Database Info

[Q] NFC Card Emulation on ICS 4.0.3

Hi,
Does anybody know if the new features introduced in ICS (Beam feature for instance) may help in the use of 'NFC card emulation' ?
Thanks,
Javier

This is indeed a million dollar question. I would really like to know an official answer to it.
Current research lead me to the following information:
1) Unofficial Android 2.3.4+ supports Card Emulation for Nexus S. This custom Android OS has no official Google support and the APIs may not fully work.
2) You can have card emulation using Inside's Open NFC Stack 4.3.3 for ICS. I checked the website, and the documentation, live working examples were very weak/almost non-existant. Inside attemps to compete with NXP. With such a website, I see failure for Inside.
I also do not fully understand the hype around NFC if the most important feature - Card Emulation - is not functional.
Some companies, such as Assa Abloy have implement mobile keys based on NFC. I do not know whether they used custom-hacked phones to act as card-emulated phones.
Please share any additional info you find on this topic!
A plain reader/writer can't do much in my opinion. In order for interesting applications such as mobile payments, mobile keys etc to work, card emulation should be enabled.

Any news on this topic?
// Offtopic
Another question is whether the Galaxy Nexus supports the single-wire protocol or not? Particularly, is the SIM card physically connected to the NFC controller?
Cheers,
koRn

NFC UID on Nexus S with ICS 4.0.3
Hi there,
I am using a Samsug Google Nexus S (I9023) with ICS v4.0.3
Does anyone know how can i get a Unique Identifier (UID) in my card emulation application (Mifare 1K) instead of the Random Identifier (RID) ?
I can't use NFC in my company access control if the Identifier is never the same...
Is there any form to pass trough this?
Is this one intentional leak on google official API?

It appears that nobody has yet performed card-emulation on the Nexus S running ICS 4.0.x.
Update:
I tried it myself, and obtained limited functionality. I was also not able to read the ID of the emulated card when the phone was off. (that somehow defies the purpose of card emulation.)
UPDATE (05.05.2012):
I managed to force the ID of the secure element to be fixed. The phone can now be read by an NFC reader even when the phone is off. The Nexus S' NFC antenna (found on the back cover, under a black coating) is powered by the RF field generated by the reader and the embedded SE can be read by the external reader.
If anybody is still interested in the above subject, I will post my steps and compiled sources.

marco-f.nunes said:
Does anyone know how can i get a Unique Identifier (UID) in my card emulation application (Mifare 1K) instead of the Random Identifier (RID) ?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yes, with the hacked Gingerbread OS provided by M0rtadelo (you have to compile from source - nasty procedure, requires good knowledge and confidence with Linux) or by softy007 (search his blog for the compiled binaries), you will be able to have card-emulation working. It is for experimental purposes only. The UID will be fixed, but you cannot do much from there.
marco-f.nunes said:
I can't use NFC in my company access control if the Identifier is never the same...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Card emulation is too much in its infancy to be able to do what you want right now. You may do some research on SEEK for Android. I don't know about your company, but the latter might not like a hacked android phone due to security issues.
marco-f.nunes said:
Is this one intentional leak on google official API?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yes, this is intentional. Nick Pelly and Jeff Hamilton officially state so on the official Google IO 2011 presentation. (http://www.google.com/events/io/2011/sessions/how-to-nfc.html)

Hi shailentj,
I'm really interested in this post. Currently, I'm doing the same thing that marco-f.nunes wants to do.
I would like to emulate all the Galaxy Nexus of my company to allow them to open every locked doors. Thus, I just want to emulate a passive NFC tag (through an app for now) [EDIT: but it's just a POC!]
shailentj said:
If anybody is still interested in the above subject, I will post my steps and compiled sources.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
So, I would be really interested and grateful if you could post it!
Thanks.

Software Developer
Hi Shailentj,
I am trying to develop a NFC application to read the nfc tag, this works fine on emulator, but not working on device/phone.
Please do advice me the steps that help me to read nfc tag through the phone. the app is also having other non nfc model along with it. all others models are working fine expect the nfc part.
Please do help me. also please provide me the steps that you performed and also the compiled source.
Thanks and Regards
Srikanth k
shailentj said:
It appears that nobody has yet performed card-emulation on the Nexus S running ICS 4.0.x.
Update:
I tried it myself, and obtained limited functionality. I was also not able to read the ID of the emulated card when the phone was off. (that somehow defies the purpose of card emulation.)
UPDATE (05.05.2012):
I managed to force the ID of the secure element to be fixed. The phone can now be read by an NFC reader even when the phone is off. The Nexus S' NFC antenna (found on the back cover, under a black coating) is powered by the RF field generated by the reader and the embedded SE can be read by the external reader.
If anybody is still interested in the above subject, I will post my steps and compiled sources.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse

I there, been watching this subject for a while ago and things are going slower then we'd like...'cause everyone wants card emulation to work so that you can just forget your card at home and then pull out your phone and still go to work without calling a mate to open up the door for you.
There's still nothing done, pretty and nifty but it seems there are quite a few solutions to turn up...recently i checked this:
hxxps://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=at.mroland.android.apps.nfctaginfo
which reads all of my MIFARE 1k cards and pulls out a lot information, but it still as a problem to get the KEYs, of course...the sectors are encrypted...but the above app let's you force the keys A and B to use to read all sectors...you just need to crack A and B KEYs.
So i think, dispite the phone beeing able or not to emulate a tag...i think there's still the problem of getting the keys...so it can truelly emulate the tag, am i correct fellows? 'cause i didn't see anyone talking about this...and it's clear for me...
MIFARE Classic algorithm was hacked some years ago that's not the problem, we can get the keys, proof of concept was people got transportation cards cloned (Oysters for ex.)...but to do so they needed to clone the cards, and for that they had to hack MIFARE Classic algorithm...
Still with me?! Bottom line...maybe i'm getting all wrong...so without getting the KEYs of the card (hacking it!) you won't be able to emulate it with your phone...

Correct, a lot of work cards, gate cards, etc have proprietary software and codes. So getting the keys from the card is a huge issue, and a security issue.
Sent from my Nexus S using Tapatalk 2

I have random access to the security systems at ond of my sites and if i hold my nexus up against the reader it beep / pulse the invalid Card witch it should say once, when then go in to the security logs loads of card ids in the log, is there a way to get the phone to always have the same id?
Sent from my Nexus S using Tapatalk 2

I am really want to know this solution. Can you post the steps here?
shailentj said:
UPDATE (05.05.2012):
I managed to force the ID of the secure element to be fixed. The phone can now be read by an NFC reader even when the phone is off. The Nexus S' NFC antenna (found on the back cover, under a black coating) is powered by the RF field generated by the reader and the embedded SE can be read by the external reader.
If anybody is still interested in the above subject, I will post my steps and compiled sources.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I am really want to know this solution. Can you post the steps here?

shailentj, would u please post the steps here?

Why card emulation makes so complicate
I might be wrong. I think the card emulation make things too complicate. If a NFC enabled phone, why not just act as a simple tag with no SE, no SWP, no UICC. Or reader just read such emulated card's UID then proceed the server-side data read back. It likes an ID card, no need to store any sensitive data. When reader gets the UID, anything can be done.

card emulation
Cyanogen9.0 (ICS) supports true card emulation as a 14443-4A/B card
xrodriguez said:
Hi,
Does anybody know if the new features introduced in ICS (Beam feature for instance) may help in the use of 'NFC card emulation' ?
Thanks,
Javier
Click to expand...
Click to collapse

[email protected] said:
Cyanogen9.0 (ICS) supports true card emulation as a 14443-4A/B card
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Ohhh waiting for to come in JB CM
Sent from my Nexus S using Tapatalk 2

Some science on this topic:
Software NFC emulation

This is really an interesting topic.
It would be great to use my phone to open the door instead using my card...
Any development on this?
Cheers!

I too hope there is some progress in this field?
It would be really great to just clone/dump the raw information from my RFID tag (Mifare Classic 1K) at work, and then use card emulation on my phone to access all the doors and elevators.
What I'm struggling to understand, and where I'm hitting a wall in my research, is where the true limitation(s) lie? Is it in the Secure Element access, and that we need it to control the NFC chip? Or is it simple lack of high level APIs to gain access to the low level functionality of the NFC chip?

Mifare 1k classic emulation on Nexus S
shailentj said:
It appears that nobody has yet performed card-emulation on the Nexus S running ICS 4.0.x.
Update:
I tried it myself, and obtained limited functionality. I was also not able to read the ID of the emulated card when the phone was off. (that somehow defies the purpose of card emulation.)
UPDATE (05.05.2012):
I managed to force the ID of the secure element to be fixed. The phone can now be read by an NFC reader even when the phone is off. The Nexus S' NFC antenna (found on the back cover, under a black coating) is powered by the RF field generated by the reader and the embedded SE can be read by the external reader.
If anybody is still interested in the above subject, I will post my steps and compiled sources.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Hi, would you please sharing your steps with us, may be with some code snippets. I am also trying to reach similar goals with Mifare 1k emulation on Nexus S. I would like to know your steps to make the phone respond even when it is turned off with desired UID.

[APP][IR] ONE To Remote Them All [4000+ User Codes][45'000+ preloaded Codes]

Hi guys,
i'm developing an universal IR remote control. ATM its only working on the HTC ONE and i'm trying to port it to the Galaxy S4 (except the learning function).
The original thread is here:
ONE to remote them all
Got some confirms that it works on the S4 and the Galaxy Tab 8.0.
Please use this APK
http://otrta.nibdev.com/beta/ONEtoRemoteThemAllV2.apk
And follow the thread in the HTC ONE forum if you are interested in updates.

antifish said:
Hi guys,
i'm developing an universal IR remote control. ATM its only working on the HTC ONE and i'm trying to port it to the Galaxy S4 (except the learning function).
The original thread is here:
ONE to remote them all
If you are interessted to try an .APK which should support the S4 (and other Samsung IR enabled devices), send me a PM.
When its confirmed working i'll publish an update and rename the thread correct
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
is this app going to have IR learning skills? i ask so because there are many devices which are not listed and there are also a few million devices from china which are not listed. IR learning would me great. Maybe some hardware tweak with IR receivers and using USB OTG or learning the IR codes via the camera or something similar?

francisdsa said:
is this app going to have IR learning skills? i ask so because there are many devices which are not listed and there are also a few million devices from china which are not listed. IR learning would me great. Maybe some hardware tweak with IR receivers and using USB OTG or learning the IR codes via the camera or something similar?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I dont think IR learning is support for the Galaxy S4, at least not until someone finds out how. As i dont have a S4, i cant to any reverse enigneering.
Which devices / brands are missing? Did you tried the new DB with 45'000 codes and had a look if they are listed there?
On the other side, that Database would actually have been bigger, but i cut out all brands which i could not read (chinese, arabic, etc).
There are codes for chinese cableboxes i think, at least brands like:
惠州
珠江
东莞
东莞
黑龙江
山东
(+ a lot of others)
as i dont have any clue what these signs should mean, i delted them out

I9500 test
Not working

haririan said:
Not working
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You dont have the right apk if you dont send me a PM..

antifish said:
I dont think IR learning is support for the Galaxy S4, at least not until someone finds out how. As i dont have a S4, i cant to any reverse enigneering.
Which devices / brands are missing? Did you tried the new DB with 45'000 codes and had a look if they are listed there?
On the other side, that Database would actually have been bigger, but i cut out all brands which i could not read (chinese, arabic, etc).
There are codes for chinese cableboxes i think, at least brands like:
惠州
珠江
东莞
东莞
黑龙江
山东
(+ a lot of others)
as i dont have any clue what these signs should mean, i delted them out
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
That's nice. But there are cheap chinese DVD players, media players, televisions, etc that work on IR remotes and the codes will not match all of them. Maybe if a simple interface for most uses like next, back, menu, volume, play, pause, forward, reverse, stop, power and mute are the must have buttons.
well i shall try the app and let you know if i am haveing issues.
Thanks for the reply though

francisdsa said:
That's nice. But there are cheap chinese DVD players, media players, televisions, etc that work on IR remotes and the codes will not match all of them. Maybe if a simple interface for most uses like next, back, menu, volume, play, pause, forward, reverse, stop, power and mute are the must have buttons.
well i shall try the app and let you know if i am haveing issues.
Thanks for the reply though
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I send you the link to the APK for testing.
Again, the APK in the HTC ONE forum will force close immediatly on the S4

antifish said:
I send you the link to the APK for testing.
Again, the APK in the HTC ONE forum will force close immediatly on the S4
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I did not get any link for the app.
can you resend it?
thanks

francisdsa said:
I did not get any link for the app.
can you resend it?
thanks
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Sent again

antifish said:
Sent again
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Did not get any error message. the app started and showed me a complete tabular list of the brand names. no error so far. but have nothing to test it on. Am at work. will go home and try on devices at home. will get back tomorrow
thanks
is there any other skinned layout for the buttons. this one seems very hectic

francisdsa said:
Did not get any error message. the app started and showed me a complete tabular list of the brand names. no error so far. but have nothing to test it on. Am at work. will go home and try on devices at home. will get back tomorrow
thanks
is there any other skinned layout for the buttons. this one seems very hectic
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
If it works, please thest the DB2 Browser (its a new database i got with 45000+ codes, had not the time to correctly sort and implement it yet).
Not at the moment, tell me what you like as layout and try to implement it?
What you can do at the moment is to place a widget on your homescreen for most-used functions, and soon there will be possibilty to create custom layouts (again, was already in an earlier beta version)

antifish said:
If it works, please thest the DB2 Browser (its a new database i got with 45000+ codes, had not the time to correctly sort and implement it yet).
Not at the moment, tell me what you like as layout and try to implement it?
What you can do at the moment is to place a widget on your homescreen for most-used functions, and soon there will be possibilty to create custom layouts (again, was already in an earlier beta version)
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
What i had in mind was a simple remote control skin with most used buttons over it. the rest of the buttons like the numbers, other minimal used functions, etc to be placed in a drawer or pull-down menu.
Anyways, i shall try the new database and get back.
How (or is there one) do i use the TV B-Gone code? can this block all IR frequencies?

francisdsa said:
What i had in mind was a simple remote control skin with most used buttons over it. the rest of the buttons like the numbers, other minimal used functions, etc to be placed in a drawer or pull-down menu.
Anyways, i shall try the new database and get back.
How (or is there one) do i use the TV B-Gone code? can this block all IR frequencies?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You will be able to define your layout with only your used buttons in a next version, event the buttons will be very simple (you can arrange, resize, add, delete default android buttons and assing a code).
Maybe i find a good "default" remote layout which i could use, with power, ch+/- etc, just the basic functions.
Yeah you can use the "All-off" function in the navigation menue, it will send all know power keys (the ones other users uploaded, not yet the ones form the new DB)

antifish said:
You will be able to define your layout with only your used buttons in a next version, event the buttons will be very simple (you can arrange, resize, add, delete default android buttons and assing a code).
Maybe i find a good "default" remote layout which i could use, with power, ch+/- etc, just the basic functions.
Yeah you can use the "All-off" function in the navigation menue, it will send all know power keys (the ones other users uploaded, not yet the ones form the new DB)
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Thanks dude
Maybe this common remote (jpg image) will help you make a simple useful skin
{
"lightbox_close": "Close",
"lightbox_next": "Next",
"lightbox_previous": "Previous",
"lightbox_error": "The requested content cannot be loaded. Please try again later.",
"lightbox_start_slideshow": "Start slideshow",
"lightbox_stop_slideshow": "Stop slideshow",
"lightbox_full_screen": "Full screen",
"lightbox_thumbnails": "Thumbnails",
"lightbox_download": "Download",
"lightbox_share": "Share",
"lightbox_zoom": "Zoom",
"lightbox_new_window": "New window",
"lightbox_toggle_sidebar": "Toggle sidebar"
}
OR

Got some confirmations that it works on the S4 and the Galaxy Tab 8.0.
Please check the OT for a download link and use the Thread in the HTC ONE forum for bugs / etc.

[APP][2.2+] Syncthing - Secure and Private File Synchronization

A wrapper of syncthing for Android.
Syncthing replaces Dropbox and BitTorrent Sync with something open, trustworthy and decentralized. Your data is your data alone and you deserve to choose where it is stored, if it is shared with some third party and how it's transmitted over the Internet.
Using syncthing, that control is returned to you.
{
"lightbox_close": "Close",
"lightbox_next": "Next",
"lightbox_previous": "Previous",
"lightbox_error": "The requested content cannot be loaded. Please try again later.",
"lightbox_start_slideshow": "Start slideshow",
"lightbox_stop_slideshow": "Stop slideshow",
"lightbox_full_screen": "Full screen",
"lightbox_thumbnails": "Thumbnails",
"lightbox_download": "Download",
"lightbox_share": "Share",
"lightbox_zoom": "Zoom",
"lightbox_new_window": "New window",
"lightbox_toggle_sidebar": "Toggle sidebar"
}

Great job, It seems to be a very useful app !
Does it work like FolderSync ?

Does it have local network syncing? (syncing over wifi)

So I can't add a folder, any instructions?

I Got error Notice when try to sync (the latest version in play store)
Syncthing always at 0%, it seems the app can write the data to my sdcard
can you read the logcat?
http://pastebin.com/qJscUv30

Can't capable to add any folder

How does this app handle thousands of files? Can you setup certain devices with read only? etc
I am a bitsync user, wondering if this can replace it.

mnsk said:
Does it have local network syncing? (syncing over wifi)
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yes, Syncthing can also sync on the local network (local peer discovery) without needing the external announce server. Can't speak for the Android port though.
Se7enTime said:
I Got error Notice when try to sync (the latest version in play store)
Syncthing always at 0%, it seems the app can write the data to my sdcard
can you read the logcat?
http://pastebin.com/qJscUv30
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Since the developer didn't reply....
Code:
I/SyncthingNativeCode(21290): [HBRW6] 09:29:25 WARNING: puller: final: chmod /storage/sdcard1/sinting/.syncthing.bash_cheat_sheet.pdf: operation not permitted
Attempting a chmod on a FAT filesystem (the sync folder is on the SD card) is doomed to fail. I think the developer will have to do a lot more than just wrap a native Android UI around the "Linux/ARM" commandline binary to make it properly work on Android.
Apart from that, it seems that a lot of the other problems of the Android version relate to the SD card restrictions of KitKat (locked down SD card access for apps).
JustusIV said:
How does this app handle thousands of files? Can you setup certain devices with read only? etc
I am a bitsync user, wondering if this can replace it.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I'm syncing a "repo" (to stick to Syncthing's naming covention of "shared folders") with ~9K files between four systems (2 desktop computers, 2 ARM boards, one ODroid-XU and one Jetson TK1, running Linux). No problem there, though the initial indexing may take a while, depending on the speed of your CPU of course, if you have a lot of files in there or if you dump a lot of files into it. I didn't test yet to see if there's a file limit that makes Syncthing bomb out (BTSync will bomb with >100K files in a share), but feel free to try.
And yes, Syncthing also supports a "read only" type of share. You can define a "master repo" that will only sync down to the client peers but not sync any alterations back.
Maybe snoop around on the Syncthing Website, they have a excellent documentation and issue tracker up and running, and the community is outspoken helpful.
Also, Syncthing can replace BTSync. I switched away from BTSync quite some time ago (after I got fed up dealing with the BTSync 1.4 trainwrecks) and didn't regret it; though I have to say I really have no use for syncing with Android, if I need to transfer something over to Android then I either use Solid Explorer's built-in FTP server or SMB/SSH "share" from the PC.
About the questions of "how is this different from BTSync":
Well, first, and foremost, Syncthing is Open Source Software. You can audit the source code to look for potential security threads (i.e. hidden backdoors, weak crypto). You don't have to rely on promises but you can put it to the test (given you can code and you happen to understand crypto).
Secondly, and most importantly, you can jump into the fun and contribute improvements to the project (fork it, add to it, send a pull request). The biggest advantage of FOSS: You can contribute! If you're just a end-user, well, you can at least provide testing feedback.
Thirdly, Syncthing, in my oppinion, does a good job at maintaining a sane UI, much unlike the trainwreck that is the BTSync 1.4 Beta series.
Seeing how the release at least one new pre-built build a week also shows that they got the idea of "release early, release often" (see "The Bazaar and the Cathedral" to get the idea if you don't know what that means) to not only provide you with updates but also push something out so the masses can give it a shot to try and uncover bugs or test latest improvements.

BoneWithABeagle said:
Since the developer didn't reply....
Code:
I/SyncthingNativeCode(21290): [HBRW6] 09:29:25 WARNING: puller: final: chmod /storage/sdcard1/sinting/.syncthing.bash_cheat_sheet.pdf: operation not permitted
Attempting a chmod on a FAT filesystem (the sync folder is on the SD card) is doomed to fail. I think the developer will have to do a lot more than just wrap a native Android UI around the "Linux/ARM" commandline binary to make it properly work on Android.
Apart from that, it seems that a lot of the other problems of the Android version relate to the SD card restrictions of KitKat (locked down SD card access for apps).
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Thanks for the explanation. I have the exact same issue but curiously even on my internal memory:
Code:
15:17:46: puller: final: chtimes /storage/emulated/0/Music/.syncthing.running.m3u: operation not permitted
15:17:46: Folder "Music_x230" isn't making progress - check logs for possible root cause. Pausing puller for 1m0s.
Btw, I just found the app and really love the idea. If I get it to successfully sync between my Synology NAS, Thinkpad, Mac and Note 2 it will replace all my other syncing tool. So please keep up the good work! :fingers-crossed:

I would love to see Tasker integration or a way to trigger a sync then exit... something so i could do a nightly backup or something but not have it run all the time....
Over the next few days i will try to get my syncing up and going and see what i can do with tasker.

sicut said:
Thanks for the explanation. I have the exact same issue but curiously even on my internal memory:
Code:
15:17:46: puller: final: chtimes /storage/emulated/0/Music/.syncthing.running.m3u: operation not permitted
15:17:46: Folder "Music_x230" isn't making progress - check logs for possible root cause. Pausing puller for 1m0s.
Btw, I just found the app and really love the idea. If I get it to successfully sync between my Synology NAS, Thinkpad, Mac and Note 2 it will replace all my other syncing tool. So please keep up the good work! :fingers-crossed:
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I am also getting the same errors when syncing between two android devices, phone and a tablet.
It works for the first time then shows these errors.
Plus there is no external sd card support.

getting
15:17:46: puller: final: chtimes /storage/emulated/0/Music/.syncthing.running.m3u: operation not permitted
myself

Oh **** I thought I was gonna get email updates about this thread, looks like that failed.
woaloo said:
Great job, It seems to be a very useful app !
Does it work like FolderSync ?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
FolderSync seems to work with Dropbox etc, while syncthing has it's own desktop program, and this app only works with syncthing.
mnsk said:
Does it have local network syncing? (syncing over wifi)
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yes, if two devices are on the same (wireless) LAN, data is only sent in the LAN (so that's pretty fast)
CreepyE said:
So I can't add a folder, any instructions?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
That was broken in 0.5.1, but fixed in 0.5.2 (sorry).
Se7enTime said:
I Got error Notice when try to sync (the latest version in play store)
Syncthing always at 0%, it seems the app can write the data to my sdcard
can you read the logcat?
http://pastebin.com/qJscUv30
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
That's a bug that was also fixed in 0.5.2.
JustusIV said:
How does this app handle thousands of files? Can you setup certain devices with read only? etc
I am a bitsync user, wondering if this can replace it.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I sync my ~70 GB of music so that should be fine. Read only is supported (check "Folder Master"). More info is on the forum.
JustusIV said:
I would love to see Tasker integration or a way to trigger a sync then exit... something so i could do a nightly backup or something but not have it run all the time....
Over the next few days i will try to get my syncing up and going and see what i can do with tasker.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
See issue #91. I don't have the time/interest to add this myself, but contributions are welcome, and you can also use the Rest API.
SYNC IS CURRENTLY BROKEN (issue link)
We'll have to wait for an upstream fix. Sorry for that

After reading that thread I don't have high hopes for a quick fix

JustusIV said:
After reading that thread I don't have high hopes for a quick fix
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Seems unlikely, yeah...at least not how it works currently.
It seems to be the same problem like FolderSync has for example (FAQ entry) because of the file timestamp problem in Android (issue 15480 and 1699).
It's pretty annoying, that it pulls every synced file again after a factory reset and/or clean update due of the loss of the local DB with all the file entries.
Nutomic said:
[..]
FolderSync seems to work with Dropbox etc, while syncthing has it's own desktop program, and this app only works with syncthing.
[...]
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yeah, and it also works with SMB and ftp. But because of the single client sytem it is only able to pull on qequest (although it supports Tasker to ease that a little bit). So I like the syncthing approach much more
Nutomic said:
[..]
SYNC IS CURRENTLY BROKEN (issue link)
We'll have to wait for an upstream fix. Sorry for that
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Fingers crossed, that I am wrong and it could be fixed/workaround more easily.
And thank you for all the effort!

And sync is fixed
(it may take a few hours until the update is available)

Nutomic said:
And sync is fixed
(it may take a few hours until the update is available)
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
UMMMMMM...
guess i gotta eat my words :/
How was this "fix" achieved?
Reverted to the old method?

JustusIV said:
UMMMMMM...
guess i gotta eat my words :/
How was this "fix" achieved?
Reverted to the old method?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yeah, by ignoring failure to set modification times (like it was before).

Why does it say up to date... When it is not?

Nutomic said:
And sync is fixed
(it may take a few hours until the update is available)
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
which release # should we look out for? 0.5.3? I'm seeing this issue with 0.5.2

Mods, Customization - Snapdragon 835

Hi all, I would like to inquire if it is possible to be able to root the Quest and introduce mods, launchers, optimizations and customization especially that it runs snapdragon 835 ?

Hi!
I found the security patch level of Quest is a bit old.
2017-10-05
Maybe we can use existing vulnerabilty to get root.

Hehe, i like whre this is heading.
rurie said:
Hi!
I found the security patch level of Quest is a bit old.
2017-10-05
Maybe we can use existing vulnerabilty to get root.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse

rurie said:
Hi!
I found the security patch level of Quest is a bit old.
2017-10-05
Maybe we can use existing vulnerabilty to get root.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
With Android 7.1.1, would any of the methods here work? Has anyone tried yet?

I tried waterdrop (CVE-2019-2025), but no luck.
info:
http://blogs.360.cn/post/Binder_Kernel_Vul_EN.html
https://www.exploit-db.com/exploits/46503
$ /data/local/tmp/poc
/data/local/tmp/poc: binder_become_context_manager: Device or resource busy
We need kernel hacker. Can anyone help?
---------- Post added at 08:26 ---------- Previous post was at 08:19 ----------
In addition, I found Quest have Qualcomm's EDL mode. By pressing vul-up,down and power will boot in EDL mode.
And Quest supports fastboot on USB Update Mode. but "fastboot oem unlock" needs unlock code.

I tried the dirtycow methods but I think that was patched out before this build, no success.
I also tried just running the usual commands to bring up USB Tethering, but that seems to need root as well. All I want is better ALVR streaming

fyi Oculus is unwilling to provide bootloader unlock codes citing section 4.1 of their Terms of Service, as being in conflict with the request.

I found this to be interesting.
I've began a support request to get the boot loader unlock codes and explicitly began requesting the GPL code (parts of Android and their Linux kernel source). This should give me a few options.
They may or may not decline giving me the boot loader codes. Not the end of the world.
They are legally obligated to give me certain source code for what's running on this device. Such as the linux kernel with the modifications they've made. If they don't provide this source in it's entirety, then there's some legal implications involved there. The first response from their support was pretty ignorant. They linked me to some download section of their website that only had developer SDKs, not the sources I was requiring of them.
Anyway, once I have the kernel source, if no bootloader codes are provided, I can begin scouring it for ways to elevate to root at least.

sync.demon said:
Anyway, once I have the kernel source.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I believe the kernel for the oculus go is here:
https://github.com/facebookincubator/oculus-go-kernel
I can't see any published quest kernel, perhaps it's the same?

reclaimyoursenses said:
perhaps it's the same?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
It's quite possible for the kernel to be the same. I'm going to await confirmation directly from Oculus. If it goes well, I get to unlock my bootloader on top of having the correct source. If it goes poorly, who knows. I might get to see what the legal side of the GNU GPL looks like.
I really want to audit the support for this device and software I own.

Not the same. The posted kernel for Go is Linux 3 while Quest is using Linux 4.4.21. They've built on Android, which means they're starting with a stock Linux kernel, I don't think getting their sources is going to clue us into anything that can't be known already; they'll just upload that same vanilla Linux 4 kernel source. The drivers they will use for practically everything are almost certainly closed-source. They don't have to provide their kernel configuration either.
Best of luck on getting the bootloader, though, that's the holy grail at the moment

Well, the dudes that I'm talking with finally provided kernel source:
https://github.com/facebookincubator/oculus-linux-kernel
It's the Quest Branch of the Oculus Linux Kernel. So we have something to search through for vulnerabilities.
I'm still talking with them about flashing the hardware. I'm not convinced that it's locked, because they seemed a bit confused what I was talking about. Having not touched phone boot loaders in years, I'm still doing my research into the bootloading stuff, since I'm only guessing that it involves a signature check at the moment.

Waiting for mine to be delivered, where does it store the downloaded game files?

deconfrost said:
Waiting for mine to be delivered, where does it store the downloaded game files?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The game files, if you mean the apk-files are generally stored on the internal sdcard and are available as movable USB storage. I don't think you even need to set it in developer mode to access the apk files. Anyway, if you set the device in the supplied developer mode it works fine. So there is no problem to load your own applications or backup downloaded games. SideQuest is a great application that simplifies this for semi-advanced users.
You can also use adb quite extensively and for example use scrcpy to dump the full screen output to a computer. Over all the Quest allows you to do most things you need.
But... The "problem" is that the Quest Android OS is locked and some things, mainly Ethernet over USB, have been disabled. You can stream video to the Quest via Wifi and play Oculus or SteamVR games that run on your computer fairly decent as it is now (using AVLR), but if Ethernet over USB was activated it could more or less replace a Oculus Rift or other wired unit completely. Oculus would likely not be happy with this since it would threaten their business/ market strategies, their segmentation of devices and the Oculus Store. But, that is why rooting the device would be interesting.

I've been finding holes to install the USB ethernet driver, but with no luck. Hope somebody will root the device so i can use either USB Tethering or a USB Ethernet device. Will even pay the person that can crack the device haha.
If I enter this CMD:
adb shell am start -a android.intent.action.VIEW -d com.oculus.tv -e uri com.android.settings/.DevelopmentSettings com.oculus.vrshell/.MainActivity
I can't even enable RNDIS manually, but that is logic since they just only added the WLAN drivers to the device.

Yesl

I just want to check that you've definitely tried plugging in a USB-C ethernet adapter? If you haven't I'm going to order one, plug in to the Quest and do lsusb.
cicada said:
I tried the dirtycow methods but I think that was patched out before this build, no success.
I also tried just running the usual commands to bring up USB Tethering, but that seems to need root as well. All I want is better ALVR streaming
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
JohanTEA said:
The game files, if you mean the apk-files are generally stored on the internal sdcard and are available as movable USB storage. I don't think you even need to set it in developer mode to access the apk files. Anyway, if you set the device in the supplied developer mode it works fine. So there is no problem to load your own applications or backup downloaded games. SideQuest is a great application that simplifies this for semi-advanced users.
You can also use adb quite extensively and for example use scrcpy to dump the full screen output to a computer. Over all the Quest allows you to do most things you need.
But... The "problem" is that the Quest Android OS is locked and some things, mainly Ethernet over USB, have been disabled. You can stream video to the Quest via Wifi and play Oculus or SteamVR games that run on your computer fairly decent as it is now (using AVLR), but if Ethernet over USB was activated it could more or less replace a Oculus Rift or other wired unit completely. Oculus would likely not be happy with this since it would threaten their business/ market strategies, their segmentation of devices and the Oculus Store. But, that is why rooting the device would be interesting.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Pfreaker said:
I've been finding holes to install the USB ethernet driver, but with no luck. Hope somebody will root the device so i can use either USB Tethering or a USB Ethernet device. Will even pay the person that can crack the device haha.
If I enter this CMD:
adb shell am start -a android.intent.action.VIEW -d com.oculus.tv -e uri com.android.settings/.DevelopmentSettings com.oculus.vrshell/.MainActivity
I can't even enable RNDIS manually, but that is logic since they just only added the WLAN drivers to the device.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse

guys if you use 5ghz wifi you get speeds way faster than you need anyway - I dont know why you so need to enable ethernet?
the quest has a better screen res than the rift as well. Games come up mint using ALVR
I use moonlight to stream normal non-vr games as well - also works flawlessly
however - one thing that doesnt work too well - if i am using ALVR to stream a VR game that uses a gamepad and not the controlers, i pair my XBOX gamepad via bluetooth and ALVR crashes every time.
When i use moonlight and the bluetooth gamepad it does not crash.
This means i can only play VR games which require a gamepad if i am in proximity to the PC itself and not anywhere in the house which is what i would like.
Has anyone found a solution to this "ALVR crashes with Bluetooth Gamepad connected" issue yet?

Quest Root - 90Hz possibility
With the quest link coming up and the fact that the Quest's OLED displays apparently can support up to 90Hz (Though they won't change it due to needing to verify it with the FCC), I'm hoping that that could be a reason for people to start trying to go for root! Especially with PCVR, a Rooted Quest running at 90Hz would possibly be better than the Oculus Rift S!
{
"lightbox_close": "Close",
"lightbox_next": "Next",
"lightbox_previous": "Previous",
"lightbox_error": "The requested content cannot be loaded. Please try again later.",
"lightbox_start_slideshow": "Start slideshow",
"lightbox_stop_slideshow": "Stop slideshow",
"lightbox_full_screen": "Full screen",
"lightbox_thumbnails": "Thumbnails",
"lightbox_download": "Download",
"lightbox_share": "Share",
"lightbox_zoom": "Zoom",
"lightbox_new_window": "New window",
"lightbox_toggle_sidebar": "Toggle sidebar"
}

one click root???
has anyone tried (one click root) to get root access
https://www.xda-developers.com/best-one-click-root-2018/
maybe the root master works or something else because android 7 was annouced in August 22, 2016 and rootmaster got last update 2017.
sry bad english.

Huawei Share, Multi-screen colaboration on any PC- updated

Hello!
I spent the last 2 days figuring out how to install Huawei share (pc manager) on a Non-Huawei laptop, and I encountered a lot of outdated informations or outdated files, missing download links, bugs, but I finally made it to work. I hope this post will save others some time.
THIS IS NOT MY WORK. I just spent a lot of time struggling on chinese sites to understand how this app work, instructions were in chinese.
This is Huawei PC Manager v11, it should work for AMD CPU ( but i didn't tested it ).
Your PC needs bluetooth and wifi (you can use it through cable without bt & wifi) & NFC Tag works too.
Download link for zip file: https://www.mediafire.com/file/mgd2f3hh3bf9d9u/PCManagerHuawei.rar/file
1. Extract the zip and open PCManagerMgr.exe as administrator.
2. Set your PC time to May 12, 2020. *THIS IS IMPORTANT*
3. In PCManagerMgr, you should insert code : 1DBDFC If you didn't set May 12, 2020 it doesn't work.
{
"lightbox_close": "Close",
"lightbox_next": "Next",
"lightbox_previous": "Previous",
"lightbox_error": "The requested content cannot be loaded. Please try again later.",
"lightbox_start_slideshow": "Start slideshow",
"lightbox_stop_slideshow": "Stop slideshow",
"lightbox_full_screen": "Full screen",
"lightbox_thumbnails": "Thumbnails",
"lightbox_download": "Download",
"lightbox_share": "Share",
"lightbox_zoom": "Zoom",
"lightbox_new_window": "New window",
"lightbox_toggle_sidebar": "Toggle sidebar"
}
Black arrow - > It's not PcManager V10. it's v11 but I couldn't change the program so, i rename the installer from v11 to v10 to match our program.
Yellow thing - > I just tried to blur my pc's serial number but you can get it anyway by scanning the QR code that I forgot to blur, anyway, I won't blur further.
Green arrows - > You won't have the same status, mine is already installed and i'm running it right now, that's why.
Make everything the same as in photo and you're good to go, press install. The installer should open.
After the installation, you can launch PC Manager from desktop shortcut, go to phone on left, and click connect.
Follow the red arrow in the above picture and click that half QR code.
You will get a bigger QR Code, picture 2 lines below.
Now you need to enable Huawei Share, BT and maybe NFC on your Huawei phone. (i really don't know if it's mandatory to have nfc on).
Scan this QR code using Huawei's browser, it won't work with any other QR Scanner. You need to set Huawei's Browser as default browser. Some connection requests should appear and click allow.
IF You scan this QR Code and all you get is this, and nothing happens:
Then you need to go to settings on your phone -> apps -> apps -> search for browser -> and in the upper right corner you have 3 dots, with an "uninstall updates" option. You need to uninstall updates, i think they patched this with some update. Never update browser app.
then you can try again to scan QR Code, it should work now.
If you have an NFC Tag and want to use it, You need to install that chinese .apk file on your phone, you have it in the zip file you downloaded.
This chinese named apk file will install Huawei Share OneHop app. With this app you need to scan the QR Code from PCManagerMgr, it's the QR Code from the first picture of this post, and after you scan it, it will ask you to place the NFC module (your phone, near the cameras on p40 pro) against the NFC Tag you want to use. It should be done and good to go. It worked for me in the first try.
If you have more questions, feel free to ask here.
It's my first post, I'm not good at this. This is not my work, I just wanted to help people since there isn't an updated post.
Also my english is not so good but it's better than chinese.
Credits :
deagle-lim - that 12 may 2020 trick.​tomhrusk - 'set Huawei's browser as default browser' info​lopsyfa - Who had a comment on how to install the latest version - > basically i made the opposite of his comment, i renamed the v11 installer to v10 instead.​JazonX - who uploaded this archive but with v10 pc manager.​

thanks

THANK YOU, this is the most understandable and complete tutorial about this. i finally get it connected after days of trying before i read this tutorial.
But now i have a problem, the multi screen cant show anything. i can control the phone (3 button at the bottom and clicks is registered) but the picture didnt show up just stuck like this. i tried diff version of pc manager and set nvidia control panel etc, but nothing works. if anybody know how (or just any idea that i can try) to resolve this, i will appreciate it. thank you

Hi,
thank you for the file and the guide. It's been really helpful. Do you have any tips on how to connect over Wi-Fi?
My problem is that at certain point I have de-installed the Huawei Browser from my phone and now I can only download it via the App Gallery (where I get the screenshot that you've uploaded). Should I look on APK mirror or similar for an older version, and if there is one available, which one would you recommend?
Otherwise, the phone connects and works via USB cable

apocalypse_bg said:
Hi,
thank you for the file and the guide. It's been really helpful. Do you have any tips on how to connect over Wi-Fi?
My problem is that at certain point I have de-installed the Huawei Browser from my phone and now I can only download it via the App Gallery (where I get the screenshot that you've uploaded). Should I look on APK mirror or similar for an older version, and if there is one available, which one would you recommend?
Otherwise, the phone connects and works via USB cable
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
My browser is version 11.0.2.306

Wow, it works on my ROG strix and Huawei Mate20x...
Now i wont need to buy matepad 11 to replace my gaming laptop...
Thanks for the translation and explanation

Thanks for sharing this helpful trick.
===
At first I tried to connect my phone by USB, and it worked. However, OneHop (NFC Tag) always fails.
Then I tried to connect by Scan the QR Code (you need to Uninstall browser Updates first), yes it worked too. After that, suddenly my OneHop managed to work perfectly.
I can conclude that, in order to use OneHop, PC Manager has to get authenticated for the first time (because when connecting by OneHop it always shows an error that authentication failed). Maybe the OneHop feature has a bug or something that makes it not work properly.
Then by connecting by QR Code, the PC Manager has received authentication, so that the OneHop feature can work properly because it already authenticated.

Thank you very much for instruction, could you please describe more about nfc tag, if I want to create my own, what nfc tag type should I buy and by that chinese app I would be able to Wright data on that nfc tag? Will apretiate if you will describe more how you made your nfc tag what will support same futures as original Huawei share tag, because I even thought to go to shop and try to copy nfc tag from Huawei laptop)) and please tell me after reinstalling windows and new instalation of pcmanager old created nfc tag will work?

PavelUstinov said:
Thank you very much for instruction, could you please describe more about nfc tag, if I want to create my own, what nfc tag type should I buy and by that chinese app I would be able to Wright data on that nfc tag? Will apretiate if you will describe more how you made your nfc tag what will support same futures as original Huawei share tag, because I even thought to go to shop and try to copy nfc tag from Huawei laptop)) and please tell me after reinstalling windows and new instalation of pcmanager old created nfc tag will work?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You can buy a Programmable NFC Tag Sticker, it's cost less than $1/pc in my local store.
Aliexpress (for reference only)

As I understanded that Chinese app for Android will make Wright to nfc sticker and after it would be like Huawei sticker

PseudoRax said:
You can buy a Programmable NFC Tag Sticker, it's cost less than $1/pc in my local store.
Aliexpress (for reference only)
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
But what type of nfc tag do I need? And how to make that nfc tag work as Huawei share original tag?

PavelUstinov said:
But what type of nfc tag do I need? And how to make that nfc tag work as Huawei share original tag?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You need a Programmable NFC Tag like the product in Aliexpress I posted.
How it work? (as far as I know)
The OneHop App (Chinese App) write a code (or maybe an URL Address) into the NFC Tag.
The NFC Tag will trigger the PC Manager and make a connection once it tapped.
I tried scan the Barcode in PC Manager, and I got this address: (I replaced some text with XXXX)
Code:
https://consumer.huawei.com/en/support/laptopsassistant/v2applinks/?s=XXXX&version=4.0.0.2&devid=XXXX&random=XXXX&modeltype=5&modelsubtype=0&s2=XXXX
I think the address is unique & static for every PC, because I can make a connection by enter this address in browser without scan the barcode anymore.
And maybe the mechanisme is the same as the (configured) NFC tag do, NFC Tag will open the same URL address once it tapped.
I believe the original Huawei Share do the same way.
(ps: I can't check what code in my configured NFC Tag, everytime I tap the tag by NFC Reader App it just not work, and my phone immediatly open the Connection (to PCManager) Popup. Using another non-Huawei NFC phone should be work I think)

PseudoRax said:
You need a Programmable NFC Tag like the product in Aliexpress I posted.
How it work? (as far as I know)
The OneHop App (Chinese App) write a code (or maybe an URL Address) into the NFC Tag.
The NFC Tag will trigger the PC Manager and make a connection once it tapped.
I tried scan the Barcode in PC Manager, and I got this address: (I replaced some text with XXXX)
Code:
https://consumer.huawei.com/en/support/laptopsassistant/v2applinks/?s=XXXX&version=4.0.0.2&devid=XXXX&random=XXXX&modeltype=5&modelsubtype=0&s2=XXXX
I think the address is unique & static for every PC, because I can make a connection by enter this address in browser without scan the barcode anymore.
And maybe the mechanisme is the same as the (configured) NFC tag do, NFC Tag will open the same URL address once it tapped.
I believe the original Huawei Share do the same way.
(ps: I can't check what code in my configured NFC Tag, everytime I tap the tag by NFC Reader App it just not work, and my phone immediatly open the Connection (to PCManager) Popup. Using another non-Huawei NFC phone should be work I think)
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Okay I see, thank you very much for explanation, last question, there is a lot of types of nfc tag, commonly ntag213, ntag215, is that matter what nfc tag I will use? What type you have been using to make that pcmanager work?

PavelUstinov said:
Okay I see, thank you very much for explanation, last question, there is a lot of types of nfc tag, commonly ntag213, ntag215, is that matter what nfc tag I will use? What type you have been using to make that pcmanager work?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
No problem.
I'm using NTag213 chip, and I don't really understand that either

kismarian said:
Hello!
I spent the last 2 days figuring out how to install Huawei share (pc manager) on a Non-Huawei laptop, and I encountered a lot of outdated informations or outdated files, missing download links, bugs, but I finally made it to work. I hope this post will save others some time.
THIS IS NOT MY WORK. I just spent a lot of time struggling on chinese sites to understand how this app work, instructions were in chinese.
This is Huawei PC Manager v11, it should work for AMD CPU ( but i didn't tested it ).
Your PC needs bluetooth and wifi (you can use it through cable without bt & wifi) & NFC Tag works too.
Download link for zip file: https://www.mediafire.com/file/mgd2f3hh3bf9d9u/PCManagerHuawei.rar/file
1. Extract the zip and open PCManagerMgr.exe as administrator.
2. Set your PC time to May 12, 2020. *THIS IS IMPORTANT*
3. In PCManagerMgr, you should insert code : 1DBDFC If you didn't set May 12, 2020 it doesn't work.
View attachment 5318865
Black arrow - > It's not PcManager V10. it's v11 but I couldn't change the program so, i rename the installer from v11 to v10 to match our program.
Yellow thing - > I just tried to blur my pc's serial number but you can get it anyway by scanning the QR code that I forgot to blur, anyway, I won't blur further.
Green arrows - > You won't have the same status, mine is already installed and i'm running it right now, that's why.
Make everything the same as in photo and you're good to go, press install. The installer should open.
After the installation, you can launch PC Manager from desktop shortcut, go to phone on left, and click connect.
View attachment 5318867
Follow the red arrow in the above picture and click that half QR code.
You will get a bigger QR Code, picture 2 lines below.
Now you need to enable Huawei Share, BT and maybe NFC on your Huawei phone. (i really don't know if it's mandatory to have nfc on).
View attachment 5318869
Scan this QR code using Huawei's browser, it won't work with any other QR Scanner. You need to set Huawei's Browser as default browser. Some connection requests should appear and click allow.
IF You scan this QR Code and all you get is this, and nothing happens:
View attachment 5318871
Then you need to go to settings on your phone -> apps -> apps -> search for browser -> and in the upper right corner you have 3 dots, with an "uninstall updates" option. You need to uninstall updates, i think they patched this with some update. Never update browser app.
then you can try again to scan QR Code, it should work now.
If you have an NFC Tag and want to use it, You need to install that chinese .apk file on your phone, you have it in the zip file you downloaded.
This chinese named apk file will install Huawei Share OneHop app. With this app you need to scan the QR Code from PCManagerMgr, it's the QR Code from the first picture of this post, and after you scan it, it will ask you to place the NFC module (your phone, near the cameras on p40 pro) against the NFC Tag you want to use. It should be done and good to go. It worked for me in the first try.
If you have more questions, feel free to ask here.
It's my first post, I'm not good at this. This is not my work, I just wanted to help people since there isn't an updated post.
Also my english is not so good but it's better than chinese.
Credits :
deagle-lim - that 12 may 2020 trick.​tomhrusk - 'set Huawei's browser as default browser' info​lopsyfa - Who had a comment on how to install the latest version - > basically i made the opposite of his comment, i renamed the v11 installer to v10 instead.​JazonX - who uploaded this archive but with v10 pc manager.​
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I need some help. This method already worked for me with the version given, but I would like to install Huawei PC Manager version 11.1.1.97 on my PC, since it is the latest version of this application and I would love to be able to connect the tablet that I will buy in a couple of months.
Is there a way to update the software or directly install the most up-to-date version?

11.1.1.97 is not working for me, it is giving me error about drivers not updated. Use previous version i.e. PCManager11.0.8.87(C233).exe, it will work with the same procedure.

theintelligent said:
11.1.1.97 is not working for me, it is giving me error about drivers not updated. Use previous version i.e. PCManager11.0.8.87(C233).exe, it will work with the same procedure.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
OK, thanks. Is that 11.0.8.87 version the one that is given above by kismarian?

i am getting this Error. i have AMD Ryzen 7

Have you changed the date to May 12, 2020.

Hey, thanks for your work, it's the first guide that actually explains it very clearly, could you please upload a new version? My Matepad 11 is not compatible with this one