[][][]DISCLAIMER - ITS YOUR RESPONSIBILITY TO FIGURE WHAT IF ANY LEGAL IMPLICATIONS ANY OF THIS MAY HAVE IN YOUR AREA, THREAD IS FOR INFORMATIONAL PURPOSES ONLY!![][][]
Well there's a lot of conflicting information, this first post is reserved for the ultimate list or so, forgive the future constant editing. And, though i make a bare, rudimentary effort, irc rules for punctuation apply - only when really needed
Here's the scenario:
a. sprint branded touch pro 2
b. friend who owns boost auth. [and others] cell store
c. goal - boost cdma
d. never been activated!
problems i've run into so far:
at least with the initial activation you cannot choose ANY of the 3 cdma phones boost sells [sold?]. Wonder why? Well your in luck i've spent about 14 hrs on the phone with sprint and boost so far, and have a few answers. Reps for either Co. feel free to comment.
a. of the phones they offer for the cdma or offered as the case may be, the primary obstacle is that the meid [dec] does not fall in the same //family// as theirs. Currently they are looking for a 268..... [there's another one i don't have in front of me offhand, will edit this later with that].
b. Second point of contention: When investigating the process that cells are 'authorized' for use on a carrier it seems to fall down to talking to someone who is both willing and able to add a given phone's id to inventory.
1. so if your wondering why metropcs is so easy, but boost is so hard:
A. the software houdini - that's the authorized dealer's access portal to the metropcs inventory. That is why its the only 'legal' way to get a [good/bad/non-metropcs] imei/esn/dec/{whatever they wanna call it this week} into the system.
B. Once its in inventory, the phone must also at least have the correct PRL - Preferred Roaming List. After that's where custom roms come in
[ anyone feel free to correct me i've no personal pride tied up here ]
2. so essentially what we're looking for is a boost agent who is capable of inputting this legit clean never-been-used dec.
a. Tried using the phone models they do offer, with my real dec - no go. Two models are having 11digit dec, the other one has 15 digits.
So no offense to those who have said they had existing service, but added a phone, here i have to call BS. Again in MY experience, over 4 hours calling in to many many MANY different reps - i could not even activate the phone - ONTO THE BOOST UNLIMITED CDMA PLAN - to an active account with over a half dozen lines.
[ for the curious, the shop owner was using his acct for that step, as if we can ever figure this out, we plan to offer it out, as long as its a legit process, etc. ]
Now here's the kicker - the phone cannot be added to even an existing Boost Unlimited CDMA account ONLY because of several re-cyclical reasons [those they use to justify each other and when all are heard end up in some sort of circular logic pattern]
What i've heard so far [again feel free to add in here]:
1. amount of digits in imei cannot work
2. i am not capable
3. only second level tech can do inventory adds
4. there is only one level of tech support at boost and we do not know how to do it
5. we cannot activate it since we don't know the phone model
6. you cannot put sprint on boost no matter what
7. that phone is incompatible
Keep in mind, i'm about a half step from an FCC filing, as they can certainly deny custom service for no reason, however in telecommunications the company is legally responsible for what their operators say. If you can prove they offered you XXXXX and there's a recording, a long drawn out investigation CAN reveal these facts, and remember mediation is your only option unless you can PROVE they are violating the contract, which is the thing requiring mediation. [the FCC can check if they are in violation, but this is a lot of work and time to get started, and even worse getting finished lol.]
so with the blustering anger out of the way lets review the boost excuses:
1. - possible.. i can see a software/database check to ensure against, well i'm sure fraud is usually the reason given for this type of policy, it makes sense - just frustrating.
2. lies.
3. need rep confirmation
4. need rep confirmation
5. lies.
6. lies.
7. LIEZ!
so for compatibility lets review the sprint branded touch pro 2:
cdma - check
gsm - check
edge - check
evdeo - check
iden - check
hsdpa - NOPE
fm radio - DOESN'T LOOK LIKE IT
[Ive not tried my hand yet, get to that next week... shoot i don't even listen to the radio, i just hate being locked out of anything that my device is capable of, JUST IN CASE ]
So in conclusion, I think [so far]:
a. they can
b. they don't wanna
c. sometimes someone's probably frustrated with job and does anyway
d. wondering if it matters where you say your from [I'm in calli - its on the cdma list]
[][][]Lets try not to flame them [boost/sprint], this makes marketing sense for a number of reasons for them to do this, I, and many of you, it seems just do not want to pay more than needed just to use a cool phone.[][][]
Hate to bump like this, but 120 views and no opinions?? oi!
I LOVE this type of tinkering, this is what the guys at 2600 love to find answers for.
Another reason SIM cards are superior, as there is no jumping through hoops to add a phone to the system.
I dont have a solution, however you have more access than most to the network with your buddy a BOOST store owner. There is a very low probability you will be able to add this phone for the pure reason you stated of adding a new phone not being currently sold to the BOOST network.
One thing, is it possible to get a phone activated on the Boost network, then clone the ESN from the working phone to the TP2, I know people can change the CID # so might be able to change the ESN, only way I can think of without a level 2 insider.
GL
Force
forcelite said:
I LOVE this type of tinkering, this is what the guys at 2600 love to find answers for.
Another reason SIM cards are superior, as there is no jumping through hoops to add a phone to the system.
I dont have a solution, however you have more access than most to the network with your buddy a BOOST store owner. There is a very low probability you will be able to add this phone for the pure reason you stated of adding a new phone not being currently sold to the BOOST network.
One thing, is it possible to get a phone activated on the Boost network, then clone the ESN from the working phone to the TP2, I know people can change the CID # so might be able to change the ESN, only way I can think of without a level 2 insider.
GL
Force
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
see the thing is, i'm pretty sure i can change the esn, but i'm not sure of the implications - even if i was doing it legit. And if i did, the guy's gonna want me to do it to dozens of others so i'd have to consult legal eagle before going that route. cloning a working phone is definately a felony. Cloning a phone you own and that is non-functional - mmmmmmm - who knows.
i got a sprint tp2 on boost cdma and i got proof
I as well have a Sprint Touch Pro 2 on Boost Mobile unlimited. It was pretty easy too but there's a website that I won't mention (Not sure about the rules) that does this stuff.
I personally already had the iDen account for a year or so and in a case where you're already on the iDen network, you can just call and tell them you want to switch to the CDMA service and give them the numbers off the phone. Obviously some reps will do it and some won't but I believe if you're nice and patient it can easily be done.
If you are going to just start a CDMA account, you need a boost branded phone to start the account and then later call back and switch in your other phone.
But, for whatever reason, a small number of TP2's cannot be activated on Boost. From reading people have tried figuring out if it has something to do with the numbers or what but no one has come up with anything.
I am happy to be one of those ppl to have my tp2 activated on boost. It is also one of those hard to activate numbers they talk about. Had a little problem getting it programmed to work, but now everything works. I had to make several calls to customer service not by regular means. google boost mobile customer service for a different number and dial 88 at the prompt. Takes you to a live agent no wait time at all. Still took 3 trys but finally a nice rep walked me through the process and stated several times they could not be held responsible if it did not work. Thanks everyone for your help.
starryis said:
I am happy to be one of those ppl to have my tp2 activated on boost. It is also one of those hard to activate numbers they talk about. Had a little problem getting it programmed to work, but now everything works. I had to make several calls to customer service not by regular means. google boost mobile customer service for a different number and dial 88 at the prompt. Takes you to a live agent no wait time at all. Still took 3 trys but finally a nice rep walked me through the process and stated several times they could not be held responsible if it did not work. Thanks everyone for your help.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
That's basically how I was also able to get a Sprint CDMA Blackberry on the boost mobile network almost a year ago now. I just kept calling until i spoke to someone who actually knew what they were doing and was generally actually a nice person and they did it for me on the phone. They can do it if they want to. They would probably give it more consideration if you already have a data plan with another network and tell them you want to make the switch. That's what I'm planning on doing tomorrow. Personally I believe a cell phone bill should be in the range of $20. You have to consider that the signals are in the air whether you use them or not, so they might as well take your $20 just have to navigate past the BS as with anything. I'm pissed at my new TP2 service on T-mobile now because they told me the 15$ no contract unlimited text and 10cents a minute talk came with 2gb of data and now I am finding out that was a lie. I probably should have checked better but hey I was in a rush and they are throwing commercials out on TV for another contract plan that has web access for 10$ and that threw me off a little into thinking they were a decent company so I'm pissed. Pretty sure I can get my money back if they don't give me what I want, but otherwise I'm going to boost or virgin mobile one way or the other.
Not sure if this correct forum to post this and did a quick search, but didn't see anything that correlated. I'm a otr truck driver and 75% of the time I'm on edge network. Currently I have data roam turned off. Was wondering if anybody had a solution to "trick " network into thinking I was in a 3G area. I have unlimited data plan and my thinking was, if tethering was free with rooted dev.how come I have to pay extra to data roam when I'm not on atnt's signal?
Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I897 using XDA App
there is no way to "trick" a cell tower to broadcast farther.
Roostercruiser said:
Not sure if this correct forum to post this and did a quick search, but didn't see anything that correlated. I'm a otr truck driver and 75% of the time I'm on edge network. Currently I have data roam turned off. Was wondering if anybody had a solution to "trick " network into thinking I was in a 3G area. I have unlimited data plan and my thinking was, if tethering was free with rooted dev.how come I have to pay extra to data roam when I'm not on atnt's signal?
Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I897 using XDA App
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Not exactly sure what you're trying to do here, but let me take a stab at it:
There is very little reason while within the continental united states to have "data roaming" turned off. So yes, technically, on an AT&T phone, you can "roam" to other data networks, but so long as you're not using excessive amounts of data, and not spending long periods of time only on the roaming network, it won't be a problem. All AT&T plans are "nationwide access" so except for one teensy tiny condition that I'll explain in a second, there's no need to manually restrict your phone. Basically let your phone "roam" to whatever networks it wants, be but warned, if there is any AT&T tower in sight, your phone will take that over any other GSM network, even if it's only an EDGE connection. Only way to get around that is to lock your phone to WCDMA (3G), but that may have undesirable effects if you're travelling over long distances where cell coverage is poor.
So here's the exception, if you are both:
- Spending multiple consecutive days on an AT&T partner "roaming" network
- Using large amounts of data (like from tethering, which you shouldn't be doing anyway w/o a tethering plan)
Then you will get in trouble. AT&T will call you first, and tell you to stop. If you don't stop, then they will terminate your contract. No ETF or other fees will be charged, but you probably won't be able to get another plan with AT&T under the same name again. The reason is that AT&T has to pay lots of money to those roaming partners to let you (the customer) use their networks. Due to FCC regs, spectrum allocations, anti-trust, etc... AT&T can only offer service in certain areas, and not in others, hence why they have to partner with other cell networks. But apparently, those agreements really r*pe AT&T up the butt, which is why they'll let it go for a while, but if you start costing them too much money, they'll just drop you as a customer.
This happened to me once in Arizona, in an area only covered by T-Mobile. I was tethering through my 3G phone at the time (an HTC Kaiser/Tilt actually) and used something like 500 MB over a week. This was back in the old days of unlimited plans, and before AT&T could enforce tethering/non-tethering plans. I got a phone call from a special department within AT&T, and they politely said, "turn the data functions of your phone off immediately, or your contract will be terminated". Apparently, through roaming agreements, they had paid out (or were contractually obliged to eventually pay out) something like $300-$400 to T-Mobile over the course of a week, and we're none too pleased about it. I stopped, and it was all good.
Long story short, don't abuse the roaming agreements, and you won't have a problem.
The reason tether can be free is because it SHOULD be free. You are using an inbuilt feature of the phone to route internet requests.... its a simple feature which has been available on dumb phones since year 1995. It was not mainstream until recently and ATT realized they could simply disable it and charge. Its free in Europe because that's how it should be...
Tethering just sends internet requests to your device and your device returns the results of the request to your computer. Its very shadey of ATT to charge for it. Any internet enabled device has the inbuilt capability to route data from one device to another... even the simplest dumb phone.
Shammyh said:
Not exactly sure what you're trying to do here, but let me take a stab at it:
There is very little reason while within the continental united states to have "data roaming" turned off. So yes, technically, on an AT&T phone, you can "roam" to other data networks, but so long as you're not using excessive amounts of data, and not spending long periods of time only on the roaming network, it won't be a problem. All AT&T plans are "nationwide access" so except for one teensy tiny condition that I'll explain in a second, there's no need to manually restrict your phone. Basically let your phone "roam" to whatever networks it wants, be but warned, if there is any AT&T tower in sight, your phone will take that over any other GSM network, even if it's only an EDGE connection. Only way to get around that is to lock your phone to WCDMA (3G), but that may have undesirable effects if you're travelling over long distances where cell coverage is poor.
So here's the exception, if you are both:
- Spending multiple consecutive days on an AT&T partner "roaming" network
- Using large amounts of data (like from tethering, which you shouldn't be doing anyway w/o a tethering plan)
Then you will get in trouble. AT&T will call you first, and tell you to stop. If you don't stop, then they will terminate your contract. No ETF or other fees will be charged, but you probably won't be able to get another plan with AT&T under the same name again. The reason is that AT&T has to pay lots of money to those roaming partners to let you (the customer) use their networks. Due to FCC regs, spectrum allocations, anti-trust, etc... AT&T can only offer service in certain areas, and not in others, hence why they have to partner with other cell networks. But apparently, those agreements really r*pe AT&T up the butt, which is why they'll let it go for a while, but if you start costing them too much money, they'll just drop you as a customer.
This happened to me once in Arizona, in an area only covered by T-Mobile. I was tethering through my 3G phone at the time (an HTC Kaiser/Tilt actually) and used something like 500 MB over a week. This was back in the old days of unlimited plans, and before AT&T could enforce tethering/non-tethering plans. I got a phone call from a special department within AT&T, and they politely said, "turn the data functions of your phone off immediately, or your contract will be terminated". Apparently, through roaming agreements, they had paid out (or were contractually obliged to eventually pay out) something like $300-$400 to T-Mobile over the course of a week, and we're none too pleased about it. I stopped, and it was all good.
Long story short, don't abuse the roaming agreements, and you won't have a problem.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Moral of the story: If you don't want to pay an ETF find a remote area of Arizona.
AdamOutler said:
The reason tether can be free is because it SHOULD be free. You are using an inbuilt feature of the phone to route internet requests.... its a simple feature which has been available on dumb phones since year 1995. It was not mainstream until recently and ATT realized they could simply disable it and charge. Its free in Europe because that's how it should be...
Tethering just sends internet requests to your device and your device returns the results of the request to your computer. Its very shadey of ATT to charge for it. Any internet enabled device has the inbuilt capability to route data from one device to another... even the simplest dumb phone.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Totally agree. I'm just explaining the way it works, not the way it *should* work.
In fact, I figure that as long as I don't go over my 2 GB/month allocation, I can tether as much as I want, and I do.
Shammyh said:
Not exactly sure what you're trying to do here, but let me take a stab at it:
There is very little reason while within the continental united states to have "data roaming" turned off... and it was all good.
Long story short, don't abuse the roaming agreements, and you won't have a problem.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Pardon me for redacting, but I wished to get to the heart of the matter.
A four-year member with 204 posts. I applaud both your insight and restraint, sir.
The point was, you can't access network features because they are on your network. You can access phone features because they are on your phone. Roaming is roaming no matter what. Its tracked by the network by your SIM. Change the SIM and you change your service type. Im not sure if its legal to mess with that.
Is it possible to purchase a 'data sim'? Whereby you could access a regional data network on an unlocked phone? i.e. I'm in Nowhereland but they locally sell me a pay as you go data sim to use in my unlocked phone for data, but not network telephone service.
A Unicorn? Or real?
Shammyh said:
Totally agree. I'm just explaining the way it works, not the way it *should* work.
In fact, I figure that as long as I don't go over my 2 GB/month allocation, I can tether as much as I want, and I do.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The OP's question boils down to this...
if tethering was free with rooted dev.how come I have to pay extra to data roam when I'm not on atnt's signal?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The simple answer is because tethering is a device function and AT&T's shadey business practices make you pay to use your own device. Roaming is a network function and there's nothing that can be done about it except
1. update towers
2. change modems (sometimes yeilds better results on different AT&T towers, but wont' change roming)
3. change carriers
4. modify your SIM card to be more compatible with your current network.
AdamOutler said:
4. modify your SIM card to be more compatible with your current network.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
So how does one modify one's SIM card to be more compatible with one's current network?
clemmie said:
So how does one modify one's SIM card to be more compatible with one's current network?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You wouldn't... you would change the identifiers so it thought you were another customer..... illegally.
I'm not sure exactly, but I may have an answer soon. I'm looking at methods of communicating with the call processor in order to device bricked phones. It might be the best way to inject code into the ram. . Ill get back to you on that.
AdamOutler said:
The reason tether can be free is because it SHOULD be free. You are using an inbuilt feature of the phone to route internet requests.... its a simple feature which has been available on dumb phones since year 1995. It was not mainstream until recently and ATT realized they could simply disable it and charge. Its free in Europe because that's how it should be...
Tethering just sends internet requests to your device and your device returns the results of the request to your computer. Its very shadey of ATT to charge for it. Any internet enabled device has the inbuilt capability to route data from one device to another... even the simplest dumb phone.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Uncle does it on dumb kyocera and Samsung phones on metro pcs all day long
clemmie said:
Is it possible to purchase a 'data sim'? Whereby you could access a regional data network on an unlocked phone? i.e. I'm in Nowhereland but they locally sell me a pay as you go data sim to use in my unlocked phone for data, but not network telephone service.
A Unicorn? Or real?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yes, but it's not straightforward, and not exactly kosher.
You'll have to get/calculate/steal/borrow a "data connect" IMEI. Basically you need the IMEI off of a built in data card, or a purchased data card, (like one of these).
You may also need to go to an AT&T store and buy a new SIM card (usually $35 one time fee) because usually if you re-use your existing cell SIM card, they won't allow you to sign up. So with your new SIM card in hand, and an IMEI of any data connect device, you go and sign up for one of these data plans. Rates for Domestic DataConnect Pass Plans are:
DataConnect Day Pass - 100 MB for $15
DataConnect Week Pass - 300 MB for $30
DataConnect Month Pass - 1 GB for $50
Assuming no terrible problems, you should now have a "data only" AT&T SIM card. Problem is, they'll see pretty quickly that you're not using the SIM card with the device IMEI you signed up with. That may or may not cause problems. Hasn't for me in the past, but I make no guarantees.
AdamOutler said:
You wouldn't... you would change the identifiers so it thought you were another customer..... illegally.
I'm not sure exactly, but I may have an answer soon. I'm looking at methods of communicating with the call processor in order to device bricked phones. It might be the best way to inject code into the ram. . Ill get back to you on that.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Doubt that's possible, not the injecting into the CP, but rather the changing what the phone "identifies" as. Injecting into the CP opens up all sorts of cool possibilities, but I believe actual network identification and communication is reliant upon the SIM card. In particular the Authentication Key (Ki) which I believe never leaves the internal memory of the smart card (aka SIM). Without messing with that, there's no way a phone could "pretend" to be anyone other than itself. Even when I fake out my IMEI on my Captivate (by deleting the EFS data and using the "default IMEI"), my phone still happily connects and works with AT&T. Basically, the cell network doesn't really care as long as your ICCID and crypto package are valid.
PS, been following your work closely w/ regard to the un-bricking business. Best of luck figuring out an "external" way of getting us booted w/ a corrupted PBL/SBL.
Shammyh said:
Doubt that's possible, not the injecting into the CP, but rather the changing what the phone "identifies" as. Injecting into the CP opens up all sorts of cool possibilities, but I believe actual network identification and communication is reliant upon the SIM card. In particular the Authentication Key (Ki) which I believe never leaves the internal memory of the smart card (aka SIM). Without messing with that, there's no way a phone could "pretend" to be anyone other than itself. Even when I fake out my IMEI on my Captivate (by deleting the EFS data and using the "default IMEI"), my phone still happily connects and works with AT&T. Basically, the cell network doesn't really care as long as your ICCID and crypto package are valid.
PS, been following your work closely w/ regard to the un-bricking business. Best of luck figuring out an "external" way of getting us booted w/ a corrupted PBL/SBL.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Thanks...
Like I said, I've not done any investigation into the modification of the SIM card, but I know it DOES have a programming pin on it. I'm thinking that may be for programming the SIM card.
I just received a cool communication toy in the mail. It's a Bus Pirate. so this weekend may be fun and turn up something.
MikeyMike01 said:
Moral of the story: If you don't want to pay an ETF find a remote area of Arizona.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Or anywhere where AT&T coverage is through a partner network. Brand new iPhone 4? Go find a nice spot somewhere, use lots of data, wait for AT&T to call, and get out of your contract scott free.
Nifty trick, eh? Just don't expect to get AT&T service again...
AdamOutler said:
Thanks...
Like I said, I've not done any investigation into the modification of the SIM card, but I know it DOES have a programming pin on it. I'm thinking that may be for programming the SIM card.
I just received a cool communication toy in the mail. It's a Bus Pirate. so this weekend may be fun and turn up something.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Sounds fun...
Ok so I know I'm a noob when it comes to some things on here, but I think this is a legitimate question so bare with me.
Basically, I have to move back home to Trenton, FL because of personal family issues. The problem is that I get absolutely NO service from T-Mobile over there. (It's horrible) I have a rooted and unlocked G2x for T-Mobile/ATT. My question is; can I simply purchase an ATT sim card and use their network back home without having to shut off my T-Mobile account and switch to ATT? From what I've researched, I'm pretty sure it's possible to "Borrow" service from ATT's towers over there with an unlocked T-Mobile phone and a data plan, but I'm not 100% sure. It's not a huge deal, but I'd like to know the answer before I actually move. Thanks!
Can someone please give me an accurate answer?
In short, no. If you want to use Att's cell towers but have a tmo subscription that would be considered roaming. If you had an att SIM you'd have to have service from them, it wouldn't be service from tmo. You could get some sort of roaming plan (I think) from tmo that would allow you access to the att towers.
I appreciate the help, but I'm pretty sure I have roaming from T-mobile. At least, I think I do, cause I think I've roamed before cause I've seen the symbols E and G on my service bar before. Hopefully this is good news! So I guess I'll just have to ask T-Mobile and see what's up.
The t-Mobile rep told me that wherever there is no tmo service you will piggy back on att's network for free. I've done it with both att and cellular one.
Call them and ask to be sure. But you shouldn't need to get a new att sim.
Sent from my LG-P999 using XDA App
Wouldn't bother calling about this...
1) To roam onto AT&T's network, they would have to have a roaming agreement in place. They only pay for roaming agreements in areas where A) They realllly realllly need to have coverage, and B) They don't already have coverage. If T-Mobile already has coverage in an area, they won't pay for an AT&T Roaming agreement. Even if it is bad coverage.
2) If you put an AT&T Sim in the an unlocked phone, then it will have nothing to do with T-Mobile while the AT&T Sim is in there... that is, as said above, you would need to have a service plan with AT&T and as such a new phone number, bill, etc...
3) You can't add a special roaming plan. They don't exist. You get all the roaming that's available already. Now, if you go OVERSEAS that's different - you have to call to add INTERNATIONAL roaming, but that's done so you don't get charged for international roaming without having been warned first. But for within the US, no, you can't get additional roaming on your T-Mobile plan...
The sad thing is, Roaming used to be a lot more common. Wireless services have gotten so competitive, however, that many of those old roaming agreements are dead and gone. Nobody's willing to share their networks any more.
If you bought an AT&T SIM and use that in the G2x, then you would simply be an AT&T customer, except I don't think G2x supports AT&T's 3g band, so you'll just have EDGE.
If T-Mobile doesn't have coverage where you're going, you can call them and terminate your service with T-Mobile, provided that you have proof that you moved there, and T-Mobile has zero coverage in the town you moved to. Otherwise, either keep your TMO account alive, or you have to pay a contract termination fee.
Damn guys I'm glad you told me all of this, especially the part about proving where I'm moving. That's awesome, now I don't have to pay two cell phone bills. Hells yes.