Everywhere I go, I see the following message:
"... links removed due to legal complaint from Microsoft. ..."
They finally got P.Oed enough by the success of this forum and by the fact that you guys are doing everything they can't or won't.
Well, it's a sad day for us all :-(
In the hopes that this forum keeps on doing what it's doing, I say this.
Well done guys! keep on the good work !
And thank you for hearing my rants
I'm not sure why at all it would be considered the end of XDA-developers. Microsoft will still release wm6.5 no doubt so It is just matter of time until WM6.5 is released and then cooking on wm6.5 will start again. Just right now the movie is on pause
And WM 6.1 can continue to be tweaked to our heart's desire.
oh and I also happen to have b16b's WM6.5 if you want that....
I am sure it's a very credibly crafted hoax.
Of course Admins don't want any trouble or harrasement from anyone (certainly such mighty legal giants like Msoft) so they did what all of you would do - take a precautionary measures
Let'em sort it out.
Its just a temporary disturbance in the force far from end of xda LOL
And now I have utopykzebulon's v6 WM6.5 josh's WM6.5 also
"Is this the end of xda-developers?"
uhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh...no.
Not even close.
Same thing happened when wm6.1 was leaked.
/thread
dhob187 said:
Everywhere I go, I see the following message:
"... links removed due to legal complaint from Microsoft. ..."
They finally got P.Oed enough by the success of this forum and by the fact that you guys are doing everything they can't or won't.
Well, it's a sad day for us all :-(
In the hopes that this forum keeps on doing what it's doing, I say this.
Well done guys! keep on the good work !
And thank you for hearing my rants
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Just a hoax...
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=492791
This thread has been up for a couple of days now...
op, it's not even close to the end! xda will continue on rocking!!
Same thing happened when pre-released WM5.0 builds leaked on XDA-Dev a long time ago. The website lost all it's FTP files to Microsoft back then because of that and yet here it is, still up and running smoothly.
I have strong doubts that xda-dev will go down. Besides, it's not in the best of HTC or Microsoft's interests that they do so. A strong community like the one on xda-dev brings lots of advantages to them. For starters, there's the publicity that they're getting out of this, then there's the strong client base for their devices and OS for which one of the major reasons of purchase is Windows Mobile modability and the advantages this website brings in high-level customization of their own device. Which is what most users like to do: to get the most out of their hard-earned money. And last, but by no means least, there's also the potential feedback on their applications and OS that they can get from xda-dev which might help for future improvements. As for the leaks, i'm sure they really have nothing serious against them, as such leaks keep interest in devices alive. Of course, there are limits to this, as the boys need to keep their pre-release material safe and also incite interest in newer devices, but still... Backwards support is always good for PR.
I can remember when WM5 was in Beta, I added the fix to the Typhoon (orange c500 rom) shortly before it was taken off the FTP... my name is still on the "where has WM5 gone" text file on the root of the ftp those were the days eh?
think of it as a temporary set back... technically roms are no longer hosted on XDA anyways.
Hah, no way is it the end, the links should be back up soon after the admins fix this hoax stuff up. Seriously, the guy who sent the fraudulent emails is such an idiot!
rosebud said:
I can remember when WM5 was in Beta, I added the fix to the Typhoon (orange c500 rom) shortly before it was taken off the FTP... my name is still on the "where has WM5 gone" text file on the root of the ftp those were the days eh?
think of it as a temporary set back... technically roms are no longer hosted on XDA anyways.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
No, they're not. Again, since that little FTP incident. Those were the days...
dhob187 said:
Everywhere I go, I see the following message:
"... links removed due to legal complaint from Microsoft. ..."
They finally got P.Oed enough by the success of this forum and by the fact that you guys are doing everything they can't or won't.
Well, it's a sad day for us all :-(
In the hopes that this forum keeps on doing what it's doing, I say this.
Well done guys! keep on the good work !
And thank you for hearing my rants
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The end is on year 2012 my friend, LOL
And as somebody earlier mentioned this is a very strong WM community, here you can find som stats about xda-developers: http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=491608
Cheers
P.S. Be Positive
Might not be such a bad thing anyway
Even if there was an end in sight for xda-dev, another forum would spring up elsewhere to take its place. And that might not be such a bad thing...
xda-dev is one of the most hostile, unfriendly forums I frequent. Incredibly useful, with infinitely valuable resources, but senior members are often arrogant and intentionally unhelpful, and mods are heavy-handed, closing down threads unnecessarily at the drop of a hat.
Microsoft and HTC in good terms with xda?
There has recently been much anxiety in the Windows Mobile ROM cooking world over at XDA-Developers after the web site started receiving take down notices from some-one purporting to be from Microsoft. The practice of making updated firmware for older devices have always been borderline illegal, and the similar practice on the desktop (e.g placing a pirated copy of Windows Vista on a XP machine) would never have been tolerated.
It later turned out the take down notices were rather dubious in origin, and did not really conform to the format used by Microsoft. Tweakers.net, a Dutch web site, decided to take the bull by the horns and ask Microsoft and HTC directly what they thought of the situation.
Maarten Sonneveld, from Microsoft Netherlands was very clear. "What is happening there, adjusting ROMs is illegal. They go to get the intellectual property of others." He however, Pilate-like, absolved Microsoft from any responsibility to address the crime. "This intellectual property is not with us. The ROMs are owned by manufacturers or providers, if the branded versions. We supply only the OS."
That leaves the ball in HTC’s court. HTC however had no plans to squash one of the biggest selling points of their phones. "What happens there should not", says HTC Benelux director Mark Moons. "But XDA-Developers is the largest and most active community of Windows Mobile developers. We can not live with ‘em and we can not live without’ em."
The outcome of these statements is therefore than an uneasy truce exists, leaving XDA-Developers to continue their exploits in peace, but always with a gun pointed at their head if either Microsoft or HTC changes their minds. If this were to happen however it is likely that both would see a dramatic loss of market share, as many regulars who only buy HTC Smartphones, abandon the platform in droves.
We hope therefore, as is the case now, that cooler minds continue to prevail.
VIA: wmpoweruser.com
Related
Alright, there are a good 3-4 forums going about various JGUI products. There are a lot of bad notes about the bugginess and quality of his software.
So, just to drive home our disappointment (and so he can see), I'm running a poll...
1. who has paid and been screwed?
2. who has had to do a hard reset as a result of his software?
3. who has sent an email and never received a response?
I'll start.
1. NOT ME
2. ME
3. NOT ME
1. NOT ME
2. ME
3. ME
1. ME
2. ME
3. ME
Totally immature topic for this forum. I think enough has been said on the subject. People are aware of the situation and we don't need to talk about it forever.
This site used to be a place I looked forward to coming to. To help people or to be helped. That's hasn't really changed but it seems to me that recently there is a lot of *****ing going on.
The two of you, and other people, have already stated their opinion in this matter. You don't need to keep *****ing on about it.
Try to balance the "freedom of speach" and "Liable, Slander, Defamation"
http://www.seas.rochester.edu:8080/CNG/docs/Security/node30.html
This is freedom of speech!
And, no, it's not inappropriate as JGUI continues to use this board to SELL his software that is riddled with bugs, etc.
The purpose is to warn others of potentially damaging software that could force them to hard-reset their PDA's and lose information.
This is an information exchange and this is an attempt to consolodate complaints about multiple JGUI applications.
JGUI creates new threads when he's tired of seeing everyone's complaints. This way he can evade bad publicity with bad software--just create a new thread! (see below)
http://forum.xda-developers.com/viewtopic.php?t=8865&highlight=
http://forum.xda-developers.com/viewtopic.php?t=4073&highlight=
http://forum.xda-developers.com/viewtopic.php?t=9186&highlight=
http://forum.xda-developers.com/viewtopic.php?t=5169&highlight=
http://forum.xda-developers.com/viewtopic.php?t=8033&highlight=
http://forum.xda-developers.com/viewtopic.php?t=6977&highlight=
http://forum.xda-developers.com/viewtopic.php?t=9361&highlight=
http://forum.xda-developers.com/viewtopic.php?t=9361&highlight=
If you don't want to participate, then ignore the thread.
I tend to agree that if JGUI keeps trying to use this Forum to sell his software that he should expect others (who feel that they have a legitimate complaint) to make comments.
I've also had problem with his 'freeware' software, but didn't choose to air my opinions about it.
and as for ....
Try to balance the "freedom of speach" and "Liable, Slander, Defamation"
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
.... If people have a genuine complaint (and from the amount of 'abuse' that JGUI gets on this forum I would suggest that they do) then it isn't "Liable, Slander, Defamation" is it!!!!
Personally I find the threads denouncing JGUIs work quite amusing
No, This is a witch hunt
wiredup said:
And, no, it's not inappropriate as JGUI continues to use this board to SELL his software that is riddled with bugs, etc.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
How old are you? 13. Grow up. He's entitled to try sell whatever he wants, within the realms of the law. As he stated, people don't HAVE to buy. There are time limited demos to try. I'm not sticking up for his actions, and I don't agree with releasing software unless it is properly tested. But it's best practise to back up any computer on a regular basis. This includes Pocket PC's. And yes, software that is installed on any computer could have detrimental results but that's the risk you take from an unknown supplier without doing your research.
wiredup said:
The purpose is to warn others of potentially damaging software that could force them to hard-reset their PDA's and lose information.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
People have been warned already in different threads. From what I can see, you are not warning people, you are just bad mouthing him. I see this thread as a witch hunt, nothing more.
wiredup said:
JGUI creates new threads when he's tired of seeing everyone's complaints. Just look on the main page and you'll see at least 3.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
That's his prerogative.
wiredup said:
If you don't want to participate, then ignore the thread.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I dunno. Maybe I will partcipate. Someone has to keep a level head. Sure, consider me in the discussion and I'll cast my vote.
1. NOT ME
2. NOT ME
3. NOT ME
come on now
If you clicked on the title of this post, you can't really be complaining how it's childish. The title is a very good description of what you'll find, and it's nothing that you shouldn't be expecting.
For the uptight morons that really take this guy's software and some mishap seriously it's a good place to vent, and to me it's FUNNY.
Especially since really early on in the whole debacle the guy had lectured me about his success in software development
:lol:
In sweden this is very common tactics in forums, it´s called "spy galla".
Like, "puking bile" in english
And it´s really sickening and childish behavior indeed.
But, complaining about the persons behaving likethis, is doing the exact same thing as they are doing. So, without a proper dialog, a thread is as good as closed. And if it not close, the level of the thread will go slo low that the substance is just rediculous! And that lowers the standard of the whole forum!
So i´d vote for this thread closed, as it is already clear that JGUI makes bad programs with alot of bugs, and don´t care about fixing them.
Altough, i REALLY SINCERELY don´t like that he is trying to SELL his softer in here! There is already TO many sites trying to sell people software, and this is not the place. Imagine every developer doing the same thing. It would RUIN this forum completely!
i am also "automatic hard reset victim" of my|phone 1.4 and i fully agree to all the claiming about jguis software. anyway i think it is a fact that the level of this forums discussion gets lowered by threads like this. so i would suggest the following to webmaster(s):
1. please close duplicate claiming threads (on the same subject)
2. bann any kind of advertising into a special section of this forum. this should be the only place where commercial messages are allowed.
issue 2. should prevent that people spreading commercials all over the forum and annoying users which would result in making the leave the forum -> that means end of the forum. wouldn't be the first time happening and it really would be a shame.
so long
peter altherr
1. NOT ME
2. NOT ME
3. NOT ME
havent really used anything from him apart from that free cellphone thingy which at times reported a signal str of 105%
so i cant comment too much but i do feel that there are issues within
wm2003 itself which people at times get and if they dont know better they blame the last software they put on
thinking "i installed X program and now i'm missing Y on my today screen"
this is a wm2003 thing not a 3th party software thing
and freezing devices they dont have to be 3th party software related
wm2003 is perfectly cable of freezing itself
Hm, hm, hm... before we make that a discussion about childish behavior I like to re-focus on what would need to be the content.
JGUI develops commercial software for PocketPC.
In several cases people buying his products ended up with significant problems - me being one of them about 2 years ago. (long enough to calm my temptation, bur present enough to understand what people are complaining about )
Attempts of JGUI to deliver corrected versions failed or even lead to additional problems.
There is two ways to look at this:
Firstly users need to understand that it is better for them to use a demo version before purchasing a product. Gee, nobody buys a car without testdriving it... is the small price of a PocketPC program justification to miss out on a demo version? If so, the only thing you complain about is your own carelessness :shock:
Especially inexperienced and new PocketPC expect the same level of quality from a software product that they get when buying Office for their desktop computer. There is education required to reset expectations - in writing like in a thret like this and / or in wasted payments.
And I like to add a thing: I'm surprised that some here brand the complaints as childish but not the way how the forum is being misused by JGUI. I would think it's just fair to stop JGUI advertising here in the first place...
Conclusions:
1. Stop Jgui´s advertisement.
2. Lock this thread.
I got 115% :? So I got a clear understanding of how proffesional the program was -and uninstalled.
havent really used anything from him apart from that free cellphone thingy which at times reported a signal str of 105%
so i cant comment too much but i do feel that there are issues within
wm2003 itself which people at times get and if they dont know better they blame the last software they put on
thinking "i installed X program and now i'm missing Y on my today screen"
this is a wm2003 thing not a 3th party software thing
and freezing devices they dont have to be 3th party software related
wm2003 is perfectly cable of freezing itself [/quote]
Web fora piss me off
I’m *so* sorry, but apparently I need to make 8 nōnsense postings here before I am allowed to REPLY TO A THREAD I HAVE ALREADY POSTED TO in a development forum to answer a user’s question about my software (WTF?!). Two – oh the joy, can’t even _do_ that, why oh why can’t you guys just use a mailing list… I hate web fora.
I have zero interest in _using_ xda myself (except maybe on a device at work…), but I develop for Android occasionally (the system leven, below Java™), so I do not know AT ALL what to do in the non-developer part. And I don’t want to ask a question even, but provide an authoritative answer… believe me I’m qualified enough.
Recently, someone in this thread http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=320018 said that we are all (with a few exceptions) running a pirated OS by installing WM6 on our Wizards. I am not sure that I agree or disagree with that. Please keep your comments focused on the technical aspects of why you think we are or are not pirates.
We are all pirates (As I say besides Ingenetics and any others who officially had the rom loaded by M$).
If you purchase Windows 2000 for example, that does not give you the right to run a pirated version of XP just because you have already purchased one OS version.
Our devices came with WM5 and WM5 is all we are allowed to run in a legal sense.
Im a pirate and I love it
Why not use the original thread that addressed this?
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=319706&highlight=wm6+illegal
I did see that thread, but wanted to set it up as a poll so that people could vote without leaving a comment if they didn't want to.
So, I ask,
If Cingular chooses not to release WM6 that M$ gave them for free allowing them to release it for free to customers, where do I get it? Oh, I have to buy a new $400 device... Hmm...
Yes, that's one of the points that bothers me too. If it's freely given away, then how can it be stealing?
Well, it is a gray area. I do not think that I am wrong from the point of view of my consience (since I have no other possibility - there is no "legal" WM 6 for Wizard).
But - according to the copyrights laws, the above mentioned does not matter... It is a piracy.
There is a similar problem with "abandonware" (when old programs/games are not sold/not available, it is still not legal to use them unless the copyright owner explicitly allows it)...
I do not have any problems with this and I think nobody loses here (I am now a big fan of Windows Mobile and I cannot imagine to buy a mobile phone with another system - I am lost for Symbian/Linux...), but it does not change anything from the legal point of view... It is a piracy.
@mdhensley5: I think it was you who was having problems with version number in WHITERAT's build... Well, unlike that (rather artificall) problem, this is something which is certainly not correct... (sorry, I could not help myself).
Mirek
Hey Mirek, thanks for the comments about the piracy question, but like I said at the beginning, let's keep all comments directed toward the technical aspects of whether or not this is piracy.
Well, It's one of those thigns that could be construed to be piracy if you want to stick to the exact letter of the law. But as was stated earlier there is no WM6 official rom for sale for the Wizard. If there were im sure most of us would buy it. I suppose it's if you want to live by the letter of the law or the spirit of the law. If HTC wants to offer a core rom for purchase that is modifyable to the point as all the current roms then i'll buy it. Until then im running what ive got.
Shane
If mobile carriers have it and can give it away free but they don't only to coerce customers to buy a new device they don't need, is that extortion?
Hmm....
If the company that developed it says it’s free, but they just don’t give a means to get it, then you just have to get it yourself.
hahahaha
like you DIDN'T know you were using hacked M$ code..if you didn't know that you shouldn't be using it anyways in my opinion.
Of course it's pirated, i'm sure even the new members remember M$ was all over this site for a few weeks making sure we didn't release their beans without paying (M$ stingy as apple with copyrights)
Whiterat is right, we're all pirates, I will never, never ever ever purchase another piece of software as I live!
wtf wait up
mdhensley5 said:
Recently, someone said that we are all (with a few exceptions) running a pirated OS by installing WM6 on our Wizards. I am not sure that I agree or disagree with that. Please keep your comments focused on the technical aspects of why you think we are or are not pirates.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
and hey you're the jesus freak that was bashing 'ole boy for a build number...something so pety hahaha so how can you possibly use a pirated OS of ANYTHING?! You just made your baby jesus cry.
BA_Flash_GOD said:
and hey you're the jesus freak that was bashing 'ole boy for a build number...something so pety hahaha so how can you possibly use a pirated OS of ANYTHING?! You just made your baby jesus cry.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
BA_Flash_GOD,
That's out of line, lets not personally attack each other.
is this a technical question? please abide by the forum rules.
this forum is turning lame.
boldfacelies said:
is this a technical question? please abide by the forum rules.
this forum is turning lame.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Now that you say that, I agree!
Lets discuss HTC Wizard techical issues.
calouro said:
BA_Flash_GOD,
That's out of line, lets not personally attack each other, but voice our opinion on the issue at hand.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
It was no personal attack. It's a factual statement. Got upset for something that small, how can one possibly use stolen code? It is Fact, it's actually HIGHLY illegal. Ask your service providers see what they say.
Anyone is breaking the law here using this, that is out of line haha.. I'm guessing M$ just said oh well they have franken-roms and let it be.
calouro said:
If mobile carriers have it and can give it away free but they don't only to coerce customers to buy a new device they don't need, is that extortion?
Hmm....
If the company that developed it says it’s free, but they just don’t give a means to get it, then you just have to get it yourself.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
This is nothing new mobile phone providers are not the only ones that do this hahah.. the whole world runs this way.
It's amazing to me that some people can't discuss something without resorting to name calling and personal attacks.
Poor form Admin
mdhensley5 said:
It's amazing to me that some people can't discuss something without resorting to name calling and personal attacks.
Cingular 8125 G4 Locked
OS - NBD 7.9 Touch
"This is a tech forum, keep your religious feelings elsewhere." - added by unamed Admin
Admin, do you feel like a big man now after changing my signature?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Hmm...
Hey Admin, ye must be working on changing Samy.3660's signature!
"Prophet (pbuh) said: Be in this world as if you are a stranger or traveller.
If you are interested in religion come here www.gawaher.com/"
I only say this matey, because what's good for one is good for another.
Mdhensley5 did not mention religion, only his opinion and thoughts; he only had a quote in his signature block, just like everyone else. If you censor mdhensley5, you have to censor everyone.
So, keeping to your current form, I expect Samy.3660 signature block to be changed.
Thanks for pointing that out, Captain Jack.
BA_Flash_GOD said:
and hey you're the jesus freak that was bashing 'ole boy for a build number...something so pety hahaha so how can you possibly use a pirated OS of ANYTHING?! You just made your baby jesus cry.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I'm not religous but comments like yours would quickly make me side with him over just about anything against you. Grow up.
i mean, everything on this site is pretty much microsoft, which should create some copyright issues.
they are just happy to find a place where winmo doesn't get bashed constantly
duude said:
i mean, everything on this site is pretty much microsoft, which should create some copyright issues.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
LOL, your first post and you have a pop at this site?
You dont work for MS do you
GREAT first post.
anyway.
They tolerate it because we don't personally host anything and yes, we do make windows mobile better.
Also, this site actively opposes software theft, (warez and others like it,) which is the bulk of any copyright problems. It spreads goodwill towards Microsoft, believe it or not; if users have problems with standard Microsoft software, they don't have to just sit there and be unhappy, it can be tweaked. By doing so, people are happier with their Microsoft-driven equipment, and more likely to keep using it than changing to something else. There are countless people on this site who would tell you that without this site, they might not be using a Windows-driven phone.
It is also free tech-support for Microsoft, which saves them loads of money.
LOL duude...are u an attorney or do u own an iphone?
m$ knows better to keep this site alive. its their faults we are tweakin up and makin it better. beside...you never know...this draws a lot and i mean a lot of ppl towards m$. so i m pretty much sure the revenue keeps em' happy
yesod7 said:
There are countless people on this site who would tell you that without this site, they might not be using a Windows-driven phone
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
One here!!!
microsoft never sold wm to any end user
and this site never taken part in porting wm to a device that dident came with it
more because of the close to impossibility of doing so
so as ms still get their licensense from the manufactors
and better rep with users who can get more out of their devices then just
depending on what the manfucators give before they forget about older devices
and move on to their new stuff
more wm phone owners keep getting new wm devices rather then moving to iphones or symbian devices so
it helps ms out alot in their quest of getting a larger % of the market
Plus, along with the free tech ehlp, the improving of current phones, we all know new htc phones will be tweaked cooked and stuff, so buy another phone. so XDA not only saves tehm money, but actually gains them money
It's because of this site that I'm looking at the Windows Mobile platform for my next phone rather than traditional Nokia, Sony Ericsson (other than x1), or even the iPhone..... actually come to think of it, without the exisitence of this site EVER, I would get an iPhone 3G right away.
you will see that in the coming future microsoft will be incorporating programs and devs that were created through this site to their platform. There was once a time when microsoft tried to shut it down when they realised that the site actually brings more people to microsoft and keeps them there.
LOL! I was going to post something else, but I'm pretty sure everybody has already said it, or thinks it! To much good comes from this site! Think about it, how many users of this site are now WM users for good and will always be sold on the next best WM platform because of this site.
yesod7 said:
Also, this site actively opposes software theft, (warez and others like it,) which is the bulk of any copyright problems. It spreads goodwill towards Microsoft, believe it or not; if users have problems with standard Microsoft software, they don't have to just sit there and be unhappy, it can be tweaked. By doing so, people are happier with their Microsoft-driven equipment, and more likely to keep using it than changing to something else. There are countless people on this site who would tell you that without this site, they might not be using a Windows-driven phone.
It is also free tech-support for Microsoft, which saves them loads of money.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yup, that's it.
TheChampJT said:
LOL! I was going to post something else, but I'm pretty sure everybody has already said it, or thinks it! To much good comes from this site! Think about it, how many users of this site are now WM users for good and will always be sold on the next best WM platform because of this site.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Amen to that!
Why haven't they done anything?
because nobody there is smoking crack
Would you close down a site that gets people talking about your products ? that is full of people writing programs that enhances the usability of your products? that's a great place to see some ideas you might steal for later versions of your OS.
This is free R&D!
duude said:
i mean, everything on this site is pretty much microsoft, which should create some copyright issues.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Alas, I saw this differently with others. I think the question is very out of topic since this is an All-HTC-Devices forum, not an M$ WM forum. It's only 'coincidence' that after these years, HTC always used WM as their OS.
If HTC decided in the future that they will build their own OS, or maybe use Android, then it may trigger M$ to reconsider its stance against this forum. Especially, when we -as always- try to improve our experience with the devices, do it by porting some parts (drivers/softwares) from WM to other OS, or vice versa. Then the issue may be valid.
Btw, I don't know but do you all think it's safe -legally and/or morally- to port other vendor/ODM's part (drivers/softwares/etc) into our HTC devices? I ask this because I saw many attempts already...
I don't know the exact number of people on this site, but I do know that there are a whole lot of people on this site. My point for that last sectence is "would you destroy a site that has FREE workers helping your company out to better there products and gain more money"
Yes, we might receive applications before they are release, but honestly where do you really think we receive those from uuuummmm?
So again, if I was a big company I would never touch this site because I will pass my software to this site let eveyone play with it and then I would know where all the bugs are at. So then I will fix it and then sale it.
There might be alot of poeple on this site but I think MS has a lot more customers that don't even know that this site is even alive.
There you go my 2 cents.
gsessons said:
I don't know the exact number of people on this site, but I do know that there are a whole lot of people on this site. My point for that last sectence is "would you destroy a site that has FREE workers helping your company out to better there products and gain more money"
Yes, we might receive applications before they are release, but honestly where do you really think we receive those from uuuummmm?
So again, if I was a big company I would never touch this site because I will pass my software to this site let eveyone play with it and then I would know where all the bugs are at. So then I will fix it and then sale it.
There might be alot of poeple on this site but I think MS has a lot more customers that don't even know that this site is even alive.
There you go my 2 cents.
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and if the truth be known, they (M$) are happy that the masses dont know., in truth, the people on this site contain more knowledge and expertise than all of m$ combined as far as HTC handsets are concerned and how to tweak and tune the software to ACTUALLY work. it could be perceived as (truth) the Big companies are just mass clearing houses of useless data they can sell for a profit. how many of us came here for the first time only looking for useable software programs? how many of us came here for the first time trying to find a solution to an OEM problem?
M$ has found a truly unique forum in the world of r&d., although probably more out of frustration than than anything else, the majority of talented people here could teach this stuff to most of the employees at m$ about these devices and how they work and why.
I would be very surprised if they didnt have a staff of several people working there monitoring and testing to roms and software packages developed or tweaked through this site. they would have to be unbelieveably arrogant to think this is a bad thing for business, and we all know who one of the richest men and companies in the world is dont we. he didnt just fall off the truck so to speak, he understands..............economics!
With all of that in mind can anyone understand why pocket development is not possible on Visual studio express editions (free).
Isn't that a shoot on the foot? I think so.
I think that a platform with a lot of developers is much more appeling, and then seel more. Only a opinion from someone that will never buy a iphone.
I was wondering if anyone knows a real answer for this. How easy would it be to cook in something that would send back your email login and password? Or other logins to stuff like banking sites. The people who make the roms seem to be hard working enthusiasts, but it still makes me nervous.
The reason I am asking this is because WM6.1 seems pretty buggy and slow and I was hoping that maybe updating to 6.5 would help, however Sprint is being super slow and vague (as usual) about if they will ever release an official rom.
And please no "then just don't use custom roms" replies. I am just hoping someone has some way to show that they are safe and then I will happily use it!
I was wondering the same thing. I don't use any cooked rom for anything banking related for this possible risk.
I know there are other threads that have the answer but can't find them maybe someone hid them?
Anyway what would the average chef gain, second of all how do you know a member of Opera or IE is not taking down your details or even Bill? "by that i mean there is more to worry about"
My point being chefs cook ROMs to give users better phones than stocks... Also the world of WM isn't laden with virus's/spyware so even doing so would be hard and no one would be bothered to spend there time considering how much time cooking consumes.
Just Hard-SPL your device and start flashing
I find cooked roms are the best! They are tweeked, customized, optimized, flexable, etc. Happy Flashing
Im still leary. Im going to wait until you all flash...then i will know its safe
If any chef here did anything as dumb as that, I guarantee you everyone would know in VERY short order what was done, and that chef would be hung up by his ankles and verbally flogged by everyone here.
Trust me, it's never happened here, and it's not GOING to happen; because we have a great community here with great chefs who do nothing but make life better for everyone else. Choose a ROM, flash it, and quit being so paranoid.
FloatingFatMan said:
If any chef here did anything as dumb as that, I guarantee you everyone would know in VERY short order what was done, and that chef would be hung up by his ankles and verbally flogged by everyone here.
Trust me, it's never happened here, and it's not GOING to happen; because we have a great community here with great chefs who do nothing but make life better for everyone else. Choose a ROM, flash it, and quit being so paranoid.
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That is a very argumentative answer to a very simple and valid concern that allwires has regarding the security of using cooked rom's. Some people that use these rom's like to use their device's web capabilities for banking and for storing personal information and he brings up a very valid question regarding the safety of using these rom's for these purposes. Then you insult the poster by saying he or she is being paranoid when we all know that the capabilities for wrong doing via viruses and other malicious software are very valid concerns in this day and age. I would like to hear an intelligent and informative answer to this question since I'm sure as this sort of thing becomes more mainstream as it is bound through time to become there will be many more inquiries made as to the safety of their usage.
I'm with FloatingFatMan here, any cook daft enough to do such a thing to a ROM would very quickly be found by his peers, tried, convicted and summarily thrown to the lions.
For all that how do we know Messrs Gates, Jobs, well their minions anyway , and other sundry "professional" ROM cooks are not hiding sneaky payloads in?
deedee said:
I'm with FloatingFatMan here, any cook daft enough to do such a thing to a ROM would very quickly be found by his peers, tried, convicted and summarily thrown to the lions.
For all that how do we know Messrs Gates, Jobs, well their minions anyway , and other sundry "professional" ROM cooks are not hiding sneaky payloads in?
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Well, but you see that is my point exactly. Whether it is the big guy or the small guy doing it history has shown that where there is a will there is a way, especially when there is a profit to be made. Its like when Norton got busted for spyware found in their AV software in the early 2000's, remember that? I just wonder if such an attempt will be made with this newly emerging technology that is similar to the PC of the late 90's and the early 2000's, vulnerable. No one is offering (at least no one that I'm aware of) AV or firewall software for these various mobile OS's and I think that it is only a matter of time before the bad guys find a way to take advantage of these opportunities the same way they did the PC. Al least over time there became ways to detect these types of illegal practices with firewall software and packet capture software that made the average user capable of some control over his or her personal data.
qqa92 said:
Well, but you see that is my point exactly. Whether it is the big guy or the small guy doing it history has shown that where there is a will there is a way, especially when there is a profit to be made. Its like when Norton got busted for spyware found in their AV software in the early 2000's, remember that? I just wonder if such an attempt will be made with this newly emerging technology that is similar to the PC of the late 90's and the early 2000's, vulnerable. No one is offering (at least no one that I'm aware of) AV or firewall software for these various mobile OS's and I think that it is only a matter of time before the bad guys find a way to take advantage of these opportunities the same way they did the PC. Al least over time there became ways to detect these types of illegal practices with firewall software and packet capture software that made the average user capable of some control over his or her personal data.
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Hey There,
Not wanting to be unkind but i think you are being very paranoid here and btw, you can indeed purchase AV software for mobile devices; youve only gotta google AV software for windows mobile to see that
The limited OS and how its written means the "baddies" would have nothing to gain/find it difficult to exploit so whats the point.
The only "virus" (and i use the term loosely) i ever came across actually asked you "do you want to install blah blah blah" to which the obvious answer was no.............oooo that was dangerous
To summerise, dont get your knickers in a twist about it and enjoy!
^^ And to add to Tim's comments. Just make sure you get your cooked ROM from an established chef if you're worried, and there won't be any problems.
Now, if the ROM was from someone with a tiny postcount and wasn't known, then you might have cause to think twice; but that's not going to happen here...
timmymarsh said:
Hey There,
Not wanting to be unkind but i think you are being very paranoid here and btw, you can indeed purchase AV software for mobile devices; youve only gotta google AV software for windows mobile to see that
The limited OS and how its written means the "baddies" would have nothing to gain/find it difficult to exploit so whats the point.
The only "virus" (and i use the term loosely) i ever came across actually asked you "do you want to install blah blah blah" to which the obvious answer was no.............oooo that was dangerous
To summerise, dont get your knickers in a twist about it and enjoy!
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Well then why not let the cat out of the bag. I'm just in here to see if I can get a large portion of the members in here's knickers in a twist so that they will all go out and buy my mobile AV since mine is the biggest one out there currently. Lots of potential there, in terms of cha-ching you have to agree. LOL!
There's also the option of downloading a kitchen and cooking your own ROM ... this method permits you to look at each package in detail.
Cheers,
I once opened my yahoo on a cooked room, later on I was trying to log on on my laptop and password was rejected. I freaked out and kept trying, later that day I was able to log in after few hours for some unknown reason...
I stopped using my HTC fuze for emails since.
The myth that ALL cooked ROMs in here are completely clean sounds like an old familiar story of when the young man said to the girl "don't worry it will not hurt a bit" lol
I wish there was a tool that scans for such security gaps in a ROM
I'm not sure what your reasoningn was to stop using email on the phone because of a failure to login to yahoo from a laptop. Did you notice any malicious activity on your yahoo account? Have you since? Have you changed that password? Just seems strange.
As for the security of cooked ROMS, I've never used one but I have a new phone coming and I'm going to try one from a reputable party here. I'm not nervous about it and I use online banking all the time. Here is why I am not concerned:
1.) As several people pointed out already, your PC is more vulnerable just because of sheer numbers. WinMo has a small market share and cooked ROMs would represent an even smaller market share. Even then, there are many custom ROMs to choose from. Then if EVERY user of a specific tainted ROM used their online banking on their phones, there is still little they could actually do with that information. For example, chase uses text messaging which means yes, someone could get my balance and stuff, but I actually have to login to the site to authorize my phone rather than login through the phone. So the information itself may or may not be useful. At the end of the day, it just wouldn't make the chef much money since there would simply be too few potential victims.
2.) The liklihood is very high that the perp would be caught by their peers and exposed in order to 1 - protect their own integrity, and 2 - get bonus points for being the one who exposed the bad guy (or girl). When you add this level of risk to the low reward, it just doesn't make sense. High risk, lots of work, little reward.
3.) Then of course, if someone fraudulently accesses your account, you can usually get that money back.
So I'm perfectly comfortable froma security standpoint. It's the stability standpoint I'm a bit concerned about but that's why I'm waiting till I get my new phone to try one out so I can go back to my old phone if it all craps out.
RedScorpion78 said:
I once opened my yahoo on a cooked room, later on I was trying to log on on my laptop and password was rejected. I freaked out and kept trying, later that day I was able to log in after few hours for some unknown reason...
I stopped using my HTC fuze for emails since.
The myth that ALL cooked ROMs in here are completely clean sounds like an old familiar story of when the young man said to the girl "don't worry it will not hurt a bit" lol
I wish there was a tool that scans for such security gaps in a ROM
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I was thinking the same thing and how much it would cost to have Lavasoft or AVG or Symantec evaluate ROMs as an impartial third party.
If anybody is thinking peer review would snuff out cheaters there are plenty cases where Ebay and Craigslist deals go bad and everybody is in on it - even (inadvertently) the local police authority that doesn't have the technical knowhow to deal with a cyber-based threat.
startluvova said:
I was thinking the same thing and how much it would cost to have Lavasoft or AVG or Symantec evaluate ROMs as an impartial third party.
If anybody is thinking peer review would snuff out cheaters there are plenty cases where Ebay and Craigslist deals go bad and everybody is in on it - even (inadvertently) the local police authority that doesn't have the technical knowhow to deal with a cyber-based threat.
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Hey there,
Way to go to ressurect an old thread
Nothing has changed, i have never heard of seen of a custom rom that has a virus cooked in, or one that has been intentionally created to spy on the user.
That said, i guess you have to make your own decision after reading the comments from some experienced chefs/flashers here
CHeers.
If permitted may we ask why is so many chefs leaving?
care to be a bit more specific?
I can think of one reason.
$$$.
Maybe site like you knw whichone (htc pe*di*.com)
site might require them to have exclusive agreement with them.
In return they get some cut from sites revenue.
supersanj said:
care to be a bit more specific?
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itj, miri, hellonasty ......
jimk68 said:
If permitted may we ask why is so many chefs leaving?
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It is the App Store effect. It is really hard to put hours and hours, weeks and weeks of work into a rom or an app, then watch 3000 people download and use it, only to have 30 people actually press your donation button.
It is especially hard when you read things like this and realize the possibilities outside this " donation only " generating forum.
jimk68 said:
itj, miri, hellonasty ......
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duttythroy, freyberry, both from HD2 section in last couple of days..
I may only be a visitor most of the time, but I'm looking elsewhere too.
Threads are full of ego. totally off the original topic mostly and just one-upmanship.
It's just not friendly any more.
The number of people visiting this site has made it what it is and gained it no end of publicity and there is no question that there are some great people coming here and sharing their knowledge.
However I feel it has moved from a "community" spirit of mutual help to one of it being the roughest pub in town.
I really hope they can get their house in order. Threading with ranked comments perhaps?
I'm sure there are admins on here who know that change gotta come.
Chefs have their own life out XDA, they come and go.
I don´t think Chefs are leaving
orb3000 said:
Chefs have their own life out XDA, they come and go.
I don´t think Chefs are leaving
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They are, they have said, all moving to another site but won't give a reason as if they're not allowed... not even allowed to post their ROMs here or support them here.
Wow!!
I was out from XDA and now knowing this bad news
I wonder why is this happening?
If anyone can tell the story...
Hope not all leave...
Yes i have also heard this. Many are saying that htcxxxxx.com is paying them to move on to their site and in a agreement that they should post their roms in their site only that is upload to their site only forever!!
jagan2 said:
Yes i have also heard this. Many are saying that htcxxxxx.com is paying them to move on to their site and in a agreement that they should post their roms in their site only that is upload to their site only forever!!
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True........?
It could be true.
It started with udK I think.
[ElCondor] said:
It could be true.
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Good chefs have definitely said they'll be leaving in the last couple of days, leaving for another site, with no real reason (that they are able to give). I'm sure we'll see a lot more go in the next week.
I'm concerned people like monx who seem to be able to get hold of unofficial WM ROMs before anyone else will hold them and keep them for just people on the other site. This is all very bad for XDA.
I think our lost, that site never ask for anything other then register and download, always ask to refer back here. So many top chefs
Cheers
They'll probably buy out all chefs here, and when they're done, they sell the roms on HTCpedia.
The chefs will get paid in that way, and HTCPedia will make a lot of profit.
I am making my own ROMs, if everyone leaves, I'll publish them here.
Money....money.......money.........money..........
And don't think for one second, it is not all about money !!!!!!!
Xda as a web site is valued at close to a million dollars, some estimates over a million. What is XDA intrinsically ? A bunch of servers in a leased office in Amsterdam, with a hand full of administrators.
The true value is in the knowledge base of it's members, App developers and rom chefs. Like any other business, the " employees " see the " boss " making all this money from their knowledge and hard work, and say " hey , we can do this for ourselves and make all the money instead of them. "
A couple of chefs get together at HTCpedia and start to develop their own site, based on their own knowledge and their own cooked roms. They get some advertisers and some members and traffic. It turns things from, one chef deciding to list his work on his own site for convenience and control ( like sakajati did over at the Kaiser forum, or MobileMatt did with his great themes ) to competing businesses.
The chefs try to bolster their traffic by providing links in their rom threads here, ( something that has always been acceptable ) egos clash , accusations about stealing business, the fine line between personal links and advertising. Basically children with their toys try to carve out their own area's of the playground.
Money.....money......money...... and as with Apple vs HTC, who i going to be the big loser in this battle ? Does it matter to you where you download your roms ? If you donate to a chef here or over there, does it change your rom flashing experience ? Or could you care less about this petty squabbling and just wish everyone would just grow up.
As far as paying people to list roms on a certain site, that is a slippery slope that everyone walks. Chefs cook , manipulate, improve and port these roms, but the roms themselves are the intellectual property of M$ and HTC without question. This is the reason for the donation system and not the " pay per ". You can ask for a donation for the time and effort you put into cooking these roms, but you cannot sell what you do not own. And nobody " owns " these roms except the companies that created the rom bases.
Who is going to gain and who is going to lose from this " butting of heads ? " Who knows, but does anyone really want a public battle over the posting ( and ad revenues ) of intellectual property they do not even own.
Kick and scream too loud, and you might just get the attention of people that have been looking the other way for a long time. Money.....money.....money......I'm just sayin...........
dead right, as soon as the roms, or the distribution of the roms becomes a commodity, htc and ms have to take notice.
samsamuel said:
dead right, as soon as the roms, or the distribution of the roms becomes a commodity, htc and ms have to take notice.
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+1.
I have been away from the site for a few months and this and another thread about the same topic have been the first things I have seen!!
This is all very bad news. For one thing, it looks like xda-developers is losing some of it's finest talent. Is this phenomenon limited to ROM chefs? What about developers who make applications (for example, Advanced Config)? I notice that the other site has that app up for download, has the developer of that app migrated exclusively to the other site?
As has already been mentioned, once people start making money off the cooked ROMs I am sure Microsoft will start to take note. Also, how many of the developers are using a licenesed copy of Visual Studio or whatever it is they use? And the SDKs required?
Will HTC start to take umberance to the fact that people are using the Manilla SDK and butchering their (already customised) ROMs?
Maybe much ado about nothing or maybe it will lead to problems for both xda-developers and the other site.
Syphon Filter said:
Maybe much ado about nothing or maybe it will lead to problems for both xda-developers and the other site.
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Yes, if they actually start charging for ROMs (one way or another) Microsoft and HTC will definitely crack down on this type of thing. I've read that they can make it almost impossible to install custom ROMs if they want to (not that it's that easy right now), not to mention taking various sites to court, Microsoft$ favorite past time..