: What if somehow Apple managed to coerce AT&T into sabotaging the ICS release with the intent of deflating Samsung, just in case their lawsuit didn't work out? In return, AT&T would be thrown a handful of Apple exclusives (since they were so bent out of shape about Apple cheating on them first with Verizon then Sprint; ironically about the same time that the Android lineup REALLY improved at AT&T). Naturally, greedy AT&T would jump at the chance to be Apple's main (excuse me) ***** one more time, right?
I guess this is coming from a place of substantial anger. I'm FURIOUS that the phone I LOVED so much for seven months was basically taken away from me. And there is not a SINGLE official word from either Samsung or AT&T about what I can do about it. So I suppose I can bring the thing back to Best Buy, AGAIN, and recieve another REFURBISHED edition (one that's only 300 IMEI numbers up from the original one), but honestly, I don't have the time or desire to rebuild the damn thing one more time (and then beg the guy at Android Assistant to please let me not have to pay again ... etc. etc. etc.)
I know ... I'm delving deeeeeeep into conspiracy theorism and perhaps I shouldn't play so many video games. BUT, maybe ............ anybody think it makes sense?
PS Thanks for keeping this great and informative site running. It serves as such an amazing resource. The amount of knowledge I've picked up here is invaluable.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
No. Dude these are multibillion dollar companies, they have better **** to deal then playing subterfuge over what would amount to a couple thousand dollars, at the most, lost from annoyed customers
Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I727 using Tapatalk 2
what do you mean taken away from you? did you mess it up and bricked it or somebody confiscated it from your home?
Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I727 using xda premium
NYCblues said:
Did i miss something and AT&T officially released JB? Because I'm speaking specifically about the official release that AT&T and Samsung sent out to its customers ... you know, the legal way.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Actually- rooting your phone and using a custom ROM are 100% legal.
Carriers like at&t don't like it, but its legal.
Sent from my SGH-I727 using Tapatalk 2
Lol. If anything AT&T is trying to get away from Apple products. They make more profit selling Android devices.
Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I727 using Tapatalk 2
mindmajick said:
Actually- rooting your phone and using a custom ROM are 100% legal.
Carriers like at&t don't like it, but its legal.
Sent from my SGH-I727 using Tapatalk 2
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
THIS.
All it does is void your warranty. Since it was probably already void for who knows why else among the array of things that could void your warranty, the OP's argument is null and void, and similarly a useless waste of space.
aycockonxion said:
THIS.
All it does is void your warranty. Since it was probably already void for who knows why else among the array of things that could void your warranty, the OP's argument is null and void, and similarly a useless waste of space.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
What argument? Who's arguing with who? What'd I miss?
And since I didn't really present any facts since it wasn't an argument, per se ... what exactly is your point?
Seems like all you guys want to do is argue ... or troll. Hmmmmmm.
PS the original point was meant to be a funny "get this **** out of my head" thing. Maybe I'll re-evaluate my needs. Can I have my money back, then?
NYCblues said:
What argument? Who's arguing with who? What'd I miss?
And since I didn't really present any facts since it wasn't an argument, per se ... what exactly is your point?
Seems like all you guys want to do is argue ... or troll. Hmmmmmm.
PS the original point was meant to be a funny "get this **** out of my head" thing. Maybe I'll re-evaluate my needs. Can I have my money back, then?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
It's who is arguing with whom. Also, I believe the word you were searching for in the thread title is theorist, not theory-ist.
Sincerely,
Heir Hare
XDA Grammar Nazi
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m4570d0n said:
It's who is arguing with whom. Also, I believe the word you were searching for in the thread title is theorist, not theory-ist.
Sincerely,
Heir Hare
XDA Grammar Nazi
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I love grammar Nazis! U R the gr8est!
m4570d0n said:
It's who is arguing with whom. Also, I believe the word you were searching for in the thread title is theorist, not theory-ist.
Sincerely,
Heir Hare
XDA Grammar Nazi
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
That was sweet! ALL HAIL GRAMMAR NAZI! As far as the 'discussion' goes, it should make no difference to you who releases what and when. As it was pointed out, maybe you are missing the point of this arena. Whether you develop, tinker, or just screw around with your phone, the point is this: collectively, we as a group could not care less what the carriers or even manufacturers provide for us in the way of OS updates. We seek out our own, by way of skilled and knowledgeable people who aren't satisfied with the bloatware infested offerings given to us long after the fact. As a member of this forum, you are EXPECTED to have the desire to learn how to make your own way in the android world, albeit with the help of others most of the time.This is a development and learning forum. Regardless of the trolling and/or occasional flaming for the sub-genius among us, you need to want to learn, not wait on the conglomerates to dole out what they want to....my penny and a half.
Anybody interested in the bootloader and unlocking it I encourage you to sign this petition. These phones are ours to use how we see fit and the more noise we make the better our chances are. I bought this phone under the assumption that nothing had changed and for Samsung to change their policies without notice isn't acceptable for me and hopefully you as well. Thank you
Petition
And please re-tweet:
Vote which John
It's time!
I signed
Used the picture on Instagram and @JohnLegere thanks!
lost_ said:
And please re-tweet: It's time!
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Done!
Sent from my SM-G935T using Tapatalk
Signed!
Signed
Signed.
This bad boy has over 500 signatures now. The more we share and retweet the louder we sound. Samsung has also responded to a few people, so you know we're being heard. Keep your fingers crossed and keep the pressure up until we hear one way or the other.
See, this is what is wrong with this picture... "Make Tmobile great again"! That's wrong, Tmo has been doing a great job as of late; do not undermine its performance just because Sammy is putting all of its panties in a bunch with their pay system.
That picture should have said "Keep Tmobile being great"! If I was the CEO of a company and I come across something like this, I would be losing respect for whatever movement faster than ligth because it is making me look bad not just the company.. especially if it has not been proven that Tmo is at fault here guys; don't paint as a bad guy an innocent party until proven guilty.. It defeats the purpose
Signed
Signed!
signed! git 'er 'dun T-Mobile!
brendan802 said:
Anybody interested in the bootloader and unlocking it I encourage you to sign this petition. These phones are ours to use how we see fit and the more noise we make the better our chances are. I bought this phone under the assumption that nothing had changed and for Samsung to change their policies without notice isn't acceptable for me and hopefully you as well. Thank you
Petition
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
What percentage of people do you think own the phone vs lease the phone? I would wager the vast majority are using it on JUMP or JOD or just a regular lease. If you are leasing a phone, its certainly "not yours to use how you see fit". It would be great if Samsung would allow those of us who paid the phone full price the option to unlock the bootloader, but T-Mobile is under no obligation to do it for those who lease the phone.
Signed
Sent from my SM-G935T using XDA Free mobile app
Semantics said:
What percentage of people do you think own the phone vs lease the phone? I would wager the vast majority are using it on JUMP or JOD or just a regular lease. If you are leasing a phone, its certainly "not yours to use how you see fit". It would be great if Samsung would allow those of us who paid the phone full price the option to unlock the bootloader, but T-Mobile is under no obligation to do it for those who lease the phone.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Your name is very accurate.
Also, you seem to be, at core, a very self-centered, self-serving individual. Why would you even present that argument, when an unlock for everyone gives you exactly what you get if your suggestion is implemented? Do you have a need to be one of the only ones with the full bells and whistles? Is it a need to be the cool kid with the rooted phone that no one else has? Is it because you feel more entitled, as you bought the phone outright for reasons of your own, instead of going on month-to-month? I'm genuinely curious, none of this is meant to insult you. I'm interested in the psychology behind people who see things like you did.
psych0r3bel said:
Your name is very accurate.
Also, you seem to be, at core, a very self-centered, self-serving individual. Why would you even present that argument, when an unlock for everyone gives you exactly what you get if your suggestion is implemented? Do you have a need to be one of the only ones with the full bells and whistles? Is it a need to be the cool kid with the rooted phone that no one else has? Is it because you feel more entitled, as you bought the phone outright for reasons of your own, instead of going on month-to-month? I'm genuinely curious, none of this is meant to insult you. I'm interested in the psychology behind people who see things like you did.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I've said already I'm not rooting regardless. I find it ironic the guy who doesn't actually own his phone feels that he's entitled to the same benefits as the people who actually do own the phone. If you want to use words like it's mine to do as I please, then you should at least own the phone before claiming ownership. I couldn't care less about an unlocked bootloader, its clearly an issue for some, but don't try and play me as the entitled one when you are in fact acting like you are owed something you are not. Bernie Sanders fan too I wager.
Semantics said:
What percentage of people do you think own the phone vs lease the phone? I would wager the vast majority are using it on JUMP or JOD or just a regular lease. If you are leasing a phone, its certainly "not yours to use how you see fit". It would be great if Samsung would allow those of us who paid the phone full price the option to unlock the bootloader, but T-Mobile is under no obligation to do it for those who lease the phone.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Id say that probably about 25-30% own them outright and I understand what you are saying but they use to be unlocked no matter what method of payment you have so why should that change now? If they would unlock just the ones sold outright that would be fine for me and I bet that would be better for the carriers too. Either way they shouldn't change their stance without notice as samsung knows how upset people become over locked bootloaders. I am with sprint for the record as t-mobile isnt available in fabulous rural rutland vermont and I posted to all carrier forums hoping the more noise we make the better for us all.
A promising lead or empty words from a Tmo employee: Real or Not?
Edit: TMobile deleted the tweet by KimB that stated, "it's getting unlocked.."
Semantics said:
What percentage of people do you think own the phone vs lease the phone? I would wager the vast majority are using it on JUMP or JOD or just a regular lease. If you are leasing a phone, its certainly "not yours to use how you see fit". It would be great if Samsung would allow those of us who paid the phone full price the option to unlock the bootloader, but T-Mobile is under no obligation to do it for those who lease the phone.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
psych0r3bel said:
Your name is very accurate.
Also, you seem to be, at core, a very self-centered, self-serving individual. Why would you even present that argument, when an unlock for everyone gives you exactly what you get if your suggestion is implemented? Do you have a need to be one of the only ones with the full bells and whistles? Is it a need to be the cool kid with the rooted phone that no one else has? Is it because you feel more entitled, as you bought the phone outright for reasons of your own, instead of going on month-to-month? I'm genuinely curious, none of this is meant to insult you. I'm interested in the psychology behind people who see things like you did.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
No Im not doing this just for myself I strongly believe that android should stay open the way its meant to be and locked bootloaders are not that. And actually guess what I'm on a month to month lease with sprint but if need be I will go out and buy one outright so I can do what I want with something that is supposed to be mine. Hows that for self serving because I wouldn't get the unlock if they released it right now to paid in full s7 owners. Were you expecting that I bet not. I have never had a single device whether I bought it outright or not that had a locked bootloader and I wont keep one that cannot be unlocked. Douchebag looking to start sh!t with a stranger real nice you dont know me or what I'm about. 24 payments of $30.50 but Im self serving like you thought. No response from the psychologist huh. You know samsung had previously locked phones that they sold as developer editions if you bought them outright just like I said paid in full. I think that none should be locked no matter what way you pay for them. Its like saying if you are paying off a car that you cant put a performance pipe on it because you haven't paid it completely off???
Here is my lease agreement
https://onedrive.live.com/redir?res...authkey=!AGpsyhp_4N0lMyg&v=3&ithint=photo,png