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Newsflash: Android Is Not Perfect

This is just a PSA to all you vicious Android fanboys on this forum that hound anyone who asks the question "what phone should I get", especially when one of those options includes an iOS device or a WP7 device.
So let me get this started. I love Android. But Android is not perfect. Take a deep breath, and say it with me again, out loud.
"Android is not perfect." Was that too hard? If so the following explanation is for you.
Ever since Android first came out, people were hailing it as the iPhone killer. But in reality? It's really not. It may be getting there, and may be getting there quickly, but that's not that point.
It may be a surprise to many of you, but there are actually other human beings outside of XDA that use smartphones. Human beings that are not interested in rooting their phones or spending a lot of time completely customizing them or pushing them to the limit. These human beings want their phones to work when they need them, and that's all. Whether these phones are iOS, Android, or Windows Mobile/7 phones is completely irrelevant to them.
Except, it actually is. But see, not in the way most of you seem to think it is.
People shop for phones nowadays because the have an end they need to reach and they need the means to get to that end. Whether it's something as simple as checking an email message or quenching a thirst to play a game, they take into consideration what is the quickest, most hassle-free way to do this. This requirement is not because they are stupid. Most XDA users seem to think that anyone off XDA just buys iPhones because they are uneducated about "the true power of Android" and all that jazz. Guess what? That's not the case.
Yes. Here at XDA, we can do a lot with our phones. We root them, we build custom ROMs for them, we use features that were locked before, or get versions of our OS that aren't out yet.
But please be damn sure you understand that we are the minority. We will always be the minority. Your experience here doesn't define the mobile landscape, it only improves your personal experience with your phone. Just because you took a few hours to root your phone, find the perfect custom ROM, and settle down with it doesn't make the average Joe who just bought an iPhone (because it does what he wants easily and has all the apps he likes) a stupid user.
Here is the meat of this newsflash; Android wouldn't be here if it wasn't for iOS. (Going further, iOS wouldn't be there without Windows Mobile, and etc etc etc until we reached the very first man who asked 'why can't I see my email from my phone'). Apple took a chance on what people wanted, and realized they had something. They built an OS that was based on the ideals of OS X; simple, straight-forward, good looking, and well received. And so began the App and Data revolution. All of a sudden, the idea of having mobile data became real. These wonderful delicious little things called "apps" made the mobile world much more exciting than it had even been before. And so Apple hit a goldmine, and the mobile landscape had been painted. These apps were well-designed, fun, informative, useful, and people liked them so much, they started to buy paid apps. Apple knows how to market to people, and there success showed.
So then. Android.
Android was birthed out of the idea that Google could cash in on this app world. You may think the intentions were noble, with the idea that it was some pipe dream in the same way linux was; completely open mobile platform. After all, if Apple could have the success with a closed system, Google obviously could rock the world with an open one.
But it's not. Android, or at least what most people come to think of as Android these days, is not "open". It's open to phone manufacturers, and carriers, but that's it. It' snot open to the end user. Why else do we have locked down features, closed-source OEM skins that hinder future firmware upgrades? Why else do we have carrier-controlled Market restrictions? Why do some phones not ship with developer tools, or the ability to install from unknown sources?
Let me be frank. I love Android, but Android is a mess. It's a mess of a bunch of wonderful ideas that would have shined like nothing else in the perfect world, but a mess that didn't anticipate a simple fact; businesses like to make money.
The truth of the matter is that we don't have freedom with Android. Every little part of it has a restriction we need to bypass. Do you buy an expensive high end phone, or a cheaper low-end phone? Will you still be able to play those cool games on that low end phone? Will it get software updates? Is it safe from malware? Buying an Android phone has become the same as trying to buy a Windows PC.
It suffers from the same problem that Microsoft does when compared to Apple's line of computers. Apple builds its hardware AND its software, so they interface with complete precision and function. People with iPhones don't need to worry about security updates, or whether their phone will be obsolete. Apple may release a new phone every year, but the point is that those phones are made to last, both in terms of hardware and software. They even went the next step further and made the iPod touch, which gave phone users who weren't ready for smartphones a taste of what it was like.
My Sprint Hero came out on October 11th, 2009. The iPhone 3GS came out in June of the same year. Both were priced around the same amount, but what stands out to me the most when I think back to when I tested both that year? The fact it took Google this long to make an operating system which took ages to mature enough to be used by HTC to make a phone that STILL could not even give me a smooth web browser, something that the very first iPhone was able to do. Games on the Hero sucked in comparison to the 3D games that were playable on the iPhone.
Now then, Android smartphone hardware has advanced to a significant level, but the point of this whole rant is that Google has always been following in Apple's footsteps in the mobile world, and it's going to be that way for some time.
Be a bit humble about the begginings of Android and what it's become, and for f***'s sake, be a bit mature than just saying "LOLOLOL APPLE SUCKS GG GET ANDROID".
Because it's the rest of the world outside of XDA that defines the success of these mobile platforms, because I hate to say this, but you and I are not part of that outside world of mobile phone users, and we never will be.
The truth is, no one can really say what the "perfect" mobile OS is. All we can do is say what works best for us or what we prefer, but when we state it as fact, as though it's not arguable, that's when we become the fanboys that we so dearly hate. Just keep that in mind.
Opinions welcome, fanboyism from either side not wanted at all. Congrats on finishing this post.

Excellent post. Would read again.

Great things said there. I can see a point in it. But still, I don't either see Ios higher as Android since Ios is a mess too. Let me just take this simple statement. Music on a Ipod/Iphone needs to be converted from the computer to the device, you can't random download a song(on the device) from Internet and play it. Same as the file exploring.. if you want to search for a file, you find a file in some folder like: im/af/on/ar/qr, or just some folders which are messy, and the file types are unknown for the computer. All those small things give me the excuse to stay at Windows Mobile. Simply cause we can download music files and play it, simply cause there is great development on it, simply cause it can be customized how we want it.

Cool story bro
Sent from my HTC Glacier using XDA Premium App

d12unk13astard said:
Cool story bro
Sent from my HTC Glacier using XDA Premium App
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Good job. That must have taken some serious thought to come up with.

This is something I 100% agree with.
When I had a Samsung Moment, I had problems galore with it. Keyboard wouldn't type, horrible support, and the big network lockup. Mind you, a network lockup where you can't call out to anyone is against FCC laws. But just to get some type of damn support for the thing, I almost had to root it. And I'm sorry, but I shouldn't have to depend on an online community for support for a phone when the carrier and manufacturer of the phone should be doing that. What the hell is the point in buying the phone and paying damn near $70 a month if I can't use the damn thing?
Let's also talk about performance of the Moment and how unoptimized it was. The Moment uses the same SoC found in the Iphone 2g, and 3g. The only difference, stock 2g and 3g SoC is 600 mhz, clocked down to about 422 mhz for battery, while the Moment was 800 mhz. Both arm11 cpu cores. The Iphone 2g and 3g despite having almost half the clocked frequency of the Moment, was smoother and had actual hardware support and acceleration. Even this day, Samsung still does not have proper hardware support for the SoC being used in the Moment, Intercept, Transform, Spica, etc etc.
If done right, Android is pretty awesome I'll admit. But if I want a phone to work, I'll get something that actually works.

big advantage of android, but also a weakness:
it works well on many devices, but its not optimised for the spezific hardware of each phone...

gosualex said:
big advantage of android, but also a weakness:
it works well on many devices, but its not optimised for the spezific hardware of each phone...
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Good understanding

I love android because I love to tinker. Nothing could ever change my mind short of the os aging. I will say this flaws or not I refuse to give apple my money. So it's either wp7 or android.
My words to live buy if I can't hack it I don't want it. Just my 2cents
Sent from my A500 using XDA Premium Apps

I would agree iPhones support is a lot longer no network changes added, updates can brick the phones though.
Android need some love. Fragmentation. Networks slow to update. Ui 's being to sluggish to update the phone to higher levels.
All android phones should be aosp no extras from makers or networks.
Love my cm7/miui.us phone but most people would want to flash it or know how to. They would just think might as well get an iPhone.
Just my feelings. I own apple computers. Custom built pcs android phones had iPhones I still use an iPod touch in the kitchen as you can get the best speaker docks for them. Use what works best for the situation.
Sent from my GT-I9000 using XDA Premium App

Android security warning !!
I think android is the best system, but its very insecure if you let it on stock and don't secure it, root it, get rid of some apps and optimize it.
Did you know that a normal app with all permissions can get all your data?
-gps location
-contacts
-logs
-screenshots
-hidden camerashots
-sms/mms
-emails
-photos
-etc
BELIEVE IT OR NOT, THIS IS FACT !!!
There was a test in germany, where a developer made a app with all the rights to do the things above and send them hidden in the backround to a specified server to that he had access. So he could read and see all the things above and it was even updating immidiatly after a new sms or something came in and the testuser who installed it had no clue at all and was shocked when they told it to her.
The App itself was just making photos with a black censor stripe in the eyes and it seemed that it never could do that, but all the real action is going on in the backround.
By the way, he sayd it was very easy and many apps could do that and most of them really do that.
And what I know, many of you don't know or don't care and spread all your information to some companys that like to have them alot. And they allways want more.
Maybe you should spread this information by quoting this post or linking to it, because many people don't like to be ripped of their information.
Or do you like it, when someone is standing close to you and listens all what you say to your friends, when you have a private conversation ? I think not!
check out my signature also.
and be safe!
edit: i think i should post this as a new thread!

Great post, good read!!

Hard to say any mobile OS is perfect. But the world of mobile OS is developing quickly in recent years.
Haven't played extensively with Android and IOS. Currenly, I still think IOS is more polish. Android definitely have a lot of features and I am looking forward to where they take the OS to in the future. It seems like it's an OS that has a lot of support and has had to "grow up" really rapidly.

I actually agrer with everything in this post. Fact is the best technology in the world is technology that is stable, works, and allows the user to complete what ever task is needed.
Last night it was decided my wife and I are switching to verizon why? Cause the wife wants IOS and I am more partial to android and BB and thats the only carrier that has all 3.
Now to add on what was already said I think google needs to pick one manufacture purchase them then do exactly what apple does marry the hardware amd software together to get rid of what can be a problematic OS simply cause with some manufactures android is worse then on others.
Sent from my SPH-P100 using XDA App

(•.•) said:
I think android is the best system, but its very insecure if you let it on stock and don't secure it, root it, get rid of some apps and optimize it.
Did you know that a normal app with all permissions can get all your data?
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You give apps on an iphone or WM phone permissions to do these things too right, so this is a more general problem in the new mobile world...
BTW, I like you're post LiquidSolstice, you could almost call it a fact, it's not that the one is better than the other. It's just that they are different and the majority of people likes easy and simple...

I agree with alot of what LS mentions in the first post. My wife is one of those who could really care less about rooting, overclocking, mem management, or even what version of Android she is using for that matter. She just wants to be able to send that text without the keyboard "hicupping", or to make that phone call without the dialer lagging, etc. I like Android, but I don't like Google's.. well let's say "less than kosher" business practices and corporate involvements. I think a big point to remember is that there will always be people like us that get a huge kick out of toying with electronics. For some, it's a hobby, for others, a career. With that being said, there will also always be those doofies that get on sites like this one and annoy the living crap out of you. Everything needs to be taken in stride, and though there are those who appear to be clueless on a subject, always remember that we all have to learn somehow. Knowledge is not obtained through osmosis.

Android feels like a permanent beta. I prefer iOS for simple tasks plusSbsettings is unmatched. WP7 seems more like a feature phone, it doesn't tell you 'I'm smart.'

I mostly agree
I don't think the problem with android is really the fact that more than one company is involved in developing phones for android. The problem is that those companies, (OEMs & carriers) have been given way to much freedom to decide not only what processor & RAM the phone would have but to put their "stamp" on android. I think the blame for that partially falls on Google for not putting a stop to OEMs & carriers putting their bloatware on phones. Google has been asked multiple times to do something about the "fragmentation" issue & they've refused, so ultimately they are partly responsible for the "mess" android has become.

tsaxda said:
I don't think the problem with android is really the fact that more than one company is involved in developing phones for android. The problem is that those companies, (OEMs & carriers) have been given way to much freedom to decide not only what processor & RAM the phone would have but to put their "stamp" on android. I think the blame for that partially falls on Google for not putting a stop to OEMs & carriers putting their bloatware on phones. Google has been asked multiple times to do something about the "fragmentation" issue & they've refused, so ultimately they are partly responsible for the "mess" android has become.
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Well, carrier "bloat" --I put that in quotes because the current three major skins bring much needed features to Android (whether or not the execution is done well or not is a different argument)-- isn't quite what's killing it, it's the time spent optimizing the hardware for Android.
Android gets slapped on as many devices as possible and then sold as a low end affordable smartphone, and that's the issue, but that's the essence of Android at the same time.

ZeGuitarist said:
Excellent post. Would read again.
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+1 Outstanding post. Completely agree.

Just Realizing... OEMs are Taking Advantage of us!

Alright, so after reading a couple articles on a bunch of sites. I can sort of understand a vicious cycle that's going on in the mobile development world.
First off, let me begin, Mobile OEMs (as we all know) don't release updates very often. And as a general rule, when they do... it's usually a couple months late. Just look at HTC devices, most of the (somewhat) older devices (depending on what you're definition of older is) aren't getting the updates to ICS for while http://goo.gl/FjcMJ . And in some cases they just decide not to update them at all. (see the Desire HD and possibly the Thunderbolt http://goo.gl/BwZld )
Initially when Android started, this was a little different. And allow me to clarify by going far far back, to the first Android device. The HTC Dream.
It initially came out with Android 1.0 (Astro) it eventually got updated all the way to the software version 1.5 (Cupcake). If you look back then, that's two software updates! Astro to Bender to Cupcake.
Now let's look at just about any other Android device (not made my Samsung, for the most part they're a bad example... (of course then again, they have the head of Cyanogenmod Steve Kondik on their team).
We're going to look at Motorola, because despite the fact that it's owned by Google, not all of their devices have received updates. And the device I've chosen from them is the defy. Now if you look over at the development section of the forums you'll see that we have a working (and apparently a very smooth) port of Jelly Bean for the Defy. http://goo.gl/mE1Qy
But if you decide to see what Motorola's deciding to do to update it from Gingerbread, well... their development section is devoid of everything for the Defy... http://goo.gl/g8XN0
Now why does that matter to us happy go lucky developers and modders? Well let's look over this little scenario I've played out in my head more than once.
CEO#1 "Oh they want Jelly Bean?"
CEO#2 "Yeah they do..."
CEO#1 "So what are we going to do about it?"
CEO#2 *checks XDA* "Nothing, the ones who really care about it have a working ROM up already."
CEO#1 "Okay, sounds good to me. So are you ready to go make some more phones with high specs and outdated software?"
CEO#2 "Well if we start now, we should be able to get six new devices running ICS 4.0.3 out by mid December!"
CEO#1 "Ohh, not even having the latest version of ICS is really going to get them. Brilliant!"
This is a vicious cycle that just keeps going around, and around, and around. The problem is that there doesn't seem to be a way to stop it. While we need Superuser and rooting privileges, we also need updates to the latest version of Android OS to keep us going.
OEMs on the other hand see us as free labor for development and as the only people who really want/need the updates. The problem is that with their history of sending out updates we really can't stop working. And even when they do send out updates, sometimes they aren't even fully stable! (see Evo 3D http://goo.gl/VzCNM )
So the question is, how are we going to stop this?

Buy devices from the companies that keep things up to date. The Nexus gets direct pushes from Google so you know you're good there. Sony has a dedicated line to developers through their forums and even offers devices for temporary dev use and has reasonably priced unsubsidised phones.
Put your dollars in the right places if you want to make change happen. Those who want full access still aren't a large enough part of the market to shape everything. That said, people pushing for control have made sure that iDevices can be jailbroken and HTC is staggering hard because of mis-steps in marketing that have been worsened by lackluster updates and their decision to shun the dev community that was bolstering them.

They can't look at xda or whatever Android forum because there is a larger population of users who have no idea what rooting is, let alone custom ROMs. Those people depend on updates and if they won't get an official update, they won't get one at all.
Sent from my MB508 using xda premium

If you ask 10 Android users what version of Android they are on, 8 of them will have no clue, 1 will know because the sales rep used it as a selling point, and one of them will be running Jellybean (thanks to XDA!).
Consumer demand is not high enough to demand the cost of testing new software on dated phones. Sad but true.

thebeastglasser said:
OEMs on the other hand see us as free labor for development and as the only people who really want/need the updates.
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If they really saw us as free labor, they would release a phone with cyanogenmod or something and just kang whatever works for their next update. (Actually, this would be a very good idea.)
However, in actuality, they just don't care about the devs. Too busy trying to differentiate their products with custom skins and cause more work for everyone.

It is true that most people don't know much more than that they are are android or "droid", just like many people don't know much more than they have an Iphone. The vocal majority of phone users (online) however have quite a bit more knowledge which means they get much more feedback from the minority.
One of the main reasons (other than price) that I got a Nexus 7 was due to the fact that Google pushes updates immediately to their nexus devices. I see this as an additional "perk".

You can't buy a device Android or other from an OEM or carrier and expect to get the latest greatest updates a or mods any too quickly. Forums and sites like xda bring in developers and users who ate eager to offer mods and help that you will never find coming from the mainstream as quickly or with the same quality. I get the device I want and look to here to make it better quicker.
Sent from my Galaxy Nexus using xda app-developers app

But what I see is that there are a bunch of phones that could easily be running better software (like the Defy) but OEMs clearly see that anybody who seems to care enough about updates are doing it themselves. The problem is, there are relatives of mine who refuse to root and yet they know enough about phones to know what version they're running and know the difference between the two versions. The one they currently have, and the one they could have.
I feel like this is kind of unfair to the sed-mentioned people and on top of that, it makes uneducated users buy more phones, while it keeps people like us are at work.
I'd bet that it was a pain in the a** porting ICS to the Desire HD no thanks to HTC, and yet this is just one less job for HTC and a hell of a lot more work for us... That's just me.
And also, that idea for a "pre-kanged" phone or one running a version of Cyanogenmod is pretty good. It'd be a great idea...

Again, speak with your dollars. I have no doubt that Nexus sales will continue to climb not only because of devs, but because people who just end up with them will like seeing timely updates and devices that continue to get better and better. If you want to help the rise of affordable, quality devices then steer others toward them when you can and buy them yourself when it's time for something new.

Also, people on xda do not see development as a "work", they see it as a hobby...
So even if all the phones were on the latest android, the dev community here at Xda would still be hard at "work" to come up with something better...something which the OEM's and Google couldn't think of implementing even with such large resources at their disposal...
And let's face it, apart from games, the general public in large doesn't have "need" for BETTER phones...
I've seen the likes of HTC One X and Galaxy S3 go in the hands of people for whom multitasking would mean chatting on whatsapp while waiting for the fb app to load...
So the question would arise, if the public doesn't "need" better phones, how do we sell it to them?
The answer becomes clear, stop giving them updates...make them feel that their device is outdated...that they "need" a NEW and BETTER phone...
The ones who understand the capability of their phone would have the ability, or more importantly, the will to make the updates happen...
For the rest, well there's fancy advertising...
Hope this clears up...
- Via xda premium

Yeah, I suppose it makes sense. Thanks guys!

How many people are there using Android? About 60% of the market, which means hundred milion users How many members do we have here on XDA? Less than hundred thousands! It means that regular users dont know and dont care what OS they use or even dont know what the update is. Froyo, GB, ICS, JB sound like alien languages for most of regular users. For those who know wat they are using, they are already XDA members, the rest just doesnt care or they just simply buy an iCrapple. Therefore, there is no way you can stop that. Customers are always taken granted by companies.
Sent from my SGH-T989 using xda app-developers app

Extreemly well put. We all knew it but didn't say anything. I am awaiting the next nexus for this very reason. Props to thebeastglasser

MissionImprobable said:
Again, speak with your dollars. I have no doubt that Nexus sales will continue to climb
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The bundling is too strong with this market. When there are literally only one or two phone brands, usually otherwise sub-par, that are stock, the voting with dollars won't make much of a difference. It's like voting in an election where a lot of people who might prefer a pure candidate are given tons of reasons to go with more mainstream ones.
So how can change actually be effected? First and most obviously, google might dictate to motorola to make stock phones. Hopefully, that will happen and stock android will start getting a positive reputation for straightforward and automatic upgrades.
The other option starts at grassroots levels: this bundling leaves a gap in the market, and eventually someone should step in to fill that gap. I can imagine small start ups in third-world countries (where price is a real issue) revitalizing older brands with the highest supported cyanogenmod, then selling them at still relatively low prices for a profit. If there is enough demand for this, this "repackaging" business would be emulated all over and the OEMs might start to take a hint.

For the record there are over four million members on XDA...

thebeastglasser said:
For the record there are over four million members on XDA...
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Not currently active users though. Remember XDA used to make you register to download files so that jacked up the member rate.

thebobp said:
The bundling is too strong with this market. When there are literally only one or two phone brands, usually otherwise sub-par, that are stock, the voting with dollars won't make much of a difference. It's like voting in an election where a lot of people who might prefer a pure candidate are given tons of reasons to go with more mainstream ones.
So how can change actually be effected? First and most obviously, google might dictate to motorola to make stock phones. Hopefully, that will happen and stock android will start getting a positive reputation for straightforward and automatic upgrades.
The other option starts at grassroots levels: this bundling leaves a gap in the market, and eventually someone should step in to fill that gap. I can imagine small start ups in third-world countries (where price is a real issue) revitalizing older brands with the highest supported cyanogenmod, then selling them at still relatively low prices for a profit. If there is enough demand for this, this "repackaging" business would be emulated all over and the OEMs might start to take a hint.
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The Chinese market is already doing that, and with brand new phones that come both rooted and sometimes unlocked. Yes, there are other markets in which this can be done, but it doesn't make sense to talk on the one hand about voting with dollars not making a difference and then saying third-world resellers will change the game.
Google is marketing a clean, recognizable line in their Nexus devices, advertising intelligently, and making sure that they continue to stay on the latest firmware. Supporting them and other companies who do so will dictate what model corporations follow. Again, HTC is eating crow because their abandonment of the dev community and their decision to spread themselves thin, ala Motorola, who are also being dug out of a hole now by Google. I'd say both companies have paid the price for ignoring what the marketplace demands.
Moto had everyone hooked with the original Droid so there is no doubt that share is won or lost by how you approach relevancy for the long run. Go back and look at how many people loved their OG Droids in every way but have now moved on to other brands because of locked bootloaders and lack of firmware updates on the models that followed. Money makes the corporate world go round and every little bit helps.
Grassroots movements have done everything from keeping the iPhone legal to jailbreak to getting a man his goodies when a WP store tried to pull a fast one in regards to him winning the WP challenge to getting VZ to clarify that they wouldn't be doing anything to their Unlimited users. We may not be the majority, but we are far more organized and informed than the masses and as such what we do gets noticed and picked up on by tech, blog, and news coverage. The only ones who don't make change happen are the naysayers who sit by and do nothing. Support the brands that support the customers and devs.

MissionImprobable said:
The Chinese market is already doing that, and with brand new phones that come both rooted and sometimes unlocked. Yes, there are other markets in which this can be done, but it doesn't make sense to talk on the one hand about voting with dollars not making a difference and then saying third-world resellers will change the game.
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Sure voting makes sense.. if you're in another country where the election's not as rigged.
MissionImprobable said:
Again, HTC is eating crow because their abandonment of the dev community and their decision to spread themselves thin, ala Motorola, who are also being dug out of a hole now by Google. I'd say both companies have paid the price for ignoring what the marketplace demands.
Moto had everyone hooked with the original Droid so there is no doubt that share is won or lost by how you approach relevancy for the long run. Go back and look at how many people loved their OG Droids in every way but have now moved on to other brands because of locked bootloaders and lack of firmware updates on the models that followed. Money makes the corporate world go round and every little bit helps.
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I'm not really convinced that Motorola's and HTC's losses were due to locked bootloaders, or even lack of firmware updates. Rather, I think it's due to brand inertia: at some point, Samsung came up with a phone (the Galaxy S2) that was so far ahead of anything else on the market at the time, that they just grabbed market share and brand loyalty from many of the consumers on the market. This has little to do with the Galaxy Nexus, and indeed their "next big thing" has been the horribly backward (from a stock perspective) S3 and the Note.

It's been my perception that there is a strong correlation between developer support and whatever device I want to get next.
When I got my very first phone, it was the Samsung Captivate.
It had (Still has) great dev support. I decided not to wait a month to get the Moto Atrix because, there was no predicting what kind of dev support it would have despite having great specs. I find that (generally speaking) Samsung phones have had strong dev support.
I sort of hate to point this out.. But, if you think the "average consumer" cares about upgrades.. I would be inclined to disagree. A lot of people do care about upgrades.. Myself, my girlfriend, a lot of people who frequent forums in general.
Still, your average consumer is probably more concerned with the screen size than the software it's packing. Even if ICS is "nicer" and "more elegant" there are a lot of people who really don't know or even care what OS their phone is running. As long as they can text and check facebook, they aren't going to be bothered with the small details of "Jellybean" or "ICS"
I have to be completely honest when I admit, if I were a manufacturer.. I don't honestly know how inclined I would be to release OS updates. Not because I want to be an evil corporation and force you to upgrade to get the newest OS.. But, because putting it plain and simply.. It takes time, energy, and money to release an update. If *ANYTHING* goes wrong with the update and even a single person doesn't follow the instructions.. It becomes really hard to prove they are the one at fault. So you spend your time and energy making an update, potentially having more cost incurred due to possibly damaged hardware, and then finally.. wondering how many people really cared in the first place. A lot of people don't care and even won't upgrade their phone because, they perceive it as "a pointless endeavor."

thebobp said:
Sure voting makes sense.. if you're in another country where the election's not as rigged.
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What does this have to do with supporting companies that support us? Voting with your dollars is a metaphor; it doesn't mean that there is an election for phones.

Why is Samsung acting like Apple?

Android is supposed to be open, customizable and free, vs iOS. That's why I'm making the switch (plus I couldn't stand the screen size of iPhone).
But now I realize Samsung is behaving like Apple:
- Knox highly discourages (prevents) rooting, just like Apple tries to prevent jailbreaks
- Firmware can't be downgraded, just like on iOS too
Part 1 is still acceptable under the pretext of corporate security, especially since end users generally have no issues getting warranty even with Knox tripped.
But part 2 is simply inconceivable IMO. No downgrading is just ridiculous. It's way worse than part 1 because at least users can choose to void warranty and ignore Knox, but part 2 is maintaining an iron control.

That is the really stupid bit. I have been upgrading, downgrading when I wanted to since the galaxy s days and now this not being able to downgrade really ppppppeeee me off. Didn't care about Knox and tripped it.... But...?... Let's set what's out there come September when my contract runs out
Sent from my SM-N9005 using Tapatalk

When I read threads on how which firmware versions are rootable (without tripping knox) and which aren't, they remind me of apple blogs posting about which iOS versions are jailbreak safe.
Can't believe I'm still gonna buy a note 3!

fterh said:
When I read threads on how which firmware versions are rootable (without tripping knox) and which aren't, they remind me of apple blogs posting about which iOS versions are jailbreak safe.
Can't believe I'm still gonna buy a note 3!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I get it. The hardware is still a good value, but I'll probably look elsewhere in the future.

These companies get too big and start to dictate what the user wants instead of listening... And when they are sitting pretty on top they tend to stop developing new innovations because "They are the best" and then the item tends to stagnate with VERY little actual developement thrown in. Anything new is a kneejerk reaction to the next up and comer for king of the heap....
They will still say it is for the best of the user but in reality its because they're too damn lazy to work. Then comes the copyright everything attitudeand the litigation and more effort is spent suing others for copyright einfingement than making the latest and greatest, what was Apple"s big thing a while back, oh yeah, lets make it white....
Works well for them and most users who have a hard time working out which end to speak in but not for those who actually want to own, use and control what their device actually does....

Take a lil bit, bit by bit til theres nothing less
Sent from my SM-N9005 using XDA Premium 4 mobile app

It's not just Samsung others are going the same route, LG for instance says it got something similar to KNOX in the pipeline, HTC makes it difficult as possible to root their phones, Sony is also going to follow a similar path to Samsung & LG as they all want the corp market to buy their smartphones and feel safe, sod the general consumer that not interested in any of this.
The option in the near future if you want to tinker without tripping something or blowing an efuse is to buy a Nexus.

Its also because of the data breach that chinese and NSA are doing. They want our phones and its data to be safe. Not like modified system files with backdoors and trojans. So its for our own safety. Yes u can always change the layouts, launchers and other stuff. But changing kernel and rooting devices to use system procedures. These are just for developers and those who actually know abt stuff. Not for the common man.
Sent from my GT-N7000 using xda app-developers app

Because Samsung need sale by millions on US like Apple but must be very Secured:
Quote from another post:
...The Knox Bootloader that is the first from a new type of bootloaders, block and not permit many things.
To understand what is the Knox and is bootloader and kernel read this:
https://www.samsungknox.com/en/overview/technical-details See also the video How to Use on it...
On the first attachment we see at left the usual Android, at right we see the Android whit the Samsung Security System Knox in white and the usual until now in blue. Whit this System people can have like two phones on one. A personal whit his own appl and a second secured to work on Enterprises and Governments and others.
The Knox Bootloader protect the secured part and not permit the flashing by Odin some files that it consider not secured like the oldest bootloaders. Then the Knox Warranty Void: 0x0 is first of all the Security System Knox secured. 0x1 is not secured.
For example I quote this from that doc/link:
Samsung KNOX offers a multi-faceted security solution rooted in the tamper-resistant device hardware, through the Linux kernel and Android operating system. The first line of defense against malicious attacks, Samsung KNOX is currently approved to run on US Department of Defense networks. (If flag 0x0, my opinion).

fterh said:
Android is supposed to be open, customizable and free, vs iOS.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
And there's your problem.
Android is open, customizable, and free - at source code level. However, individual implementations (such as Samsung's Touchwiz) have so such requirement to be so.
People like us, who like to hack around with our phones, are not the market that Samsung is aiming for. The vast, vast majority of Samsung Android users are never going to root their phone, manually upgrade/downgrade their firmware via Odin, or install custom ROMs. These users are *never* going to even thing about tripping Knox, let alone do anything that might trip it.
To be fair, Samsung are not alone in this - pretty much all major phone vendors are doing similar. Someone works out how to get S-OFF on the HTC One, and HTC release a patch to prevent it.
Going forward, I see a time coming where if you want to have complete control over your device, you will have to buy a developer edition.
Regards,
Dave

Really? Another thread to whine about Knox?
Sent from my SM-N9005 using XDA Premium 4 mobile app

ultramag69 said:
These companies get too big and start to dictate what the user wants instead of listening... And when they are sitting pretty on top they tend to stop developing new innovations because "They are the best" and then the item tends to stagnate with VERY little actual developement thrown in. Anything new is a kneejerk reaction to the next up and comer for king of the heap....
They will still say it is for the best of the user but in reality its because they're too damn lazy to work. Then comes the copyright everything attitudeand the litigation and more effort is spent suing others for copyright einfingement than making the latest and greatest, what was Apple"s big thing a while back, oh yeah, lets make it white....
Works well for them and most users who have a hard time working out which end to speak in but not for those who actually want to own, use and control what their device actually does....
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
This post basically nails all the reasons in one fell swoop..

And then they are forcing to use original accessories which is really really stupid of Samsung.

Question: Why is Samsung acting like Apple?
Answer: Because Apple is the most successful company in the world.
Do you really need another reason?

aydc said:
Question: Why is Samsung acting like Apple?
Answer: Because Apple is the most successful company in the world.
Do you really need another reason?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
C'mon!!
OK. I've had rooted and hacked everyphohe I've had.. Since Nokia monocromatic days, Sony Ericsson devices and now android... I've used almost every custom ROM.. Applied hundreds of modifications, etc, etc... Trust me. Its funny how ppl complain about software and this Knox thing... Android continues to be on top of iOS for many many reasons... Many many reasons!!
I personally like to root .. Of course but with power comes disorder.. Yes maybe cosmetic custom is one of the reasons for rooting..and its fun. But as it comes with plenty of features so it comes with problems never experienced on stock.. Like freezes, restarts,etc, etc.. U know what am talking about.. Most of us have chosen the Gnote 3 for its innumerable capacities over almost every device on the market. It is a beast. No doubt. For me I haven't seen yet any modification or feature that make me wanna root my note.. It is a beast as it is now. Am not running KK.. Uh uh.. I'll wait for a more completed version... I have more than 15 years using cellphones and customizing them.. And now it seems that companies are getting to know what customers need in their devices .. That's why rooting will no longer be necessary.. Why don't you sit and think about this? I've root my Sgs2 and could have the multi window feature when it came out.. And the list goes and goes.. Arent you able to see we are going to another place now with stock phones?? Actually CM will have its on device sponsored by Google itself !!! See for example the multiple features of the moto x ... It is like R2D2 haha.. Personally I'm happy with the nowadays devices..let s see what's next...
Sent from my SM-N9005 using xda app-developers app

At least Samsung will not shut down your phone and force update, like Crapple does, on Samsung at least you can disable updates. And blame other users as well for this lockdowns: how many people brick their phones when modding and then at least try to claim warranty repairs or exchange? I don't have to look far, my good friend rooted his Note3 and this made his Gear stop working. Couldn't fix it, so he took it to service center and strangely enough they did fix it for free (he may have unrooted first, I don't know), by bringing all to stock and he is a hacker, perfectly capable of figuring it out, just didn't want to bother I guess. And yes, because Crapple is so successful, many companies will follow suit, so blame all Crapple users as well. If Crapple was a total failure, no one would imitate them.

pete4k said:
At least Samsung will not shut down your phone and force update, like Crapple does, on Samsung at least you can disable updates. And blame other users as well for this lockdowns: how many people brick their phones when modding and then at least try to claim warranty repairs or exchange? I don't have to look far, my good friend rooted his Note3 and this made his Gear stop working. Couldn't fix it, so he took it to service center and strangely enough they did fix it for free (he may have unrooted first, I don't know), by bringing all to stock and he is a hacker, perfectly capable of figuring it out, just didn't want to bother I guess. And yes, because Crapple is so successful, many companies will follow suit, so blame all Crapple users as well. If Crapple was a total failure, no one would imitate them.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Soon change in a few years. You'll see Samsung become more and more like Apple in time.

Samsung used to be just another Korean electronics company, like what LG is today. Then they started copying Apple. The more they copied Apple, the more successful they became. It's this simple. Believe it. If you do what successful people do, you become successful. Just because you don't like something doesn't mean it doesn't work.

aydc said:
Samsung used to be just another Korean electronics company, like what LG is today. Then they started copying Apple. The more they copied Apple, the more successful they became. It's this simple. Believe it. If you do what successful people do, you become successful. Just because you don't like something doesn't mean it doesn't work.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Just like the sales of apple is now falling I believe it will also happen to samsung.
Another thing not related to your comment since they've stopped allot people from rooting and developing due to the warranty issues. Development is Damn slow now. Like they did with gokhanmoral (think thats how you spell it all credits to him) with the s2 they had cherry picked from his kernel tree to implement into the stock to make stock run even smoother. Now there's only really one kernel in development for the international model compared to what previous phones had where there were quite a range.
What's the point of having really high end specs if you can't really exploit them? and sticking to something which much lower and play 'safe'.
Sent from my SM-N9005 using xda app-developers app

I miss old days of xda-developers.

The community was full of talented developers and modders that would put their all into it. Even when a update was in testing developers was still able to get us a copy so that we didn't have to wait for the carrier dragging their feet. We had guarantee root and unroot methods. People would answer questions when asked. Threads would always got comments no matter the topic. I don't know what happened to this great community. Almost seem like people don't care to much anymore. I come here almost every day and it's no new activity. Could it be this device or did xda-developers really change?

It's this device. Unless we get a bootloader unlock, you'll see the same activity pretty much every single day. If you check out the Exynos version of this device, activity is splendid and dev support is pretty well. Many of us knew that this device would stay locked, and you as well should have known before purchasing this device.

xWolf is 99% right.
Our devices are locked down, not a lot you can do when the bootloader is encrypted. The old days of leaked keys and hacked bootloader's are pretty much over.
The other 1% is the communities attitude. We have people running full stock down talking people who want to root. We have people who don't read and flash things that were never meant for their device. Then there are the people who attack developers for not doing things how they want... that's just in the T-Mobile S7 edge forums.
I have multiple phones. Some my daily driver like the s7 are mostly stock running the U firmware, but my G3 is still being developed I have Nougat on my G3... my S4 is still developed, and my s6 is slow but there are a few dedicated folks doing stuff. I have been part of XDA for about a decade soft and hard bricked more than a few phones working with devs to test things and the last few years the community has been flooded with people who don't deserve the time and effort these devs put into their work.
Sorry rant over...
Sent from my SM-G935U using XDA Premium HD app

problem is things like samsung pay which are awesome. As we switch to a smartphone taking over PC's for standard users development like this will die. I miss the old days too. I just wish I could overclock my cpu/gpu on my S7 and still have samsung pay. Not having to carry my wallet is nice.

This isn't specific to the T-Mo forums, unfortunately. Though there does seem to be more virtual foot-traffic in the AT&T realm (I'm an AT&T user), it essentially amounts to the same level of traction.
I concur with what others have said, and honestly - I don't care about root at this point. Phones do most everything that I want (custom launcher, etc), but the one thing that drives me insane is the lack of ability to do a nandroid backup. I cannot stand that - after all this time on Android - Google has not made this a possibility without root. Light users don't and won't care, but then again they aren't on XDA in the first place. Those of us that are want to be able to backup things in a "snapshot" type of way, so we don't have to start from scratch. Helium, and similar apps only go so far (not nearly far enough, IMO) to band-aid this.

This phone isn't geared toward the "XDA user" in the first place. 99.9% of people who use this device have no idea what a nandroid is and how it benefits them. And honestly, on a stock device, I also fail to see the utility of snapshot backups. I get why they exist but how often does the casual user wipe their device to make it worthwhile? Also, space is still pretty limited on mobile devices. Google will never bring this functionality to Android, but I would not complain if they had a backup utility similar to Apple's iTunes, which restores everything from a computer. That actually makes sense, and I am surprised that Google has not made something similar.
That being said, there are plenty of excellent devices that offer you what you want. Everything is a trade-off.

Kingaries79 said:
The community was full of talented developers and modders that would put their all into it. Even when a update was in testing developers was still able to get us a copy so that we didn't have to wait for the carrier dragging their feet. We had guarantee root and unroot methods. People would answer questions when asked. Threads would always got comments no matter the topic. I don't know what happened to this great community. Almost seem like people don't care to much anymore. I come here almost every day and it's no new activity. Could it be this device or did xda-developers really change?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Come to the V20. You have to follow the hardware to play you cant go with what has the best hardware all the time.

RIP Unlocking bootloader officially

https://www.xda-developers.com/huawei-stop-providing-bootloader-unlock-codes/

Oh come on that's never an issue script and bypass by exploiting it

Thats huge NO NO, this is my first and last Huawei device. I love my p9 and was planning to get p20 pro but now... If they get out with this most of companies will follow imo

KinG5Pac said:
Thats huge NO NO, this is my first and last Huawei device. I love my p9 and was planning to get p20 pro but now... If they get out with this most of companies will follow imo
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Nuh i dont think so. And its not the first company who actually done it. And again its in their legal rights to do so., but as i said it very easy to exploit the bootloader without bootloader code and it will not make any difference customizing it. Back in my days we had to crack the CD to clone the game....and even today we crack the EXE to play pirate games. The same will happen with the devices. Samsung and Google already locked many devices and you was not able to get a bootloader code. That did not stop us though

KinG5Pac said:
Thats huge NO NO, this is my first and last Huawei device. I love my p9 and was planning to get p20 pro but now... If they get out with this most of companies will follow imo
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Same thing here. P9 was really great had it for two years and I was very satisfied. But no way am I going with the P20. It has terrible value... So expensive? Bad design choices...
I think most companies take a bad turn after they get too big. Same thing with Samsung. They made an almost perfect phone with the Galaxy S3 (at the time) for a great price. Then they kept releasing the same design but increased price every year and now they sell glass slates that break if you look at them wrong, that cost 1000$.
I just got an amazing deal on an LG G6 which already has Oreo. That will hopefully last me until this whole notch/no headphone-jack craze washes over!

clouds5 said:
I think most companies take a bad turn after they get too big. Same thing with Samsung.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Its not about "getting to big". Look at it from company and market perspective. Some people here dont get it but modded devices take really small percentage of overall Android devices out there. We sit inside and read about that so we thing that everyone doing that but, most of android users dont even know what Android version they have, for them its just "Android Phone" + Brand name.
But for past year that number of custom roms and forcing updates that users do because they dont want to wait for official OTA grow and companies want to protect their names so there will be no situation like company is known that it have bad devices because people who mess with firmware cry about it all over the internet creating bad reputation.
Huawei was never perfect device for modding, and because Huawei is one of the biggest companies that aim for top they want to smooth their reputation by protecting their devices(no messing with bootloader = marketing advertising for "safe" device) and make users to use build in features and updates that they can control instead of messing with device to get it.
And yes, some people will cry that they will never get Huawei device again, or cry that its worst decision, but in reality those people are less than 0.5% of their worldwide user base. Some people will still mod those devices because they know-how, and stopping "easy way" to unlocking bootloader is not big deal, and Huawei devices are not alone here, there is lots of other devices and few companies that also block it and no one cry about it beside small number of people.
For me and probably for most of people it dont matter, Huawei devices are not bad compared to other companies, they work good, and for all normal people thats matter: that device work good. Today there is not much reason to mod devices, most of options that people need are build in, performance on even mid-range devices are good, no need to tinker under the hud like in old days to get device to work smooth. There are still many apps that need root and there are many roms that are really good, but most of people dont need that anymore, and only new users and people who are bored tinker with it... and for most of time screw their devices and then cry all over the internet that phone dont work...

vampirian said:
Oh come on that's never an issue script and bypass by exploiting it
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Sorry what do you mean?

Akinaro said:
Its not about "getting to big". Look at it from company and market perspective. Some people here dont get it but modded devices take really small percentage of overall Android devices out there. We sit inside and read about that so we thing that everyone doing that but, most of android users dont even know what Android version they have, for them its just "Android Phone" + Brand name.
But for past year that number of custom roms and forcing updates that users do because they dont want to wait for official OTA grow and companies want to protect their names so there will be no situation like company is known that it have bad devices because people who mess with firmware cry about it all over the internet creating bad reputation.
Huawei was never perfect device for modding, and because Huawei is one of the biggest companies that aim for top they want to smooth their reputation by protecting their devices(no messing with bootloader = marketing advertising for "safe" device) and make users to use build in features and updates that they can control instead of messing with device to get it.
And yes, some people will cry that they will never get Huawei device again, or cry that its worst decision, but in reality those people are less than 0.5% of their worldwide user base. Some people will still mod those devices because they know-how, and stopping "easy way" to unlocking bootloader is not big deal, and Huawei devices are not alone here, there is lots of other devices and few companies that also block it and no one cry about it beside small number of people.
For me and probably for most of people it dont matter, Huawei devices are not bad compared to other companies, they work good, and for all normal people thats matter: that device work good. Today there is not much reason to mod devices, most of options that people need are build in, performance on even mid-range devices are good, no need to tinker under the hud like in old days to get device to work smooth. There are still many apps that need root and there are many roms that are really good, but most of people dont need that anymore, and only new users and people who are bored tinker with it... and for most of time screw their devices and then cry all over the internet that phone dont work...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Aww sorry for touching your feelings about huawei. -0.5% also money which is gone for sure btw not only p9 users heard about this news so do your calculations it's more than 0.5%, and most of people buy phones just asking these "tech-savvy (crying)" people's recommendation.

zwwel said:
Sorry what do you mean?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
not gonna sit and explain because it will look like a chinese alphabet to newcomers.
KinG5Pac said:
Aww sorry for touching your feelings about huawei. -0.5% also money which is gone for sure btw not only p9 users heard about this news so do your calculations it's more than 0.5%, and most of people buy phones just asking these "tech-savvy (crying)" people's recommendation.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
He is right though because the market is not targeting on "under the hood modders" but they do target on average Joes who gets a phone , takes a good picture, using messenger, call, play some android games yadda yadda.
I can tell you that its less than 0.5% worldwide and if that 0.5% needs 3-4 times to return the devices because they hardbrick their devices from custom firmwares, they will have to replace the device which is a cost and also they will gain bad reputation for having "sensitive" devices. I dont think you bought P9 for the under the hood customization. Did you? because most of us got it for the superior cameras tbh.
I do dislike the fact that bootloader is locked , however there is always a way to bypass bootloader and push TWRP. Ive done it already on P8 and P9 and i can not see where it would be a problem with newer devices.
If someone wants to push a custom firmware and have the knowledge to do it, then definitely he will have enough experience on searching for tools that can do this job. Legally, illegally it doesnt matter.

KinG5Pac said:
Aww sorry for touching your feelings about huawei. -0.5% also money which is gone for sure btw not only p9 users heard about this news so do your calculations it's more than 0.5%, and most of people buy phones just asking these "tech-savvy (crying)" people's recommendation.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Touching my feelings? Grow up kid...
Huawei P9 is my first Huawei device, for past years I was using only Sony devices. I dont have any "feelings" to phone, because its just device, and it work as advertised.
I dont care how Huawei run its own company, I see other companies and overall market and its not different than others.
What I dont like are are people who behave like kid and cry about small things and get personal with any cont argument that they dont like. Open your eyes wider and look at this from wider perspective than your own nose, then maybe you will understand some things

Akinaro said:
Touching my feelings? Grow up kid...
Huawei P9 is my first Huawei device, for past years I was using only Sony devices. I dont have any "feelings" to phone, because its just device, and it work as advertised.
I dont care how Huawei run its own company, I see other companies and overall market and its not different than others.
What I dont like are are people who behave like kid and cry about small things and get personal with any cont argument that they dont like. Open your eyes wider and look at this from wider perspective than your own nose, then maybe you will understand some things
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
There there, wipe your tears. Your logic make me wanna puke. Don't be angry about others opinions cos I really don't give a f about yours but i read it cos your asking "me" to grove up (really man?) thanks I'll do it, but still stop being asshhole.
Have good one! :victory:

KinG5Pac said:
There there, wipe your tears. Your logic make me wanna puke. Don't be angry about others opinions cos I really don't give a f about yours but i read it cos your asking "me" to grove up (really man?) thanks I'll do it, but still stop being asshhole.
Have good one! :victory:
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Keyboard warrior? He expressed his opinion and yes you have to grow up. Its a bloody device and not a girlfriend. I really notice that this forum is basically 13 years old mouthy kids. There you go if i change device is only for this reason. Till then im going to the russian community. At least they are developing things. They are not like here expressing clueless opinions, leeching and been demanding and insult other forum members, either act like kids who wants a lollipop. Here take your lollipop.
Byeeeee

vampirian said:
Keyboard warrior? He expressed his opinion and yes you have to grow up. Its a bloody device and not a girlfriend. I really notice that this forum is basically 13 years old mouthy kids. There you go if i change device is only for this reason. Till then im going to the russian community. At least they are developing things. They are not like here expressing clueless opinions, leeching and been demanding and insult other forum members, either act like kids who wants a lollipop. Here take your lollipop.
Byeeeee
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Why you even here? Anyways you still thinking unlocking bootloader is some scripting or something? There are still some HTC phones which are impossible to unlock and I remember some devs used beg Xiaomi to make kernel open source, LG bootloader aghh Sony's DRM after unlock... Anyways say hello to 4pda
У меня всё... :fingers-crossed:

KinG5Pac said:
Why you even here? Anyways you still thinking unlocking bootloader is some scripting or something? There are still some HTC phones which are impossible to unlock and I remember some devs used beg Xiaomi to make kernel open source, LG bootloader aghh Sony's DRM after unlock... Anyways say hello to 4pda
У меня всё... :fingers-crossed:
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
are you one of those guyz?
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/femail/a...remony-prove-precious-phones-daily-lives.html
Bootloader=kernel?
you mixed up what is what.
Lesson one:
Android Bootloader
Every Android phone has a bootloader that instructs the operating system kernel to boot normally. But you need to understand one thing here that as Android OS is an open source OS and is available on a variety of different hardware, every manufacturer has their own version of bootloader specific for the hardware present in it’s environment. At its most basic level, your Android smartphone is like a hard drive, made of up several partitions. One of those partitions holds the Android system files, another holds all the app data you accumulate (which is how you’re usually able to update without losing all your stuff), and others to do more behind-the scenes stuff.
Lesson two
Why are Bootloaders Locked?
A bootloader is usually locked on an Android device because although it’s an open source OS, still the manufacturers want you to stick to their Android OS version specifically designed for the device. In order to apply this concept, manufacturers lock the bootloader. With a locked bootloader on Android devices, it is virtually impossible to flash a Custom ROM and forced attempts void warranty as well as usually end up in bricks. Therefore, the first step is to always unlock the bootloader.
Lesson 3:
Why keep a bootloader out of reach? One of the biggest reasons is that the carriers and manufacturers dont want to have to support hacked phones. The other is that a lot of time and money is spent developing these things.
Lesson 4
No company is obligated to release or to help you unlock your bootloader. You are allowed to hack it. But you have to respect the brick and return policies.
You can complain as much you want. If you want to play with fimrwares you can go buy an old samsung device.
The market is targeting the user and not the developer.
ты говоришь дерьмо, и ты высокомерный
хорошего дня

vampirian said:
are you one of those guyz?
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/femail/a...remony-prove-precious-phones-daily-lives.html
Bootloader=kernel?
you mixed up what is what.
Lesson one:
Android Bootloader
Every Android phone has a bootloader that instructs the operating system kernel to boot normally. But you need to understand one thing here that as Android OS is an open source OS and is available on a variety of different hardware, every manufacturer has their own version of bootloader specific for the hardware present in it’s environment. At its most basic level, your Android smartphone is like a hard drive, made of up several partitions. One of those partitions holds the Android system files, another holds all the app data you accumulate (which is how you’re usually able to update without losing all your stuff), and others to do more behind-the scenes stuff.
Lesson two
Why are Bootloaders Locked?
A bootloader is usually locked on an Android device because although it’s an open source OS, still the manufacturers want you to stick to their Android OS version specifically designed for the device. In order to apply this concept, manufacturers lock the bootloader. With a locked bootloader on Android devices, it is virtually impossible to flash a Custom ROM and forced attempts void warranty as well as usually end up in bricks. Therefore, the first step is to always unlock the bootloader.
Lesson 3:
Why keep a bootloader out of reach? One of the biggest reasons is that the carriers and manufacturers dont want to have to support hacked phones. The other is that a lot of time and money is spent developing these things.
Lesson 4
No company is obligated to release or to help you unlock your bootloader. You are allowed to hack it. But you have to respect the brick and return policies.
You can complain as much you want. If you want to play with fimrwares you can go buy an old samsung device.
The market is targeting the user and not the developer.
ты говоришь дерьмо, и ты высокомерный
хорошего дня
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Click to collapse
I'm not even comparing, im just giving you examples where companies are being just ignorant to devs. Why they should care about brick after unlocking bootloader? You make zero sense. Unlocked bootloader void warranty so back to the topic. If you still think removing to have an option is "good" then congratulations have fun.
update: I appreciate your time that you spent on research.

Any kind soul willing to help me unlock bootloader, i belive huawei stoped supporting the website to get the bootloader code.
i tried to search everything in the forum.
should i try any suspicious website that asks money to unlock?
Really apreciated!

nightgost said:
Any kind soul willing to help me unlock bootloader, i belive huawei stoped supporting the website to get the bootloader code.
i tried to search everything in the forum.
should i try any suspicious website that asks money to unlock?
Really apreciated!
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DC-Unlocker is the place to go: https://www.dc-unlocker.com/supported_models_1/huawei_phones
I think it costs 4 Euros. I've used this site and it's legit.

vampirian said:
Nuh i dont think so. And its not the first company who actually done it. And again its in their legal rights to do so., but as i said it very easy to exploit the bootloader without bootloader code and it will not make any difference customizing it. Back in my days we had to crack the CD to clone the game....and even today we crack the EXE to play pirate games. The same will happen with the devices. Samsung and Google already locked many devices and you was not able to get a bootloader code. That did not stop us though
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How to Do unlock process? kindly tell me..

5pd said:
How to Do unlock process? kindly tell me..
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Scroll up in this thread and you will find link to their website with instructions there:
https://www.dc-unlocker.com/how-to-read-huawei-bootloader-unlock-code

So my only option is to use DC-Unlocker right?