Related
Firstly.... go here and read this -
http://batteryuniversity.com/learn/article/charging_lithium_ion_batteries
The battery is fully charged when it is at 4.2 Volts and fully discharged at some predefined voltage (Lets say 3 volts).
The phone can measure these voltages directly from the battery. To see the voltage of your battery type *#*#4636#*#* into your phone and go to battery information.
If all that is so then what is the point or need of "recalibrating" and deleting battery stats and all that.
It seems logical to me that battery stats is just the place where your battery usage history is stored and nothing else.
Can someone confirm this or convince me otherwise?
(I rotate between 3 batteries and cannot grasp the idea that my phone can't consistently measure the charge level of the battery and operate accordingly.)
Measuring the Voltage to get the charge level is not very accurate, and has to be done with no load on the battery (that is, when its not in your phone).
So the phone has to count "energy used from"/"energy stored in" the battery for an accurate display. (called "Coloumb counter")
Did some test
I did a test on new a battery a while ago. Measure voltage when the battery completely empty and fully charged.
Empty battery
1% remaining, using SystemPanel
Take the battery out and measure it with Multimeter
Fully charged
100% charged
Again, measure it with Multimeter
The voltage showed on the phone using SystemPanel app is quite accurate with 0.04V margin of error. Most smart electronic measure lithium battery capacity according to the remaining voltage. In this case, fully charged SGS is 4.2V, empty is 3.5V.
Me too, don't know why we have to delete batterystats.bin to recalibrate battery indicator But I do know that SGS keep track on power consumption on each of its component/application. Its a little bit silly if SGS reads batterystats.bin and display it as battery indicator.
Yet again how is this android development.
Sent from my GT-I9000 using XDA App
xufos said:
I did a test on new a battery a while ago. Measure current when the battery completely empty and fully charged.
Empty battery
1% remaining, using SystemPanel
Take the battery out and measure it with Multimeter
Fully charged
100% charged
Again, measure it with Multimeter
The current showed on the phone using SystemPanel app is quite accurate with 0.04V error margin. Most smart electronic measure lithium battery capacity according to the remaining current. In this case, fully charged SGS is 4.2V, empty is 3.5V.
Me too, don't know why we have to delete batterystats.bin to recalibrate battery indicator But I do know that SGS keep track on power consumption on each of its component/application. Its a little bit silly if SGS reads batterystats.bin and display it as battery indicator.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Thanks for that, but you were actually measuring the Voltage, not current (Amperes).
In any case, for laptop Li-ion batteries there is normally a capacity counter (Coulomb counter) that reports the capacity in terms of mAh (milli-ampere hours). It can normally report the remaining capacity, maximum capacity, design capacity, and can be used to measure the *actual* power drain (in terms of Watts).
I wonder if Android has APIs that let apps access that kind of information?
Not really sure about this, but:
Phone seems to measure both voltage & discharge speed, "predicting" remaining charge.
It happens that after a flash battery indicator jumps to a higher value (not compatible with the couple of minutes of dc connection it had), and fall to a way too low value after any battery intensive task (a few minutes of audio call are enough), once more not compatible with the real usage.
I should inspect android code to be shure of this, but I suspect batterystats.bin is used to keep track of battery usage and to this sort of prediction, while a firmware flash seems to mess somehow the measurement.
Edit: this is based on my direct experience, even if on just "empirical" tests. I'll take a look to code asap
'mkay, battery talk... always interesting to see what people make of this.
Let's help out all the misunderstandings here and start with the basics
First of all: read the basics on Li-ion batteries:
http://electronics.howstuffworks.com/lithium-ion-battery.htm
second:
you DON'T measure your voltage when your battery is disconnected. Because it will rise to the normal values of the battery after a while. When you connect it, and use it, the voltage will lower. Compare it to a garden hose. if you let water run out, the presure drops and water starts flowing (presure is voltage, flowing is the current). If you measure the presure when there is no water running, the presure will always mount to the default value, even if there is "not much water left in the tank". But when it starts running again, it could very well run out very fast. So in comparison: voltage says something, but only when you "use" it.
Third:
When a battery ages, it's characteristics change, it will be full... and then all at once, empty. It's not linear. So calculating the capacity is always a bit "guessing". (compare it to stones in your water tank... they don't give you water, the tank doesn't change, but all of a sudden, you're out of water).
conclusion:
capacity of a battery is a very tricky thing to do, it's a combination of voltage, current, age... so the best way to determine capacity is by using the history of the battery as the "guide" to the future. Resetting the battery statistics will remove that history and your phone will have to "learn" it's behavior again. If you don't reset your stats, your values will become more reliable over time (depending of course on the time the stats are kept )
For those who speak dutch, i put a complete battery description/howto/misunderstandings post on www.modelbouwforum.nl (search for posts of "harrydg")
If there are more questions or so, just ask, i'll try to help out as much as possible...
wow harrydg that's great explanation, wish you were my physics teacher back in high school
someone add this post to the main FAQ!
I just wanna write it in a simpler way:
You've access to the battery stats from the kernel. And of course its current consumption which is measured not voltage. Voltage doesn't tell all that much. During high draws your voltage (at the battery level) can fluctuate quite a bit.
There's a regulator (or probably a bunch of them) get a stable voltage no matter what the input voltage is (well, still it has to be in the 3.3/5v range probably else the regulator burns)
Anyway, that's also why the battery stats have to be calibrated, while you can measure how much current is used (in maH aka milli amp per hour, or in mA aka "instant" milli amps), you don't know the battery capacity.
Not only the battery capacity changes from battery to battery but it also changes during the life time of the battery.
The *only* way to calibrate the battery, is to delete the stats, have a fully charged phone and let it drain out the battery until it turns off. That way the kernel will measure for example 1457mah used until it ran out of juice, and that's your battery capacity then. Having the full capacity allows the kernel to give you a rather precise estimate of your current battery status (eg "80%" that you see on the top of the screen) (of course the actual calculation is a bit more complicate but that's the basics)
If calibration stats storage is changed for any reason (probably kernel upgrade or just a whacky samsung implementation that gets corrupted for some reason) you need to delete it and make a new one to recalibrate.
If you want to make it simpler, make it at least correct...
"Anyway, that's also why the battery stats have to be calibrated, while you can measure how much current is used (in maH aka milli amp per hour, or in mA aka "instant" milli amps), you don't know the battery capacity."
First of al, it's mAh, which means milli ampere hour, NOT per hour, that would be mA/h, which it is not.
mA is milli ampere, which is a current
there is a significant difference between the 2.
the first is "capacity"
the second is "current"
it's like a bottle. The capacity is 2l and you pour at 1l per minut...
so... make it simple please...
My guess is, that android is measuring the known min and max by the battery reported values, stores them and calculates the percentages.
So it is device and battery independent.
harrydg said:
If you want to make it simpler, make it at least correct...
"Anyway, that's also why the battery stats have to be calibrated, while you can measure how much current is used (in maH aka milli amp per hour, or in mA aka "instant" milli amps), you don't know the battery capacity."
First of al, it's mAh, which means milli ampere hour, NOT per hour, that would be mA/h, which it is not.
mA is milli ampere, which is a current
there is a significant difference between the 2.
the first is "capacity"
the second is "current"
it's like a bottle. The capacity is 2l and you pour at 1l per minut...
so... make it simple please...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Sorry a typo and no caps deserve heavy flaming
bilboa1 said:
Sorry a typo and no caps deserve heavy flaming
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
hehe, sorry for the rant, but if you want to put it simple, make sure the terminology and abbreviations are correct. If not, people will take over the mistakes and conversations will go totally wrong because of misunderstandings...
Thanks very much for the feedback guys. It makes more sense now.
It's using batterystats to get familiar with discharge rates in order to give an accurate estimation of remaining charge and a prediction of when it will run dry.
Can it misreprasent these values and forcibly power down the phone when there is still charge remaining?
And likewise can it stop the charging process prematurely, estimating the battery to be at 100% charge when it is lower?
Is this the reason to recalibrate?
Heres one thing what I noticed about the battery stats, some say deleting it fixes the guage and does not really recalibrate the battery, I really doubt there is a way for end users to do that, even if you never delete the battery stats bin and your drain is pretty fast, it significantly slows down when your battery hits around 25~35, the lower the power on the battery the more accurate it can be represented regardless of the calibration. This is applicaple for the SGS only.
Now it comes to the question..
If the phone create battery stats every time the phone reboot, then when is the best time to delete and the best way to calibrate?
This is what I normally do..
..delete stats at 5%, let it run dry til it turn itself off, dont turn on but connect the charger til it fully charged. Turn phone on and ill have fully charged battery along with fresh stats.
Is this correct?
vosszaa said:
Now it comes to the question..
If the phone create battery stats every time the phone reboot, then when is the best time to delete and the best way to calibrate?
This is what I normally do..
..delete stats at 5%, let it run dry til it turn itself off, dont turn on but connect the charger til it fully charged. Turn phone on and ill have fully charged battery along with fresh stats.
Is this correct?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
On the SGS theres no real point in deleting it, unless you dont really wanna see the battery go down to 35% and stay there for a while, how ever busted your battery indicator is it gets very accurate as the lower it goes.
I never found batterystats made any difference. What did make a difference is the rom or kernel, what widgets, lagfix e.t.c
If you get more than 1% battery drain per 5hr standby then something is wrong
Sent from my GT-I9000 using XDA App
android53 said:
I never found batterystats made any difference. What did make a difference is the rom or kernel, what widgets, lagfix e.t.c
If you get more than 1% battery drain per 5hr standby then something is wrong
Sent from my GT-I9000 using XDA App
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I find that conclusion quite flawed.
First of all, what's your definition of standby?
3g on? Wireless on? Autosync on? There are also noticeable differences between different firmwares and between 2.1 and 2.2.
In addition, most people are reporting somewhere around 1% per 1 hour standby or 1% per 2 hour standby, which it what I have been experiencing as well. Sometimes, apparently for no reason, it can drain faster than that, maybe 1% per 0,5 hour or more. I think this might be some widgets fault.
1%/5h standby 3g no sync
i get 1%/2h with data and sync
Depends on your reception, im just basically saying if your losing say 8% battery overnight or more then something is wrong unless your polling several push email accounts
As a Captivate owner, I know that we aren't the luckiest smartphone owners when it comes to battery capacity. Since I first got my phone, I've struggled to keep it above 10% by the end of the day even on the stock ROM. My battery currently drains at about 1% every 10-20 minutes when idle, or every 2 minutes under load, but enough about me.
Using "Spare Parts" or a similar app, could some other users please post what their battery voltage reads at 100% (off charger) and at 1% (off charger). For me, those values are
4243mV at 100%
3510mV at 1% (read with multimeter)
Hopefully this will give us a reference for more accurate battery health/calibration.
The ADC might be a little off. 4235mV is the maximum safe voltage for Li-Ion and the phone shuts off when it reaches 3500mV.
Voltage is not as important as current though. The voltage can reach 4.2 with as little as 20% charge and continue charging until cell resistance reaches cutoff. The battery meter is calculated based on current draw accumulated over time (or accumulated * 100 / capacity = percent), which is why you need calibrate or to go from full to empty back to full when the accumulated value is lost. There's better info on this subject in other threads.
For some reason once my phone hits 8% battery life it drops to 2% immediately.
This happens on viperxl & cm, so its not ROM related.
Any ideas on how to fix it? Is there a way to recalibrate the battery ?
Sent from my One X using Tapatalk
There's nothing wrong with your battery. That's normal behaviour when the battery is at such a low level. The battery percentage is never an exact value, it's only an estimate based on the current voltage that is being reported by the battery. When a battery is that low it isn't abnormal at all for it to jump down drastically like that.
On a side note, unless you're performing an initial charge cycle after flashing a new ROM you really shouldn't let your battery deplete to such a low level. With this specify type of battery technology it's quite bad for it and will actually affect the long term life of the battery. The preferred method of charging is to do regular top up charges from anywhere between ~80% and ~30% battery level right up to the 100% mark.
Sent from my Evita
The_Zodiac said:
Any ideas on how to fix it? Is there a way to recalibrate the battery ?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
There is no such thing as "recalibrating the battery". This term is sometimes used by folks who confuse Li ion technology with old NiCad batteries that need to be "conditioned".
What you may mean is recalibrating the battery meter, which has to do with software, not battery chemistry. Battery meter is usually not accurate after a ROM flash, and should be recalibrated. This is done by charging to 100% (let it sit for half hour or so at full, to ensure any saturation charge is achieved) then deplete until around 10 or 20%.
Other than that, the meter is as accurate as its going to get. As timmaaa already stated, the battery % is just an inaccurate approximation of the amount of usage left that corresponds to various voltages. It often can't be trusted to be accurate to within 1% (or even 5%) increments. And also as timmaa stated, you should not be draining your battery that low on a frequent or habitual basis, as its harmful to the long term life of the battery. Charge frequently.
MPJ 6440mah Extended Battery Review
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Few days ago I received an extended battery for the Note 4 from MPJ.
The size of the battery is x2.5-x3 bigger than the original Samsung one.
It holds up to 6440mah and the packages comes with an extra back cover for your Note 4.
As we can see from the picture above the design is user friendly and the colours match exactly as they should match. Overall the design is not boring and it is eye catching.
Now the back cover has a gloss finish and it is also thicker and taller so the battery can fit correctly.
It does add an extra bulk to your device but from my perspective I don’t think it’s that much noticeable. Note 4 is already a big phone adding some extra height won’t be a problem, but yes it doesn’t look as good as with the original back cover. I had zero problems in everyday use with that back cover, not even with pockets.
Now let’s start talking about the battery life and how it performs!
Day 1 :
The battery life was just how I expected! As we saw earlier the battery has 6440mah which means 2x3220mah which is the capacity of your Note 4 original battery. With the OEM battery you can get 6 hours of Screen On Time (SOT) in 16-18 hours of total use. With this extended battery I managed to get 12 hours of SOT from the very first day! How awesome is that ? The pictures below talk by them selves.
Day 2 :
I have charged my phone through the AC. The battery life was awful! Only 7:30 hours of SOT, which can be achieved from the original battery also. I think my AC in that specific room is a little bit faulty that’s why the battery drained out so quickly.
GameBench :
I ran also GameBench to test out how many hours the battery can hold up playing Traffic Racer. I have played for 15 minutes and i lost 3% of battery juice. GameBench claims that the phone can last 6.5 hours playing this game from a full charge.
Day 3 :
I have recharged the battery from 7% to 100% from a power bank and I am at 62% at the moment with 4 hours of SOT and 10 hours of total use. That means the battery is doing better than Day 2.
In total i got 11 hours of SOT and 1 day and 4 hours of total use, which is great! I managed to get 2days with a single charge check out the screenshots below
The battery charges quite fast, i managed to charge it from 8% to 100% in 2 hours and 5 minutes.
Conclusion :
Pros :
- Battery performs great, it can last 2 days with medium to heavy use and can reach up to 12 hours of SOT
- In very light use it can last up to 3 days. (It drains 2% every 8 hours on idle with WiFi on)
- Full Idle can last up to 5 days (I believe even more)
- Beautiful Design and Colors match perfectly
- Feels great in the hand
- The extra bulk is NOT a problem
- You can buy it either with NFC or without
- The cutouts for the speaker,S Pen, Camera are perfectly aligned in the correct position
- It does add some kind of protection
Cons :
- The back cover has a gloss finish, it would be much better if it had a leather texture like the Original Cover
- Charging on AC is very slow compared to Power Bank
- The battery without the back cover can fell off , its not tight enough.
Overall its a great battery, having 12 hours of SOT is amazing.
The extra bulk was no problem for me instead the phone is heavier and it feels more solid.
I recommend this battery to everyone that uses their Note 4 heavily. People who think that 6 hours of SOT is not enough should get this battery.The only downside is the back cover, I wish it could have a more premium feel although I will continue to use this battery on daily basis
You can buy your own MPJ extended battery from here :
http://www.mpjbattery.com/mpj-6440m...10r4-n910t-n910a-n910v-n910p-eb-bn910bbe.html
NOTE : When restarting the phone you get some extra juice between (10-30%) , that happens because the phone can read up to 3220mah and it gets confused with that extra battery power.
great review... I have no experience with extended battery but maybe i am going to try
chaRast said:
great review... I have no experience with extended battery but maybe i am going to try
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Thank you mate!
You should give it a try! 12hours of SOT is just crazy
Sent from my SM-N910F using XDA Free mobile app
patriotaki said:
NOTE : .....the phone can read up to 3220mah and it gets confused with that extra battery power.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I do appreciate your review but that particular statement is not true at all because when you run the battery sensor display codes display stats and battery tests results are clearly denoted in voltage which is the key component in determining the battery life in percentage, not just in phones but world wide industrial and domestic battery applications. There's no way it reads in mAh. I studied battery technologies and applications in campus and in all our test runs about batteries the voltage was the key component in determining battery % never the mAh capacity which also varies infinitely because of the apparent resistance the circuit in it will give. Therefore you cannot use a infinitely varying component to determine a definite component.. NOT POSSIBLE! Voltage is still used to date in all battery run applications as the key determining factor in battery life. Just study how the intelligent battery charger works and you will see it clearly for yourself, that in the note 4 the 9v fast charge is actually the bulk phase in charging the battery, then comes the absorption stage and finally float which both require the 5v charge to complete these two processes that follow. So effectively not requiring the 9v all the way through and dropping to the regular 5v which effectively charges the battery very very well to within 90-95% of it's theoretical capacity. There's no way the phone reads in mAh because the A in mAh is totally load dependent as I have pointed it out previously.
The process you are observing there is taking place exclusively in the battery and is designated as the Redox reaction that when a battery suddenly is unloaded with a load requiring a significant current to run, the process of providing electrons still continues but because it doesn't discharge through the load (as it has been removed), electrons now build up at the cathode so that when the phone now turns ON, it finds a higher potential difference between the anode and the cathode which in turn the phone reads as a higher voltage hence translates that to higher % battery life.
Proof: leave any set of discharged batteries lying around for a while then come later and measure their voltage, tell me whether the voltage that you left them with is the same as it reads now. That is proof of the Redox reaction in ALL batteries.
Purchase one from here
http://www.mpjbattery.com/mpj-6440m...10r4-n910t-n910a-n910v-n910p-eb-bn910bbe.html
Sent from my SM-N910F using XDA Free mobile app
I had a bad experience with my order from these guys. My batter for my S5 never came to me. How was your shipping experience with MPJ?
i root SGH i777 said:
I had a bad experience with my order from these guys. My batter for my S5 never came to me. How was your shipping experience with MPJ?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Pretty fast From Germany to Greece 2 weeks
Sent from my SM-N910F using XDA Free mobile app
Any nice case out there for this extended battery??
patriotaki said:
Thank you mate!
You should give it a try! 12hours of SOT is just crazy
Sent from my SM-N910F using XDA Free mobile app
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I read your review and it looks quite interesting. I have tried many "fake" extended batteries, are sure this is the one ?
Do they ship fast in Athens ?
Kernel ranger said:
I do appreciate your review but that particular statement is not true at all because when you run the battery sensor display codes display stats and battery tests results are clearly denoted in voltage which is the key component in determining the battery life in percentage, not just in phones but world wide industrial and domestic battery applications. There's no way it reads in mAh. I studied battery technologies and applications in campus and in all our test runs about batteries the voltage was the key component in determining battery % never the mAh capacity which also varies infinitely because of the apparent resistance the circuit in it will give. Therefore you cannot use a infinitely varying component to determine a definite component.. NOT POSSIBLE! Voltage is still used to date in all battery run applications as the key determining factor in battery life. Just study how the intelligent battery charger works and you will see it clearly for yourself, that in the note 4 the 9v fast charge is actually the bulk phase in charging the battery, then comes the absorption stage and finally float which both require the 5v charge to complete these two processes that follow. So effectively not requiring the 9v all the way through and dropping to the regular 5v which effectively charges the battery very very well to within 90-95% of it's theoretical capacity. There's no way the phone reads in mAh because the A in mAh is totally load dependent as I have pointed it out previously.
The process you are observing there is taking place exclusively in the battery and is designated as the Redox reaction that when a battery suddenly is unloaded with a load requiring a significant current to run, the process of providing electrons still continues but because it doesn't discharge through the load (as it has been removed), electrons now build up at the cathode so that when the phone now turns ON, it finds a higher potential difference between the anode and the cathode which in turn the phone reads as a higher voltage hence translates that to higher % battery life.
Proof: leave any set of discharged batteries lying around for a while then come later and measure their voltage, tell me whether the voltage that you left them with is the same as it reads now. That is proof of the Redox reaction in ALL batteries.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Not entirely true. While not all devices will use current sensing for measuring consumption of power, voltage alone is not an accurate reading of a lithium battery's state of charge. The discharge curve between 3.7V nominal and 3.4 is the bulk of the battery's capacity. Yes it may be 4.2V at full charge, but as soon as you put a load that will quickly drop to 4V, even 3.9V depending on screen brightness or total current draw (heavy CPU activity, etc). It will then remain at that nominal voltage level (roughly 3.7V) through 60% or more of the battery's capacity. Voltage drop under load can be used, but you still need to know what that load is. If I have read correctly, phones that do not have current sensing capabilities have a "table" that outlines what parameters will equate to what mA current draw. IE: 75% screen brightness with 20% CPU load is about equal to 450mA current draw (pulling those figures out of my a** here, not factual)
I couldn't find the exact picture I was looking for, but here is an example of lithium based batteries' discharge graphs. Granted these are under constant load scenarios, but the point is made. Voltage alone is not an accurate reading of a lithium (whatever, ion, FE, cobalt, etc) battery. I know these aren't lithium ion batteries so the voltage levels are different, but the graph looks very similar, just different voltages. Again all these graphs are all under a constant load scenario, something our phones do NOT have the privelage of doing. Current load is always changing, from screen brightness, cellular/GPS radios, CPU/GPU activity, etc.
The Redox reaction is only applicable in a no load scenario. Discharge a 1S 1000mah battery at 1 Amp for 30 minutes. Let's assume everything is perfect, you will have consumed 500mah of power, and voltage will probably be about 3.5V under load, and 3.7 under rest. Let it sit (at the same temperature it was under load, say 35C), and come back a little later. Yes voltage may have climbed to 3.8V but as soon as you put a load it will quickly drop.
I'm not fully educated on how phones determine state of charge, but I'm guessing it is more software based on a combination of voltage level, and ASSUMED current draw based on those "tables" I mentioned above. Some phones do actually have current sensing built in. I think some of my older HTC phones would actually give you mA current draw, and could log mAH consumption.
"Smart charging" or whatever you want to call it is merely limiting current once cell voltage reaches 4.2V. This is why the last 20% of a charge takes longer than the first 80%. If voltage rises, current drops. Don't see the correlation to that in terms of measuring a discharge capacity.
Temperature also plays a large role in a lithium's voltage level. I'm an avid R/C guy, flying helicopters mainly. We use large 6 Cell 5000mah lithium polymer batteries with 35C discharge capabilities. If you were to charge your battery in the garage in the winter, and the cells were all balanced at 4.2V per cell after charging. You bring that battery inside to a toasty house that voltge could climb to 4.25 or 4.3/cell. Not a good thing but it allowed you to squeeze a little more capacity into your battery for that extra 10 seconds of flying. Granted our motors are pulling upwards of 10Kw (yes, 10,000 watts or more) so I'm sure it was negligible, but still it made you feel like you were getting more. Getting off topic here, sorry.
http://www.mpoweruk.com/soc.htm
Problems can occur with some cell chemistries however, particularly Lithium which exhibits only a very small change in voltage over most of the charge/discharge cycle. The following graph shows the discharge curve for a high capacity Lithium-ion cell. This is ideal for the battery application in that the cell voltage does not fall appreciably as the cell is discharged, but for the same reason, the actual cell voltage is not a good measure of the SOC of the cell.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
---------- Post added at 12:34 PM ---------- Previous post was at 12:21 PM ----------
patriotaki said:
MPJ 6440mah Extended Battery Review
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Was there any documentation with the battery that stated whether or not you could use fast charging with this battery? I'm assuming since you said it charged in a little over 2 hours that you kept fast charging enabled.
I'm looking for an extend battery, the zero lemon is just too big for me so I like this one better.
Only downside is not being able to find a diztronic style "case" for it any longer. Just a slim rubber case similar to the diztronic that I love so much.
---------- Post added at 12:37 PM ---------- Previous post was at 12:34 PM ----------
Just ordered it
Also FYI this battery is on Amazon prime WITH NFC for $26.99
http://www.amazon.com/Extended-Batt...1454348203&sr=8-3&keywords=MPJ+note+4+battery
Received my MPJ Battery today, unfortunately the case doesn't close on all 4 sides. No matter how I do it, either the left side or the right side won't snap shut. Hopefully the replacement works better. Can't wait to see how much SOT I can get though. Had an extended battery with my Note 2 and loved it.
poor_red_neck said:
Not entirely true. While not all devices will use current sensing for measuring consumption of power, voltage alone is not an accurate reading of a lithium battery's state of charge. The discharge curve between 3.7V nominal and 3.4 is the bulk of the battery's capacity. Yes it may be 4.2V at full charge, but as soon as you put a load that will quickly drop to 4V, even 3.9V depending on screen brightness or total current draw (heavy CPU activity, etc). It will then remain at that nominal voltage level (roughly 3.7V) through 60% or more of the battery's capacity. Voltage drop under load can be used, but you still need to know what that load is. If I have read correctly, phones that do not have current sensing capabilities have a "table" that outlines what parameters will equate to what mA current draw. IE: 75% screen brightness with 20% CPU load is about equal to 450mA current draw (pulling those figures out of my a** here, not factual)
I couldn't find the exact picture I was looking for, but here is an example of lithium based batteries' discharge graphs. Granted these are under constant load scenarios, but the point is made. Voltage alone is not an accurate reading of a lithium (whatever, ion, FE, cobalt, etc) battery. I know these aren't lithium ion batteries so the voltage levels are different, but the graph looks very similar, just different voltages. Again all these graphs are all under a constant load scenario, something our phones do NOT have the privelage of doing. Current load is always changing, from screen brightness, cellular/GPS radios, CPU/GPU activity, etc.
The Redox reaction is only applicable in a no load scenario. Discharge a 1S 1000mah battery at 1 Amp for 30 minutes. Let's assume everything is perfect, you will have consumed 500mah of power, and voltage will probably be about 3.5V under load, and 3.7 under rest. Let it sit (at the same temperature it was under load, say 35C), and come back a little later. Yes voltage may have climbed to 3.8V but as soon as you put a load it will quickly drop.
I'm not fully educated on how phones determine state of charge, but I'm guessing it is more software based on a combination of voltage level, and ASSUMED current draw based on those "tables" I mentioned above. Some phones do actually have current sensing built in. I think some of my older HTC phones would actually give you mA current draw, and could log mAH consumption.
"Smart charging" or whatever you want to call it is merely limiting current once cell voltage reaches 4.2V. This is why the last 20% of a charge takes longer than the first 80%. If voltage rises, current drops. Don't see the correlation to that in terms of measuring a discharge capacity.
Temperature also plays a large role in a lithium's voltage level. I'm an avid R/C guy, flying helicopters mainly. We use large 6 Cell 5000mah lithium polymer batteries with 35C discharge capabilities. If you were to charge your battery in the garage in the winter, and the cells were all balanced at 4.2V per cell after charging. You bring that battery inside to a toasty house that voltge could climb to 4.25 or 4.3/cell. Not a good thing but it allowed you to squeeze a little more capacity into your battery for that extra 10 seconds of flying. Granted our motors are pulling upwards of 10Kw (yes, 10,000 watts or more) so I'm sure it was negligible, but still it made you feel like you were getting more. Getting off topic here, sorry.
http://www.mpoweruk.com/soc.htm
---------- Post added at 12:34 PM ---------- Previous post was at 12:21 PM ----------
Was there any documentation with the battery that stated whether or not you could use fast charging with this battery? I'm assuming since you said it charged in a little over 2 hours that you kept fast charging enabled.
I'm looking for an extend battery, the zero lemon is just too big for me so I like this one better.
Only downside is not being able to find a diztronic style "case" for it any longer. Just a slim rubber case similar to the diztronic that I love so much.
---------- Post added at 12:37 PM ---------- Previous post was at 12:34 PM ----------
Just ordered it
Also FYI this battery is on Amazon prime WITH NFC for $26.99
http://www.amazon.com/Extended-Batt...1454348203&sr=8-3&keywords=MPJ+note+4+battery
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You have a good expo because as you say not all phones use precise mechanisms to determine battery charge but for a flagship model like the Note 4 we can't afford that kind of mediocrity. I was only addressing the part where the battery seems to acquire charge after a reboot which temporalily actually occurs due to the temp no load situation.
After reading all of the comments i decided and ordered the battery. Can anyone inform me, when the battery arrives, do i use it until it drains and charge for 8-10 hours ? or do i put on charge immediately and after 8-10 hours use it ?
nikoldm said:
After reading all of the comments i decided and ordered the battery. Can anyone inform me, when the battery arrives, do i use it until it drains and charge for 8-10 hours ? or do i put on charge immediately and after 8-10 hours use it ?
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I also ordered this battery after reading this review because my note4 had an insane battery loss about 20% in 1 hours!!!
If you want to know the method about How to Check Battery Health? then you simple click given below link and see the complete method. In this way, you can also see the sumsang mobile battery health here.
Click here: How to Check Battery Health
If only it really did...
That doesn't really tell much about its health other than relative power level (of current "full" capacity rather than what its capacity was when new)*.
The only valuable information is the actual SOT and the screen off time power consumption.
The current ones vs what these values were when the battery was new, roughly.
The charging curve may also indicate erratic fast charging which can be a sign of a failed Li.
A swollen battery is a failure. A bulging rear cover or display is the only warning you'll get.
Even then the battery condition will still be reported as "Good"
To avoid a failure and possibly destroying the display, even the whole phone, replace Li's when they fall below 80% of their original capacity.
At 50% it's clearly noticable as run time is cut in half of what it was when new.
Don't wait for it to fail. A degraded Li is much more likely to fail than one in good condition.
*% is based on cell voltage not current capacity.
As a cell degrades it still charges to near the same voltage as new but its current capacity slowly declines. So the battery % indicator provides only one of two needed parameters to gauge battery health. VxA=Watts
The phone's wattage use is constant as is the required voltage for V+. The phone's power controller uses more amps as the battery voltage falls to maintain a constant V+ and mAh.
Accubattery gives useful power usage logs to help gauge excessive power usage and monitor battery decline.
This is what a healthy battery's usage pattern looks like. This battery is 4 months old.