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I am constantly seeing blogs about fragmentation and how it is poisoning the well for developers. I personal think it is a load of crap, but i thought i would ask the developers.
What do you guys think?
Is fragmentation an issue?
YES, it could be an issue if Google did nothing to fix it, but they are:
http://www.engadget.com/2010/03/29/exclusive-android-froyo-to-take-a-serious-shot-at-stemming-plat/
Not pretending to be an expert, or even a developer, but plenty of apps didn't cross well from various WinMo builds, or devices. WinMo fragmentation hasn't been trending. It's a rhetorical buzzword sustained by iPhanbois, imo.
bwhite82 said:
YES, it could be an issue if Google did nothing to fix it, but they are:
http://www.engadget.com/2010/03/29/exclusive-android-froyo-to-take-a-serious-shot-at-stemming-plat/
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Yea I saw that too
It's just today we are suppose to be in fragmentation hell... It's just i don't see it.
Once in a while i will tell my friend with a Samsung Moment about an app, and for some reason he does not see it in the market, but this is few and far between.
I chose yes but I doubt it will kill android. It is annoying though to have a phone that is way behind because the maker of the custom UI is too lazy to do anything.
It did not kill the pc, or Windows for that matter. It will probably be gaming benefiting the most of future power increases.
Yeah, iFanboys are the most common people to critizise android for fragmentation - but they are not safe either.
Now with 2g, 3g, 3gs and ipad - and all having diffrent hardware in one way or another - they will also experience fragmentation. Esp. now that OS4 wont be feature-complete on 3g vs 3gs - and ipad wont get it until later.
Just because android got 3 res (320, 480 and 800) doesnt mean that it will be problems since 1.6 came out. Sure they need to fix/force vendors to upgrade handsets to latest android, so that people wont be left out - but since 1.6 that problem is much smaller, and there aint many handsets left out there with builds earlier then 1.6.
It's a problem.
Why do you think there are so many apps that are rated lowly on the market because of incompatibilities.
If there was only 1 phone and 1 version of android to code for, then bugs and compatibility would nearly be a thing of the past.
I think it's an issue, but a minor one. I'd rather them improve the OS rapidly and deal with not being able to use some apps, than sit with a stagnate OS but have more apps.
Like the other poster said though, they are going to try to fix it after 2.2 and work on making apps more compatible with all OS versions.
Hell, at least they realize it's a problem. Microsoft sure didn't give a ****, and doesn't now with 7 series.
Because of the "vendor delay" and the frequent Android releases, Android phones seem to have a 5-month lifecycle (my 1.5 Magic is 6 months old now, and I still can't use Donut/Eclair apps like Goggles, Maps w/ Buzz and many new apps that require 1.6+).
Access to applications is what makes most people buy smartphones. Remove or limit this, and people will switch to other vendors or platforms.
For people that root and switch custom roms, this doesn't seem like a big issue. But the majority of the users won't have access to all the new 1.6/2.1 apps being released on the market.
clamknuckle said:
I think it's an issue, but a minor one. I'd rather them improve the OS rapidly and deal with not being able to use some apps, than sit with a stagnate OS but have more apps.
Like the other poster said though, they are going to try to fix it after 2.2 and work on making apps more compatible with all OS versions.
Hell, at least they realize it's a problem. Microsoft sure didn't give a ****, and doesn't now with 7 series.
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@Clam*, you're right about them realizing it's a problem and working on it.
I believe they plan to have every phone running the same version of android, but with many add-ons available from the market.
This is surely a desirable route. Might it never happen? I haven't the slightest.
Alternatively a big pack of goodies you can get from online or preferrably the market that has all the addons depending on the sufficiency of phone hardware.
Hell, better yet! It could be part of the "first use tutorial" we all know and love
The first time the user turns on the phone after entering google info etc. they can check all the options they want and it will automatically download them from googles servers and set them up on the phone.
Very reminiscent of certain linux installations with addons from repositories.
OpenSuSE comes to mind.
Or to speed that process up, the phone retailer can install the addons specific for that phone.
Though it would still be nice to have the option to checkmark features at our own whim, allowing the system to discard the rest for example.
Of course if the addons were discarded or never installed by phone retailers in the first place they could still be downloaded from googles servers automatically.
**To Google Gods: It would be nice to have such options in the settings where we could enable and disable features and have them download or be discarded in the background**
There are so many methods out there to make fragmentation nothing more than a bygone.
I hope Google can turn this OS into what I've dreamed (figuratively) that it could be..
Ahh how I concieve ideas that will likely never occur..
Sorry.. i could write volumes about my futile ideas for the world, though I'm too hopeful and eager.
I'm sad to say..
"Such is our reality serving as the torrent thrusting back creative thought." -me
I've been looking at Android m since it came out.
However my oem will not be supporting the majority of my devices
(That's you Samsung 2 year support has me thinking of never buying your product new again).(Not that many others are much better).
So with the bugs that are ever present in custom Android roms and the developer never ending rush to the next update while the last aosp is not retail stable on most devices(come on Google wait two years and get the base or rock solid already before messing yet again with things).(I understand developers want to play with new features and new devices, but so many people have a 2 y old very capable device that just needs security updates). I have been reluctant to update from 4.4 that most of my devices run solid on.
How much more security has Android m brought to the table?
Is the permission manager worth the update from 4.4 or 5.1 ?
With all the new apps supporting permission denial without crashing going benefit the older os with permission blockers or xprivacy running?
Is the permission paranoid user better off waiting until the last minute to update to miss the worst of the bugs left to squash or just jump in now and live with them?
What is your opinion?
Nope, the permission manager isn't worth the update.
System apps crash when you restrict them too much, even if you restrict permissions they don't need to work properly, which wasn't the case in pre Marsh Mellow ROMs.
Oh well, they crash if you restrict them through the built-in permission management system bla bla, but they probably won't if you restrict them with third part apps...
Plus, at least on the phone I'm currently working on (but I guess it must be the same on all Mesh Mallow phones), the permission system became very dishonest, to say the least.
When you install a new app you don't see all the permissions you are about to grant but only the categories (remember the last changes in the play sore?), which tricks you into wrongly believing that the app doesn't have too many perms. Once installed you can't review neither the permissions nor the categories, pfuut, gone with the wind...
All this "security" hype about Ma Shallow isn't really about security but about making you feel that thanks to google and its well known abnegation you are secure and that you don't need anything more to protect you further.
There's nothing worse than a false sense of security...
What else to say?
The auto start manager, well done, except that third part apps offered it since the days of ICS, if not GB, and that a script can take care of that stuff without even installing anything.
All in all if security is your thing don't bother, moreover than xposed doesn't work on some Mesh Hollow ROM, leaving you without any other alternatives but to secure your ROM on your own.
It's of course doable if you know how, but it'll take time and a lot of decompilation/recompilation/testing.
New features?
Boah, 2-3 gimmicks as usual, fancy colors animations widgets I don't know what bling bling yo yo, not worth the money unless you really need a new phone.
Security patches?
Boah again, they made everybody paranoid with stagefright and the like but hey, do you really think you'll get hit?
What are the chances, unless you download cracked apps or are naive enough to let anyone touch your phone without the screenlock on?
I'd say more or less the same than meeting Santa Claus in person, do you believe in Santa?
I personally don't but still, those vulnerabilities are good for business, it makes the Santa crowd buy newer and more "secure" phones, cool...
Hi !
I am ex-owner of Nokia 7 Plus and new owner of 8.1. After a few days with this phone, i have noticed, that there's something wrong with multitasking and background services, that are supposed to receive push notifications such as Messenger. Multitasking is a nightmare as compared to Nokia 7 Plus or Zenfone 2. Phone closes running apps and cleans RAM too quickly/ too aggresively. The same thing happens to push enabled apps such as Messenger, Facebook etc. Notifications appear with big delay (up to 5 minutes). I have made a discovery and i have noticed, that Adaptive Battery keeps turning back on itself + according to https://dontkillmyapp.com the problem is that one nasty system APK called "Battery Saving" (com.evenwell.powersaving.g3). I can tell this APK is a troublemaker, because once force closed, problem is gone until next reboot. It can't be disabled permanently. It's frustrating.
The faster Nokia gets rid of this APK or fixes it, the better.
I haven't encountered any delays with respect to the delivery of my notifications. But I do agree that some apps are killed way too early whereas they should be kept in memory. Maybe they are just trying to find a balance between users who want more battery backup and those who need constantly running apps in the background. I do not mind closed apps, but all I want is a whitelist which ensures me that these few apps will never be touched by the battery optimizer.
I don't face any notification delays or anything like that,and apps over a period of time are and should be removed from background ,that aggressive power saving is from Google itslef not from Nokia ,if someone still wants to make it run all the time then select don't optimise from power options it should help
My kids have a 6.1 but don't appear to have this program in their apps listing, so I'm wondering if maybe it's been removed in a monthly patch at some point? If people are still having this problem, have you tried following the instructions on the linked site (dontkillmyapp) to remove it with ADB?
i dont face notification delay... all good
Supposedly Nokia removed the culprit (evenwell) from their devices, so I take it that all is good now? (I will be receiving the 8.1 today, so wanting to make sure I do my homework).
wrp2015 said:
Supposedly Nokia removed the culprit (evenwell) from their devices, so I take it that all is good now? (I will be receiving the 8.1 today, so wanting to make sure I do my homework).
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I dont think so any company can do like this.
light.apps said:
I dont think so any company can do like this.
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Well, I am glad I returned the device without taking it out of the box because bootloader can't be opened. Got a OnePlus 5T now, so a custom operating system can be installed.
Ok, thanks good for you.
wrp2015 said:
Well, I am glad I returned the device without taking it out of the box because bootloader can't be opened. Got a OnePlus 5T now, so a custom operating system can be installed.
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There is no such apk called com.evenwell.powersaving.g3 on my Nokia 8.1
It is easy to uninstall those aplications, i have a 7 plus and have uninstalled all evenwell cancer of the phone. Check on Nokia 7 plus forums, you need a pc and copy past a command and that's it.
razor17 said:
There is no such apk called com.evenwell.powersaving.g3 on my Nokia 8.1
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Maybe because you have already upgraded to Android 10, which got rid of this package.
Hey guys!
First, my apologies if I am in the wrong section posting. I was not sure where to post. Please move my thread if needed. Thanks!
Second, would someone recommend and/or suggest Android 9 over Android 10 or Android 10 over Android 9? For myself, I really do not like Android 10. When I am referring to Android 10 and I am referring to the original in September and the two updates in September where that last update has a C3 in part of the name, as well as the October Android 10 update. I just do not like any of the updates. Would I be better off going back to Android 9? It is not an issue because I can flash the factory images via ADB when the phone is powered on than Fastboot once the phone is in the flashing mode
Can you explain why you do not like the update?
I personally don't find that there is a lot of difference between 9 and 10, but offcourse 10 has the latest security updates, which might be a reason for you to stay with 10.
Personally I think the biggest noticeable difference between 9 and 10 is the gesture based navigation. However you can turn the Android 9 style navigation back on if you so desire (Settings/System/Gestures/2-button navigation) or even the older 3 button navigation.
Other changes - like dark mode - are also optional. I see little reason to stay on Android 9. Especially since it is not being updated with security updates.
It would be nice if we could continue to use a preferred version but that comes with considerable security risks. If your dislike is purely asthetics, you can try other launchers.
For the sake of security I'll stick with Q10 for now. I have yet to succeed with a direct OTA update even under full stock. If the pending November OTA updates without needing to sideload, I might then install Magisk.
Cool I w up - Micr
alliance1975 said:
For the sake of security I'll stick with Q10 for now. I have yet to succeed with a direct OTA update even under full stock. If the pending November OTA updates without needing to sideload, I might then install Magisk.
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The majority of pushback comes from people USED to Android 9/Pie. I get it; I really do - when folks get comfortable, change scares the bejeebers outta them. Because I never ran Pie before the Pixel 3a came along (and Android 10 was halfway through its beta when the 3a arrived) I was able to go from 8/Oreo to 10 pretty much directly with only one migration issue; the gesture support. Simply not using them (even with Gboard) was an option, however - and one I adopted.
Launchers - Pixel Launcher was one I was already familiar with (from my Android 6 and 7 days); returning to it was therefore rather a relief.
The even bigger surprise is that I'm not rooted - or using a non-stock recovery; the first time I've done that on a smartphone (or any Android device since Android 5). TWRP was a certain install on a smartphone (as certain as doing tax returns every year); now - I could, in fact, care less. I follow TWRP development (and Magisk development as well); however, it's more a case of looking for a reason to install either - so far, nothing in Android 10 has given me a reason to move away from dead-stock. (Basically, it's a NEW sort of comfort - dead stock - for the first time in my Android phone history - IS actually good enough to run un-stepped-on.)
Dark mode requires neither; it's an option in Settings. Same with VoLTE/VoWiFi. Basically, so much for Magisk.
The thing is, you have to be comfortable with dead-stock; being as this is, after all, a developer/tweaker-targeting community, how many folks are actually comfortable running dead-stock?
If you CAN get comfortable running dead-stock, Android 10 on your 3a or 3a XL (or any Pixel, for that matter) makes a ton of sense.
Follow up - Due to Microsoft Launcher changing it's code base, I installed the beta on my Pixel 3a, replacing Pixel Launched as default. Due to new features, Pixel Launcher is in trouble! It is not the support for Dark Mode, third party launchers either have or are adding it. It is being able to use apps as plug ins; two I use now are Word (expected) and Google Calendar (unexpected). How many third party launchers let you use a system app - even Calendar - as a plug in directly. While Outlook for Android does, it is still nice to have Launcher do so as well. This very post is another example - I have added the XDA app as a plug in. Depending on how often you use an app, using it as a plug in May be faster than as a shortcut.
Im a new pixel user, i come from Nokia 7 plus (Android 9 - android one program, almost the same as pixel) and simply cant go back to 9...
Im glad my nokia also updated to 10 today , i really like the gestures. And i have been on 9 for 1 1/2 year now...
Nova launcher, gestures work fine on android 10, dark mode is not everywhere but its coming....
PGHammer said:
The majority of pushback comes from people USED to Android 9/Pie. I get it; I really do - when folks get comfortable, change scares the bejeebers outta them. Because I never ran Pie before the Pixel 3a came along (and Android 10 was halfway through its beta when the 3a arrived) I was able to go from 8/Oreo to 10 pretty much directly with only one migration issue; the gesture support. Simply not using them (even with Gboard) was an option, however - and one I adopted.
Launchers - Pixel Launcher was one I was already familiar with (from my Android 6 and 7 days); returning to it was therefore rather a relief.
The even bigger surprise is that I'm not rooted - or using a non-stock recovery; the first time I've done that on a smartphone (or any Android device since Android 5). TWRP was a certain install on a smartphone (as certain as doing tax returns every year); now - I could, in fact, care less. I follow TWRP development (and Magisk development as well); however, it's more a case of looking for a reason to install either - so far, nothing in Android 10 has given me a reason to move away from dead-stock. (Basically, it's a NEW sort of comfort - dead stock - for the first time in my Android phone history - IS actually good enough to run un-stepped-on.)
Dark mode requires neither; it's an option in Settings. Same with VoLTE/VoWiFi. Basically, so much for Magisk.
The thing is, you have to be comfortable with dead-stock; being as this is, after all, a developer/tweaker-targeting community, how many folks are actually comfortable running dead-stock?
If you CAN get comfortable running dead-stock, Android 10 on your 3a or 3a XL (or any Pixel, for that matter) makes a ton of sense.
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I don't know that I had to, but I sideloaded the December update. However, the January update downloaded and installed w/o problem. I have had time to get used to full Q10 stock and it does many nice things. I don't think I'll do root until major changes happen.
Hi
I have a Moto G3 from 2015 bought in the UK.
I have Android 6 on it, since that's the latest one I can update to. Some of my apps stopped working with this version though and require 8.0 or newer. I also noticed that when having things like Firefox, VLC, etc. open at the same time, apps are extremely slow and sometimes crash. I need to go into settings>apps and force close stuff to make the phone usable.
I know this is a terrible phone by 2023 standards, but I only use it for calling, texting, videos, and the occasional app. If it's possible to keep it alive for a while longer instead of buying a new one, I say why not.
I know nothing about Android, ROMs, rooting, or anything like that. All I know is I need a newer version, and some of the apps I use require Google Play to be active (eg. Sleep) and access to Location and some other permissions.
I saw some ROMs on this forum, like several versions of LineageOS, but I don't know if that's what I should get or not. I just want the lightest possible OS that can do everything that my current stock Android 6 can do (or, was able to a few months ago).
Any helpful pointers as to where to start?
Thanks