Related
Just wondering is the apps 2 sd method still used?
I remember I got the 8gb memory card just for this purpose, but now I'm wondering is it still used the same way? As in we have to setup the memory card in a specific way for it to work properly.
I hear things about compcache and all but i never really caught on what that really is.
Anybody got some info? Shed some light?
Yes.
Off to Q-n-A you go.
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=762109
Can we replicate this on the Captivate? I've been playing around with my new Epic for a few days and it is AMAZINGLY fast. This is supposed to be the lag fix that Sammy employed on the Epic.
I knew it was just a matter of time until Samsung took action against the lag problem. I mean they wouldn't want their big, bad, and fast galaxy s line slowed to a screeching halt because of lag issues. I wouldn't be surprised if we see this in an update in the near future. With Samsungs track recored though they might end up waiting for Froyo to emplement it.
Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I897 using XDA App
We have a nand lag fix already right? Wouldn't this give the same results? I thought the ext 2 internal storage lag fix was faster the the nand fix.
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=737829&highlight=nand+lag+fix
I'm no dev but I think this is the same thing that's already been implemented by the community (for that matter, Samsung probably got the fix from the community )
From what most have gathered, samsung didn't fix the lag, they used different hardware that is faster. That will do no good for captivate and vibrant users.
l7777 said:
From what most have gathered, samsung didn't fix the lag, they used different hardware that is faster. That will do no good for captivate and vibrant users.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
What the heck?
A) It uses the same hardware that matters anyway (granted LED, keyboard, etc is different).
B) Someone pulled the init.rc and proved what the OP is saying
C) You don't know what you're talking about
is there a good reference for the mapping of /dev/? or the whole file system in general? I went to see if busybox had a symlink for bash and much to my surprise there was no /bin. I'm new to android but a long time linux user and the differences are becoming readily apparent.
l7777 said:
From what most have gathered, samsung didn't fix the lag, they used different hardware that is faster. That will do no good for captivate and vibrant users.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I wouldn't go as far to say that. Everything is the same internally other than how the file system is setup, and in this case they are using the NAND (I believe).
From Boygeniusreport:
"We’re assuming the phone uses NAND Flash as the internal memory medium. On the Captivate if you navigate to Settings >SD Card and phones storage you see “External SD Card” and “Internal SD Card” listed. On the EPIC you see “External SD Card” and “Internal Phone storage.” We’ve reached out to Sprint for clarification and will update this article if they respond with a definitive answer."
Source: http://www.boygeniusreport.com/2010/08/18/your-epic-4g-questions-answered/
same hardware, different software...just minor things different
The Epic is missing the 16gb internal SD card... the SD card that Samsung has split into 2GB for apps and 14GB for /sdcard for the rest of the US Galaxy S devices (no idea how the EU phones are set up). As a result, it has far less space for apps, but it more than makes up for it in speed.
About the only thing that I think Samsung can do to improve speed on the rest of the Galaxy S phones is to either work like hell to come up with a better driver for the internal SD card, or to accept a massive limitation in app space and build in the original lag fix.
I'm hoping it's just a driver issue... when copying a 1GB file to and from my /sdcard using the USB mass storage mode, I sometimes see 10+ megs per second, and sometimes see >1 meg per second. This is with my phone sitting idle, nothing else going on at all (except for OS Monitor, so I can see what's going on). That leads me to believe that it's either a driver problem or the internal SD card is the world's crappiest. Seeing as everything else on the phone is very nice hardware, and seeing how the GPS and compass drivers have issues as well, I'm kinda (and maybe foolishly) thinking that it's probably a driver issue. We'll see.
It almost certainly is a driver issue. Formatting the internal SD with another filesystem provides a large boost in I/O performance. It's not as large as with the loopback hacks, which probably result in both subsystems buffering data, but it's enough to make using the device much more pleasant.
Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I897 using XDA App
not sure if this has been covered already, but it looks like the Galaxy S phones use NAND for internal storage and not a flash card. the following link:
http://www.sprintdroids.com/forum/s...-galaxy-s-torn-down-extensively-detailed.html
will link a Korean site that tears down a Galaxy S device. here's the direct link to the translated Korean page:
http://translate.google.com/transla....com/News_List_View.php?nModeC=4&nSeq=1742568
andy2na said:
I wouldn't go as far to say that. Everything is the same internally other than how the file system is setup, and in this case they are using the NAND (I believe).
From Boygeniusreport:
"We’re assuming the phone uses NAND Flash as the internal memory medium. On the Captivate if you navigate to Settings >SD Card and phones storage you see “External SD Card” and “Internal SD Card” listed. On the EPIC you see “External SD Card” and “Internal Phone storage.” We’ve reached out to Sprint for clarification and will update this article if they respond with a definitive answer."
Source: http://www.boygeniusreport.com/2010/08/18/your-epic-4g-questions-answered/
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
on the Captivate, if you scroll down farther, past Internal and Externa SD Card, you will also see "Internal Phone Storage".
not sure if this has been covered already, but it looks like the Galaxy S phones use NAND for internal storage and not a flash card. the following link:
http://www.sprintdroids.com/forum/s...-galaxy-s-torn-down-extensively-detailed.html
will link a Korean site that tears down a Galaxy S device. here's the direct link to the translated Korean page:
http://translate.google.com/transla....com/News_List_View.php?nModeC=4&nSeq=1742568
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The Captivate has both, as you can see quite clearly in the shell by using the mount command. Most if the partitions are segments of the NAND, using /dev/block/stlXX devices, but /data is /dev/block/mmcblk0p2, the second partition of the internal SD card. All are Samsung's proprietary RFS filesystem, which appears to perform poorly on the SD.
Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I897 using XDA App
Unhelpful said:
The Captivate has both, as you can see quite clearly in the shell by using the mount command. Most if the partitions are segments of the NAND, using /dev/block/stlXX devices, but /data is /dev/block/mmcblk0p2, the second partition of the internal SD card. All are Samsung's proprietary RFS filesystem, which appears to perform poorly on the SD.
Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I897 using XDA App
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
pardon my ignorance, as i truly am ignorant in the subject, but how are logical names proof of physical hardware? could Samsung not have partitioned a NAND chip with different mount points and call them whatever they want? from the tear down pics, it seems that there would be no room for an internal SD card on the PCB. also, from reading around, it seems that all Galaxy S phones are pretty much the same hardware-wise, is this not true for the Captivate version?
again, i don't mean to come off antagonistic. i'm just searching for knowledge.
I just wish everyone would quit calling the system memory an "Internal SD card". There is no such thing. Samsung gave it this stupid name so the simpleton's of the world would realize it was data storage.
SD - Secure Digital is a form factor design. The phone has different kinds of flash memory and no one has yet to determine if the 14GB "internal SD" is a seperate chip from the total 16GB of internal storage.
Comparing this "Internal SD" to a real SD card is just dumb. An SD card is removable, of a certain physical size, has a write protection, and supports built in DRM - part of what Secure Digital means.
I am speculating too, but until someone can pinpoint the chips used on the captivate, we don't really know what this internal SD is made of.
-=HOLLYW00D=- said:
pardon my ignorance, as i truly am ignorant in the subject, but how are logical names proof of physical hardware? could Samsung not have partitioned a NAND chip with different mount points and call them whatever they want? from the tear down pics, it seems that there would be no room for an internal SD card on the PCB. also, from reading around, it seems that all Galaxy S phones are pretty much the same hardware-wise, is this not true for the Captivate version?
again, i don't mean to come off antagonistic. i'm just searching for knowledge.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I agree - SD is just NAND with DRM and some other features. I think Samsung just calls it this to separate internal OS/Application storage from user addressable storage. I would be there is one 16GB NAND chip as I have never heard of a 14GB chip. I bet they just partitioned the 16GB chip in different ways, but for some reason gave the 14GB chunk a slower FS partition by mistake.
Unhelpful said:
It almost certainly is a driver issue. Formatting the internal SD with another filesystem provides a large boost in I/O performance. It's not as large as with the loopback hacks, which probably result in both subsystems buffering data, but it's enough to make using the device much more pleasant.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Ah, good to know then. Thanks!
It is not only a logical name. While there may not be a removable card in a slot, the name suggests, and information in sysfs agrees, that the "internal SD" is accessed via an sd/mmc host controller. This means that many details about the flash are being hidden from the OS - it doesn't know what the erase block size of the flash is, it only sees a device with a certain number of blocks and a partition table at the beginning. Block remapping and wear levelling are hidden, which is why we can't use any of the linux filesystems for MTD devices. And for some reason, I'm not sure why, RFS performs much worse on an mmc device, or at least on this one, than it does on the OneNAND partitions. That it should matter seems a bit odd, as they are both block devices, but perhaps the OneNAND driver exposes some other information or interfaces via ioctl calls that are not present on the mmc device.
It is certainly possible for a filesystem to perform better on the internal SD than RFS does - this is easily demonstrated by formatting it with ext4 or nilfs2, and is also suggested by the improvement in lag that some seem to see with the leaked firmwares. In the future we may not care about alternate filesystems, because we get an rfs module that performs better on the internal sd.
Unhelpful said:
It is not only a logical name. While there may not be a removable card in a slot, the name suggests, and information in sysfs agrees, that the "internal SD" is accessed via an sd/mmc host controller.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
sounds reasonable, thanks. but getting down to it, is it not at all possible that the internal "memory" is a physical NAND chip, albeit partitioned and interpreted logically however Samsung saw fit?
this may seem like a pointless debate, but perhaps if the community knew it was NAND for a fact, they could rewrite this or that to make things faster/better/etc..
here's a link that revers to the internal memory as NAND. not the source i'm looking for, but it's something:
http://www.66mobile.com/phones/samsung/samsung-galaxys.html
here's another spec sheet referencing NAND:
http://www.dropshippers.co.za/W32574411-Samsung-I9000/Documentation.html
here's an official Samsung site referencing NAND:
http://www.samsung.com/uk/consumer/...dex.idx?pagetype=prd_detail&tab=specification
Dumped my buggy not impressive Galaxy s 4g today> (love Costcos 3 months policy) and picked up G2x. So far extremally impressed!
One question is the Costco phone guy handed my the 16gig micro SD card from the Galaxy as he said he had extras from dead phones. I said THANK YOU! and installed. However when using AppstoSd program it only see's internal mem, and Internal SD 5gs. It does not see or give option to move to my 16g Sd card?
My HD2 and Samsung worked great with AppstoSD. Am I missing something? I mean I guess the 1.2gig and 5gigs of internal is enough. But I like to also use the SD card for programs to not overload internal memory.
I have not rooted yet, will do that so I can get my Titanium backup working to see it I can do it with that.
Thanks!
iceshark said:
Dumped my buggy not impressive Galaxy s 4g today> (love Costcos 3 months policy) and picked up G2x. So far extremally impressed!
One question is the Costco phone guy handed my the 16gig micro SD card from the Galaxy as he said he had extras from dead phones. I said THANK YOU! and installed. However when using AppstoSd program it only see's internal mem, and Internal SD 5gs. It does not see or give option to move to my 16g Sd card?
My HD2 and Samsung worked great with AppstoSD. Am I missing something? I mean I guess the 1.2gig and 5gigs of internal is enough. But I like to also use the SD card for programs to not overload internal memory.
I have not rooted yet, will do that so I can get my Titanium backup working to see it I can do it with that.
Thanks!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Can't be done, discussed endlessly in the corresponding O2x thread...
djmcnz said:
Can't be done, discussed endlessly in the corresponding O2x thread...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Been all over that thread. This issue and the "phantom AT&T bands are two big issues on this device. However, there may be some hope at the CM end - not this item in the latest CM7 changelog"
OpenMergedAbandoned
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Change I6beb0077: Allow multiple shareable SD Cards by using getShareableVolumes() to get all the volumes that are shareable and allowing sharing/unsharing for all of them rather than just the hardcoded getExternalStorage calls.
Change-Id:
I6beb007700ef4be04c3eb273bbf2069c87b30011
Owner atinm
Project CyanogenMod/android_frameworks_base
Branch gingerbread
Topic
Uploaded Apr 10, 2011 5:35 PM
Updated Apr 20, 2011 7:49 PM
Status Merged
.
First thank you for responding. I am not a newbie but have been rooting and testing my Hd2's for past year. My first non HTC phone in awhile was the vibrant s4g, it had its own problems with very low internal memory.
So I was excited this phone had 8 gigs plus now my 16 gig card. I have not been on these forums so I did not know it was a known issue Sorry.
So to clarify, there is no workaroud? But can I not just use root explorer and move files to the SD card? I understand apps to sd wont do it automaticly. But I plan to put my music and movies at least on SD... What would even be the use of the manufacturer putting SD slot on phone if you could not use it?
Ira that is what I do. SD card = sdcard/external_SD
Or something to that effect. I plan to keep my apps2sd on internal and SD for straight storage and backups.
From the sound of it, the clockwork mod can access the microsd so at least backups will be off the device.
-sent from my LG 2Gx
iceshark said:
First thank you for responding. I am not a newbie but have been rooting and testing my Hd2's for past year. My first non HTC phone in awhile was the vibrant s4g, it had its own problems with very low internal memory.
So I was excited this phone had 8 gigs plus now my 16 gig card. I have not been on these forums so I did not know it was a known issue Sorry.
So to clarify, there is no workaroud? But can I not just use root explorer and move files to the SD card? I understand apps to sd wont do it automaticly. But I plan to put my music and movies at least on SD... What would even be the use of the manufacturer putting SD slot on phone if you could not use it?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
What I have been doing is the basic copy and paste. I copy the app or video ect. from the sd card and paste it on the ext/sd card. If there is a faster oor easier way please let me know. I am rooted and this is the first phone I ever had with this kind of a set up with the sd card. I prefer the other way much better ala Nexus One.
player911 said:
Ira that is what I do. SD card = sdcard/external_SD
Or something to that effect. I plan to keep my apps2sd on internal and SD for straight storage and backups.
From the sound of it, the clockwork mod can access the microsd so at least backups will be off the device.
-sent from my LG 2Gx
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
That is correct. In a file manager etc. you can locate your SD Card by going to the ExternalSD folder (path: SD Card/ExternalSD). The "SD Card" is actually the internal memory, and the "External SD" is the actual SD Card. When you plug your phone into a PC two different drives come up, one for the internal and one for the SD Card. From what I know you can't put apps on your actual SD Card. However music, pics, etc. all work just fine. I have all my music on my SD Card and everything else on the internal.
P.S. When opening the internal memory in a PC it will still have an ExternalSD folder, but it will be empty. I would advise not deleting it.
There's something like 1.5GB just for apps. What the heck are you doing to "overload" it??
cyberchuck9000 said:
There's something like 1.5GB just for apps. What the heck are you doing to "overload" it??
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
GPS maps will easily overload the internal SD card. If they let the map location be set, that would fix it, but most do not (yet).
Hey everyone,
Found this mod for the Galaxy S (Or SGSII, not sure what the i9003 is), which switches the Internal and External SD cards, according to the Android OS. Personally, I have a lot more space of my external SD and would like games and such to store their data there, instead of on my smaller internal SD. Some apps like Titanium backup can change their data locations, but Games such as Gameloft games and the like cant have their game data moved to the External SD card atm.
This looks like a great alternative to this issue, could this hack be adapted to the G2x?
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=1088474
Although I could see how you would think this would be in development, this post should actually go in Q&A.
That being said, this would be a very useful modification.
Edit: My apologies. Apparently you posted in precisely the right forum. My apprehension arose from the fact that so many people say 'BUT WHAT ABOUT THIS MODDD??!?!' and it just clutters things up so my immediate reaction was to motion to have it moved. Good deal bringing it to Krylon and Tweezit's attention
I couldnt decide between Q&A and Development for this topic, as it involves porting or adapting a hack for another phone to the G2x.
MODS: Please move this to Q&A, if necessary.
EDIT: Apparently not, this seems to be a development topic now
Here is a file Be warned I have not tested this. If it messes your phone up I am not held responsible. **Personally I would let another dev look at this to be on the safe side as I am not 100% sure on this.**
You will have to extract it and use root explorer to push to /system/etc/
Oh I needed to clarify this was on 2.2.2 so it may differ on 2.3.
Since we have a little interest, we'll leave it for a day or so and see if anything comes of it.
I've PM'd krylon to take a look at Tweezit's vold. (sounds like a nasty STD).
overground said:
Since we have a little interest, we'll leave it for a day or so and see if anything comes of it.
I've PM'd krylon to take a look at Tweezit's vold. (sounds like a nasty STD).
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Smart move as I spent all of 2 minutes looking through the file as I am in a rush to leave
Later guys ^^
I'm looking at this now. Your biggest issue is you are going to have to have 3 different versions... well... in reality 2 different versions. CM based and Non-CM Based.
And if someone flashes the wrong one...they are hosed and will have to restore from a backup
ok, after reviewing Tweezits vold, Bionix vold, and CM7 vold, tweezit's would break mounting.
The reason being, with the introduction of Tegra, the vold changed for it.
I'll have to do some testing, but making the internal to external switch should be fairly easy.
krylon360 said:
I'm looking at this now. Your biggest issue is you are going to have to have 3 different versions... well... in reality 2 different versions. CM based and Non-CM Based.
And if someone flashes the wrong one...they are hosed and will have to restore from a backup
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Eh not bad in my eyes I always do backups
Sent from my LG-P999 using Tapatalk
krylon360 said:
ok, after reviewing Tweezits vold, Bionix vold, and CM7 vold, tweezit's would break mounting.
The reason being, with the introduction of Tegra, the vold changed for it.
I'll have to do some testing, but making the internal to external switch should be fairly easy.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Is there a way to have setting like a switch to interchange between the two
Sent from my LG-P999 using Tapatalk
Suprah said:
Eh not bad in my eyes I always do backups
Sent from my LG-P999 using Tapatalk
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
last time I did a backup was when I was testing EXT4/3 restore.
Lol I'm a rom crack addicr
Sent from my LG-P999 using Tapatalk
We need to decide on a standard. Unfortunately some people don't have SD cards but I'm sure most people would that visit here.
I'm for the switch cause i hate crap installing to my internal drive. Cm already made the switch.
player911 said:
We need to decide on a standard. Unfortunately some people don't have SD cards but I'm sure most people would that visit here.
I'm for the switch cause i hate crap installing to my internal drive. Cm already made the switch.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I'm with you. Maybe we should put together a poll or something...
Multiple versions just confuse the new guys. Would be nice if there was some priority... Like use SD as first choice then fall back on internal if SD is not present.
That still complicates things as people wont know what's going on.
****best idea****
If CWM flips it by default then you can just streamline everything and make a public service announcement on the CWM download page that they will be flipped and an SD is required for flashing. Makes sense to use a SD for flashing anyway.
Even a 2gb is plenty for some Roms and app storage. Save the internal for personal music and other media. I hope no one rocks less then that these days.
Plus if you use internal storage I can see certain scenarios popping up where they are boot looping and lost their access into the internal files. I can't mount using 3.1.0.1 external. If it werent for my SD I'd be stuck hardcore.
player911 said:
Multiple versions just confuse the new guys. Would be nice if there was some priority... Like use SD as first choice then fall back on internal if SD is not present.
That still complicates things as people wont know what's going on.
****best idea****
If CWM flips it by default then you can just streamline everything and make a public service announcement on the CWM download page that they will be flipped and an SD is required for flashing. Makes sense to use a SD for flashing anyway.
Even a 2gb is plenty for some Roms and app storage. Save the internal for personal music and other media. I hope no one rocks less then that these days.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I'm kind of with you on this one. I use all of my roms and such for the external SD card and everything else for internal.
player911 said:
Multiple versions just confuse the new guys. Would be nice if there was some priority... Like use SD as first choice then fall back on internal if SD is not present.
That still complicates things as people wont know what's going on.
****best idea****
If CWM flips it by default then you can just streamline everything and make a public service announcement on the CWM download page that they will be flipped and an SD is required for flashing. Makes sense to use a SD for flashing anyway.
Even a 2gb is plenty for some Roms and app storage. Save the internal for personal music and other media. I hope no one rocks less then that these days.
Plus if you use internal storage I can see certain scenarios popping up where they are boot looping and lost their access into the internal files. I can't mount using 3.1.0.1 external. If it werent for my SD I'd be stuck hardcore.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Good point however 5gb of internal space is not enough for me since I have 10gbs of music onmy sd card. I wish there was a way to have a switch function that will enable you to choose which sd crd to download to
Sent from my LG-P999 using Tapatalk
I've attached the CWM flashable .zip of the mod I've been running for awhile that will swap your SDcards. Never been able to get it to mount the external card as a folder inside /sdcard/. Didn't really want to release it until I did, but here ya go anyway
BTW, is it just me, or do init.d scripts not work in CM7?
This is for CyanogenMod only!
I don't have the volds from other builds on hand to mod them....
WOW! I come back from long day of work and find all this discussion.....awesome!! Thanks for chiming in guys. I def understand there will have to be at least 2 versions cause of CM, but as its a file, couldnt a simple app\script be created to swap it back and forth, after detecting CM or not? It may be a lil beyond my scripting knowledge, for the detection portion at least.
I see a ton of useful reasons for this switch, as the 5GB isnt the 13ishGB that the Galaxy S has and doesn't quite satisfy the requirements of a "primary" sdcard IMO. The 5GB would be useful as an "_InternalSD" folder bind\mount (whatever is being used), with the External SD as the main SD card. I'll list a few useful reasons why.....
Off the top of my head......
If your a serious gamer and you have a TON of games that have downloadable files put to the SD card, that 5GB will go quick (Gameloft I'm looking at you)
External SD can hold WAY more nandroid backups than Internal SD, and ROM Manager would recognize them (I acknowledge the external sd issue is not really an issue w/ the two ext4 recoveries)
hiko36 said:
Although I could see how you would think this would be in development, this post should actually go in Q&A.
That being said, this would be a very useful modification.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I humbly disagree.... If anything it would belong in the General or Development. It is a work towards development and there is no "question" being asked. Just because it isn't a ROM, doesn't make it any less important to work on the phone.
Just my .02
Hello all,
First of all I want to say thank you to all the devs that spend their time building & debugging these wonderful mods that I have been using over the years. THANKS!!
Now I understand, with ICS, there is a new type of file system that is more efficient in combining storage space for apps and data, but somehow messes with internal and external storage. I am not extremely familiar with details and that is the extent of my knowlege.
here is my issue: (if I suspect correctly this is because I dont have a micro sd card)
When I flash an ICS mod I am unable to take pictures, download anything, or perform any task that requires writing to internal storage. I have searched through the forums and found people with similar problems but I have not found a solution.
Any help would be greatly appreciated.
The only thing that is preventing me from going out and purchasing a micro sd card is my wheelchair (i was in a motorcycle accident recently).
Thanks!!!
You need to have a micro SD because the phones internal memory is not used the same way as in a stock LG rom. In order for your camera or apps to work correctly you need a micro SD card so it can save the information to it. The 8GB internal memory is not accessed at all, some roms may give you the option to save your pictures to the internal memory but it is not advised because that is where you Rom is stored, so if you get a corrupt file, your gonna get some unplesent results. You can purchase a micro SD card anywhere from $1-$30 online, ranging from 512mb-30gb, i suggest eBay, just make sure you buy from a reputable seller because there are many fake mislabeled micro SD cards on there. Gook Luck and Enjoy ICS
I wouldn't suggest eBay, too many scams, try Amazon also.
Sent from my LG-P999 using xda app-developers app
Amazon ftw, Ebay can be a bit too risky as far as finding a reputable seller