Database Info

HTC Touch Cruise is HERE

This is one fantastic XDA device. The one that nearly has it all.
Highlights at www.onthegosolutions.com
Greenland Meteor tsk credits to borealcool
(Just arrived this morning - Can't put it down yet)

A few more shots
That's enough for now

WOW it looks really cool, similar to Artemis
this is the direct link for more info
http://www.onthegosolutions.com/product.asp?itemMDL=HTC_CRUISE#

xplode said:
WOW it looks really cool, similar to Artemis
this is the direct link for more info
http://www.onthegosolutions.com/product.asp?itemMDL=HTC_CRUISE#
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Only by vague comparison. Specs and performance are most similar to Kaiser, without a sliding QWERTY. Size is only slightly larger than the ELF (Touch). It does resemble Artemis, but the specs and features are far superior.

Has it got a real hardware touchflo screen like the original Touch?
Or is it a software one like the Kaiser?
And is the screen transflective?
Thanks.

wywywywy said:
Has it got a real hardware touchflo screen like the original Touch?
Or is it a software one like the Kaiser?
And is the screen transflective?
Thanks.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
It has the real hardware screen. Actually, it is the same size screen as the original Touch, surrounded by 'black chrome' over the entire face. As for transreflective, I believe it is backlit like the origianl Touch. Side by side, the screen qualities are identical. If I find more information on this I will repost.

Can you please do me a massive massive favour and see whether it is readable under direct sunlight (like the TyTN/Hermes) or faded out (like the TyTN II/Kaiser)?
Thanks.

i think all of htc's new screens NOT transreflective

But if it was the same as the original Touch, then it would be, and that's what I am really hoping...

raskell said:
This is one fantastic XDA device. The one that nearly has it all.
Highlights at www.onthegosolutions.com
Greenland Meteor tsk credits to Swiftblade, et.al.., at the Touch Forum
(Just arrived this morning - Can't put it down yet)
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Hi,
Can we please get the HTC Debug Tools you got there? (Gps router, etc...)
Please upload it.
Dump the rom or somthing please.
Thanks,
Nadavi.

I am not sure I am getting this -- does it mean you actually already got one of your own? Where from? Expansys/mobileplanet pushed back the availability by another 10 days.

raskell said:
(Just arrived this morning - Can't put it down yet)
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Hi raskell, could you please take some standard pictures of it, i wonder to buy this phone, but i'm not sure how it looks, would like to see some real images (without photo shop improvements) of this new machine

http://www.coolsmartphone.com/article747.html
tested

just preordered this sucker, looks to be a good device

Nice1 but I like the Kaiser more

xmoo said:
Nice1 but I like the Kaiser more
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
aye, this is pretty much the same thing without the keyboard, which i don't need ;p just wish it had a vga/bigger/true colour screen

DeviceWire are saying that HTC have pushed back the launch until mid-late Dec. Devicewire expect to be shipping at the beginning of Jan. Does look a good phone, got it on pre-order, hope it doesn't disappoint!

can someone check about hardware accelerated directX on that device ?

qtek_metanol said:
Hi raskell, could you please take some standard pictures of it, i wonder to buy this phone, but i'm not sure how it looks, would like to see some real images (without photo shop improvements) of this new machine
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Here's some photos, just in case you're doubting if I really have the device.
As you can see the front face is 'black chrome' , actually mirror like. that's why photos are taken from oblique angles.
A standard SD card adapter is shown for size reference. The phone is sleek and trim, fits comfortably in the hand and in the pocket. I use a case for the Samsung BlackJack which fits it quite well.

wywywywy said:
Can you please do me a massive massive favour and see whether it is readable under direct sunlight (like the TyTN/Hermes) or faded out (like the TyTN II/Kaiser)?
Thanks.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Wy, you are in the UK, I am in Ohio. (I leved in Leeds for three years.) Chances of having a sunny day, in Ohio, in November is quite slim, as it is where you live. I did hold the device directly under a 60 watt spot light and it is still totally visible. My wife's original Touch is viewable in high sun.
Here it is side by side with the Sprint Touch. The actual LxW of the screens look identical.
(Photos taken with HTC Athena aka Dopod U1000)

O2 Orbit 2 - Silver, not black

I ordered and Orbit 2 online on Friday.
On Saturday I saw one in the flesh and was dissapointed that it basically has a silver mirror front, not a black one as it appears to have on the web.
Whilst this may seem trivial I think that the silver front makes it look a bit tacky and I have cancelled the order.
I am sure that pre-production models were black. Am I wrong? Are they different in Germany?
http://www.theunwired.net/?item=pho...-windows-mobile-6-professional-gps-smartphone
I am now waiting for the UK release of the LG KS20

rpbrown said:
I ordered and Orbit 2 online on Friday.
On Saturday I saw one in the flesh and was dissapointed that it basically has a silver mirror front, not a black one as it appears to have on the web.
Whilst this may seem trivial I think that the silver front makes it look a bit tacky and I have cancelled the order.
I am sure that pre-production models were black. Am I wrong? Are they different in Germany?
http://www.theunwired.net/?item=pho...-windows-mobile-6-professional-gps-smartphone
I am now waiting for the UK release of the LG KS20
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The silver mirror is right but, depending on the light, the Polaris looks black (nice effect. for sure !). When I've received my Polaris (HTC not a branded one), I was a bit disappointed. Finally the look is pretty cute like this.

academic said:
When I've received my Polaris (HTC not a branded one), I was a bit disappointed. Finally the look is pretty cute like this.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Me too. I have an unbranded one and the appearance really did put me off before buying it; I almost waited for the O2 release on the basis of the pictures.
When I did buy my Polaris I was originally a bit disappointed. People had said that in most lighting conditions the mirrored surround looks pretty black but that wasn't/isn't the way it looks to me. Having lived with it for a while though I've got used to it and it doesn't bug me at all. On the plus side I've never really seen it look as silver in real life as it does in some of the photos I've seen, it's more of a fairly discreet dark grey.
These are just my personal observations obviously and everyone will have their own views on this.
- Julian

Whilst I knew the "Cruise" was silver I had thought the Orbit 2 was black. Apparently not!

I was told that the LG KS20 is never coming to the UK.
I am disappointed too because I think the KS20 is the best looking WM6 phone so far.

wywywywy said:
I was told that the LG KS20 is never coming to the UK.
I am disappointed too because I think the KS20 is the best looking WM6 phone so far.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Seem the same for Switzerland..

wywywywy said:
I was told that the LG KS20 is never coming to the UK.
I am disappointed too because I think the KS20 is the best looking WM6 phone so far.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Same for Switzerland..

All pictures found on the web are misleading
I too fell for it - all the pictures I found on the web showed the device other than is really is - for example:
http://www.theunwired.net/?item=pho...-windows-mobile-6-professional-gps-smartphone
I ordered one, and while waiting - I saw one in a store and was very disappointed with the mirrored face - very distracting.
Unfortunately, all models are like this - no exceptions. They should use such deceptive photography (just do a search for Orbit2 on Google and you will see!)
I got the phone anyway, because there is no other phone right now on the market which offers what this one does (except the Kaiser II which is a bit thick)
Cheers -

wywywywy said:
I was told that the LG KS20 is never coming to the UK.
I am disappointed too because I think the KS20 is the best looking WM6 phone so far.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Oh no! Who told you that?
I have been holding out for months for a decent looking WM6 phone and after I have been dissapointed by the Orbit 2 my last chance was the KS20.
If this is not being released it means going right back to the drawing board!

rpbrown said:
Oh no! Who told you that?
I have been holding out for months for a decent looking WM6 phone and after I have been dissapointed by the Orbit 2 my last chance was the KS20.
If this is not being released it means going right back to the drawing board!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Function before form.
You get used to the silverish finish soon enough.

I'm so glad that Orbit 2 is not black. As I got the orginal HTC version, for which I liked the sharp edges type shape and scroll wheel with purple light ring in between (features not in Orbit 2), but only thing I was jealous about Orbit 2 was its total black colour in pictures. But as its silver mirror now, worse than original HTC's dark grey, I am satisfed with the original one, knowing that original one is the BEST .... .... cheeky!!!

rpbrown said:
Oh no! Who told you that?
I have been holding out for months for a decent looking WM6 phone and after I have been dissapointed by the Orbit 2 my last chance was the KS20.
If this is not being released it means going right back to the drawing board!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You know, I am thinking hard but I really can't remember who told me that.
But anyway it was released over 3 months ago in Europe, so if it could come to the UK it would have done so already.
The best thing about the KS20 is that you get proper drivers!!
(But lacks support from the XDA-Dev community obviously.)
And I really really really want a KS20 for its transflective screen.

The odd KS20 creeps onto ebay.
I was wanting to get one with a contract and have therefore held off.
I am not sure that the KS20 does not also have the driver issue. "the unwired" has done a review, as has GSM Arena and it might get mentioned there.

Thx, good feedback here!

lol, the silver finish was one of the main reasons I had to have this PDA, it's cool, I love it.

Trying to decide between the Touch cruise and Kaiser...

I did a list of downsides for each (only in relation to each other).
Downsides of Kaiser:
- relatively Big and heavy.
Downsides of Touch Cruise: (from more worse to less worse)
- No cheap version (like AT&T's TILT - $500 USD).
- Insensitive touch screen.
- Bad reception on Bluetooth.
- Mediocre build quality (loose volume control, etc.)
- No hardware keyboard (becomes a bigger problem if the touch screen is insensitive).
- Smaller xda community (might change in the future).
It seems like the choice should be easy, but I just don't know how easy it will be for me to live with a 200 gram brick in my pocket...

As a former kaiser and now a polaris owner, I can say:
The Polaris is cheaper than the kaiser
the touch screen works just fine (same as with the tilt)
community for polaris & kaiser is almost the same
the polaris has more & newer functionality (applies to original rom)

As a former kaiser and now a polaris owner, I can say:
The Polaris is cheaper than the kaiser
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
As I said, for the Kaiser there is the cheaper option of going with the AT&T TILT, which can be had NEW (with warranty) for $450-500 USD on ebay. The lowest price on ebay for which the Polaris can be bought is around $700 USD. That's a HUGE price difference, for two products which basically have similar functions and hardware.
the touch screen works just fine (same as with the tilt)
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I've read just too many posts from people with the Polaris saying the touch screen is insensitive. Are you saying it's a non issue and both the touch screen sensitivity of the Polaris is not worse than the Kaiser ? (it's important for me to hear it from someone who came from the Kaiser).

Noam23 said:
I did a list of downsides for each (only in relation to each other).
Downsides of Kaiser:
- relatively Big and heavy.
Downsides of Touch Cruise: (from more worse to less worse)
- No cheap version (like AT&T's TILT - $500 USD).
- Insensitive touch screen.
- Bad reception on Bluetooth.
- Mediocre build quality (loose volume control, etc.)
- No hardware keyboard (becomes a bigger problem if the touch screen is insensitive).
- Smaller xda community (might change in the future).
It seems like the choice should be easy, but I just don't know how easy it will be for me to live with a 200 gram brick in my pocket...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I had a kaiser for 1 month or 2 also then sold it because I realized I didn't use the hardware keyboard as much as I thought I did.
When I took the cruise out of the box I thought it was a fake phone because it is lighter then the kaiser (obviously) and my s730, hell, even lighter then my Motorola v60 I think! lol
Here was my mini list
Kaiser:
More mechanical components mean greater chances of something physically breaking/wearing down. I drop kaiser on the city bus, I am screwed!
jog wheel works fine, but it's a little loose sometimes too, like the cruise volume slider (this thing is almost useless at the moment unless I can "work it in")
The hard keys on the front are great, but on a lot of kaisers, they are loose. I had two kaisers, and both hard key face plates were loose. had to send the first one back because depending on how much the plate had slid, i couldn't go up or down with the d pad.
I really liked the touch keypad that i installed on the kaiser, but the buttons were harder to press with thumb in corners or a long the side cuz of the groove where the screen meets the casing.
Kaiser is around the same size, but just a lot thicker obviously.
Thoughts on the cruise so far;
Volume slider sucks ass, have to use my nail to move it. Luckily whatever i am listening to i can either use that REALLY cool dial pad/jog wheel thing. I set hat more than I used the kaiser jog wheel. Or I use my headset.
The screen is flush with the sides and tops of the casing, so hitting buttons on the corners or sides are no problem, but if you have a case then it's the same as having a kaiser.
About the insensitive screen. I have to agree with you on that somewhat. With the kaiser, it looks like what's there is just the screen. But with the cruise, it looks like the screen is underneath another layer of something. This is how we have the flush face with the cruise, there is something else over the screen that the kaiser does not(i don't think at last) have. sometimes if you press hard enough (which you shouldn't have to do ) you can feel your thumb hit the "second screen" (the actual lcd), not the thing that we actually touch on top). It's hard to explain clearly
I have sensitives on very high using kaisertweak and playing with reg keys. I've got it pretty close to sensitivity of kaiser now. I do notice with cube i have to press a little hard to OPEN it, but not left or right or close it. kind of weird.
It's true about the communities, it is a little small right now, but also I think tytn i had abig following so it's natural tytn II would now also. but again, cruise and tytn ii are pretty much the same inside.
I bought my cruise for 699 Canadian, new.
The radio is really cool too (amazing, for such a high tech modern device, something as old school as an FM radio is what really impresses me.. lol)
Another gripe so far about cruise is that i dont know if its the rom i am using, or if its all roms, or if it's the extra layer over the screen, is that when I am typing out a message, with ANY keyboard, but ONLY in the messaging application, i get no feedback from the keys. Nothing highlights if i press it quickly. The letter appears, which is great, but i don't see any of the keys being highlighted unless i hold onto it longer. This could be the rom id downloaded, but i tried on 2 roms I think, and it might have even been like this on the original rom too, I can't remember. I am still trying to figure it out. But visual key feedback is very important to me. I didn't have that problem with the touch keyboard installed on the kaiser. I think I'll do some more testing on that tonight actually.

A few other things.. haha, on a roll.
With the Kaiser.. I noticed that the way I hold it with one had, my pointing finger woudl ALWAYS land on the damn camera lens because the lens is on the top half of the casing the back. Pretty annoying to obsessively clean that lens. With the cruise, the main camera is in the middle, and my finger does not touch it
I do admit the Kaiser is nicer to actually hold because of the rounder corners and it's thickness. If fits in the hand better.
The cruise has more of a rectangular/pointy shape. It takes a little getting use to but I didn't really notice the difference until today. Also, depends on how you hold it i guess.

Kaiser (i've never owned one, although I have a Hermes)too thick....looks dated (very shallow statement..I know)
Polaris..I've never had a problem with the touch screen...barring ofcourse when you try to select a different SIP from the taskbar.
The PocketCM keyboard is one the best touch software around...very intellegent...I was never a texter..but with this keyboard I very rarely have to backtrack my typing...and in general touch software is only going to get better.
besides IMVPO I dont like thick pullout keypads....
Just my 2 pence worth...

briggs81,
Thank you for your words.
From what you say I think I'll go with the TILT. I simply can't justify paying $200 USD more for the cruise. If they were both at the same price, I would have taken the cruise with its faults, but the price difference is the last straw.
In the following year I'm sure lots of great devices wil come out, including probably HTC devices with proper video drivers. We should always be ready to upgrade, and I don't feel the cruise is such a good investment at this time (if you're on a budget, that is).

Screen insensitive??? Lol, with the right tweak the screen is to sensitive haha...mine is quick and very alert for touches.

Yzord said:
Screen insensitive??? Lol, with the right tweak the screen is to sensitive haha...mine is quick and very alert for touches.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Maybe on your device, and in your opinion. No point in laughing.

Don't know about everyone else, but my screen is extremely sensitive, it has never missed a tap EVER. FYI, I roll w/o a screen protector (they ruin the look too much imo but I always keep the phone in its suede case when not in use). BTW, Kaiser is really a brick compared to the Polaris, and the polaris is pretty much a one handed phone for me whereas the Kaiser is definitely not, furthermore as far as looks there is really no competition. However, if you need the keyboard Kaiser is clearly the only choice. I emphasize need, bc you will most likely find that you get along just fine with the onscreen touch keyboard.

briggs81 said:
Maybe on your device, and in your opinion. No point in laughing.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
No... this is true. There is not any touch-sensitivity problems with Polaris as it can easily (very easily) can be improved with some registry tweaks.

I own one of the first Touch Cruises (first one reported here in the Forum) and I also have a Kaiser for conducting an end-user custom ROM review. I am free to put my sim card in either device, but it always ends up in the Cruise. I have to force myself to keep the Kaiser active for any time over a few hours.
With the Kaiser custom ROM, I have all of the TouchFlo interface features as the Cruise. I have never perceived a problem with the screen sensitivity on the Cruise. To the contrary, I have more struggles with the Kaiser and most often, I find the landscape/portrait getting out of sync due to accidentally nudging the screen slider on then back off before the swap has time to apply. If you're bothered by the pointy corners on the Cruise, get the Orbit II but this is really only cosmetics. For me I have no issues with the volume slider on the Crusie. The scroll wheel is kind of free and easy, but for the limited number of times I've ever needed to use it, it works fine. I think you can tell which device I prefer. For me, even if it were $200-$250 less for the AT&T Tilt, I don't like it sitting side by side with the Cruise.

Indeed you can edit the registry setting for the sensitivity of the screen, although it is not needed (atleast for me).
I find it strange that you have to pay 200 dollars more for a cruise then a kaiser.
A kaiser here costs around 670 euro, the cruise costs about 500 euro
Also the pictures I am taking have far more better quality then on the kaiser.
Maybe my lense on the kaiser wasnt clean enough, i don't know.
But as said before here, the position of the camera is way better then on the kaiser. No more fears for dirty fingers on the lense
I switched from kaiser to touch cruise and until now i hadnt have one moment of regret

Damn it guys, you are making this decision harder for me
Regarding the screen of the touch cruise, how can you protect it if it's on the same plane with the sides of the device, I mean, how will the screen protector stay in one place and not move ?
I find it strange that you have to pay 200 dollars more for a cruise then a kaiser.
A kaiser here costs around 670 euro, the cruise costs about 500 euro
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
That's because you don't have the AT&T TILT version of the Kaiser in europe.

Regarding the screen of the touch cruise, how can you protect it if it's on the same plane with the sides of the device, I mean, how will the screen protector stay in one place and not move ?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The TC comes with a screen protector which sticks to the screen via adhesive (I haven't put it on though as I'm careful with the phone and keep it in its oem suede/microfiber case when I'm not on the phone).
BTW, I was actually in a position to get the ATT Tilt for just $100 after rebates and discounts...I still chose the Touch Cruise as its ridiculously better looking and a lot more usable for me as the flush screen paired w/Touch Flo allows for one handed usage (one-handed usage is key for me, esp as I'm a former Smartphone user).
FYI: I did pick up another smartphone from ATT to sell on eBay so that I could in a way subsidize the cost of the Polaris.

on tuch cruise screen sensitivity for finger, not for stylus. so its easy for finger & hard for stylus.

The TC comes with a screen protector which sticks to the screen via adhesive (I haven't put it on though as I'm careful with the phone and keep it in its oem suede/microfiber case when I'm not on the phone).
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
But can't it still catch a scratch from the stylus ?, is the screen of the touch cruise less prone to scratches ? (like the Iphone)
Also, using adhesive will destroy the look of the phone, no ?, and how will you take it off if you want without leaving residue ?
on tuch cruise screen sensitivity is for finger, not for stylus. so its easy for finger & hard for stylus.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Really, it will be easier using a stylus with the Kaiser than with the Cuise ?, a lot of software is still for stylus only...

I have never found a need for using a screen protector on any of my devices. As they have been passed down through my teenage sons, they too have learned proper care and use of the screens. With the Cruise, I definitely don't like to prospect of having a 'sticker' on the face if it. Just learn how to properly care for and use your screen and it will last.

I have never found a need for using a screen protector on any of my devices. As they have been passed down through my teenage sons, they too have learned proper care and use of the screens. With the Cruise, I definitely don't like to prospect of having a 'sticker' on the face if it. Just learn how to properly care for and use your screen and it will last.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I intend to put the phone in my jean's pocket (without anything else) with the screen toward the leg.
Could this thing cause a problem ?

alipi2007 said:
on tuch cruise screen sensitivity for finger, not for stylus. so its easy for finger & hard for stylus.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I don't have this issue, its easy for me to use my finger just as it is easy to use the stylus. Both require very little pressure. I did use a Kaiser in a shop once, and it actually required a lot of pressure (prob due screen protector they had installed on it).
I intend to put the phone in my jean's pocket (without anything else) with the screen toward the leg.
Could this thing cause a problem ?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I wouldn't think so.... but I would still use the oem suede/microfiber sheath, as its extremely thin and doesn't add to the bulk of the device, but protects it from lint, and any inadverdent scratches just in case something happens to already be in your pocket.
But can't it still catch a scratch from the stylus ?, is the screen of the touch cruise less prone to scratches ? (like the Iphone)
Also, using adhesive will destroy the look of the phone, no ?, and how will you take it off if you want without leaving residue ?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The screen seems very resistant to scratches from the stylus and the stylus glides across the screen without any resistance. In fact, you got me curious and I applied a moderate amount of strength to the stylus just to see and its still smooth as silk without any scratching.
As far as the adhesive from the screen protector, my guess is that this is a non-issue. I don't use screen protectors as they tend to look kind of cheap, but I'd imagine if it did leave any residue behind, it could be cleaned up fairly easily.

Get rid of the Orbit 2?

Ok... My Orbit 2 is annoying to the point where I want to put it under the wheel of a car.
The silver tacky-ness is flaking off, the rubber ring off the wheel has fallen off.
Then the screen showed nothing but black and white. After pressing lightly around the screen to see if it was a connection problem the screen cracked... (Yes, cracked while under the duty of a touch screen)
I've moaned at O2 about and they wanted to do a repair but I asked for a new handset via a courier swap (Team Leaders can authorise this).
Heard nothing back for months so I phoned again... same story "Yes it seems we authorised a courier swap but nothing happened, I'll organise a new one"
Again nothing happens...
Phone again today and they say it's out of stock so we'll have to check the status of this device and may offer you an upgrade... O2 haven't released an updated version yet. So I asked about the Stellar they said that may be a possibility.
So what do I do?
I don't want to keep the Orbit really as it is really pants.
The Stellar... Don't know that much about them but I know they are similar if not the same specs.
Or wait until they release the Diamond under their XDA name?
The Diamond I'm not keen on as it only has internal memory... 4Gb but using Windows Mobile 4Gb doesn't go that far.

Raphael Back Panels

I was looking at the Wiki that's been setup for the Raphael, and I noticed there are two "editions" of the Raphael. One of them has the diamondesque battery cover with all the angles, and the other seems to have a rounder, smoother panel.
Here's the link (The first post is has the pictures, Front and Back)
http://wiki.xda-developers.com/index.php?pagename=HTC_Raphael
Now, I REALLY like the Raphael. My brother's got one and I'll be getting one in a couple of weeks or so. BUT, I hate the back panel that I've seen on all the Raphaels todate, which is the Angular one.
This rounded cover appeals to me, but I haven't seen it anywhere else? Is this still an HTC Touch Pro? Is it an OEM version? Is it possible to buy that cover individually so I can replace a standard angular one?
Ciao
K

That looks like one of the rebrand back covers for the Diamond. I think the wiki author got it mixed up or something.
Its clearly a Diamond back cover because it has no place for a flash light.
Im guessing its a Tmobile styled rebrand because of the rounder top bottom and side.
But i do agree i prefer this smooth style of back plate over the diamondesc backplate.
Its a good bet that custom back panels will be developed at some point by a third party.

NutsyUK said:
Its clearly a Diamond back cover because it has no place for a flash light.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Damn good observation. I hadn't noticed that. So I can take solace in the fact that there's probably no lucky guy out there with a Touch Pro with that back panel, unless he exchanged it with a Diamond (I wonder if it would fit...).
NutsyUK said:
Its a good bet that custom back panels will be developed at some point by a third party.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Most probably too late to be of any real use, since the typically pouch life of a phone these days is 9 to 12 months max.

Eh yeah. It is a diamond panel.
Raphael says 3.2 megapixel
The other cover says 3.1

kishengajjar said:
Most probably too late to be of any real use, since the typically pouch life of a phone these days is 9 to 12 months max.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Speak for yourself im looking at a 18-24 month contract

NutsyUK said:
Speak for yourself im looking at a 18-24 month contract
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You'll be drooling over other phones in half that time

O2's Raphael in Germany (O2 Xda diamond pro) has a smooth back panel.. http://www.theunwired.net/index.php?item=photoview-hands-on-with-the-o2-xda-diamond-pro-windows-mobile-smartphone

Pete79 said:
O2's Raphael in Germany (O2 Xda diamond pro) has a smooth back panel.. http://www.theunwired.net/index.php?item=photoview-hands-on-with-the-o2-xda-diamond-pro-windows-mobile-smartphone
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Looks like the O2 Branded Raphael is going to have the smooth back panel, but it doesn't look as nice as the Diamond one.