Hi Everyone,
Ive been on a bit of a mission with T-mobile and have been in touch with the directors office, they are under the impression that nothing has been locked down on the phone in rc7/rc30 that would limit the use of the phone from a development standpoint.
Ive given them a few examples of things that cant be done but they refuse to do anything (other than cancel my contact if i want) as im only one person who is complaining.
I know everyone runnning rc30v1.2 and rc8v.12 is ok atm, but could EVERONE please send a little email of complaint. Just explaining that you are unhappy that they have locked down the phone and denied us root.
cl&[email protected]
They say that if they get more complaints then something will be done
ITS WORTH A SHOT ISNT IT?
PS... If anyone wants to cancel their contract in the uk because of the lack of access, call 01707 315000 and ask to talk to Leah within the Directors team about your G1 problem. I explained that i couldnt get my apps working because i couldnt edit/add files to system directories.
They should offer to cancel it, it worked for me
Yeah, it's worth a shot, although from past experience with T-Mobile this may be akin to trying to extract blood from a stone
I tried doing the same thing after I got my G1 (before anyone figured out the hole in RC29). I found the people over at T-Mobile USA are just as clueless. As soon as you mention the words Android or G1, they instantly transfer you to a different support queue. I tried to explain what root access was and they didn't have a clue what I was talking about.
I found that here in the UK also, these people work in the directors team and so far have not fobbed me off.
They dont claim to be technical but are at least talking to the T-mobile developers about this. They have raised my concerns with the UK G1 manager, i think my case just needs a little more oomph from others complaining.
I've already called HTC, G1 support, and the PDA/Smartphone support ppl. None of them were willing to even try to understand the issue.
T-mobile have just called me and have advised that we should expect a statement about the issue by the end of the week. The issue is now with board members apparently
Maybee they are actuclly starting to understand??
You should have them email. At least that way it leaves a paper trail.
SGTDavePwnage said:
T-mobile have just called me and have advised that we should expect a statement about the issue by the end of the week. The issue is now with board members apparently
Maybee they are actuclly starting to understand??
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
That's very interesting that T-Mobile is even considering the idea of allowing root access, to the point where it would be an executive decision by the board members. Do you have any other information on this aside from your first post? Can anyone else confirm this?
i phoned tmobile uk today and asked why i couldnt get root on my tc5-rc8.
and i had a long talk with the guy and he said he had a email about this issue
and went throught a few things with me on my phone. and then he said he would phone me back tomorrow with someone that new more about the g1 then the tec support staff. and he would be able to give me more answers about it.
qtronix
Cool
Sounds like my insessant *****ing at T-mobile support might have gotten us somewhere?
At least techies are not fobbing people off at the moment.
Could you please concider sending an email to the address i posted, just so they are aware that others are miffed.
******This is a copy of the email i sent to the directors team******
Leah
Many thanks for your call....
As t-mobile dont seem to see/understand the problem I have given the contact details of the director team to a group of developers so that you can hopefully get a few more calls about this. Please believe me that I am not the only person who has these concerns, but when people call tech support about this they are simply fobbed off by people who are not trained/do not understand the issue.
I would like to point out an error with t-mobiles response that they have in no way locked down the phone so that it is detremental for putting developed software onto the phone.
Please see a few examples of how the new RC8 Software limits Developers :-
1. Say I wanted my screen to automatically rotate without wanting to open the keyboard, this is simply a matter of editing offset: 1104724 within /system/framework/framework.odex to 0x0F001246.
I could do this on the old software but not on the new RC8
2. Say i wanted to update the web browser to do the same, this would mean editing the origional browser source code released by Google and putting it on my phone. Again, this was possible with root access on RC7 but has now been made impossible on the new RC8.
3. Say i wanted to make a tethering application that allows me to use my G1 as a modem to my PC (i know this would cost me money on my contract for data transfer) but I might want to do it so that i can connect to my workplace vpn to fix something. This was Doable on RC7, but now is not.
4. The G1 currently has no way of clearing cache for the marketplace, this again was doable on RC7 but not on RC8
5. The G1 has a limited ammount of space to install applications. It would be a good idea if we could install applications to our SD memory Cards, but again we cant do this because of the new software.
The above examples are just some simple things developers are working on that would benefit the phone, but we cant develop them and put them on the phone.
Basically anything that means editing a system file / writing a file to a system directory is now impossible.
Please understand that developers are not trying to take over the world or ruin the phone. We are simply trying to make the phone do what we want / improve the features.
This is how OpenSource works. Everyone has access to the Source code so that it can if neccecary be customised/edited to improve things for everyone.
The new software has made it impossible for programs that interact with the main system files or require extra files to be put in a system folder, to work.
Developers understand why the phone RC7 software was unsafe in the way it ran commands, we understand why you fixed the command running problem, but instead of fixing the issue properly you have just locked down root access?? Why??
If the new software in no way limits what developers can do, then why when you search on the net are so many people “Jailbreaking” their phones to get the access they require.
http://arstechnica.com/news.ars/post/20081105-android-liberation-t-mobile-g1-jailbroken.html
Can i draw your attention to
"In contrast, the G1 has been developed by the Open Handset Alliance project. It's extremely unlikely that this alliance, which is committed to an open platform, will engage in the same kinds of protective shenanigans that Apple has resorted to. The Android philosophy states that "anyone can contribute to Android and influence its direction. That means that anyone can download, build, and run the code needed to create a complete mobile device."
So why jailbreak an already-open device? One big jailbreak advantage is that it allows you to bypass the G1's internal storage. Until now, you were limited by the G1's built-in memory for installing and running programs. With the jailbreak, you can install applications onto a local SD card and run them from the card. Running low on memory? Just swap cards in and out.
Jailbreaking also allows you to use low-level tools that run in the background. Want your G1 to call home and report your location every 20 minutes? A simple Unix process, called a daemon, can handle that for you. You can set daemons up to remind you of appointments, to scan for nearby wireless devices and more. The world of handheld computing doesn't begin or end with graphic interfaces. There's an enormously rich world of possibilities available through command line processes.
Most importantly, jailbreaking gives you complete control of your system from the bottom up. It lets you stop thinking of your phone as a handheld gadget and start using it as a fully-capable Unix platform. "
Please could you explain how T-mobile are of the opinion that they have not limited developers with the above examples in mind.
The G1 is being sold as a Developer friendly OpenSource Phone. How can you claim this is developer friendly when the software severely limits what developers can do?
Are T-mobile saying that the phone was never supposed to allow users this access and that the RC7 root access was a mistake?
Eagerly Awaiting your response..
******
Well written, although I would have DEFINITELY left out the part about tethering the phone.
vr24 said:
Well written, although I would have DEFINITELY left out the part about tethering the phone.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I did think about that, but then i reconcidered as we already have tetherbot which works without root.
Suppose we will just have to see if anything comes of it
SGTDavePwnage said:
I did think about that, but then i reconcidered as we already have tetherbot which works without root.
Suppose we will just have to see if anything comes of it
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
you can always call t-mobile and say that after you updated the phone it is now:
constantly feezing, apps are running slow, and at times you can not connect to internet.
also tell them that you tried a factory reset and it did not help (make up a story that you have friend that has a lot of app and his phone runs faster than you phone with no apps installed)
if you have insurance they will send you one for free, you just have to return your old phone,
i believe they are still sending out rc29 for replacements as of now.
friend and cousin tried it and it worked.
might be worth a shot
Just got this in my inbox:
"Thank you for letting us know of your concerns with the 'open source' and 'root access' on your G1 mobile phone. We really do appreciate your comments about this.
We're aware that there are concerns in relation to this and our leadership teams in the UK and the USA are currently reviewing your comments and our position. We plan to provide you and other customers with similar concerns, with a response early next week, which should answer your concerns. I'll be in touch with you then.
Your comments are extremely valuable to us Mr * and I'm grateful for your patience while we look into this. I'd like to thank you personally for your co-operation.
In the mean time I hope you enjoy your weekend.
Kind regards
Leah Young
Directors' Office Co-ordinator
T-Mobile (UK)"
Of course, their answer could be anything from "f*ck off" to "yes, we'd love to embrace the openness of android with both arms, here everyone, have root!" so we'll all have to keep our fingers crossed 'til monday.
Well I just hope they release an update with options that allow us to turn off all background services (myfaves) and unwanted datatraffic (or actuall prevent overriding options when roaming).
How did that dead horse like the beating?
Perhaps a dead horse. Could it be that Tmo has now figured out that with root access, it won't take long for people like the coders at XDA to fully jailbreak the device to the point that voIP will be easy for any user to obtain? Are they just trying to protect their ability to profit off of voice traffic?
rynosaur said:
Perhaps a dead horse. Could it be that Tmo has now figured out that with root access, it won't take long for people like the coders at XDA to fully jailbreak the device to the point that voIP will be easy for any user to obtain? Are they just trying to protect their ability to profit off of voice traffic?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Hummm... I think ALL wireless providers are threatened by VOIP but the main reason root access was blocked was due to bad press mainly by tons of articles stating that there is a huge security risk and a flaw was found with Android which could let remote users attack someone's device...blah blah blah and so forth. That pretty much scared T-Mobile and Google which hated to have bad press so close to the G1 just being released and were forced to correct this issue. The only problem with that protection came with closing alot of freedom for the G1 and may happen to alot of more Android-based devices in the future, I'm afraid... Maybe Google will realize that there are other ways to protect mobile hijacking (which is extremely rare anyways) by creating some type of built-in firewall software instead?
rynosaur said:
Perhaps a dead horse. Could it be that Tmo has now figured out that with root access, it won't take long for people like the coders at XDA to fully jailbreak the device to the point that voIP will be easy for any user to obtain? Are they just trying to protect their ability to profit off of voice traffic?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Root is not necessary to build a voip app. Fact is, G1 launched with a skype-compatible voip app called iSkoot. Look it up.
SGTDavePwnage said:
Cool
Sounds like my insessant *****ing at T-mobile support might have gotten us somewhere?
At least techies are not fobbing people off at the moment.
Could you please concider sending an email to the address i posted, just so they are aware that others are miffed.
******This is a copy of the email i sent to the directors team******
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
i wont quote the entire email because its big. but you sir are very well spoken, great email!
Have anybody but me thought about having muliple user logons on an Android device?
I'm thinking with the Galaxy Tab and many similar devices to come it would be natural to share the device within the household. Naturally you wouldn't want others to log on to your facebook/msn/email etc.
Are there any projects aiming to do this? Would it be possible?
hey, I'm loosing it trying to find out the same for weeks now. Been trying to start a little project that would involve multiple users on a same device, somethink like the xp's guest user would be awesome...
can sameone at least tell me it's absolutely not possible, couse then I'd finish my search and try for something different, thx!
We just got a transformer tablet at work and we had to tie it to a public gmail account dedicated to this device but multiple users will need to use it and have it tied to their google apps account. This is a problem for us and the apps that 'divide' the tablet just cost too much for what they do. We have at least 4-5 people who would use it. This isn't a situation where we should just have a tablet for each employee. The scientific work we do requires so much equipment that it has to be shared and scheduled. The tablet is just another thing we have to pack up in the morning when we have field work on our project. Multi user android support is needed!
Hello guys
I'm fairly new to WP7 and recently bought an Omnia 7.
One thing pisses me off though - not being able to buy apps outside a supported country or credit card.
My suggestion is therefore, wouldnt it be possible to develop something like cydia app store for (pardon) iPhone?
Im currently on my phone and waiting for a flight at the airport, so havnt searched around too much, so incase i've failed to spot a similar thread please direct me to it instead of giving me a "use search you mofo"
Thanks in advance guys. =)
WP7 is fairly new, new countries will be supported as it grows larger.
As for a Cydia like application, I'm sure it will come along some time, but I don't think there is one right now.
I am currently working on a desktop application to bring a Cydia-like market to WP7. My main aims are:
- Provide homebrew developers with a place to host their applications/profit from them
- Provide a simple all-in-one dekstop solution for users to download, update and install apps to their phone
- "Trial Mode" will not exist, rather developers can post two versions of the same application with different functionality
- Market will be free from Marketplace restrictions. This includes UI/Metro restrictions. It's up to the user to decide whether they want to use a non-metro application.
My main issue at the moment is just getting the infrastructure in place and making sure everything is secure. I've only really got the barebones together, so it will take some time to get the project finished off.
Anybody who has any suggestions, feel free to post them here or PM me them
Cheers Blade0rz
Im happy to this is already in development.
I will let you know if any ideas happen to pop up. Will be following your progression
Hello everyone,
I have been developing an application that registers several prices, such as combustible, food costs etc...
Now I was asked in the intercourse to create an app that the admin connects to a certain database AND another one that makes his phone, the admin, that can see what his employees have made in the first application I made.
I honestly have no idea what to do, I'm almost panicking cause the boss of this company I'm working now, as my internship demands and screams alot. I can't find anything useful in the internet so I thought if someone that knows this can help me, please? I depend on you lool..
Thanks!
Hello to everyone!
I've been learning to code for a while so to create my own application/software idea but the problem is that I found out that it isn't really my "area". The thing is I still got this awesome idea that I really want to be developed. It's pretty obvious that I'm not just yelling out what the idea specifically is...but... I need someone that:
1- Knows how to develop an app and release to it in "play store".
2- Good all-round(by this I mean can easily jump from one problem to a completely different problem)(I don't need a "programmer or nothing")
3- Well motivated and friendly.
4- This idea obviously needs some funding. I can do that on my own if you don't want to. Without a doubt the profits will be split between us (This will be later accorded when we meet up)
The idea basically is: Develpment of an alternative market. Come on read on... By market I don't mean Aptoid,Snappzmarket where people can steal software...It's a different market.
The idea won't make you a billionare! But it has an incredible amount of potential if done correctly...and that's where I need you.
I currently live in Italy but can travel anywhere in Europe without any problem.
If anyone is interested in this please contact me via PM. I'm relitively new to xda developers but I have been reading loads of great stuff on it so THUMBS UP XDA! I'm not posting my email address for SPAM reasons.