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I am looking for a file encryption app that is dropbox and multi-platform compatible. I currently use a truecrypt container stored in dropbox for sensitive files that I need under both windows and Linux. Unfortunately, truecrypt doesn't exist for android. So I'm looking for alternatives.
thoughts?
-J
I'm in the same situation. Been hoping truecrypt would come out as an app, but no luck yet. I've been looking at RR File Locker. Looks pretty good and has some good reviews.
Sent from my Thunderbolt using Tapatalk
I have connections with people in investigation / forensics work, and if you have a decent lengthed truecrypt key then they aren't getting anywhere near your files. Honestly, I would stick with it as it's a proven application and provides top notch encryption.
wuala?
Maybe not answering your question exactly but you guys may want to check out Wuala. It works similar to dropbox (but has even more features) and securely encrypts your data before it leaves your machine (unlike dropbox). And of course, there is an android app.
sharkynolike said:
Maybe not answering your question exactly but you guys may want to check out Wuala. It works similar to dropbox (but has even more features) and securely encrypts your data before it leaves your machine (unlike dropbox). And of course, there is an android app.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Hey thanks sharkynolike. I was looking for something like DropBox but due to their security model I was not impressed. DropBox can (if they need to. i.e. warrant, etc) access your files. Wuala encrypts before the file is sent. No one but you has the password.
I did not know about Wuala. Just got storage space there. It is going to make a great backup location and the crypto sells it.
Skickat från min ASUS Eee Pad TF101
pgp?
Have you Considered pgp? Agp on my android and gnupgp on my pc combined with dropbox works for me...
sharkynolike said:
Maybe not answering your question exactly but you guys may want to check out Wuala. It works similar to dropbox (but has even more features) and securely encrypts your data before it leaves your machine (unlike dropbox). And of course, there is an android app.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Wuala seems to fit the bill and has a nice interface. Thanks
jayson269 said:
Hey thanks sharkynolike. I was looking for something like DropBox but due to their security model I was not impressed. DropBox can (if they need to. i.e. warrant, etc) access your files. Wuala encrypts before the file is sent. No one but you has the password.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
This is exactly the reason I recently switched from Dropbox. So far, I am really enjoying Wuala as it does everything dropbox could, plus more. I also like the fact that you can gain additional free storage by trading local storage. Anyway, glad you found it useful.
Just got my Samsung Focus S, and I'm trying to get as much data as I can from my old Samsung Focus over to the new phone. What's the best way of doing this?
image the phone to the sdcard and then change the car.... oh wait.... wp7.... nevermind
that was fun
Bottom line, you can't get there from here.
Anything that has been copied to your PC through Zune (photos, videos, music) can be copied back to your new phone. Also, anything that is already stored in the cloud will still be available. But anything that is solely on your phone (app/game settings & saves, SMS messages, documents created by apps that don't support cloud storage, etc), will be permanently lost.
Microsoft does not provide (or even allow for) any mechanism to make a transferable backup of your device.
ohgood said:
image the phone to the sdcard and then change the car.... oh wait.... wp7.... nevermind
that was fun
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
yea that was productive...NOT!!! go somewhere. Anyway u can't make a backup of one device and transfer it to another but u can reinstall all ur apps from the web marketplace and resync all media once reconnected to Zune. Text messages and game saves will be gone unless the games get updated for cloud saves.
Sent from my T7575 using Board Express
any chance of using that custom backup tool and then forcing a restore backup? I know the backups that Zune makes before an update store everything (sms, apps, contacts)
ScottSUmmers said:
any chance of using that custom backup tool and then forcing a restore backup? I know the backups that Zune makes before an update store everything (sms, apps, contacts)
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The backup is just like a Image backup in your Windows, which means any changes after the backup is voided if you restore.
What we want is, a working backup that can backup our precious data like SMS, apps data, etc... so that we can quickly restore it after we reseted our phone or switching to a new phone...
Cheers~
weijoon said:
The backup is just like a Image backup in your Windows, which means any changes after the backup is voided if you restore.
What we want is, a working backup that can backup our precious data like SMS, apps data, etc... so that we can quickly restore it after we reseted our phone or switching to a new phone...
Cheers~
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
No but that's what I'm getting at. If this guy has a new phone, in theory, he'd just have to load the image of backup over the new phone's OS. Unless, Windows Phone freaks out over hardware changes like Windows does
ScottSUmmers said:
No but that's what I'm getting at. If this guy has a new phone, in theory, he'd just have to load the image of backup over the new phone's OS. Unless, Windows Phone freaks out over hardware changes like Windows does
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
To further your knowledge, each backup are encrypted and unique to each phone by reading the device ID and which only restorable to that specific device.
Yeah, means if you switch to new phone, your old phone backup cannot transfer to the new phone
JustinTV773 said:
yea that was productive...NOT!!! go somewhere. Anyway u can't make a backup of one device and transfer it to another but u can reinstall all ur apps from the web marketplace and resync all media once reconnected to Zune. Text messages and game saves will be gone unless the games get updated for cloud saves.
Sent from my T7575 using Board Express
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
you're taking a loyalty to a phone far too seriously here mate.
wp7 could benefit from real, full os imaging, just like -any- digital device that reads/writes zeros and ones could.
imaging a device has aboslutely zero security risk, to the owner, developer of applications, or to the market (hardware) place. the unique device ID (hardware) is enough to ensure software piracy is kept at bay.
its a huge plus to the consumer:
at 3am the phone automagically images it's entire self to microSD, and deletes the oldest past 3 backups, saving two.
sms, gamesaves, offline documents, offline settings, CALL LOGS, and system updates are all in a safe, convenient place.
then just mount the microSD to your computer and copy over the phone images to your computer or encrypt and upload to a secure server.
this means destroying a phone is only a hardware loss. within 10 minutes of recieving a new piece of hardware the entire phone could be as it was before whatever damaged the previous.
how people see this as something that isn't needed is beyond me.
weijoon said:
To further your knowledge, each backup are encrypted and unique to each phone by reading the device ID and which only restorable to that specific device.
Yeah, means if you switch to new phone, your old phone backup cannot transfer to the new phone
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Ah gotcha. Didn't know that.
[/COLOR]
ohgood said:
you're taking a loyalty to a phone far too seriously here mate.
wp7 could benefit from real, full os imaging, just like -any- digital device that reads/writes zeros and ones could.
imaging a device has aboslutely zero security risk, to the owner, developer of applications, or to the market (hardware) place. the unique device ID (hardware) is enough to ensure software piracy is kept at bay.
its a huge plus to the consumer:
at 3am the phone automagically images it's entire self to microSD, and deletes the oldest past 3 backups, saving two.
sms, gamesaves, offline documents, offline settings, CALL LOGS, and system updates are all in a safe, convenient place.
then just mount the microSD to your computer and copy over the phone images to your computer or encrypt and upload to a secure server.
this means destroying a phone is only a hardware loss. within 10 minutes of recieving a new piece of hardware the entire phone could be as it was before whatever damaged the previous.
how people see this as something that isn't needed is beyond me.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I totally agree. I love wp7 and will fight its corner against anything to anyone however if something is missing and needed its still missing and needed! This is one of them things just like vpn. I am 4 days from upgrading to the lumia 800 and i hate the fact i will lose all my game saves esp as some are working towards xbox live points. As i said you cant pretend something isnt needed just because its not there, this is a real shame. To me though it is like loveing my son but i do hate it when he screams at me cos i didnt give him my malteasers. Dont mean i love him any less but i would hope they sort it out. Or ay least give me some malteasers.
ScottSUmmers said:
Ah gotcha. Didn't know that.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Glad that I can help.
ohgood said:
how people see this as something that isn't needed is beyond me.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The most we can do at this point is VOTE UP that feature in the windows phone feature suggestion page and MAYBE microsoft will implement it. That feature has a ****load of votes, cannot remember link. The idea is quite good.
The reason the dude commented on your post was because your initial post did absolutely NOTHING to help the OP, it only satisfied your urge to bash the platform :-/
Very unproductive.
so no way to restore from old phone ..............hmmmmm
What if Microsoft made a feature like the ones found in Windows, the Easy Transfer wizard? They could whip up a feature in Windows Phone settings as "Easy Transfer" and let the user choose how they will transfer the files and settings (wallpaper, sms, system settings, as in ALL including synced emails) from the old phone to the new one, either wifi, or at least bluetooth. EVERYBODEH HAPPEH
I wrote a data backup app for HTC phones a while ago, but nothing for Samsung yet because Heathcliff74 hasn't released a tool for getting filesystem access (like his WP7 Root Tools app does) to other devs yet. No guarantee it'd be immediatley usable anyhow though, since the Focus S seems to use different high-privilege DLLs than the first-gen phones so all our current high-privilege apps (registry editing and provxml and all) don't work yet.
just found a way to get my apps back on my Focus S
Its not quite the end all fix,
but I just bought a focus S and wanted to transfer my apps from my old focus, of course the marketplace doesn't show that I own those apps on my new phone and there's no way to transfer them in Zune, but you can do it through the windowsphone site.
if you log into your windowsLive ID at WindowsPhone.com theres an option to reinstall apps from your purchase history. you just select the phone you want to transfer to, and then you select the app or game and then it sends you a text message to reinstall the app.
its not the greatest way, but atleast you dont have to buy all the stuff over again
newtype311 said:
Its not quite the end all fix,
but I just bought a focus S and wanted to transfer my apps from my old focus, of course the marketplace doesn't show that I own those apps on my new phone and there's no way to transfer them in Zune, but you can do it through the windowsphone site.
if you log into your windowsLive ID at WindowsPhone.com theres an option to reinstall apps from your purchase history. you just select the phone you want to transfer to, and then you select the app or game and then it sends you a text message to reinstall the app.
its not the greatest way, but atleast you dont have to buy all the stuff over again
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Attempting to repurchase an app will simply tell you you've purchased it before and install it for free. So the market doesn't tell you what you've bought before, but there's no risk of repurchasing either.
Mods: Sorry if this thread was posted in the wrong sub-forum, I didn't realize till I was done typing that I was asking a question! Please move to Q&A if it belongs there.
One of the major features I was looking forward to with my new Razr Maxx HD was finally being able to have device encryption similar to what I had with my Blackberry. That's one thing BB really nailed on the head. Today, I finally get around to set up encryption on my phone and I contacted Motorola to ask a few questions. I asked about how to copy files to a PC and what happens with the data on the SD card if the device breaks. The agents reply?
"I do recommend that you don't encrypt your device. Just do the normal process."
I asked her about several scenarios and was told every time that there is no way to copy files from the device to a computer and no way to guarantee that the files will be retrievable even with regular use of the encryption feature that they falsely represent in sales tactics as "government grade encryption" for the device. They use the term to try and sell the phone to serious business people like me, then tell me that they advise against using it at all because the data on the phone may never be able to be retrieved if something happens to the phone. Not to mention that there is no way to copy the files to a PC if you want to do regular backups. I was the one who asked about the possibility of just emailing important files form the phone to myself or uploading them to dropbox, she couldn't even recommend that on her own. All in all, it's a very pathetic situation.
So, what I'm wondering is. Is there anyone who uses device encryption? Have you figured out any way to get around the issue of being unable to backup your files to a PC? I really want to use encryption, I've been missing it for over two years since I switched from BB. I'm not a top secret FBI agent or anything, but I do feel more secure with my personal and business information encrypted. What I'm thinking is, set up Titanium Backup to do a scheduled sync to Dropbox. I haven't done that before, but I think Titanium will do that. This should cover pretty much anything on the phone itself. Now, what I am wondering, is there something similar to Titanium Backup that can backup contents of the SD card to the cloud? I already have Dropsnap uploading my photos to Dropbox, so those are safe, but I would like to backup the rest of my data from the SD card too. Seems any way the phone can send the files to a server would basically be a good way to backup data in an unencrypted state. I just don't know of any solution for that for the SD card.
This is a very disappointing thing about the encryption, I'm hoping someone here has some ideas!
gadsden,
One app that I am fond of for transferring any type of file from my phone to the cloud is FolderSync. It can sync any type of file to the more popular cloud services (Dropbox, Box, Google Drive, etc.), and it has a lot of additional functionality such as move files around on your phone (internal storage to SD, SD to cloud, cloud to SD, etc.), instant syncs, scheduled syncs, widgets for syncing on demand, and more.
It's just under $3, but it's well worth the functionality it brings and it may be what you are looking for. Definitely worth a look at regardless.
madkel said:
gadsden,
One app that I am fond of for transferring any type of file from my phone to the cloud is FolderSync. It can sync any type of file to the more popular cloud services (Dropbox, Box, Google Drive, etc.), and it has a lot of additional functionality such as move files around on your phone (internal storage to SD, SD to cloud, cloud to SD, etc.), instant syncs, scheduled syncs, widgets for syncing on demand, and more.
It's just under $3, but it's well worth the functionality it brings and it may be what you are looking for. Definitely worth a look at regardless.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Cool, that seems like it will do exactly what I want. I'm definitely going to give it a try, thanks!
So, as of Android 12, rightfully so: https://developer.android.com/about/versions/12/backup-restore
For apps running on and targeting Android 12 and higher:
Specifying android:allowBackup="false" does disable backups to Google Drive, but doesn’t disable D2D transfers for the app.
Specifying include and exclude rules with the XML configuration mechanism no longer affects D2D transfers, though it still affects Google Drive backups. To specify rules for D2D transfers, you must use the new configuration covered in the next section.
So, is there a way to use adb or something else to access this functionality so that we can make PC backups of app data?
This is the 1 Achilles Heel of Android: you can't make backups of all app data.
I want to make an Android app or PC app that makes use of this D2D app-data transfer functionality so that users can backup their app-data with ease and peace-of-mind.
Read this review of the companion app for this feature that Google has for Pixels.
At least I think this is the app for that and it doesn't look too good:
Data Transfer Tool - Apps on Google Play
Restore apps and more from an old phone
play.google.com
That being said, this might be just that one app and other OEMs might simply elect to not have these restrictions, but it's something I had been wondering myself for a while when I read that Google chooses to replace adb backup with a function that's curiously not called a backup anymore, but a transfer tool.
It's not that uncommon for stipulations like these to be the difference between a backup and a transfer.
Definitely something to look out for.
Not allowing easy and complete app-data back-ups is user-hostile.
iOS isn't perfect but much better about this because it allows complete backups via iTunes or Finder.
And, I think this Data Transfer Tool app is either Pixel-only or that OEMs implement it or include it themselves directly.
I agree, it is very hostile and I'm honestly puzzled why backups that are transferable within various Android flavors at least for third-party apps aren't legally required of Google by now.
The EU is going ahead to mandate that all charging ports on mobiles should have the same standard when there are already only 2, but this **** is allowed to fly?
Absolutely ridiculous and out of touch.
Too bad I care about long-term support in terms of security patches and features like a usable pen (S-Pen), otherwise I'd be on some Xiaomi phone where apparently complete backups are a reality.
Glassed Silver said:
Too bad I care about long-term support in terms of security patches and features like a usable pen (S-Pen), otherwise I'd be on some Xiaomi phone where apparently complete backups are a reality.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Does Xiaomi beat Smart Switch and grab the app-data of apps that don't have that backup boolean set to true?
Smart Switch grabs the app-data of all apps that have that backup boolean set to True. And, you can backup to an external HDD via a USB-C hub also. This beats Google hands down.
iOS has been doing this since forever. I don't understand the delay in implementing this very basic feature. No apps should be allowed to bypass this requirement.
nixnixnixnix4 said:
So, is there a way to use adb or something else to access this functionality so that we can make PC backups of app data?
This is the 1 Achilles Heel of Android: you can't make backups of all app data.
I want to make an Android app or PC app that makes use of this D2D app-data transfer functionality so that users can backup their app-data with ease and peace-of-mind.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Try this:
[TOOL][ADB][WIN]Android Partitions Backupper / Cloner
Hi all, wrote a Windows CMD script that backups / clones partitions of an Android device via ADB because I wasn't content with any 3rd-party APK what claims to do this job. The backups /clones are stored on Windows computer as...
forum.xda-developers.com
jwoegerbauer said:
Try this:
[TOOL][ADB][WIN]Android Partitions Backupper / Cloner
Hi all, wrote a Windows CMD script that backups / clones partitions of an Android device via ADB because I wasn't content with any 3rd-party APK what claims to do this job. The backups /clones are stored on Windows computer as...
forum.xda-developers.com
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Unless you can grab the app-data as a restorable package, the way adb does, this won't make life easier.
nixnixnixnix4 said:
Does Xiaomi beat Smart Switch and grab the app-data of apps that don't have that backup boolean set to true?
Smart Switch grabs the app-data of all apps that have that backup boolean set to True. And, you can backup to an external HDD via a USB-C hub also. This beats Google hands down.
iOS has been doing this since forever. I don't understand the delay in implementing this very basic feature. No apps should be allowed to bypass this requirement.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
From what I've read yes.
Xiaomi being a Chinese company I guess they just don't give much of a toss about what those app devs think should be happening to the app data, which in this instance is a good thing for the user, however I don't really trust my valuable data to Xiaomi in general, so I'd rather steer clear of that company.
I just cannot trust them. It's got nothing to do with them being Chinese, but them being at the direct whim of the CCP.
Actually same for Huawei where I have to admit to still own a MediaPad 8.4 for manga reading, but I'm really picky about what I put on there and am actively looking for a replacement. Something with 8 inches (perfect manga reading screen size) and somewhat decent specs and build quality that comes with Android and ample security patch timeline.
Basically I'm waiting for something like a Galaxy Tab S7 in 8 inches. Yeah, that'd be pretty fly. No A-line please, I'd really like an S-Pen on it, especially since I'm not too certain I want to go with a foldable phone after my Note20, but I for sure want to keep using an S-Pen...
Glassed Silver said:
however I don't really trust my valuable data to Xiaomi in general, so I'd rather steer clear of that company.
I just cannot trust them. It's got nothing to do with them being Chinese, but them being at the direct whim of the CCP.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Rumor is: If a Xiaomi phone hears you say the word "Tibet" more than 3 times, it will explode.
Hello community!
I think this is the best place to ask this question as this is a forum of default for all developers.
Why is Android not providing backup of app data?
On iOS, factory reset and restore is a breeze. The process is extremely simple, and there is absolutely no user intervention required after a factory reset. iOS simply puts everything in its place as if nothing happened. Same is true for macOS, WatchOS & iPadOS. This is just a wonderful implementation. The only limitation is if an existing app is no longer available on the Apple AppStore. In that case, the app data would still remain in the cloud (or iTunes backup), and can be easily restored if the app (.ipa file) is backed up using iTunes (or similar 3rd party software).
Can someone answer why the same is not available on Android, despite it being the more versatile software?
As far as I know, backup over ADB isn't reliable. And more importantly, ADB isn't for everyone.
Thanks.
android is google. there exist native backup option to backup app data in google drive. adb backup is androids native backup option. it will save apps data to PC and can restored even to other devices.
so your question should be, why android provides solution to app developers protecting their app data from backup.
aIecxs said:
android is google. there exist native backup option to backup app data in google drive. adb backup is androids native backup option. it will save apps data to PC and can restored even to other devices.
so your question should be, why android provides solution to app developers protecting their app data from backup.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The native backup solution doesn't backup most of the apps data. As a result, most things must be setup from scratch after a factory reset. The process isn't automatic and requires plenty of manual work. This is clear from the numbers below:
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Size of actual backup:
It is clear that most apps are not backed up, and only a very few apps' data is included, which I believe is mostly Google stuff.
That said, why does Android allow developers to prevent their apps' data from being backed up? This doesn't make sense because the data belongs to the user, not the developer of the app.
what you don't understand app data can be perfectly backed up. it's just the app developers they decide whether it's allowed or not. It's controlled in AndroidManifest.xml
android:allowBackup="true" API level < 30
android:debuggable="true" API level > 30
https://developer.android.com/about/versions/12/behavior-changes-12#adb-backup-restrictions
btw your screenshots refer to EXTERNAL_STORAGE
https://developer.android.com/training/data-storage
aIecxs said:
what you don't understand app data can be perfectly backed up. it's just the app developers they decide whether it's allowed or not. It's controlled in AndroidManifest.xml
android:allowBackup="true" API level < 30
android:debuggable="true" API level > 30
https://developer.android.com/about/versions/12/behavior-changes-12#adb-backup-restrictions
btw your screenshots refer to EXTERNAL_STORAGE
https://developer.android.com/training/data-storage
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
On iOS, the backup doesn't include apps' own data (those that are required for the app to run properly), instead only the data that the app has collected from the user, such as settings, login credentials, etc. So that when the user restores a backup, everything simply works like nothing happened. And this includes crucial apps like Banking apps too.
During the restore process, the system downloads the apps automatically from the Store that comes with the entire database, libraries and other files that the app needs to run properly, which isn't part of the backup. The user doesn't have to worry about any of these things as the system handles EVERYTHING automatically.
I don't understand why App Developers should have a say in whether the user specific data that they collect and store in their working directories should be part of the backups. That data belongs to the user and as such only the user should decide whether it needs to be backed up or not, just how it is in iOS.
On Android, where does the app save all of user configurations and files?
I think we can track it down to simple rule.
if you wanna have control and responsibility about your phone in your hands, use android.
if you don't care a f** about what's stored in cloud - buy iPhone
aIecxs said:
I think we can track it down to simple rule.
if you wanna have control and responsibility about your phone in your hands, use android.
if you don't care a f** about what's stored in cloud - buy iPhone
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You missed an important point: on iOS, user decides whether his data that is collected by an app should be backed up to the cloud or not. You get to control what to backup, and what not to backup. If user chooses to save in the cloud, Apple is pretty good in keeping that data secure. Most cases of breach are users' own stupidity.
With Android, it is absurd that the app developers make this decision for the users. And you are saying one should use Android if he wants to take control of this. I don't see a simple or reliable way to do that.
Yes because Android is highly customizeable. I know how to backup my data. There exist TWRP, Migrate, Titanium, and I never used any cloud. Btw the last thing I would backup is /storage/emulated/0/Android this is the first directory I always delete, and I never lost any app data (although I don't know what obb really contains as I never played games, used WhatsApp or any other memory wasting stuff)
It's okay if it is absurd to you, but sure it's not a technical reason. I have linked the documents explaining. To me it would scare me to dead if my device would re-install everything and becomes in the exact same state as before factory reset
TheMystic said:
The native backup solution doesn't backup most of the apps data.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
can you give example app please, let's do reality check
It's simple, main reason is GDPR, cmiiw
Data needs to be separated between application data (config, everything that is not stored any customer/user/client information) and user's data (login sessions, anything that might compromise customer/user/client information).
For most application data, it can be safely assumed, google, huawei, or any third party software, can back it up, stores it in any kind of their backup storage (cloud, ftp, you name it), and restores it as they wished. However, as the user's data, they cannot. At least without user's consent. And it's because of GDPR.
And @Alecxs is correct. Imagine if someone can restore your data in their phone, and then they were identified as you, imagine the horror. If you think no it's impossible, think again. If you think Apple is secure and that's not possible, think again.
And now, why many backup apps exist in play store that can do that? Simple, they don't provide any kind of agreement that they will store your data in their storage, it's always in your local storage or your own cloud storage (dropbox, drive, you name it). And because there isn't any clear protocol from android to do so (separated backup between application or user data), most of them needs to be operated under root.
aIecxs said:
Yes because Android is highly customizeable. I know how to backup my data. There exist TWRP, Migrate, Titanium, and I never used any cloud. Btw the last thing I would backup is /storage/emulated/0/Android this is the first directory I always delete, and I never lost any app data (although I don't know what obb really contains as I never played games, used WhatsApp or any other memory wasting stuff)
It's okay if it is absurd to you, but sure it's not a technical reason. I have linked the documents explaining. To me it would scare me to dead if my device would re-install everything and becomes in the exact same state as before factory reset
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Less than 2% of Android users install a custom recovery and/ or root their device. And a much smaller number use ADB to take care of a few things on their non-rooted device. I'm talking about backup solution for the remaining over 98% users.
Pretty much everyone knows how to backup their stuff. It's just that there is a lot of work to do and requires patience. An automated backup solution helps in saving plenty of time and unnecessary work for the user.
There are, however, some situations where the user is helpless. I was playing a game for a long time, spent a good amount of money on in-app purchases, and when I bought a new phone, there was no way to transfer all that stuff. That game provided no means (either using Google Play Games or Social Media integration) to backup the user account. I wrote to the developer several times, but never got any response. I even complained to Google, but nothing happened for a pretty long time. I stopped buying stuff in that game. Many months later, the developer finally allowed saving game data to Google Play Games. Although I could now move my stuff to my new device, it was just too late. I lost interest in that game. In my case, I still had the old device with me, and working fine. So I could save all my details to Google Play Games. Imagine if someone lost their device, or broke it, or sold it...for them all that money spent in that game would be gone.
'As with your scare me to death' statement, I think you haven't understood how backup & restore works on iOS. iOS will wipe everything on your phone, do a fresh installation of the OS, download all your apps again, and then restore user settings, login credentials, etc, which pretty much takes care of EVERYTHING. The user has no work to do here. But the system is fresh, and all the junk built up over time by both the system and the apps are now gone! It is NOT a system image and restore that will bring everything back, including the unwanted stuff. So your device isn't actually in the exact state like before. It is much leaner, cleaner and much more efficient. The exact same thing happens when you migrate to a new device. Only the things that matter are migrated, the rest are not.
Do note that the user has full control over which apps to backup, and therefore, which ones will be restored/ migrated.
aIecxs said:
can you give example app please, let's do reality check
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If I factory reset my Android phone, the backup will only restore call logs, sms, contacts, and a few basic stuff. It will also download all my apps from the Google Play Store. But here ends the similarity. Beyond this, the user has to setup every app from scratch, with the exception of a few like Google's and Microsoft's cloud based apps. User also has to setup all the permissions for apps from scratch. There is a lot of work involved, which can be easily avoided if Android provided an automated way of getting this done.
User configuration files and login credentials belong to the user. You haven't explained why app developers can choose whether this information can be backed up or not. To me, it seems like Android has a big limitation in the way it is designed, and so is unable to provide a simple backup solution that takes care of these things like in iOS.
x3r0.13urn said:
It's simple, main reason is GDPR, cmiiw
Data needs to be separated between application data (config, everything that is not stored any customer/user/client information) and user's data (login sessions, anything that might compromise customer/user/client information).
For most application data, it can be safely assumed, google, huawei, or any third party software, can back it up, stores it in any kind of their backup storage (cloud, ftp, you name it), and restores it as they wished. However, as the user's data, they cannot. At least without user's consent. And it's because of GDPR.
And @Alecxs is correct. Imagine if someone can restore your data in their phone, and then they were identified as you, imagine the horror. If you think no it's impossible, think again. If you think Apple is secure and that's not possible, think again.
And now, why many backup apps exist in play store that can do that? Simple, they don't provide any kind of agreement that they will store your data in their storage, it's always in your local storage or your own cloud storage (dropbox, drive, you name it). And because there isn't any clear protocol from android to do so (separated backup between application or user data), most of them needs to be operated under root.
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GDPR? Seriously?
Is GDPR not applicable to Apple?
And GDPR is not about backup and restore. It is about collecting user data without authorization AND using it for purposes that benefit someone else.
For the purposes of backup, all data remains with the user account and not used for any purpose other than to restore the same to the user's device(s), subject to credentials verification.
By your logic, there cannot be any cloud based solution either, including emails!
As mentioned before, Apple is pretty good in taking care of their cloud services. And so is Google. Most cases of breach have been found to be a fault at the users' end. Someone keyed in their credentials in the wrong place and then complained that their account is compromised, their photos have been leaked - not Apple's fault.
TheMystic said:
it seems like Android has a big limitation in the way it is designed, and so is unable to provide a simple backup solution that takes care of these things
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please give me example app pkgname so I can double check
aIecxs said:
please give me example app pkgname so I can double check
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You can take any app on your phone which isn't cloud based. Take the file manager app for example. I have set up several remote connections on my file manager. There is no way this information will be restored from the stock Android backup. I will have to setup all remote connections again if I were to uninstall this app and reinstall it. Same holds true if I factory reset my phone or migrate my information to a new device. Android will only reinstall the app for me automatically. I will have to setup all remote connections manually, AND also setup all the custom configurations for the app that I have setup in System Settings.
Only if the app itself provides a built-in way to export all the configurations, will I be able to export them and import it back after a factory reset/ migration. Even then, the configurations (or permissions, etc) for the app under System Settings must be redone manually on Android.
can you please provide pkgname (or google play link) of your file manager, so I can double check?
aIecxs said:
can you please provide pkgname (or google play link) of your file manager, so I can double check?
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Because this is applicable for all non-cloud based apps which are the majority, I don't have to be specific.
But, since you asked, here are a couple :
1. https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.alphainventor.filemanager&hl=en
2. https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.teslacoilsw.launcher&hl=en
okay I am not going to test crappy google one backup on my daily driver, as I don't want to safe my phone to cloud for reason.
Haven't checked Nova Launcher but for File Manager I can say android:allowBackup="true" is allowed in AndroidManifest.xml, so adb backup and restore of app data will work (I can test it later)
Not sure what you mean with non-cloud based apps, are you trying to say these apps can't backed up from google drive? If so, who decides if an app is "cloud based" or not?
aIecxs said:
okay I am not going to test crappy google one backup on my daily driver, as I don't want to safe my phone to cloud for reason.
Haven't checked Nova Launcher but for File Manager I can say android:allowBackup="true" is allowed in AndroidManifest.xml, so adb backup and restore of app data will work (I can test it later)
Not sure what you mean with non-cloud based apps, are you trying to say these apps can't backed up from google drive? If so, who decides if an app is "cloud based" or not?
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Most of the important/ critical information are already in the cloud for almost everyone. This includes emails, photos & videos, documents, etc. for those who use Cloud Storage (which is pretty much everyone, with an exception of an insignificant minority, insignificant being purely in terms of numbers).
Which also means that all login credentials are already with the service providers in encrypted form, in the cloud. So there isn't really anything critical in the app backups that isn't already there in the cloud. App specific configurations don't come under critical information, and as such all that data should never leave the device, unless it is part of the system backup. More importantly, that data belongs to the user, and there is no reason app developers should have a say in whether that should be available for backup or not. It simply shows that Android is most likely limited by its flawed design on this issue.
Pretty much everyone uses the built-in Backup feature provided by Google, and it makes sense to use that over others like Samsung Cloud because a Google backup is available on all brands of Android devices. I haven't used Samsung Backup or other OEM specific backups, but I guess they are pretty much the exact same like Google Backup, the only difference being the service provider.
By cloud based apps, I mean apps that save all data in the cloud, e.g. Gmail, Outlook, Google Keep, Microsoft OneNote, Google Drive, OneDrive, etc. Apps like file managers, launchers, clipboard managers that don't use a cloud, firewall apps, etc that work locally are the apps whose data must be backed up to the cloud. Again, by app data I mean the user configurations (e.g. remote/ cloud connections set up in a file manager) and login credentials that belong to the user, and not the app or its maker.
user configurations (e.g. remote/ cloud connections set up in a file manager) and login credentials for com.alphainventor.filemanager can backed up, I don't see a problem here besides the fact the app developer seems to agree with your opinion and does allow it (there are good reasons for app developers to deny, I can give you example if you want)
lets stay at facts, regardless of your opinion post #2 applies. Android is providing backup of app data
aIecxs said:
user configurations (e.g. remote/ cloud connections set up in a file manager) and login credentials for com.alphainventor.filemanager can backed up, I don't see a problem here besides the fact the app developer seems to agree with your opinion and does allow it (there are good reasons for app developers to deny, I can give you example if you want)
lets stay at facts, regardless of your opinion post #2 applies. Android is providing backup of app data
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Please, adb doesn't come under official backup feature provided on phones. ADB, root, custom recovery, etc. are for a niche of users who are an insignificant minority of the user base.
So, Android needs to provide a way or redesign itself where it's Backup & Restore function is just as seamless and effortless, as it is on iOS.
Do let me know what 'good reasons' app developers have to opt out of data backups. Hope they do realise that no one is interested in the app specific stuff, they only care for their own configuration files. And those who do, they know how to root and extract all app data.